 I'm from the Martin E. Seedle Theatre Center and one of the few times where we are not at the Graduate Center CUNY in New York City, but we are in Guadalupe at the moment and we are in the Cultural Center. So Nice here on the island in Buster, if I understand that right, and we are here with everybody to talk about our work and our book that we put together. It's called New Place from the Caribbean. It's a very important book for us is one of the most significant and energizing projects we have ever done. I think in the history of the Seedle Theatre, we had playwrights from Haiti, Martin E. and Guadalupe coming to New York City. It was our last event, our last big event actually before the time of Corona. After that we had one talk and everything had to shut down. And as everybody in the world we are catching up and tonight at today, we are talking about the experience of this project about writing for the theater and for performance here in the Caribbean. And with us we have playwrights, we have producers and arts managers. So I welcome Eddie, who is working here at the Center, Elvia, who runs the company Zeejab, Zeejaj, Guy Regisse from playwright from Haiti who was in Paris. This is the great Stephanie Berra, who initiates the project together with us, Danieli, who is with us from Martinique, Gael, Octavia, Magali, and Charlotte. So it's really a fantastic little impression from the work we have been doing. And to start the project off, I would like to give the word to Eddie Comper, who runs the center here, the cultural center, so nice. Eddie, tell us a little bit, where are we here? We are in Guadeloupe, the French West Indies and at Sony. Sony is one of its local located in Abim. Abim is the heart, I think the heart of Guadeloupe because Abim is the middle of Guadeloupe. And Sony is an equipment from the agglomeration Capexelos. It's three-town Abim, point-à-pique, point-à-pique the commercial center in Guadeloupe, and BMAO is the industrial center. It's an equipment who study, dance, music, and theater. And we do show because we have a place of 250 people who can make sure. And it's a place where you can learn the teach and you can perform on the stage because we have a stage. I'm the director. Sony is a 34 professor, a dance, music, and theater. And administrative, we have about 20 people. That's one of the major good plays in Guadeloupe. I invite everybody who's across Guadeloupe to come and see us and performing in our stage. Fantastic. Yeah, we're going to talk with you again next Friday when we talk about the play. And we did hear the tale of black histories. And Elvia, you are the leader or you run the company, Siage, tell us a little bit how you are connected to Sony's and about the project. Well, thank you for this opportunity. Well, actually, we've been working with Eddie Comper since a long time ago. We had the past last production that was co-produced by Eddie Comper, the Centro Cultural Sonnese, and with the National School of Art in Korea. And now we are continuing with the other projects with this exciting project of art about what we're going to talk about later, how we're going to bring this project of art here in Guadeloupe. And so, and also we are also we have this other project of going on, a story of black history. So that is going to be presented very soon. And so far, well, just the company was created in 2002, and is co-directed by Gilber Le Mord. And so it's a Caribbean company inspired by the, in all the productions by this popular tradition and multi, multi, multi-ciplinarity, whether music, dance, theater, storytelling and the trail. Fantastic. Again, you know, we're going to talk about the project that we did in New York where we had six readings with six directors, New York actors putting together those plays. And we at the Segal Center feel it is of utmost importance to listen to voices from the Caribbean. Interestingly enough, the largest group of immigrants in New York City and city of about 12, 13 million people is not Asian American, African American or Latino American. The largest group is actually Caribbean artists and people, workers from Haiti, Cuba, Jamaica, Puerto Rico, Dominican Republic, all the countries. And so we feel it is important that what we see on stages represents the makeup of a city, the stories of the people, and we don't really see them. Interestingly enough, if we understand right the first time ever even French speaking playwrights from the Caribbean were to present it together in one festival. The history of theater was in our Segal Theater Center. And I would like to ask Stephanie Vera, who is joining us from Paris, a professor of theater who initiated with us the program. Stephanie, why do you put your life's work? Why did you focus on theater of the Caribbean and tell us a little bit about the project? Thank you, Frank, for inviting me and for making it possible to have act taking place in New York. I've been working on Caribbean Theater for, I don't know, maybe 20 years now, more than 20 years. I did my PhD on the theater from Guadeloupe and Martinique written in Creole and French. And I had the pleasure to live in Guadeloupe for many years and establish connection with the playwrights, with the companies, that's how I met Siage when I was doing my fieldwork for my PhD. And since then we have been working together with the company Siage to bring Caribbean Theater in the United States where I was teaching for many, many years. They came to Maine with a play by Marie Skondé. They came to Charlottesville also in Virginia. And we've been working with Elvia to promote Caribbean Theater outside of the Caribbean perimeter and not only in connection with Metropolitan France. And every time we were facing the same issue as to the language, you know, they came to the United States and performed in French and in Creole with English subtitles. And what we were thinking of is that translation is a good way, a good tool to make this theater accessible to an outside audience, you know. So I had been working with you, Frank, on two projects at the Martin Segal Theater. And I came, you know, it was in 2017, if I remember well. And we talked about how it would be possible to have, you know, this place from the Francophone Caribbean translated into English and you open the doors. And we built, you know, a team of readers to select six plays. You know, there was a pool of 25 plays, I think. And we selected six plays, two from Guadeloupe, two from Martinique, two from Haiti. The point was to promote not only established writers, playwrights, but also a new generation, and to have parity between female writers and male writers, and to have also contemporary themes, topics that could connect the world with the American world. So I think, you know, we managed to put together with your help and with Martin Segal and the embassy, the French embassy, a pool of writers, translators, and also directors from New York and actors who were able to make it alive on stage and have the playwrights come to New York in 2019 just before the COVID. So we were lucky enough, we didn't know at that time that all the doors would be closed. And that was a great, great adventure. So I'm happy now to have the playwrights talk about his experience and Guy, don't worry. Guy, don't worry. Well, thank you, Stephanie. It was, I think, a great electrifying experience, actually, lots of audiences with, you know, people working with us, a big team, and I thought and felt it was something very, very meaningful. So now to the playwrights, and you could perhaps talk a little bit about you, your work where you come from, but also we are interested, not just about the play so, but also how are you now, how is writing for the theater in the moment, how do you feel in this time of Corona? I spoke with some of you also with our Seagull Talks in between, but maybe, Danieli, we start with you. How are you now? How is your work going? What do you remember from New York? Did it have an impact on you? I'm fine. I'm fine. I'm still writing, and I was, and I remember New York as a moment like a dream. I don't know. It was just crazy for me that a play that I wrote in Martinique about a character like La Diabless, who is a character from our imaginary, Caribbean imaginary. would be presented and translated and presented in New York. It was just very interesting for me because it was a moment of meeting, also the Caribbean in New York, and to see that for them too, this character was something big and interesting. And for me, it was very, as we say, encouraging, encouraging. That my playwright move to New York and open itself to the others. It was really good for me. And since New York, I was hoping to go back to New York, Frank, to theater, but the COVID came and it was a moment of writing for me. I wrote another playwright in another experience of playwright. More familial, more about familial and history. The link between historical violence and family violence now in Martinique or in Guadalupe. Because for me, there is a link between historic violence and history and violence today in families and in Timothy. Thank you. And by now I'm writing a little play for the Avignon Festival this year because they asked me to write a little play about 30 minutes to present in the festival. Fantastic. Very good. Regis, we can come to you. I think you're still on mute. Yes, you're on. You travel all around the world. You're very established artists from the Caribbean. What did this festival mean to you? What did you observe or learn or what did you take with you and what are you working on now? I've reached a translation. You're a very well-known author. What does this experience mean to you from the Act Action Caribbean Theatre project mean to you to have one of your pieces translated in English and published in a rocker? What does this experience mean to you and what are you working on today? It's a very good experience because I'm still in contact with Kanesa. He asked me to write a text about immigration. I was free. So I sent him a text. There was this presence in New York, this meeting with her, and the same translation I had before for the father. This is Judith Miller, who is now in the retreat. So it was really a very consistent and extraordinary process. And now I'm going to work on a long project, very long in Bordeaux. I'm going to talk about it tomorrow in Bordeaux. I'm going to work on the Bible of development, which is a long text with the city's characters who intervene on this issue of monument in public space. And I want it to be a project that takes place in public space. And so to work with Kanesa on the performance in public space. And then inside, there are other things. It's like a lot of my projects, a little impossible to reach because I wanted to intervene in 250 characters. At the size of the city of Bordeaux because Bordeaux is 250,000 at the time. And so that's what I'm working on right now. I'm working with a director who will stage, you know, the, his play. De toute la terre, Le Grand Tiffin. And they are still working on new project together. It was also very pleased to have Judith Miller as a translator. She was a translator of one of his play, Le Père, the father. He was more retired and so he was happy that she could translate another play by him. He's currently working on a very large project in Bordeaux, in France, about people in the city and how to place monuments in the public space. And to have performance, public performance outside on the street with more than 250 people. So that's a very ambitious project to 250 people outside in the street of Bordeaux for a city of 250,000 people. So it's, as we know, Bordeaux is connected with a slave trade. So it's also very symbolic to have to have a play stage in Bordeaux by Girurgis Junior. The new project is Biblue du déboulonnement. And I must say that déboulonnement, I don't know how to translate it in English, how to deconstruct the Bible of this construction in a way. Fantastic. Thank you. Gael, tell us a little bit about you. Yes. I think your internet is not working at the moment. Gael, we can't hear you. Maybe first we go to Magali and Charlotte, maybe those of you. Gael, we cannot hear you. Unfortunately, I couldn't attend the... We cannot hear you. Let's make it right. Maybe it will get back. Let's start first with Magali and Charlotte. You can't hear me at all? No. I will try without the... Try to sign out and sign back in, please. And we go to Magali and Charlotte. Tell us a little bit where you are at the moment and what do you remember from the time in New York? And you are mute? For us, the three days spent in New York were very rich. We also listen to other pieces that our piece was heard for the first time in English. We are always in touch with Florent Massé from Princeton to see what we could put in place with him for the rest, maybe for the day we were allowed to do other things. And our piece, The Day by Fazok, was played last year at the Chapelle du Verbe incarné. If you translate first, or you speak English, yeah? Stephanie, you are mute. It was Charlotte. So Charlotte, Magali. Magali just said it was a wonderful experience to be in New York, to have the opportunity to hear their play translated and stayed read in English, but also to listen, to have the opportunity to listen to other Caribbean plays, to meet other Caribbean playwrights. So this gathering of all Caribbean playwrights in New York was a big event for them. They are still connected in relationship with Florent Massé from Princeton University who directed the play and are trying to have project, future project with Princeton or with Florent Massé. Their play, the play which was translated and stayed played in New York, Le jour où mon père Mathieu was performed in Avignon last year at the Chapelle du Verbe incarné. And thanks to Mélia Parenteau, who is our translator of the play, we are in touch with The Voyager Theatres Company. Before Covid, they had the project of setting up the play and for the moment it is in standby. There was a lecture organized during Covid, a lecture with two comedians and a live lecture with a lot of people who connected to a certain time and a virtual lecture of the play. So they are still in relationship with Mélia Parenteau, who was the translator of their play. They have established connection also with The Voyager Theatres Company. And they have the project to have their plays performed in the US. Before that, during the time of Covid, there was a reading, an online reading of the play with American actors from this company, Voyager Theatres Company. Yes. And since then, we have played at the Avignon Festival, right? Yes. Yes, we played at the Avignon Festival last July. With The Day My Father Killed Me. Yeah, so this was before the Seagal, we had the Seagal event before and then it went to the Avignon Festival. I think we should come back later on your play because it showed the complexity and perhaps also failures. You know, how to start, how to direct something, how to do something right, how to honour the spirit of the play. But again, can we try if we can hear you now? You can hear me now? Yes. Okay. Okay, I don't know what happened. So as I was trying to say, I couldn't attend the reading of the play. It was when it was in 2020, it was already in 2019, already, in New York. It was very, of course, I have a lot of regret not to be able to come because I saw the video of the reading and it was really wonderful. But we still had the, I kept the contact with Lucy. Lucy Tibergien was the director of the play. And there was another time of reading, of public reading of the play. And so Lucy continued to work on the play with her students and with her team. And there was another reading of the play in Brooklyn, in Prospect Park. In the Molière in the Park program with Molière plays and contemporary plays, something that Lucy Tibergien put together, contemporary theatre with Molière theatre. It's a way to show how Molière is still very, very contemporary in reality, the theme. So this program acts really begin something, begin a really deep contact and sharing of work with Lucy and thinking about theatre, about the play. And I hope that maybe someday she will make a real production of it, not only a reading, but the readings were very, so I couldn't attend it because it was. You know, there's a lot of energy in the room, a great interest, one could feel something new emerging that hadn't been done and also French cultural services, Nicole and Laurent really were helpful. Judith Miller was involved in so many, we also had drama talks working with us. A question to all of you as playwrights. How does it feel at the moment, in this moment in time to be a playwright from the Caribbean, and to write for theatre and performance. What has changed since 2019 it's incredible to think that 2019 20 when we did this is almost three years ago, and to be only catching up now but what has changed how is writing for the theatre as a Caribbean writers for you what does it mean for you at the moment is a new awareness and it's open question and maybe just Stephanie you translated for Charlotte Magali and Giso they hear Yes Magali So Magali Solinia just said that the COVID just stopped all the projects. So it was a time of a suspended time where they couldn't really achieve and make possible the project they had. And when things started again they had to, to lead not only one but two but several projects which was a very intensive time of production of working. Fortunately, the French state offered helps financial helps so that they could lead, you know, several projects and now they, they have they are just, you know, again running. Their project and feeling back to to a to a life of creativity and production. Maybe my situation is a little bit different from the others, because I'm just a writer. I think that all of you are also directors or actors. And so maybe it didn't change a lot. Maybe it changed more things the COVID I mean to change the moral things for the others. Because I'm always in this situation of waiting for somebody to take my, my place and and produce them because I don't do it myself. And of course, the COVID had an impact. For example, another play I wrote after family was Rhapsody, which made a tour in Africa and which was supposed to be performed in Paris but which couldn't be performed in Paris because of COVID in 2021. But I think that it did maybe didn't impact the pure question of writing things because I, I, I, I continued to write to write plays after and without knowing if it could be produced or performed, but it's, it's, it's already like this for me, actually. When I found the most, as a real disturbing element in this COVID period is that, as the world has become a small village at that time, countries like Haiti were much more fragile actually. Because of the disease, but because of the fact that it became more difficult for the Haitians to circulate in the world. We took advantage of the COVID period to tighten up all the, all the possibilities of travel, visas. It's much more difficult to, to go from one country to another. What makes me as a creator, it's the first time I asked myself the question, it's impossible for an Haitian to naturalize. In any case, it's impossible for me. And it was still, I missed, for example, a year of work in Canada because they took a lot of time to give me the visa. For a year, they didn't give it. I had my visa only now. They pushed it back for 2025. It has never been so hard for the Haitians to travel. I suppose it must be for other countries. That's it. Let's translate maybe a little bit. Wait, hold the start and we'll come back. So, I just said that the COVID was huge, had a huge effect on the whole world. You know that for the world that the world became a little village, as he said, and for precarious nations such as Haiti, they became even more fragile. Because it was more and more difficult to travel around the world. And the conditions for Haitian people to visit other countries was highly, highly restricted in terms of visa. He himself as a creator, as a playwright, as an artist or writer, he started to think about taking another nationality, another citizenship, what he didn't consider before. He took the example of Canada. He was invited to spend one year in Canada. And they took so many time to make the decision to allow to give him the visa that it had to be postponed for 2025. It's still going on today. Even if there is an opening, I don't know if you remember, the United States closed for a long time. Even with Biden, it was still closed. You can't imagine the circulation of an Haitian artist. And in addition, with the current situation, it's good that Haitian people are leaving. They're leaving even more. And so it's a very complicated situation on this side, in any case. After me, I'm not complaining at all because I was able to make my creations. The two creations, just like Maghri said earlier, so there was a booting. I had to make two creations in the same night. The five times I saw my father, he mounted a cathedral in Soveli because it was a booting. We're going to say that it's great to have made two shows in the same year. But there is one thing that is indeniable for me. It's that I want to be able to circulate by staying necessarily in France to make my creations. I also want to make my creations in Haiti or in Canada or elsewhere. That's what it's all about. So he explained that, in fact, they took, you know, in a way, the excuse of closing down the borders to make it even more difficult. Stephanie, at the moment, we cannot hear you. So maybe also. Can you hear me now? Yes. No, maybe sign back in again and then you translate. I'm going to go out and try to sign back in. It's who knows why I'm not sure why. But if you can, can you hear me? Yeah, it's not working. Not working at all. Try to sign back in and let's ask maybe Eddie and Elvia to touch on something. No. Try to sign back in, please. And Eddie, what we heard a little bit from the complications, you both present Caribbean artists in Caribbean world and go to loop Eddie you also a music producer and pictures, but how is the connection to the world how difficult is it or how easy is it. How is the respect and how are invitations. How are you connected to the outside world. Yeah, maybe you can start. Do you hear me? Do you hear how the connections are made with the world? I think it's. I think it's. Stephanie, she came back. She came back. I think Stephanie. I think Stephanie is back. Let's back and he can translate the answer. You want me to translate what he said. Yes, please say again. Guy Regi Juneux just said that the sanitary protection measures that were taken for all the people in the world during the time of COVID made an effect on how difficult it became for Haitian people to get out of the country. even with Biden, you know, it was really impossible for Haitian people to get out of Haiti. The situation, the current situation, economical, political turmoil make, you know, people, Haitian people want to get out of Haiti. So the restriction and the protection of borders are even stronger. He said that for himself, he cannot really complain because as an established playwright, he's allowed to travel and he was able to produce two plays, you know, in one year after the COVID. But he wants to be able to travel around the world and to be able to create his plays, not only in France, but in Haiti and outside. So the freedom to travel and produce everywhere is kind of threatened by the closing of borders. Yeah. It's a very difficult situation always, but now especially for Haiti, it is so complicated. Elvia, can you hear us? Sometimes it's cutting a little bit. Yeah. Tell us a little bit. You also present Caribbean work, a specialist theater. You normally also try to connect to France, but the world is bigger. How is it? How easy is it to connect Caribbean work to the world, to the global world? Well, in a way, I would say that you really have to be stubborn in order to be able to succeed because the connections in the Caribbean are quite difficult. It's much easier to go to Paris or to go to the U.S. to travel among the islands. So we really have to have like a spirit, a militant spirit to go to really be able to make all these connections. But I think that the spirit is strong enough and it's because it comes from all the diaspora and this necessity to be connected and to keep this spirit alive. It's connected with the, well, with the Mother Earth. Yeah. But we've been very privileged to work with Cuba, with Eugenio Mendes Espinoza. We also have several projects also in Haiti. And in that also allowed us to go really beyond and also to be somehow repérée, to be noticed, to even be noticed by another continent that I would never imagine that we would work like for Korea, the National University of Korea, that offered Gilbert the possibility to teach his vision of the Caribbean theater. And from that, we were able to build another production with this institution and in connection with Eddie Comperre. So how are the connections to France and Canada, French-speaking countries or Belgium? Is there an interest in the work of Caribbean? Well, actually, I realized because I lived in Paris for 16 years. And I realized how difficult it is when I came to live in Guadeloupe. And when the company, well, the company was created in 2002. So it was, it had a label, this national label of Compagnie Convolutionné. So I thought it was going to be very, very, very easy and smooth to travel all around the world. I mean, because of course we were, we have this ambition as a young company in 2002. And actually when I had a meeting with, to introduce the company to La Citule Francais. So I really realized how difficult it was to this, I mean, the doors when I used to work in Paris, it made connections with the Latin American companies. And so they were really open, even if they didn't know what was the background of the directors. And we were a Guadeloupe company with a label, a national label of the Ministry of Culture. But we didn't have this opportunity. So I really, to really be able to make connections with the U.S., I had to myself just call and call the French services to just to introduce the company. And then from there we really, the starting point was in San Francisco. And then actually the cultural attaché from the French council in San Francisco. So he, the following day I call him, he just received us with the whole team. And he told me, well, Elvia, if you want, if you want to really build a project, go to New York and in Chicago. And then from there, so thanks to this connection, I was able to build a project with Marie Skondé. And it ended up to be a tour in five states of the U.S. and with Marie Skondé and giving also lectures in links with the French embassy, with the network of U.S. universities and well. So it's not easy. It's not easy. I know some people, French people also, you know, artists say, oh, I don't know, are there playwrights in the Caribbean? I haven't heard of it. And it is a bit shocking, actually, the attitude. And we all need to listen to these stories, you know, also what we can learn from the Caribbean experience, from the way they are connected to natures, to the ancestors, to the ghosts, to the spiritual, all that we talk about in the new time we live now in the Anthropocene. We say we live entering a new world where we have to completely rethink to survive as mankind. And I think there's a lot we can learn and understand from an experience of Caribbean nations, artists and people. My question again to everybody, all the writers, do you feel more politicized? Do you feel more more anger? Do you feel more courage? How is the experience for you to write as what is now in some way also a minority language, French, but also a minority within the French writing in French cultures? If you could translate a bit, Stephanie. Do you still feel a minority within the French culture as a writer? Can I answer in French? It will be easier. I would say yes, that is to say that as an artist, as an artist, I am also a writer and writer. So I produce projects. I feel that it is very difficult, as Elvia said, to enter the French hexagonal market, French nationality when we come from the Caribbean. There are sometimes openings and curiosity, but often from the closure. I think again, I let you translate. So Danieline Francis just said that as a playwright, as an actress, as a director, she produces a lot of projects, you know, theater projects, and she finds it really, really difficult to open up to French hexagonal, you know, metropolitan France stage, that there is a kind of curiosity from the part of the French producers, but also a lot of neuro-mindness that people tend to have a limited perspective, you know, closing what the Caribbean means. So it is challenging for her to have a place produced, even if now she has been invited to the Avignon Festival and the program IN, you know, the biggest, very prestigious festival d'Avignon. I think it is a political act for me, finally. Resonance, it is political, that is to say that when I am invited to the Avignon Festival, what do I mean? What do I mean? It is important for me to bring an authentic word. I could be positioned as an artist, very short, but I can only be positioned as an artist of the Caribbean and of the Francophone Caribbean and of the Martinique, in particular, because I think there is still a colonial look on us. There is still this colonial look. We are waiting for a certain speech, we are waiting for a certain place, and I think we have to go a little bit with the dynamite, we have to go with a spirit of rebellion in this establishment. We have to go with a rebellious spirit. Danieli just said that it is easier for her to perform abroad, you know, in foreign countries than to be invited in France. So the opportunity to have the possibility to present a text, to stage a text in the Avignon Festival has a political dimension, and she feels that she has to bring a sincere, authentic work so that she can, in a way, embody not only female artists, but also an artist coming from the Caribbean and coming from Martinique. She still believes that French, metropolitan French, tend to have a new colonial gaze on what is produced, what is coming from the Caribbean. So she wants to make all the cliché, all the stereotypes, you know, explode in a way and to go there with a spirit of resistance, of rebellion against the establishment. With the peace, that is to say, to be whole, to stay whole, to stay whole and to go wholeheartedly. But I have the impression, with this question, to finish, that my two writings since we met in 2019, yes, they are charged with a political commitment, yes, there is a political commitment in what I have written since 2019. So now she realizes with this question that since 2019, the two texts she has written have a political dimension. They are militant texts and activism, yeah, and engage in activism. What are the stigma of politics in our bodies and in our spaces? It is really what leads what I have written. What are in the way the political imprint, you know, that remains, that we explore in her theatrical rights and in her play. Same question to everyone. What has changed? What do you feel urgent? What is important now to write about? And when I go to the Avignon Festival, for example, I can't go to the Vébencarné chapel. Because I have the impression that what I am going to see in this space, there is always a very strong political message. And in the rest of the French theater, we don't necessarily hear this discourse there. I'm sorry to say it, but more and more, I realize that it is still an extremely beautiful place. There is an intro to it, but already in the teams that constitute all the directions of the theaters. There is much more diversity in this place. There is more and more in relation to the place of women, but there is very little in relation to the rest of the world. But I can say that it is really the image of the French society, in fact, which is exactly the same in the theater. And when there is a room that works very well and that we say to go see, I wait for a proposal. And in fact, it's always mine, in fact. It's always non-realistic. I've been seeing a room for a long time, a young person on stage, where everyone talks and everything. I arrive and say, well, it could be interesting. In fact, from beginning to end, it's not that I shit myself, but I tell myself, what does it say? And we are like bubbles, spaces like that, bubbles that exist in the world with the Caribbean and the history. We will not go with it. There are also good players in the Caribbean, but I don't think they are in the middle of the room. Okay, so what he is saying is that he agrees with Danieli about the content of the play, what theater talks about, the political, social engagement. And he says, when he goes to the Châtel d'hiver d'un Carlin Navignon, which is a specific theater to promote all the plays from the Outre-mer, he says that it's different from what he sees in other French theaters. He believes that the French cultural milieu is highly bourgeois and self-centered, that the people who direct theater, they know each other. So it's a kind of very small world, that there is no space for diversity, even if it's changing in the terms of making it possible for women to access certain positions. He says that this theatrical world, which is bourgeois and self-centered, it's just reflecting the French society that is really highly, not really, I don't know how to translate that, but to look at themselves, but not to be open to the world. And he went to see the play recently in Paris and he was wondering what does it tell us about the world, you know, and he was not convinced that every French place can make it possible to think about what's happening in the world outside of France, that is just making it limited to their own little space and little issues. I often call it after Floyd. After Floyd's death, there was a lot of movement, racism about the Blacks and all that. After the literary release, there was only one book written on the subject in France, and it was a book by Naïcien, and it's still very strong because I thought it was going to save the Empire, at least the French Empire in the world, because it really concerns France, but in fact it was very, very quickly swept away. Or I go to Thomas two years ago, it's there that I'm going to see a little piece that talks about the French nuclear, of all the nuclear tests they did in Polynesia. The comedy was not beautiful, but why do I never hear this subject in the French theater? It's extremely interesting, isn't it? It's a really important subject, in fact. It's trying to slide. So Guy said that we think that French people do not want to hear, to listen, to be open to what's happening outside. It took two examples, one that are very symptomatic of this narrow-mindedness, and one is after the death of George Floyd. He said that all over the world there were movements against racism, and he just noticed that when all the books you know in the fall, when you have all the new books coming out, in France there was only one talking about this topic, and it was one book written by Biohation. So he said that France just want to avoid to talk about certain topics, and one of them is racism. Another example he took is he saw a small play two years ago which addresses the topic of the nuclear essays in Polynesia, which you know is highly problematic, and that no playwrights address this topic of nuclear essays, and that was a place. It was a play written by Parquay. I would say I don't remember, but it was a good company. He was talking about the problem of the nuclear in Ocean Indian, and how the French government used their power to do bad things and asked to put on the table and nobody knew exactly what happened, but I don't miss. Eddie, how is it for you? How do you feel as a presenter, someone who runs a cultural center, who gives space to artists, but you also, I know you work a lot with musicians, how do you feel? How is the connection to the world from the Caribbean or Guadalupe or Martinique? How do you feel? For us it's very important to have a connection over the world, because our market is small. We build some plays and you ought to play outside, but I think I'm so glad that's about your questions, but I think we, without to ask, did the world with our story give us opportunity to not be politics and to not be militants when we show about music, dance, and theater? That, I think, this question is very important, because everybody's said the same when a small company in Guadalupe or Martinique or French Canada want to level, first level, want to communicate with the neighbors in the Caribbean. We have plenty, plenty problems to collect, to have a visa, to have a plane who travel between all the Caribbean. You are French and they are English or Spanish. You are not independent. They are independent. You couldn't take the decisions in Guadalupe. You need to go to Paris to take the decisions to make the connection. That's the first level. The second level, New York, states, France, Europe, Africa, we got the same perhaps, to travel and how they don't put you in a place only for the minority culture. You are not in the main stage. You are not in the main place because you are considered the minority culture. And so behind this, how do you do behind this? How do you fight for everybody? For one example, Kassav in music was full of zenith without French media, without French media. So now the things, how long will still to fight, to say everybody recognize we have a universal culture. But in so many ways we fight, we fight over this. We give, we give chance and our politics know to help the company to go to Korea. So we pay and we spend many money because for us it's in a political action. Because to go outside of Guadalupe because we need to look for new markets. And the world ought to be with us to know our culture. So we're still fighting on it. It's very important to fight on it. I wanted to add something about being a Caribbean writer in France. That is linked to what Daniel Lee and the other said. For example, the very last play I wrote is a comedy. In France you have two systems. You have the private theatres and the public theatres and it's two separated systems with the public theatres. It's maybe a caricature what I would say. It's very, you can have conceptual and experimental and intellectual theatre and what is considered like for the general public, it's the private theatre with comedies, not only but our plays performed by movie stars. So actors, people know very well because they come from the cinema and they are in the private theatre. So what I do is more for the public theatre. But the very last play I wrote is a comedy. And one of my friends who is a quite famous singer but she was also an actress but she's more known as a singer. She read it because she likes to read what I write. And she was like, oh, for the first time you wrote some things that is really, really for the general public. And it's a comedy. And she told me, oh, I know the director of a private theatre. And she told me, oh, it's a very good play for this kind of theatre, private theatre. So she gave with my permission, she gave the text to this man who is directing this private theatre. And he wrote, he read the play. So the play is a comedy but it takes place in Martinique and it's about autonomy and independence of Martinique. So it's political position. It's not because it's a comedy that it's not political. So the guy read the play and he said, oh, it's very good. It's very funny. It's hilarious. There is a good reason. It's perfect but the problem is that it takes place in Martinique. And he said that nobody in Paris, in his private Parisian theatre would be interested in the play taking place in Martinique. And it was the only objection he had about this play. And to me it was crazy because it's either it's a good play, either it's a bad one, but who cares if it takes place in Martinique? And why would the Parisian, and I think it's a prejudice, you know, about the public because I think that the general public is of course able and ready to see a play taking place in Martinique. But it's the people who decide which plays are supposed to be performed in which theatres. It's these people that think that a play about autonomy of Martinique will not be interesting for the Parisian public, which is, I think, not true at all. But it's an example of the problem, you know, we're talking about. Charlotte, Magalie, how is that all for you? I mean, but in fact, in what way can it disturb the fact that it takes place in Guadeloupe? Because in fact, the stories are universal. In the end, even if you point your finger at certain certain places, certain subjects that are itinerant to Guadeloupe or to the Caribbean, but it's universal and it allows, and often the public, when we play modern Parisian, for example, they tell us that they are happy with the fact that it happens elsewhere. In fact, it makes them feel good because it also disconnects them even more from reality and they can enter more into history. And by the way, I'm cutting you in two seconds, but you say at the very beginning of the play, we added a sort of prologue where Magalie tells in what context we wrote the play, all the two. She addresses the public and tells that. And at the end of her play, it takes place in Guadeloupe, but it can happen anywhere. In fact, it takes place in Guadeloupe, it could happen in New York, it can happen in... Well, that's it. In the end, we tell what we... The human comedy we tell, this human comedy could happen anywhere, in fact. And it's funny, it's actually a reproach that we did, a reproach for a theater that did not want to take us because it takes place in Guadeloupe. And for me, it's worse than that. That is to say that if we did a play that happens on the moon or on Mars or on Pluto, there would be no objection. Yeah, let's first translate. Magalie just said that they are facing the same problem as what Gaëlle was talking about, that a play which takes place, the plot takes place in Martinique and Guadeloupe, how can it be of interest for a French audience? So they still have to face this issue of making it possible to perform a play about Guadeloupe or about Martinique in a Parisian theater. And the fact is that when people come and see their play, that was a point in the La Voire Moderne Parisien, a small theater in Paris. The audience was perfectly fine with the fact that it was taking place in Guadeloupe. And in fact, it could take place anywhere, you know, not only Martinique, Guadeloupe or anywhere in the world. And the people would be interested. It's not the question of the place. Gaëlle was saying, you know, if it was taking place on Mars, maybe it wouldn't be a problem for the French directors and the people who are. Stephanie, as a question for you, as an intellectual, as a researcher at academia and teacher, how is the field of Caribbean theater performance, how is it regarded in France, but also outside the world where you are known as an expert? How do you see your field? Yeah, I must say that every time I was talking about my research on Caribbean theater, what was interesting is that the French, even the French scholars, I must say in theater, you know, when I went to conferences, they were always very surprised that there was a Caribbean theater, you know, they were not even, they couldn't even mention one name, not even Césaire, you know. So there was a kind of surprise and then, oh, is there a theater in the Caribbean? Even if we know that Martinique Guadeloupe or Port-au-France and that Haiti was, you know, the Black French. So there was this kind of suspicion about what kind of theater is staged there. And but I must say, when I travel to other countries, you know, to give papers in conferences or people are more inclined to be a curiosity and a real intellectual curiosity without the prejudice of a kind of minor theater, you know, a marginal theater, that's what I could experience. I must say that if I decided to do my PhD in on Caribbean theater in the US, is that because I got subsidized by American universities to work on Francophone Caribbean theater, I did a PhD in France where I didn't receive any money at all. So it was easier for me to get a position in American universities and in French universities. When I apply for jobs in France, I cannot apply for, there are several categories as academic, you know, departments. And as working on Francophone, I'm most of the time in comparative literature, but I cannot be included in French literature, even if, you know, Martinique and Guadeloupe are French. So it tells you something. And all the positions in academia, there are very, very few, even if it's changing, even when I taught, you know, at the Sorbonne Nouvelle and the seminar, they were fooled. I mean, the students were really, really interested in this, in this kind of theater. I think it's changing that now that we have a new director in the Avenue Festival, who comes from Portugal, you know, I think he has a different perspective, Thiago Rodriguez. What I can see on the new program is that all the political, you know, issues, all the colonial, also colonial, post-colonial issues are part, you know, of the program, the programation of the next festival in July. So that will be really interesting to see, you know, who has, like, Danieli Francis has been invited, which is new, Guille, you were also part of the in-festival. So I'm hoping, you know, that it will change. And yeah, I would like to add something. Yeah, I just want to point out that the experience, this long experience that we've had as a company with Stephanie was very precious and meaningful, because we were able to, when she invited us, the different universities where she worked, it was really a very rich experience for all the actors and directors to be surrounded by five departments that, at least five departments, that Stephanie were able to reunite around the project. And it was very interesting to see how, from different perspectives, how they perceived the place we brought. And yeah, so I would say that Stephanie also, that experience we've never lived in, I think it would be even difficult to live, to experience it in France. Yeah, so yeah. So I just want to say, it's just a testimony to see how, you know, the relation of a Caribbean company in the United States then, in comparison. An additional complication is that, as we had with the piece of Charlotte and Magali, when Princeton, Florian came, they don't have students who are black. They don't have students with this experience. So how do you do a play with, about, you know, what you, that complex play, that murder case, what you put up, you know, but your own student, but he doesn't reflect that, you know, and there would be much more happy to do, I guess, a 20th century French contemporary play about middle class problems, people sitting around a family table, you know, and discussing life and what it means to be French or not. So they are, it's so complex and so much is against you. My question is, there is, there are nations that also are closer to a Kipe Lagos, the idea of the Creole, there's like Indonesia, Japan is a nation of islands, perhaps China, you know, so how are their connections, are you actively reaching out, because one also has a feeling that you look to France for recognition, but the love is not returned in that way, you know, but are you now also at the moment where we say, we would like, we connect to other places of the world who might be interested in our, our work, our culture, our place and what we have to give to the world, because I believe in Caribbean is an important place in the world, not only because of Cluzon, others because, but the way of living is something, we all can learn something from it. Well, I just would like to say the experience that we had with Le Sac de Lita, which was co-produced by Eddie Comper, in KRS, Korea National University of Arts, what we experience is that actually we have more things in common with Korea than with France, because it's the relation with the ancestors, the drums, the storytelling, and so actually, and I remember it in, when we, because we presented this play in Avignon and the media, what, what are the questions that often came out is to, because they called, there was a co-director, Korean co-director, and they, they asked them, well, with whom you have more things in common with France, or with Waterloo, well, definitely with Waterloo, with all, for all the reasons that I just explained. But I want to just go into, to talking about what Elvia said, but for me today is necessary to have different points of view, different point to see. The Caribbean is big. When you're talking about Cuba, Trinidad, Jamaica, Republic, Republica Dominicana, Puerto Rico, we have many plenty of islands, and we have a biggest market. We, we touch, we start to touching now Africa, the French Africa, the English African, the Portuguese African, and Europe, even Belgium, Germany. So we have, we have some writers, some plays who can, interesting the world. We don't, we don't play, we don't do theater, writing theater for only for Caribbean people. We have story, universe story. So, so we had, we, we, we, we, it's necessary to talk to the world, and the world receive what, what I give us. And we can learn from the world, and the world can learn from us. That's why we love to continue to act in, in take place in Guadalupe and in the Caribbean, because it's a bridge. We need to build bridge over the world, because when we see how the world is changing, is in a trouble. Arts, theater, music, and, and the one can give the piece the world need now. And we, I think the Caribbean have to talk and have something to say to the world about, about this point of view. So the bridge is important. We are small islands, but big minds, that I want to say. Yeah, so we're coming closer to the end of our discussion. Anything anybody still wants to say or to add? I'm very interesting in, in, in talking to the, the entire world and, and we have, we, we are building bridges, as you said, between our small islands and the rest of the world. And our plays are read or performed in other countries. And of course, the French system in which we are, but it's not our choice, makes that it's, it's not easy for us to travel in, in other places easily without having a, a stop in Paris, for example, we can, we don't have direct lines between our islands and the rest of the world. But we would like to, we would like to travel more and to, to be in, and especially in the Caribbean. Personally, I have a big frustration of, of this Caribbean, you know, because I would like to be more connected and, and, and translations like this, this, this book of, of our plays translated in English, it's very, very important translation is very important for us because we are part of a multilingual, multilingualistic, I don't know how to say this, but we are really Caribbean people. And, and the Caribbean is, is a place where people speak a lot of languages. And it's important for us to, to be, to be read in those languages. So it's, it's a very important beginning, this translation in English, for example, for me, yes. I, I, I, I write about, I write about the mitigation, I write about my place, about the problems that I see, my family is a little scattered around, but at the same time it speaks, it speaks to humans. I, I, I, I, I, I, I don't even know the words, I, I, I don't go there because I know very well that I have had full, full, full, full examples before me and, because my place is played a little everywhere in the world and no longer, he no longer knows how to ask the question. It's what I, I, I, I get from my Caribbean place, I write, I write about, I can write about my wife, I can write about my mother, I can write about my father, and I have the feeling that I'm not there with the whole world, by writing that, in fact. Stephanie? He, so he just said that he's a little bit suspicious about the concept of universalism, about writing for the world. He said that, well, when Shakespeare wrote, he didn't really, he wasn't expecting to talk, you know, to the whole world. He wrote his plays and his plays are now, they talk about power, about domination, about violence, and they're still staged and read today, and Molière is the same, you know, so this, how do you say, objective is goal, to reach the world may not be, you know, the best one. He says, well, I'm, I'm talking from where I am, you know, it can be Haiti, I'm talking, I can write about my mother, about my father, but when I do that, I, I connect, you know, to the world without having to talk about universal topics or issues. Well, often a locality is the universitality, it's combined, and then it was interesting, we have something, this is very specific, and very local, but also global and universal. We are coming to the end, it's one of our longer talks again, this thank you all for participating in Stephanie, for being the editor of the book, The New Place from the Caribbean, so I encourage everyone really to, to look at it, and many other plays are there, it's just a short selection, and we will continue the project, one of the ideas we have in October, there will be readings of excerpts of the plays in here with Eddie at the festival here in Guadeloupe, and the Siage Company will help us to put together, we are thinking about creating perhaps a pan-Caribbean festival, 14-15 nations, you know, all together, this place, we cannot invite theater companies, which we should, but money isn't there, but we could perhaps create a festival, you know, it was plays from Cuba and Jamaica and Martinique, Haiti, to say this is a, you know, a region of the world we should listen to, and if we get this done, I'm happy to invite all these plays to come to New York, and we do a Carille Caribbean reading festival also in New York, that combines the English and French and Portuguese speaking countries, there's someone Akiba in Boston at Emerson College who heard about our project, listened to the postcards and saw the readings, and she created a 10-part series in response to the French speaking Caribbean plays, she did it for the English speaking countries, so it's already a big thing that happened that came out of it, so let's see what we can do to also foster playwriting, have a new generation of writers writing workshops, maybe you all can help us to do something to foster that energy and the creation, and theater in itself represents life, it represents the creative forces, what it means to feel alive, to be alive, it's the closest we can be, I think, to the experience of being human, and so this is very important to hear from this very unique place in the world and the Segal Center, we are very fortunate and honored to have stumbled into this, and it's an important lessons we have to learn and important stories we need to know about, and there has to be a representation on the stages of the world, everyone, especially also in New York City where such a large Caribbean community, and we don't hear them, we don't see it, and it is really wrong and we have to change it and we have to be part of the change, so thank you all and get the book, we're going to continue on Friday, we're going to talk about the play, the history of the Black the history of the Black people by Edouard Glissant, a project that we will talk about, Eddie is presenting the work here, we're going to have a talk with Florian Maltzaker from Berlin, he wrote about a new way to think about theater after the post-traumatic book from Hans-Tis Lehmann, perhaps an update on how to think about truly contemporary theater, he's a great curator and then next week we will hear from playwrights from the Ukraine and directors, it's the project that takes place in Boston and in New York and to see how theater artists react to global crisis and how can we make theater in the face of war and the face of violence and worse the place and what stories come out of place like the Ukraine, so thank you all for listening and it was a big group today but it was really worth it, it was an important discussion, thank you all for being so patient, to listen in to all our viewers who listened to it, thank you for taking the time to listen to these voices from the Caribbean, they're important ones and we can learn from it, it could change your life and thanks to HowlRound for hosting us of course, Thea and Vijay and everybody else involved, so thank you all, I know we could talk much much longer but we get an idea for the idea and I really encourage everybody to engage with this part of the world and it's an important one and like in music we listen to world music, we listen to music actually from the Caribbean, we have to do the same in theater especially if you work in theater and you listen to this, find a way to incorporate these voices in your work, thank you, bye bye, bye bye, see you, thank you