 having committees stipends as separate line items are you talking about all committees having the like each committee having their own line item or just committee stipends in one? The charter requires that the city council stipend is on its own line so that's all I'm saying because right now in the legislative budget we have the city council stipends plus the potential community advisory board and the best committee stipends all up online so we'll just need to break those out so it's only separating the city council and not the others yes okay great because I just wanted to make sure that if somebody say if we had the housing commission as a unique line item that then someone wouldn't be able to quickly just do the math and say oh it seems as if x number of people are taking it and aren't doing it to just try to help a little bit without shaming somebody into either taking or not taking the stipend that's the only impetus yep for us I yeah that is what that is yeah and you know I'd have to think about that a tiny bit just to make sure in my mind that we don't have any other committees that it's only one committee in a budget most of them are in the community development budget and those are all you wouldn't see that but I'll have to think about that a little bit more in terms of where we put these other ones okay because yeah so yeah excuse me I'm talking too long we have bike walk tree advisory housing we've discussed that's it right currently operating right now capital capital excuse me sorry um so for we've talked about resurrecting some kind of economic development or downtown or both yep um two more don't no yeah one of you um there's been discussion in the community about getting to a place where we inform a recognizable community yep and you know a lot of these are optional right so we don't we're not paying my showing up people can request to do this as needed so it does leave us a flexibility if we have a special community project come up you know maybe there's an ordinance discussion that we want to have that includes that we need special input from people maybe we're trying to reach certain portions of our community that budget also can be used there because it's unlikely and I think our history tells us that we're budgeting for the amounts we maximum we wouldn't even the maximum but that money stuff will be being taken out so I think that's that's kind of a benefit of that and we do have some flexibility as we you know as we reach out for different things tonight sort of anticipate with this next year especially at 24 that we're going to have a lot of community outreach to as we as we get things as we get things going as a new city and as we we bring up of different efforts so I don't think we'll need more than I just think it's nice to have the flexibility to to engage with people just to elaborate for for those listening because the hard part of government budgeting is that we have to plan now and so if we're going to do something next year we need to put it in the budget now otherwise it is going to be very difficult for that to happen so in eight months if somebody or a group comes to us and say or says hey we think it'd be fantastic if the city had a party planning committee had a new resident or new community member welcoming committee great thank you and we don't have money in the budget to pay for the stipend so that can't happen this fiscal year it needs to wait until the next fiscal year so hence part of that difficulty in this process of if it hasn't if it wasn't planned for then sorry it can't happen until the next budget year anything else bring good on that piece broadly with the budget I'm sorry what broadly with the budget um I I just want to first of all observe that our our new manager and finance director I can't say how pleased I am and thankful and grateful I am I thought I thought you guys did a great job putting this together and I you know as a team just not having worked with each other and you came together very quickly and put together a great presentation so I really appreciate that with everything was really clear the whole mock budget thing was a good idea um I I only gonna observe you just touched on it briefly I do want to point out that uh and I I'm not picking on recreation but and but our recreation budget has increased almost a hundred percent in three years it went from can't remember where it was with 620 and we're over a million dollars that's I understand all of the specifics um of the recreation budget why one thing or another nevertheless sometimes you have to step back from the forest and so you don't see the trees and look at something because at the same time in the same time period our capital transfers which is our capital cost our repairing of critical infrastructure that budget actually declined now I know that that budget is pegged to upcoming pending capital projects we try to anticipate and put the money in a year ahead of time but that's telling us where our priorities are and it's a little concerning and so I as someone who is leaving the board I do urge you and we've heard this from some of our constituents I do urge you to put some kind of a recreation oversight or committee in place just to make sure that we understand that this is a significant commitment this community is making to recreation yeah in as opposed to some other things that we could be making commitments to and so I'd like to make sure that we get community input and guidance on that going forward absolutely Georgia in terms of the new committees that within Virginia's memo the recreation advisory committee is one of the ones that will have money budgeted to be paying for English was not very good there but I think you know what I'm saying yeah it's not exactly what you say great thank you so I know that at our last meeting we had a conversation around stipends and around our city council stipends Raj do you want to touch on this do you want me to go first so based on our last conversation one thing just contextually in thinking about how that conversation went and the things that we're trying to do around around diversity around equity and inclusion none of us in this room are experts in the subject none of us in this room have our crystal ball or magic a ball and know if we do one thing here what that is then going to do tomorrow what that's then going to do in six months nine months ten months ten years we have no idea and so we are here in this fog of either doing nothing and hoping for the best or doing something and hoping for the best personally I I do not believe in doing nothing and hoping for the best to me that's a fool's errand my words and I would propose that we do something in terms of starting a conversation from a budgetary standpoint and to try to find some kind of a happy medium I would propose instead of the six thousand five hundred that was originally proposed that we do five thousand per council member I mean I'll go next I'm fine with that I put this together I put this together I've talked to a bunch of people I spent the past few days talking to some people that do have some knowledge around this with the state it is a conversation that's happening every day now in the state house they're trying to address it's happening in more similar to ours now around the state not just here and it's centered around you know I included this in the novel people in local leadership positions remain unaware of their biases or shortcomings of perpetuated system where marginalized voices are further excluded from community affairs not on purpose we're not doing anything here I just want to clarify because it got a little confusing last time I don't believe we're doing anything in here to make that we're not knowingly coming out that we're not intending nothing we're doing we're what we're trying to do with it's certainly community and what we've all been doing is doing so this isn't a comment at all this is recognizing that when I was out recruiting for YouTube for a place in YouTube for instance I was talking to like single mothers who I thought be great to come on here and having to identify things that weren't you need a painting it was how much time does it take all right let me look into that type wow so what would you need well baby sitting right now in the community there's about 20 bucks an hour for a kid so we just cover our meetings and free work it's 20 you know so you get to that point where you're trying to say to people we really want to hear you know we don't have anybody on this board for instance that we're welcoming to the community that lives and all the new development we're bringing in it is going to take some effort to meet them where they fall to get them here because we are saying that we want their their participation we need to hear from them because we need to know what to do with community we don't we know some things right but we don't know what we can't speak for them we just simply can't we can guess you know so and the irony there is we could I've heard I'm not laughing at anybody else just myself for saying that like this but we can say to ourselves we should really get out there and talk but we've already seen in numbers how much time we are currently spending or anybody in our role not just not about us would already be spending just doing this work so to then say why don't you spend more time having a Saturday morning community conversation at bottom pot or stopping by when there's a barbecue okay well that's that's adding on in a way that's already it's it's ironic so I think there are all kinds of ways to come to a number I don't pretend to say that all of a sudden before the petitions for this election are due that we're going to see or even one and I can't predict that we're going to see many more next election but we're you know these budgets their numbers and their expenditures and their revenues but their policy statements their value statements and what we're saying we're a community by doing this is it's expensive go to the grand scheme of things I think five thousand is four dollars and maybe ten cents on the average not nothing because that happens every year what we're saying is we really do want that input we're gonna meet people where they are we can adjust it you know this isn't in the charter this isn't in our so it's not in our community constitution we can come back in a couple of years and say I know that didn't really give us much use I don't know what the time frame would be but if we're not getting the result we want we can pick the reason this is coming up now rather rushed and I didn't say this last time I didn't know the two of you I didn't know we're gonna have two open seats so that's not necessarily important because people still have to get elected as you rightly pointed out and but it's harder to run against somebody it's already right now we have open seats so it's really they don't have to compete against current board members so that does make it easier right so we're going to go out and try to round up some people and try to really convince them that they belong here they can do it we're going to support them this way as a community and we value them it's a good time to do it it's a little last minute here I granted it um also we have to make like Andrew pointed out we have to make this decision now for next march in April for the next petition season because you know so if we don't put this in now we're not only we're missing an opportunity for these two seats but we're missing an opportunity for the next two seats and and that's 80 of our board we've basically said we're gonna we're gonna wait and those seats last that'll be six years we're waiting to see that turnover and so I realized this is last minute it's sudden it was unexpected but I think part of it comes from just being opportunistic in a way and saying this is a good time to bring this up in the sense that it's a good time for people to join the board and I'll stop at other things okay can I can I can comment all right all right um I did want to express that I thought a lot about what you said and I still disagree I disagree with the five thousand dollar statement increase of five thousand up to five thousand um the things I've I've contemplated this issue and a couple things come to mind like I said there's no guarantee that we're going to get no you know people to to um come from that community that you're talking about whatever single mothers or BIPOC community what have you the things I see that could not tie to cost but like you said it's hard to be in incumbent is term limits increasing the size of the board from five these are those are char things but increasing the size of the board from five to seven members so you know you're getting a large you know board but potentially from more things because to try and placate every group I mean you could break it down to the elderly we we heard from people talking about the senior bus and all the things there are many many groups factions whatever out there that want to be heard I mean to get representation of them we'd probably have a board of who knows 30 40 people what what what you know who knows how many what is the right number and how many people have to be on board to to to make it equitable to what people think is going to be equitable so I think term limits I think you know potentially increasing the size of the board another thing could be we have committees or groups or advisory boards reaching out to people we had it with the five with the police department with these issues I don't see why we can't do do such so we can get input from the youth the elderly the handicapped everybody out there that's in a position where they'd love to be able to have input but it's difficult for them to get involved with this due to whatever you know limitations they have and just think that money is going to solve it I disagree can I can I say can I jump in okay I'd like to bring a completely different dimension into this okay I'm going to start by saying I think it's and I discussed this with Andrew previously when we were putting the charter together there were a bunch of little areas that troubled me and but we were in a rush we needed to make it in time for the legislative session so we kind of let a lot of stuff go and I think we're making some good corrections this year but compensation for the city council was one of those issues that I was a little leery about and and here's why I think it's inappropriate and kind of borderline unethical for any elected board in charge of of a municipal budget to give itself a raise and in effect the way the charter is set up by simply putting a raise for the city council uh into the general fund budget uh the only if and we've already seen that this is a controversial issue and we've gotten emails already and we've seen is this controversial uh this this question because you can come at it from so many different angles begs significant community input but you're not going to get that because you're going to put it into the general fund budget and people who don't agree with giving us a raise what's their choice the only choice is to vote down the police the fire department public works capital they have to vote down the entire municipal budget in order to say no I don't want you to get a raise okay and I in other words we're in effect holding the municipal budget hostage okay I'm sorry but that's how I look at it I would like to propose a a kind of a compromise here if I can how do we get around it look the charter language how do we get around it I would like to propose that we put a question on the about about doing this okay not a separate line item but a separate question so shall the shall the the fy 25 budget uh include a proposal to increase city council stipends to five thousand dollars obviously it would have to take effect in the following year's budget in the fy 25 budget right because you can't we can't retroactively put it back into the budget because the budget is going to have been approved but let me point out I don't think we can disagree on a lot of things but I think we can all agree I don't think there's an emergency here I don't think that the wheels of government are going to come undone if the s extension city council doesn't get a pay raise this coming this July I think this could wait I think then you would know it's going to be in place Raj by the by the next election cycle you you would know it's going to be in there okay and that would give us the opportunity to really hear what the community has to say you know because there are a lot of people looking at this at our budget and looking and we have just heard from a couple are going gee I voted for separation thinking I was going to see a decrease in my well it's complicated because of inflation because we had the transfer but nevertheless it there are there are people out there who are looking at us saying what was it what is it that you guys ever say no to you say yes to everything but when do you say no to some request so but on the other hand I completely understand the the issues that you're raising Raj so I hear a lot about community input let's get some real significant binding political community input put this as a question on the upcoming ballot that's going to annual meeting at annual meeting we can explain our positions you can make your case it can be debated publicly if the people say yes then the city council has its it has its answer the other reason why I think it's an ethical way to approach this is because it really does kind of distance the current city council from the the pay increase that happens in other words two of the members won't we're certainly not going to benefit from it but two of the other members may not benefit from it it's for a board that's going to be put together a year from now so that makes it less like we are looking just to compensate ourselves as opposed to saying we think that this is a a good move a good governance move okay so I would like to make that proposal as a compromise I the the only other thing I'm going to add I I do want to point out that there are we there are a lot of unknowns about about why people in some populations don't apply for the board or don't run for the board I want to point out that what we do know out there in s6 junction is that there are thousands of people middle and upper income people who also don't run for the board okay is that because they're bad people they don't care about their community of course not they care about their community but they don't want to get involved because they don't care they're not that interested they don't want to take on that degree of responsibility they don't want to be in the public eye they don't want to have to go and knock on doors and and get a petition signed and and so when I say and so they don't and so we can understand why those people and it's understandable why people who could run for the board they have the resources in the time that to run for the board and we don't and they don't and yet we say that's okay well why doesn't that that logic and that reasoning apply across to all everyone in every other community low income people people in marginalized community in communities I I I think that I'm just pointing out that you're right putting more money onto the city count into the city council compensation it is a real shot in the dark that it's going to do anything and in fact it could do just the opposite of what you want it could encourage more people from other parts of the community not not marginalized parts of the community to also run and they could further displace it um so I I just don't know what to say I don't think that there's a clear path I'm not sure it's fiscally irresponsible responsible to for us to spend money on something that we're not really clear what the problem is and we I have absolutely no idea if it's going to have an effect I think we have to understand that it's a lot of people would question whether that's a reasonable thing for the city council to do so that's why I will go back to my suggestion that we put this as a separate question let let the let the community weigh in on it and then that will inform next year's budget by the city council thank you George uh amber did you want to add anything at this point um I'll I'll just add a quick comment um I'm struggling with this question honestly um I do think it's always it's always nice to add an increase um because I think that's just the general I mean the city council stipend stayed at what it was for years and then we got the increase we had the increase last year um I'm just struggling with that large of an increase um and I hear the counter proposal of 5000 but I'm still I'm still not I'm not I'm not 100 sold that I would go that far you know maybe 2000 2500 I appreciate all of the research that Raj has done on this and I totally understand where he's coming from in regards to the to the numbers that he's proposing um I but I will just say that one of the biggest things one of the biggest impediments to me even stepping up was not the monetary piece of it was the time commitment you know is somebody who works 40 plus hours a week it's not it's not the two hours that we sit here on a zoom call or in at to Lincoln it's the four hours that we're spending reading 200 pages um on top of trying to you know trying to live our lives here um and so that's that's while I see the the monetary piece of it I guess I'm also agreeing with with Dan and George and saying I'm not sure that that's the reason entirely why we don't have the diversification um on the board so I guess I'm still in a I don't know where I'm at kind of position but just wanted to share my thought process great thank you amber um in terms of moving this forward so I think overall I completely understand where you're both coming from term limits have been discussed before we're going to discuss yesterday let's say you know there's pros and cons to that as you said before people still need to get elected and I think George that's where when you refer to those people who might make more than the average or some of those people that might make less everybody who still has to get elected I don't think the community is going to all of a sudden go uh that guy that's the one you know if they don't believe it so I think some of those concerns while I hear exactly what you're saying I think the community is a little more savvy in terms of who they're going to put on the board so I don't actually share that concern but overall I think the theme I'm hearing and my my thought to all of this is you're asking a system that's in place to change itself to reduce its power you know so if you think about this as a system and you're looking at it and saying well it should just agree that at some point and you know it's a way to kind of perpetuate that system when people say well we can't quantify it we're going on faith we're going to you know see how it goes we'll ask the community very few of the of these moves of this type in our country's history have been by popular vote and had they been left the popular vote would not have been we'd still be dealing with other things I'm not equating this to that sir I'm saying there are no I'll come back to it single other things on this board there are no there's nobody under 30 right um you know you see the great what are you talking about yeah 10 years ago there you know we could go on and on and on it's it's not simply about my public concern um but but I've been out talking to a lot of people who care just as deeply about our community as everybody in this room right now and and I I know all of you amazing people I look out and there's more than two people it's all of us it's just us and I know there's a there's a dozen people probably watching on YouTube some will watch later there's probably eight people on Zoom right now that our employees it's always us we always joke about it's how it's always us I'm not mad at it and it'll be always joking I think it's funny we go to elections same bowl workers we go to committees same people volunteering you know we had a great turnout for the hiring committee that was cool only got people we were interested in we can't talk and then come on the board it's we're not putting the memo how much this would cost but can not tribute I don't pretend any any expenditure in our budget is true but I think the community and I will we're not making decisions tonight I'll think about what you said about the advisory you know we've we've done it with other banks my concern about that like I said is you're asking a system that sort of benefits from from leaving it alone to change itself I don't have a history of that happen I don't see where that's happened before especially when people can say well you're just trying to just trying to get to a percentage I mean Dan I think I know what you mean but you were I think when you when you talk about this you try to I think you're you're trying kind of is that is the answer you're looking for what are the numbers we want to see we're not looking for a target we're looking for voices we're looking for a life experience lived experience we're looking for lived experience we I don't have there's no target there's no right number it will change election to election so I don't want us to to get caught up with what's the right ratio you know are we are we on percentage for the number of people who speaking English is the second language that are in our community the simple fact is that the majority of the growth by far in the state of Vermont where people of color not English speakers as first languages and others in this past census so I'm not saying that's the target it's a wide net so I'm just trying to answer and again in Georgia give that some thought about you know should we do that and we'll get some feedback from people I think can I can I respond to your thing about the percentage and stuff I don't disagree with you it doesn't have to be a percentage but you're talking about single mothers you're talking about different people from different backgrounds different life experiences on war as I said earlier to we're how many different voices do we we all have different voices I have a different background than you do we all have different backgrounds and it depends on how you look at it Raj okay so my background is law enforcement my my whole life okay I am a single father I think the rest of you guys are all married okay and okay well I still was for all the term my you know whole time whether I've won the planning commission all the way through reconvysory council this board and work the job at shift work nights weekends calls for search and rescue everything I made it work it was difficult and not easy but that's something I chose to do and it's not no one forced you to do it and I try to represent all the people and don't I felt kind of almost like an affront to me that because I can't we don't have your initial message was we don't represent our community and I think we do and to think that I'd like to know because I'm not of a unique situation whatever you're describing it I can't represent those people our state our federal representatives up to the longest time Bernie Sanders Patrick Leahy and Peter Welch three old white guys they represent the state of Vermont okay we have a super majority and mom player of Democrats okay they got the house they've got the Senate we have moderate governor but we talk about inequities but we don't look beyond we talk country what so there's a lot of ways you can look at the picture I'm just saying I disagree with trying to solve this by putting money to it I want to hear voices from everybody we try and do that we we're doing a lot more of it like I said before now that we we Skype in meetings like I said before Patty used to Patty Benoit used to come around with that three room binder to teach our houses and drop that off for our meetings now we get people calling in we have much more attendance than we ever had in the 12 years I've been on this board okay so I'm happy with that is it perfect no but you know it's a process we move forward we move forward quite a bit and that's all I'll say right now yeah I just want to say yes to everything you're saying I'll add that when you were talking about we have other committees they can report to us and we can do something about that's to your that's what our filters we filter that we bring our way of thinking our life experience and interpret what they tell us in our own way and then make our decision they're not making that decision is what I'm saying so when we say it's good enough to have that representation there my reaction to that is yes you're right it is amazing to have that representation that's that's enough and when we take and when we say we don't need to make that impact on this board we're saying it's good enough to have it there and then we're just going to let that filter through the same group of people that always serve so we're keeping that lack of representation in the decision making table you know it's kind of like I heard from I heard from somebody about the budget my interest are being represented this is an increase valid valid valid I asked them questions about them they're not here in this group we can think like them we can hear them and we can say I think they'll like this but it's even the people you're talking about you know like we're filtering we're always filtering it's like newspaper right editors will always filter the writer that's what ends up in the paper we're just doing that so you can look back to it right but it's the same thing it's our filter and we don't have to go on this all night because we've done a long meeting and we don't have to decide tonight I just want this continued thinking about it and I appreciate the input I really do and then so I'll stop I want to clarify but let me let me quickly as a former editor I want to say considering the state of social media today I think things were a lot better off when they did go throughout but we'll put that we'll put that issue aside I I'm trying to say I really Raj I I'm trying to say you know this is this is a lively debate and so I'm posing the question to the city council why not amplify this debate and let the community have this debate and let them let them vote on it I understand what you're saying that sometimes an institutional structure doesn't want to change itself but I I think we're I think we're pretty a pretty flexible progressive group here in s extension and I would trust the voters on this and I would just really urge or urge us to try to let's let's get community input on it put it on a ballot as a separate question again I have to point out I've been on here 15 years you know but I didn't even know they gave compensation when I joined and so we've done a pretty good job for the last 15 years I think holding off one more year is not going to be critical and then if if the answer is yes then you guys will know what to do and then in the next election cycle in in a you know a year from now you the the people who run for for those seats they will know that starting in a couple of months they're going to get a little more compensation see if you bring it's two elections it's effectively two election cycles they won't know it would kick in it would kick in in the in the in that in that in that budget it would kick in in that that fiscal year in the in the in July of that fiscal year so you would have it you would it would only be if you would miss this one you'd miss this one all you'd miss is this one and so it would kick in the following year and so all I'm saying and I don't think that's a I think that's a reasonable compromise to make in order to really let the community weigh in on this and inform the board and and I'll let me add I would recommend that that you we either you guys either consider maybe altering this in the charter to how how the to give the community the community a little more input into this down the road and I think that that would give you an opportunity to do that as well so I I would just urge you to do it I think it would be a good thing I think it would be good to have the community debate this and and give us and give you guys their input on so the only thing I'd like to just to wrap this up the only things that I kind of want to add into this in terms of somebody not liking a line item within our budget whether that be our stipends whether that be the amount for the police department health officer whatever recreation anything else in our budget the only recourse anyone has is to vote it to vote the budget in its totality up or down regardless of what it is and so at some point in time the people who have been elected by the community to make some of these tough decisions have to make a decision and it's of course up to us whether we choose to utilize that power that has been given to us or whether we advocate that power with public input I got two emails I don't know about the rest of you that's all I got on Facebook there was some lively conversation about this broadly it was in support a few against but much more so in support of increasing the stipends the question of should it be 6500 5000 4000 different numbers were thrown around a broad increase was was favorable I didn't see anything on foreign porch forum if there's other conversations on other forms of social media I don't do those I have no idea term limits I would say governance in general one of the things we put in our charter is to have a study on governance and our governance options by years or within three years of the passage of our charter so these are some conversations that I hope our community does have around our governance structure around the number of people who sit at this table should we have wards term limits all those types of things so again we could look at at that point in time other aspects of the system to change to then see what types of impact that may have but again as Raj is saying this is a system with various attributes to the system and so we can either change something hope for the best or do nothing and hope for the best and we can continue that well I I I think you you brought up a good point Andrew I think that it's reasonable to say that this a board giving a board getting increasing its stipend it's always going to be a controversial issue I think okay um and just as staff wants to if they they want salary increases uh operational increases we're the boss in terms of that they have to come to us and ask our permission and who's our boss yeah um so I think it's time for us to go to the boss and ask the boss's opinion on number one and I think you raised a good question because when we transitioned from having live meetings to uh Australian ballot I think that there was a a a tacit necessity in there for us to not put controversial things uh into the Australian ballot budget because as we know I'm sorry it does not get the scrutiny that it does when you when you had two or three hundred people gathered at the auditorium and stuff like this would get pulled out and debated and that meant people could change it from the floor that that doesn't happen and it doesn't get that level of scrutiny before people vote on it so again I go back to saying um that's why I think this is controversial I think it's it's a fascinating debate for the community to have I would urge us to just put it on hold you know I think we can safely the the wheels of government the government won't explode if we put it on hold for a year let the community have it say and then that will inform the city council when you guys are putting the budget together next year that would be my my suggestion anything new so many thanks um I think controversial really is I guess defined by whoever's looking at so I could suspect that we have many controversial things I think this is you know if we're looking to the state this is how the legislature does it and they're struggling right now with this question because they don't dare do this because it's politically difficult they're also struggling and probably being impacted more by not being able to get the bodies they need to to run and serve um and and so I we don't keep going on this I just um I think it's an interesting idea to have the community way and I always want to know the community thanks I'm not going to say I don't trust them at all but there's not a lot of history you know I'll say I'll think part about it because I'm talking to people I'll say that because I'm a little bit the thing about controversial things in our budget Raj the controversial things in our budget for projects or anything we want to you know start new at budget this could be construed or looked upon as being self-serving it's as opposed to the projects we do in the community benefits the community as a whole indirectly you can make your argument to say this benefits the community as a whole but I think if you were to pull a lot of people they could say well this you know you're giving yourselves a raise as it were and that is very self-serving whereas the other stuff I don't look upon it as being self-serving just as much as any member of you know we can't have a person involved in public works you know like Ricky Jones on this board because it's his conflict of interest but we you know his budget he's dealing with his budget I mean but I'm saying we're able to vote and say our personal stipend is going to go up this this much you know basically like George said and then they got to vote the whole it's tied to the budget and then if they're opposed to it it really doesn't get you know it's difficult to make sure we're not equating want to participate and good with volunteer and automatically losing that good and service to community with increases because we're already paying ourselves right I'm just saying I'm just saying always been something it's just it's but just I'm saying the extent I'm saying the extent I'm saying the extent it's not no across the board communities everyone you know generally there's a stipend for community service but I'm just saying the extent of it the amount of it this this adding adding it to you know so at the beginning of the public hearing I said that we would then talk about the budget and at that point in time I would ask if there are public comments on things that they've heard so far so with that in mind if anybody either in the room or out in zoomland wants to make a comment have a question things you've heard thus far about the budget because after this I'm assuming or I'm thinking we're going to go off of this topic and onto the next agenda item please go ahead and raise your hand Marlon just listen to the plan adopted kind of maybe because of things I wanted to maybe just talk about just to give my two cents since I didn't participate online so and I talked a little bit about it but we talked about it on our own board too from my perspective we came from an equity lens I don't look at it as checking boxes off I don't look at it as I need to like pick one person from here pick the person there pick the person there to make sure that I pull all these boxes that's not that equity is giving everybody a chance to actually have you see the table and I think and again I don't even know what to get out of it I'm going to be involved with that as I should I can't check it online out in the back I apologize for that but I was having the open question for you guys um one because the law was passed here you know making a say and I appreciate that it was a lot of work people a lot hours into that but you know that including you know the years prior to that for you for for being on the board hall on it like yeah going on 12 years 11 years and rock all over this is my form 15 and 12 never falling down the board I think it's four almost four four years so you're the newbie type in the morning yeah Raj and I are almost the same time frame so so I have the question you guys especially the three of them got over the tech experts on the board so in your time on the board I'm certain there's times with all this meetings I've missed being the school board I'm certain you guys missed me because of commitments I've never been in time or you guys have missed a board meeting not because you had prior to it because you but because you couldn't afford to come to a meeting like let's say you got you know you're at home and the kids are there there's no way to wash I mean you can't pay or afford to pay a daily center to wash them or you are you're you're having to work up to a certain point and if you can't you can't afford to miss work because you can't pay your bills it's either come to the board meeting or it's I don't I don't put my feet or don't I'm not able to provide for my family is that ever happened to the three of you specifically the team members of the board do you recall a time at time that you've been on the board that they've made it happen to you that made it that hard decision of like I can't come to the board because if I don't my family it's okay my right it's okay um you know my children don't get washed and I'm unable to do it so just not to your house right I think that we um I think we can just broadly completely understand what you're saying not trying to stop the the comments just want to make sure we don't get into a have you have and I don't mean and I thought into it but the point the question the point of that question is this I think that bringing up the idea I was saying and yes it's something we'll see is large enough but I think for some folks I think in arguing we had in our board is the point is this is I think that the top of the choice like a lot of people should not want to do this work it's a hassle the pain it is trust me I I'm a newbie to this and it's I needed the pain to do this work but when I look at it and that I have the ability that I don't have to worry about um making that financial force um you know if I come to a meeting in my family and they're going to be a room for my house and I think that's because I'm talking my necklace point there if I could afford babies if I could afford to maybe miss a couple hours of a shift that's not going to impact me to be able to have it see in these tables to help my voice be heard and to make an impact in the in the work again you guys have done great work and I appreciate what you guys have done it's not that easy we've asked all the heavy lift all of you and you guys have come through this community and I appreciate that I really really do but I think that sometimes we talk about equity we focus on patent books we focus on you know though the person next to me fit a certain category look a certain way that's not equity that's not equity is allowing everybody an equal opportunity at these seats at these tables that you guys have right now that I have on Tuesday it's on a red Tuesday I can tell you for a fact not everybody in this community has an opportunity it's not a choice because a choice is I can do A or B and at the end of the day yeah I may miss those things but it's not going to have a major impact on my life equity is if I choose B I can have a very negative impact on myself my family's life so when we talk about equity I just kind of want to put that on the screen but it's something to think about for food to thought that I understand there's a lot of talk to me you can talk to your student but I urge you guys from an equity lens to think about not so much of a choice not so much as you know people trying to fill boxes or fill spots here it's about an opportunity for folks that we don't get to hear very often you know I won't admit I'll be on the school board I got lauded repeatedly for being the first BIPOC person in the school and this school district has been there hundreds and over a hundred plus years that's we shouldn't be that shouldn't be a barrier but I know there are others in the community with a barrier for what I heard that I talked to them and they appreciated me being having to see that table so I just asked you guys when you think about this further that yes I understand what you want the community is to speak and I agree I can understand that I agree with that but I just say for you guys in the here in this conversation please think about that that when you're looking at this here it's not about it's about making sure everybody has a has a an opportunity that I see in this table and I know for a fact that not everybody's community has a choice right now because we see an arc where people have not wanted from the world because they can't because they choose to but because they flat out can't that's a financial issue right now for most of those so we met that so thank you guys thank you thank you Marlon anybody else in the room Bridget just a couple quick things if you are going if you are planning or thinking about putting this that condition and the separate question on the ballot that's George said it's going to require a lot of education because people are just you know I'm sorry and and once they understand the issues understand the time you're spending those kind of things so I would like to to know that you will commit to doing that education however however you have to do it because I don't think putting it on the ballot is really going to have the effect in terms of community education that you that you're looking for you want an informed decision made by by the citizenry and and just putting it on there is not going to be I think you all know that but it is a commitment to do that education the second thing um going back to uh comment that George made about uh about re-establishing um a recreation advisory council I just want to be really clear excerpt on that board as to Dan Raj and I've worked for 12 years um is not an oversight board you would have to rewrite the charter job whenever you want to call it if you want that kind of a board we were an advisory board we served as the conduit between community and recreation and it was we didn't have budget oversight and things like that that's what you're looking for um it's going to require a total rewrite of our of what what we used as a as a as a mission statement um you know we changed charter a couple times but um never did we have that kind of oversight or supervisory capacity so that's it just to expand on that for one quick moment since you brought it up uh the other thing that it would likely require is a charter change since we're very clear in the charter that the manager has the ultimate responsibility on uh the departments within our community and that it is not given to the the city council in terms of operational oversight but rather our manager and so if that's occurred to me a lot in terms of this conversation in relation to this conversation I've been having served on that board for as long as I did um council for as long as I think um uh using the rationale that recreation needs more oversight if you will you are the you're the oversight board you you and and and the manager oversee that aren't you at the same I mean thinking about this does that mean in public works same kind of oversight right I I hear your logic yeah can I just just I was what I was thinking Bridget is more like the Brownell oversight board now that is in the charter and it's in their foundation charter that they have to have an award like that but I've been on that board and certainly the director Wendy has control and and the and she proposes a budget but then they have a lot of input to that budget before the budget comes to us and that's really what I was sort of recommending for something of just so you know you're talking about you're not talking about advisory council you're talking about some kind of an oversight board and if that again would require a lot of research and education it turns to establish because across the board um recreation advisory councils do not have that kind of power oversight they just don't so that they're they're they're they're established to communicate with the community to volunteer at events to do those nice things so you're talking about a fully different kind of work yeah and I don't approve or disapprove I'm just saying it's going to require some just one quick word it's a it's a four million dollar cost center right now with their with their with their all their program funds that I believe is our largest cost center in in the city third I think it's it's a third I'm not sure what you call streets which I call public work no that's a that's about that's under two million it depends on what we're what you're calling in terms of what you're including in terms of general fund or I'm not trying to in general conversation but I'm just saying it's a very very significant it's no longer when you go from half a million a year to that much money it's a significant amount of money which requires a significant response like right I'm not saying they're doing anything bad right but it's a that's a big budget I'm not defending or or because I haven't been involved in that closely with that for a while but I do think we've asked rep to do a lot that we normally did in other you know like okay they'll take it on they'll take it on the moral difference they'll take this on they'll take that on and you can't do that and then say uh wait a minute your your budget is increasing and that's not going to work I mean it's all this is a part of the whole right I mean it's a part of the whole examination of how how the municipality um runs how it works and how it works for the community how it works for the staff how it works for everybody and and this should be something we spend time on you know and um and an exam in terms of how we want this to work it's kind of same conversation you're having about the getting people to serve you know and seeing the same people over and over again um I just think it's another thing we can do here there's something else I may not struggle with it for 20 years I don't you know but um there's something else there's a way that we can we can connect the community to the municipality you know and I just want to say I I agree with you I we're going to have a strategic planning process right in the near future one of the things I wanted to talk about because there's a lot of all of a sudden there's a lot of talk about recreation as we can go right now and you know it's fine we have one for a while I don't think that's that thing I've been thinking a lot about how we interact with our community and the number of committees we have and the number of required people number of people that requires and can we can we think about a different way can we be more nimble can we have a can we have people we just know we can go to on a topic and say look got this project problem do you have a few weeks to or six weeks to engage on it and give us some advice and and really have groups of people that are out there to help us when we need it or with it bring us or rec or public or whoever things that need to be worth and then we can you know to be more nimble to be more creative to get more voices in to not have these separate little silos that then require whole whole you know times that we need to meet with them you know they're all then under different meeting environments different lines you know like I think we we we have this opportunity as a new city I said I agree we have this opportunity as a new city to really kind of look at how we're doing this and I think I just asked for folks to give us a chance to get the city going I know that sounds a little lame no but we really just need a chance to get the city going we're going to talk about this we're going to engage the community on it we need a couple years of your sorry but just need some time I've always been a proponent of involving the community and I think we saw with the manager search committee that you can ask the community to do that very serious very in some ways pretty difficult work and they step up they step up I think they're in a way we need to do more of that give the community some important jobs some really important jobs and I think they'll step up and I think a lot of what we're doing so that needs full facilitation which is why you're seeing some of these positions in the budget recommended because we need people to interact with the with the community in that way yeah so I mean when you when you when we talk about that I just want to make sure as we're talking about the budget and everything that people understand this takes it's not the entire reason we're not you know we need more people but we have a lot of things we want to do here as a community and and I think that requires a conversation that requires some staff and it's different than what we thought two years ago and it's unfortunate but I will say that I'm a proponent of disabilities rip off the band aid yeah very difficult so I want we want to hear from more people if it's not the right way to go more evidence well you know you're having really important conversation right here right now and that's the beginning and certainly hear more opinions and ideas and I think that's that's certainly where you start but but you know and I'm just strong proponent of getting the community involved and and I'm in really important work so thank you Bridget can I just add one one thing um sorry just mostly since we are talking about the budget just want to be clear that I get the point about the EJRP budget but just so most folks know that a very strong majority of that is not uh at general fund expense at the property tax it is a program-based enterprise fund essentially yeah right the overwhelming majority something like two-thirds or three-quarters of EJRP's revenue and expenditures goes through the enterprise funds which are user-feeding by the people who use those things whether that be our child care licensed child care the recreation programs in general the pool all those those things um which are not in the general fund and so are not paid for by taxes anybody else in the room being no hands in the room so I've got my email in and I've warned you yep you email that that may not be the last one your email is in the reading file I it is in the email I would I would love if there's anybody online or in the room that would maybe go up and speak and I wouldn't have to but if not there's one person online who'd like to speak maybe Elise oh good lord I'm supposedly maybe speaking for someone I apologize I am not putting my camera on because as my grandma said I don't have my face on so I wanted to just chime in and said one I'm voting yes on this budget so thank you so much for all the hard work I really appreciate it I wanted to also voice my support for Marlon's position on the stipends I do have a bit of a conflict of interest in this but I thought it was important enough to step forward and say that I know I think number one it is an equity issue I hope it doesn't end there as a conversation about increasing a stipend but potentially how do we also remove other barriers from people's way to level the playing field and give them the opportunity to serve so I really encourage the council to think of not only raising a stipend and I'd like to see debate over the amount but also about other things like maybe supporting child care things like that giving more options for virtual options which I think we're moving towards but I think this is critical piece of work for the city to show a commitment to the second thing that I would say in support of the stipend is there's a value to people's time and they're volunteering and serving and I also support this in the legislature paying the people in the legislature for all their time because it certainly is a barrier and I really would like to just acknowledge everyone who does put in their time whether it be on a committee on a council an elective position that that's time away from their families that's time away from their education that's time away from their own sort of self-care so I think that value should be acknowledged and I think one way we do that is financially so thank you for that I also want to voice my support for an advisory committee for eJRP but I do believe that that makes it takes a little thought and we do want the we I want to understand fully what that advisory committee is responsible for having worked and a lot of nonprofits that have boards and committees that staff reports to it's very difficult to have so many people trying to drive the ship as a staff member and we need to trust our staff to do the right thing with the proper oversight but I'm sorry I feel like the push to to target eJRP at this time is is more personal than it is about eJRP and I think that I am totally open to an advisory committee conversation but I'm willing to wait for that conversation to happen in a thoughtful well documented process thanks so much thank you Elise next up on zoom we have any cooper hi um my push Elise is not personal um Andrew speaking to you I would like to um say that a 4.6 million dollar recreation budget while two thirds to three quarters of it comes into program is residential income it's income for the city and so I I think it's been a long time that we talk about how great it is which it is great of course absolutely it is fantastic that programming brings in income we are so fortunate to have a thriving recreation department it's great the recreation department manages many budgets our um our village our voices had that 10k budget for that committee that Elise was on and Bridget was on and um Eileen Haney was on that was a great um moment in time where that committee was formed um there's been there's a committee for the Memorial Day parade that budget is managed by the rec department um I think it's so important that our rec department be supported and that things like the cash preferred during Halloween that we really threw me friends that really threw me I it really surprised me and it threw me so that was the the main impetus for my feelings about a rec advisory committee that aside George makes an excellent point that we've lost the ability to have discussions on the floor and point out particulars and vote on things that should be changed in the budget and while I 100% agree with Australian ballot and I 100% agree with how we're doing it we need to change with that like George said we need to find ways to bring more community input as we go and uh in regards to the stipend I would like to see if there's a question on the ballot or discussion throughout the year just take myself back one more time to the rec advisory committee component I don't mind what that committee gets determined to be I don't I trust that those of you sitting at that table and Regina and the rec department can determine what that committee does I'm just frustrated that we've not had it for seven years and this is an eighth year so those are all my frustrations uh those are my thoughts about the stipend as well and thank you all so much for your time thank you Annie Arlen are you good or so all right you can have the final word um a lot to take in uh and if I send my email top conversations I appreciate you guys doing that um great conversations uh George I agree with you that there should be discussion um problem is it's really difficult and then um it's kind of interesting we're talking about like some marginalized groups um and trying to give everybody a voice and I don't think putting the question on the ballot answers anything if anything we've discovered and actually you wouldn't be it's not actually on the ballot right it's a separate question very similar to what we did before the problem is you can't get enough information education as Bridget spoke to it um it just gives you a kind of yes or no um and honestly because we're talking about taxes I don't think there's a person around here that will claim that they have never at some point in their life said no no more taxes no more new taxes just you know that's that's our our goal to you is always don't raise our taxes um I think this is I think if you did get into public discussion if you found a unique way social media it's not going to cut it um some of these marginalized communities can't get on social media um from Port Form um you know anything within the internet don't get me wrong we're reaching way more people than we are used to um I don't know if we're still reaching some of these marginalized communities um and I and again to go back to public discussion I think you're gonna get I think you're gonna get 50-50 I don't think you're gonna get an answer I don't think they're gonna point you in a direction um I think this board is faced with one of the top reasons that you guys all signed up for which is you're gonna you're gonna make a decision and you're gonna get yelled at some people are not gonna be happy with other people are gonna support you have done um and the other thing that I found interesting is I was thinking you let that out okay so we go that let's let's say we get 6500 only because I'm a little competitive and I'd like to be first and if we go to 6500 we're the first community to ever do it but I'll go back to five but that's where we need to go um just I felt like you what I feel like you let that out of the bag right we do 6500 we're never gonna get it but then I got thinking about it it is a line of them I mean technically we could just reduce the budget and pull it out of there so I guess we could have it and then we have to figure out how many years do we give it an opportunity to see if it changes the board right how many how many voting cycles do we go through before we get it so it's a big conversation I could go either way um piece of me that says pull the trigger let's do it let's see what happens let's give you all that for a little while and see what happens thank you Harlan you're going to join us in the yelling okay never mind yeah I'll talk to you offline no I'm standing behind Harlan thank you Harlan all right uh Raysa got your hand in it just the last moment thank you sorry I didn't mean to do that I couldn't get to the hand um I completely support increasing the stipend not to this amount and not to this way I was a very strong supporter of merger and then when that when it was clear that that was never going to happen I was an extremely strong supporter of separation um I said at that time and I meant it if I'm paying the same amount of taxes however it's all staying in the city I'm okay with that I am having a real hard time with my money going to the town however looking at this budget I'm not seeing that there was any attempt to start it from where we were only as a city and adding from there so referring to the budget increase as 1.6 it may be 1.5 I may have that wrong that's not quite the case and it makes me it makes me uncomfortable it makes me uncomfortable that a city council is saying we're going to add this as a line item to our budget and include in there an annual inflation increase you know I I I know how much you guys work you guys do I can talk about my conversation with Raj which took up way too much of his time and I appreciated his time you all do so much that's not the question the question is $25 plus an hour which most people don't make in our community because that's what's considered the livable wage that seems like an overreach when I saw the 6500 I viewed it as this is smart you ask for 6500 because you're going to get 3000 and be really thrilled with it but apparently that isn't the case the case is you want 6500 now you're not willing to wait a year from now as George has suggested and you want there to be in addition to that in an an additional inflation increase each year I also I've listened clearly to everything everyone has said and I keep coming back to what Raj said about you know it's always us and he's right and all I keep thinking is this is a real push for me to consider the outliers to consider voting for the people who aren't part of quote unquote us because I think that right now we need a shake up it is very sad that George with all of his institutional history is leaving that Dan with all of his institutional history and frankly a view that is different than mine is leaving I understand them leaving I completely do there comes a point you want to get on with your life but when I asked at the beginning is this something that would be as an amendment or as part of the line item this was why I agree that there needs to be discussion I agree that it's it's not something that people will automatically understand but considering how high our budget is over what we paid only to the city adding this is a line item feels to me like you're trying to hide it I know you're not doing that it's been very clear it's been all over Facebook it's been in the in the packets but you know I I really believe this is something that should go to the community and if the council doesn't believe that the community will have the council's best interest at heart I think that's something about the relationship between the community and the council thank you thank you Raysa the only couple clear pieces of clarification I just wanted to put out there you talk about an annual increase that isn't guaranteed unless we put that into the charter which would then be voted upon by the community it would have to be discussed every single year by the board approved of by the board to then be approved by the voters through the budget process so we here can't guarantee that in five years it would increase at the rate of inflation without that charter change and then just with it being the city council stipends within our charter it's supposed to be its own unique line item within our budget so that that way it would clearly show what that that stipend is so it wouldn't be hidden among any other purpose so it wouldn't be within say the public works paving budget so that nobody could find it so it does have to be its own unique line item just like thank you for that my comment about the annual inflation rate is because that is stated in Raj's memo so that's where I got that and I realized that it's a separate line item if not being an amendment it's just like the council voted on this and passed is a little questionable thank you thank you Risa so do I want to talk about the combined city budget okay there's no other hands up so we will go on to business item 6 be a discussion and consideration of moving the annual meeting date and discussion on the annual meeting election and preparation schedule okay let me while you're you're finding that I do want to offer two apologies one I want to apologize that the community has not had an apology from the council or anybody on the council for where we are and even needing to have this conversation so for that first portion I apologize and the second apology here is the fact that when we put this schedule together when we put out the the annual meeting happening we did not look at a calendar that was included that was more inclusive than a calendar that personally I would have grown up with throughout my entire life and so I did not know at that point in time but this was the first day of Passover moving forward what we will be doing is we will be using a more inclusive calendar that will have more holidays that would be recognized more days of importance that would be recognized and so just on behalf of myself I think I can speak for the city council here broadly of offering my apology to the community for this oversight and so I am sorry for that as well okay so thank you Andrew so the memo points out some of that information and essentially so because the charter now has all of your voting done by Australian ballot which we've talked about quite a bit tonight the annual meeting itself really can be the voting day so this memo was recommending that you change the annual meeting to April 11th which is the date that everybody will be voting and then with that you've got to have your informational meeting 10 days prior to that so the recommendation here is that the annual meeting moved to April 11th and the informational meeting happened the night before on the 10th the we're thinking that the best way to do the informational meeting is a completely online meeting because the school will be hosting their informational meeting at the high school that prior night before we also just want to let folks know we are aware that there used to be a much more fun community dinner event with the committees outside trying to explain what they did and and try to get some more folks to come into the room and we have looked into that logistically to figure out if we can make that happen and we certainly can't do it on the 10th and we have investigated whether we can do it for some other kind of event in between now and then and it just logistically isn't isn't possible so that's why we're suggesting an online meeting for the informational meeting because if folks really want to come this room is not big enough we can't be in the high school and so online might be the best way to get the most people to participate also I will point out that for a lot of people in your consent agenda you have the concept of mailing ballots if we mail ballots a lot of people will be voting way earlier than April 10th and so the whole process is a little bit different and changed at this point and really perhaps at some point we'll get some state changes state statute changes that kind of identified this new future that we're in for prepping for local elections I think that's it thank you Regina and would you have any questions comments concerns my only comment is if you know if we just talk with the board of civil authority if we're going to move the operation over to CVE probably it's too obviously can't do it this year but once you settle in over there you might be able to have your your kind of fun dinner over there certainly CVA I'm sure it would be amenable to that but it's too too soon but I think that's a good plan the other portion as well one of the nice things about doing it at the high school was also just that dinner side yeah being frankly very inexpensive whereas we don't have it in this budget that we know of at least to be able to recreate that and have some kind of private catering entity as the school right now doesn't have the capacity to do those kinds of events anymore but yes absolutely would love to be able to get back to that point in time well you can do it we'll get you can do it we'll get you're not gonna come back no I'm not gonna be I won't be part of this you can do it anything else from the council Marcus I see your hands up quick question based on how I read this memo because the way that it's worded here an informational meeting is required 10 days prior to the annual meeting if you have it the night before that's within 10 days where I read this it sounds like in sweet April 1st within 10 days you can't yeah you have to have it within the 10 days of the vote yep yep yeah sorry that's that's confusing in here yeah I appreciate that clarification and yeah as a part of what Regina was talking about with the lack of alignment with current practice and capabilities to do mail-in ballots and yeah unfortunately how I entertain the motion okay I will move that the city council moved the 2023 annual meeting from Wednesday April 5th 2023 to Tuesday April 11th 2023 to vote for the village officers and transact any business involving voting by Australian ballot second George thank you Dan any further discussion hearing none all in favor please signify by saying aye does the post say nay right so that passed unanimously and next up is something else this is just a minor present connector this is all right come on this is a good thing rick's here I'm thrilled that you're here for this I can start us off if you'd like so essentially we are ready to award the bid for phase two of the actual construction of the of the roadway itself you've got a lot of attachments here in the memo but essentially we have identified a low bid and are recommending that you move forward on that on that bid award I we are also identifying here in the amendment that there are a number of non-participating items that the city will have to cover and some of that we don't 100% know what that cost is going to be yet particularly with the contaminated soils that have to be addressed but there are some other things which George excellent memory knew that there were some of these bike racks and other kinds of in-street amenities associated with that so I'll leave it at that so where we find ourselves is at the end of the trip that's lasted well years they a little bit longer than that but from the preliminary study scouting studies the alternative analysis environmental assessment a corrective action plan designed the right-of-way acquisition all of those process steps over the last 12 years and products to this point where we're ready to actually compete the work and actually do the construction and before I go on any other details let me just say that as you can imagine a project like this it's extremely complicated it's like a giant flywheel and it starts moving very slowly and as we get closer again it's moving very quickly and Regina has joined us at a point where we're in this carousel this flywheel moving very quickly and could easily have been thrown to the ground when confronted with it or definitely stepped on and joined it which she has evolved very impressively fast just to be able to catch up with where we are after 12 years of focus on this project so it's been really the awesome to watch why we hired her exactly good choice so and so we're at the point as I say we've got a bitter a low bitter and in our current bidding environment over the last year and a half almost two years now to get a little bit that was lower than the engineer's estimate has been very rare that over the last year and a half two years the bids have been significantly higher in the engineer's estimate but in this case it was actually 1.6 percent lower than the engineer's estimate that was again that design engineers prepared which is great news for us this project is 100% funded except for the things that we've talked about by state and federal funds so it's a part of the certain potential alternative projects although we don't use that term anymore so the the main work of this project is 100% funded by state and federal funds to build the project the bid has been completely analyzed based on v-tran standards and so and you'll see in your package if you want to delve into it deeply but there are multiple tests that a bid must go through and builders to make sure that there's no disadvantage in this case to the city to awarding that low bid and the bid analysis which is multiple pages of specifically looking at the line out of my line out of the bid has determined both the design engineer's review and v-tran's incurs that there is no and the the term of art here is no disadvantage to the city in issuing and accepting this bid and issuing a contract to this contractor which is the finding you hope to find with a low bid so that's where we're at as Regina says the one piece that's still unknown is because unfortunately this work is along historic railroad right of way and the railroad over time used both coal and wood and that emissions from the low vengeance created some contamination in the soil mainly metals arsenic for one and so right now the v-tran's are examining what the city had done up to this point in terms of due diligence related to those contaminating soils our initial read is that the city through all this process over the last 12 years has done every single thing possible to mitigate that and so we're hoping that the findings from the good folks v-tran's are that they will pay all for a large percentage of the cost of the disposal our initial read throughout the project leading up to this point even before that finding was a hope for a 50-50 split i'm hoping that we get a little bit more if they came back and said there's no participation for the soils that plus the life of the gracks the bike loft is uh eating charging stations some other thing that the the city wanted that aren't really considered under v-tran was part of a necessary part of the project for this type of funding the percentage would be about three percent just a hair over three percent of this little project cost so again very small percentage against what the city will get from this project and so that's that's where we're at at this point and ready to go as you may know phase one of the project has already been completed and that was all the railroad work that happened this summer so the reconstruction of every single crossing within the city limits that hadn't been upgraded recently so short of north the north street crossing which had been rebuilt so central street was rebuilt maple street main street park street north park street south and south summer street crossing uh we rebuilt the wet speed extension extension had been rebuilt a few years before so um that was phase one of the project all those signals all the crossing panels um and a lot of railroad infrastructure was work on the summer so phase two is is the road comes along behind as you know the road will start on park uh it will cross traverse the lands of mcqueen uh the land g's uh all provided easements to the city along with the railroad at maple street there'll be a new signalized intersection the railroad street will be completely reconstructed from maple to main and there'll be a new signalized intersection at the intersection of the crossing connector and park park street so um bike lanes will be on both sides of the road so we'll have a bike lane connection all the way from park to main sidewalks public parking will be a part of the project will be part of the infrastructure and the entire street route will be uh lit so uh quite an input for that stretch to give you from park to main so that's where we're at and we're hoping you agree that it's do the final do the final step I remember um it was about nine or so years ago we were having the conversation about the bonds for briar and some other construction projects at the same time and a staff member at that point in time had said this is going to be one real busy construction season especially with the crossing connector coming in that this upcoming construction season and here we are nine years well well you were still a good predictor of future events because yeah right now we're teed up to do all the water line replacement on main street the culvert replacement on brick yard yeah and that's connector project so it'll still be it will so I'll make sure to repulse that post from nine years ago to the facebook community to say it's going to be a very busy construction season again this year yeah um this is absolutely fantastic thrill that it's happening can't wait for the for the crescent connector to come through um George Dan I can I know how many times you've spoken about this uh I this started for me this started with a meeting in the governor's office in 2011 and then probably I would say were you were you with the circ alternative were you with the rpc with the circ alternative task force it just started in 2011 and I think they were kind of wrapped out I think I spent a hundred hours seeing this beast through the circ alternative task force because we had to go to every possible person in the state who could say no to us and convince them to say I but it was wonderful every single moment but yeah it'd be great I'm going to reserve the right to make this motion so you can ask a few questions but it helped me put this puppy to bed I was gonna show somebody else if if anybody tried right go ahead no I I I'm I'm very happy to see this project moving forward now when I came on the board uh John Lager was the primary rep to the regional planning commission it was two actually it was regional planning commission and the the ccrpc was you know uh mpo and regional planning mixed problem planning so much much and we combined but anyhow so I saw this from the get-go starting up and the other projects all the way through down Williston and we had our group of uh it's a small group because it was the communities that were actually in would have been impacted had the circ been built so us the town Williston calls past their circ community that's it you know it's it was quite interesting but we're finally here I will point out that that that Colchester their circ alternative project was this complicated diamond intersection if you know if you've been keeping up on that and that thing our project is way better than it started there is a 16 it's called the diverging double diamond the diverging double diamond yeah and uh great name it is it's gonna be a it sounds like that it does it's gonna be several years but if you drive up by exit 16 on route 7 to its combo you'll see they've got concrete blocks and they're digging away on the south side to the bridge above toward the bridge above that side so it's not the joyous time of a more aggressive connect sure things take time I mean up in up in grand isle they've got a new drawbridge it's taken many many years but takes a lot of covid didn't help and it's it's taken a lot of tenacity hard work by certainly some of you here in this room yeah those who are not in this room as well yeah it wouldn't be where it is without everybody who's been a part of it we appreciate it and thankful yep for all of you yep I'm not seeing any other questions George there's anything else you wanted to add okay I will recommend that the city council award the Crescent connector phase two project the lowest bidder engineers construction incorporated and authorize hamlin engineering to manage the construction phase of the project and authorize the city manager to execute the contracts second any further discussion hearing none all favor please signify by saying aye aye those opposed say nay great that passed unanimously or he would have been voted off the board wow thank you rick thank you like you know you're getting punchy we'll see you this summer next all big yeah thank you rick appreciate it and Raj you wanted to bring up the minutes yeah a couple quick things in the minutes um and I just found this one page 115 or sorry line 115 um I don't know I just saw it so I'm going to bring it up Bridget this spelled with an I to yet it's Bridget Meyer and I know it's not as she spells her name but more importantly what I was bringing up the first time was part of line 104 in our conversation about the stipends just the word vision on line 104 I think it changes the meaning of what the discussion was um I think the original word was aesthetic and then changed to appearance I think vision in this context would refer to how the board sees the future of the community as opposed to what I think the conversation was actually about would you propose an amendment so 104 change I think damn changed it to appearance so I would go with that so change the word vision to appearance in the end of line 104 as well as on 115 Bridget Bridget VRI DGET yeah not IT all right anybody have anything else all the identity boy yeah so you'd like to make that motion to amend I moved to amend the minutes as described I'll second any further discussion hearing none all favorably signified by saying aye aye those opposed say nay pass unanimously and that will bring us into the consent agenda the approved consent agenda second any further discussion hearing none on favor signify by saying aye aye those opposed say nay great and so now we will go into the reading file and board member comments the only thing I wanted to mention uh the board of civil authority met right before this meeting for those of you who weren't present for that and made the decision that voting will no longer happen for this voting in April and for this upcoming year of 2024 voting will happen at CVE so Champlain Valley Expo it will not be happening at the high school this should allow for more parking in terms of accessibility the parking will be on a flat surface you won't have to go up a ramp it will be heated and or air conditioned depending on the temperature it won't be in a school so that way in terms of a school safety standpoint you won't have guests going into the school and so that crowd control will be able to be managed significantly better especially as in case you did not hear about the the school shooting hoax that happened today that dynamic would not be played out during voting so be on the lookout it will be different but it will be a an exciting change and hope that it it goes well it's any member have anything else hope you're doing second oh wow witch all in favor what else you have all in favor say I I hope I'll say nay have a good night everybody