 Thank you, Mrs. Ridgeborn. He'll be back in a while. You're welcome. I hope he doesn't keep me waiting too long. No, I don't think he will. Good day, ma'am. Is this Dr. Cleveland's office? Yes, it is. May I help you? Yes, ma'am. We need to speak to Dr. Cleveland. Is he in? Oh, I'm sorry. He's been called away to the hospital on an emergency. I'm Louise Tanner, his office manager. Can I help you with something? Well, ma'am, we're investigating a case of health care fraud, and we really do need to speak to the doctor. Wait a minute. Is Dr. Cleveland in some kind of trouble? Are you guys police officers? Well, not exactly. We're from the IG's office. IG? What's that? I'm sorry. From the Office of the Inspector General. And no, Dr. Cleveland is not in any kind of trouble as far as we know, but we do need to speak to him anyway. Health care fraud? Did you say health care fraud? No way. I do all the paperwork around here, and there's no health care fraud here. Ma'am, will you please just calm down for a minute? Now, we need to talk to the doctor because he may have information that is crucial to our investigation. Let me tell you, Dr. Cleveland would never have anything to do with fraud. He's a good man, officer. I've been with him for 14 years, and I can tell you he's no criminal. No, ma'am. No one is accusing him of anything. However, we do have evidence of a connection between a DME and this office, and we're here to find out more about that. Well, he's at the hospital. I told you. He's in the middle of surgery, and I don't know when he'll be back. Yes, ma'am. Well, we can wait. But as long as we're here, maybe we could have a look at some of your records. Specifically, we need to review copies of the CMNs that Dr. Cleveland has completed that you keep us busy until he returns. I don't have the authority to let you do that. So unless you have a warrant or something, your best bet is to come back tomorrow morning. Our doors are open at eight. Yes, ma'am. Sorry to have troubled you. Please tell Dr. Cleveland we will be back tomorrow morning. Not a very productive interview, was it? Our officers didn't get the information they were looking for in their investigation, and in the process may have damaged the physician's reputation and practice. Tell Dr. Cleveland, I'm sorry, but that kind of trouble is just too scary for you. No, no, no, no, no, Miss Rage of War, I can assure you this is all a mistake. No, Miss Tanner, I'll just have my new doctor call for my records. That was 30 minutes wasted. And so they're leaving empty-handed, which is unfortunate, because more likely than not have they conducted their interview properly, utilizing the five general stages of an effective law enforcement interview, it may have turned out to be much more productive. In this program, we will review those five general stages and discuss how they can be administered in the context of an effective law enforcement interview. The five general stages of an effective law enforcement interview are the introduction, rapport, the questioning phase, the summary, and the close. Let's take a look at each one of these stages individually. Thank you, Mrs. Rage-Born. We'll be back in a while. Welcome. I hope he doesn't keep me waiting too long. No, I don't. Good day, ma'am. Is this Dr. Cleveland's office? Yes, it is. May I help you? Yes, ma'am. We're from the Health and Human Services Office of the Inspector General. I'm Special Agent Lisa Bowman, and this is Special Agent Don Grady. Hi. Oh, my. Is there something wrong? Oh, no, ma'am. Nothing to worry about. Is Dr. Cleveland in? No, I'm sorry. He's been called away to the hospital on an emergency. My name is Louise Tanner. I'm his office manager. Maybe I can help. Are you sure there's nothing wrong? Yes, ma'am. Everything is fine. We just need to see if Dr. Cleveland can help us with some information regarding an investigation we're working on. In the introduction stage, you should show proper credentials and identify yourself and your partner if you have one. Also, find out who you're talking to. You should state the reason for the interview, whether it's the actual purpose or a cover story you're using at the time. Stay with the truth when you can. Oh, well, like I said, he's at the hospital, but maybe I can help. Well, yes, ma'am. Perhaps you can. We'd appreciate that. Is that your son? Yes, it is. That's my David. He looks like a natural with that soccer ball. Does he play in the summer league out at the park? Yes, he does. He's first string forward on the barons. I have a daughter who plays for the Cardinals. She's only been playing for a year now, but oh, she loves it. Do you go to the games? Every one of them. I even try to make the practices. I mean, David really is something special on the field. Well, you know, I'm surprised we haven't run into each other out there. I'll have to look you up next time. Establishing rapport is your next task. This can be accomplished in many ways, depending on the interviewee and the circumstances. Being friendly is the best policy. Talk about everyday topics, perhaps something of apparent interest to your subject. Ensure he or she is relaxed before moving on to the questioning stage. Miss Tanner, I was wondering if you could help us out with something. We have information that indicates that Dr. Cleveland has completed several certificates of medical necessity for his patients, and that many of these CMS were subsequently filled by a durable medical equipment company called Medico. Do you know anything about that? Yeah, sure. We deal with them. They're a Medicare-approved DME. Why? Have we done something wrong? Oh, no, ma'am. I'm sure you haven't. But we need to find out as much as we can about the quality of the products that Medico has provided to Dr. Cleveland's patients. Has the doctor ever received any complaints regarding the wheelchairs or other medical equipment this company has provided? No, not that I'm aware of. I handle all the doctors' day-to-day operations, so he would have told me if there was a problem. Dr. Cleveland is very particular about making sure his patients receive what they need, and I'm sure if there was any problem with Medico's product, he would have stopped doing business with him and would have called Medicare immediately. What is it that Medico has done? The doctor isn't in any kind of trouble, is he? No, ma'am. Nobody is in any trouble here. This could have happened without you and the doctor even knowing about it. Now, when was the last time a medical representative came by here? Two or three weeks ago. Did you notice anything out of the ordinary? Out of the ordinary. No, I see so many company reps. I can't remember anything in particular. That's okay. Don't worry about it. You did say that you handle all the day-to-day operations, though, right? Yes, I do. Could that also include CMMs? Yes, it does. In fact, I keep copies of them in Dr. Cleveland's office. Do you want to take a look at them? Oh, yes, ma'am. That would be very helpful. You know, now that I think of it, that name, Medical, has come up quite a bit recently. You know what I can do if you want? I can get the company reps name and number and then pull copies of our CMMs that Medical has filled. Anything you can do for us, Miss Tanner, we would really appreciate it. Well, look, why don't you just come around here and we can look at the files together? Terrific. The next stage of your interview is the questioning stage. Begin with general questions and then narrow in on the specific answers you're looking for. Remember, in most cases, you are asking for information. So keep your conversation friendly if possible and be careful to maintain rapport with your subject. If you should find yourself losing rapport, work to re-establish it. A friendly interview will almost always yield more information. Well, thanks for your help, Miss Tanner. The information you gave us will really help with our investigation. No trouble at all. Are you sure that's all you need? Yes, for now. We'll be back Monday to see if Dr. Cleveland has anything else he can add, but you've given us enough information to keep us busy until then. Miss Tanner, I'd just like to review what we've covered today. Now, you say that Dr. Cleveland has been dealing with the Charles Fredrickson of Medico DME for approximately 18 months? Yes, that's correct. And that Medico's main office is located at 402 Water Street in Miami, Florida? Yes. Now, let's see. The doctor has completed 32 CMMs in the past six months and in that time 19 patients have dealt with Medico. And of that number, now according to these records, five of them had complaints about the equipment. Now, there may be more that the doctor is dealing with now that are not in these records. You'll have to ask him about those. The fourth stage of your interview is the summary. It's a good idea to go over all the information you've gained with your subject. This will not only ensure you have all your facts right, but will also give your subject a chance to add new information or clarify something he or she may have already stated. Well, I think we have everything we need. Mm-hmm. Thank you, Ms. Tanner. This is really going to help. Yes, thank you. We're done for now, but take my card and if you think of anything between now and Monday, just give me a call. I'll be glad to hear from you. Sure, I'll do that. And look, as far as Monday goes, our doors are open at eight, but Dr. Cleveland is always here by seven. So if you're up and about that early, you'll be sure to catch him then. Thank you, Ms. Tanner, and thanks again for your help. You've really made our job easier on this one. Sure, no problem. The final stage of the interview is the close. Keep it friendly and leave the door open for further interviews. Make sure you leave your business card and telephone number and discuss how and when you can contact them if the need arises. As you can see, this time, our agents had a much more successful interview. They obtained the information they needed, kept the door open for further contact, and maintained a cooperative spirit with their subject. They were able to do so by following the five general stages of a proper law enforcement interview. Remember them. At the beginning of every interview, introduce and identify yourself properly, making sure you clearly state your purpose for being there. Next, establish rapport between yourself and the subject. Then, while maintaining that rapport, gather the information you need by questioning the subject. Summarize with your subject all the information you have collected, and then close on a friendly note, keeping the door open for further interview sessions. Now that we have discussed the five stages of a proper law enforcement interview, let's see how they apply in a number of different situations. Good morning. How are you doing? Great. About yourself. Not too bad. Can I help you with something? Oh, you go ahead and finish up what you're doing there. I can wait. Okay. Look around a little bit. Sure. Be my guest. So, you got some nice hardware here. Some of the best I've seen are out. Thanks. I like to think so, anyway. You a collector? Yeah. I like to hunt, though, when I get a half the chance. Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. It seems like every opening season, I'm stuck here behind this counter. So, are you the owner here? Yeah. Joe Cryer. Can I help you there? Looks like you've been looking at that browning. Yeah, I have. Well, maybe next season. Mr. Cryer, I'm agent Jeff Stearns with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. I'd like to ask you a few questions if I may. ATF. You guys were here less than three months ago, and I checked out clean. So now watch the trouble. There's no trouble at all, Mr. Cryer. We're just following up on the history of a handgun. The records indicate that it was shipped from the manufacturer to you early last year. I'd like to find out if you sold it and if you did get the information on who the buyer was. Listen, agent... Stearns. Agent Stearns. I run everything by the book around here. And let me tell you something. I lose a lot of business because of it. Now, you guys are the ones that make the rules. So how come you're hassling me for following them? I don't mean to hassle you, Mr. Cryer. I'm sure you run a legal business here. That's why we make the rules, to protect legitimate businessmen like you. Your records help us keep track of weapons like the one I'm talking about. It was used to commit an armed robbery last week. Shots were fired and people were injured. And we've recovered the weapon, and its serial number indicates that it was shipped from the manufacturer to your dealership. I just want to find out if you sold the weapon, because the chances are whoever you sold it to had it stolen from them. That's the reason I'm here. I only hope you can help me. Listen, Agent Stearns, I'm sorry. It's just that I get nervous when you guys come around. I mean, I've got nothing to hide. It's just that you're being from the government and all. Well, it usually means trouble when you come around. That's perfectly all right. I'd probably make me nervous, but I really need your help here. Okay, what kind of information do you need? I need to see the .4473 on a .32 caliber Beretta. The serial number is K674539. Well, come on around and see for yourself. Thanks. That was a .32 caliber Beretta. Serial number K674539. Oh, yeah. I remember her. This is Gail Warren. September 14th last year. You got that? No. .4528 Lawton Street. You know, that's just right down the road here. I said her husband goes out of town a lot on business, so she wanted some protection. These days, I can't blame her. Do you remember anything else about her? No, she checked out okay on the instant check, so I wrapped it up and she took it home. Bought a box of shelves, too. Did anybody come in with her? No, she came in alone. I was timid about buying it, but she knew what she wanted. Said her husband had recommended the Beretta. And have you seen her since? No. That was the last time. You know, I sure hope she's not in any trouble or anything. She seemed like a nice lady. No, I think everything's going to be all right, Mr. Crier. Let me just double check that name and address. Gail Warren .4528 Lawton Street. That's it. Okay. Well, I think that's it. Thanks for your help. Ain't no problem whatsoever. I'm glad I could be of some service to you. Listen, if you think of anything else or if something comes up regarding that handgun, would you give me a call? Sure will. You know about that business a little while ago? I'm sorry I went off on you like that. Don't worry about it. You've been a big help. Listen, you might see me again sometime, just as a follow-up. Besides, I think that Browning and I might have a date next deer season. Tell you what, you'll buy it and I'll go with you. You got a deal, pal. Thanks. However, you may waive your right to advice or counsel and your right to remain silent and answer questions or make a statement without consulting with an attorney if you desire. You understand these rights as I've read them to you? Yeah. So? So let me tell you where we're at with this thing, Marin. Like I said before, I'm Special Agent Green. This is Special Agent Farley of the United States Custom Service. Right now, we're the only thing standing between you and about 20 years in federal prison. At 10 keys at Coke, you tried to smuggle across the border put you in a bad way, my friend. It didn't even hide it very well. Look, for one thing, I know I'm not your friend because you're just a stinking cop. And for another, I've got nothing to say to you. That's it, Marin. Make it easy on yourself. Let's see if we can't dig that hole just a little bit deeper. Yeah. I said I've got nothing to say to you. Now, what part of nothing to say to you is there that you don't understand? I don't know, Marin. I guess it's that nothing part because your girlfriend had plenty to say. She ain't my girlfriend. Hey, what did she say anyway? She said enough to put you away for a very long time, Lonnie. And we got to figure that with that 10 keys at Coke or the trunk of your car, what she said was probably true. What'd she say? What did that line bitch say? Lonnie, what she said to us really isn't that important to you right now. What is important is what you said to us in the next, oh, 10 minutes or so. If you tell us where you got the stuff and where it was headed, we'll tell the U.S. Attorney that you cooperated with our investigation. If you can't help us out, then I guess all we've got to go on is what Ms. Darby told us. That chick don't know nothing about me, man. Hey, hell, I just met the bitch. And I'm gonna tell you something. Anything she's telling you is a bunch of crap. Look, Lonnie, you and I both know that the girl was just along for the ride, right? So whatever plans that you had for that dope, it's your ballgame now, not hers. We've got you cold and you know it. And you can tell us who your boss is, and we'll stand up for you when the U.S. Attorney gets involved. Or you can go ahead and tell us to go to hell. You can take the hit for this bust all by yourself. So what's it gonna be, Lonnie? What the hell are you looking at, man? Okay, let's just say what we play. Let's make a deal, okay? What kind of deal are you gonna make me? I can't make any deals, Lonnie. That's up to the U.S. Attorney. But if you help us out on this one, I'll tell him that you did. Okay, dude's name is Roscoe Brenteno. I'm supposed to deliver the stuff to a couple of his goons out in the sticks, somewhere outside of Houston. And how long you known this Roscoe? A couple of years. This is my first time running with him, and I swear that, man, first time. And who are the guys you're making the drop to? I don't know. Never seen him. All I know is Roscoe said, just show up. They'd meet me. When's it going down? That's supposed to be tonight. Do you know where you're supposed to go? Well, I know where I'm supposed to be. All right. You've done good, Lonnie. You're not out of the woods, but you've come a long way. Why don't you just go ahead and take it easy now? Let me go make some phone calls. I'll be back in a little while to finish up here, okay? In the meantime, I want you to try to remember everything you can about this guy, Roscoe, and your deal tonight. Maybe we can work something out. Okay, Linda, what's the problem? Look, Bob, I'm sorry I had to call you back in. I know you're on your way home, but I called somebody this afternoon for a burglary. And George tells me you have a history with this guy. I thought you might have a little more success with him in the interview. Oh, yeah? Who you got? Oh, don't tell me that's, uh... Gerald Jeffries. Jerry Jeffries. Here's his file. I don't need to see that. That scumbag and I go way back. What's the beef now? Well, we have an eyewitness that has him going into a campsite and making off of the camcorder. The witness called us, so we were actually able to stop him on the road. In the back seat of his car was a camcorder. In the trunk, to other cameras, and a pair of binoculars. You get a statement from the witness? Oh, yeah. And a complaint from the owner of that last camcorder. What a bonehead. Not only is this guy a thief, he's a stupid thief. I've nailed him twice before he keeps coming back, begging for more. It's the same MO. Petty theft most of the time. We know he's moving the stuff, but we can't seem to nail his fence. You read him his rights? Oh, yeah. Okay. Let's go bottom feeding. This time he's gonna deal us his fence. I'm gonna have his scalp on my totem pole. Here you are again. Here I am again. I guess I just can't get enough of you, Steadman. But I'd have figured a bad-ass park ranger like you would have been promoted by now or something. I guess your bosses don't like you as much as I do. Shut up, Jeffries. I've had all I'm gonna take from you, and I'm gonna make it my personal goal to make sure that when you go down this time, you stay down. Take your best shot, Ranger Bob. But personally, I don't think you've got it in you. That's where you're wrong, Big Shot. This time it's not just one camcorder. It's all the other stuff in your trunk. This time we're talking felony, Jerry. And you, being the three-time loser that you are, Judge won't even think twice about sending you up. That was an illegal search. You people had no right to search my vehicle. You've been watching too much TV, Jerry. We've got an eyewitness that puts you at the scene. No way. I was just driving through the park, minding my own business, when your smoky-the-bear goons yanked me out of my car and handcuffed me in front of everybody. That stuff in the trunk is mine, and I can prove it. My lawyer's gonna have a field day with you people. This is an unlawful arrest, and you're gonna pay. Listen to me, you piece of garbage. Your law, you're ain't gonna do squat. You haven't got a leg to stand on, and you know it. So this is what you're gonna do. You're gonna give us the name of your fence, and you're gonna testify against him. And then, maybe, if you're nice, the U.S. attorney will give you a break. Oh, and I'm gonna do all of this because why? Because Ranger Bob told me to? Man, you're on another planet! Listen, Jeffery, save the mouthwash, Steadman. It ain't working, man. Can everybody just take a deep breath, all right? And, um, settle down? Are you all right, Mr. Jeffery's? No, I'm fine. But you better check with your partner. I think he's losing it. Oh, he'll be all right. But let's you and I have a little talk, all right? My name is Ranger Clark. Can I get you a Coke or something? No, I don't want a Coke. I want to know why you people are hassling me. All right, let's start right there, then. First of all, we have an eyewitness that swears that you went into the Swanson family campsite. You went into their camper while they weren't there, and came out with a camcorder. She says you then got into the camp site and drove off. She says you then got into a dirty white Chevy with a broken tail light and drove off. Next, we have Mr. Swanson, who has sworn out a complaint that his camcorder was stolen, and he supplied us with a serial number to his camera. Next, we have the camcorder that was taken from the back seat of your dirty white Chevy. The serial number on that camera matches that to Mr. Swanson's camera. Finally, we have all of the other equipment that was taken from your car. Then I'm sure, and you know this as well as I do, that it's going to match up to other campers' complaints of stolen property by the time this is all over. Do you see where I'm going with this? Yeah, I can see where you're going with it. So maybe I took the camcorder, but I didn't break into anybody's camper. I swear, I mean, it was just laying on the ground right out in the open. I just picked it up and took it. I didn't steal it from anybody. It was my witnesses that say you did. Now, who do you think the judge is going to believe? But it's not all bad. I mean, so yes, you took the stuff, but nobody was hurt, right? So if you help us out with the rest of this investigation, we will go to bat for you with the U.S. Attorney. You mean I wouldn't go to jail? No, I didn't say that. I said that if you help us out, we will tell the U.S. Attorney that you did cooperate. So what's that going to do for me? Jerry, I don't know. That's for him to decide. But I will tell you this, that if you don't help us out, we're certainly not going to tell him that you did. So what kind of help you need? We want you to tell us about the guy who's moving the stuff for you. No, there's nobody. I just sell it myself. Come on, Jerry. You and I both know that that's not true. In any way, why would you want to take the heat for this guy? I mean, why? You're the one out there taking all the risks. He just sits back fat and happy and collects all the money. Doesn't that make you mad? Doesn't that get to you? How many times do you want to go to jail for this guy? And for what? What's he done for you, aside from Rob, you blind? Jerry, he doesn't deserve your loyalties. He deserves to spend some time behind bars. So if I serve this guy up for you, you're going to go to bat for me with the U.S. Attorney? Absolutely. All right. His name's George Lugakis. They call him Zorba. I think he's Greek or something. Where does he work out of? He's got a pawn shop down on the south side on Halstead Street. It's called Southside Pawn. Do you have a routine? You've worked out with him, or is it just hit or miss? No, no, just whenever I show up, he's there. I think he lives above it or behind it or something. I mean, he's always there. I just bring him the stuff. He gives me the cash, and that's that. How long have you worked with him? About two years. Do you know anybody else who works with him? No, I've never seen anybody. But I'm sure I'm not the only one. Why is that? Because he's always busting my chops about how his other suppliers are better and bring him better stuff, and if I don't get with the program, he's going to drop my percentage. Nice guy. Yeah. Well, you said if I gave you the information, you'd help me out with the attorney, right? Yes, and I will keep my word. But first, before we go any further, I just want to back up and go over what we've covered. Okay, Jerry, let's make sure we got this right. George Lukakis is his name.