 Live from Nassau in the Bahamas, it's theCUBE covering Polygon 18, brought to you by PolyMath. Okay, welcome back everyone, we're here live in the Bahamas for Polygon 18. This is theCUBE's exclusive coverage for day one, wrapping up the segment here. I'm John Furrier with my co-host Dave Vellante, co-founder with me at SiliconANGLE Media theCUBE. Our guest wrap up co-host, Anthony Diorio, co-founder of Ethereum. Also CEO of Jax and Decentral. We had a great chat yesterday. Welcome to join our wrap up for day one. Right here at the show. Thanks for having me on again. Thank you. Yeah, we're live this time. All right, sounds better. Okay, cut it. Genie's out of the bottle on everything. So we had loopers on the last segment, a little water break. But on a serious note, Dave and I want to wrap up the show. We do this every time, day one. A lot of excitement in the panels. People in the hallway were buzzing. People doing deals. A lot of intimate conversations, Dave. We see this early on in these shows. Anthony, you've been out in the hallways, in sessions, talking to people, in meetings, getting things done. What's the day one wrap up for you? Like, what's happened here? So I'm a little bit different at events. I don't attend many of the sessions. I never have. This is more of a way for me to connect with people that I haven't seen for a while. I try not to do too many conferences anymore. I've been doing this for six years now in the blockchain space. And I realized a couple of years ago, it's really about focusing on what I need to do. So this was a little bit different. I did the keynote here yesterday, and I'd asked if I could send my hologram in instead, but they're like, no, you got to come. You got to, we can't do that. So generally, I'm at conferences, I don't really do many of the sessions. I'm just chilling out and kind of using it as vacation times too. But it has been pretty busy. It has been good. I've had a number of meetings. And yeah, it's quite a good bunch. What are some of the things you're talking about with your friends and colleagues and partners in the business and the industry? Is it tech, are you talking tech, are you talking personal? What are some of the things going on here? Cause these events have a mishmash of all that. Yeah, I try to keep them both ways, their business and personal stuff. Cause I think business, I'm just going to get drained too much and it's nice to make things a little bit lighter. A lot of my meetings have been with people that are, you know, they're looking to know what's going on. People, you know, thinking about security tokens now. And it's a change from the traditional utility tokens or, and it's a lot of just trying to pick my brain about what's happening, what am I seeing? What am I investing in? What are the different things that I'm looking for? It's that. Meeting people that I haven't been able to connect with for a while, which is always good. Aligning other events and things coming up. And then also spending quite a bit of day by the pool and catching up on emails and make sure you do that. You look good. I wish I could have been there. We'd do an interviews all day, but we're doing whatever it takes, get the videos out there. We had some interesting guests on, we'll get your reaction to. We had Hare Tayswani who's Hoshio.io co-founder. They do audits on smart contracts and some other folks. But the general observation, I don't think he said this, but he was kind of validating and other things that Ethereum is by far the most developer oriented chain. It has a lot more traction and smart contracts are getting better and better. We've been trying to get kind of an answer just kind of order of magnitude relative to developer communities. What is a ballpark order of magnitude percentage in your mind of developers on the platforms? Is Ethereum the largest? Yeah, I'd say so. It was really interesting. We were doing really good at setting up the communities and we really were focused on devs. There was a lot of setup in the initial structures that was more business oriented, but after the crowd sale, everything was down to developers building the communities because that's what we needed. We needed people to actually develop on the platform. Yeah, of course. And Ethereum just had a way, I think it's mostly because of italic. It just was a developer project. And I think that's what attracted a lot of the people to start building smart contracts, building things on it. And yeah, it's tough to raise a community with developers and I think Ethereum has done a super job of that and it really is that developer focus. I mean, their event is DevCon, right? So the event is for developers. That's what they're focused on on their massive conferences that they do. It's all for the developers. So that's definitely been the focus for them. It's still tons of upside, right? I mean, you said yesterday that you really don't look for blockchain developers. You look for good devs. And I said to you afterwards, it's probably because there aren't enough blockchain devs. No, that's not it really for us, is that we've already solved a lot of our problems. We've created a platform that goes across many platforms. It syncs very easily. It integrates many platforms in. We don't work on the protocol level of the platforms. Like we're not actually trying to solve problems and create a platform from scratch that maybe will be valuable in a few years. We're letting all of our partners and platforms do that. We're an app that is something that's not necessarily requiring blockchain devs to integrate. We do connect to blockchains, that's fine. But we're looking for more traditional stuff that we're doing that actually gonna monetize right now and it's based on stuff and technology that doesn't have to be created yet. So we're not looking for those massive problem solvers to develop protocols that need to solve major problems. So we can have good JavaScript developers. That's what we require and we need. And we can teach them internally what the skills they need on blockchain. So actually we don't necessarily need blockchain or we would be looking even for blockchain devs. We're looking for good JavaScript developers. So guys like in traditional enterprise devs, is that right? And that's why it's easy for us to get those in. But if you're looking to solve a problem and you're looking to do this core stuff working on protocol level stuff, then you need someone who's been in the blockchain space for a number of years that can actually help you with that stuff and they're very hard to find right now. And they're also full stack developers. It's really a unique skill set, new language, full stack. They're got jobs in their hands. Yeah, they're working on tons of projects. They're demanding tons of money. Guys that have been developing on protocol stuff for five years, there's very, very few. And there's so much going on, there's so high in demand. And also they want a lot more freedom in the work they're doing because they're so high in demand. And I have one guy that's a rock star. He works with us just a few hours a week and when we do have critical issues or critical problems, he's our consultant that can help us because he's been in the space for a while. He teaches, he's got an Ethereum developer meetup that he runs in Toronto. So he's our go-to guy. But we're also just not about Ethereum. We develop, we work with 75 different projects. It's a wide range of things. And we can also tap their communities when we need problems, when we have problems. We go directly to the Dash community. Hey, there's something going on here. Can you make sure that we're in the loop with this? And we'll go right with them and find the things we need. Hey, we should run your, Dave's got a, we always talk about digital transformation. Dave talks about a unique perspective. Share your digital transformation, the role of the developer. Because that, the impact and get his reaction because we think that the developer on the digitalized applications is probably the most important trend that I don't think mainstream is talking about. Because it also doesn't really conflict with any other developer movement. It just adds more headroom. But we see it from a transformation standpoint. Our scenario is that, you know, you talk about cloud, SaaS, big data, mobile, social, web 2.0, that stuff's yesterday's news, right? And blockchain and the developments go on at a conference like these really underscore that momentum. And we see that organizations that are succeeding today and taking advantage of that momentum are, they have data as, it's foundational. It's at their core. And there's so many traditional companies where it's human expertise is the core and data sort of bolted on. And that's a big gap. And so we see blockchain and this digital transformation converging and developers building this new web, whatever you want to call it. But this matrix of digital services, which they tap to build new companies. And so the role of the developer is always been critical, but now it's compensated and they're stakeholders in ways that we've never seen before globally. And they're also, like I look at it as these technologies are still very new. They're going to take a long time to displace and disrupt other sectors. And I think some people are thinking that they're doing, we're going to go from A to Z right away. I've taken the approach that we're going to use a lot of traditional stuff right now. And we're going to build and make sure that we can monetize and make sure it's growing. We're going to slowly be adding things in where they think if you take a too long approach, you're not going to be able to actually last. So a lot of stuff is doing what, you can actually build in traditional stuff right now too. That's what we do. We use AWS quite a bit of this stuff that we're doing. We're not going to centralize storage for how we're starting. It's just not pruning it, it's not scalable yet. It's going to take a long time to let stuff is. And until then you have to make sure that you're actually staying in business, you make sure you're doing well. So it's using a mixture of both things and not going right to the end game. You have to de-risk that and take advantage of cloud economics that are there today. Yeah, I mean, if you think about it in space right now, what sector has been disrupted by blockchain? What has been made faster, better, cheaper right now in blockchain? I can't think of anything. Crypto-kitties. Well, but this is a really important point. Yeah, there hasn't been much value. That's why I bring it back to digital transformation because think about what's been transformed by digital. Obviously, publishing, books, ads. And I thought, well, is it bits versus atoms? Well, it's digital or is it information transfer? Well, it's information transfer that actually disrupted that. Well, now it's value transfer. That's what's coming, right? Yes, and so, but then you'd assume that, okay, blockchain, banking, but banking hasn't been disrupted yet? Not yet. It's going to take a lot of time. And so, insurance, healthcare, and these industries need to. Well, I would say VCs have been disrupted by the eyes. But that's a high risk. Here's my premise, is that risk is the factor that will determine disruption. Maybe it's a little bit of bits versus atoms, but it's the risk factors associated with banking, healthcare, insurance, defense, government stuff. High risk, highly entrenched businesses, organizations. But eventually, they will be disrupted. While the signals. Yeah, but it's a lot of, when we first started Ethereum, there was, we had shirts at the back would say Dropbox and Five Lines. And that's just not true. At the time, this was the goal. But when you realize and you try to do it, well, this isn't scalable. This isn't going to be done. It's going to be too expensive to actually do it. If you're actually paying for Ether to do it, it doesn't make any sense. So that was actually, even if I was thinking, that's what we're going to be able to do. We're a ways off of that. Problem need to be solved. Scalability, biggest problem. Interoperability between all the different chains and how they're all going to work together. That needs to be solved. How are you going to stop these forking operations that happen that split communities when actually a coin fork or something happens, you get these battles. Those are problems that need to be solved now. So we solved the problem with smart contracts. Now that's the second generation. Now we're looking for other things like Cardano says, you know, they're looking at the third generation stuff. It's solving those problems and we're a ways off. So that's why until then you got to still do things with tradition and don't be afraid to use things that are proven and work right now in order to get there, yeah. All right, Anthony, well, great to have you on the wrap up. That's day one. We're seeing a lot of great stuff. We had Halsey Minor on, another industry pro. You're seeing pros come into this business. You see the old dogs, the new dogs, the young guns. I mean, it's a really amazing community. I got to say, reminds me of a lot of trends kind of coming together. And that's awesome work that you guys have done. Thanks for coming on. Thanks for having me on again. Appreciate it. A lot to wrap up for day one here at the Polycon 18. Token, economics, cryptocurrency, blockchain. All the players are here doing deals, making it all happen. It's the cue to wrap up. Thanks for watching.