 Yes, so I mean I wonder whether it might be more helpful to move away from the moralization of this discussion because I was thinking about what was said earlier in the panel. There's 12% of the world that shares this view and 88% that doesn't. And the question is not why does the 88% not share this view? Is that because they're stupid? Is that because they're immoral? Is that because there's something about the Western stance on this conflict and the moralization of the conflict that doesn't sit well with the kind of double standards when it comes to assessing morally conflicts around the world that doesn't resonate with actually the majority of the world's population that isn't represented around this table and isn't represented in this theater, but is there. And the question is, what is their point of view? It's not about the Eastern West, it's about the majority and the minority, 88%. You don't know that 88% believe that the Ukrainians should lay down and die. You don't know that. And since they are also human beings, I have to assume that if Oksana went to Shanghai and had an event and told her story, she would find much sympathy and support. Secondly, 88%, 99% of people can believe something and still be wrong. And 1% of the world can believe something and still be right. By supporting the Ukrainians and by fighting the Russians, one is not ignoring, neglecting or endorsing the long history of colonialism that preceded it. But every single time I choose to order a meal, I cannot be expected to deal with the problem of colonialism. There are times when one has to deal with this, but there are also emergencies in history. And when there are emergencies, whatever the past was, if I'm a son of Holocaust survivors, if Germany is attacked by Putin, I will support them and I will not sit there and say, well, it's complicated for me because they murdered my family and so on. That is not any way to proceed. Okay, no, no, no, no. Just a second, you cannot reduce the Shoah, the Holocaust to this war. This war has nothing to do with the Holocaust. This war has nothing to do with Shoah. This is a war and has nothing to do also with colonialism. This war is a war between two nationalism, two, yes, two strong nationalism. Okay, I want to shift it just slightly. Because what I think Donatello is talking about is not that the Ukrainian should lie down and die. I think what you're talking about, tell me if I'm wrong, is that there's a place for negotiation and reason. That ought to be an alternative now. But this is where I, American historian, on January 20th, 1961, John F. Kennedy famously said, right, let us not negotiate out of fear, but let us not ever fear to negotiate. I want to flip that. Let us never fear to negotiate, but we should never negotiate out of fear. And I think what's going on today is that we're being asked to negotiate out of fear. That is precisely what the Russians are doing, not just with this, but what was discussed earlier, all of the nuclear threats, all of that stuff that's going on here. Taken for what you will, it is injecting fear. It is expecting us to negotiate out of fear. That is not a position. I mean, there is such a thing as goodwill, seriousness, moral seriousness, but also political seriousness. And I don't see that here. What I see is that we're being pushed to the negotiating table in a completely false way, because it's not about negotiation. It's just not.