 It's waiting for the recording. Okay welcome back everybody to our second lecture on BC 106 interpreting scripture. We are just taking time to look at difficult passages and try to interpret them and try to understand them correctly. So like we mentioned earlier there are two passages in the New Testament that are difficult or have to deal with about whether women can minister in church or not. So we looked at one which is 1 Corinthians the 14th chapter verses 34 and 35. There is another passage in 1 Timothy chapter 2 verses 8 to 15. 1 Timothy chapter 2 verse 8 to 15 which is a difficult passage which we will look at. But before we go to 1 Timothy chapter 2, 8 to 15 I want to I want us to go to Ephesians chapter 4 because if we answer that Ephesians 4 then we will be better able to understand 1 Timothy chapter 2. So let's go to Ephesians chapter 4 and let us look Ephesians chapter 4 and we're going to look at verse 8 through 11 Ephesians 4 8 through 11 or let's read verse 7 through 11 Ephesians chapter 4 let me write it down here. Ephesians 7 to 11 okay so we're going to look at this first and then we are going to go to 1 Timothy chapter 2. So Ephesians 4 7 through 11 I will read the passage and then I will put the question to the class to discuss and then we will discuss it and then go to the next passage. So Ephesians chapter 4 verse 7 through 11 Paul the Apostle wrote he says but to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift. Therefore he says when he ascended on high he led captivity captive and gave gifts to men. Now this he ascended what does it mean but that he also first ascended into the lower parts of the earth he ascended is also the one who he who descended is also the one who ascended far above all the heavens that he might fill all things and he himself gave some to be apostles some prophets some evangelists and some pastors and teachers and he goes on. Okay the question I want to ask here is can a woman, can a woman be an apostle, a prophet, a pastor, teacher, evangelist, pastor and teacher or is this only for men is Ephesians 4 11 only for men or can a woman also be in the role of an apostle or a prophet or evangelist or a pastor or a teacher. The reason some may think that Ephesians 4 11 is only for men is because of what it says in verse 8 it says he gave gifts to men he gave gifts to men and then verse 11 tells us what those gifts are some he gave apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, teachers. So question is can a lady, can a woman be either an apostle or a prophet, an evangelist, a pastor or a teacher or do you think anybody this is just free discussion so you don't have to worry about being right or wrong just share your thoughts. Question is can a woman be an apostle, a prophet, evangelist, pastor or teacher. Please go ahead Abubakre the Bilobab. Please go ahead please. Thank you pastor. Good morning sir. Good morning. What I saw in this passage the man that Paul referring to here is human being because my translation in my whole language translates as human being. It's not specifically specifying maybe the man or the woman. So referring to both female and male both women and men. So in this place and the fact that he's referring to both men and male and female here and the verse 11 is talking about also men and women so that means women can be an apostle, can be a prophet, an evangelist, a pastor or teacher. But the only question I have under this place is can a woman be the church? That is the problem I have on that place. I believe women can be an apostle, can be a prophet, an evangelist, pastor or some teacher but can a woman be the church? That is my question sir. Okay good. So the first part, the first part I mean the question, the first part of the question Abubakre the Bilobab answered it correctly right? So remember when we, one of the things we learned in the early part of the course is to study the words and study it in the Greek whenever possible so we can use our study tools. So when you go and look at verse 8 it says, and he gave gifts to men. That word men in which in English Bible is translated men but in the Greek the Greek word is anthropos which is just meaning human being. It's not referring to male or female and so like Abubakre said you know in his in his language translation it's human being which is correct. That same word anthropos is used in Matthew chapter 4 verse 4 when Jesus said man shall not live by bread alone. So in the English Bible it is translated as man but it literally means male and female people just means human being people. He's saying people will not live by bread alone but they'll all have to live by the word of God. So it's the same word anthropos. So Matthew chapter 4 verse 8 he gave gifts to people. He gave gifts to human beings not just men but he gave gifts to everybody male and female. So verse 11 must be understood in the context. Notice in verse 7 he says to each one of us that is brothers and sisters male or female human beings people all of us were in Christ all of us have received grace according to the measure of Christ's gift that means whatever gift Christ wanted he has given it to us everybody male or female. So that's verse 7 verse 8 men is I mean the English Bible men literally the Greek is anthropos which is gender neutral it's people. So therefore when we get down to verse 11 we have to keep that same thought that is apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, teacher is open. These giftings are open for both male and female. It's not it's not specific to that noise too much. Can you hear the noise? I mean I couldn't turn it off. You can hear me clearly. Yes it's clear sir. Oh okay great thank you. All right so that is the correct way to understand right but Abu Bakr brought up another question which is also very important. Okay we will accept that men and women can be called into any of these five ministry functions, a boss, a prophet, evangelist, pastor, teacher. But the next question is can a woman lead the church? A congregation can a woman lead a congregation? That is a tough question but we have to answer we have to have an answer okay. So what we have to do is now we know from Ephesians 4 that women can be in these ministry functions. A woman can be an apostle, a prophet, an evangelist or pastor or teacher. So now if you look at some of these functions especially that of an apostle or that of a pastor these two especially imply leadership an apostle really an apostolic ministry is somebody who's you know is leading the way you know in in certain area whatever that in whichever sphere of influence God has given them apostolic is they're leading the way. Same thing with the prophetic and not with the past total you're a pastor is a spiritual leader of a congregation so if a woman is a pastor she's a leader if a woman is an apostle she is a leader in that case right. So keep that thought in mind now let us go to another difficult passage which is 1st Timothy chapter 2 and then we will try to answer that question you know can a woman lead a congregation or lead a ministry you know we have to answer that. Let's go to 1st Timothy chapter 2 and we want to read verses 8 through 15. This is another difficult passage and this is another passage just sometimes people use and they especially in certain denominations in certain Christian traditions very very strong they will not allow a woman to minister the word of God to teach very strong and they will use this like 1st Corinthians 14 and 1st Timothy chapter 2 but let's read it and let's try to understand 1st Timothy chapter 2 verses 8 to 15 I will read it we could just please follow with me the apostle Paul is writing he says I desire therefore that men pray everywhere lifting up holy hands without wrath and doubting in like manner also that the women adorn themselves in modest apparel with propriety and moderation but not with braided hair or gold or pearls or costly clothing but which is proper for women professing godliness with good works let a woman learn in silence with all submission and I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man but to be in silence for Adam was formed first then Eve for Adam was not to see but the woman was being deceived fell into transgression nevertheless she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith love and holiness with self-control so this is a quite a difficult passage because 1st Timothy 2 and verse 12 he is very clear he says here I do not permit a woman to a letter woman verse 11 let a woman learn in silence with all submission and I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man but to be in silence okay so how do we understand it how do we apply this and how do we answer the question can a woman teach the word of God can a woman be in leadership so on okay so first of all what is the context right the context is he's dealing with conduct in verse 8 through 15 he's dealing with conduct he is not dealing with a church service so what is the context the context is not church service the context is life conduct how do we know that because you look at verse 8 I desire that men pray in the church no he's not talking about church I desire that men pray everywhere that means wherever you are so he's not the context is not church service setting the context is daily life in conduct so in daily life in conduct how should men behave men should behave they should be prayerful I'm looking at verse 8 okay they should be prayerful they should lift up holy hands what is that they should live a life of surrender lifting up holy hands that means your life is consecrated to God surrender to God and they should not be in wrought and doubting that means don't live with anger don't live in doubts doubt of God doubting God so this is how men should live so okay in your life in conduct everywhere men be prayerful live a life of surrender don't be angry don't be doubtful about your faith in God next women in like manner that means women this is how you must conduct yourself where in the church no everywhere so he's talking about life conduct he's not talking about church service he's saying women you clothe yourself with modesty don't let your focus be on you know the gold the pearls the costly clothing but worse than you profess godliness with good works so the context is not church service the context is how you live your life men be like this women be like this the second thing I want to point out is even though Paul in these two verses he's saying women talking to women he says you know your focus should not be gold or pearls or costly clothing do we allow women to wear gold pearls costly clothing of course because you know when we go to first to first Peter chapter three where Peter wrote you know women you know let it be the hidden man of the heart and be like Sarah well if you look at Sarah she wore gold and silver and costly clothing in if you go to Genesis the 24th chapter so Peter says be like Sarah but hey Sarah wore gold pearls I mean costly clothing and so on so it was not about just completely forbidding but it's telling us don't make the focus on that you walk in with godliness okay that's a side note so the first thing I want to want I want us to understand is first Timothy chapter two verse eight to fifteen is not talking about church service it's talking about daily life and conduct that is this is how men must behave everywhere in your house out on the street wherever you are everywhere you be like this women everywhere this is how you live your focus must be in godliness and good works so with that in mind then you understand verses 11 and 12 that means in your daily life and converts women be in submission to man don't overrule your man so verses 11 and 12 is not talking about church it's talking about everyday life and the context has to do with a husband wife why because the next few verses is talking about a woman bearing children adam and eve women bearing children so let's talk about a marriage relationship right adam and eve is not just saying any woman any man no no no this is a special relationship adam and eve marriage relationship childbearing so the context of verses eight through 15 is twofold one is everyday life and conduct and from verse 11 to 15 the context is more specific about a husband wife like adam and eve in that context woman or wife being submission to your own husband which is what the bible teaches in other passages don't try to teach your man but and don't try to take authority over your husband no but you walk in submission why because of adam and eve it's a relationship husband wife relation it's not like any man any woman no the context is adam and eve husband by relation in that context wife you've been submission to your husband he is your leader there and god will protect you in your childbearing so how must we understand first timothy chapter two verse eight to 11 I'm repeating the context has to do with two things one it has to do with everyday life how men should conduct themselves how women should conduct themselves in everyday life everywhere second the context transitions it changes from verse 11 to verse 15 it changes to an adam and eve context which is a husband wife married man married woman and man in that context woman you do not try to teach your husband that means you don't try to override your husband but you walk in submission which is what Ephesians chapter five teaches us which is what collusion chapter three teaches everywhere else the same truth so scripture must be interpreted in the light of scripture the same person who wrote first timothy two also wrote Ephesians five also wrote collusion three so the understanding is the same that wife you walk in submission to your husband because god has given him as your protector and overseer so you walk that way it's not local church context he's not talking about preaching and teaching in church that is not the context of first timothy chapter two eight to 15 later on chapter three verse one goes into the local church context that was a clear did you understand any questions on that so okay i see your comment in the chat so now we can go back to the other question which is can a woman lead a church can a woman lead a church we know that in the context husband wife the husband is the head of the wife or provides leadership to the wife in the con in the marriage marriage context so in that context adam and eve context eve is subject to adam don't try to uh have authority over your husband no you be submitted to your husband that context but we shouldn't take that and apply it to a woman who is called to be an apostle or is called to be a pastor a woman who's called by god to be an apostle she has to fulfill her calling so let's say a woman is a married woman but she's called to be an apostle or let's say a married woman is called to be a pastor both these apply to her that means as a wife she will be in submission to her husband but so that's part one side of her calling she's a wife she must be in submission to us but that same woman is if she's called to be an apostle then as an apostle she is in leadership what she does as an apostle she's answerable to god not to a husband what she does as a wife she's answerable to her husband that same woman if she's married woman if she's called to be a pastor as a wife she's in submission to her husband she's answerable to her husband as a pastor she's a leader of her congregation she's answerable to god she's a shepherd the chief shepherd is jesus okay so we must understand that in different contexts the authority structure is different in the home adam and eve eve be in submission to your adam don't try to teach him and take his authority his place no but in the church if god has called a woman to be an apostle or a pastor or whatever they have to fulfill their calling and they're answerable to jesus christ or gave them that responsibility so to answer your question can a woman lead a church yes if she's called by god to lead a church she has to lead the church can a woman pastor a church yes if she's called by god to pastor a church she has to pastor a church she's answerable to god but that same woman at home as a wife she's submitted to her husband as a mother she cares for her children all those things so the same woman is handling different roles or responsibilities and the authority structure is different okay is it clear so we have answered or we have gone through two difficult passages concerning whether a woman can minister and the two passages are first current in chapter 14 34 and 35 and first Timothy chapter 2 8 to 15 these are the two difficult passages but like we said in both cases if you just look at the context that means what is Paul addressing then and you interpret it in the context then it is very clear but if we take the verses by itself in isolation then it becomes very confusing and then it's difficult for us okay so the key in both these passages first Corinthians 14 and first Timothy 2 is context what is he talking about actually the context is very clear we just have to see it then the explanation is easy to understand okay and also like we said scripture must be interpreted in the light of rest of scripture so the same writer which is Paul what else did he say about the subject in other places you know then then we can interpret it okay everyone's with me so far any any questions on these two things i know or the general question can a woman minister the word of god can a woman be in the ministry along those lines any questions okay we will go to one more passage again this is it may or may not be difficult i don't know but let's please go to first Corinthians chapter 11 and this has to do with head covering okay in some places this becomes a very very contentious contentious issue some places you know some places it is they don't worry too much but in some parts of the christian church this becomes a big argument so we have to try and understand this okay first Corinthians chapter 11 we want to read 1 2 verses 1 to 16 okay first Corinthians chapter 11 1 to 16 the questionnaires about head covering okay the question we want to ask is very simple should women cover the head when they are in the church service or is it optional in some places they insist based on this first Corinthians chapter 11 that women must cover the heads in some christian churches it's okay they don't they don't force it if you want to cover your head it's your choice it's up to you you know you do it but it's not forced so how should we understand it correctly and the main passage is first Corinthians chapter 1 verse 1 to 16 so can somebody read these verses for us and then i want to hear your i want to hear from the students from your class from the class what do you think right first Corinthians chapter 1 verse 1 to 16 first Corinthians chapter 11 1 to 16 somebody could read it for us please anyone first Corinthians chapter 1 verses 11 to 16 sorry chapter 11 chapter 11 1 to 1 first Corinthians chapter 11 verse 1 onwards imitate me just as i also imitate christ now i praise you brethren that you remember me in all things and keep the traditions just as i delivered them to you but i want you to know that the head of every man is christ the head of woman is man and the head of christ is god every man praying or prophesying having his head covered dishonors his head but every woman who prays or prophesies with her uncovered dishonors her head for that is one and the same as if her as if her head were shaped for if a woman is not covered let her also be shown but if it is shameful for a woman to be shown or shaved let her be covered for a man indeed ought not to cover his head since he is the image and glory of god but woman is the glory of man for man is not from woman but woman is from man nor was man created for the woman but woman for the man for this reason the woman ought to have symbol of authority on her head because of the angels nevertheless neither is man independent of woman nor woman independent of man in the lord for as woman come came from man even so man also comes through woman but all things are from god till was 16 yeah yeah was 13 judge among yourself is it proper for a woman to pray to god with her head uncovered does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair it is a dishonor to him but if a woman has long hair it is a glory to her for her hair is given to her for a covering but if anyone seems to be contentious we have no such customs no nor do the churches of god hmm so this is a difficult passage there are many difficult pieces in this passage many many but we want to answer one question first to begin with we could discuss other things later but one question based on this passage should we make it compulsory for women to cover the head i mean put a shawl or something sorry to cover the head when they come to the church service or is it not mandatory how should we interpret this passage because i know you know like i was saying earlier some places very strict and sometimes they have gone when i was when i travel to different places pastors they start fighting how about this you know it becomes such a big issue i want to hear from you what do you think how to understand this passage correctly anyone can share because it is written addressing Corinthian's church it is not mandatory for us to be ahead covering it is purely optional okay so John is saying now this is specific to the Corinthians okay so that is one one thought okay Avobakre please go ahead wait a second sir so the the contents of this place has to do with the culture of the of the Corinthians and because the way we live and our culture determines sometimes the way we worship our God so from places they don't used to cover their head normally they don't used to cover their head and in some culture the even whether you're christian or other religion you must cover your head so in this place i see it as if so it's dependent the area christian find yourself or based on the culture that's are bound with the pain with the christened in their area so if you are you are you are in culture that they used to cover their head it's go in line with your with you that's anytime you want to appear in your god in the presence of your god you must cover your head but in the case where maybe your culture is not is not important in covering of head is not important in your culture so there's no means that you should force yourself to cover your head when you want to look at the european country women used to wear trousers the countries as their own part of life but in our in africa here most especially in engilia in our own culture if women wear trousers then we look at that woman as as a lot we prostitute so we don't we don't we don't like it here it's not part of our culture so it's dependent on individual culture so whether you cover your head or you know cover your head thank you sir yeah so abu mcreltsu says you know it depends on the local culture and so first Corinthians 11 is addressing the culture in current this like paul john also john paul also said it's addressing the Corinthian church okay anybody else with that you know any other thought any other response based on this passage should we insist women must cover their head or how do we interpret this anyone else okay so i think uh so you know when you look at this whole passage we should ask ourselves several questions right we know that in paul's episode episodes there are things he addresses which are very specific to that particular church so there are matters that are very that that are specific to that church example in the Corinthian church we know there was division so he was addressing that there was a man who was committing sin he was first born in chapter five so he was addressing that they had other problems like about how they would come and eat in the Lord's table they would fight with each other to take part of the bread and the wine so he was addressing that so we know that in paul's letters to the Corinthian church he was addressing certain matters which are not a problem in every church but are specific to that church like we mentioned some examples so therefore it is safe for us to even say that this head covering issue was specific to the Corinthian church and not intended for everybody all churches and as we read in verse 16 right paul sums up his instruction by saying that we have no such custom nor do the churches of God in other words we are not enforcing this in all the churches of God right it's he himself says in verse 16 this is specific to your situation the Corinthian church situation so then that is when we need to get back into understanding the culture of the people so and we need to read up a little bit on the history and what is happening there right so that's one thing secondly we also have to look at it very logically I mean in the light of the rest of scripture as New Testament believers Jesus taught us we worship God and spirit and truth it's not about whether I cover my head or not does that mean if a man is wearing a cap for whatever reason maybe it's very hot maybe it's very cold so he's covered his head or maybe he's riding on a bike so he's wearing a helmet or maybe you know whatever situation where he's wearing a cap does that mean just because he's got his head covered he cannot pray no he can pray because prayer is from the heart it's not just whether you cover your head or not right so we know that spiritual truth so the same thing will apply for women also whether the woman is wearing a hat or not wearing a hat it's okay she can worship God and spirit and truth right so that's the second thing so we must come from that perspective otherwise we will put people in bondage by you know these outward things so spiritual truth must also be brought to bear so culture spiritual truth the context of what's happening in New Testament believer must be brought to bear and when we get into the culture and this is something you can treat generally general information you see in the Corinthian church Corinth was a city where there was a lot of prostitution and the prostitution the temple prostitution shaved their heads so that is what he's referring to and in chapter 6 he did mention such was some of you you know that means they some of the people had come out of those kinds of lifestyle such were some of you but now your wash sanctified justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ so these women who were previously temple prostitutes they had shown the head they had come they had become saved they had come to Jesus so now you can imagine they're sitting in the congregation their heads all shaved because that was their previous life and they're sitting there so Paul is saying okay look cover your head that's all okay so that's the cultural context and it's it's a symbol of authority right it's showing that you are in submission you have a husband you're married or you're in submission to God so you know you cover your head and then he concludes that passage by saying we don't if anybody is arguing about this we don't have any custom like this in our other churches so he's basically saying I am speaking this very specifically for the Corinthian church so therefore we should not take this passage and make it compulsory for every woman in every church to cover the head no we leave it to obstacle if it is hot and somebody wants to cover the head that is their choice if it is very cold and somebody wants to cover the head that is their choice we know that we worship God in spirit and truth so this doesn't matter okay so I think you know just hearing all of you I think you know we kind of understand this it is something we agree on okay so we will close here for today next week we'll just pick up some other passages I'm just you know taking different portions of scripture passages which are generally you know difficult or people have you know different opinions on it and just trying to explain it and trying to understand it so that we can all be clear okay so let's close and pray we'll continue next week Thursday could somebody please pray and leave out this mess anyone Holy Father we thank You Lord for teaching us from the word Lord whatever we have heard help us Lord to receive it well in the right understanding and right perspective that we may apply it rightfully in our life we may understand the context in which is written and we may take into account the spiritual truth Father and taking rightful look from your spirit the spiritual truth that is in the passage you may do all things rightfully so that what we do and what we practice in our life and we accept it and please you Lord we thank You for after teaching us these things bless Him Father blesses the spiritual greatly bless everyone of us we just mode Lord from the word in the families in Jesus name and thank you thank you everyone and have a good break and get ready for your next class thank you bye now