 Good afternoon, everyone. I know there's a lot of interest in our plans to transition from the emergency pandemic hotel-motel program to a system that's better for the clients, the communities, and the state. So we're going to dig into that a little bit more today. Secretary Samuelson will cover the current hotel-motel program, which was established at the very beginning of the pandemic. It was specifically intended for people who would otherwise be in a congregate shelter, but they were closed because physical distancing was not possible. Now, over time, it ballooned into something totally different. And while it made sense in the beginning, after three years, it's clear that it's not working as well as it needs to. As the Secretary will explain, the program doesn't integrate well with our current social service system. And the hotels and motels in this program have also become significant public safety concerns, exposing participants to additional risks and have required a lot of attention from law enforcement. But more directly, those in the program don't have adequate access to and are not required to reach out for services, including safety net programs, counseling, mental health, and substance use treatment or job training. When you consider many in the program are no better off than when they were three years ago after spending almost $200 million, you can see why we might conclude. There must be a better way. This may be one of the many reasons why Congress and the President chose not to, once again, extend the program so states could return to a system of with clear eligibility, reasonable requirements, and sustainable funding. With that in mind, AHS has been working for months, reaching out to participants. As we transition back to a housing program with a better connection to Vermont's wraparound services, which are among the most generous in the nation. Now, there's no doubt this is going to be challenging because each has different needs and abilities. But we're committed to using the resources of all our agencies and departments, working with municipalities, state-funded housing programs, and community groups to build a better housing program. And this has been our approach from the very start. We have to acknowledge the root cause for many continues to be the affordability crisis we face across the state with housing in particular. That's why I've asked our commissioner of public safety and director of fire safety to work with local leaders to identify rental housing units that have been taken off the market due to safety concerns and lack of funding, to bring them back up to code and introduce them to our very successful VHIP program. I've also directed the Secretary of Natural Resources to continue her work with municipalities to identify communities with a wastewater capacity that would allow for additional housing units. And I've asked the commissioner of housing to work with the Office of the Treasure, VHCB and VHFA to identify all housing programs and available funding to significantly expedite construction of short, medium, and long-term housing. In report by June 30th on how the housing money intended to go to the treasure in VHCB in the budget could be deployed to get faster results for low and middle-income families. Lastly, looking a little further down the road, I've also asked that by July 28th, the Secretary of Commerce and Community Development, the Chair of the Natural Resources Board, the Secretary of Natural Resources, and the Secretary of Transportation identify all local and state rules and regulations which currently challenge the timely development of safe, decent, affordable housing in our communities. They'll report back to me on any flexibility that exists and whether temporary suspension of some rules and regulations would get us there faster. Again, there's a lot going on. And we acknowledge that moving away from this pandemic emergency program is going to be a challenge for some. But we're going to work with them as best we can to help them through it. And with that, I'll turn it over to Secretary Samuelson. Thank you, Governor, and thank you all for joining us today. I want to start by grounding us in what our ultimate goal is. And that is housing Vermonters, stably and permanently, while ensuring that we have wraparound supports and services that they need. I want to be clear that the pandemic hotel housing program falls short of this goal. In fact, I believe that while it was necessary stopgap during the pandemic, continuing to fund and make it the focal point of our housing program is preventing us from achieving our goal. I want to be sure that the public is up to speed on what our plans are for transitioning this program. And so I've asked Commissioner Winters to join me here who will help us walk through those details. I also want to be clear that as we look at the current program, we know that individuals are still dying in the program. We know that they have told us that they are reaching out to friends and families because they don't necessarily feel safe and to public safety. We also are clear that before we started working with them to come up with a plan that as many as 25% had an alternative plan that they were waiting to move forward with. And that's before we started working with those who didn't otherwise have a plan. In order for us to lay out the details, I want us to remember where we were three years ago in the spring of 2020. We didn't know much about COVID, how it spread, how it was treated and how it would impact the loss of human lives. We didn't have vaccines. And as a result, we had a complex and difficult decision to make. And we asked for monsters to stop their usual lives and to stay home and to stay safe. Yet we needed a plan for those who were unhoused and we needed a plan for those who were housed and relying on our congregate homeless shelters. To accomplish the goal of spreading COVID among that population, for the duration of the emergency, of the public health emergency, we opened up the eligibility criteria for our general assistance housing program. The pandemic program as we have moved it forward had few criteria and does not require people to engage in services. We were able to use federal pandemic emergency funding to continue to pay for it. And yet this came at a significant cost. From fiscal year 2020 to May 1st of this year, the state has spent more than $190 million on hotels and motels. And the current average cost per day is $145 per room. That's more than $51,000 a year for each of the households. Now we're three years on and the public health emergency is over and the federal funding has ended. The pandemic hotel housing program was structured as an economic benefit and was based on the general assistance housing program. It was used before the pandemic as a last resort. And it was a safety net that was intended to be used for very limited periods of time. It was not designated to be permanent or even a medium term housing solution for families and households. The result of using the emergency housing program which is an economic benefit only is that people in the hotel and motel program are not getting the services that they need and which are built into our other programs that are specifically designed to address homelessness. The traditional programs that we have in permanent supportive housing and transitional housings goals are decided to make homelessness brief and non-reoccurring. As established, the pandemic housing program took in a diverse set of individuals. Some who have needs that need to be addressed that include long-term care, developmental services, people who need mental health care and others who need care for treatment for substance use disorder. Some are also able-bodied adults who are just currently really struggling. The clients in this program I wanna emphasize have very diverse needs and diverse range of services. So as we talk with one, it's one, it's not everyone. This should not be accepted. The range of services that they need to access, they have been often disconnected from through this program and that should not be acceptable to anyone here or anyone in this room. For this reason, this program needs to be transitioned and we have a plan to get us there that includes enhancing the specialized transitional and permanent housing supports that Vermonters need and that they deserve. To start, AHS has been working, as the governor said, for months to assess the needs of these individuals who will be transitioning from the program on June 1 and July 1 and to assist them in getting services that they need. These include mental health services, substance use treatment, healthcare, workforce and training, supports and housing opportunities. We've had teams in the hotels since last fall really digging in and driving forward to help people move. We're putting in place, we know that not everyone will be ready on June 1 and July 1. So we're putting in safety nets for populations who don't have other alternatives. The agency is going to increase the capacity in our current shelters and we have been and we've been transitioning them from being temporary seasonal shelters to permanent shelters. And we're also going to support temporary congregate shelters and capacity beginning on July 1. Importantly, we are not doing this work alone. There are incredible set of partners all across Vermont with the expertise and the infrastructure to assist us. We're seeking their input and you've seen that in some of our actions this week and ideas from those leaders and communities so that we can support and enhance their work and collaborate with them. However, when communities do not have the resources or the plans needed, the state is ready to work together to find creative solutions. There won't be a one size fits all approach. As I said, it's a diverse body of individuals and it's a diverse set of communities and service providers. This transition will require our team to work closely as case managers with each individual to find the solutions that are right for them. And we won't stop there. We are working to, as I said, to expand shelter beds, including moving some of our seasonal shelters to year round and permanent shelters. We will include collaboration with ACCD and VHCB to bring on units with strong investments as Commissioner Hannaffords will speak with about the, with the VHIP program and to focus on bringing mobile homes back where there are current vacant lots. And we must expand permanent and transitional housing programs and we're working to do that, including our corrections reentry programs, our residential mental health beds, adding substance use and recovery housing beds and medical respite to help better serve these populations. Very importantly, we will be restarting the general assistance housing program on July 1 and expanding eligibility to those families who have children. This is an all hands on deck moment to get these Vermonters to a better place, literally and figuratively. And the need to end this pandemic program has brought into focus the real problem. The affordable housing crisis that has developed around Vermont over the last several decades. Regulatory and policy barriers to upgrade our housing stock and build new affordable housing, along with our rapidly aging demographics have driven the current crisis we are facing in our state. We're seeing first time home owners who are priced out of the market. Homes are selling within hours unseen. Workforce shortages and high demand mean that we don't have enough skilled contractors to make the repairs that people need. And rental units are at an all time vacancy low. As the pressures get pushed down the affordable housing crisis impacts our most vulnerable Vermonters the most. Those who are lower income or who are in marginalized populations. Let me be clear, Vermont has a critical housing crisis. This includes long standing policies that disproportionately impact marginalized populations and primarily those that the agency of human services serves. Again, we recognize the end of this pandemic program is going to be difficult transition for some. We know that there are some in our system of care who are going to have to make a transitionary step and Commissioner Winchers will talk about this in greater detail, but we are committed to being there to help and to support them. These steps are not easy, but our team is working with individuals who need it and who accept our help. These Vermonters are our neighbors, they're our friends, our families, and they need us to help them step up from this program in this moment and to help them accept that this housing is not in their best interest and does not serve us to move them forward in their lives. Like the rest of us, they need and deserve to be housed and stable and permanently while ensuring that they have wraparound services and supports that they need to survive. Now I'm going to turn it over to the department of Children and Families Commissioner, Chris Winters, to go into more detail. Thank you, Secretary. As the brand new commissioner of DCF, I've had to come up to speed rather quickly on a number of issues in this one being first and foremost. I think there's a bit of a misperception out there that the department or the state in general has not been planning, has not been working on this issue, and I can tell you there's nothing further from the truth. I have a staff of people who are dedicated, dedicated to helping Vermonters. They're there working for the state because they want to make a difference and they've been working very hard, especially over the last three years to make a difference for Vermonters during the pandemic and coming out of it. This is going to be and is incredibly challenging for all involved, but especially for the folks who are experiencing homelessness. All of us agree that homelessness is not adequately addressed by using the hotel rooms or the emergency shelters. Only housing units with sustainable income or rental support and connections to supports, including employment, mental health, substance use, medical care, only that kind of housing will truly address the problem. And that's not happening in hotels. The Department for Children and Families has traditionally been there to support the crisis response to homelessness and to work with other agencies and organizations and we do work with other organizations on the longer term solutions. DCF's Economic Services Division has provided support for Vermonters experiencing poverty and other challenges. The Office of Economic Opportunity within DCF helps provide funding, support, and planning for emergency shelters. All of these folks have been working incredibly hard to address and prevent unsheltered homelessness and continue to every single day. DCF, as has been said, is intended as a safety net with ladders of opportunity. And there are other support services for those folks who are experiencing a low point in their lives and may need some help to get back on their feet and move out of poverty. It's important to remember, it's been said a couple of times already, but it's worth repeating that these folks are our neighbors. Also important to remember is just like the rest of Vermont, this is a diverse population with diverse and sometimes complex needs. And since April of 2020, we've worked to help 3,000 households exit homelessness. Meanwhile, we can't lose sight of investments in housing, in rental assistance, in emergency housing, and in homelessness assistance services. DCF will continue to be that safety net, and we are returning to pre-pandemic requirements. We've been engaged in this work for quite some time. Just in the past year, DCF has invested additional funding in shelter expansion and renovation. We've supported permanent housing. We've expanded homelessness prevention efforts, and we've partnered with more and more hotels and motels to support the General Assistance Housing Program. It's now 76 hotels and motels in the program currently. Here's how we've been helping people transition throughout the last three years, and how we're helping people prepare for this transition coming up. Much of this work has been ongoing since October. The Agency of Human Services has transitional housing care coordination teams that have been conducting motel-based outreach. They're in the hotels and motels every day, screening and sharing care planning since October. They're trying to connect the people with the resources that they may need with mixed success. Health care through nurses from the Vermont Chronic Care Initiative, economic benefits, family services, job training through the higher ability program, and we've been able to reach at least half of the households and hotels and motels, but there is no requirement that they connect with us or participate. Even more recently, we've been focused on cross-departmental teams within the Agency of Human Services, bringing health, mental health, aging and independent living, corrections, and health access to the table to do everything that we can to increase opportunities for those coming out of the hotels and motels, including medical respite beds, long-term care and senior housing program beds, leveraging increased rates for assisted care in residential care, recovery housing, mental health residential beds, Department of Corrections reentry housing. These are all in coordination with the complex care housing teams. We work to incorporate community partners and healthcare providers into those care teams and into those care conferences where it's not already occurring. We work with the Department of Vermont Health Access to identify and prioritize clients who need support with long-term care determinations. We work with the Department of Aging and Independent Living, Department of Health and Department of Mental Health to triage those needing other levels of care. These departments will assist complex care housing teams in navigating to the appropriate provider. We have a focus on physical and mental health needs and substance use as well as long-term care options. We prioritize beds for those with complex needs and those eligible for skilled nursing care. These are all the connections we're making with those who are experiencing homelessness and are coming out of the hotel and motel program. Some of the other efforts that we're making include work with community partners. The community partners and providers are really key here. The state can't solve this problem alone. We've sent out a letter of interest to see all of the local solutions and ideas, what might already be in progress and how we can bolster efforts on the ground that are already working successfully. We want to partner with these communities. We've issued an RFP to backfill any gaps if needed, especially around staffing, emergency shelters and day stations. We're working to establish congregate shelters in areas with a high proportion of individuals exiting pandemic housing and to establish day stations in partnership with local municipalities where people can access showers, bathrooms, running water, charging stations and other services that they may need. We're having community meetings with the commissioner of DCF president and the secretary of AHS in key communities. Those are already underway. And we have field services directors in every community meeting with them ongoing with key coordination points and seeking out local solutions. The current moment with all of its challenges and all of the obstacles we face calls for a collaborative approach to this issue. We need to be doing our collective best to support people during this transition. Solving homelessness takes broad coordination. The larger response to homelessness relies on the availability or creation of affordable units and the capital to support those units based on the necessity of having the three components to support safe and stable exits, housing, stock, rental assistance and services. The governor touched on a few of these and commissioner Hanford will now go further into further detail on the housing side of things. We all have a part to play in this. Thank you, commission winners. The team has already covered a lot about the importance of permanent housing in this discussion. So I'll be brief, but I do want to give a little more context to the shortage of units we face and what we've been doing to address it. First, it's important to be honest with ourselves that this housing crisis is not just the result of the pandemic. It's been decades in the making, decades of underbuilding, and that underbuilding in many cases was intentional. We've all seen the data showing nearly zero percent net new housing growth over the last decade from 2010 to 2020. The regulatory barriers in place do slow housing. They slow our ability to build more and they make it more expensive, which dries up the cost for renters and homeowners. We hear from many home builders who run into barrier after barrier that delay projects, force for your units and even scrap some projects altogether. You can even see this controversy playing out all over Vermont right now around projects to build more shelters or others to serve vulnerable populations. This makes it harder to solve this challenge. And we took some good steps forward this year in the legislature and proposals from the governor, but it's not enough. Second, despite these obstacles, we have put historic amounts of funding into building more affordable housing. This all started back in 2017 with the governor calling for the $37 million housing revenue bond. We built on that with nearly another $400 million for affordable housing development appropriated just in the last three years. And while it's still not enough, it does make a difference. There's housing being built all around the state. The Vermont Housing and Conservation Board has brought 545 new affordable units online, filled at this moment, 350 those serving formerly homeless families. And one of our most effective tools to date to re-house homeless individuals and families in Vermont has been the Vermont Housing Improvement Program, VHIP. This program revitalizes existing units, which means they can get online faster and at about a 10th the cost of other more costly programs. VHIP, with about a $20 million investment so far, has created 586 units with over 400 serving formerly homeless Vermont families. This year we asked the legislature for another 20 million that was reduced to 15 million, but we're working to get that into the field quickly as possible and bringing new units online for those exiting homelessness or in need of more affordable housing. Finally, I want to be clear that our housing crisis extends throughout income levels, and we have a significant shortage of housing for middle income from honors as well. The very housing needed by those working so hard to solve this problem and to address the needs of the most vulnerable. We can't take our attention away from this housing need as well. That's why we've also tried hard to get more investments into missing middle housing, a segment of the market that we desperately need more of because we have more units for middle-income families that helps free up more affordable housing units and provides the housing we need for communities and our economy to thrive in Vermont. And with that, I'll turn it back over to the Governor. Thank you very much, and we'll now open up to questions. You said about eligibility for families with children. So as we've looked at what we can do, and as we've laid out a key set of examples, because I think as Commissioner Winter says, we've been working on this transition for months, first to build the units, as Commissioner Hannaford said, then to assess and help people get services they need, and third, identifying the gap. In that planning, we've come, and you've heard us talk through a few of these strategies today. We've looked at different options. One of the options that we have is that we're going to take the general assistance housing program, and it will restart on July 1st. And in addition to that, right now, it serves families with children up to six. We're going to allow and expand that to families with children who are up to 18 and are school-aged. How many days of shelter will they receive? So our current, and I can, Commissioner Winters can add and address more specific questions about the program. But the current GA housing program that existed prior to the pandemic is 28 days for families with children. So if you were the family with children, you can get an extra month in the GA program if you can update me. That is correct. So this would also be for Secretary Samuelson. You kind of talked about whether it's turning temporary shelters into permanent, or just kind of expanding capacity, but city and town managers I've spoken with in the past weeks, and this is all happening, say either can't find people to run these shelters or already completely full, they don't know how that capacity could be expanded. So I guess what would be the problem for that municipality is just don't believe the room is there. I can take this one. That's one of the reasons we're issuing the RFP. We're looking for ideas. We're looking, we know that some of the best ideas will come from outside of state government. Part of that RFP is to set up emergency shelters. It's also to provide staffing, because we are hearing the same thing in our conversations, and we're hearing it over and over. The local community action agencies are burned out. It's been a long couple of years. They're working really hard with many shelters at capacity already. So staffing is something that's really key to those expansions and to new shelters. So we're waiting to see what we get as far as offers proposals to provide that staffing. And we're also asking others to step forward, maybe others who haven't been involved in supporting these kinds of community organizations or this work now is a great time for people to step up. We need this is, as we've heard, an all hands on deck moment. And it'll take all of us to help solve this problem that's facing us in the next couple of months. Governor, I think I heard Secretary Samuelsson say that, right now, emergency housing participants are not required to seek help with the problems that may have contributed to their homelessness. Will the state begin to require people receiving these benefits to seek help as a condition of further assistance? I think, again, I'll let one of them answer the question specifically, but that's been one of the challenges with the program over the last two or three years. There hasn't been that accountability, the oversight that we had in the GA program to begin with. So going back to the GA program, we will have more accountability, more oversight, and get those folks who are in the program the help they need so that they can exit homelessness and we can address some of the substance use issues that they might have and other issues to get them back into some sort of sustainability and have a life ahead of them that where they can fulfill that rather than just be housed in a hotel program. It'll look like the GA program that we had previous to this, whether it's in some of what we've talked about today, whether it's finding them an opportunity, a job, giving them the substance use counseling that they need. Anything, and Secretary Samuelson said, each and every one is different, they're not the same. So that's why it takes so much time and effort to make sure that we get them the help they need. So going off that, do you think people took advantage of this? Do you think people came to Vermont? I think there are some that did, yes. Some that didn't have a number. No, I mean, that's part of the problem. Like I said, we didn't have a lot of oversight into this program, it was just opened up. And we were just, we were actually just the credit card that they use to get into the program. There wasn't a lot of oversight there. So obviously all these programs have been in the works months before we're sitting here today, but we're days, weeks away. Is there gonna be a flood of people camping in streets throughout the state? We don't know, to be perfectly honest with you, we are going to address that as we need to. Again, June one is the first date, the phase one, so to speak, and phase two is July one. So we are going to have all hands on deck trying to do whatever we can to prevent that from happening. But I don't think Vermont should be surprised. During the pandemic, we had to give good news and bad news, and this isn't something that we hoped for. But I don't think people should be surprised to see people in those situations. Yeah, go ahead. That's why I'm sure that I understood what is happening for the families that have children who are, for whom the program is going to end July 1st. Are they basically gaining an extension of 28 days as long as they participate in the general assistance program? Do I have that right? Basically. So for families, right now what we're saying is for, and I'm going to go into a little bit more detail so we can prevent some of the additional questions. So we are saying that for those who are eligible for the general assistance housing program, traditional eligibility encompassed families with children up to age six, individuals who have a disability, women who are pregnant in their third trimester, and individuals who, try and make sure I got them all. The day that we are going to the program will restart on July 1 for them. The eligibility, one of the groups that's not included in the traditional eligibility criteria are families with children between the ages of seven and 18. They will be included in the GA program and that reset of the clock on July 1st. And I missed an eligibility category, Chris. Can you help me out there? I don't have it off the top of my head. But connected to that, as part of the general assistance program would be the accountability segment and services. So I'm going to take a step back to that question. The best practice that we see in housing and homelessness is that individuals are enrolled in programs where services are provided. They include things like our shelters that we see across the state, where there's active case management happening in those shelters. They also include things like corrections reentry housing, substance use recovery housing, mental health residential care, medical respite. All of those programs that are the best practices for working with individuals who are experiencing homelessness include services and case management and by design individuals who are participating in those programs are getting those services. The general assistance housing program was intended to be a very short term stop gap for individuals who had no other options. It's why we use it in the winter during adverse weather conditions. It really is for those who have no other options. There are some criteria around homelessness and how you became homeless. There are also criteria related to your income and criteria that require you to contribute some of your income to paying for the hotel rooms. That will go back into effect with the general assistance housing program. SSDI, SSDI. So again, I'm gonna walk through what those eligibility criteria are. They include those who are experiencing domestic violence, 65 and those who are 65 and older, children with families who are up to six years old, those with SSDI and women who are pregnant in their third trimester. These people get 30, sorry, 28 days of shelter, right? They do get 20 against shelter. In a single calendar year. In a single calendar year, that is correct. What happens at the end of those 28 days? We are, during those 28 days, our teams will continue to work with them to navigate to alternatives. And as a state, we are putting in place safety nets including congregate shelters and expansion of our current shelter system. I mean, if no one answers the state's call for that RFP, what then? So there's a multi-pronged approach here as Commissioner Winters said and I think the governor will also have some questions and answers for this. The multi-pronged approach here, we've been doing planning, identifying sites, locations, organizations. The multi-pronged approach, yep. But, okay, there are hundreds of shelter beds in Vermont. They're already full. There are thousands of homeless people in Vermont. So, we are gonna set up congregate shelters. How do you cover that gap? Yeah, we're gonna work to set up congregate shelters. We've been very successful throughout the pandemic in using staffing organizations and companies to staff our healthcare institutions and organizations. The RFP allows us to pull that back out and to use it as a backstop and an alternative. We've been very successful with that today. So, that's the main hope is that someone comes through answers that RFP and stands up like maybe up to a thousand shelter beds within a month or two. We will continuously assess what the gap is and continue to meet the folks' needs. And similar to what we've done over the last three years to respond to what the needs are on the ground. And I don't know, Robert, do you have anything to add to that? As we've proven over the last seven years, we'll address these challenges as they come. I would contend we don't know exactly what the number will be. I think a thousand is probably inflated some. But time will tell and we'll address it as we need to. Is there a plan if these people don't wanna leave? Are they just going to throw them and re-arrest them? This is their homes right now, it's been for a while. Well, again, this is something that they would have to deal with the hotel or motel that they're staying at this point in time. It's a contract between them and we've been paying the bill. Kind of going off of that painting picture of what, just a couple of days from now will look like. I mean, is there gonna be anybody from the state or law enforcement? Because like he said, I can't imagine everyone's just gonna wanna walk out of their rooms on their own free will. If any of you guys may be able to paint a picture of what this is going to look like. Well, we're hoping that those who have received notice will comply. And we'll address it as we need to. Governor, I wanna ask on a separate topic, a little earlier this week or late last week, Judge Allison Arms and Chittenden held your commissioner of mental health in contempt for not providing a mental health evaluation. Just wanna get your reaction to that. It was unfortunate after I heard about it. It's unfortunate that it reached that level. But I think it is being dealt with at this point in time and resolved. So we'll move forward from here. Do you believe that since something like this happened, this may be a stretch here, but is the commissioner's job in jeopardy at all? No, no, I have full faith in her. We just need to make sure that we do all we can to work together. That's been our approach over the last seven years and we'll continue to do that. Just one more, unless I think of another in this topic. Does this speak to a larger issue that you may be familiar with and incited in the order by the judge was there was some confusion around the statute and then there was some conversation about too many evaluations that need to be done, a backlog, not enough people. Is that something you're familiar with and what is your office doing to help address it? I can't address that. Maybe someone else here can. But again, we are throughout Vermont in every sector, we have staffing workforce issues. And we also know that through some of what we've tried to work with the legislature on, there are some who take advantage of the system as well to challenge the system, so to speak, whether it's in the judiciary or otherwise. So we need to again work together to make sure that we're providing the services we need and that we don't duplicate those efforts as well because there's a lot of folks who need out there. Is this an issue maybe addressing a backlog that was mentioned that you can throw money at and fix it? I mean, how do you fix a problem like that with the backlog in the courts now, a backlog in the mental health department? Yeah, I mean, money always helps, but as we found in this program alone, money doesn't solve all the problems and we need to address those individually as we can. So money isn't always the answer, although helpful. Can I go to the farms and then we can head to that? The only thing I would add is I want to emphasize with the governor that we will continue to work collaboratively with the courts as will the Department for Mental Health, but to specifically address the question, money won't solve it all, but what we have seen is the Department of Mental Health has been able to over the last brief period of time reduce the wait time significantly by about half of what they were before from a year to less than six months. And so not only are we going to continue to work collaboratively with the courts, we are working hard to address the issue and the wait time that was the ire of the court. The last one for me, Jason, I'm sorry. For the secretary, as part of that contempt order, there was a $3,000 payment that needed to be made by the Department of Mental Health. Where is that money coming from? Is the commissioner paying it out of pocket? Where are the taxpayers putting the bill? Where does that money come from? I'll leave it that to our lawyers to respond to how to interpret that. But my understanding is that's if we don't comply and at this point it's mine, we have ordered the evaluation, the individual is, and we're moving forward. Thank you. I just had a quick question before we go to the phone with the governor. Is there any doubt that you're going to veto the state budget this year? Yes. Could you explain that to me? You've talked about this before. There's always doubt. Well, I don't think so. How likely is it that you're going to veto it? I don't think anybody's going to be very surprised if I veto this bill. But there's always an opportunity to find a different way. And we've got another 24 hours to think about that. Can you explain what you're trying to negotiate with legislators later? No. So we're just coming to grips with the ripple effect of this as well. But I don't think anyone's going to be surprised. I've talked about this. I think we're spending too much money in too many different areas. And I just don't think it's healthy for our economic outlook to move forward. But I could change my mind in 24 hours. What could happen to make you change your mind? We might find a different way of accomplishing the same thing, although unlikely. But we need to go through the bill. We're still going through the bill. We, as you know, we received, I think we'll be receiving about 70 bills that were passed in the last two weeks. So they're coming fast and furious now, and it takes a lot of work by one particular general counsel, person that has to go through each and every word and all our departments and agencies. And we have an obligation, even if we know what we're going to do with the bill, we still have to go through it to identify maybe challenges within the bill. Maybe there was mistakes made. And we need to identify that so that the legislature can choose to rectify it or at least know about it as we see it. Because at the last minute, you've been around for a long time, Bob. You know that there's a lot going on legislatively and a lot of things get put together and put into the bill and they might not all tie out well and correctly. So we're trying to identify those as we work through the language. Does the state's most recent revenue report reinforce your concerns that this bill spends too much money? I think it does. And I think that what we're seeing across the country should give everyone just a little bit of pause here. As I said, many, many times, our goals are the same. It's just the pace at which we're getting there is the concerning part. And I believe that we proven that with the right approach working together, we can provide for economic vitality and grow the resources that we need that we want to use for some of these programs over time. But we can't do it all at once and we can't force this. Governor, what do you make of this fundraiser that the Vermont Democratic Party started to what they characterize as fight back against you and your administration on the GA housing discussion? Yeah, I mean, it's just politics as usual. It's DC style politics. I don't think it lends well to what we're all trying to accomplish. We need less polarization. We need more people to get together, work this out and for the betterment of Vermont. But it's politics as usual. Going back to the April revenues coming out, back in January and throughout the session you've worn that we're kind of gonna sober up as a state financially and so did the state's economists at the board meeting back in January. With the Education Fund, Transportation Fund, General Fund, not hitting our targets and personal income, are we kind of starting to see this in front of our very eyes now of what you and the economists worn back in January? Yeah, I do think so. Again, as I've said many, many times, this injection of all this federal money really stimulated the economy here in Vermont and throughout the country. It overstimulated in some respects, but the less money we're receiving of these programs ending have an effect on our income. So it just makes sense that we're not going to be able to live by the standard we've been living by over the last few years, two or three years. It's going to become in full view that our revenues will decline. In fact, there could be a negative budget adjust next year. We'll see. We'll go to the phones now and then come back to folks in the room. We'll start with Keith Rutland-Herald. Keith, it looks like you're still muted. There you go. Yeah, I'm up. That's right. Thank you. Tim McQuiston, Vermont Business Magazine. Hi, Governor. Jermaine, what Bob was talking about, if the budget's vetoed and it's then sustained, it's likely that the new budget would have actually more money in it to meet the political obligations as you well know. And what do you do at that point? Well, we take one budget at a time. As I've shown, we'll do what's right for Vermonters. And if, you know, I don't want to play the what-ifs because I don't know for sure they have the numbers. Obviously, they will, some of them that voted against the bill will probably come to the aid of the party in their mission and eventually override if we choose to take that approach. But if not, and they come up with something that's worse, I veto that as well. You know, with the revenues, one of the curious things is the cratering of the personal income tax revenues. And at a time when we're in a labor shortage and there's a lot of employment, we know that there's been a wage inflation. Do you have a handle on why the personal income tax would be shorting at this point? I don't, actually. But there's more, you know, there was a lot of money injected over the last couple of years into this economy to help businesses survive and individuals survive. And that's not going to be, that's not sustainable and it's not coming anymore. So you think about all that money thrown in, the billions of dollars that were thrown into our economy that was somewhat artificial in some respects, that also was taxed, right? You know, with the sales tax and other taxes as well and the inflated prices for housing and so forth and building materials. I mean, we're just seeing the results of that. And when that flow of federal money stops and slows down, it has to have an effect on our economy. Now, thank you, Governor. Tom Davis, come this for a moment. Thanks, Jason. Governor, with that large pile of bills that your people are going through, where are you with S-100 at this point? S-100, I don't believe we've received it yet. They come in batches, never know what's coming next, sometimes three or four at a time. Sometimes I would say that it's going to be more aggressive as time moves on, but I don't believe we've received S-100 at this point. Okay, thank you. Another question. This process of doing more research regarding Act 250 and its impact on development for Maud, is do you have anyone in the administration who's involved in the implementation of that research? Are you talking about what I said in my remarks, or are you talking about it in general? They've begun some survey of research to see what the disposition is of different communities in regards to how the overall Act 250 provisions are working for towns and where the difficulties may be. Yeah, I don't have any knowledge of that at this point in time. Happy to look into it for you. Primary curiosity was one of the first places where they sent emails looking for survey responses was to municipalities, select boards or governing boards. And the unusual thing that seemed about that is while those individuals certainly govern and are aware of what's going on, they don't actually participate to the most part of the permitting process. And I was curious if they're actually gonna go out and get data from people who have experienced the entire Act 250 process. Yeah, Tom, maybe we can talk, have someone talk offline, we can tell us where that came from that would help us track it down. Very good, thank you, sir. Thank you. Got a few minutes for anyone else in the room. Brenda Siegel has just been warning that there will be people leaving this program who will be, as she says, sleeping on the couches of their drug dealers or going back to the homes of the people who abused them. And that she said people will die and that's gonna be the state's responsibility. And how do you respond to that? Yeah, again, I think I'll let Secretary Samuelson or Commissioner Winters approach that we don't think the Hotel Motel program that we have right now is healthy. I think a lot of what you're hearing is actually happening in this program because they're isolated. They're just basically warehouse in a hotel or motel and we don't have any eyes on them, so to speak. So that's part of the reason we want to move our way out of this. And the federal funding is being eliminated. So we want to make sure that we're providing all the services and the safety that they need so that that doesn't happen. So I'm going to let the other two add to that. So I think one of the things to go back to is what was the Motel and Hotel program designed to do? It was designed to prevent the spread of COVID. And in order to do that, it was designed to create a space where folks were isolated from others. And what we have seen is that the Hotel and Motel program, it's not immune from people who are participating in dying, often from overdoses just as you explain. It is not immune from folks feeling unsafe. When we've talked with individuals, they have told us that they are still reaching out to friends, to families, to public safety and law enforcement because they don't feel safe in the hotels and Motel programs. I'm not going to argue that this is going to be an easy transition for individuals, but our goal is again to make sure that individuals are established and set up with services to expand programs like recovery housing for those folks who are experiencing substance use disorder to ensure that we have additional mental health beds that are available for folks who desire and want to engage with us. So again, the Motel and Hotel program is not helping people thrive any more than it then and is not best practice. These other programs are best practice and are designed to help people receive the care they need and to move forward with their lives. When I like, before I, Chris, see Commissioner Winters, there's anything to add. I'll just add that one of the areas in which we do have some capacity for shelter beds are domestic violence shelters. That's a really important part of taking care of Vermonters and we would encourage anyone in those situations to reach out either through our office or directly to those domestic violence organizations for some help. Not gonna say that any of this is going to be easy. This is going to be really challenging when people don't have a roof over their heads. That stability does come into play. They have to make really difficult choices about where they're going to stay to provide for themselves or their families. None of this is easy, but I will commit that the Department for Children and Families and all of our other state partners and our community organizations are gonna be working really hard to connect with every single person who comes out of those motels, find them safe places, find them good choices and do our best to make sure that their needs are met and that they stay safe. I wrote like 3,000 words on how terrible this local program was. How expensive it is, how poor some of the overnight was. So I'm not gonna argue that this program is wasteful and inadequate. But where is the evidence that the alternative is any better if the shelter beds do not exist in which to deliver these wraparound services that you keep talking about, right? You talked about how isolated these people are in hotel rooms. Are they not also going to be isolated intense? It is our hope that with the program ending, other programs are going to step up. We understand there's not a lot of capacity out there. But if we don't ever get to an endpoint and we keep kicking the can down the road, having folks in these bad conditions in motels, that's not a good policy. It's not good for the people in the program either. Like I said, this is gonna be really, really difficult. This is an inflection point for us to put these folks into back in front of everyone's visibility so that we're actually facing and addressing the real issues behind homelessness. It's a really difficult choice that legislators have had to make, that this administration has had to make. And we're not saying that any one of these solutions is perfect. Just a really question on the families of children. So when I've asked state officials in the past about what happens when the GA program comes back, they have said that those who are currently in the program, even if they would qualify under the GA rules, because they're already in the program, they will have been considered to have already used up their days. So are you changing that? So I'm thinking of like your family with like a seven year old, right? Or at this point, even a six year old. Are you out on, if you're in the program now, are you out on July 1st? Or are you now out 28 days after? Because you qualify. 28 days after we're resetting the clock. Okay. That was another difficult decision to make, but we think it provides for an additional off ramp, a slowing of exiting people from motels, additional time for people to make plans. Okay. So like if you're near third trimester, all of those things, over 65, you now have effectively an extra month. Okay, I just wanted to say. Further governor, I believe tomorrow and I would be the deadline. I'm just wondering if you had an inkling or maybe a decision on some of those? Well, again, we have the next 24 hours to figure that out. But you might want to look back at what I've done with those charter changes previously. Final question for me related to the housing. We talked a lot about the impact that this is going to have on the folks living in these conditions, but what about the hotels and motels themselves? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. But what about the hotel and motels themselves? I mean, when this program ends, is the state have plans to help these folks fix up the hotel rooms from, say, potential damages or anything like that? Without federal cash, how are you going to do that? Well, I think they've received quite a bit of federal cash already. And I would think if they plan properly and they put enough money away from what they were charging to make any necessary repairs. This is another opportunity, though. was to talk about this, but some of these hotels and motels might change their business practice at this point. They might go and provide maybe longer term rentals and so forth. So some of the people who are in these facilities now may be staying. We don't know, but we've heard anecdotally that some of that will happen, and then they can make some of the repairs and renovations necessary to change their whole program. Josh? I think that's exactly right, Governor. There already have been 13 or 14 hotel and motel conversions to permanent housing around the state. I think there's more opportunity to get back to the staffing shortage and some of the organizations to manage those, but I think that some of these hotel and motel operators are looking at that, and maybe they can make that conversion themselves, because I'm not sure that their market is going to be quite the same. I think it's also when we talk about folks resolving their situation, we hear about some folks in these motels that are working full time, jobs, but they just can't find a unit. Maybe they can work out a better deal with the owner. They've been paid quite a bit for these rooms well beyond what I believe they were making before the pandemic. Maybe some folks, if it is a good place for them, can work out a situation to stay off the revenue they're receiving. Going off that, did the state ever negotiate these rooms? We knew the funds were running out. We're paying $4,000 a month for rooms closer than this, but nothing in it. Did we ever negotiate these prices? Again, this is a supply and demand issue. We had more to plan than we had supply. They were setting the rates and we had virtually no choice in many cases. It's not the way I would like to negotiate, but at the same time, when you think about during the pandemic, we had an obligation to make sure that the people were isolated and could keep them safe, and so there weren't a lot of rooms available. You mentioned the previous concerns that you had with some charter changes, I'm thinking of Brattleboro and the 16 and 17-year-olds. If I remember correctly, when you vetoed that charter change before, you had concerns about people under 18 signing legal contracts on behalf of the community. Serving on the select board. Lawmakers feel they've addressed that particular issue. Do you think they have? We'll go through that over the next 24 hours and see if they did or not, but I think you'll find that they actually might have made it worse, but we'll see. All right. So the timeline right now is about 800 people leave on June 1st, 2,000 people leave on July 1. Given that reset, what are the new, so it's 800 June 1st, right? And then how many will leave July 1st and then how many will leave 28 days from then? I don't know that number off the top of my head, but I can get that for you. Thank you. With that, I hope everyone has a very safe Memorial Day weekend, and if you get an opportunity, think of that as well, honor the fallen, but along those same lines, thank the living for all that they've done for us. So again, have a very safe and enjoyable weekend. We'll talk to you next week.