 I'll make a motion to approve minutes. Second. All in favor. Yes. Any opposed. Awesome. Thank you. I'm sorry for all of that confusion. Okay. And then we've got a pretty full agenda. So talking about the committee on committees. So we're going to talk about this. Like goal and agenda. Siphoned discussion, including reviewing kind of a form to send out to the committees before we do the outreach. At the committee and committees meetings for the pilot proposal, conversation. And then also just wanting to talk about. In other business. The open here comes more in. I've also wanted to talk about the. I think that's where you were like, Michael is like, I have, I, I have thoughts. I have ideas on this. So I guess if you're wondering, we can move the agenda around to have this stipend and the form conversation go first to kind of inform the committee and committees and inform. The conversation on the. I'm. Consultant. There we go. Okay. Hi. Welcome. Um, so I just shared out a form that I made. Kind of incorporate. I'm glad I don't look over the notes, but glad it incorporates some of the things from the notes. don't get in to the committee. And so the only kind of ways that I incorporated that was like, have you applied to be on this committee before and not been accepted or not heard back? So having that. And then a couple of other things is I know for creative discourse, they just I just use kind of the categories that they use for the most part. So we can kind of hold them side by side. So one thing that I remember talking about creative discourse is they use education as the like marker for like socioeconomic class. And that we have there was like issues with that and thinking that about how housing is such a huge, you know, one of the number one issues. So then kind of incorporating a couple of additional questions around and English language. So a couple of additional questions around that was like have the with the highest degree or level of education completed. Do you regularly speak a language besides English at home? So trying to get to not just like is English your second language like not just the ESL kind of stuff, but all like having it be more comprehensive than that. And then kind of like what is your housing like situation? I don't know how to label that. What type of housing do you live in? And what are your current family responsibilities, ability and internet access and transportation? Trying to figure out like kind of putting those in kind of the middle to be like these are something like the needs that were identified in the equity audit that we want to make sure that these stipends are like diversifying not just like the gender identity and the like sexual orientation. And if people have master's degrees or not in the committees, but like we identified these kind of being key issue areas that we wanted to kind of dig into. So that but that thing said, I don't know if I like phrase these questions appropriately, because I'm not going to consult it. So, you know, like, what is your, you know, like, does it make sense to like ask if you have, you know, children, parents or other dependents who like live at home or live at home at least part of the time, or do not live at home, you know, like, and the multiple checkboxes and things like that. So I was thinking maybe we could have like a general conversation about this like kind of big picture, and then like put it out for wordsmithing more before the next meeting, but not more of just like, do we need to like ask other people about these buckets or things like that. So let me stop talking there. And I also just realized I left my coffee down there, so I'm going to be right back, but I'm ahead from things like in here, but priorities, you know. Can we do you all, I don't, where did Shayna share these questions? That's just a minute to the email she sent out yesterday. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. I'm having trouble downloading it to anything, but I don't think you can. I don't think you can. Yeah. Thank you to open it as a form online. So then how do we save it? I don't think you can. And I think, yeah, I maybe should have done this as a document of here all the questions and then plug them into the form. But I didn't think about that. I think you can copy and paste. I don't know how. When you do all the formatting, I tried that. Oh, it didn't. Okay. Yeah, it just comes out as a single list of words. I can do it as a, and then this is the spreadsheet on the back end. And actually, I can download this. So it just has the question kind of listed up top. Well, didn't Creative Discourse say that they would be open to like advisory roles? Insulting. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Right. If we want to send this to them and get feedback. The only concern I have about it, I think it's very good because it asks all the right questions and it gives just about every possible answer as an option. But as a result, it becomes a very long questionnaire. And people don't like to spend a lot of time, generally, in my experience, filling out questionnaires. And so that, you know, it's sort of a tradeoff. You get less information, but more response. If you start shortening these and compressing some of the possible answers. And I guess one of the big questions is why are we asking all of these questions? I mean, in what purposes does it serve in terms of distributing funds for these stipends? I think it's mainly we want to show growth, right? So we want to see kind of what is our baseline so that in a year, when we're saying, okay, here's how the stipends have worked. What is the change been? It's not necessarily about where we are now, but it's about how the stipends will impact that. Right. Because, you know, if we don't establish sort of what the, what it looks like now, what the makeup of all of our committees look like now, we won't be able to prove that we did anything useful. I also wonder at this committee on committees, if we can try to establish it as a norm, not like in a meeting in the next, you know, three months before July, that in the meeting, the committees will do it. And so like maybe that will be making it easier for it to be a little bit longer of a survey if people are filling it out in the meeting and not like sending it by email and being like, do it at home. And then because I didn't put any language at the top too, I think it does need some like context, but then also people can talk about the stipends and be like, if you know of other people that want, like, please reach out. We need to make sure we have X type of representation in our committee or things like that. So yeah, I think it's a good idea to make it part of the agenda for each committee. If there's a way to just formatting wise, like, can you make columns for some of them? Like, I just feel like, to Michael's point of like, it's not actually that many questions and it should be pretty easy because it's like, it's stuff you know, it's not like, oh, I have to think of some like essay question. It's like, yes, no, you know, like, this is where I live. Like, so it shouldn't be most of the questions shouldn't take people very long. But I think yes, sometimes people just open something. It's like, this takes me a long time to scroll. I'm done. But so maybe if there's like some formatting things that actually could just make it look shorter. Yeah. The only other just the way that disability question, I wonder if instead of saying like, ADA qualified, just because somebody might have one and like not know if they're qualified or not, like, so I would maybe just take that language out and just use the definition and just say, I have a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits. Or like, I have a disability comma a physical or mental impairment and then I do not have a disability that people could just, you know, even if somebody it's not like ADA qualified, but they feel like they have some something that, you know, is an impairment in their life, then they should be able to acknowledge that. Right. Disability is also not like a bad word, right? Yeah. I think that's great though, Shayna. Thank you for the work. Yeah, it's a lot. Thank you. I, yeah, I feel like the ability, like family responsibility, ability and and transportation question and internet access, like the questions that I added are the ones, obviously, that I feel the least good about. But feel like are important questions to ask for like participation in committee. So okay. So I think we'll continue like working off of this and then we'll send it to Sue for review, right? Do you mind if I become a nitpicky editor? Well, maybe wait until after I send it to Sue for review, if they have like bigger picture reflections to, does that make sense? Like if they're like, oh, you should ask these three other questions or, and then I can send it to you or if you can review it twice, whatever works. Yeah. What were your nitpicky questions? I'm so sorry. Go ahead. So they're just in the current family responsibilities. So I have children, elderly parents or other, it depends who I care, it should be whom I care for. Okay. The second one. Yep, got it. And then that the two following it, the same, the same quite. I think I saw some other, I'll go through it again. And if there are any things like other little things like that, I'll send them to you. But those are the ones that I saw right away, but great. I wonder in the outreach to creative discourse, like, I mean, to me, like this seems like it gets out a lot, but I don't have clarity on like, what questions are we going to ask that we're assessing a year from now to see if the program was a success? Like, does this cover all of that? And that seems something that creative discourse who, you know, this was just part of their suite of recommendation. So I assume they have some like thoughts on like, what, what metrics could we use? And so does this capture all of those? Are we asking all the right questions to be able to assess progress, which it generally feels like good to me, but like that they might have some other thoughts. Great. And then I wonder, and that's what they may be like, ask these three other questions, don't ask those two questions. Great. Yep. Yeah, or like, is the way we're asking it going to get the information that we're going to be able to make that assessment on the program later? Right. And this is where I'm like, for like the accessibility question, I'm like, I worry that that's not the question. Like, do you have a disability? It's not like, do you have a disability that like makes it harder for you to participate in, you know, like it's like, so that's probably using the ADA language. But like, is that, yeah, so as like one example, so yeah, right. Let's ask them. Great. Depending on where certain committees meet or something, like, I assume none meet like at the rec center, but like, it's not ADA accessible. So somebody just, you wouldn't be able to. They can't meet at the rec center, because it's not ADA accessible. Yeah, whatever. But yeah, there might be some other way as well. So I was, I was curious about how the TW Wood Board got on this list. It's not a point there. They're not appointed by the city council. I know the mayor is on it, or the or a designee of the mayor. So I think that's just part of our list of like annual appointments we do because someone from city council is on it. But yeah, it's not our board to control. We just have a seat on it. Okay. But not, but the library has, doesn't the Kellogg Hubbard Library have a committee member, a city council member anymore? It did for a while. Thanks. So that hasn't been on our list that I remember. No, so I don't know. Do you want the ones? Shane, is this off the list that I sent you the other day? Okay. Yeah. And obviously it was the list that Jeremy used. I could have used that. I just wasn't thinking. So great. Um, I think, I think some of these might be interesting. So like city councils elected, right? So stipends aren't going to do anything there. So that one could, oh, right. So take them off. Yep. Let's see who else is the building code appeals. I know counselors are on that. Is there public members of that? Um, no, that one can come off too. Building code of appeals above the public safety authority is also elected public safety authority. Let's see what else. I don't think that's on here. Central Vermont. So it's at the top. Oh, thank you. Public safety authority. Yep. Let's see. The investment committee. That's for, um, the CIT investment committee that can come off. Sorry, if I, if I had understood what the, the, what you were using it for, I would have edited. Sorry. I could have applied some critical thinking skills before just copying, pasting it too. So yeah, take up a TW Woodmore event too. Oh, sorry. Sorry. Is the Montpelier foundation a city committee or is that a whole separate, wholly separate? That's a whole separate thing. Otherwise this looks fine to me. The public restroom committee has yet to meet. Um, and then we have a new one that's being established about our wastewater. Why can't I think of the words? The stormwater utility committee. Thank you. Stormwater utility, not wastewater. Oh boy. I see another committee in my future. I'm so excited about that. We need you. I want you to be on that very bad. Um, so I'm mostly thinking about it myself. What is it called? Wastewater utility, stormwater utility committee. Yeah, I keep saying wastewater. It's not, it's stormwater. It's about impervious surfaces and taxes. Great. I'm less excited about the wastewater facility, but anyway. Okay. Um, I'm recognizing it is a 30. This is very silly how long that took, but thank you guys so much for diving in. So then we're releasing this to then talking about, like, so we'll use this to talk about it in the committee on committees meeting in April. But we wanted to talk more about like the goals of that meeting as well. So, um, the goal of them, like the draft agenda to be able to, we've like got a hell of people's calendars, but now it's like, why? Um, so one of the things is to roll out the stipends. So, right? So like rolling out the pre stipends survey, talking to people about why it's important to have the stipends and then like make the pitch for how to get more, get people, get people the stipends as needed. Um, and so maybe we should start by talking about how to roll out the stipends. So let's, sorry, I didn't think this through first meeting of the day. Um, so for having for the stipend roll out, I know we talked about this like briefly and then kind of tell it last meeting. But like, um, Michael, Lauren, did you guys have any thoughts on how like the, because we kind of left it open, we said like we have a set amount of money, and then we can figure out from there and we're going to talk more to, um, Essex about how their rollout is going, um, in a few months, but like any other ideas of if we should prioritize some committees or if we should have it open to any, anyone, and then once we get that set amount of money, like it's capped. And so once we reach it, we're done. Um, if, yeah, there's other potential solutions. I believe Parks is elected, Michael, separately. Yes, they're elected. Okay. I mean, I'm sorry, go ahead. But, uh, but even so, I mean, um, people make a choice about whether or not to put, you know, to stand for, you know, an elect, an elected, um, and a cemetery commission is the same thing, right? They're elected, but, um, do we want to, do we want to get everybody, get all the people who are possible? Um, I'm sorry to take back a step, but. No, I think, right. The goal of the survey is to see how the stipends work. So I think the question is, do we want to offer the stipends to these elected positions? Well, I mean, other, um, other people who are elected get stipends, right? City Council, uh, uh, school, school board. So it's not as if it's, um, unheard of. But I mean, there's a question about what's the, is the barrier to either running for election or be, or requesting for appointment important here? Or is the idea that we want to get a, we want to get more people involved from all sorts of, you know, all sorts of people involved in both elected and appointed? I think for, uh, I think that in the beginning, my advice would be the narrower the scope, the better. Okay. I think it would be, I think election, um, or running for office is such a, um, it's a harder nut to crack, I think. Um, there's a lot more factors that go into why someone is or is not going to run for office that I think my, my suggestion for y'all would be stick with appointed positions right now. And then if we find success, then we could maybe talk about some of the other systemic barriers that exist with electing folks and then talk about how, because that's a, that's a huge effort. I think that also involves the community quite a bit. And, um, that would be my suggestion for y'all is to keep your, your initial limit smaller and narrower. That's fine. It's a long list anyway. And that's okay. I just wanted to know what our criteria were here. I mean, y'all can disagree with me for sure. That's just my suggestion. No, I think it's a fine, I think it's a good answer to, to a question, to the question. Yeah, I'm okay with that. In terms of your question, Shayna about rollout, um, I mean, partly I think my answer might like, I'd want to be informed by how much uptake, for example, has Essex had in like our, it seemed like we thought there went, we wouldn't necessarily like run out, even if we offered it to every committee. But so part of me is like, well, let's just go broad. Definitely counsel seemed to, there was a general thrust of like, start with the ones that like must exist. And there's like a lot of recreate committees like all the time. And so there was like, there wasn't like half to exist. We should prioritize and make sure that they're part of it first and foremost. But then some of the like non mandated ones or whatever are somewhere, I think we would probably most want to be getting like, I mean, we want it for all of them. But like, you know, if we're not making it easy for people who have experienced homelessness to be on the homelessness task force, then we're not doing a great job. Yeah. So maybe it's like concerted outreach. Sorry. I was very unhelpful, but sorry. Yes, it was. No, but it's like, do we then like just do like more concerted like one on one outreach to those committees to talk, you know, like go to their committees rather than just having like just relying on the committee and committees, essentially. And because we're still having it be open for everyone. All right. Okay. One question I have to try to and maybe this is part of the meeting with all the committees is like, how do you do outreach? And like, I mean, different committees might, you know, how are they like seeking people? Is it a lot of like friends just talking to friends and invite, you know, like, or how what, you know, and some of them might have good ideas like, oh, we actually post over here for like, we, whatever, we might realize nobody really does much beyond like what the city does for advertising. And some of them we might want more focused outreach. So kind of as part of the site, like on that study, the committee and committee is how to be like delivering information about the stipend process and getting feedback on it. And then also having more like a discussion on how to do that outreach most effectively and have people share what they've used that's been effective at getting new like members of their committees, that's besides just the general like what the city does and word of mouth, right? Or like if they've done like conservative outreach to certain communities based on their committee, just having people having to be a little bit more of a discussion. So like the goal of the meeting would be, you know, share about the stipend and share best practices about how to do that outreach in the city. I think that would be great. And like, I mean, I'm also thinking, I wonder if probably a lot of them have like, talked to various people through the years, like, what are the reasons people are giving for not being able or willing or interested in serving? Like, and are we actually getting at those barriers? Like are we like, there might be some interesting shared feedback that we could get from people who are not in the room based on conversations. I was wondering, just getting on your hands and knees and begging count. Oh my god. You're amazing. Okay. And so then do we want like, what else do we want to do in the in the committee and committees to like, I know we all lose like, also it's important to like have space for people to share and get to see the other committees and what they're working on. And so, yeah, I think I was kind of like, I've been part of these things where people just like, prepare like one slide and they shared it, everyone about what their goals are and what they're working on. But does that, is that like asking too much or, you know, like, is there do you have other goals of what we want as outcomes of this, you know, kind of by annual meeting? And then are there easier ways to accomplish this goals than having people prepare a two minute presentation and running through them all. So would you be looking for feedback on like, do y'all want, by April, do y'all want to have sort of like your rollout plan outlined? Is that the goal? Or is it, are you looking for feedback from folks in this about how they would like to see it roll out? I think we should come up with a proposal and then be like, what a folks thing, you know, and then to get maybe get feedback on the proposal, but to have as much of it nailed out as possible. And then hopefully people will be like, look, amazing, you should tweak it this way, but not like starting to stretch. Yeah, okay, okay. So I'm assuming that should be sort of like your next few meetings is just really talking about the proposal rollout. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we should get that we should meet with Essex, I feel like, or you talk to people on Essex, Cameron. So yeah, just just kind of through through you talk. See if she can join us on the 23rd. I'll ask. Amazing. I'm just wondering, it's only two months in, but like, we can kind of get the overview of what they will at least have a, here's what we, what's the word policy intended to do? Right? Yeah. Cool. I mean, I know they're having some issues, but you know, what she said to me about it is really just like the system does not exist. The way that like we've set up our systems don't really exist to allow this to happen, right? We've taught, we've flagged the issues that we already know are going to come up like filling out i9s and that kind of stuff. Like people are going to have to fill out, there's just like a whole host of bureaucratics nonsense that go along with things like this. So that was the what she expressed to me last time. So yeah, just like hearing more about that. Yeah. Even if there's not solutions for it, but yeah. Cool. I want to be mindful of time, but let me just pause and so I want to make sure we can talk more about like next steps with creative discourse or other things, but just one more pause of like other goals that we want to accomplish in this committee and committees. Sharing about what's happening and rolling out the site doesn't seem great to me. I like your idea about outreach though. It's the best practice of outreach. Yeah. Thank you. One question. I'm sure we'll discuss this part of our plan, but I would assume that this particular audience in April would be very interested in is like how do people who are already on, like it seems easy, like when people are applying that it's now made available and you could know that you could take advantage of it. But like for everyone who's currently serving, like what's process or best practice or like, you know, everyone who did it right now thought they could do it without getting a stipend. It might really appreciate a stipend. Like so anyway, I just be like figuring out how we talk about that to that group is going to be important. Just to put on our list of things. And putting the language at the top of the survey and having like talking points for people to bring it back to their committees. Yeah, all of that is going to be important. Cool. Next steps for creative discourse slash other committees, other consultants. So where I think stand is that we have, you know, $10,000 to be working on the next phase of, you know, the rollout of our plan for this year. Because of the pandemic and many other reasons are kind of initial timeline has been totally thrown out the window. We completed phase one, you know, really phase two was according to kind of what creative discourse signed out was going to be a big in person event, which we were hoping to maybe do this summer. But obviously, here we are with Omicron and every end Omicron beta or whatever it's called. And like, we're just feeling I like that. I know there's a lot of concerns with hosting a big, you know, in depth gathering with a lot of people in Montpelier. The next phase after that was going to go into focus groups of bringing together people from different identity backgrounds together to be digging in on different pieces. Adding a complicated factors to all this too is that creative discourse said that they're withdrawing their kind of commitment to do the work kind of over this summer because of they just have like a lot of other like ongoing commitments. And so they're not going to kind of go move forward with a full time, you know, like working on this project with us. So Michael, I like know, just to put you on the spot, you had like a lot of concern about like what the proposed next phase of this kind of campaign would be, which is a big in-person event. Do you think of like, so I think there's kind of two different things of like, what are our next steps? And then what do we want to do about the consult? Like, do we want to put it out for an RFP for other consultants? Do we want to just do the like, like coaching and mentoring and do more of the work ourselves and roll over the funds for doing more next year when, you know, knock on wood, do the things will be safer. I feel like I am not wedded to any outcome here and so I would love to hear what all of you think. Well, I was one of the concerns that I had was that trying to get together a big group of people, before we have any really substantive report to make, that, you know, we have to give time, we have to build into whatever schedule we're going to have, time for moving this massive machine of city government, you know, around. It's, you know, the old metaphor of trying to turn a big ship. And I think, you know, within the small amount of time that we had put out for this, there wouldn't really be much in the way of being able to report a lot of change or a lot of efforts. So until we have, you know, until we have some thing else to add to the list of suggestions, I think it's important to hold back on a big, a big kind of event of any kind. And also, I've been to enough big meetings where, you know, you have, let's brainstorm about this and come up with big lists of things that, you know, just can't be done or, you know, or things you don't want to do. And you've spent a lot of time getting people to, to devote to this. And what what you have in hand is a question I have. So I'm not a big fan of, you know, mass meetings. But in an all day meeting, the number of people who stayed at the very end is quite, quite significantly smaller than the people who started out with cookies and donuts and coffee at the beginning. guilty in there. Yep. We all are, you know, just so much time that you can put your energy into this something like this. And quite frankly, you're asking people, especially if we're concerned about getting a larger scope of the population of all, you're asking people who are already challenged with, you know, work life and family to, to give a whole day to an event like this. On a weekday, that means not going to work on the weekend. It means taking time away from your family who we haven't seen because you've been to work. That kind of I know it's supposed to be a public event. But after listening to Michael, can we just do it like invitation based? And if other people want to come, they can come like key people who can make change and who can have impact. Oh, like moving things, you know, just just the brainstorming, just then, you know, I'm thinking out loud. I think it's kind of like good, right? Like moving to like the phase three, which is like doing the like more like bringing people together from all these different different plate, like walks of life in Montpelier kind of doing that more like invitation and kind of bringing folks together to have these like concerted smaller group conversations. And I think like the big group was more being like, it's like see who is interested in being a part of this and not having it be kind of invitation only, but and so like having it be more democratic in that way. But right, I'm just like the realities of where we're at, does it make sense just to skip right to these like smaller groups? Yeah. And like we can maybe spend some time this summer doing the like who should be in those smaller groups and then have creative like ask creative discourse to come back on in the fall to do the skip right to phase three kind of thing, like skip over phase two entirely of the big group. Is that makes sense? Are you thinking of having a big group as invitation only to like big group, small group? It's like all the same words. No, I was talking what Michael said. So if it is a concern, sorry, sorry about my voice for people to come and spend all that time, if it's not good for them, maybe we can invite people who can really, really interested not only, oh, let me go and just listen. And I will figure out if I'm interested. But yeah, I want to do something. And it's a great opportunity for me, maybe for other people, we can make it like a, I don't know, live virtual events. They don't have to come. They can just watch in their home if it is their case, right? I cannot let leave my family. I cannot leave my, you know, kids. No. Yeah. Just an idea. So I feel like I'm not hearing any like strong opinions or proposals of like what we have to do for the next step. I guess my, to go back to the first thing I said, I think we need to find a time far enough out so that we have something to report as a, you know, for results. Where are we now? What's happened since the, since the Creative Discord made its presentation? And then once we have a list of things that we had that have been done, or that are in the process of being done, changes that are being, you know, being made in policy, or, you know, that may not be so visible, but to reassure, you know, our public, this is not set, just, you know, another thing that got shelled as soon as it was, it was as offered. And I'm not sure what kind of timetable we need for that. And Cameron may be more helpful on this than any of us trying to guess when things might happen. But, and we can also use the opportunity of the Committee on Committees just to get some feedback from them about what they see coming out of the report that was already delivered and what are they planning or have already, they have already done to try to respond to that report. And I think we need a time of information gathering, and then we can figure out how we, how we, you know, get that. Is it another report to the City, to the Council? Is it another report that is made available widely to the general public? You know, we can also, and I, well, we also need to think about how difficult it was for creative discourse to identify and get people to talk, people who feel marginalized already. And they didn't really want to be out in the public talking about this. So those are, we don't even know who they are. And, and creative discourse is not about to tell us. So we're sort of stuck if we can't, if we can't reach some of those people who already feel on the margins, how are we going to get them to come out for, for an event like this? So I think what I'm hearing from the proposal, I want to say from what you're saying, Michael, is like a July 4, 2023 would be a year of the stipend. It'd be kind of like a year of implementation, or, you know, a year and a half of implementation of the plan. And, and so kind of a release of what's been done to date, and then like, and see if creative discourse can commit to coming back then, or like for the lead up for that, probably, you know, three months before or whatnot, to plan kind of a report back and just like start having a discussion of next steps, like around then, does that make sense? Kind of having, having the phase two big group meeting, summer 2023, and then just like kind of pushing everything, pushing things back to having to that date. Is that, am I catching it? Yeah, I think that's, that's a good way to do it. I like that idea. I mean, thinking of like Helen's idea, I wonder in the meantime, like it does seem like spending the next year like really implementing and trying to just like take what we learned so far and put into place. And like, I wonder if like the focus groups like Helen was suggesting, like, I mean, I'm thinking like, okay, if we do, for example, pass this bond around this like piece of land where there's opportunity for housing and recreation and other things, like are there like focused outreach projects or things that are happening in the community where like we could play a role in who are we talking to? How are we getting input? How are we shaping a vision in the community? Like some really tangible things that people can like, wrap their heads around, like I could have an impact and like shaping what our city is doing that's less like vague than like equity and justice and come to an all day retreat. And like, and then if we can show like here's the kind of work we're doing like to Michael's point in a year and a few months or something. I don't know, just like having more discrete projects for people to like tap into and focusing that way. Yeah, instead of calling small group, we can call them impact group groups gathering or like that. Yeah. So we can choose, you know, very specific groups or people, they can really contribute and take action and create some results. Love it. Okay, so I think what I'm hearing is we're dismantling urgency and not feeling like we have to move forward with anything right now. When I circle back to Sue can kind of just with with this thing can kind of lay out this updated timeline for engaging with consultants again. But that in the meantime, as they like working more on a reactive basis as things come up to be engaged to as a committee to support the creation of like impact committees. I like that of like, yeah, and to be able to to support the kind of the engagement that we want to see happening, right? Just kind of like doing doing that. So for example, in the bond vote, but there's probably other things too that we should think more about. Um, I feel excited about that. Is that Cameron? Does that make some like logistically for this? Okay, for the city and stuff? Okay. Great. Call it a call it a decision made for the moment. Yeah, enough for the moment. Decision made and then implementing it will be work. Go ahead, Lauren. Sorry. I mean, one idea is part of the committee on committees is like talking about we want to create impact teams or whatever great phrase you had, and like, do you have do you have things coming up where you could see a value of us doing work to bring that diversity of perspectives, whether it's like the master plan process or like whatever other people might have. So people could like make a pitch to us of like, how could we help make things that are going to be going on in the city like more inclusive? Cool. Awesome. Okay. So our next meeting agenda, we're going to hopefully have someone from Essex come on the 23rd to share about their process and to make like make plans. I think we'll really just focus on that and like make plans on what the site that rollout would be. I think that's that's that's the agenda for next time. Let's not try to put more on it. Great. Do we have a date for the committee on committees? April 11th at 530. Okay. Before we go, does anyone know anyone who speaks Pashto? Okay. If if you could keep your eyes and mind peeled for translation services that have that language offered, I am I'm running into issues getting things translated for Michael's because they have a they have a Michael's college. They have a second language degree there. I think they have a program where they teach people how to teach people English. Awesome. Thank you. And also there's like a dearth of like with the African like this is a real this is a current statewide issue, right? Is that there's just like not enough people in general? Yeah. And you also might contact the central one adult basic education. The I think I mentioned, we go back into the minutes. I think I gave her a name there. I'll see if I can find her and again, she was interested in in the idea that we wanted to reach out to, you know, people with whose first language is not English. But I'll see if I can treat her name. Thank you. I will follow those leads. I gotta hop to my next but thank you guys. All right, everyone have a good day. Thank you. Bye. Yeah.