 Speak, your tongue is still your own, your listen body yours alone. Speak, your life is still your own. Look into the blacksmith's forge, the flame blesses the iron's ring. Look and fasten upon mounted, every chain slings springing white. Speak, a little time suffices. Before the tongue, the body died. Speak, the tune is still alive. Speak, say what you have to say. While celebrating the freedom of speech and justice, equality, liberty and fraternity, the golden jewels enshrined in the constitution of India, I J. Danika Achimi welcome you all to this August gathering. The day's important event will be cheered by me and moderated by Professor Larry T. U. Kuzo. The day we are immensely happy to organize the first seminar in the Top Talk series in collaboration with Department of Political Science. Our seminar series is called Neel Naglen a Step Forward. We are truly fortunate to have with us an eminent personality in Naglen, Sri Kautar Sushisamy, as inaugural speaker who will be delivering a talk today on the Naga journey, need of realism and invention. About the speaker, Kaouda Chishi did his schooling from St. Edmunds College, Shilong Megalaya, studied at Science College, Colima and graduated from Fazali College, Mokotu. Grandson of Shekha Pulsema, Chief GP of Locoball College, who raised the British colonial government's displeasure by granting permission to the American Baptist Missionary to send out the first Sumi Christian Center at Aizutotown. He is the sixth and the youngest son of Nivaka Seema, a pioneer of Mokotu Town, who was instrumental in establishing the town's highest secondary school, Fazali College, Sumi High School and Nivaka High School. Sumi is Presently Chief GP of Halixie Village, established by his father in 1969, while his elder brother, Inato Chishi, continues as Chief GP of Locoball Village. Sumi has written more than 140 articles published in the local papers and political, social, cultural and religious issues confronting Naglen. With a vast following in Naglen, especially among the new, he has appeared multiple times on national television, has been quoted by national print media and is a favorite subject of interviews and on the multitude of issues arising in Naglen for YouTube channels of Naglen. Now, with your permission, I request Shrikha Odechishi to kindly get the charge of the DIA stage is all yours then. Good morning, evening, good evening. I would like to thank the principal and faculty for their support and courtesy. And also thank all of you for attending this talk. It's the same time and I feel, that's a privilege. My only experience was being independent. Coming back to the topic, explain the reason why we Nagas are facing so many confusion on so many issues. It is a common phenomenon an advanced culture comes to contact with a primitive culture. It is natural that the primitive people when exposed to new thoughts, new ideas and new institutions, they go into a state of cultural shock. And this is what is happening in Naglen. In a few short years, everything around us has changed. Knowledge which has passed out from the bottom of the sun has now suddenly become this popularized education system. Religion was very simple. We appeased good and evil spirits, but now we have all different new religions, doctrines, the rituals and the ceremonies and governance also. Our villages are independent self-governing societies. Now we have inter, not only tribal but inter-tribal, inter-ethnic communities living under one form of government. So all of this has created confusion. And we have seen a lot of direction. Our native people do not know the purpose or value of our education. And this has reflected in many aspects of our lives. So starting with the first term, the term Naga itself, here the most popular group of the world, I believe, is the Kachetuwa Noka, which means piercings in the ears. Now I grew up in a time when I saw my elders with huge holes in their ears, not a specific small piercings. And that was because they had sort of a mirror, a white mirror, a big cube. Through the course of time, they had ear holes in the next hand. So that I believe is the most popular origin of the world, Naga. Now this term Naga has been used to identify the different ethnic groups of populations, in the present state of Naga, Manipura, Assam, Arbacher, and Rihabapura. Now the confusion in Naga has a reason about the term Naga with the advent of the NSNIM. See, people think that I don't like the NSNIM, that I am a local national. But that's not true. I just say as they are. There was no confusion about who considered himself a Naga and who did not. This confusion arose only in the early 90s, when the NSNIM, in an effort to strengthen its political hold, started into the non-Naga tribes, especially in the old Muki tribes, into the Naga fold. And this confusion is still here after the present. So as educated young men and women, you should always try to find out what are the facts behind any issue and what has led to this issue arising. So now we are in a state where we have multiple Naga tribes, and among the newly inducted Naga tribes there are a division among them. Some of them are Naga, some of them are Naga. And this has a spread to where the recognize the Naga tribes do not want to be known as Naga. So that we must be very well aware of who we are, what identity we are, and who we want to become. With regard to governance, we were self-government societies. In a village we knew each other, we were related to each other, and we knew the laws which govern us, local fusion. But with the advent of colonialism and then Indian nationals and against state law, we have become lost. Our state government functions only for the purpose of misusing funds. Our village societies, our village councils, and our civil societies are churches. Everybody is after money. And this has risen because we do not understand the concepts. The Naga English Council Act was passed in 1988. It tried to formalize the traditional Naga governance. So they gave the example of the Au, the Putumidum. So these people, the Putumidum, they take turns. The clans, the clans who formed the village, they changed the governance every 13 years. It's been reduced to 15 now. And this is just an example. Now you have the Yunkum tribes, the Epiculums. So these, and then the Angami, I believe it's Pehibira. Nortar is Tungki. So all these, these are the people who should form the village councils. These are the people who should be the Kanbaras. But now we have reached a stage where the politicians are choosing who should be the Kanbaras. The politicians are choosing who should be the village councils. The original act was called the Naga language area council act. This area council was repealed because he started acting. He started exercising powers beyond here. Now the reason for the future is the amendment in 2010 which has renamed Naga language area council acts. Naga language and tribal council act. Now it says that tribes can form tribal councils, like our A.P.S. bodies. Or groups of tribal councils, like the CMTC, the N.P.O.A.R. Kinimiya, Nudin. But the problem is, this is not a legally valid act. Because it states that we should form these councils according to our Kasami laws. Now Naga Kasami law does not recognize any authority other than the village council. These tribal councils, they have no authority under Naga Kasami law. They are operating under Article 191C of Indian constitution. The right to form Indian associations. Now the Naga language and tribal council act has tried to subvert our Kasami rights. By trying to legalize something which has no legal basis. So this is because of laws like this, the confusions arise in society. If I challenge an apex tribal body like the civil war, I know that they have no standing under any law. They have no authority over me. But they tried to use the excuse of this. Act which has been passed by the Naga tribal council. So now to challenge that I have to go to court. I know that I will be in court. But I have to spend money, I have to spend time. So it just comes out to a lot of social media or big media. So these are our own leaders, our own people are creating confusion amongst us. And their purpose in creating this confusion is so that they can carry on at the end of their business of using us. They have not a certain policy. It seems to be a concerted policy that they must confuse. We have to hear all these doctors solution. This is coming, that is coming. All unnecessary issues are brought up. But nobody mentions the real issue. The group of all the confusion, all the tribal Naga language which is Karabheela. Karabheela in every field, every department and every sphere of society. So as educated young people you should be aware of that. Always try to get to the core of an issue. Think, reason, then you understand. Don't just accept everything as a thing. Give it to you. Don't swallow all the things. Always filter it. Always keep it. I am always in reason. No. Last year I was privileged to witness a seminar in Guwahati. The Lotus Human Rights Law Network. And there I mentioned that in an ordinary society, you have the government, you have civil societies, you have the institutionalized religions, you have the print media and you have the criminal, organized criminals and hates. Now these five elements, they are supposed to be against each other in Guwahati or Yadav. But in Nagaland, these five elements, they are combined together to suppress the rights and privileges and the opportunities of the ordinary world. The government is into rampant corruption. The civil societies are handling Guwahati again. In my recent interview I talked about that. How election to our apex tribal bodies is manipulated. I gave the example of a civil war. So in one way or the other, the government selects the civil societies and then the church is either actively indulging in corruption or is silent about corruption. The media also is silenced and the undergrounds have taken over the role of the organized criminals. So we must be aware that nobody is fighting for the common people. Nobody is voicing off the grievance of the common people. Because all these institutions of a normal society are working hand in glove to suppress the ordinary Nagas versus a privileged section of the Nagas society because we have access to education in a good institution. But there are thousands of other Nagas living in the villages who do not have access to basic education. Who have no hope of ever entering college. You must do it. Are we so selfish we call ourselves Nagas? We are trying to identify as a group of people, as a single American society. But when you do not care about the less privileged among you, what is your purpose? Is your purpose in life solely to make money by any means possible? I want you to think and to delay your lives according to a certain purpose. It's okay if you want to make money. Learn how to make money in ethical ways. Not by stealing from the weak. This is what we have become. Another people we have become a band of ours. And depending on the level we are stealing from the rich are stealing from the less rich. The less rich are stealing from the poor. Not these levels. So we have to face reality and we have to change direction. Always we will not survive as Nagas. We will not survive as simis, as anami, as reimas, whatever. We will only survive as rich and poor. There is a definite line between the rich and poor among the Nagas. You have people who are spending money, hand over fist. Lively. And you have people who are struggling to make territory peace. How does this come up in such a short time? Nagas will always equal. Somebody might have a little more capital than you. Somebody might have had no grain than you. But you didn't stop. You didn't have different classes in society. But now we have reached a stage where there is a definite line between the rich and poor. And it's going to get worse. So we have to think about that. So, governments and religion. The majority of the Nagas we call ourselves American Nagas. Now what is American Nagas? It is spiritualism. Straight orthodox. Now suddenly we are seeing people who call themselves a converted Baptist who having visions talking about donating money to the churches. And if you donate money they are implying that God will give you hope. There is nothing to do with your converted Baptist. Our churches are not looking after the less privileged among us. What we have done is we have perverted American Baptism with Bibleism. We call it Bible. But actually it is from an independent church in Australia. We just start. Which has been influenced by prosperity churches. So we have a mixture of the Pentecostal visions and faith healing combined with prosperity churches, preaching, saying that if we give to the church God will give you hope. If we build our churches what growth, state of growth when our neighbors can hardly afford one meal a day. What is the purpose of building a church? What is the purpose of a pastor driving around in a luxury car? Don't you understand the absurdity of calling ourselves American Baptists? What we see on the TVs, these American TV preachers, they are not American Baptists. They are just comedy. So learn to read the Bible, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. That is Christianity. I challenged the NBCC in a prior article. I wrote about a reduction of Christianity. I said that the NBCC has reduced Christianity to prohibition and closing shops on Sundays. You could not reply. It is true. And all of them have no grounding in Christian theology. Where in the Bible does it say that you shall not drink? Where in the Bible does it say that the Sabbath is on Saturday? The Sabbath is on Saturday? These false principles to make us believe that between something good for society, in 2020 the modern foundation and modern express these people. They connected to the seminar, they made on this issue. NBCC did not allow officially, they did not allow. And those who turned up, they could not say anything on behalf of prohibition. I have to understand whether it is our government or whether it is our churches, whether it is our, whether it is our eight-pixel bodies. We have to question them. Why are they doing these things? And the only way you can question them is if you know something important. See, growing up, I had to search around for things. But for you, it is so easy. You have it in your hands, in your forms. You can search anything. You can find anything. Use the tools that you have. You are a fool if you do not use what you have. To be misled, you have to understand this. The majority of people are too lazy. They are too lazy to do their own thing. So they are misled, easily misled by evil people. So if you don't want to be misled, you have to think for yourself, you have to search for yourself. So understand this. Your religion, your denomination, the way you worship, how regularly you worship will not grant you salvation. It is your deeds, how you treat humanity. The Bible says God made man in his image. Jesus Christ said he destroyed his temple. I will repeat it in three days. He meant the boy. This is the temple of God. It is not a stone house concept. So understand, salvation comes through your deeds, not through your worship. The church is there to strengthen your faith. To strengthen your, like many people, you do not find your faith in the church. The faith is what you do. So understand. People just because they have degrees, just because they are called to certain institutions. God has given help, all of us, the ability to understand and the ability to choose. You can choose to blame the foreign people or you can choose to think. So the choice is yours. So don't be misled by a religious dog. Go to education. This, I'll call it the Western system of education. This system of education is one of the greatest evils that we all have faced. You have to understand how education developed. See, education is there to pass on knowledge. It's well-informed. Other societies, they have gone through the process of gaining knowledge and skills and passing their certification. We're just hunter-gatherers who have barely made it into the agricultural age when all the modern forms have descended on us. Now we're using phones, we're using cars, we're building houses, we're building roads, bridges. But how many Nakas know how to do that? He must focus on his vocational training. We need Nakas need mechanics. We need carpenters, we need lasers, we need instruments. And if you have those skills, you can become rich. I've seen it in my own eyes. The mechanic, I repair my vehicle when I've been with him for 30 years. From a mere, he doesn't even know ABC also. But I believe he's got around 5,000 points, 2 boyos, always here. He's got his workshop, which is always filled with neighbors. So you have to understand the purpose of education. Now, if you want to go into the army or the police, that's it, or nothing is enough. If you want to appear for civil services and exams, then graduation is enough. If you want to teach, then you can go for your MA and PhD. What is the purpose of going for higher studies when you're going to eventually settle on a job which does not require anything? Years of academic learning. I'm standing in front of you. I don't remember using the mathematical knowledge I learned after class 12. I'm not integrating what you mean. But I want you to understand why you're doing it. It's okay. You're in college now. If you're going to try for a government job, stop the BA. Don't waste your time. Don't waste your time starting your big MA and PhD. You go for all these higher levels of studies only if you teach. Similarly, you teach your less fortunate villages or people they know. It's not necessary that they start going to college. Now, when you look at developed countries, you see that hardly 30% of them enter college. They stop the high school after that. Their advantage is they have vocational training. So God willing, in the future, we would understand the need for vocational training. But as of now, I want you to understand. I want you to tell why you have to know why you're studying. What is your purpose in life? And I'll tell you, if you want to be happy in life, you pursue something which you like. The way you will find content. You see all these other big shots, better than ministers, officers, technocrats. None of them are happy. The money that they look gives them the illusion of happiness. But when you look deep down, you see none of them are happy. They don't have peace of mind. They don't have job satisfaction. Job satisfaction is something which you will never understand. Only a person who thinks something he loves will know that. Even me, I have not been something which I like. For me, the Guru life, not farming, that is the best. I love it. I love working out in many fields. Without electricity, we don't care. We don't work for fun, we care. But because of social pressure, peer pressure, people will say, what do you do? What have you studied? And then we have this need to always protect the negative image of ourselves. So, as educated non-millionaire women understand why you are studying and what you want to do in life. And these are the few ways in which we have lost our way and we need to touch reality. Now, how many possible societies? Several societies grew out of a need to address the imbalance in society. When the industrial revolution came about, the working class was born. And the capitalists exploited the working classes. And that's when these unions and associations were formed to fight for the rights of the working class. Now, this has expanded. Now we have different unions, different associations which are meant to fight for its members. But in Nagaland, we have formed unions, associations to enrich the existing members. So, we take ahead with several bodies. They have never actually addressed the problems, the hardships of the members of the tribe. Recently, in a Facebook group, they were deploring the state of the roads insnilable. So, I personally, where is the semi-home? Then people started walking the way. It is the purpose of the epic travel bodies to ensure that the development and justice is granted to the members of the tribe. It is not their purpose to just sit there attend every government meeting and to give their love to government offices. So, similarly, here also, you see this demarcation of the union. The presidents, they live in luxury. When they are supposed to be in the auto driver, they never do anything for the benefit of the auto driver. So, this is what we have become. Now, that is a pressure group. Then you have the non-profit organizations. These organizations, they have learned to fill gaps where the government could not cover the problem. But in mind, we have not long-profit organizations, but for-profit organizations. You see all these so-called social do-gooders. Advertising what they've been, as skill development, feeding the poor, whatever. I don't know what they do. And you look at how they live. They live like millionaires. Now, if there were rich people who were investing part of the money to help the weaker sections of society, that's okay. But all their wealth has been accumulated through the funds which the government of India has given to uplift the poor. So, we have to understand that our civil societies, there are few of them who are being good. I don't deny it. But the vast majority of them are out for themselves. You have to understand that. They do not represent you. They do not speak for you. They speak for themselves and for the best interests. So, as before, think, filter and reason. Coming to nationalism, very surprised. When discussions on this nationalism comes, we seem to have no idea of what nationalism is, what is their purpose. The Nara national movement was started by the NNC, which formed the FGN, federal government of Nara. Now, recently, we're hearing things about the flag and the Hezbollah, the Hezbollah-being constitution. To bring up this issue multiple times, it's not easy to be sure. But every time I've been shut down, either by the anchor or by my four panelists, they just don't seem to understand what they're asking for. In the same Nara, we should be questioning, what does the Hezbollah entail? What does it mean? Now, the NNC, the GN Hezbollah, was a democratic decision based on parliamentary lines. But the NNC constitution is totally different. It is a totally communist agenda. It talks about a one-party government. It talks about a president with all executive and financial powers. It talks about nationalizing all our land, all our resources, all our rivers, all our animals, transportation. And I'm surprised that so many educated Nara's are so big. Gang Ho, about the fact that the NNC is going to get the Hezbollah, including the Indian Gulf Sea. It's not going to happen. But the fact that it's not going to happen does not change the fact that they are so stupid. How stupid are we? Our self-proclaimed leaders and our government-protected leaders talking about the flag in the constitution, I said leave the flag aside, let's talk about the constitution. But nobody is going to discuss that. Some of the ways in which we are facing confusion and crisis. So as stated earlier, okay, it is natural. It is natural for us to be confused by all these issues. But how do we go about addressing these issues? What is the direction we should take? And that is just simple. Try to act authentically, not morally. Morality differs from person to person. I am from culture to culture, from religion to religion. But ethical behavior is the same across humanity. Honesty. Honesty, right deal. These are the basis of ethical behavior. Justice. If you are honest, if you behave properly, then everything else follows. What Nagas need to do is to start behaving ethically. Whether you work in the church, whether you work in the government, whether you work in the underground, or civil society, media, or even you go to conversations, you have to behave ethically. Because no matter who lectures you, who says, as long as you yourself do not behave ethically, you cannot do anything against those who behave ethically. My greatest strength has been that I've got no hope for anybody to act with you or me. I've tried to act ethically both in a private life and in a public life. People say that I'm very famous. They say, no, I'm infamous. No Naga has ever had as much enemies as I have. No Naga has ever been so equalitarian, you can say, in the class of his enemies. I've got enemies of rage for none. But the reason why they cannot do anything against me is because everything I do, I try to do it ethically. I urge upon you, if you want to bring change into the Naga society, and start behaving ethically in every role of your life. Because that is the only thing which can save our society. Thank you all. Thank you, sir, for sharing your eye-opening thoughts. We are tempted to your knowledge and wisdom. Now I request Professor Leritie to kindly count with us and open the series for discussion and conscience. He has given us different dimensions, different areas where our society has left behind, where we have fall short. So let's grab this opportunity and also take this opportunity to share your thoughts, clarifying from us, sir. So I invite us, sir, to the dice and we can start with the interaction session. Our students to come up with your questions. The stage is open. Free to ask any questions or anything. It does not necessarily have to be in one set now. But I will try to clarify and answer as necessary. My name is Motun. I'm from the Department of Political Science. In the beginning of this speech, sir mentioned about the addition of the old Kuki tribes into the Naga fall. And I'm from Manipura. I'm a Naga from Manipura. And we have often been claimed that we belong to the old Naga tribes. But my question is one, what basis, is there any basis why we have been blocked for rather allegedly been blocked into the old Naga tribes and been added later? See, as far as I know, the first study of the few tribes of the Northeast was done in British. And there were the ones who classified us as Naga, Kukis, and Oathemites. And the main basis of this classification was linguistics, language. So, you know from which tribes? I want to talk about the marines. No, marines, yes. I want to bring that up. There's annals and marines, right? I think they are the most victimized among the tribe of marines. Because on one hand we have Naga, and the same, I am telling you that on the other hand, we have Kuki insurgents in the Naga. So, you yourself will be the way of your language, huh? With whom it has word, affinity with. And I believe that this confusion arose only after 1992-3. And it was thought of by NSLIM. They have a definite secret. NSLIM is one of the most powerful groups in Northeast India. And the reason is because they are very highly developed intellectually. They know how to function. They know what to do. They know their purpose. And they know whom and what organizations to use to achieve their purpose. So, if I am not mistaken, earlier there were 8-9 tribes from Manipura. 8 tribes who were considered Naga in Manipura. Now I believe it has increased, right? So, all this is part of the policy. So, it is... I understand the environment you are in, okay? You are friends of all the Angkor communities, and you tell me also. So, I understand the pressures in your facing. But, it will happen. A day will have to come when you have to speak out. Or what you believe is your true identity. It is not for me or for someone from outside to define who you are. It is for you, yourself, to define who you are. That's all I can say. Hello, students. My name is Cicero. I am from the Portland Department of the MFH since we have been talking about religion. I want to publicly denounce the practice of sending those offerings that people made to the church. So, Slade, for example, we bought the church and you offer some precious materials to the church, and they send it. But those offerings aren't supposed to be shared to the poor people. So, I want to publicly denounce the practice. Thank you. Thank you. It is very courageous of you. When you look at children from other parts of India or the world, and other children, there is a vast difference between them and other parts of the question that parents may ask you. But here, too, we just like to accept. So, it's so good of you to come here and to speak out your mind about... The offerings in these are the good stuff, like the first part of the school. So, that is the crux of my issue with organized religion. You know, really. Martin Gandhi said it right when he said, I love Christianity, but I hate Christianity. Here is a clear distinction, the principles which Christ thought and what we are practicing under Christianity have no connection. Christ thought only about helping people, helping the less fortunate, and the parable of the good Samaritan. How many of you are aware of that? The pastors, they never talk about these things. It is about a man who was robbed, beaten and left to die, and the various Jews who pass it. And it was only a Samaritan, a non-believer, who treated the Indian man. Now, this translates into the concept that it is not your religion which will save you but your deeds. And as my young friend pointed out, our church is bringing nothing to help the poor. So, thank you for bringing that up. More questions, and I'm from the Department of English. So, it's very good to see you in person because I often watch your videos talking about religion. Very firmly. So, I also have a question on the corruption. Like, I'll tell you now, the corruption is not only about factor appointments or any such, but we also have class distinctions like advanced drives or any type of drives. What do you think about this manner if you have any prejudices? Thank you so much for bringing that up. This issue is one where I've read the comments, and many people they want to address that, so thank you for bringing that up. Now, the reason why there are advanced drives and type of drives is because of the tradition. The British ruled Nagaland only up to the Tsizir River. So, those beyond the Tsizir River with the coming of statehood were classified as backward tribes because they did not have the advantage of education. So, that is where this advance in backward tribes took over. See, many people have problems with similes having reservation, but it is not for all states, it is for those who come from across the Tsizir River. Now, the problem with such reservations, even in India, or even in the case of Nagas in the Union services, is we do not have the concept of the creamy layer. So, only the rich, only the privileged are getting those jobs, which are meant for the reserved people. So, say you take, for example, the SDs in the Hillar, India, you can see that they are so backward, but they are getting the privileges. Similarly, here among the backward tribes in Ireland, it is only the children of the rich and the privileged who have access to good education that are getting the reservation. Whereas the villagers living there, they have no thing. And their misery is being used to advance their backward tribe agenda. Say, Frontier Nagas, I am not against it, but it is not going to achieve anything. Because the same class of people who have exploited the Eastern Nagas in statehood, they will be the ones in charge in Frontier Nagas. You will not say it is about English. It is for us, for all of us to think and to raise the standard of living of a less fortunate person. And that has always been the purpose of whether I write or when I talk. It is above the Nagas in the villages, the ones who are suffering. When I travel, when I see a Nagar villageer having a big road, I always get angry. What is the difference between them and me? That I am driving in a car on the basis, as Boman said. It is because of the inequality of the situation of the privileges, the jobs and opportunities which the government gives us. So we have to address that. And it is very difficult because those who are enjoying the privileges are richer. They are more powerful. What we do not realize is that if the pressure level, the anger of the people reaches a certain level, which then takes turn by it. There is something which I have always been trying to avoid. So I don't know if you will be happy with what I have said, but this concept of backward, not our world, and it is a valid fact, but it is being misused by some. Thank you so much for spending your time for coming to Malaysia. Spending on such interesting topics. Sir, my name is Kawoto Jepangu from Paul's Department of Arts and Mystery. My question is, sir, since Nagay has been axing the government of India to give Nagaland as an independent country, what if the Indian government accepts this issue and makes Nagaland an independent country? How do you think the independent Nagaland country will function in your view? How will the Nagaland country be? Thank you for bringing up again another very valid question. The reason why I say the NSN iron is very intelligent is because India always allowed that value. During the early days of the Nagay insurgency, up to the 1960s, if we had received independence, we would have functioned as an aggregate state. Not everybody living in his own villages, cultivating his own lands, and maybe buying salt from the sand. But now we have tasted the benefits of modern society, become un-eastern. So this is why independence, that work has been changed to sovereignty. And many people, I try to bring it up in a sense, but they don't understand the distinction between independence and sovereignty. Independence is freedom. Freedom to rule ourselves, to do it in. Sovereignty is the power to rule. So NSN iron has changed the narrative from independence to sovereignty and to shared sovereignty. So what you're asking is not independence from India, but the right to rule the Nara. That function, if India were to give us independence, within one month, we'll break out of the civil war. Because we have nothing. We cannot go back to our villages, stuck cultivating two feet. It is impossible. I've mentioned this a number of times. When I spoke with Mr. Arun Ravi, I told him, why don't you give us probability independence for five years? Now, then you'll see Nara's clevering to get back to India within two months now. But that is something which India also will not take the risk of. Because by the time some other power, some other group or country might grab power here. So independence is no normal piece. You just have to go to YouTube. There's a free documentary, the title. You look up Myanmar. You'll see how the Nagas are living, compared to how they live in India. Even the poorest Nagas in India is living better than the rich people in India. So, very valid question. With something, among my friends also, I have many of them who talk about the constitution, about independence, and I laugh at them, but I am surprised at this stupidity. You understand, that's why your problem is stopping. We cannot survive as an independent nation, unless each and every one of us is willing to go back to our villages and start farming. Once again, I have a simple question. Don't you think legalizing legal shopping are still going to start again? Legalizing legal shopping? Okay. Thank you so much. Prohibition? I don't know why the NBCC started to press for prohibition. But I'm a recovering drug addict. I'm a recovering alcoholic. I know exactly what an alcoholic does. No matter how difficult they make it for me to buy, I will go to any lengths to purchase it. And these wararlists, people who have no experience, for them it is very easy to classify. Like drinking is a sin. It's not. When the Bible is written that drinking is a sin, Jesus Christ's first miracle was making one. They don't know the difference between an alcoholic and a social drinker. They don't know what drives a man to abuse his wife and children. The reason is because of the print now. During this war, I mentioned the war on the express and power. The war on the population debate. I gave the examples of two of my brothers-in-law. My wife's, elder sisters, other sisters. Both of them are alcoholics. But one beats his wife regularly. One is always joking with his wife. In fact, his wife is on the verge of beating him now. So, see, they make all these stupid moralistic conclusions based on an inaccurate knowledge of how personal people behave. They bring up these issues of child abuse, domestic abuse. And they use it to shore up the argument for prohibition. And it is broken false. Forget about the revenue which syrup and oil brings. Think of the damage which furious alcohol puts on the economy. Growing up, I grew up among drinkers. I drank prior to prohibition. I don't recall hearing of anyone dying of liver sources, unless he happened to be 70 or above. Nowadays, you see young people, 25, 30 years, dying of liver sources. Imagine how what a total prohibition has taken off. You see young people wait for drugs. Imagine that same debate that Naglain Medicine Dealers Association became. And it was very good of them to office. They said that for them prohibition is good. Prior to prohibition, there were only 13 wholesale drug dealers in Mahbub. Now it seems they have around 20 wholesalers. And all of them, they are selling not genuine medicines for illnesses, but all these cobserves and pills which can make you happy. So this is the other side of prohibition. One which the NPCC refuses to see, which they refuse to address. They never came for the debate. They didn't reply to my article on the reduction of Christianity. The only feedback I got from my article on the reduction of Christianity, I think I believe I wrote that in 2021 December. Our former Chief Minister, King Kishin, his elder brother, Dr. Binto, he called me up. And it seems some members of the NPCC called him up saying that what kind of drug does not apply to all of us? All of us. And then it seems he replied, he told them, please I have not read the article, let me read it first. And then after he read it, he called me up to say, he agreed with me on every issue. So we have this multitude of traditional colleges. At last count, 1990 after 2000, that's 23 years ago, at last count, there were 17 traditional colleges in the upper room. 17. I don't know how much they are now. Now all these colleges, they have got no... I don't believe they have any solid theological academic credentials. But those running these colleges are part of the thing, organized church. So they need to create employment for these graduates of these spurious traditional colleges. In one of my interviews, I said that you can get a traditional college in Nala also. And this is the reason why all these prayer centers are sprouting up everywhere. We have prayer warriors. What is a prayer warrior? I don't understand. Who gives you the title of a prayer warrior? I believe only God can give you the title. Because he's the one hearing our prayers. He knows whose prayers are good and whose prayers are bad. So on sets like this, prohibition, prayer warriors, contributing. As far as I know, the Bible talks only of types. Type in 10% of your earnings. Now we have donations for this and that. Even this handful of rice, no? Every time you cook, you leave a handful of rice. Where does the rice go to? It is distributed among televisions. There's so much hate coming from foreign countries. What did they do? They distributed among themselves. I heard a case where some person, they contacted the children of, our grandchildren of Billy Graham. And then they sent all these nice gift boxes for children, for children's day, and then they distributed among televisions. He didn't pay. One of our friends said that their pastor wants to buy us coffee. I said, hey, ours are still behind us. This means they're moving over us. So, see, they pray on us. And to show up the credibility. Okay, prohibition does not have any real theological position. But to show up their reputation as boomers. To create a false image that they bring something good for society, they endorse prohibition. They tell us to close shops on Sundays. So, we understand that concept. And until we understand, the government does not need to consult the churches about any policy. The reason why there is a clear divide between the government and the church is because Europe spent centuries fighting against the pope. So, now they understand that the church and government must be separate. But here, our government does that because they are into corruption. So, they appease every small section of society. And for them, if any revenue that comes from sale of liquor goes into the public sector, whereas the bootleggers, they take it straight to the reports. So, it is better for them to support the publishing. I think I address the people, I hope I address the pope. Interaction. Sir, as usual. It's always a learning journey with you. I consider I'm a student of Netherlands. I'm an observer. I'm a commentator. And every moment I observe, sometimes it makes me happy. Sometimes it makes me sad. Sometimes I get depressed. The journey of Netherlands has not been easy, even after the getting the state. So, as a Nagas scholar, as an activist, as a writer, as a commentator, how do you see the future of the Nagas? How do you see the future of the Netherlands? And how do you see this younger generation of the Nagas as an asset of the great Indian nation? I mean, how do you see that? See, I have great faith in Nagas people. Because I studied with no Nagas. And I know that we are as good as any other people, if not better. Now, to bring about positive change, you have to understand that it lies in your hands. This is the problem with Nagas. We always expect someone to come and do things for us. You have to understand it is for you to actively take power in issues which matter to you. It may be on any issue. But if we feel that it is a valid issue, we have to part. This is the biggest weakness of the Nagas. We know it is right, but we have to believe it. It is for somebody else to do. Now, in my last interview on the government today, I said that change throughout the history of the world change has come only to the young people. Then one guy commented saying that Mark Nagandhi was not a young man. I can imagine the stupidity of that thing. As if Mark Nagandhi was a boy. Or maybe to old man. Mark Nagandhi started his journey of activism when he was in the stream. When he showed to me for it. So, we have to understand. Because we are primitive societies. In primitive societies, things don't change. We have to understand that. Things don't change. So whatever our elders say, since they have more experience in the same thing. When you keep repeating something, the older you become, the better you become. So we come from a society where we are used to accepting whatever our elders tell us. But that day and age is gone. You understand modern concepts better than I do. I learn so many things from Facebook. In fact, you will not believe me. But I learn so many things from young people. It is because of an interaction on Facebook, especially with young people. That I am able to address them. So you must understand that you influence people. Every word you write. Every opinion you express. You can fix someone around you. In one way or the other. So you have to take charge of your future. You have to start with your college student union elections. Take active part by at least voting for the right person. And if you believe you can contribute, then stand for election in your student councils. Because that is the only way you are going to bring about change. You see all the student leaders now, all crooks. Because our environment is such that only crooks can flourish. So that is what this field of law must do. I have faith. I have hope. But I cannot believe you. You have to believe yourselves. Hello, sir. My name is Dr. Roland Malavide. I am from Mizoran, actually. So first of all, I want to say that I am a great supporter of Nagaan nationalism. Because at one point of time, the Mizoran and Nagaan shared the same history. We have these insurgencies going on. And today, what I would like to know is that the Mizorans are now having their peace now with the Indian government. But the Nagaan still cannot fix that state. And what would be the reason for that? And there could be certain reasons like due to the feelings of lands and tribes. Or is there any kind of ideology like the Indian government trying to popularize the idealization among the Naga people? That happens the peace process. So can you tell me your idea on that? How you see that? Thank you very much for bringing up a very, very point. Like many people compare the Mizoran insurgencies with the Naga insurgencies. But we have fundamentally differences. The first is that the Mizoran insurgencies arose due to the time. The Mizoran to occasionally know that is powering the Naga. Naga powering, which leads to an increase in the rat population and which leads to a decrease in the population. So unfortunately, the government of India did not take any concrete steps to alleviate the suffering of the Mizoran people during this time. So that's the reason why the Mizoran insurgencies started. Whereas the Naga is purely a political movement. Now again, another fundamental difference is the mix of the population. Now Mizoran, you have nearly a homogeneous operation speaking one language. Here we have so many tribes and so many new tribes have been created every day. So that is under India's significant advantage of that. There is no doubt India's significant advantage of it. India is not actively doing it, but not proactively, but actively encouraging. Recently I had a meeting with General Niki and General Secretary of the House. So I told them. I asked that question because I see this play. So is this also a kind of some kind of Naga? That's true, I don't know. But I am the only Naga who has publicly owed my allegiance to the Constitution of India. Okay, these politicians now, they did with when they were in the election, but that is for different purposes. Why? Because I believe in the Constitution of India. It is a good constitution. See the fact that the people who enforce or sit in the institutions of India. Say the Supreme Court. I have an issue with one of the automotive justice. But it does not mean that I don't trust in the institution of the Supreme Court of India. I don't trust in some people sitting there. So these things, India is also a new nation. So India is also going through many world acts. When compared to other nations, India is still new. So this I understand. But it is for us. See, I grew up with many millions of friends in school. So in your culture has many impacts. Okay, good culture. This body I saw was very funny with the one Naga lying on the road and cutting in grass. Like not even bordering to the stand. But this good culture of the measles, the fact that you have a really homogeneous population. And then see, you have a young user association. It is so powerful. But look at what NSF has begun. NSF was once as powerful as the YMA. But it has been politicized. We played tribal politics. So in NSF we do. So that is the difference. It's not a question of how India has done this for that. It is our own duty. Okay, let us talk about the connection. I think you must be reading the articles that our student writes. And I like what you just said. Okay, there are certain things that we have to take the ownership of. The illness in the society, the problems in the society, the structure issue that I witnessed. I have been associated with the civil society organizations and the people and the students for over 10 years. I am a scholar and a teacher. I am also a legal advisor of some of the organizations. So what I understand is that the view that the younger generation is having. They are so purely egalitarian. They are universal in nature. They are the ones who believe in justice, equality, liberty and fraternity. So in this context I want you to tell them that how these young people are going to challenge those problems. That it has been created as a by-product of some of the wrong decisions we have been taking in the land itself. What is your take on it, sir? As early as you have to understand the power of public opinion. My greatest strength has been the power of public opinion. So you have to, the young people, you have to elect good student leaders who will take forward the agenda of changing society. There is no other way. You cannot wait until you are old or you have to support someone who is visibly cheap. This seems like self-promotion sort of thing. Because as far as I know I am the only visible guy who is speaking against all this. But it's okay. When you come across a person who speaks out on certain issues. It is not that you have to agree with him on everything. If you agree with a person on the whole issues, you must vote him. The problem with Nagas is especially similar. If I have an issue with someone on one issue, I will be against him on a totally unrelated issue. Now I see many comments. Now when I speak, you speak out against the origins. Just because I spoke up once or twice against the origins. Now they are against me whether I speak out against corruption or against me. Whether I speak out against the other wrong things against me. So this attitude, we must learn to change this attitude, okay? You may not agree with a person on a certain issue. But if on another issue you agree with him, then you must vote him. And there has always been my deal. People are quite surprised. Sometimes I support someone on one issue, sometimes on another issue I support another person. So you must learn to discern the issues and to give the support. You must learn to understand. That just because someone out there, your parents or someone is elder than you. It does not necessarily mean that he is right or that you have to follow him. You have to learn to make decisions for yourself. Regarding the service, the rights of a woman. See, not us traditionally, I don't think we have suppressed women to the extent that others are fighting sad. The reason why women were left to reserve was because they had healthy. And women's heads were more priced because they were more perfect. Now, when you look at lack of families across tribes, I don't think there are many instances where the parents deprive the girl of education because of financial problems. You see, either girl or boy, whoever is the thing, are more capable of going to sit and do further education. With regard to ULB, I was always against the 33% reservation during the covers time. Not because I am anything against women, but because when you implement that, that means 33% of the consumencies are always there for women. Men cannot understand those consumencies. So the reverse discrimination principle comes with great. Men are discriminated against. Reverse discrimination is called reverse discrimination. So I wrote an article, 2017, where I brought up this concept of look sabar or just sabar, sort of thing. So, say there are 10 consumencies. So there are 10 wars in the town. So combine two wars, each one for women to contest for. So the order will go once. One for my ward, one for the woman. I don't know if you get my concept, but you have 10 wars. So in the 10 wars, there are 10 consulates. 10 consulates, whether it be man or woman. But for the woman, say ward one and two will be combined to form a woman, a ward woman contest. Say one and two, three and four, five and six, seven, eight, nine times. So that comes up to 33%. So there will be 10 open things, wards and five reserved women. And the order will go twice. One for the thing. If I'm from ward one, I will vote once for my ward member and one more time for the woman. Now, the vote for ward two also will vote twice. But this vote will be counted separately in the sense for ward one and two separate, and for ward one and two combined for women. So that is the concept I think. Okay, so another question would be, would there ever be a female gambora, a female gambora? See, Sumis, we have the concept. Okay, where if the chief dies and leaves a young child, then his wife and the groom in his place until the sun comes up each. But regarding other times, I don't think there's ever been death. No, what I mean is the traditional governing system, okay? Now, the washing is, why can they be whooping the washes? The washes are just interpreters. No, we don't have so fast. But we can. But the problem is this washing system. I've had this before in my college. This is again one of the biggest institutions of injustice in Ireland. It does not affect us, but it affects the beliefs. This is the washes that act like the be-all and end-all of customary law. And even this law, I came across a law, a textbook, which says that a judgement by the worship court is the ultimate judgement, which is patently false because I have challenged them and I have won against them. So this debauchy thing, the system needs to be streamlined, qualifications are important. Now, this takes me to another interesting observations. You have been speaking about the customary laws. I have studied our customary laws, even I am very much familiar with the Santam customary laws also. So what I found was with my limited knowledge that each tribe has its own customary laws, and I have talked about the period of time, different perspectives. Maybe some commonalities might be there, but customary laws are distinctly different. Even if you compare the community's customary law, community's perspective to the world, how their system has evolved over the period of time, I am familiar with that also. So the community's customary law is totally different from the our very endemic customary law. Now, coming back to the debate regarding the constitution, how this considering the diversities that we have, when every other tribe evolved distinctly in a fortified environment as an independent republic over the period of thousands of years, and they evolved their own legal system also in the context of the customary law, right? How that varieties of laws, how that diversity are going to be incorporated in the discourse of the yazaabu. I just want to know that. See, this is what I mean about the yazaabu. The Indian constitution in Haudenosaunee has given us the right to practice our customary laws. So we don't need the yazaabu to tell us that. And the yazaabu, as I said earlier, they are two totally different yazaabus. The NNC and GM yazaabu, which takes into consideration the customary laws of the different tribes. And the NNC yazaabu, which totally takes away all customary laws, all rights. Now, regarding the thing that references in the customary law of the two tribes, I propose that all criminal laws should come under the IDC. And civil laws, especially landing ratings, like every tribe, if it's all the customary law, that will create a long way into it, taking away the confusion of the customary law. Because we have to understand that our customary law, especially criminal cases, is very primitive. Because Naga didn't have much crime. Hardly any rape, hardly any murder, a small theft that deals only three crimes. So, in a modern society, you cannot cover all the crimes under these three laws. So, the state assembly should pass laws of this. Okay, sir. Regarding your view on the party three percent, I think there is a little bit in this understanding, in the sense that the reservation of thirty-three percent doesn't mean that thirty-three percent seat will be directly owned by the woman. That means, if we say that it is MLA seat thirty-three percent, thirty-three percent of the seat will be directly given to a woman. They will contest that if they won't, they will be in the MLA. And if they don't, they will be in the MLA. Therefore, I think this reservation needs to be reconsidered, especially regarding the woman reservation. Because in the other state also, they practice it, and if the woman won't, then it's okay. And the man also can contest, and the man can also win the seat. So, therefore, I think there's a little bit in this conception. Sir, I think when you talk about thirty-three percent reservation, it means that thirty-three percent of the seats are only for women to contest it. Man cannot contest it. It's not a mistake. Are you sure? Because in that event, you don't need reservation for women. They can contest anything. I think the way we have reservation for the, you know, the Chevrolet Cast candidates, right? And there are some consequences without the Chevrolet Cast. And no other candidate can contest on that. Okay. Like, for example, there are four parties. Specific constituents deserve for that specific category. Then all the candidates belong to different parties, belong to that category, can only contest that. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, this is what the idea is. I think women, what do you say? Like, women reservation will also be like that? Yeah. They have, like, thirty-three percent reservation seats. And that means they will be given the candidates seat. And if they are elected then, they are elected. If they are not elected, then they are not elected. See, again, what Professor Aniruddha, he's saying that, he's also agreeing with me in the fact, in the sense that it is deserve only women. What you are saying is that the political parties will select only women. Yeah. So it comes out to say, this is a women, that's why only women are going to contest. They contest in the other seats. Okay. Yeah. Thirty-three percent is a reserved woman and they can contest in the other seats, six percent. Yeah. I think that's what you're meaning. What thirty-three percent is reserved for? We have so many things to discuss, but due to tight constraints, we will put it close to this. I'll start with one question. Since you have emphasized so much on egalitarian society and as you mentioned in your speech, that the root cause of corruption, the root cause of our society's men in today's corruption and the vicious cycle continues. And so if you have envisaged the idea of an egalitarian society, what would be the first step that we should take to move towards an egalitarian society? It's my question. See, I believe the government of India has programs which try to address this thing. We want to take society. So for us, it is for us to see that it is implemented in full and properly. I think that's the only root cause. Economic freedom is the most important freedom. Without economic freedom, no other freedom is going to work well. So unless we improve the living standards of the poor, we cannot move, achieve, egalitarian and gross society. Thank you, sir. It was really nice having you. We all had a thought-provoking session and we have learned a lot from you. We continue to support you and we continue to look forward. Put our trust on you that one day you will bring a change to our society. Thank you. Thank you so much. Honorable guest speaker, respect to teachers and students. On behalf of the Department of Political Science, I would like to thank you for sharing your thoughts about denial issues and speaking so clearly and passionately about all the issues. And I feel that one of the major contributions that such interaction would have in society is that it produces a dialogue among the society about issues. You may have differences or opinions. Some may be in favour, some may be in against, but nevertheless what is the need of the R is to have a dialogue among the different tribes, among the society in relation to all the other stakeholders. I would also like to thank the organiser, especially Dr. Irtha, Larry Day, for managing the event quite well. I would also like to specially mention our insistence who actually did a tremendous job in organising and helping us in all the tidbits of this event. And I would also like to thank the students for making this interaction very interesting for asking very relevant questions, including our teachers. And I think this, belonging from the Political Science Department, I would like to say that having such interaction is actually what defines the society towards actually moving on, bringing change, that is what we aspire towards. So following the tradition, I would like to again thank you each and everyone, and again to Mr. Dr. Jeejee for sharing your time with us. Having such an elaborate discussion with each and everyone, so thanks so much, and thank you everyone.