 I think we're about ready to start. We're good. Perfect. Remember, this is a live session. Live television is my specialty. I'm kidding. But I'm very grateful for everyone, for being here on time, and to discuss and share thoughts on this important topic. For a second, just imagine if every person around the world could affordably participate in the digital economy. This is the ambitious goal that inspired the creation of the Edison Alliance, an incredible movement, a network of leaders across private and public sectors that are promoting change and trying to really bring private and public sectors, like I said, in that collaboration in three main areas, financial services, education, and health care. Everyone in this room is part of that mission in some form or another, directly or indirectly. And today we're focusing on unlocking capital at scale for digital inclusion. The current estimates suggest that between $400 billion and $2 trillion are needed in order to achieve universal digital inclusion. We're talking about around 1 billion people around the world. So the question seems to be how we can mobilize private assets and foster a cooperative policy to achieve an environment that generates this much needed investment in the digital economy and in digital inclusion. And before I introduce the distinguished members of our panel, I want to thank Her Majesty, Queen Maxima, the Queen of the Netherlands, who's here in her capacity as the United Nations Secretary General Advocate or Special Envoy on Inclusive Finance. Thank you so much for being here. It's an honor to have you, Your Majesty. Thank you so much. If you could lead us with some introductory remarks and talk about why this particular topic of financial inclusion is so close to your heart and, of course, the challenge of how we scale action, how we increase action in order to achieve a more inclusive financial digital world. Well, first of all, thank you, everybody. You just mentioned my very long name, a title that I have that was given to me by Secretary General as things are in the Bretton World Institute, sometimes it's a big negotiation. And you might ask yourself, what is she doing on digital inclusion? Well, to be honest with you, nowadays, if I speak about financial inclusion, we cannot speak about financial inclusion without having a mobile phone and without having access to markets digitally. So this is a very, very important part of my work. So what I found myself in this issue and this transition when I did study 16 years ago with microfinance to all the way to here, that I'm actually speaking about IDs, I'm speaking about connectivity, I'm speaking about level of handhelds that people are actually using. So I'm completely immersed in this issue of digital inclusion and the importance of actually having this in a way that is really, really inclusive. So it's very nice, therefore, to join you as a champion of the Edison Alliance. I have to say that public and private sector financing is our best chance to mobilize the vast resources you just mentioned, needed to provide affordable, accessible and safe digital connections for everyone, especially the nearly 3 billion people that still are offline. This includes the poor, women, smallholder farmers and MSMEs. The pandemic sapped their resources and made it even more expensive to get connected. New data shows today that for the first time in years, fewer, not more women are using mobile internet, fewer. Many had to choose between owning a mobile phone or putting food at the table. So to avoid a growing digital divide and achieve really universal digital inclusion, the public and private sector really must work and invest together. And I say the Edison Alliance could really make a huge difference. Its goal of actually improving 1 billion lives through digital solutions by 2025 is a really a call to action that we need. We have seen a lot of very encouraging public and commitments from government and industry, so are the tools and products being created to do this. Now on the Digital Financial Inclusion Fund, we need not only digital inclusion, but really a set of what I call public goods, that together will assure inclusion, stability and basic sustainability. Too often the digital infrastructure and policies are considered in different silos, but really these public goods work best actually together. Some unlock digital access by expanding for example connectivity or agent networks into new areas. Other public goods make markets work better for customers through fair competition and interoperable payment systems for example. And some others protect the financial system and its users by strengthening data privacy, cybersecurity, consumer protection, digital and financial literacy. Some will be provided by governments, and others by the private sector, but in any way they will have to be a collective effort. We've actually seen interoperable payment systems now coming up in many, many countries. Some of them we've known the India case is a very good one. A system basically supports high number of small value transactions are unlikely to be developed without government encouragement and innovation and incentive. But then we need to have them because if we don't have that, the small transactions and the poorer and the women and the smaller families we're never gonna be able to come in. Propo payments like these were set up in Pakistan and India. They can increase competition between providers, drive down costs, allow infrastructure to be shared between competing firms and open the financial system to potentially millions of new customers. For the private sector, this means serving a bigger market and this will entail other types of products and services. And this of course will challenge innovations to their existing business models. This also means that they need to sit at the table to help build fair governance structures, rules and set pricing that makes sense to all stakeholders. And I really want to say this, the decision of actually sitting all together at the table is very important. You cannot from a government standpoint come up with something in which the pricing structure is absolutely not right in which not one private sector player wants to actually participate. Another big example is connectivity and here reaching the last mile can be the longest mile. Connecting and serving the poor in rural and remote areas affordably can only be achieved through collaboration. But what are those models of cooperation that enable the last mile clients to really get digitally connected? What are the types of regulations and the right incentives for the private sector to invest and serve this last mile? And we must not forget that connectivity also means access to devices and good quality devices. So to build all these vital digital public goods, we should start of course with dialogue. When countries start sharing the knowledge together, we can really learn from what works, such as the Brazil PIX Interoperable Payment System or the India Stack and the Indian ID System. There are many, many examples and they do not only come from very countries because when I speaking about Nigeria, India or Pakistan, we have amounts of people that we can actually set up several systems that might actually work. But we also have very good examples of countries like Peru, Estonia, that have actually set up these type of corporations that really work with much, much smaller countries. And of course, what is the role of global organizations? They can really help bring governments and private sector together. If I've seen something in all my visits with all my partners is we've been the nexus and the glue to actually bring this dialogue together because without that dialogue, we're not going to move the needle on this front. So the World Economic Forum, UNDP, the Bank of International Settlements can also facilitate discussion and exchange on public digital public goods. The Gates Foundation and the World Bank Group are really ready to provide capital and technical assistance to many of them. So let us not lose ourselves in discussing what are the competing allocations of, is it digital, or is it health, or is it education? Without digital inclusion, we will not make health possible, we will not make financial inclusion possible, and we're not going to make education for all possible. So if we just sequence our priorities, it will be the way to go. Thank you very much. And I'm looking forward to the good discussion of these very talented people here. Thank you. Thank you so much, Queen Maxima. We're grateful for your leadership in that capacity in the UN as a champion of the Edison Alliance and, of course, for your personal investment and your commitment to this issue. Thank you so much for those introductory remarks. And I'm going to start introducing our panel at a couple of housekeeping items. You can share our conversation if you feel inclined to do so on social media using the hashtag WEF22. I'm contractually obligated to say that. No, no, I'm just kidding. And then, of course, feel free to make this an interactive conversation. We will have some time for questions at the end and make those questions with a question mark at the end so we can move the conversation forward. Makhtar Diop, the managing director of the International Finance Corporation. Thank you so much for being here today. Hans Besberg, the chairman and the CEO of Verizon and the chair of the Edison Alliance. We're going to talk about a lot today. And Shobana Kimineni, she's the executive vice chairperson of Apollo Hospitals and board of the Edison Alliance. Board member of the Edison Alliance. Thank you so much. We were talking offstage in the speaker's room about the fact that it's been a year since, around a year since the creation of the Edison Alliance. And Hans, I want to start by asking you, now you have a good benchmark to measure tangible results, to sort of figure out the direction that you're heading in. What have been some of the barriers, the main barriers of unlocking capital for digital inclusion? You was going to go back a little bit in time and of course, once in a while, my dream was to have the goal 18 of the SDGs and that would be that everybody's connected in the world. We all know that it's 17 SDGs. So, but during the COVID, I think we all understood that that when the first centers infrastructure is actually mobility broadband and cloud, give the same chance for anyone, wherever they come from, wherever they're born, and wherever they live. And actually, it was pretty good progress during COVID. 800 million people more got connected online during COVID, which is just enormous. 800 million people. 800 million people. But we needed COVID to understand it and do it. And that's far away from where we need to be. We still have 2.9 billion people that are not connected on this planet. So, the conversation about Edison Alliance was of course that, okay, what is needed to address that? You need three pieces. You need the accessibility of the technology. You need to affordability and then usability. And you need private public partnership to make it happen. And in the early discussion, we had the Klaus Wobb was about the biggest platform in the world is World Economic Forum where basically everyone is here. We have the private sector, public sector. We have NGOs and everything. There was the idea, can we launch something here to actually address something much larger when it comes to digital divide? So, we agreed upon doing that, but we also said that accessibility for the ability and usability has to be the guiding principle. So, we decided to have the leading star in education, healthcare, and financial inclusion based on the digital divide because only having access is not enough. So, we started with a smaller group. We ended up now having 46 champions that all are committed, that commit a contribution in kind or are doing something in order to meet the target that we put up for ourselves in September last year, which was one billion lives connected by 2025, additional one billion that are touched upon it. So far, of course, we have a lot of commitment from different companies, countries that is part of it. We're going to do the first report during the UN week in September. That's one year off to announce it. I'm extremely encouraged for the capital, the contribution on kind for companies, from private sector, from public sector in order to make this happen and the sharing in between them. Is it easy? No, it's super difficult. There are many barriers. And capital is one, of course, to see that you have financing for the digital divide. But I'm encouraged what I see. I see now bonds coming out on digital divide. I can actually finance the same money I can finance Verizon's balance sheet with. I can do a digital bond. And I get the same interest rate because the market is now understanding this is important things to finance. Equally as much as I do a green bond, I get the same interest rate on my green bond as the digital inclusion bond, as the corporate financing I do on my balance sheet. That is encouraging to see that capital is allocated to this. So that's one thing. There are many other things we need to talk about, of course, because affordability becomes important, handsets become extremely important, or devices in general, and I probably shouldn't spend too much time in the beginning, but that's the outset on what we're doing. And it's a five-year journey we're doing, adding one billion people more into the digital world and of course, focusing a lot about the most vulnerable females that will have the chance. But trying to do it, not only talking about I need more broadband, if I have the broadband, I need to afford it. And then I need application from healthcare, education, or that I can actually use the mobile phone to make in mobile transactions financially as a bank account. So you cannot only talk about one thing. And that's what the Alliance is doing. Of course, we are technology partners, but the leaders, like Shobana, she's leading the healthcare, digital healthcare. And Michael Maibach from MasterCard, he's leading the financial inclusion. And then the education is the Minister of IT from Rwanda. So we try to lead it, not only by technology, because it has to be a combination of it. Yeah, it's pretty clear that the table has three legs and without any of those three legs isn't just gonna be able to maintain itself. Shobana, how do we find these leading business models in sectors like healthcare, for example, that are good models for financial digital health services, for advancing digital health services, especially in rural areas, where they don't have access sometimes to physical space to the actual services? I think that we're actually fortunate. Health is in a very good space because it makes people think of this as one of the top ESG. So their funds, whether it's ESG, whether it's CSR, whether it's bonds, everyone is interested to give health a break because they know that it's foundational to a country's development. If a country's not healthy, if they don't have a healthy population, it's very likely that it's going to impact the GDP very negatively, especially as we've seen during COVID. So if you look at it, I think that solving the problem and health is a problem, there will be financing solutions. We've seen it for COVID, for instance, 357 days from the start to a vaccine coming out. It was global, the way that, whether it was institutional lending, it was banks, it was CSR, it was foundations, it was countries that were giving money into it. And this is a model that I think is completely replicable when you have a good story behind it, but you have to write that up. The problem has to be sharp now. People don't want vague promises of saying that I will, I'm going to cure, I'm going to eradicate TB or I'm going to diagnose all the cancers in the country. They want sharper, they want us to go down into the areas. When we talk about rural, what will you do? How are you going to manage it? And I think that's why the Edison Alliance is actually so pivotal in making a billion lives, you know, transforming, because we can go down and use this digital because your Majesty, you spoke about it, saying that without digital, you're not going to have the steps to go further down. And this is the kind of inclusion that brings it large and makes it affordable. So that's very important too. I can't go into an Indian village. So the best thing that the Indian government has done is our UPI, when you refer to the stack twice or twice, I was super thrilled, but it's really true. Any Indian can just go in there, we don't need credit cards, we don't need cash, you just, you can go in there, scan a QR code and it just goes into your accounts, money gets deposited directly. Having said that, I think it's a huge, makes a huge impact in underserved rural areas because there you have the connections because they have, thanks to Hans and all his colleagues around the world, we have connectivity everywhere. And with that connectivity, we can actually provide a tele-consult, we have digital dispensaries. This is something that we're doing in the Edison Alliance. We already have five models up there and the state governments are financing it, we are doing it, and I think this blended finance the world is going to hear more and more about blended finance. People with different financial, I might need an X return, someone else might need much less but we can all work together through a catalyst and a long-term program. As long as that there's a problem that needs to be answered, I think that I have great optimism and faith that the world can overcome that challenge. And we keep highlighting the need for partnerships. Queen Maxima said that during her introduction, your marks both of you have talked about this right balance between public capital, complementing itself with private efforts. And, Max, how do you hit the right balance between those two, what it's needed to make this a successful approach? Because we seem to have momentum, we have leadership, we all agree that this is a crucial project but then we're starting to see some of the main challenges ahead. No, thank you very much. It's happening, actually. I'm optimistic because a year and a half ago when you had this big shock, it came to, in front of us, we were wondering what to do and we created this speedboat. So we got together at GSMAs, Alliance, ITU, everybody got together and said, we have to solve that problem. We never have that rate of connectivity, never, ever. It means that when we have a shock and of this nature, we are able to get things together and the challenge is to replicate it and to sustain that effort. And I think that's where we are today. And the solution, I agree with you, is multiple dimensions and I would like really to Queen Maxima to thank you because the work that you've been doing on digital ID has been critical in that process. The resilience of economy after this shock, during this shock, has been linked to the digital inclusion. Countries which have been able to connect quickly, as you said, we've been able to transfer resources to SOPRA to give them medical services. If we didn't have that foundation ID4D, it would have been impossible. So I really would like to commend you for really your leadership on that because you've been the big champion of it and it came from solving the problem. The initial question was how to bring more people to financial inclusion. And realize that, you know, it was not only handing some money, I give money, I give Michael credit here. Then the way to scan it up was to be able to to connect the people and to give digital ID. I think that we have also second good news is that part of the world which were not connected on broadband are receiving more broadband. Let's take Africa. We have two new submarine cable that's had been laid off the shore of Africa soon and we really have 300 gigabyte of shore of Africa. Today for those who don't know, the capacity installed in sub-Saharan Africa is around 30 terabyte or less. So a factor of 10. So that's why policy and public and private will be important because you can bring the fiber of shore at the coast of a country but if you are not able to do the last mile to connect the poorest, you are not solving the problem. If you don't have the user cases, if you don't have the handheld, which is cheap and accessible, if you don't have a share infrastructure to allow you to be able to connect the largest number of people to 4G, you are not doing so. It will require really working together. And in addition, if you want to do this to the poorest country, not only to be able to consume services but also to export and to be part of the world economy, we need to give them skills to be able to do that. I was just talking an hour ago with a education service provider and the model now is to have a hybrid model where they bring a training which is coming from TVT online with the formal degrees. And that's what it is being. So all this development are only possible if you look at different element. Lastly, let's not forget cybersecurity. We are the time where security is becoming a big problem, even more than before. And as we are moving in that process, a big role of the government will be really to help on creating the framework, the policies for cybersecurity. Otherwise, all the efforts that are being put in place might be to be jeopardized in the near future, including for the poorest who will be needing to use all these handset and all tools. And it's incredible to go ahead, Hans. No, I just want to add that I think that's so good with the talking, but then sometimes we talk high level and then you don't feel that deep enough. But if you think about it, I mean, I was born in a place where I had 500 meters to the school and I have 500 meters to the hospital. We know in the continent that you come from, it's going to be a billion people more. There's no way we can do physical solution. And I just wish we think like that, that the only way to actually see that every African that comes up and once being there, the only way for them is actually to have digital solution. And the government needs to understand that that's equally important infrastructure as anybody. Of course, food always comes first. But if they have digital skilling with education, healthcare, they will have the same chance as I had when I was born. But we cannot expect that they're gonna build brick and mortar because it's just impossible practically to do that. And I think that's the mentality we need to start thinking about that the mobility broad on the cloud is the 21st century infrastructure. And we need to work like that. And we from the private sector, we need to do it. And the public sector need to think like that. And that's a very important piece of thinking in order to see that everybody on this planet gonna have the same chance. Because if you're outside the digital divide, you don't have the same chance anymore. I just want to just rebound on this. Example, do you talk about Rwanda? It was a very interesting example. How people use technology to leapfrog. It's a mountainous country. It's a country of 1,000 hills, schools. And build a road is very expensive. Because of digital and the coverage they have of 4G, people can order bullet samples and have it delivered by drone on a hill. So it's just leapfrogging and make a huge difference in terms of service delivering health. I just wanted to give that example. No, and I think it's a great example. And I was gonna share a personal story. One of my, if not the first assignment I ever had as a reporter back when I worked at a local newspaper in Mexico was to go to the mountains of Guerrero. It's one of the poorest states in Mexico. In a town called Metlatono, which had the lowest levels of human development in Latin America. And one of the main reasons for that was that they were isolated. It would take pregnant women five hours to get to the nearest clinic or children hours to walk to school. And when you come to a place like Davos, even today, and you hear these conversations about remote work and remote education and how healthcare is approaching a new era where everything's gonna be done through digital. This is why this conversation is so important. Because it complements everything that's being discussed outside the Edison Alliance and what's happening here. And it's important to tell that story, Hans. It's part of what you've learned in these few months, first few months of the Edison Alliance. Absolutely, no, no, and there are so many great people. And the thing is also what you start to see, you combine that with the social responsibility that many private company takes today and making it part of the strategy. So even if something, okay, where all this money coming from, it's actually part of the strategy to be part of doing this for your communities because the community's ultimately your customers and they're part of your society. So the whole sort of, I came here the first time, 2008, and I was super excited. I had been in Africa somewhere. I saw a mobile phone, somebody was collecting data from a village and they can detect where the disease came from. Of course, nobody really thought it was a good idea. Now, 15 years later, you see everybody start understanding the power of that. But now the movement has to come. And how do we keep that momentum going, especially after the pandemic in sectors like healthcare? We all paid attention to healthcare during the past couple of years, more than ever before, probably in our lives. But how do you keep that attention and that inertia moving forward? Because healthcare has become front and center again. So I think that we might move away from acknowledging that COVID is endemic and we just want to forget that period. But it doesn't mean that we're going to forget how to look after our health on one side. So I think that people have become, because of digital, people have become more aware, it's coming to their own hands, that they can order a test, that they can find out that they can consult a doctor, that they can actually have their records and actually go to those goals, prevent diabetes, attach it to your fitness. So these kind of things, now we have early warning trackers of through your watch, as your EKG comes in, we can say that it doesn't look good, why don't you come in? So there are that healthcare has actually become democratized, it's in people's hands. But I really think that it's also important that we have to make it, that it's also highly inclusive. By having digital health, we're working on projects in rural India where for $5 a year, really $5 a year, we want to be able to write up the patient's initial record, give them basic medicines, and also do the diagnostic that they need per person. And if this can be done at scale, taken to countries that I think even in rural America or wherever, all over the world, that it lets such a cost affordability, we were discussing yesterday, $100 for a smartphone might be too expensive, for 25 is already expensive. So that's where we need to get that convergence, so people will remember. And the last point I want to say is that it's not just the traditional players that are going to be in healthcare anymore, you have the Googles and the Amazons and the Microsoft and just about everybody who's in technology thinks that they can bring a smarter solution to the table, that's a good thing. Innovation, do you see that? Lots of innovation, and that is being funded. Talking about, your Majesty, you wanna do? No, I just wanted to strengthen her point, I've actually been to many places in Africa in which you see the increase of efficiencies just by having digital systems. So we're actually speaking about how do we finance and the health system, and I see what a doctor, that used to be feeling informed for every patient to actually get the insurance company. And it's all done by the phone. So the doctor, instead of actually seeing three patients per hour, he's seeing like 20 patients per hour, the efficiency is a really very big thing. Now the one thing is, we might actually have capital, but the one problem that I'm actually seeing with a lot of countries that are actually asking for investments in the digital sphere, they don't have the technical capacity to do this in a sustainable and safe way. So we have to really pay, we talked about cyber security here, we really have to be really mindful of the capacity constraints that some of these countries have in dealing with the risks that we're also taking by doing these humongous transitions to doing everything digital. So we really have to be altogether globally think about these digital public goods, what is good practice, what is standard. And there's right now no work being done on this field and I'm trying to do that with BIS, BIS and other institutions with FSB as well, certainly on the financial side, but extremely important. The whole issue of data agency. So these are very, because these are things that will end up destroying also customer trust and also losing it. We also talk about algorithm biases. Bias can actually exclude more than include. So let us be mindful that while we give them people accessibility, affordability and viability, that we also give them a way that is safe and actually will increase trust in the whole system. And I'm so glad we're getting it specific. Yeah, and I think this question is so good and sometimes I make things very simple, which they are not, but I'm gonna try it now. So if you are in a company and you start to digitalize in the whole company, what do you do? I mean, you have a chief information, secured officer that is seeing that you are resilient, you are resilient with data and all of that. If you are a country and you believe that digitalization is the most important infrastructure I have to include all your citizens in having the data, healthcare data, you need to think that you need the chief information secured officer as well. Sitting and looking over that, that's sort of the beginning thinking about the infrastructure equally important as a corporation, as a government, because you're right, the first time, all data from, I don't know, from the healthcare system is hacked and out in the market, the trust is just going down for the government. And then we lose that digital inclusion. Max, I want you to react to that, but also I wanna add a question, if you don't mind. We've talked about capital at the beginning and some of the instruments, financial instruments available, like the bonds. But what are other instruments is the IFC putting on the table to make sure that these underserved communities also develop that capacity. For low-income countries doing blended finance, that's exactly what you said. Actually, we are investing in your company for a long time and it's blended finance. For low-income countries, we need to have a cost of capital, which is lower. But the good news is that, actually, the digital space is naturally a private sector space. Even in the country which are highly dominated by the states, you go to Africa, for instance, 90% of the investment in the digital space is done by the private sector. So what are the questions that we need to address? Taxation, because this is becoming, when you go in a country which have a very weak economy, the digital sector is an easy sector to tax to be able to get more resources. So we have this tension of the minister of finance which tells you, okay, I need to tax this sector very much, but also I need to make sure that the sector develops. So we have been in situations where, at a point where we needed to increase investment in Tower on 4G, some companies were saying, okay, this is becoming more and more difficult for us to do that because taxation. So we need to have the right balance on taxation. Public policy on cybersecurity for me is critical. Data localization, you have also a debate about every country should be keeping their data in the geographical space and not allowing to go to the cloud because of data nationalism, all these questions that you know. So these questions are important questions because there will be in the future an obstacle, protection of consumer. One of the things which is very important now is focusing on facial recognition, all these type of application. You'd be surprised that some countries, the marginal data is very important. If you have, let me for the sake of it, a lot of data which is a physical characteristic or racial characteristic. And you have very little data on people of my complexion or my physical characteristic. In fact, the algorithm which are written are often not serving everybody. So more and more data that we'd be collecting in the developing countries, I think we have a more important value to be able to be able to serve those. So in all this conversation, as you rightly said, is important that the least developed country at the public level have a good policy framework to be able to think through those issues, protect the consumer and not to do it in an afterthought and also to make sure that they are part comfortably of the world economy on the cloud economy without worrying about those data being hacked and forced. Something I've learned in the past 20 years as a journalist is that I do a better job when I talk less and I listen more. So I think it's a perfect time to ask the audience if they have a question and if we can pass around the microphone or if you can just identify yourself. So if anybody has a question, please go ahead. Raise your hand. If not, we can, oh, please. Thank you so much. George Raidenberg, the Davos Alzheimer's Collaborative. We're beginning to develop the infrastructure about how to detect cognitive impairment around the world. So I'm going to come back to your notion of data security and privacy and nationalism because beginning to get into the health services area, we're going to have to get personal health information on individuals. Governments for protecting their own citizens are not sure that they want that aggregated in some global fashion. But it would be useful to compare how cognitive impairment occurs in Africa as the United States. So we need to begin to compare and contrast that information in ways. So I'm curious as how you're in the health space, how you're getting past this notion of trying to guard against the export of data all at EU and other countries as we begin to look at how to nationalize or globalize these health services. I think we're still in version one that people have countries. Because we're so naive countries in terms of cybersecurity and data that they're overcompensating and saying that everything has to be localized. And in doing so, once the realization comes, there could be areas like if we can anonymize it properly. And actually, I think that this is where the Bitcoin concepts and all this thing of data mining and blockchain, if we can really put a good blockchain in process, a lot of this information can go out while keeping the privacy of the user. Because at the end of the day, I would not mind my data being used for the good of humanity as long as it was not used against me by the insurance company or my banks not giving me a loan or increasing my insurance. Very simplistic. But I really feel if we can apply more principles of blockchain and I think that's where version two will go when countries will start appreciating how we can protect. It seems to be a good problem to have because then you'll reach a scale in which this is becoming problematic, right? I think that in some ways it's probably essential. The reason that we were able to find a cure for COVID in 354 days is because everyone collaborated. So if the problem is big enough, we'll find it. Well, I mean, at least in my country, the Netherlands, it's already happening. You have a very stringent policy framework and you have open databases for many of the research issues and they are completely anonymized data. So I think it's very possible. Now, I know that a lot of people say, if you know 300 points of information of one person, you will know who that person is. So it is something we really need to think about and that when we actually get all those pieces of information on any given patient that we don't go back to one person that we can actually negative influence that person. But certainly something to be thought of but it's not that right now, this is really happening. I mean, most right now, that data has been owned by one hospital or one company, one place and they do not share data. In the Netherlands, we did for the first time the only one institution that every cancer patient has to give the DNA of their tumor and they give it for research. That doesn't happen anywhere else in the world. We have 70,000 new cancer cases per year and we try to do this as a public good. Now, I know that in other countries, every hospital keeps their own cancer data because they wanna do their own research because that's their, of course, they monetize on that research. So I think that we need to think is, how do we keep that data agency while sharing the monumental sort of research type of data where we actually derive knowledge from? Please, go ahead. Hi, I'm Sachin Dougal from builder.ai. Once we think about some of the items being discussed, do you think about what's happening in the startup and the scale-up space? How do you think young companies can help, especially when valuations from revenues generated in emerging markets are a far lower multiple than those generated in developed markets? And it's a capital issue as well because capital into early stage tech doesn't really find home in emerging markets. Who has a take on that? I can always use the power of the moderator and assign the question. And all this question, if you had asked it 10 days ago, is very different from the answer you were probably asking. No, we are created at IFC, disruptive technology fund, which aims exactly at take some help from those startups, which are interesting, just to go out of what we're discussing, the kind of things that we are doing. Food waste, about climate change. We talk about a lot of emissions. We don't talk enough about food waste. And if you look at the impact on climate change on the poor farmers in developing countries, having a solution which allows you to protect, the product is very helpful. For instance, we invest in a company which has a product which is covering the vegetables or fruits and keep them much longer than they would have done. So this type of intervention, some things that we are working, and we are working also with MIT, where they have also a group of engineers which are working for development. And these are the kind of initiatives that we are developing. And we are trying to develop the ecosystem in emerging economies to be able to have that connection between those more advanced economy development funds, but also linking it to things which matter for people alive in developing countries. Hans, you get the last word? Yeah, the only thing I would say, first of all, first, it's about, of course, the purpose you have for the company, what you want to do. But if you want to scale and make profit very quickly, there's also ways you can help. Because sometimes you actually start with more richer countries, and when you have the scale there, then you can bring it to these areas. I think about mobile phones. I mean, that started costing, I'm not sure. $10,000 first mobile phone in Saudi Arabia and Sweden. And of course, that's where it started. And then you scale it, and then you can have it in the rest of the world. So there's still parts how you can help, even though you need to start in a sort of a capital market that is coming your way. But it's thinking how you want to scale it, because I think that many of the solutions you start within healthcare as well, they start in certain markets, and then they go to the rest of the world. I think the best outcome of our conversation today is that it is to be continued. And I want to thank Green Maxim again for being here today. Thank you so much for your insights. Of course, Makhtar, thank you for your presence. Hans Bestberg and Shobana Kimineni, you're great. You made my job easy. Thank you so much. Thank you.