 Hi everyone. Welcome back to Virtual Classic Tuesdays from the Bedford Playhouse. I'm John Farr. Tonight we're featuring Bonnie and Clyde from 1967. A landmark film that opened the floodgates to a new boldness and originality in Hollywood filmmaking. A creative renaissance that would last about a decade. The making of Bonnie and Clyde is also about the dogged persistence of one man, Warren Beatty, who not only starred in the film but also produced it. From the start, Bonnie and Clyde had more than a chair of doubters and detractors. Really, it was Beatty's unwavering faith in the film that allowed it eventually to succeed. Today, we think of Warren Beatty as a highly accomplished actor, producer, writer, and director. But back in the early to mid-60s, he was in a very different place. A stunningly handsome younger brother of actress Shirley McClain, he'd won early fame when he co-starred opposite Natalie Wood in 1961's Splendor in the Grass, directed by Elia Kazan. But every movie he'd made since, like The Roman Spring of Mrs. Stone, Lilith, and Mickey One, had fizzled. He'd also helped produce the wacky comedy What's New Pussycat in 1965, bringing on Woody Allen to write the script and co-star. And even though that movie made money, it was an unhappy experience for him and Beatty was not proud of the finished product. Worse yet, the word was out that Warren Beatty was difficult to work with, and in Hollywood, that's only tolerated if you deliver the goods consistently. Simply put, in 1966, Warren Beatty badly needed a hit. Well, as is often the case, the opportunity came about totally by chance and from an unexpected source. In 1965, Beatty was still involved with Leslie Caron, an older, more established star best remembered for an American in Paris and Gigi. Caron was obviously French and knew the director Francois Truffaut, a leading proponent of a movement in cinema called The French New Wave. Well, she and Beatty were in Paris and set up a lunch with Truffaut to talk about an idea they had for a biopic on French singer Edith Piaf. Well, Truffaut wasn't interested, but he mentioned a script treatment he'd received about two American bank robbers from the 30s, Clyde Barrow and Bonnie Parker. The treatment was written by two novices from New York City who both had day jobs at Esquire Magazine. Their names were David Newman and Robert Benton. Newman and Benton were huge fans of The French New Wave. Being New Yorkers, they had plenty of opportunity to see those films which were being shown all over town in those days. Benton had actually grown up in Texas and remembered hearing about the exploits of the doomed bank robbers Bonnie and Clyde. He and Newman had picked up a book about depression-era bank robbers at the same time and both had been inspired. They wanted to take a quintessentially American story and film it in the raw style of The French New Wave, which is why they approached Truffaut first. Once back in the States, Beatty called Benton and asked to read the script. Benton was thrilled, said, sure, and offered to bring it to him. Well, Benton was surprised when Beatty said, no, no, I'll come get it. Ten minutes later, knock on the door and there was Beatty himself. There had not even been time for Benton to warn his wife, who promptly appeared in Curlers. Benton said that when Beatty left, his wife would not speak to him for weeks. Well, no surprise, Beatty loved the script. But at first, he thought he'd just produced the film. Initially, he saw his friend Bob Dylan for the part of Clyde, as Dylan actually resembled him physically. The real Clyde Barrow was a wiry 5'7", while Beatty was a strapping 6'4". For Bonnie, he first thought of his sister Shirley McClain. Eventually, he came around to the idea of playing the part himself. Obviously, he couldn't play opposite his sister, so he considered a range of other actresses, including his old flame Natalie Wood, who was decidedly not interested. An even bigger challenge was finding the right director. Beatty first pitched old-timers George Stevens and William Weiler and they turned him down. He took it to Arthur Penn, who just directed Beatty and Mickey 1. Penn passed on it too. Beatty approached a few more names, who all declined, and then circled back to Penn. And Beatty was a bulldog, and a highly persuasive bulldog, and finally Penn relented. Also resisting the film was legendary studio head Jack Warner, who failed to see the appeal of this bloody exercise that seemed to glorify the bad guys. As with Arthur Penn, more than anything else, Beatty simply wore him down. One story has Jack Warner pointing to the Warner Brothers' water tower, and reminding Warren that it's his name up there. Well, Beatty replied that WB were also his initials. This guy at Hood Spa. The tumult happening in Hollywood just then, including the upcoming sale of Warner Brothers to 7Arts, proved a key advantage for Beatty and Penn. The old formulas and movies had not been working for some time. The old regimes and traditional ways of doing things were also quietly crumbling all around them. So there was room and tolerance for experimentation. Beatty and Penn would take their modest budget of $2.5 million and shoot most of their film on location across Texas. And they would mostly be left alone with the freedom to make something truly special. First, Beatty hired his close friend Robert Town for script rewrites. Town, who'd win a best screenplay Oscar several years later for Chinatown, would be on the set for the duration. Beatty knew casting would be critical. He'd admired Gene Hackman's talent and discipline on the set of Lilith and quickly cast him as Clyde's brother Buck. Arthur Penn had also directed TV and theater and knew all the players. He suggested Estelle Parsons for Buck's wife Blanche. And he also cast a virtually unknown stage actor named Gene Wilder to play the undertaker kidnapped by Bonnie and Clyde. Now the character of sidekick C.W. Moss, eventually played by Michael J. Pollard, was a composite of several actual accomplices Bonnie and Clyde picked up during their crime spree. That character evolved considerably over time. Originally, Benton and Newman's script portrayed Clyde as bisexual, with Moss a he-man type and a menage-au-tois situation going on with Moss, Clyde and Bonnie. Well, Penn convinced the writers this was a bridge too far for 1967 audiences and suggested they make Clyde impotent instead to keep an element of sexual dysfunction. So the character of C.W. Moss was then reimagined with Pollard in mind and his character provides much needed comic relief. For the key role of Bonnie, they finally took a chance on 25-year-old actress and model Faye Dunaway. Penn had seen Dunaway on stage back east and thought she had possibilities. But Bady resisted at first, wanting a more established name. Dunaway certainly looked the part, though she'd need to lose some weight to play the bird-like Bonnie. But more important, having grown up in northern Florida in a very southern community, Dunaway could relate to this wild Texas mall. Penn continued pushing for her and Bady finally agreed. Now, there was another fortunate discovery early on in this production. Back in the mid-60s, the small towns that Bonnie and Clyde had visited were largely intact. This made location scouting and set design a lot easier than expected. Without question, Warren Bady was extremely fortunate to have Arthur Penn on board. He was really fortuitous that these two men had worked together before and knew what to expect from each other. Again, Warren Bady had a reputation for being difficult, particularly on directors. He questioned the motivation of virtually every scene, which delayed shooting and drove cast and crew nuts. But Penn had the patience to manage Bady. He'd talk him through a given scene, even if it meant everyone else on the set had to stand around and wait. Bady told Penn he wanted to have at least one fight with him each day, even if they had to manufacture one. Usually, that wasn't necessary. However, Penn understood Bady's belief that out of conflict comes inspiration, and he dealt with him accordingly. Penn was also an actors director, letting his players improvise to make scenes better. Gene Hackman, whose film career was really just beginning, would always be grateful for the freedom Penn gave him on this picture. Much has been made of the film's graphic violence, but Penn simply wanted to make his story as realistic and memorable as possible. Above all, he wanted to avoid doing another standard gangster picture, where people clutch their chests when they get shot. Here violence had to reach a new level of realism and, if possible, create a sort of perverse but powerful visual poetry. Penn knew that no Hollywood movie had ever shown a shooting without a cut between the person firing the shot and the victim's reaction. So that moment where the bank employee jumps on the getaway car and gets shot through the window was really a shocker back then, since there was no cut. Also, Penn knew that the ending of the film had to have a major impact. To achieve that, he'd go further in the use of blood squibs than anyone had before. Squibs are those small electric charges placed on actors that detonate on cue, releasing fake blood. At that time, squibs had been around for about a decade, but they'd always been used sparingly. For the climactic scene, both Bady and Dunaway were wired to the hilt with squibs. The scene was then shot with four different cameras running simultaneously at different speeds. The result speaks for itself. Bady Penn and crew wrapped shooting and returned to LA where the film was edited by the brilliant Dee Dee Allen. She included violent scenes that others within the studio assumed would end up on the cutting room floor due to censorship concerns. Finally, Jack Warner was brought in for screening. He told Bady up front, you know your picture's got a problem if I have to get up to pee. As it turned out, Warner got up no less than three times. When the screening was over, Warner said it wasn't his where it's a three-piss picture and the longest 130 minutes he'd ever spent. Well, the word quickly got out. The studio did not have faith in Bonnie and Clyde and wasn't going to get behind it with a really strong distribution and promotion plan. On its release in August 1967, a few critics raved among them a young Roger Ebert who just started working as a critic a few months earlier. However, it got a terrible review from perhaps the country's most influential critic, Bosley Crowther of the New York Times. Excoriating it for excessive violence, he referred to it as, quote, a cheap piece of bald-faced slapstick comedy, unquote, then doubled down on his contempt in a second piece for the Times Sunday magazine. As a result, many started predicting a quick death for Bonnie and Clyde. Initial ticket sales were soft, but then a few things happened. First, the film opened very strongly in Europe that fall. Then critic Pauline Kale came out in The New Yorker with a long and passionate defense of the film, calling it iconic and, quote, the most excitingly American American film since the Manchurian candidate, unquote. A month later, Time Magazine singled out Bonnie and Clyde and its year-end piece on the new cinema. Now, by this point Warner Brothers had been sold to seven arts. Jack Warner was retiring and new management was in place headed by Elliot Hyman. Well, Beatty met with Hyman and told him point-blank that the studio had botched the release of Bonnie and Clyde. And now, just as the film was building momentum, it was going to be replaced in theaters by an in-fear but much more expensive seven-arts release called Reflections in a Golden Eye. Well, Beatty demanded right there that Hyman rebook Bonnie and Clyde in theaters. An extremely unusual move. He even threatened to sue him. Still wondering what he could be sued for, Hyman nevertheless finally relented and rebooked the film. Well, it was a smart move as box office earnings rose dramatically. Benefiting from all the press exposure and the fact that with its anti-authority overtones, the film really captured the zeitgeist in the moment. The younger generation completely embraced it. It was hip to love Bonnie and Clyde because it was a period picture that felt utterly modern. The pleated skirt and beret worn by Faye Dunaway even became a fashion sensation, adopted by trendy young women in New York, L.A., Paris, and London. In February 1968, Bonnie and Clyde received a whopping ten Academy Award nominations including Best Picture, Actor, Actress, Director, and Screenplay. It ended up winning just two for supporting actress Estelle Parsons and cinematography. In the end, the movie would gross well over $20 million nearly ten times its budget. Miraculously, a dud had been transformed into a runaway hit largely thanks to the determination of Warren Beatty. Now he was well rewarded as he negotiated a sizable piece of the gross upfront. Of course, all the key players would go on to bigger and better things. After this, in addition to acting and producing, Beatty would start writing and directing. Over the next three decades, he received 12 Oscar nominations across these categories, winning Best Director for his 1981 film Reds. Both Dunaway and Hackman would become Oscar-winning stars, Hackman winning for the French Connection in 1972, Dunaway for network five years later. Penn earned an Oscar nomination for directing Alice's Restaurant in 1969. He'd also direct Dunaway again in 1970's Little Big Man and re-team with Hackman for 1975's Night Moves. David Newman and Robert Benton would collaborate on more movies including 1978's Superman and Benton would also start directing, winning double screenplay and directing Oscars for 1979's Kramer vs. Kramer. Bonnie and Clyde made a lot of that possible. Please join me next Tuesday for another classic, the best years of our lives from 1946, starring Frederick March, Myrna Loy and Dana Andrews directed by William Wyler. This magnificent story of three servicemen returning home after the Second World War, one of whopping seven Oscars, including Best Picture. It's truly one of my favorite films. Thanks for watching everybody and see you next week. Beautiful friendship. There are so many famous lines in movies, but it's a hell of a good script and you credit Robert Benton and David Newman, but you also credit Robert Town who at that point was like Warren Beatty's shadow. I mean they dressed alike, they talked alike. Robert Town kind of followed him around, but boy it was good that Beatty had him because he was already known even before Chinatown as being a great script doctor. And again, you know, Benton and Newman were not, this was their first script, this was their first film, which is amazing to consider. This question, what was different about the French New Wave, and I guess how does that relate to the influence that you talked a little bit about with Arthur Penn? That sort of gets back to the first question and there's this... Jocular is the wrong word, but there's this sort of free-spiritedness in this movie. It isn't heavy and just gratuitously violent. It's very clever. The word I always use, it's a fancy word, but I love it, is anarchic because things don't seem necessarily to flow together and it's very much about mood and it's kind of a free-wheeling sort of style of filmmaking. That's very much the French New Wave. If you ever go back and watch movies like Jules et Jim, which was Truffaut, it has that same thing, not everything's chronological. You get this feeling that they're sort of recreating cinema as they shoot it. They're hand-held cameras and Penn wanted to honor that and use that because, again, he did a lot of things in Bonnie and Clyde that really hadn't been done before. The example that I mentioned was shooting someone where in the same shot, the shot happens and then you see the bullet go through this guy's head in the same shot without any kind of a cut. That was an example of this sort of like anything goes is not the way to put it, but the French New Wave is all about not being restricted and how you shot something and always going for a kind of freshness and how you were telling your story and also an immediacy. You really feel that you're right there with Bonnie and Clyde. You're in the backseat of that car. You're with those people. You feel like you're getting to know them in a very intimate way that a plot-heavy, more traditional film wouldn't give you. And that I think is sort of a lot of the French New Wave. The notion that sometimes you're almost thinking, well that was realistic a minute ago, but now it's not really so realistic. I mean breathless where Jean-Luc Godard's film, which is a gangster film takeoff which has moments in it that feel real and then moments in it that feel like they're kind of a goof. So that sort of craziness and freshness is what I think Bonnie and Clyde captures that relates to that French New Wave style and feeling. Would you agree that the most prominent theme in the film is family? I haven't. That's not the word that I have used, but it's an interesting thought as I react to it. Obviously the relationship between Buck and Clyde is very much a part of this film and that's why Gene Hackman is so wonderful in the film. And obviously there's this idea that these are people who have very little. They don't have a lot going. And they obviously don't have much to lose. And what they do have in the shared crazy experiences, they develop this camaraderie and this unity that isn't necessarily all that strong. Because when stuff really goes, I mean, I think Estelle Parsons is so funny in this movie. She plays such a wacko. But there are moments when you're sad because you're seeing this wonderful sort of conviviality and this connection between this group of people who are like family because they're in it together. I mean, they're on a short route to nowhere. I mean, they may recognize in the back of their minds that they're probably not going to live very much longer, going to get caught eventually, but they're in it together. And that is I think about the word family. That's really what you feel. I mean, that wonderful scene where they're all in the car together. And they're so like tightly packed. That's sort of that's sort of what I think of that was not an easy scene to shoot either I can tell you. This one is a little bit about the new Hollywood now that the dawn of the new Hollywood is now over 50 years ago. How what can you trace back to this film as the launching pad for the quote unquote new Hollywood. Well, I mean, you know, the most the most clear cut thing is the violence. And in fact, the the the criticism that Bonnie and Clyde gets to this day is that it opened the floodgates to a lot of graphic violence and gratuitous violence. Well, Bonnie and Clyde had graphic violence. I don't believe that Bonnie and Clyde had gratuitous violence. And I think that that came later. But Bonnie and Clyde, they've never been anything quite like that before and after that film. Again, nobody was going to be paying much attention to the to the sensors or that was all sort of just falling apart. And you know, I just think two three years later you had a movie like mash, which is so graphic in terms of showing blood and you know bodies on a table and loss of blood everywhere and all this stuff. You never would have seen that in an older film so violence and the depiction of graphic violence was certainly one big thing. But I also I also think that that French New Wave factor that that sort of that tone that wasn't quite realism. And you see in Butch Cassie and the Sundance kid I keep bringing that up but I really see parallels between Bonnie and Clyde and that film that also took hold a little bit. It's a it's a beautifully written movie. And I think that for the next decade, there was this thing going on where young filmmakers who were just coming up and and screenwriters were actually allowed to make the movies that they wanted to make that had a brain. And then once Jaws came out and not to blame it all on Steven Spielberg but you know Star Wars and and the whole distribution strategy change where you know these big, big, big, big movies would open very, very big all over the country and there was a tremendous amount of emphasis put on those films. And that really hasn't changed that still that's still the model, all these years later. Amazingly enough. How old was Warren Beatty when they made this film was he already over 30. He was he was 30. He was just 30. So I guess don't trust anybody over 30 he just. Yeah, he just he made the cut. He made the cut. He was like 28. And Hackman was older Hackman was 37. So he know you wouldn't trust him. For sure. This is an interesting question about the production about production I guess production techniques. This person said it seems like the sound of the gunshots are much louder than the rest of the soundtrack. And is that it was that was that new or had that been done in other films where they amplify the gunshots and perfect. I can't say that it was new but it really was kind of I think it was. I think it was new. And then specifically wanted that again this was his attempt and a successful attempt to do stuff differently to make just the last thing he wanted was just to have another standard gangster picture. So it was his idea that the gunfire should be louder. There were stories of baby going around when it was when the film was being shown initially, and he'd go up into these projectionists booths, and they'd have adjusted the sound of the gunshots down, because they thought it was a mistake in the mixing. He said no, bring it back up. That's the whole idea you didn't fix anything you screwed it up bring it back up. So he actually had to do that. And that was that was followed by a movie two years later called the Wild Bunch, where the director Sam Peckinpaw did the exact same things that I want those guns to sound so loud, because it's your, your a, you know, it makes sense and and you want people to just be. You want people to be in your devilance you want them to be shocked by it in those days. It was still possible to shock people with gunfire the day unfortunately, it's all too familiar. You talked a little bit about Arthur Penn originally turning the script down. Um, were there any other prominent names. I mentioned a few like who was who was the one that got away for baby, but when he originally landed on Arthur Penn so I guess it worked out for the best. But were there any serious contenders before Arthur Penn. Um, well, George Stevens, who directed Shane, William Weiler, who directed the best years of our lives which by the way, I hope everybody comes back for because it is one of my favorite movies. I think he went to Carol Rice, who turned him down to foe obviously turned him down. And I cannot remember any other directors who said no. But I do think it's interesting that he went back to Arthur Penn. I actually met Arthur Penn and interviewed Arthur Penn years and years ago he was one of the nicest men and gentlest men you would ever want to meet. And then literally I can see I've also met Warren Beatty only once, but I could see how they would work well together and I think Beatty was very smart he might not admit it but he said, I can work with Arthur he you know I he gets me I get him. And he knew that Arthur could make it really good. So that's why I think he went back. I mean Beatty could have kept trying with different people. But he, I think he really wanted Penn and I think at the end of the day Penn just said, No, maybe this guy knows something I don't. And maybe it'll be great. And I think honestly though, having met him and interviewed him, Arthur Penn didn't do it just as a favor. He obviously something Beatty said, and maybe it was really, you know, honoring the French New Wave. And really making this a completely different kind of gangster film is what finally got Penn to come around. And I know that he would have had that conversation with Robert Benton and David Newman, because that was the whole premise that's why they did the script that's what they had in mind. I want to come back to the one I was just asked but another question about Benton and Newman, since you just brought them up was, obviously, they take some creative license with the actual story. Was there any significant, seriously significant departures from the story of Bonnie and Clyde that people took issue with or was it just accepted that it was a movie. And that's the story. The, the details of the different heists and who they kidnapped I mean the CW Moss character played by Michael J. Pollard was a composite as I said in my remarks of several different people that they picked up along the way. So I would put it this way I would say that, you know, the details of the you know the they weren't again that wasn't about being faithful to the string of robberies that Bonnie and Clyde actually perpetrated across Texas and representing it just as it happened. That was not at all. The priority. They wanted to be true to the period. They wanted to show that it was Texas I mean it's a true story is all a true story, although I don't think that Bonnie and Clyde was certainly top of mind with a lot of people in this film brought them a degree of renown that they never would have had otherwise. He was a banker, but he was a publisher who was a bank robber operating at the same time was much more famous and in fact himself looked down on Bonnie and Clyde he thought they were kind of stupid, you know, common criminals. because the priority was, we got to make this movie move and it's got to be entertaining. And so this detail is left out and we have only one sidekick, CW homage versus several. So I would say generous allowances and liberties were taken with the actual course of the robberies that were actually done. And again, also, it's amazing to think that, you know, Bonnie Parker was four feet, 10 inches tall. That was the real Bonnie Parker. They done it where it was five, seven. Five, seven was the height of the real Clyde Barrow. Warren Beatty was six, four. So it wasn't about really trying to get a realistic feeling of what these characters were. It really wasn't that. This is an interesting question. Concerning the violent action, can you talk a little bit about the use of slow motion, which Penn uses and the influence of that? Yeah, well, that's for impact. Again, I've just sort of, I've also, I bring up a movie called The Wild Bunch because I've been studying that movie as well and it was done the same way. You have a climatic battle scene or a scene of violence and when you edit it down, you're gonna, you wanna have different speeds covered. So you can cut to a different speed and then cut back to something else. And the slow motion is just sort of accentuating the, sort of, it's like a ballet. It's not the old movies where someone was shot and they'd grip their chest and they'd fall over and then it was like back to the dialogue. The director and the editor are making you watch this moment like it's a dance. Like it's this obscene dance and you're watching all the undulations of the bodies and the jerking and all of that. And it is a big contributor to the impact, the overall impact of that scene. And some of the people who saw the final scene in Bonnie and Clyde and saw the final scene in The Wild Bunch even two years later were shocked. I mean, right along the lines of the shower scene in Psycho, it's not what you expect. And it is particularly in a big theater, particularly when it's not what you've seen before or expect, it contributes to a tremendous amount of impact, which that final scene really did have. This is more of a comment than a question, but I guess it is a question. Is that final scene meant to evoke the Kennedy assassination in terms of the, and there's a paruter film? Never noticed that before, but I guess maybe it's possible. Well, that's an interesting question. I think the truth is that the Zapruder film and the Kennedy assassination had a big influence on allowing Bonnie and Clyde to be, and allowing Bonnie and Clyde to be shot though he was shot. When Kennedy was assassinated and we saw it, and we saw it later with the Zapruder film, we lost our innocence and the cat was out of the bag and these people said, no, you can't show that, you can't ask me this way or that way. That all started to go south. The idealism that characterized the early 60s was swept away both by that assassination and the Vietnam War and the disillusionment that came because of it. That in turn allowed Bonnie and Clyde to be because that was all about saying, hey, this is our world. The Eisenhower era is gone. We're in a bold and dangerous new place and in that environment, we're gonna show heads being blown off and we're gonna show people being butchered because it's all around us, it's on the evening news. Every night, the coverage of the Vietnam War on CBS, NBC, or ABC, I remember well, you saw a lot of blood, so that sort of opened it all up. All right, well, if that's all the questions that have been submitted, if anybody has any more, now's your chance to ask. We'll give it one more second before we say goodnight just to see if anybody has any other questions. We should remind everybody one more time that best years of our lives is this coming Tuesday, the 23rd, we're not taking it. Usually there's a week in between but we've changed the schedule a little bit so best years of our lives is coming up on Tuesday, 23rd, and everybody can sign up for that on our website. Please, Dan, let me jump in on that. Folks, if you haven't seen that movie in a while or if you've never seen that movie, please make the effort to do so and join us because it's really a personal favorite of mine and anyone who is interested in the Second World War from an historical standpoint needs to see this film because it really is about servicemen returning from the Second World War and it was shot as that was happening. So it's tremendously powerful. It is a longer film, it's two hours and 50 minutes, so 10 minutes short of three hours. So it's not a short film, but find a way to watch it and I don't think at the end credits you will fault me for having suggested it and I really hope that we see you all next Tuesday because it really is a wonderful movie. We do have one more question, John, this is a good one. Okay. All right, so what do you think, this is from Martin who's asked, what do you think is the best anti-hero movie of the period? That's a toughie, there were so many of them. Well, I have to be honest with you and this is, I happen to be, I've always been madly in love with Butch Cassie and the Sundance Kid. It is a movie that is, it's so unexpected in so many different ways. It's a buddy movie and when you say anti-hero, it's sort of like I define that very simply as these guys are crooks but you still love them so that they become heroes. And I remember seeing that movie in a theater as a young guy and being completely hypnotized by it, by both of them and it is such a good buddy picture. And so that's one of them. I do think much earlier, Breathless is a wonderful anti-hero film and I love Jean-Paul Belmondo and that. But I have to say that for me, and this is where I'm getting into subjective territory because there are people I've met who don't love Butch Cassie the way I do. But if you're asking me my favorite anti-hero, I think it's probably Butch and Sundance. And if I've misunderstood the question, let me know. I think that's how it was intended, that's how it works. I'm happy to have any kind of a debate or an exchange online too. People have other ideas. There were many of them. Anti-hero movies became, and in fact, The Wild Butch is another example because you watch that movie and the William Holden character is tremendously sympathetic and amazingly poignant, but he's a killer. He's a stone killer. So there were a lot of great anti-hero films at that particular time. And I encourage everybody to go and watch them again. Anti-hero is not what best years of our lives are. Those are all heroes. Those are real heroes. And that's fine too. So I hope we can, next Tuesday, we can just talk about heroes, but anti-heroes have their place too. All right, well, thanks John, as always. Thank you everybody for joining us. We hope you have enjoyed this. This has been great. Certainly I think now everybody should go out unless you're gonna do The Wild Butch at some point, John. I think everybody should probably see that one. Well, we talked about it. We talked about it quite a bit, which is a great one. And maybe we'll do that one when we're back and reopen in the theater at some point. So thanks again. Have a good night everybody. We hope to see you next week for best years of our lives. Thanks everyone. Take care. Have a good night.