 Well, I want to ask our first presenters for today to Come to the front and we have Leonhard Geier, Paul Metvessel, Tom Beckmann, Robert Huschfeldt from the University of Potsdam Presenting their project asymmetric performance in virtual reality and code Sorry, I have a bit of an involved setup. Okay, that's looking good. Yeah. Hello everyone. So Yeah, we're from Potsdam. We are rather new to the community and we've been looking at some of the Things we've been doing recently in our group anyways, which mostly revolve around life coding and most recently We are and we're wondering what sort of aspects might also be of interest to this community And what we found we tried to condense in this work that we'll be showing you in a moment So the first of all virtual reality I suppose some of you have used it before at least heard or seen about it the part that interests us the most is this idea of having a Full of the body accessible to you for interactions and in a sense also a very rich Antimediate feedback that you can obtain So if you're inside of the arm and you're interacting with something you can literally see the thing that you're holding And I am from the computer point of view can direct what it is So if I'm trying to give someone feedback on the interactions that they're performing I have a much more direct means To provide this feedback to the performer that is inside of VR as opposed to them having to turn back to a screen for example Major drawback if you've ever used VR you've probably realized this entering text just sucks. It's no fun. It takes ages, right? so looking at current Ideas of live coding which typically would involve text at least all the forms that I've tend to have seen It's not really suitable to be doing this entire in VR So as a first step to try and reconcile this idea of having this full-body experience with great feedback with the idea of being able to even Do any sort of live coding we tried to combine the two benefits the great efficiency of working with a keyboard and The great experience that you get from being inside of free arm So next I'll briefly talk about the setup of our demos that can even understand what is happening Then we'll show you that very demo. Hopefully it will work We have a video backup otherwise and then we'll go into some of the more technical details as well as a reflection at a discussion So briefly for you to understand as I've mentioned We have one performer that is at a laptop and another performer that will be in VR The performer at the laptop will be programming the squeak live programming system that you can see on the left Where we can create new methods that define loops Of MIDI sequences that are supposed to be repeated Whenever I am safe a method in our side of squeak It will be automatically synced into the VR environment and also remain at the same position You can see on the right-hand side these grey blobs are supposed to resemble the message that spawn inside of VR The colorful circles will be cylinders in a moment as you'll be seeing and there resemble instruments and the idea is that that the Performer and VR can take any of these methods With their physical hands and put them inside of these cylinders in order to schedule them for playback Meaning the performer in VR has the option to decide when something is played Whereas the performer inside or at the laptop can decide what or how it is being played by literally modifying the source code One aspect of interest or relevance maybe as it's kind of hard to see The altitude at which the performer and VR is placing the methods inside of the cylinder Effects the volume at which the samples will be playing so that allows them to kind of fade in things or fade out, etc Okay, we're just luck. Let's see Okay, the tracking volume seems to have moved a bit to the right. Let's see how it goes So I'm now in this squeak environment and I'll be starting by providing Paul with a simple Yeah Loop for a bass drum. So let's do a random bass Just good. Thanks. Mm-hmm And I'll move on to define a loop here I'll make the loop configurable so that Paul can later decide that wants it to be played and We will take a bus drum here for a quarter beach and We'll have four of those So the moment that I've now put this here You'll see that this exact code has spawned in VR as you can see on the right-hand side and Paul can now take it and Schedule it on any of the instruments Right, that sounds pretty good. So let's do some more stuff And provide him with a hi-hat pattern Okay, we're back. Nice. Thank you And for this I'm actually gonna generate something here And what is this is essentially doing is I'm asking the system to generate me a pattern of 8 and 16 nodes Using open and closed hi-hat. This has now been copied to my clipboard. I can paste it in here and Paul now has this method as well Accessible, okay at this point I will load the rest of the samples that we've prepared and Paul can interact with the system The BPM got reset So you can see in that there's a lot of Maybe should work on the organization I suppose Paul is now Getting one specific type of method which instead of a median node on and out of generates MIDI control nodes and You can schedule this as well to apply different effects to an instrument. All right Yeah, thanks for indulging us on this rather lengthy demo So a couple words on this react MIDI system that has been running there in the background. You've seen that it's essentially been this idea of Having these loops that generate MIDI events and this instance I've zoomed in a little bit on one of them You can see if you've defining this loop here and small talk code which gets four different inputs that get repeated Three or four quarter nodes in that sense a C4 C5 and then arrest and you can see how This is a declarative loop in the similar manner that you've might see in a pattern on so The interesting part about this being somewhat Inspired from the reactor s system that you might know from web development is that in the moment that I changed something for example if I If we assume that the timer is at the C5 at the moment and I've had to change this C4 to a D form and save the minimal change to make this Thing happen will be applied to the running system meaning without having to wait for a loop iteration to end for better or worse This will now Immediately become the D form and as soon as the system reaches this point in time So the idea really is to maintain as much of the state of the musical system that is running and Reconciling it with whatever I change in the code in the same way that Reactor s does hot reloading If we contrast this to other systems that you're probably more familiar with with super collider, of course most of it happens on an imperative level meaning if I want to update things I can Set new parameters to reflect the changes that I want to see him or in sonic pi and where I Can use named loops that when I re-execute the code sort of Wait for the one loop to finish before the new code gets played for the next iteration Why is this relevant to our system? Well the interesting part here is that We in this sense maintain one very specific property and namely that everything that is visible in code is at all times Looping meaning the performer and VR doesn't really have to depend on any Code that my I might have deleted changed or anything But rather whatever is currently visible is what is actually being informed by the system to be interacting, right? This doesn't necessarily mean that it's playing right now at least not in the way We've designed it here because the VR performer might not be scheduling these in the moment But whenever they want to they could do it one Interesting property of this is as well that we have great access to Having long sequences that can evolve and then also be adopted while they are running right because in the same sense that I can have One very long sequence of nodes. I can also introduce stateful variables So for example, if I want an chromatically increasing arpeggio and that just keeps repeating I can introduce a state variable in my react code and that maintains its state whenever I do a save And just for example, if I then change the exact distances that the arpeggio is playing Will resume from the current point that the state variable has reached and another useful property specifically for this Dualism of performing I would say is that errors are being shown to me at reconciliation time Meaning whenever I at the laptop press save Paul can still interact with the system in its old state Only once the system has verified that it can it produce a new valid musical object to him It will swap the two trees or rather apply the minimal change and then that becomes the new live trim So if I have to deal with a mistake here that I did Paul can still continue performing inside of we arm change Whatever is playing etc so a couple of thoughts we want to leave you Here that we noticed while performing with this We noticed that Paul was really making the calls whenever we were trying out the system That means obviously he was responsible for scheduling the notes that were playing So by the very definition he was making the calls But it was also interesting that he was asking me to perform certain changes Since I had all the power when it came to actually introducing new musical ideas that went beyond remixing simple ideas That were already present in the code We also noticed an interesting dynamic where I was sometimes anticipating changes that he might be interested in But also that I was sometimes exaggerating Changes that he was requesting so when he asked me to maybe lift something for an octave I might raise it for three octaves Sometimes without him noticing in time and then having this interesting dynamic of him try having to like Get to terms with this change that wasn't entirely what he intended But what I sort of threw him there as an opportunity One thing that you've also seen Paul do briefly in the demo was using the the arm methods as almost like a Percussive instrument where he was sliding them up or like quickly toggling them between different Instruments having the sort of more beat Like quality through them as opposed to just being a simple loop that keeps iterating and one best practice that we noticed over the course of using the system was that That really was really helpful for us to split melodic ideas into different methods So that Paul could swap them out individually and to decide okay And I want a different higher pattern only but keep that drum pattern as a base So a brief look into the future one of the more obvious things is that we want to be our controller is this amazing Analog means of providing input to be able to also provide more input than just scheduling things One idea would be to expose more parameters But in the more general sense we could allow the VR performer to point at any variable in the code and modify its value By changing the position of the controller for example One other thing that we noticed while performing was that having this idea of Transactions or groups of instruments or other methods might be of value because it was rather difficult for Paul As you've seen as well at the end to sort of make the performance stop Because he had to individually collect all the different methods that we're playing at the moment So doing something like a break is obviously not really feasible if you have four instruments playing and only two arms and one aspect that might be of specific interest to this community is that You've seen the code was quite verbose and right now This is mostly because that's sort of the level of the positive that we were comfortable with stealing and also Understanding it when we were handing it around But I think it is quite viable to also maybe embrace some of the ideas that we've seen entitled in terms of patterns and similar things to make this more conducive to Really improvising also on the laptop not just in VR So if you're brave and want to try the system there's the link I will warn you that it is a rather cumbersome setup Which is also why we are grateful to be able to swap to the first lot here But yeah, if you have any questions on this we also Happy to answer you and the GitHub issues and with that and thanks for your attention. Yes. Thank you Tom Thank you Paul for this also for the wake-up performance basically for all of us Next up it's Ian cluster. I Must look for the full title. He will present his paper lamdor Towards the generative audio workstation and he's from coming from the Georgia Institute of Technology Also questions and discussion we do at the end of the session all the papers are quite different in one in one way But very similar in the other way that they extend or implement life coding technologies the life coding paradigm into a different domain and So is Ian once he's blocked everything in cool Stage is yours. Hello Thanks Patrick for the introduction I'm Ian. I work in the computational music for all lab with Jason Freeman at the Georgia Tech Center for music technology and I'm here today to tell you about Lambda and How this is a step towards a generative audio workstation? so Lambda the name has two components perhaps the most obvious part is DAW because it's in all caps and that of course refers to the digital audio workstation, right and So this one in particular is Reaper and Does generally have a bunch of tracks in parallel You can see them in the mixer You can see them in the timeline and arrange items in them and you get this very nice interface for doing direct manipulation Right, you can just drag things around and say I want this piece of musical material to occur at this time And I'm gonna put it there The other part of lambda is of course lambda which gets alighted with the DAW and That refers to you know the lambda calculus computation and in this musical context that brings to mind for me things like patching systems like pure data or max and then also computer music languages like super collider and of course all of these wonderful live coding languages that are built on top of it and so the basic question for lambda is Can you have the best of both of these worlds can you have the direct manipulation of the DAW and this ability to just bring in material from wherever and use it and Can you combine that with the flexibility and the power? of code and the ability to make your own musical abstractions and use them and Another way to put that question is Sort of looking at it from the DAW perspective. Okay. I have audio items. I have MIDI items What if I have musical material that is a computational process? What what does that correspond to? In the timeline or in the DAW? So I'm going to talk a bit about related work But before I do that, I want to show you like a 20-second demo just so you have some idea of what the thing is I'm actually describing so Here's that Let's see. I did plug in the cable and it did work a second ago Oh, no, I have a bunch of videos so we better Take a second to get this going Okay, I'm just going to mirror my display instead and see if that works Sorry for a bit of it. Let's keep the changes and now I go through that again All right This is what I get for switching from Google Slides Okay, I will try one more time It refers to that Okay, so if you only get one thing from this presentation It's that like that's the basic idea and the rest of this is just expounding on that and why I think it's good So Okay, so a moment for related work So if you think of computation in the DAW This is probably the obvious thing to think of is you know plugins VSTs audio units all these things that let you Add some computation into the effects chain sort of an analogy to physical effects pedals and These are really useful, but they sort of apply for all time generally and Also, there's the separation where usually these are sort of already built for you You're not I mean there are a few interesting exceptions But generally you are not composing a VST at the same time as you're composing your piece and then in live coding of course there's So from the DAW perspective, we're taking code out of the effects chain and putting it in the timeline from the live coding Perspective we're taking it out of the editor or out of the IDE and bringing it into the DAW and Lambda draws on this emphasis on brevity and expressiveness as an inspiration and You can also make an interesting comparison with code jockeying practices. So this is a screenshot of dead code by Jamie Beverly and in lambda we'll talk about live coding with lambda in a minute, but the sort of Normal mode is this compositional mode where you're Working on a project writing expressions changing the expressions seeing the output and there's sort of an analog here with building up a collection of live coded snippets that then You know you you trigger later and sort of this session view like interface then jibberwocky which By Charlie Roberts and Graham Wakefield claimed the title Live coding the DAW, which is a really good paper title that I wanted but But the model is a bit different. This is more like you have a max for live device And then you can live code that and have it, you know output things according to your live coding so more still more like using Ableton live in that case as an engine for performance more than a sort of compositional environment with a timeline and Then I can't I work on your sketch. So I have to mention it But this is a pedagogical tool for teaching students to code by making music and vice versa And it very directly just juxtaposes a DAW and an editor But there's not really an integration between them and you have this script that sort of generates the entire DAW project in one go Okay, the main inspiration though is this stuff on end user programming. Okay, so Everyone loves this thing, right? It's it's a 2d grid you enter some data We're already off to a great start But the really cool thing is you can enter formulas right and you can do that anywhere you would enter data This is an old idea, right? This goes back to like busy calc There's a really great quote here, which is gonna look like long But and for a slide, but here it is because I think it's so good All right when software allows adding dynamic behavior is part of gradual enrichment It supports programming in the moment Spreadsheets support dynamic behavior with live reactive declarative formulas that you can place anywhere you would otherwise have data They treat data and formulas equally where they appear in the interface how they're edited and how they reference each other This interchangeability supports programming in the moment by allowing you to keep working with the same tools and the same mindset Thinking only about the specific thing you're modeling even though you've switched to programming They don't force you to stop and switch to your programmer hat And I think this is maybe the nicest paragraph anyone has ever written about spreadsheets And so and so I've included it here because I think it's really inspiring I mean, you know, it's sort of it's prosaic office software But it has this amazing feature where you can bring in computation and do it without first becoming an expert And it pays off very quickly Okay on that note there's an interesting project by Chris Nash called Manhattan It sort of does this for the tracker interface, which is quite like a spreadsheet So you can use expressions to determine various parameters. It also supports control flow, which is neat There's also some things you can see in proprietary software like After Effects where you can put expressions to determine properties of animations And then there's these ink and switch projects. That's who I stole that quote from potluck and ink base which both let you Do some of this end user programming in pretty free-form environments like just a tech arbitrary text document or a sketch really cool And then computational notebooks that probably everyone is familiar with This sort of goes in the other direction, right? You start with code and then you're enriching it with markdown la tech widgets plots all these things And that's another inspiration for lambda Okay, so what it even is lambda like you saw like 20 seconds earlier after I got the video to work But it's basically this so you have a DAW you have a programming language and you have time Okay, the DAW in this case is Reaper the language is Python and then you have these embedded snippets on the timeline Okay, so Remember that thing with the three pieces. Oh, what is the code piece? Okay? It's expression items So you can turn any item into an expression item with a little equal sign sort of like in a spreadsheet And so I'll just show a couple of examples probably not all of them in the interest of time, but Let's see I'll show one more I'll skip around a bit Yeah, there's a few more examples which maybe I can come back to if I unexpectedly have more time But for now, I'd like to move on so You might have a very reasonable question looking at this, which is okay. This is very nice for like cute one-liners and What about when things get more complex or when you want to build your own abstractions? How does that work and the answer is project modules? So every DAW project has an associated Python module That gets loaded to establish the environment that's used for executing these expressions and the items so This is Python so you can you know, there's a nice ecosystem. You can import lots of things like Raphael was talking about yesterday and So for instance, you might put imports in your project module Standard library imports like math and random very useful. You might pull in some music theory libraries or you might pull in Alliatora, which is a library of mine that you can use to synthesis things You can also build up custom definitions in here. So Like transpose or arpeggio, which you saw before and then you can also for instance, just run external utilities and had that triggered from Evaluation in the DAW timeline And then finally you might be wondering how if you refer to another item in the timeline by name And an expression, you know, you're using it just like a Python variable. How does that conversion work? so there's a default behavior for converting audio and MIDI items and For converting iterables back to these from Python, but you can override this behavior So say that you want strings any expression that returns a string to automatically go through text to speech Then you can define a custom converter that does that for you Okay, now here's that the main demo Hopefully, yeah, I think we're good. So I'll play most of this Thank you in Okay. Yeah, there's a lot of things here to discuss which maybe we can do at the end of the session But just in terms of future work, I wanted to mention You might have noticed during that live coding session some hitching once I added enough things like the UI paused a little bit Right now all that evaluation is just happening in Reaper. I'd like to move it out to a separate process so that Well for a bunch of reasons, but one of them is so as not to block the UI Reaper is pretty cool and also supports video and sub projects and all these types beyond audio and MIDI That would be nice to work with Big question for me is how to make this like reasonably like accessible to people I think just saying okay. Here's an empty Python module figure out. What's good to use is maybe not the right approach so Maybe it'd be good to have some kind of starter kit or you know default module to work with Another question there is, you know, how how to Encourage people to use this without feeling bad when I break it inevitably So I'm open to suggestions on that and Yeah, in the long term, there's this vision for having a An audio workstation that's as adept at working with generative audio generative music as it is with digital audio And this is a step. I think in that direction But there's still right now after you evaluate you still have a fixed output And in the really long term I would like to be able to export a generative piece directly from the dot that preserves that generativity of the items I don't think I'm especially close to that, but that's you know part of the long-term vision Okay, now I'm done. Thank you So thank you Ian next up is Dimitris Kiria Koudis vielleicht maybe okay great Presenting his paper usek a lispy modular sequencer for Eurorack with a live codable microcontroller and Dimitris Comes from the University of Sussex Okay. Hello everyone. I'm gonna be talking about you seek which is a Eurorack sequencer module that I've made with my PhDs what one of my two PhD supervisors Chris Kiefer, so My name's Dimitris Kiria Koudis I I'm in my second year parts on PhD at the University of Sussex where I'm studying live coding instruments and instrument design and practice with Chris Kiefer and Thor Magnusson and we're part of emute lab, which is the University of Sussex is lab for experimental music technologies, so Both Chris and I are Well, we're live coders we have been for a while. We've made our own languages We make digital musical instruments. We play physical instruments as well Feedback cello the piano saxophone And we are very passionate about modular synthesis and we really like performing so instruments to us are a way to to to sort of have this sort of in-the-moment connection, especially when performing and We like live coding we like hardware modular synths, but there are some problems So with live coding for example, we find that we already spend way too much time in front of laptops as it is and and the fact that our other Interests and hobbies are also computer-based really don't help in that. I'm sure a lot of people can relate And then we often find that it lacks some of the embodied and sonic qualities that we find in other instruments And so we're looking for ways to mitigate that And then with hardware modular synths, perhaps one of the first people thing that the people will notice about the practice is that It's not the cheapest thing. There's a reason people call it Eurocrack and And specifically when it comes to sequencing the sequencers can be a tiny bit too large sometimes Or they can be a bit too rigid in the sort of music that they allow you to sequence or they can be a bit menu Diving which is not fun when you're performing or in general And generally they can sometimes get a bit boring playing with them And if you don't believe me these are some of your acts most popular sequencers today They all cost Perhaps north of 400 euros Just for a sequencer. It doesn't make any sound And and the user interfaces leave a lot to be desired. I think So So we were wondering what what can we do about this? Is there any way that we can sort of combine our passions and and and and get some kind of synergy going on between live coding and modular synthesis And then maybe hopefully at some point in the future make an actual product out of this so To begin with our high-level goal is we want to make the combination of live coding and hardware modular fun We want it to be sort of a System that we ourselves would enjoy using in our free time And we want to keep what's best about each practice and there are different things that are best about each practice And we want to try and mitigate each practices worst with by sort of With a combination of the other the others best And to do that we really need to identify Understand and mediate the tensions that may arise Between these two practices and and we'll talk a lot more about that in a bit So those tensions can be ergonomic in the sense that the the two instruments Work differently with the body in space There might be Sort of fragmentation of what your body is doing you need to move from one from the laptop to the modular and back again Or there might be a good dynamic, which is What the instrument feels like to be played with what how how does it guide you and how does it inspire you and General what what is it that you perceive from the instrument that it wants or or or or it can be used for They can also be embodied and Cognitive so there's there's a lot of tension that might arise if you constantly need to switch between different Cognitive modalities if you have different ontologies that you need to somehow reconcile If you constantly need to be switching between thinking about the syntax versus thinking about the mob positions on the modular And lastly some of them can be creative and aesthetic So live coding and modular synthesis are in a lot of ways polar opposites in in this sort of Results that they can create or or the process that during which they Through which they create them. So we want to try and see what they're sort of in between combination And common ground could could be And ultimately we just wanted to make a live coding sequencer that we wish was already out there So our main objectives for this project was We wanted it to be limited by design. We wanted to make a sequencer and we wanted it to be accessible So it had to have consistent identity that doesn't change over time. It's a sequencer It's not another module that can be anything you program it to be there's quite a lot of them out there already And we wanted it to be fixed firmware. So We you flash it once and then your live code what's what's been flashed on the module and Then for accessibility we wanted it to be affordable As we saw some of the modules are quite sort of high-end and expensive really not Accessible to you to newcomers. We wanted it to be DIY friendly. It's a very simple hardware design and and we Believe that it can be built as a weekend projects by by an enthusiast and of course we wanted it to be open hardware and software which are Which are philosophies that both modular hardware modular synthesis and live coding really have at heart So that leads us to our research questions, which Can be stated as such What are the ergonomic and ergonodynamic tensions that arise between the practices and How can we mediate them effectively affordably and scalably so in a way that? Would if we wanted to go really crazy with it and life got everything about the modular We could expand this system to do so without breaking the bank So sort of a first we We took a look at the two practices and we tried to understand what it is that makes them what they are and how They compare in a lot of their sort of ergonomic and ergonodynamic characteristics Firstly and what I think is perhaps one of the most important ones Hardware modular synths are very limited. You select your modules month in advance of a performance You put them in a case you don't swap them out all too often. Some people might but And you definitely don't want to be plugging and unplugging them into the power supply while you're performing Although I'm sure some people have also done that and repatching them is Definitely possible, but it's it's tricky Especially if you only have one patch core that carries the sound repatching it means a temporary break In the sound whereas with live coding We're more or less unlimited by we're only limited by your CPUs and and and are in our minds So elements can be cloned forever. We can have a billion oscillators if our computers can handle that And then we can replace any part of the stack famously extemporary has the the the neat partly trick where you can change the definition of an oscillator and have every synth follow along and jump up in October 2 and all All the patterns that are currently active in a live coding set can be if you wanted them to can be swapped with just the press of a button so there's there's quite a lot of Flexibility and potential which which might be overwhelming to some but also might be very welcoming to others but also Hardware modular synths are almost by design very imprecise The the knob values aren't always labeled. You don't really know what frequency your cutoff filter is set at You don't know the exact decay in milliseconds of your envelope And that's by design them the the modules Want you to play them with your ears and not with your prefrontal Cortex So and this is it one of the best examples perhaps the maths module, which is arguably the most popular Eureka module It has maths in the name and yet I don't really see any numbers around the dial. So it's it's It's fascinating to me how they invite you to just close your eyes and tweak and see what sounds best instead of trying to round up to The nearest multiple of five Whereas with live coding there's a very explicit precision that's required Values have to be specified precisely. You can just say something around 40. You need to say either 40 or 41 or 40.5 and then it encourages the user to build an Intimacy with the numbers over time. So You build a personal relationship with certain numbers you you get a feel for what combinations work best, but you're explicitly encouraged to Look at the numbers and and try and sort of build a sense for how you want to play with them And then on the other hand it also it's it's inherently accurate and deterministic so Analogs in surf infamously sensitive to temperature changes or what time of day it is or Whether you had a good breakfast or not but live coding and computing in general is quite deterministic and quite sort of Quite accurate and on on point So there's really very little room for vagueness unless we explicitly other in using Randomness which in a lot of cases is also deterministic and Then something that's very important for the user and the player is fault tolerance. So We're dealing with really complex systems a lot of what we're doing with them is Guess work at best as to how it's gonna work out in the end and then hardware modular sins have For a long time now being designed in a way that are kind of child-proofed You can just patch anything into anything and worst-case scenario. You don't get any sound best-case scenario happy accidents And there are no compiler errors You don't get confronted with cryptic messages That might confuse you and distract you during a performance Whereas live coding and coding in general is quite strict about correctness I mean, you know the wrong semicolon or a missing coma here or there Ken and will break your code and this is this is just a Haskell compiler error for just changing a hash symbol to a dollar sign so That there's there's there's a lot of room for improvement there and a lot of people are working on that but as it stands Modular sins are a lot more inviting to have you mess around with them and and sort of not worry about About your laptop catching on fire if you if you type in a thousand instead of a hundred Lastly modular sins don't really allow you to recall presets so they invite you to just have To just have a sort of in the moment lost in the ether forever Relationship with your your system and your music And if any of you are Are sort of involved with modular sins, you know that there's a very certain feeling associated with just removing everything and starting from a patch from scratch Which which is Which can be like just deleting all of your code if you've built up some code over a session But the the tricky part here is that live coding Allows you if you want to do to completely preserve what's happening save it to a file come back to it You know a week later, and it will still be there The last thing which I personally find very Interesting for me is that live coding requires your hand to be locked in place you you're just mostly doing this You're not moving around You're not your hands are not moving around your body definitely isn't you need to be sitting in front of your laptop At least as it stands now And that's something that I'm Sort of looking at different ways of of changing in the future as part of my research And perhaps one of the best ways to show that is The the just just look at these images. They're very very different practices so on the left Colin Bender is a very Famous modular synthesis who's also happens to be from Utrecht And he's known for having these massive monster modular sins, which probably cost as much as Brand new car But but you can see that his studio is a place where he's just moving around from one One part of the desk or his setup to another. He doesn't even have a chair right next to him He's not sitting. He's he's sort of physically Moving around and and with that I'm imagining mentally moving around as well Throughout his setup whereas with live coding you are sort of there and You have this enormous degree of information complexity. That's just confined to 13 or 15 inches of a laptop screen and And and you're kind of focused on that one spot and your your eyes are your body is your hands are and everything So if we're to bring these two together, we need to find a way to deal with with that kind of tension and then lastly just to give another example of a lot of Information complexity and density. This is Richard Devine's modular setup Not a lot of people have this so this isn't this is definitely an extreme case, but you can see how there's a there is a Layout in space and all this information complexity is distributed across his monster modular And there's a lot of visual feedback In the form of patches which can get a bit overwhelming, but also a lot of blinking lights that trace along What's happening in the music? So very quickly. I want to talk a little bit about some of the context that exists already We identify two types of Solutions so this problem one is computer to modular and then the other is computer in modular And and spoiler alert the second is what we have chosen for ourselves computer to modular is There are two main solutions, they're basically audio interfaces that allow you to send code, but they Don't really run the code on themselves. They require your laptop They're mostly made for multi-track recording, so they have more inputs than outputs don't really offer any hands-on controls So you're left to your digital devices for that and they're proprietary and Pretty pricey so not really what we're looking after Computer in modular on the other hand is a lot more interesting and there's only two modules as far as we can tell That allow you to live code a modular One was presented at ICLC last year. I believe By alexanderos Drimonites and it's called code and then the other one is the monome teletype And and still both of them have some issues that we weren't happy with so they they opt for displace But they're small displace relatively so it's not particularly Practical to use them for coding They are again general purpose so they don't Guide you in any way or limit you as to how you're going to use them And so we we chose to instead develop our own Which is which we call you seek you for the Greek letter mu for micro and Capital seek because it's a big sequencer in a small package Here it is in this room. This picture was definitely not taken 20 minutes before my presentation and It has a number of specs which I don't we have all the time in the world to go into but it has the main part is for digital Outputs of four outputs that can send gates on and off triggers that that can have arbitrary lengths It also we recently added an expansion port so we can have as many of these as we want peppered through Iraq And they can all be synced together without sacrificing any of the inputs So a little bit about the hardware that's running on it we chose to go with a raspberry pi pico It costs around five euros. I got mine for three and a half pounds before inflation got too crazy It has quite a bit of IO so it allows us to have all of these inputs and outputs on the module, which is great and quite a bit of sort of processing power and storage space to to work with and then we Built the first prototype on a breadboard. This is the the one that you see in the paper Now we have a PCB for it, which we're testing so Hopefully you will be able to to put together a little DIY kit a little bit about the DSL I am gonna probably rush through it a little bit because it's not something that you've never seen before and also I want to get to the video before I run out of time It's based on a lisp because the it's a it's a small language core It allows for really tiny interpreters that can fit on the Raspberry Pi It's surprisingly hard to find interpreters what maybe not surprisingly actually but it's hard to find interpreters that can Fit and run decently on the Raspberry Pi Pico They're pretty Performance and they allow the user to change them by through metaprogramming Which we talk a little bit about in the paper as well and we chose to go with a signal style DSL I'll give you some simple examples I Can skip through this you can read that in the paper, but This is the modification that we made to the repl so Instead of just blocking and waiting for input It just checks to see whether there's input and if not it just keeps going through the the update loop Which runs? Anywhere from a hundred to seven hundred times a second Some code examples pretty basic stuff You can read a lot about this in the paper and there's a tutorial that we're working in on for the For the github repo and then finally Because I'm running out of time. I'd like to show you a picture of it being live coding live coded from a tablet So the the tablet doesn't need to run in your thick code. It just needs a serial connection to be sent to To the module And what we like about this is that it doesn't it doesn't force you to switch between having a laptop And the modular which you will see me doing in the demo video And the way that you connect to it is through a hacked USB cable that has a mini jack-on-one end So you can literally just plug into it And if you have five of them in your rack you can you can use a multiple and send code to all of them or Bonus picture of the 3d printed faceplate which can save a lot on cost total cost We estimate to be Below 30 pounds for raw materials and everything else you need And for the video. Oh That's not great Yeah, I can try Restarting One second. Sorry about this So it shows up here It's not on YouTube, but I can just find out on my Google Drive quickly Yeah, it's right here. I'm not sure why it wouldn't be playing So this is live-coded from a laptop and you can see some of the issues with moving between the two This is being live-coded through the Arduino IDE I'll just skip ahead a little bit to the oh, this is the dramatic finale So So very very briefly What we learned from the project we we really like how it that we have a bare-bone software stack We don't have that many dependencies. It allows us to Feel like the module it can be put in a case and just forgotten about and we're not gonna run into updates that break things There's a very clear scope to the module. It's just a sequencer. So when we're live-coding it We're not constantly thinking. Oh, maybe I should tweak my synth deaths or Whatever it allows for quite diverse musical outcomes and it's quite small and cheap and it sort of Tries to as far as as far as we can tell it works well with your rex philosophy of everything is a signal sanitize your inputs and so on We don't really like that the pico doesn't allow us to have many CV inputs. So it's quite limited in in that sense And they refresh rate of the update loop Would like it to be a bit faster and we're working on Sort of optimizing the interpreter that we're using and if anyone wants to contribute, please do We learned that Using dependencies that have documented source code are invaluable it's it's really hard trying to patch an interpreter that was written in 1980s style see with global pointers and mutation everywhere and and maybe five comments in the whole Was it six thousand lines nine thousand lines? file Lisp is a very good choice for this and and especially we want to look at my sort of Projectional editors that use touchscreen interfaces for for direct ASC manipulation in the future and then you can just live code with your tablet And then 3d printing module panels is a viable option. We need to do a little bit of fine-tuning to get To get the module looking nice, but it definitely is functional and it works Next steps are custom code editor. As I just said We want to make things a little bit faster and snappier, but that's not a breaking problem And we want to maybe try and use other microcontrollers or a wireless one. So this is the get hub repo please get invite involved if you like and I have a module here with me. So if anyone would like to see it Yeah, please please come talk to me and we can we can geek out about it more later. Thank you So, thank you Dimitris and you can just stay right here and I ask also Ian and the other guys to come up and we have some time for questions and Discussions and there is already a question back there by Nicholas Come up front. Yeah, so to answer in my case I repeat the question. Yes, sure. It's whether A lot of our projects seem to involve limitations by design and and whether we believe that It it forces us to sort of exert more control And and whether we have to think about it more is that is that okay? So in in my case in our case with the modular A lot of control is being delegated to the modular itself there's a there's a lot of other kinds of limitations by design in that system, but as The code is only responsible for one aspect of how the music is being made And that that kind of frees us to not have to worry I mean we can still be loose and use a lot of randomness and stuff like that But then it's up to the rest of the modules and how they want to deal with that sort of thing So it kind of it puts a clear Scope around what the code is supposed to do and expect it to do You know for use case I think it's also an interesting dynamic because of the inherent limitations that the respective system DVR system and the laptop system have So by the very definition of how it split up They co-depend on one another and have to deal with their respective limitations and communicate to overcome them Unlike systems where you might be collaborating on the same level and I suppose in the case of lambda. There's not Designed in limitations really in the same way, but there's sort of natural ones that arise from the UI Like you don't want an expression That's too long because then it's like you have to zoom in really far to see the whole thing or maybe it's just too wide so there yeah, I think You still have the same kinds of questions about how to manage complexity that you do with any kind of software thing But the tools you have available are a bit different like you can set up relationships between different things or you can Say all right, let's bail out and like put some more stuff in the user project modules More questions. Yeah, so I have a question for lambda About a used Reaper in the demo and I imagine it's because it's easy to build the things you did in Reaper But so what would you say how much work would it be to use like logic or Ableton? I asked because I I think one of the great things in Ableton is that you can control a lot of The plugins we are like for example midi. So you could also not only Use lambdas for generating nodes and stuff, but also use it for Example on one slider you you put a lambda or something like that Yeah, thank you for the question Yeah, I'm definitely interested in making it General and not be so tied to Reaper Reaper is very convenient as a starting point because it's quite hackable It has it, you know a reascript API and there's also some third-party modules that make that nicer to work with like reapply But yeah, I'd like it to be something where you can you have a variety of options for the DAW I Looked a bit at How scriptable other DAWs are and I came to the conclusion like this seems pretty doable and something like our door or Maybe zero them which are you know also have full scripting APIs. I'm not sure how Easy it would be or if it is possible to do it in Ableton Perhaps people who have done more hacking on Ableton can tell me but Yeah, that's it That's definitely an area I want to work on question for the first session Can you tell us a bit more about the reactivity like how it was implemented and what were some of the challenges? so in essence the reactivity that we have is a part from the ReactJS model to a small talk and The way that ReactJS works very briefly would be by constructing this virtual DOM idea Which we essentially doing as well just with Constructs that make sense in our context so it's not diffs and inputs and what have you in web But rather they are loops. They are not on they are not off events Etc. So in the end we obtained an object trim that can be a continuously interpreted and the activity then arises by Looking at a new version of that same object tree and the virtual representation of it creating a diff between the currently running and the new Tree and then applying the minimal change. So that means all of the state that I haven't touched is still intact etc and Yeah, that allows us to very nicely swap in and out Life while the whole system keeps running that answer question and Yeah, something I struck me about all the presentations is that when you start dealing with Direct manipulation, then you have to cope with mess like whether it's this growing timeline that you then have to decide what to do with or this tangle of wires or that all this these Virtual bits of paper that don't have to work out how to file Yeah, and I guess that becomes part of the performance then is kind of handling this mess or tangle I wonder if you have any comments on that Yeah, I'll address the infinitely growing timeline yeah, so Lambda it's sort of two distinct modes of you know composing and Generally like not having the transport running while you're doing stuff and then sort of the improvising or live coding where you have the transport running and it keeps generating new items and in that case where the it keeps generating new items and you get this timeline that's growing and growing I Think of the timeline then is not something you're really interacting with directly But as sort of the residue of the performance, right? So when you're done you end up with All of these items that serve as a record both of what output was generated the audio or the MIDI and also what code generated it So in that case, I think that the mess is sort of just a reflection of the mess of the improvisation Which I think is a nice thing to have But yeah, I think there's a question a Related question of like if you're just composing with this then You accumulate more and more things in the namespace Maybe things get out of sync and that's another kind of mess to deal with perhaps so Ties back a bit to the first question about limitations. I think that It's interesting that we have different limitations that would be a kind of limitation if you have too many methods in our system For example, it becomes just unrealty Which is with normal life coding. It's easier to work with So it's interesting to see that If you have limitations in one space it You tend to Get creative and the other spaces that are open for you. So I think limitations here help creativity so in a way, it's Maybe not that bad that we have them so in In the case of life coding a modular, I mean arguably there's Direct manipulation going on when you type in code as well, and I often end up in messes of Like ten or so blocks of code in my screen or around it and only one of them is doing something and I'm sort of trying to sift through all that does and what I find is that you you Over time develop the skill of tunnel visioning perhaps of just learning To focus on exactly the one wire that you care about right now Or the one knob that's hidden between beneath 20 wires And and you sort of learn to ignore a little bit of the complexity And then for me my personal approach is when it gets to the point where it's too hard to do that anymore It's time to un-patch everything and start from scratch and what I take out is The the experience and the knowledge of what I did that I liked in that patching session and how I can bring that with me but I Eventually I think with all these complex unless you're rich or divine. I would probably leaves that system patched in one way or another constantly I Think it's healthy to take a reset every now and again and just throw everything away question for the The majority of synthesis Approach so you talked a bit about it, but I'm still wondering why you Execute the code on the microcontroller and not on the computer Especially if you say one of the limitations is how fast it can be. Yeah, so that's a great question two reasons mostly So one of them is we wanted it to be scalable In the sense that you if you just want to double your processing power You just double the amount of modules that you have so one of the other projects that I mentioned As far as I understand and if Alex and those is here and can correct me, please do so but I It's it's a controller module that hooks to the central Raspberry Pi In in the case that runs everything and if you add two or three or four or however many of them They all just depend on that one Raspberry Pi to do that the compute work The reason of not using a laptop is because we don't want to be using laptops all that much In our everyday lives and we thought it'd be fun to challenge ourselves to try and see How can we live-code a sufficiently complex enough pattern and make sufficiently interesting music? With a simple device like a smartphone or a tablet for example Sorry Yeah, what's so different So the one thing is the locality of it. It's a lot more portable for the laptop you need to find a space next to the modular usually and and if you're anything like me dust Space is a big premium. So it can be tricky to do that with a tablet What we're one of our next steps is to try and mount that on the case itself So you don't really need to move anywhere Other than where your modular is and then you can take that with you and so on the other thing is that the touchscreen interface again as a sort of limitation by design Will probably Discourage you from typing a ton of code. So we want to get simple patterns get complex complexity out of interaction of simple parts and then Send that to the modular and start playing as quickly as possible without having to spend ten minutes building up some block of code So so and performance for sequencing specifically is not a big issue. We don't we're not doing audio rates DSP We can get away with a five euro microcontroller And and it works efficiently well For our purposes Okay, we must wrap the session up so that everybody has a break before the next paper session But all the presenters are still here first of all round of applause again for everybody and Of course, also all the papers are available in the catalog to read and we meet each week Sorry Sorry Yeah, we see each other here in ten minutes. So grab a coffee So hello again. Welcome to this last paper session This session is going to be dedicated about social implications and education and So let's welcome Giovanni Mori Giovanni Nulli and Francesco Corpi They are presenting live coding and education a practical experience Good morning, everybody. I'm Giovanni Nulli. I'm from Indira. That is a national national research center in Italy that work with schools. We are Public institutions linked with the Ministry of Education and the research center We have the idea to implement a project into into schools with live coding and We search for partners at the beginning to improve our Backgrounds so we create a partnership with Temporale and then for the for the project we Build a tender to select a live coder to help teachers to To improve Their coding Ability we decide to work with live coding in inside the music curriculum In Italy music curriculum is Music curriculum is Just part of the middle schools. There is no music. I mean that's that's nominal music into the Primary school, but usually it's very hard that you have a teacher that is able to teach music so the expert music music teachers are just from Students age that this begin 11 and 14 There is secondary schools that are Specific for music the music Lyceum, but we consider that to For two few students, so we decided to try to implement live coding into music curriculum for off of secondary school We want to try to understand as a research as a research question if the curriculum as it is is Is Right for for for this kind of activity and which are which could be the teachers Skills to have to be able to use live coding with students We propose this This activity to five Different teachers some of them as some live coding experience the other are at least able They are very good with the technology and then We decided to Ask them which kind of training they need to To use live coding in classroom. We create a group with two with all three of us and then we ask them to produce To produce lessons with live coding. So we are not providing examples with providing trainings in music and and coding and they discuss with us With how to consider less how to Create lessons in into the their normal course We we this first year we meet at least once a week to have To have training and to have discussions briefings and If something will happen that we need to discuss with them we select this This issue or idea and we have focus groups to point Which solution for the issues and how to implement the ideas We work in Live research mode And we ask the teacher to Let me say in an active pedagogy part into an active pedagogy paradigm, so They make students play These teachers are even before life coding Very motivated into this paradigm, so they were both technologically prepared and Motivated to let the student play I Underline this because not all the music teachers Have this approach to the music into the the the schools So some of them as a more Theory theoretical approach, so there are some base That are important for for us to To lead Life coding into classes and this is one of one of it so The teacher need to let the student play to let the students explore it both physical and Technological instruments So When everything started about three years ago, maybe if I remember well We we thought what what Life coding can bring to school has a has an approach has a discipline and We started to think about this this concept and After a bit we with your eyes that Life coding can be a good tool to use For teaching many different subjects. In fact, if you think about live coding The the first thing that comes to your mind. Maybe it's a tool to make music With code so it just from this this first thinking you you can involve music and Technology together, but if you dig a bit under the surface you can also See that life coding is not just music or For the main part of life coding for sure, but music and code, but it's also mathematics for example is also Improvisation is also In some way Civic education because as the community Promotes it promotes the equality. It's promotes An horizontal approach to technology, etc. So by using live coding in in schools we can teach many subjects all together and And On top of all All these subjects are taught by by having fun because Live coding is an involved activity and fun activities. So We thought that by having fun students can learn easily and Without Not without airport, but with less effort Some subject that sometimes are hard to teach especially in middle schools so for example maths is very hard for students in general and by Turning around the the problem with live coding. Maybe we thought that that it can be a good a good thing So We After a bit of thinking and a bit of exploration we thought that sonic pie was the best tool to use for this project For some main reasons the first of all is that Some of the professors that were involved in this project Already knows the already new sorry the the software so For them it was easy To learn sonic pie and then transmit the knowledge to their students Additionally sonic pie is also very easy to learn. So it has a very steep cure learning cure and Also For all those that yeah, they are quite accustomed to technology, but maybe not very much with coding so thanks to the Simplicity of since in taxes simplicity of Of reading the code, etc. They can learn sonic pie and live coding very quickly and then Transmit their their knowledge to the students additionally Sonic pie is multi-platform. So You can have a Windows computer Mac computer a Linux computer and You can install it in each machine you have so And it's free. So This this is a good thing especially in Italian school without many phones and Additionally sonic pie has also a very lively Teacher community so they they have there is a Forum a forum online where teacher from all around the world discuss Things about live coding and teaching live coding. So our teacher connects can enter in this community and discuss deeply the the subject with them and So We contacted we selected no maybe we We as a group We decide to build a course for for teacher on sonic pie as Francesco will describe Hey Yeah, so I'm Francesco and I basically help the It's off. Yeah, okay then So Okay So basically the course for the teacher was online we met once a week and Also do that. I tried gave some Individual support to the various teachers because each of them had some specific Things they wanted to try and also we use a group chat to also create this feeling of Making this project together So the main point of this course It was not really a course on sonic pie But rather like sonic pie was the mean to address certain kind of topics involving mainly algorithmic music and improvisation in live coding also It was very interesting to see how many things came up in discussion with together So at the beginning I presented kind of an idea of the topics I wanted to address during the course but the main point was that the Structure was needed to be very flexible because on the way we figure out a lot of problems that would have a rise in the class and So Myself I am I am a life-coder. I've been doing live coding for a while, but my main background is in the arts music so For this reason, I think I could kind of understood which were the necessities of the teachers and the main Way I try to introduce the concept was to translate musical concept into programming concepts So for example if I to explain how I can use an array I would say like okay think about a court a court is a collection of notes those notes are actually numbers and so in this way you could rely on some kind of prior knowledge the teacher has and by Explaining what for example an array is you're also immediately kind of pointing out some kind of applications of how that can be practically used in in yeah in in the program so We kind of can divide the course into two phases It was not like intentional this pleat But it's just something that I noticed more up posteriori and the first part was Mainly a bit more frontal in the sense that I was trying to really give to all the teachers the Same because some of them already had some experience other not and So it was an introduction to live coding to live coding in general really I showed like various tools I showed various Artists that are doing live coding in different ways and then we get into sonic pie So the interface and all this stuff and and then the first part was like introducing the various abstraction and sonic pie So starting really like from a variable a loop then introducing the various data types that we have Introducing a randomization Time states to start to like synchronize different loops. So I was trying to incrementally give an overview all of these things the lessons were kind of I Don't know half an hour 40 minutes of explanations and then I was sharing with them some examples of how to use these things So this part somehow turned to be More theoretical in a way or let's say more focused on the programming part and on the musical Application of those things in this sense the music was seen as an application of what we can do with the software And so kind of the last topic was how to write custom functions and to that point We have a discussion everyone and and we realized that probably getting deeper and deeper on the Programming was not the best thing to do And so like the second part started that was way more focused on How to use this kind of abstraction to make something? Artistically also, I mean not just to kind of say okay now I'm gonna apply this function, but really what do I want to do music wise and how I can combine it this this knowledge we develop together and So the first step to do this was to give some exercises that were kind of very guided Guided it doesn't mean that there was like a specific requirement, but I don't know an exercise could have been like Write an array Write three loops that iterate the array try to make changes. What do you notice? so like explore, but at the same time giving some Direction in the order of how to do this because at the beginning you know this stuff But you don't know where to start and this was the main problem and the other solution that proved to be very interesting was to Push the teacher to do some collaborative composition by sharing between them snippets of code So like just write a small code share it with your With another teacher and then that teacher continues the code and these kind of things it was very helpful and Then yeah other parts that were covered were like sound effects. That was because the teachers were all musician They were quite good musician and they also had some aside from the teaching they were interested in live coding as an artistic Practice so sound effects. They were asking like oh, how can we improve the Quality of the sound or these kind of things. So that was a nice thing to try out then also By the end of the course They were got very curious about the possibilities also of other software. So I introduced a bit Hydra in one session and then also like a teacher made an afternoon lab where they Involved the kids in having more multimedia kind of experiences. So that was also very interesting I I can say that by the end of the course. I was not even Really giving the lesson anymore, but it was just a brainstorming session where we were all together talking about the problems that were facing in the class and those were actually the most fruitful and important kind of meetings because there is where we talked about this project which Yeah Yeah, okay that I'll leave it to the conclusion I go on okay So yeah, this brainstorming session are actually probably very useful for us to understand all How the project was going and to also how to improve this thing? Yeah, so some of the challenge we faced in the class where lack of Existing knowledge by the students. So now we are talking about the challenge that the teacher faced in their activity so the first was that When I had to teach to the Teachers they had a solid music background So I could have this kind of conversion of their music knowledge into programming knowledge But then when you teach to a kid, it doesn't have any musical most of them and any programming So the risk is that instead of making your life easier. It just becomes overwhelming The point is that you can try to introduce this concept Making small steps. Of course the point is not in a music class The point is not to teach them how to code the point is to teach music to them So as also our main goal in this project is to have an interdisciplinary Approach to coding this could be solved if all the individual topics would Include some kind of coding because at that point and then you don't have to explain in the music class What is a loop? Because that's probably something you already know because you're doing coding in various class and then you can benefit from from these aspects the other point was that Introducing to like young creative something like life coding it means that as a teacher you get a ton of questions And probably you're not prepared to that so some of the teachers were not used to this But actually these lead to be an interesting thing because it means that the lessons become more Collaborative less frontal and it all will also really empower to the kids because they are like They see that you know, there is a problem the teacher is there Oh, I don't know how to do this. Let's figure out and then you figure out together And so you're telling them you will find this kind of problems and you don't have to be discouraged you just go on and we will do it and Yeah, and the last thing was mainly practical is that Like new generations, they are not really so much used in using computers. They use smartphones way more So not all of them had computers at home. For example One way to deal with this That we kind of thought about it But then we didn't really go through it because we were already an advanced stage was that we you can use like smartphone with Bluetooth keyboard and and have a browser base for example and Okay, I think Yeah, these are some examples we had of codes written by kids we are a bit short of time Yeah, so just Okay, yeah, I Just one word for the conclusion was like so the idea for next year goal is to involve different teachers from other topics and to understand how the kids are actually benefiting from introducing live coding and Then It's how then coding can be a way to transfer knowledge between topics. So these are mainly the thing we want to address next year So, thank you guys Just remember that the at the end of the session We are gonna have the answers and questions and answers in these questions and so on so hold on your questions for the next For the for the end of the session and next up is Alejandro Franco He's going is going to present towards another Transdiscipline art techno science and emancipation as promise and provocation for life coding Hi everybody Well, first of all, thanks to the ICLC team For this amazing conference It's always very nice to be here talking about stuff Now This will be dense. This will be difficult This will be also red so Prepared yourselves for a nice 20 minutes of me reading And also I might cough a lot So I'm not going to die. Don't worry. It's everything's fine But if I actually die It's what you to know that I die doing what I love the most which is Complaining about capitalism in front of a bunch of people. So all good Thank you Okay, so here we go In this text I deploy Nancy Fraser's theory of the triple movement to analyze and reimagine the field of techno scientific Art practice in general, but also apply to the particularities of live coding imagine community. I Provide an analysis of actor network theory and techno feminist Philosophical frameworks for the intention to reveal ideological blind spots introduced to live coding via these frameworks that obscure the political Dimensions of the practice and its community building aspirations. I First take a little to briefly explain the impact of such blind spots in a concrete community namely Mexican live coding scene and I then conclude this paper by applying the triple movement framework to the to a segment of the last chapter of the recently published live coding user manual Hoping to supplement it with a Marxist feminist framework so Okay, so We have to start by understanding what the double movement is So the double movement theory Was first proposed by sociologist car polanyi and it refers to the historical pattern of capitalist societies in which social institutions such as healthcare and housing Become commodified by the market leading to a decent bedding of the economy from society as a response Struggles to reinvent the economy in society emerge through the creation of social protection such as subsidized social programs labor laws and taxes This creates a double movement between marketization and social protection So what is important to understand here is that the economy is this embedded from society and then re-embedded again And this is like a loop that is unavoidable Okay, however Nancy Fraser argues that Polanyi's double movement theory is not deep enough to avoid the oppressive nature of re-embedding the economy in some societies Which can then adopt nationalistic ethnic and or patriarchal politics like fascism historically and right-wing populism movements today She argues that that to avoid Oppressive protection a third dimension must be considered and this one is emancipation So that's how I particularly visualize the triple movement, I hope that helps I am never sure In the current political stage Movements towards emancipation are overly critical of state oppressive protection Consider the following the market mimicking the grammar of emancipatory movements co-ops them while commodifying society Eventually when the market crushes people turn towards oppressive forms of institutional social protection Feeling hurt and upset by what they perceive as a failure of emancipatory movements But in actuality is the market that has failed a clear example is anti-immigrant politics and Some ideas that are put into people's minds about how for example Housing becomes unaffordable because there's so many people coming in from outside fortress Europe or from South of the border in the US Etc So Frazier's triple movement theory Proposes a pattern that recognizes the market's coptation power by integrating a Marxist critique of capitalism Into emancipatory struggles and re-embedding the economy into society through Emancipatory mobilization So yeah, this is how Nancy Frazier supplements the double movement with emancipation as mediation So With this framework in mind, I will attempt to answer two questions in relationship to current forms of artistic and scientific Transdisciplinary Tackled in the first part of this paper What is the role of technoscientific art and its ideologies philosophies like actor network theory Technofeminism in relationship to the ongoing global struggles between marketization social protection and emancipation And if we understand transdisciplinary as a movement, how can we provide an emancipatory mediation between the arts and sciences? That's prevents the formation of both oppressive institutions as well as market-driven industries So First let's tackle a tour Now the focus is on discussing actor network theory and its implications as well as the need For a marxist critique in feminist theory to protect it from marketization The actor network theory challenges the nature cultural divide and emphasizes the neutral and infinite Connections between culture and nature He suggests that the mere act of observation affects the objects of the experiment Making it impossible to distinguish between what is cultural and what is nature as such culture and nature Always intertwined However, as losin argues Actor network theory Can be critic for failing as a political framework because it conceptualizes mediation as politically neutral thereby ignoring the oppressive structures that shape society Marxist feminist antifascist and the colonial mediation can help us to see how networks perpetuate an invisibilized market or an oppressive institution in The case of the art science node the industry either the art market or the techno industrial complex on the one hand and Academic traditions like post-positive is scientificism and or white Eurocentric art tradition on the other hand Moving on to the case of technofeminism Technofeminism acts as a monist emancipatory mediation between market and society However, because of technofeminism's route in post-materiality It lacks the historic materialist class critic necessary to avoid being captured by market forces as Cotter argues new materialist feminisms naturalizes the market and women's exploitation by capitalism and invisibilizes class relations Therefore, it is essential to integrate a Marxist critic to protect feminist theory from coupling its emancipation to marketization As Frazier argues the pressing task for feminism today is Reconnecting struggles against personalized objection to the critique of a capitalist system that while promising liberation Actually imposes a new mode of domination now I am Wait Yeah, we're still there. Okay Ultimately for both techno scientific art and techno feminism If they neglect the power of Marxist critique and class struggle their emancipation their emancipation draws the risk of multiplying neoliberal subjectivity and techno feudal dominance the science art practice offered by Bruno Latour and Also via Latourian frameworks falls back into the loop of marketization and oppressive protection Technofeminism separates feminism from class struggle avoiding oppressive protection, but deepening marketization. I Will now use a triple movement Theory and take further the critics to act on our theory and techno feminism to understand certain Particularities of the Mexican community of life So now yes there Okay, so There was a Very big and transformative revolution in Mexico between 1910 and 1930 It almost broke a hegemony, but it just didn't but at the end of this revolution form of social protection emerged and with time and Key in this timeline the 68 Mexican 68 This oppressive this social protection became oppressive. It became oppressive from social protection Unambiguously This went on until the 80s who are emancipatory force that we are calling right now Democracy emerged and challenged this oppressive form of social protection Yeah, run for elections and failed to Grab power because of a election fraud. So context then neoliberal forces took power in 1988 1988 selection and In an attempt to appear democratic and transformative, you know copting the grammar of social of emancipation Established the National Council for Culture and Arts Conakulta and the National Fund for Culture and Arts Fonca however According to Tomas Ajea these institutions only reified a power structure who are wealthy minority dominated While the rest had to compete for resources to give you an idea according to these guys research 10% of Fonca beneficiaries Horde 50% of the benefits of Fonca while 90% has to fight to you know for the Leftovers basically no so The fragile neoliberal order broke around 2015 there are many reasons for this the international ones perhaps, you know Like a Trumpism Brexit, etc. What the more particularly in Mexico? Insane race on violence which led to finding of extermination fields in north of Mexico concentration fields Camps I mean extermination camps concentration camps, etc Which just broke a hegemony completely the neoliberal order was in crisis and there was no way of anybody believing anything that could be said On the name of neoliberalism So right now the current political moment is marked by a crisis of hegemony With a move away from dominance of neoliberal marketization towards a new kind of social protection In the context of art in this context art practice art Practice is being reimagined to feed this protective attempt But it is met with fears critical positions emerging from emancipatory movements such as feminisms multiple feminisms The colonialism and open source software Which I will focus a little bit more since open source software is like a somehow close to live coding oh I'm still in the right slide. So all good Okay Well, Mexican communities that relate with open source software principles And the live coding in particular Provide infrastructure and spaces for new social bonds Resisting state sponsored art state state concert art creation institutions and fortifying emancipatory emancipatory mobilizations They remain vulnerable to marketization The reason why Mexican live coding remains open to a market oriented escape from the current crisis has a double source The pervasiveness of state politics in tandem with the lack of Marxist class analysis normalizing the transnational aka the global north academic and artistic environment for instance Open source is deemed often as quite political But actually somehow politically agnostic Because of the same time that they can provide us like Also in live coding a framework to share ideas to share, you know material means Etc. It also allows a space for you know big corporations to experiment Or to bypass legal frameworks that protect people from their predation So open source can either work for some or for other people, no Live coding openly embraces open source software's ethos It also remains open to techno feminism and actor network theory as frameworks from which they have whipped Ideological positions useful for the dissemination of live coding as a transnational project It is worth interrogating the ways in which this ideological frameworks also introduce the aspects here critique the neutral and monist connections of a Laturian frameworks and techno feminism Into live coding when they are used as a social theory to explain its own community building processes So next slide. So this beautiful wall of text Is a bunch of questions that perhaps people in the Mexican live coding community could relate to and you know Think about or something The questions that require further research in an environment like Mexico's electronic art scene are Which artists are successful in this context? Which artists recognize as rewarded and rewarded with grants and prizes from the market? Can art that critiques the market flourish in this scenario? Moreover, what happens to the artist that can be integrated into neither the market nor the state apparatus? When all theoretical framework can explain the precarity or frank poverty of artists What have affects are engendered and what is the responsibility of well-established? artists facing this situation How can successful artists avoid stigmatizing artists that are perceived as angry because of unequal well-distributed redistribution Will the art course of techno scientific orientation communicate the audience a co-opted form of emancipation and finally those technology in live coding settings appear as a self-serving tool for artists and researchers to build careers and To be complicit in capital accumulation So, okay that I Will now tackle I will now talk about the recently published users manual for live coding edited by MIT press and Also, there's an experimental version of it that has been unleashed in heat lab, which is a pretty interesting way of publishing a book In particular, I will focus on the last chapter that describes what live coding wants I like this that like like coding desires things know and the moves through the sire I Will focus on the land I already said that in this segment the authors give an explicit Political orientation to live coding while also distancing themselves from another political framework so The true spirit of the left is not to be found in a social estate But in the liberty of playful expression the play of making new rules new algorithms and new structures is indeed a Technological speech act, but one that brings into existence new kinds of social relations as well as human-machine relations so this is a very interesting segment and I Wonder what the triple movement has to say and can't say about about it. Okay So Sorry, I just got lost in my script now We need to approach the distinction of anarchism and social in socialism proposing this segment Freedom as implied in this text is assumed to be a movement away from social protection here understood as the structural violence Apparently inherent to the socialist state Perhaps as a first attempt to make sense of this snippet I will formulate it from a delucian what are in perspective Which calls for a playful experiment as an escape from an overly codified social conventions This process could be described as the territorialization It's always followed by re-territorialization So yeah in other words The game for a sandwich theory the Lewis and Cotterian frameworks Is to permanently be one step ahead of the abilities of capitalism to reabsorb the energy liberated by the lines of flight Such processes must be faster than capitalism's digestive capabilities Pharameli drawing from sapatismo and men's assemblage theory and calls for a slow and constant de-territorialization Rather than an accelerated one Thus a fundamental question we should ask for life coding is whether the playful expression of life coding is slow and constant Or if it participates and enables the speed of capitalism The process of the territorialization that the playful expression of life coding favors appears as the locus of liberation However, the movements between the territorialization and re-territorialization Must be understood as a necessary feedback loop to transform social structures and processes mediated by emancipation In this way the playful expression of life coding in the look table your course followed and or preceded by a form social protection or marketization, oh Yeah, okay, I believe there. Why not? If the loop between social protection and emancipation is Inescapable the question of the commons via anarchism or socialism is inadequate What is relevant is to orient ourselves towards the process of emancipatory mobilization Interplaying with structures of social protection Regardless of an anarchist or socialist framework I suggest that the political potential of life coding is something yet to be explored that is irreducible to neither anarchism nor socialism Finally perfect Just in just in time finally It is worth Interrogating if life coding practice can anticipate post-capitalist modes of production by aligning to an anarchist spirit or perhaps points to the dialectic transformation Anarchism and socialism that makes them both Commensurable as political turbulence Instead of favoring one ideological stance like coding has the potential to transform both by acknowledging the need for Dynamic political processes and structures to conclude the playful expression of life coding as a form of research and art creation Can be a powerful tool for emancipation But it must be mindful of the feedback loop here trace the movements between social protection marketization and emancipation Thank you Thank you so much Alejandro So for the last presentation, but not least We are having Alex McLean and Julian. Oh hoover So with The meaning of life from art without audience to programs without users And thank you to all the organizers and all the people making this happen Lovely already Is that good like that? Don't have to bend down Okay Yes, so we'll try to have a dialogue a little bit on some very very simple Things that everybody knows so nothing new only old stuff but just to Kind of start a discourse on things that one easily forgets and that go back to the early stages of life coding We do this talk actually as three persons one person is here But you don't see her Renate visa who has written also the paper with us. She couldn't come unfortunately. So We hope you keep her in mind The black slide is very important. So this is just also this is just the Kind of a Skeleton of the paper, but it's backwards. So the paper is in the other way around So if you don't don't worry if you don't recognize it, it's it's backwards So I think the the starting point was like we both were a bit unhappy about a certain Reception of life coding in the computer science community or maybe more in the software engineering community maybe one could say Where it's kind of said, oh well life coding. It's always been there. That's nothing new and on the other hand It's life what we call life programming and artists do something strange actually, right? Yeah Yeah, they call them sales live programmers explicitly to separate themselves from the life coding community and Even though we kind of use live programming live coding interchangeably We've come settled on live coding. And so this other community of people who call themselves programming language experience designers or the future of coding and They kind of tend to call themselves live programmers and But the same time sort of occupy the same kind of territory use the same kind of references Look very similar and but there's something very different about yeah And what is the interesting thing of it about that? I think is that through looking at that one can kind of carve out what is special about life coding What was actually a new step although of course it has its prehistory But where life coding was a term actually where it turned it we can make it a little bit more precise So What yeah, let's go one just just comment that that one thing so so I mean this this whole the whole point about the software engineering and live programming is to make this this work this labor of Making an application More efficient, right? I mean it's a lot of work and we've seen we see right now We see a lot of other work Done towards that with automatic auto completion basic basically of code or automating Software writing this goes back in the history of programming language to programming itself Which is originally was automatic programming So it's about making this process more more efficient But in the end you always have an application that is then used right so That is kind of the The strong thing that that where you need this interactivity because it's very hard to imagine what a user wants You know you have to parameterize out what would the interactions be and all that right? So this is a difficult work. So you need interaction So so you so you integrate the This this kind of Interaction into the development Hmm so but Yeah, but the word efficiency Implies already implies that you have something you want to do and you want to do it as fast as possible So it's like beaming your ideas into the computer And the aim is to make it really seamless The kind of endgame being to have a you're a link device plugged into your brain and just download the code into the computer And so kind of the aim if this is what you want to do is to remove Programming and just make it about pure expression from your genius ideas Channeling from the heavens into the computer So strangely enough live coding is not about obviously right? I mean for I guess for everyone here who knows live coding. It's it's obvious. It's totally obvious That's not about this But there's this this presence of the activity of programming somehow there which is irreducible Yeah Yeah, you're not trying to make things efficient because then you'd finish your performance really quickly And at the end of the performance You might delete or your code and that's not very Efficient thing to spend like half an hour working and spent and delete it Yeah, so yeah, it's something quite different activity Yeah, let's check our notes Yeah Yeah, okay, so so yeah this activity of thinking about a Later application where you need to think about what will be the the interaction in the future is I mean if it's there in live coding It's very local to this one process, but it's not delegated to a later application where you have to think okay There's gonna be a Slider for this you know like you don't need I mean the very simple thing is you don't have a Graphical user interface you have to design and then use that's of course one of the first steps And that that is maybe the simplest example of A deeper thing about not having an application Yeah Yeah, the code becomes a kind of with live coding the code becomes a kind of interface to yourself because you're Kind of trying things out asking the question. What if I do this? What happens to me through my through this kind of unfolding of the code these in this kind of Unpredictable yet deterministic structure that makes these patterns or ever And then you experience it see what that code does to you what it means and then that informs your next question Yeah So but what's the point so where's the difference now? I mean apart from that simple fact so What we found that they're actually two meanings of life or they're actually more but That's So so one kind of liveness in In the program I mean they're very general two meanings of life which We can find as Epitomized or as realized in a technique technological in the programming World so so the live programming live or I don't want to actually use that word because it's also live programming What we I don't like the difference between coding and programming Terminologically, this is really stupid like I Think you know this one kind of life is when you embed the runtime process into your Programming environment to make application building more efficient, right? So this is the one side The other other kind of liveness is to make the programming part of the runtime process whether where the program itself cannot really run as Specified without being programmed. So if you if you take a bit of a live coding patch and run it and then wait Then the program runs incorrectly It needs to be reprogrammed So that's the difference and and that's also what what is was this? so Yeah, what is very hard to explain sometimes because if you do this kind of If you have this imagination of being someone who designs applications Only right. I mean everyone Needs to design application everyone in once in a while, but that's not what live coding is about so so there's a division of labor between the users and developers and Even in cases of end user programming which we had today. I think there's still left I mean that is very close, but there's still left this aspect of getting things done So you want to you in integrate programming to make the task More Flexibly being solved and in the end you have your Excellent spreadsheet correct, right and then it's done It's you know, it's still this aspect, but it is a spectrum, you know, it's it's not completely black and white Yeah, somehow when you talk to software engineers about this This idea of using code in this way is seen I think it's something that all programmers do through Rebels and things command lines, but it's seen as a marginal activity So bringing up the possibility of evaluating code in an editor framework With a software engineer. They said, oh, no evaluations just for utility So the way they were saying, oh, no, that's only for use. That's that's that's not anything valuable just use And so there's just like a strange disconnect between what we're trying to do which is to use code in order to And as part of a making process where the code is woven into that It's just seen as marginal Things where you're just making use of it If you as a programmer using it, that's not part of the actual outcome Yeah, and in a way, that's pretty obvious. Yeah, I mean it's not telling nothing new and in a sense We we thought about like it in the big for the beginning of life coding that also wasn't such an unobvious thing, right? It was not so And so unobvious, I mean I was always surprised how hard it was to explain to even like really knowledgeable people who I Adore for their abilities. They just didn't get the point and it was very hard to explain and the question is why so why did it appear in the art context in the 1990s one can say that there was some some basic agreement About that that's something about like life coding would make sense I think and it's but it's in the art community and it was a critique of software as a commodity and Also of art as a commodity That was very strong at that time and that was basically Comes very clear in the Hamburg data art movement, which is also Which took place or was connected to the chaos computer club movement and all the 10th chaos computer Congress Where could I sleep and and yes, they were presenting things And here's an example just to make to give one point how they Formulated that this was when I studied that was the first diagram I saw on the on the publication that was laying around It's called the dry dry shema and it and it's kind of strange And it tries to explain different relationships between people who do things and people who watch things right and between arts and audience and the Kind of the right most is this classical performance thing right you have a Performer on on a stage and the audience watching watching and and you can see that liveness In that in that sense of distribution liveness has has something to do with this image Like live broadcast TV, you know, like you have a camera and you can broadcast it live into the hall to many many different Audiences and people it's about distribution And the the left one is is what they call for care, which is exchange German for exchange or something like that in that context and there this Audience is dotted so it's just accidental can happen that someone watches it, but it's in a sense in a sense I mean it's also something everybody knows right it's not but it's it's interesting to put it out front and say There is something That is art without audience And it happens in the semi-official space I read it out the semi-official space is a place that makes exchange possible data art net art is art without Audience there's nothing to be offered no sender addresses a receiver So they come from information theory with this. This is the whole cybernetic Thing in the background and they say no, I mean that it's not a it's not a transmission as such And so you have all these runners at that time that still exists, of course participatory art net art meta art Artistic research is more now I think which which kind of goes into this Which sees the audience not as the main address? addressing I don't know what comes next actually. Oh, yeah, right changing grammars Yeah, when when we organize changing grammars renata me and we all met for the first time It was it was at that place where and auntie Esker and court ice-lim were working and it was obvious that an audience is not necessary that was kind of Bottom line and you can trace back some ideas of life coding to that I think in retrospect I have to say because it never thought about it honestly But it's so obvious that I didn't think about it But sharing screens for example was not in the initial moment like for an audience as such But to share a space even I think for you in the clubs. It was about sharing a practice. Yeah Sharing the making process Yeah, and so so programming as ongoing thing was also About not producing a product and showing how best to produce the product But about doing that process together and we had this seminar called Zuschauen in spannen programmieren watch relax and program which projects called on the screen and people would sit and have this receptive attitude and just Comment and maybe some program programs a bit more and listens a bit. So it had this spirit Yeah, I think there's something important about sharing screens When because it becomes like an oral practice then Becomes visible as an oral practice in that you're not recording things necessarily you're not Writing code and then releasing it. It's much more writing code for the moment And without sharing the screens, that's not visible and it's lost it loses value And I think this is a problem with oral culture in general. It has so many There's trade-offs, but it has so many and plus points and by oral culture. I mean not written down Which is strange to talk about with code because it is obviously written Yeah, with with actually making it visible you can't really give it power to To continue as a practice you need to need to share it If written scores have so much power and have overtaken so many oral cultures Because simply because they're written down they have presence after the fact But if we share it during the fact then we can regain territory and create space Yeah, I guess yeah, right this this showing has this emancipatory aspect like in the frené movement and the French education reform movements where they show children how to make books for example in the 19 early 19 early 20th century and To so the kids lose the respect for the book Right they they see a book is being made is and it can be changed in principle So to project something means and and to have access to it in discussion or directly You see that a rule is is made and can be experimented with but it can also be changed So you think about conventions and so on and think about also consequences and you You know you you you you start a rule and then you play with it for a while It's not about being Because it's we have this tension between anarchism and and socialism or like like you know like rule and an anti rule I think that is very very good. And this this dialectics can be directly played out in In cold Or in actions and so on in rules. Yeah Comes a form of speech So these always forgotten ideas they're always there, but they're easily like swept away I don't know some somehow that there is exists art without audience It's very normal for all artists that usually exists in their studio things that they don't show or They show only each other not the audience right or also there is art without audience like kind of a practice And there are always programs without uses But it's something to to cultivate and so that's So now it's time for questions finally so if you have a question, please come here So we can share with the people in the industry me any question questions Well, I refer to the last talk and Yes, I can I don't want to take this space here. So anyway I Thought that was very remarkable to see Exactly you both that are from the beginning of this movement that It's also nothing you that was pointed out so much nothing you that these are the two authors the most popular used frameworks in life coding today like cheatleap still supercollider and time cycles I can say that because we had just the exam in the 10th birthday, and it was pretty obvious these two Frameworks don't call the applications, but it's not so easy to not call the applications so You have users and you are the authors that talk about being reminded that programming as programming is The activity of programming is the actual point Now I see that what has been created and I thought that was pretty obvious It's yeah a lot about our engineering topics. You pointed out yourself. So how we get To better life coding practices how we can prove it It's about gravity. It's about conciseness is about speed Of altering code. So I'm not so sure if there is not What is the program ontological difference even between Life programming life coding what I see here is has become a lot about life coding But not so much about life programming that You reminded us to think again. It's always one question. So You have users and You both the most Of all here. So that's my question. How do you deal with that? I mean, you didn't address that Our users are not users they're developers if you wanted to use it in this. No, that's the point We I think we write languages not to have users Yes, yeah, I guess It's nice to not draw the distinction as much as possible not to have a core team of Developers working for the people not to encourage feature requests, but to encourage people to share ideas that aren't requests, but more like discussions I think there's different ways of Making a community or making space for a community that's kind of undermines this normal distinction between user and Developer I quite like the word janitor in terms of Tiding up more than kind of Developing something for other people I think when you're running a workshop teaching people you learn so much and so it's always like a two-way exchange Or seeing new ways of looking at your software So yeah, it's nice to kind of break down There was another question before you Shelly was first I think Hi, yeah, I had a question for the first speakers Giovanni Giovanni in Francesco You said at the start of your talk that you Were interested in how to do introduce live coding in schools in an inclusive way And I just wondered how you're defining and evaluating Inclusive and if there were any particular Methods or approaches that you found that were particularly useful for developing inclusive teaching well we We use the word include inclusive because a A lot of teachers when we proposed That kind of key activities said that they could be useful for an afternoon lab instead we ask for a Curricular space into the lessons that because often could happen that the afternoon labs are For students that that has family more aware about this kind of activities So we think that the curricular Time and space is more inclusive Then could you repeat the question my memory is not so Okay, okay, okay. Well Before evaluate We ask the teacher in which way they consider that kind of activity That it means that We have mainly two way to consider to to consider that kind of activity the one is New way to explain something that is already part of musical curriculum the other one is this is an Instrument to play with They are not so separate, but mainly they were there were these two different way to Consider that that activity The the first part the first way was evaluated Let me say in a traditional way, so they they study some part of music and and in a different way, but it is evaluated In how the students learned That part of the music curriculum the second part is a more executive way and the evaluation was was done Between students, I mean, let me say if the the the the the pieces the music is The student like the other the other students like the music and then the teacher evaluated from the He he say to produce a piece of music that should as Some characteristics, then he evaluated How much this music that the the code produced by the the students match with the With the Teacher ask the teacher question to the students and I don't know if I was clear. Sorry my English sometimes. It's not so good Okay, and we had the problem that the teachers Asked themselves and to one of the groups if they should In some way evaluate the algorithm algorithmic part The group decided that this is this is not necessary I mean first of all because they are music teacher into the music curriculum second because They they felt not confident to do that And and how to evaluate an algorithm that was used for music I mean They said they proposed to evaluate If the algorithm is more scientific than another but it's not a Music characteristic, so they don't want that didn't want to do that and we consider that this is not I mean Useful for musical curriculum Oh, sorry Sorry to interrupt Yeah, so I have I think you have we have a queue of questions here, so let's continue with that Well, the queue can grow the question is can they then all be served? Thanks all for the very interesting talks I had a sort of Question or maybe something to reflect on for the last talk Because yeah at the start you were talking about How yeah programmers who are working in maybe Engineering or or in business I agree that that it's always about efficiency that that that they want to Make code that is very efficient, but at the same time I see that I mean development cycles especially for web-based Use of code has has become really fast and could almost be seen as live I Know from people who work in that sector that's that actually When they expect a lot of visitors they enable and disable certain parts of the code So the machines don't don't get overrun And I think in that case I actually also I wouldn't see the visitors to the website as users But rather as participants in the business model In that the actual people who are really sort of using the code are the developers themselves who continuously evaluates if If the code they wrote is serving the purpose if if the the costs of writing the code balances the Prophets made with the code So I thought maybe maybe you can reflect a little bit on those aspects because I think there's a lot of sort of live programming and Maybe almost life coding happening there With of course completely different capitalist purpose Yeah, I think yeah in the paper we talk a bit about DJs as an example And I think what you're talking about here is liveness also control about whether you have these Consumers who you're trying to control to extract most money from By yeah being as live as possible, I suppose And you can say the same as DJs. They have the role of as someone who's controlling the crowd or you can see them as Creating space for the crowd giving them the story or responding to them And and so yeah, you can say that's live, but it's live for a different purpose. You're not inviting People into your development process. You're developing things as quickly as possible in order to control them Yeah, so it's interesting how live coding and DJing sort of move together and these different ways of approaching DJing And also It's an interesting way of them looking at live coding not saying that One is better than the other but saying there's these different kinds of live DJing a whole discourse around much longer older than Live coding and we can apply that to that Yeah It's good that you mentioned the dark side of life coming Yeah, this is kind of Participation is an ambiguous thing right making people participate can be very Can be very oppressive and it can be very liberating So it's neutral in that way Yeah, so We are kind of a short of time, but let's see if the answers are Maybe Okay, just a quick reflection We have been discussing that on the importance of the community and the community being something that is not mentioned in the manifesto for example and This idea of community and where live coding being and just in time activity and maybe a community so activity in a practice in a community that the audience disappears is that the place that Can where live coding can be? Position in a in a way that it actually can escape this Capitalistic rush of productivity that Alejandro and you in a way we're talking about is is that something would like to Anyone wants to commence on that is that the key point is that the meaning of escaping capitalism is that the meaning of life? I think that The key is to understand this dynamically Something at some point might be feel that I'm provoking a weird feedback loop here Like something that at one point can be In months in months evaporating at another point cannot be I guess the the thing is that that There are concrete situations and these concrete situations need abstractions for pedagogical purposes or for purposes of understanding like epistemological purposes, etc The thing with abstractions is that if you don't You know to the concrete abstract and then concrete back again They sort of remain like floating there as fix entities, right? I think that Yeah, just Something that can be liberating At this point If evaluated in another concrete situation Can not be no and I guess that's that's the key No, I don't think that what Julianne and Alex are pointing towards. Yeah, of course. No, but I guess like the point that I'm trying to make is that there's always like We always have to be analytical about it. No, and we always have to Understand the whole context around a particular situation Don't understand it better That works for you. Yeah, cool Okay, so I'm sorry about that but I need to wrap up this session But you are gonna be there. I think for the lunch So we can just keep going with the discussion Outside with the lunch and we also invite you to the next concert, which is like ten minutes It's going to be a concert in ten minutes with Niklas repel and money Cooper. So just rush with the Just wait a little bit before all the other people in the back are also entering and taking a seat But in the meantime, I will briefly very briefly Introduce Maria Balman for my personal perspective I Think I started Becoming interested in creative coding and open source communities Maybe like 12 years ago. I was doing this master's program called new media art and digital culture And then I started interviewing. I think like 21 people Around this crossover between art and science and the influence open source communities And I one of the first people I interviewed was Maria actually, so I don't know how long this is to go But yeah, it was Yeah, it was really nice and actually one of the inspirations here also for me to or to start creative coding Utrecht and well start creating communities and Yeah, so this is a bit my personal History Maria, of course, I still remember the Algarave in 2013 where you front row dancing So, yeah, I'll leave it with that Oh, yeah, maybe The second sub team of the displacement is about human machine entanglement and this is Maria's topic When she will dive into Take it away. Thanks Fabian So first of all, I want to thank creative coding Utrecht for inviting me and also organizing this conference I think I heard from Philippe that this was coming up at some point And he asked me whether I wanted to be part of it. I was like That's a lot of work. I don't think I have time for it So a big thank you for all the people involved to making this happen I've been around the projection era of life coding roughly since the start I think So I actually even though I was not live coding myself yet at that time, but I still remember Being at the ICMC in 2003 and where gay one was was presenting his first paper on Chuck. I Remember the performances of power books and plugs, which I found really inspired I Asked Julian whether there was a rebounds tour coming up not yet. We still have to wait 10 years. I think And I also really remember a performance event at the sea base in Berlin I think during trans mediala were also Craig Latta was performing and This is the Swedish duo of click Nilsen and Olsen So I've seen a lot of life coding I also remember Really heated life coding battle between gay one and Nick Collins In Madrid no Barcelona. I just remember the venue was really really hot It was Even to watch it it was a performance At the same time I've also I think always been quite critical of life coding I've been using code as an interface in a lot of my work but Actually the performances life coding performances that I've made I Just look back and there's like four performances really that that I developed In all of those I avoided to stand behind the big table to life code I I've been refusing the this big bar black block on the stage So I've always battled to get some space on the stage to move and Yes, so in all the perform all these performances I've also always reflected on the medium of life coding as well So I'm really happy to share some thoughts with you in the coming hour or so Should be a little bit less, but then we have some time for discussion And I want to start with some thoughts that I developed for the first I still see I think back then I just watched back some videos from from that And I think we've settled on I still see I think then we were still wondering whether it was a click or something like that To pronounce this conference. I think it has settled now. I See Alex laughing. So I guess it has So back at that conference. I was talking about embodiment of code So I'll start with some some fingers that have inspired me in my work about embodiment and technogenesis So one is to book the embodied mind by Varela Fumpton and rush They wrote like by the using the firm embodied we mean to highlight two points First that cognition depends upon the kinds of experience that come from having a body with various sensory motor Capacities and second that these individual sensory motor capacities are themselves embedded in a more encompassing biological psychological and cultural context And then the second citation is from Catherine Hills She's writing about Yeah, digital technologies And our relationships and development in that And she wrote like conceptualization is intimately tied in with implementation design decisions often have theoretical consequences Algorithms and body reasoning and navigation carries interpretive interpretive weight So the humanity scholar graphic designer and programmer work best when they are in continuous and respectful communication with one another So I'll just leave these quotes there and they relate to what I'll be talking about This is okay, so Code is embodied by the human and that we adapt our minds to understand the language And somehow the the order got messed up We adapt our vocabulary within the language to express our concepts then we extend the vocabulary or the language and Also very much of thinking is shaped by using the language if you've written specific snippets of codes quite often Those become part of your your regular Vocabulary and also our typing skills are Shaped by the language that we code in and I have one example one of my Screencast from from my first live coding performance Was watched a lot and at some point on the superglider mailing list There was a discussion about the auto completion in different editors And someone was complaining that he'd seen this screencast and said like other the auto completion in in Skell the e-max interface editor for superglider is so slow And I had to react and said like there was no auto completion used there So apparently I had embodied the code so much in my fingers that it was confused with automation of the machine so But yeah, basically the idea is like that Development of our low life-coded concepts come out of this continuous dialogue Between ourselves and the language both during and in preparation of the performance Then to the other in the other direction the code is also embodied by the machine and This is also Something I've been thinking out With my dad when he was still alive I talked a lot also about what I was doing and he had been in computer since the late 60s So when we talked about live coding, he actually said like well You can't actually really change the code that is running because but when it is sent when it is at the CPU You can't change it anymore So he also inspired me to look up some some papers on how early computers were designed So the 1950s and 1980s there were some other Architectures in particular the ones from from boroughs They made these big mainframe computers and the hardware for these computers was a lot more complex than Then those of their competitors because they were designed based on the requirements of the programmers So the hardware was adapted to accommodate concepts for programming Rather than the other way around which was in in the other types of architectures Where the programmers basically had to deal with the physical properties of the hardware design and that's still if you If you go to the lower levels, we're still using like these these multiples of eight bits for memory links and that's really a Decision that was made by hardware designers of these for Neumann derived architectures that this was The most useful way and then we shaped our methods of programming around that Of course nowadays Programming languages that we are using in particular also in live coding are more and more abstracted from the hardware But it's still interesting to think like okay, what what could happen what would have happened if We would be live coding on completely Like machines with a completely different architecture So I want to highlight some some works that deal with the physicality of the machine One is to works from Jonathan Rose. You see him here performing iMac music What he's doing here. He's actually live hacking into iMacs While they are running code and you see the projection of what's happening on the screen, so That's that's as live hacking or live coding as it can get in a hardware sense Similarly also in 2011 he had this work called laptop music Where he was also using electromagnetic coils to pick up the the sounds and the electromagnetic waves That were going on within the laptop as he was also processing algorithms to manipulate that sound Also quite interesting is this screenshot from beta blocker from Dave Griffiths Which was a virtual 8-bit processor with 256 bytes of memory and a small instruction set so Into live code in this it was really Yeah, manipulating the program memory of this virtual machine Which resulted in these graphics and also sound In my own performance code live code live This performance was actually prompted by a friend of mine who asked me to do a live coding performance and I was like Okay, when does it actually make sense to to to live code of course Yeah, you can just play back the code and then it's the same thing. So I was sort of Thinking about this and I thought okay. Let's let's use just the input from the internal microphone as the input So that's the main sound source that I then start to manipulate with the code And then I was also using various others inputs Like the keyboard touch pad track points that were in the computer and also sensors like in those times You had accelerometers who were monitoring how much you were you were shaking your your hard drive So they could be blocked and protected and also the camera I use as a sensor to sort of the laptop also sees me moving and So I was using these parameters also as controllers that I could then map to different parameters in the sound and Yeah, also quite important. I was performing this with actually the laptop on my lap Not many people actually use it in that way So we'll show a short video of that this was sort of remake I did in 2020 In the 10-minute live coding challenge organized by a creative coding Utrecht I Had to hack around a little bit because all the code was not working on the laptop that I was using anymore, so But you don't see that so it's a screencast so So I will leave it at that the full performance is online. You can find it through my website So I want to read go a bit deeper on these thoughts on the code embodied by the human or as you also could put it thinking inside a system Sorry made this diagram To sort of illustrate how usually what's the usual setup is between the live coding that we do Within the live coding language for example superglider Which in itself is implemented in a language like C++ and that is compiled to machine codes that runs on the CPU I might forget a few layers, but this is roughly what's going on and Often within the live coding language, we've also created our own framework for example like creating classes Having developed our own dialect So there's an additional layer there Yeah, and this this annotates the different connections between that So I want to and I think this was also in the previous session addressed a little bit About constraints and limitations So I want to to cite a Chapter by Rorubarhal and the compo in the superglider book But they wrote like in programming as an artistic activities in general the need for constraints is at least as important as the desire for features Limitations are themselves features that require implementation and they also wrote a Bit further in that chapter Where wherever a program is not a black box that is a closed system in which the user has access to only input and output But an intermediate step in development or composition The specific way in which language is constructed makes some things easy to express and do and others harder Thinking within a given language some ideas may never occur and I've highlighted the last part in blue because I think that's a very important Aspects to think about which not only in programming but generally like our language influences a lot on What concepts we can even think about I? Don't know a lot of you hopefully speak man multiple languages and sort of know Yeah, how how some of the languages, you know You can express certain feelings very well and sort of concepts and in other languages. It's a lot harder to express those They also on the other hand Wrote there that computer languages not only intertwine process and description doing and saying but they also name Enable the construction of other languages or systems that in turn become the basis of new programs And they elaborate on that with if a program is something like a recipe for a cook It resembles just so well just as well a recipe for a recipe or even a recipe for the construction of a cook Yeah, I also want to this this also then then goes to the creativity of the programmer and back in 2001 I was at a symposium organized by sonic acts in Amsterdam Called the art of programming and they were discussing a lot Yeah, about the role of coding and programming in the arts and I was I had just started Making electronic music and I remember that Robert Hanke was speaking there and he was stressing To all of the people in the audience who are mostly also artists saying like yeah It's really important that you write your own code and you develop your own code to make your music Shortly after able to live Happened Similarly, I Want to share this quote with you from an article in the philosophy plus art book Where the author wrote this can lead to the bizarre situation where programmers make commercial software which practically generates music And yet somehow the users of the software are seen as being more creative than the programmers Here programmers encode their musical style in the software and the users go little beyond guiding that soft the software to a destination pleasing to them this can be seen in filters and plugins of music studio software as well as explicitly generative commercial applications such as a corn pro The creativity of programmers is tapped into flattery of paying users I don't know who recognizes the quote Anyway, the important takeaway here is that You should find the language that suits that fits your ideas of conversing with the machine about Structures sound visual output or any other medium you might want to live code And it also raises some questions like when you live code within the framework or language of another programmer Are you actually engaging in a dialogue? With their musical concepts or concepts in general And what does that mean for offer ship? These are just some thoughts. I want to put out there Then I want to go back to the the physical entanglement So the embodied process that's that we are in while we are live coding So in this paper I From 2015 that I wrote I made this diagram This was before I worked with graphic designers who makes make really cool diagrams So this is this is sort of what I come up with like we have these concepts that we want to express in code then we are using our motor systems to To tell the keyboard these these these concepts Then they end up in an editor and we have a display of what is in the memory buffer of that editor So we can actually check are we typing what we intend to type So that's one feedback loop and then we send Basically the yeah, what is in the editor is sent to the memory code of a program We are interpreting that code and then it goes to the CPU generating output data Which generates the output medium? and That's we perceive again with our sensory system and that influences our concepts the Same McLean from 2006 in 2011 said something about the brickolage programming Which I also think is an interesting concept in this Which he described as a creative feedback loop and composing the written algorithm its interpretation and the programmers perception and reaction to its output or behavior and Further only he wrote there at the beginning the program I may have a half half formed concept which only reaches internal consistency through the process of being expressed over as an algorithm So I want to give another example from my work This is a performance Which I performed between 2013 and 2017 and that was I performed it for more more than 20 times of different venues and the whole process of that was Yeah, going between sort of building the instruments like the hardware that I was using Sort of creating a composition and performing with the piece So I was developing codes physical instruments sonic textures and also a movement language step by step Yes a combination of gesture and live coding the gestures are measured with accelerometers that I wear on the wrists and then I have like five buttons on my hands as well and During the performance. I'm alternating between Moving and controlling the sound and live coding to change the relationships between movement and the sound Yeah, so one of the concepts when I was with this work I was also yeah, this also led me to think a lot about okay. What is this relationship? Yeah between performance building an instrument composition and I'm one of the the concepts that I came across from a sort of interdisciplinary Improvisation was this idea of instant composition Combines the notion of working from the moment instantaneous creation with the intention to build something composing a piece with an audience presence That means that for us Improvisation principles are always connected with both the question of freedom and the question of structure And I think in that live coding is quite unique Because with most improvisation the intended structure is not apparent until it unfolds because it stays in the heads of the The performers but with live coding we can actually as an audience read the code When it's projected we can actually read the the intended structure before it unfolds and And but then also the life-coder may decide to change to change it before it is unfolding So in a sense Life-coded code is a folded structure that will unfold as it is executing and its output becomes experiential Yeah, but we may at any point intervening Unfolding and change the course just gonna see if this helps, let's see So we are continuously creating and displaying possible futures There was an alternative one, maybe I will check that one seems to have done something hopefully No, okay. It's quite fitting. It's at this moment So the life-coder is continuously creating and displaying possible futures of the performance and creating alternative Futures at the risk of crashing in the moment And I think that's also what life makes life coding unique the expectations of where the Performance may go or made explicit to the audience by projecting the structure Yes, so for the last part of this this presentation I want to go back to the top left manifesto So maybe a quick question. Who has read this top left manifesto? So that's quite a few and who has been involved in writing it Okay, I see one sort of Finger there, okay So I try and unpack it a little bit and I will see if I can get back Projection take this one out. So I have to click through a little bit So I want to unpack the Yeah reevaluate this manifesto there we are So it started with a lot of demands so And I'll try to perform this give us access to the performer's mind to the whole human instrument Obscuretism is dangerous show us your screens Programs are instruments that can change themselves. The program is true to be transcended artificial language is the way Code should be seen as well as heard underlying algorithms viewed as well as their visual outcome Life coding is not about tools Algorithms are thoughts change us our tools. That's why algorithms are sometimes harder to notice than chainsaws So just just to contextualize this this a little bit. This was in the era where Actually laptops were just about becoming affordable to two artists. I would say So a lot of people were annoyed by seeing a performer with just a laptop on stage And this was seen as quite boring. So there were basically two reactions to that I think one was artists started to explore how to get away from from from the laptop and and create alternative Instruments with sensors and stuff and one of that was the the life coders who Yeah, I wanted to show Yeah, what's actually happening on that computer are they reading email or are they actually doing something that relates to what we're hearing I Also sense that there is there is a Demand for democratization and also empowerment through transparency Then the second phase it starts to to Get a bit more nuanced So it says we recognize continuance of interaction and profundity but prefer insights to algorithms the skillful Extemporization of algorithm as an expressive impressive display of mental dexterity. No backup and I think the The first media for backup show a little bit the time when this was written Who still has a mini-disc player? Who still knows what a mini-disc player is? Okay, that's a little bit more Um So this is also this reaction I think Yeah, this physical performance versus mental dexterity and also emphasizing that there should be risk in performance Then the last part gets even more nuanced So it is not necessary for a lay audience to understand code to appreciate it Much as as it is not necessary to know how to play a guitar in order to appreciate watching a guitar poor performance So this was also a reaction to two people say like yeah, why project the code? No one understands it code is difficult, etc. Etc. So I Think that part is definitely a reaction to that And that's a life coding may be accompanied by an impressive display of manual Dexterity and the glorification of the typing interface Um Performance involves continuous of interaction covering perhaps the scope of controls with respect to to the parameter space of the artwork Or gestural content particularly Directness of expressive detail whilst the traditional haptic rate-timing deviations of Expressivity and instrumental music are not approximated in code. Why repeat the past? No doubt the writing of code and expression of thought will develop its own nuances and customs so again, that's that sort of yeah stressing this this Tension between the body-based performative the expresses expressiveness and virtuosity for versus the sort of mental Yeah, the human mind displaying that So Yes, this is the third life-coding performance that I made It's in a way also an example of this Manual dexterity and the glorification of the typing interface by actually looking for a different typing interface the 100th keyboard And actually first I had this idea of using this this keyboard in a performance and then I read okay I first need to learn how to write code on this So we created this environment to learn typing with it And then I had this idea. Okay, so we need a to this for life coding for coding So that's hence the title So I started looking for scripts from other life-coders that I could re-perform So I could learn how to to perform their pieces. I only found one freely available online from Frederick Odofsen from a performance in 2007. So that's the one I've been practicing And then Yeah, that also raised some questions for me like is it life-coding when I'm re-performing this code from 2007 like 12 years ago But also like because there is this this moment in this performance where The code that is executed is not doing what what Frederick was expecting and then he starts searching Yeah, what he's doing. Yeah, where the bug is and then he tries to fix it and When I am re-performing this this this script I'm also wondering. Should I just do it, right? Or should I re-perform these mistakes like what what should I do? But I found it really interesting actually too because I could really by by going through the script in this this very close way I could really sort of follow his his thinking pattern Okay, I'm gonna Drink a little sip of tea because now we're getting to the more Sweet discuss the old manifesto So we're getting slowly towards the political part of this Keynote. Yeah, so we're all dancing in the Algorave So, yeah, if you write Manifesto's it becomes political and I think as as when you give a keynote You should transcend the practice a little bit So I think one of the messages or maybe the message of live coding is that you can develop and create your own Algorithms, everybody can learn to code. So I think that's a very important message Also shows that algorithms are mutable volatile and fallible And below our everyday fancy GUIs there is code written by humans And that we do not need to take this code and the algorithms implemented in them for granted So we can control the systems that are creating our life that are controlling our lives and Yeah, code is controlling many many parts of our life And we should demand transparency and openness and oppose this technocratic dogma that only experts can cause because anyone can and Also, the there's this dogma that's the algorithms makes no mistakes. That's true humans do And that machines are intelligence and I think that's one thing they are definitely not they are just following instructions So in a sense we are living nowadays in sort of an algorithmic society Because yeah, it's it's shaped very much by the machines that we have created like information technology is now playing such a crucial day in our everyday life How our lives are regulated what advertisements we see the media that we read How we get our information everything is controlled by by algorithms these days and Data has become one of the most important currencies on which businesses strive and yeah companies use algorithms to analyze Data usually selling selling of stuff, but also policing of stuff there's a lot happening in that era and Also, if you think a little bit further than it then you could also understand the bureaucratic systems That that's many societies have As sort of machines that are executing Rules and regulations that's Polish politicians create so I guess in a sense you can actually see politics as a very slow methods of live coding But as every rule is negotiated But it is a sort of changing code in a running running system all the time And where this in particular comes dangerous because the information technology Is starting to become more and more a part of these bureaucratic systems So whereas like a bureaucrat still Can look at this at a case and say like yeah, okay the intent of the law What's this? So so it's okay When it's implemented in a computer often It's done in a way that you can't really make these nudging of the rules and you can't look at the intent But you are only faced with the outcome of applying the role So often you have to excuse like well computers is no it's not possible And that's also what the judges in in court like when it gets that far often their role is to check like it's is The outcome of applying the rules is that's actually accorded according to the intent of why the law was made And I think as life-coders we have a very important role and that we actually show and Make clear to an audience that the intent of coding something Does not always coincide with the outcome. So where do we go life coding beyond the screen? First I have some suggestions For Our everyday practice so one is alternate keyboards. Let's explore other types of keyboards because this one is getting a bit old Let's deconstruct a laptop Let's see Let's look at programming languages beyond text. I think we saw a very nice example The performance during the lunch concert with the code Clavier Where actually the piano was controlling the the code that was generating the visuals So let's explore that more like gestures images or otherwise Let's also look more at at output beyond the audio visual Let's explore life-coded meals heat smell vibrations weaving patterns That's right. So that we saw some nice examples also yesterday with choreography Yeah, and then also Let's look at code beyond the computer and I think Kate gave some very good examples of that Yesterday in a keynote But let's also explore more like what that means in society So I want to show one last work Which I developed between 2019 and 2021 and is still in development So this started as an attempt to create a gesture live coding language It's really an attempt because in the process I found it was really hard To work with Real-time time-based gestures that were learned on the fly this Is a problem that has not and using accelerometer for it. I was also not using a camera So I had this residency in Sussex and I was there for two weeks And I had already done some pre-work But during these two weeks I realized I wasn't it wasn't gonna work out with that was a performance scheduled at the end of The two weeks so I had to deal with it So I made a performance out of This process of teaching the machine Yeah, but the labor that's actually involved in that My name is Rayman The question is that I want to ask is who is doing the labor and what conditions this is So in the process I'm using time-based gestures that are not a start and an end and I measure these gestures that I use Measure the use to train machine learning algorithm you have to make recordings of this gesture doing it multiple times Repeated each time label inside make sure a start in the end of the gesture is clear One way of doing it is by displaying a graph of the data to see Because does the data look similar to the other the previous gesture So Yeah, unfortunately, I wasn't able to perform it yesterday ran out of time to prepare and rehearse it Because one of the things I also noticed doing this performance that actually remembering gestures is really something you need to train So since I only saw one finger about who wrote the the life coding manifesto, I think we need a new one So this is an invitation The future of life coding is yours Actually when I met Julian sort of yesterday You say oh, there's a lot of faces that we don't know. So the future of life coding is yours So what is our new manifesto? Where's life coding going to in the next 20 years? So I made a pad It's a blank slate right now. Let's Let's fill it up Maybe like at the end of the the question round we can see what what what is there and maybe at the end of the conference we can Publish this new manifesto So thanks Here are some references. So I Actually had had all these sources and I wanted to end with a nice picture of a book that I just wrote I brought three copies on Thursday I wanted to put them on the table there, but then I met some people at lunch But tomorrow I can bring more There's a link to pre-order or you can put your name on the little paper at the desk there Thanks Thanks a lot Maria for this provocations So we're running a bit out of time and we need to start the workshop soon But of course, there's still room for a few questions. So please come up front and I think we actually have still 3 30 When the workshop starts, yeah, I was supposed to tell this at some point. Oh, it's yeah, okay Thank you. That was amazing my my question is you you mentioned alternate computing architectures and how Sort of the world that we live in today is dominated by machines whose architecture was dominated by companies Who wanted to do things one way or not another? and in my in my sort of Time researching the history of computing and how things have come to be the way that they are in sort of a different way I came across a sort of very repeated sentiment by people who were sort of really Crucial to the development of the field in the early days Alan Kay is one of the The better examples and he was talking about how they were trying to How they were trying to convince companies that were making computers back in the day to put microcode CPUs Microcode interpreters in their CPU. So basically hardware level interpreters for high-level languages And it sounds like exactly the sort of thing that all of us would like to have today, but but none of us do and and how The design of things like the list machines or the small talk computers or all of these devices that were built as a sort of uniform body of code that is constantly There for you to to to see to inspect to interact with and change So so in essence the computer as a life-coding machine instead of us life-coding a computer But my question to you now is how what what can we do today? Given that we live in a world where these decisions are being made by companies that are way beyond our reach and and there's very little about any one individual or any one small company can do to To return to different architectures that existed in history, but not anymore Yeah, that's a good question Don't know if I have the answer But but I think I mean the those early computers I mean they Were built like back then like it was not all microprocessors So I think there is some value in actually going back and making the computers from a single like electronic components and I mean one thing which was interesting about these Burroughs computers They had like a variable bit depth for for the for the memory So you could actually decide okay I need so many bits for this this particular type piece of data So I think that was quite interesting and then also Yeah, part of that could be part of the the word could be used for the instructions So so there are like looking at these old architectures. I think that's that can give like also new ideas of how to do that But I think there's also like like other sort of horizons where where biological things like using Yeah, bio art and sort of working with those things and where computation also becomes part Or looking at things like quantum computing which also requires this completely different way of thinking about computing Where it's less about Yes, there was a manipulating zeros and ones, but it's actually a much more complicated process that's happening Yeah, I think one thing. Yeah, I would certainly be interested in and see what would happen if you challenge this binary thing like Yeah So what if there's a little bit more in uncertainty in the computing What happens then So another line for the new manifesto, I suppose Any other questions? Hi, this might not be an especially well thought out question But so you said with the machine is learning that began as an attempt to make a gestural live coding language And then you know that was hard and it kind of turned into this piece about the fact that it's hard I'm wondering are you is that still something that you're interested in like creating a Some kind of workable gestural language and and how would you approach it or how are you approaching it if you're still working on it now? Yeah, it's it's so a thing that's that's on my mind I Mean one thing I mean actually using time these time-based gestures makes it incredibly slow. I think that was Maybe a wrong starting point in any case So in that sense Actually using more poses like poses as sort of that would work a lot faster and could could have quite some potential It's also easier to recognize. So that's also helps Yeah, and I think I Mean there were a lot of things which which could have been Better because I was actually using gestures that were quite visual Where the the method of measuring was actually more focused on on the energy of movements and sort of direction from Internal point of view. So there's definitely a lot of things that I I would reconsider if I'm pursuing the thing further Yeah, yeah Thanks, I have a question when you use this gestural Do you feel that? You put us mental effort similar to how we type and we do all this kind of logical Things or we can get into more let's say Maybe I will put it. I'm not sure if that's correct more kind of Alternate states of consciousness, but I'm not sure if this is correct term here more effortless Do you think that the gestures can be more? lower the Yeah, I mean it's still I Mean as in designing any sort of Programming language you design certain types of constraints and limitations So you really have to define sort of the the sort of operations that you want to do and How you how you want to structure that? I think one thing that was particularly complicated was to actually Think about okay, how can I refer back? How can I sort of create a variable and refer back to it? and that was actually Actually quite a challenging thing to do with gestures But I think it also opens possibilities for for for completely different ways of thinking about code And that definitely needs more exploration To see where that can go. Yeah Alicia last question I think Okay, I tried to make it make sense then So you're talking us through this process of where the you know We change the machines and the machines change us and we embody the machines and the machines embody us And then we go through this idea of embodiment an inactive embodiment. That's that's really about the sensory aspect being embedded in the cultural environment and then we look at that cultural environment embodied by the Manifesto and you want us to change it? So I'm really curious like How does this how do you see that changing the manifesto as? I don't know. I mean it is it not changing fast enough. Has it not kept up with those changes Do you think it just needs to be reflective of the fact that we change or just can you explore that a little bit? Yeah, I think But it's But I think after 20 years, it's good to renew it and I think Kate already has made her Alternative or of the the choreographic life-coding Manifesto But I think I think it was Ivan who said like well the community is not reflected at all in the manifesto So I think And the world has completely changed I would also say I mean back then like laptops were really new and now now actually people So so sort of I think now actually less and less people are having laptops In their homes or computers. So now we're at a different point where actually people a Lot of people don't have programmable devices anymore in their pockets or in their homes like with tablet like tablets and and Smartphones themselves you can't code How they work you can't code them you have can have an application that can do a little bit of coding But you can't recode the machine itself on these devices. So we're actually moving into another era In that sense and I think that's also something we should reflect on I'm not sure this is an answer But it just raises a lot more questions Okay, thanks a lot Mariah that's enough for applications for now I Have two announcements are actually a few but also first two announcements are Tomorrow at 11 o'clock. We want to do this group photo. So it would be nice if everybody could join And another Another announcement is to the contributors. Please check your email We want to have this kind of a boat trip on Sunday and let us know if you want to attend That's it for me Now Lucas gonna give a tour for the workshops. Yeah, so the workshop start Start oh in four minutes excellent Okay for 19 minutes Thanks the production crew so There's three workshops in this space the Visual is meetup in the big room The expressing yourself with code world-building workshop behind his door and Animatron visual poetry in the lobby there The fourth workshop live Lily Is in the big building there It's in a space called room 31 and you will see on the corner of that building Going out is a fire escape Which you use to enter in this case the room Maybe one final note I think for most of the workshops You are invited if you registered for them Except I think for the visual is meetup. It's like No problem if there's more people than actually registered Okay, thank you Hello, sorry, I have one more announcement if we're really could sit down for one minute Actually, someone of our production crew is its birthday today. Her name is Juliet. So if we could all call her Juliet If you could come to the front and we can all sing happy birthday to you Even though you don't want to you kind of have to and all sing with me because I have a horrible singing voice Now you can go