 The new South-East Security Network codenamed Ibube Agu is greeted with mixed reactions. And as the River State local government elections draw near, non-payment of grants to political parties causes protests. Well, this is Post-Politics, and I am Mary Annacolle. South-East governors have vowed to repel any attempt by the Indigenous people of Biafra, IPUB, to disturb its new security network codenamed Ibube Agu. Likewise, the Eastern Security Network was also urged by the Ibu Social Cultural Organization, Orhanes in Ibu, to join forces with Ibube Agu to protect Ibu land against killer herdsmen. However, in a turn of events, IPUB had in a statement signed by the media and publicity secretary, Emma Powerful, warned Ibu youths against being members of the new security network threatening to deal with anyone that might spy on its activities for Ibube Agu. Well, joining us to have this conversation is Dr. Desmond Echeta. He is a senior lecturer in the Emol State Polytechnic, and of course we have Anthony Ogbekele. He's a current affairs analyst. Thank you very much gentlemen for joining us. Thank you. Thank you very much. Great. I'm going to start with you, Anthony. A lot of things have happened, of course, in the southeast that had prompted the governors of the southeast and states to put together this security network. Now, of course, we know that Nigeria as it is right now is suffering from the highest, if not level of insecurity. But give us a clear knowledge of what Ibube Agu is supposed to do in the southeast. I mean, we all know what Moteco is doing in the southwest. We see, you know, the other security outfit in the north, and now we have Ibube Agu. Explain to us what they are supposed to do and what training that they have. Okay. Thank you very much for having me. Ibube Agu is just a birth of the demand, the cries of the people from the southeast, because of the state of security issues that are taking place over the years. Over the years, just in recent times, has given a whole lot of concern, a lot of worry, especially with the advent of Moteco and with all the kidnappings and killings going on in the southwest and when we have this ESN, an iPop coming up in the southeast, a state of kidnapping, a state of killing by human investment over here, there's been described that the southeast government needs to emulate what the southwest counterparts are doing. So it's quite related, but of course they say it's better late than never. So that's why the establishment or the pronouncement of the Rago outfit came to pass this past Monday. Now, in answering the question very directly, the Rago outfit according to the release by the chairman of the southeast government from those doubles as the governor of airborne states, the person of Governor David O'Malley, is a compendium or an aggregation of vigilante groups in the entire southeast and now they're coming together to form this seamless outfit or an umbrella called a Babargo. Now, a Babargo in Igbo is from the Tiger family or the Lion family has some others who want to put it, the roar, the aura of the Lion. On the standard of a Tiger or a Lion, it's quite huge, quite a huge animal, the king of the forest, of the jungle, so to speak. Now, what it is set to do is to streamline all of these vigilante groups in the southeast together to gather intelligence and to work with the mainstream security agents to be able to fight crime and also to man the various interstate locations, forests and towns and villages and so on and so forth. So, each of these respecting the governors of the southeast are to handle and finance these vigilante groups by themselves but there's going to be a synergy which will be backed by law by the respective state houses of assembly which have not been done yet before there's been this grammar that all of these things are supposed to have been done. So, all is just in the beat to fight crime, this killing and the jailbreak, of course, that took place in the most states, killing in a born state and you should look at that going on in Enugu and also the killing that's going on in Enugu and at their states. So, the southeast governors together with Oranes and Mibu were present and the security teams, some security representatives were there on Sunday at the meeting coming together to say that this is what we need to do going forward to assist the security agents, the mainstream security agents to be able to protect people from the southeast because it is getting so bad and so worse. Interesting. Now, the Senate has also called for an investigation into the born state killings. They're asking the inspector general of police to make sure that thorough investigation is done on those people who were killed and those who were kidnapped. Has there been any arrests done so far? Any information? And what is the certainty that justice will be served? I know that you do not work with the police but, of course, you would know if there have been any arrests. Okay. Now, that is where the problem lies. We see killings over and over again in the ESA. There are a few addresses, or Huku local government area or from airborne states. And just a few days ago, just after the Eboverago announcement, there was another attack. Now, even the governor of the state have not come out to expressly see whether it is a border clash between the airborne access and their neighbors in Benway state. Therefore, it is an inflection of the fuller needs men who attack the communities. But in none of this, we have not seen anybody arranged. We've not seen any names mentioned. And the governor of the airborne states, in the presence of Dave O'Mahing, came out to say after this attack that he is aware of the people that are responsible, the masterminds of these attacks. So far, nothing in terms of drinking or public shaming or arraignment of the masterminds, so to speak, have been made so far. So we are still waiting to see maybe the emergence of the Eboverago will maybe jump them into life to see what is going to come out from the day. Okay. Let me go to Dr. Echeta. Ohana Zendibu recently has asked that the ESN joined forces with the Eboverago to protect the lives of Ndibu. But of course, the governors of the South Eastern states do not welcome this idea and it doesn't seem to sit well with them. Can you explain to the ordinary person what the difference between the ESN is and Eboverago and why these two should join forces? That's if you're in support of it. Okay. Thank you. First of all, I appreciate what Anthony Berkeley has done already. He has actually exreded the import of the Eboverago in the Southeast. But first of all, I want to also say here that ESN, for all I know, is still somewhere not open. But Eboverago is now open because there is backing by all the governors of the Southeast. So ESN is somewhere there, not open. But Eboverago is taking that open dimension. When you say not open, what exactly do you mean? You're saying that they're staying hidden, that their activities are not being brought to light. Are you saying that they probably are not legitimate? If you watch from what we've been reading, ESN is an offshoot of IPOB. And you and I know that IPOB, according to Fedra government, is a terrorist organization. And if they are a terrorist organization, why is it that they are now floating a security outfit? And if they float a security outfit to the extent to which IPOB is a terrorist organization, it could also be linked that ESN is also a terrorist organization. What I'm saying is specimen to me. But again, if the people are not clamoring, particularly Orhanes and Ebo, that ESN should join hands with Eboverago to see that South East is secured. It is also a work on development. It means that Orhanes and Ebo is also understanding that what ESN is doing is also going to be helpful or is already helping the people of the South East. But that sounds very confusing. If in one breath you're saying that these people are seemingly a terrorist organization, even though they're parading themselves as security operatives, then in another breath you're saying, well, if Orhanes says that it's okay for them to join forces, then it's okay. I don't understand. How can a terrorist group be joining forces with a government-backed security network? I don't understand how that works. You see, we have to be very, very careful when we get some of audiences in the social media. What you are saying now should be credited to who? Orhanes and Ebo. Who is the spokesperson of the Orhanes and Ebo? Can the person actually tell us that he is aware or he knows how ESN was formed? If he knows that ESN was formed, then he can authoritatively say that ESN should join forces with Ebo Bagu. But if he's not the architect of the ESN, then he doesn't have any powers to say that ESN should join forces with Ebo Bagu. Because to the extent that I know ESN is still somewhere operating in hiding, they cannot come out openly to say that they are members of ESN. They can't do that. If they come out openly and say they are members of ESN, I am sure that the law enforcement agent will be able to do something. But for us, from the Southeast, we appreciate what they are doing. Because they are already helping in security, particularly the header killer. Again, you speak from both sides of your mouth. Again, you speak from both sides of your mouth. I'm sorry, Dr. But you just said, you know, in the words of the Orhanese spokesperson. But now you're saying we in the Southeast appreciate, meaning that you are one of the sympathizers of the people in IPOB. You are a sympathizer of the ESN, but you'd rather not say it and you'd rather credit it to Ndibu. Are you a sympathizer? Do you agree with the methods of the IPOB and the ESN in the Southeast? Because you just said that you appreciate what they're doing. No, I am not contending to the fact that there is ESN. But if there is, we are making an assumption if there is ESN, then it would be a good thing that the joint forces should be able to go. But you just said that you like, you appreciate what they have been doing. Yes, we are making an assumption. We are making an assumption. So how do you appreciate something that is a probability? And for the purpose for which they are existing is to secure the people of the Southeast. Then it is a good thing. We are making an assumption because this has to be credited to, because I have not seen the information, ESN information, parading anywhere. I have not seen it. But you appreciate the work that they're doing. It is true. As long as it is true, it will be good that they should join forces with a bubago. But again, the bubago has a lot of things to do for it to actually come to lane light. Recall that this has to cover all the South Eastern states. And there should be proper legislation in all the state houses of assembly for you to actually say that this is a recognized outfit. Otherwise, it will also turn out the way ESN is being talked about. Let me go back to the other speaker. Now, let's not forget that IPOB issued a statement on the other hand. And it was signed by the media publicity secretary on Tuesday, warning Igbo-yuts against being members of a bubago. And they also threatened to deal with members of a bubago who would or may become spies in their camp. In fact, they told them that they should be ready to meet their ancestors if they dared to be spying on IPOB or ESN members because they think that those people are traitors. So how do you say prepare to join your ancestors? But then in another breast, you are protecting debos. So those people in a bubago, are they not your brothers and sisters? And I know that this question is not for you, Anthony, but you understand where I'm coming from, don't you? Yes, but you don't confide yourself if you look at this statement critically. Because trust informals, they are pros and cons for the prescribed IPOB group. Now, let me start with the government. It's well documented that they have been prescribed as a terrorist organization. Even though there have been arguments that this prescribed organization have not, to not bear arms, or have not been seen in public, to bear arms. And as against the Boko Haram, we all know the killings, the bombings, and how they have affected the national economy, the national security, the national infrastructure, and so on and so forth. Now, going forward, the ordinary man in the southeast, the average individual walking on the streets in the entirety of the southeast, have an affinity, have an emphasis towards the ESN. Now, what do you call it, street credibility or whatever it is? You can't blame them. First of all, why? Because nature holds vacuum. Once the mainstream security agents are not doing their job, the persons that they can relate with, or they have an emotional or sentimental attachment to, they cling towards them. That's just the way human nature works. Now, in my part, of course, we all saw that statement, or we read it rather. And he came out to say that anybody who formed the Bikbaba out here, who comes into spy in the ESN, should join the answers. That fruitness, that terrorist flavor, that they are just trying to prove the federal government's right because of statements like this. No matter how terrible, no matter how unprofessional, so to speak, we've seen from the police or the army, you will not hear statements coming from the mouth of any secretion official, like the way we have seen from the Mapa Afula and we have read. By and large, there is a disconnect because I cannot understand how, on one hand, you want to protect Igibo, and on the other hand, you want to fight an official from Ibubabu who, by all intents and purposes, were Islamic women. Because, remember, it is the vigilante groups of these respective five states that are coming together to make the Ibubabu outfit. So the majority of them, if not all, will be Igbo. Igbo men, Igbo women. So if you want to fight, you don't need to tell them that a member of the Ibubabu outfit will join his answers for Igbe, who did his spy. It means that you are creating a clash. And they say, when two elephants fight, it is the ground that suffers. Just like Dr. Echeta said, which I must commend again for that, you see that the Intersecurity Network, they are not known. They are under hiding. The C-style organization, or I would say the parent body that actually gave birth to Namdi Kanu and his iPhone movement. Talking about massive rap was really said that the ESN is only existing on social media, that we are not actually seeing them with our physical eyes. So it might be possible to be seen from whatever Palachial mansion or chair you are sitting on, is only going to incite more violence and more animosity between the soon to be paraded Ibubabu outfit and the quote-unquote, the hidden security report. But by and large, this statement is not good for the security of the south-eastern people that are resident in Nigeria. All right, quickly, we're out of time. Finally, Dr. Echeta, I want to quickly ask, we all were here when we had the Bakasi boys at the time. They seemed to be the good guys. They seemed to be protecting. It was a vigilante group and they were very famous for securing the lives and properties and working with police organizations. And then we were all here when it all went bust. And they became a rogue organization. Now, if all the necessary work is not done and the trainings are not given and all of the loopholes that have been pointed out are not plugged, how can we be certain that this doesn't turn into another Bakasi boys situation in closing? Okay, all right. Thank you. You see, if you chronicle what has been happening from the back of IPOV that is led by Nandekano and all that, it got to the point that he started wearing serious influence to the extent that the political leaders in the region had to start doing something to contain him. And that was what actually facilitated the prescription of IPOV. And I want to also tell you that that supremacy who is going to be in charge is still there. Nandekano is not holding any political office yet. They have serious influence on the people. And the governors are now also scared seeing the influence he is wearing. But to the question you have asked, the South Eastern governors, even though they are starting this late, it is better to be late than never. They have to do everything to see that they try to legalize the outfit, the security outfit. That is why I am saying that all the statuses of assembly must actually pass law that will protect this outfit. Once it is done, it will not have the legal backing so that it will not stand to something that could be used to winch a hand, they feed the enemies just like what we saw during the Bacassi. You know, they started like vigilante. And before you know it, they were used against the enemies of maybe certain groups of people. So I am sure that if the South Eastern governors will do the needful by trying to pass the necessary law, give the necessary training to the personnel, because personnel is important to must be in the right training. Once they have the right training, they will be modus operandi for their operation. Once that is passed, then it will help so that it will not talk to what we saw in the case of Bacassi. Well, I want to say thank you to you, Dr Desmond Echeta and of course, Anthony Bacchile for being a part of this conversation. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Well, we'll take a short break and when we return, political parties in river state protest not receiving election grants. We'll be back to talk with those parties representatives.