 Here we are with back we're live. It's my goodness. It's one o'clock. We're left at one o'clock one o'clock rock here on a given Tuesday and We're having Asia in review. We're talking about Immersion programs in language talking about the new globality of language and we have our special guests to my left Russell Lou Hi Russell Yeah, yeah ma baby I raised you to you. I'm a Ohio. Oh, I was I must informed citizen. Whoa These guys you put them together. It's like nuclear. May I say? Okay, so today we're gonna talk about language because you've been talking about language for a long time Russell You've been talking about language and the signs and the airports in Hawaii and we're missing something What do we what do we have what do we need and what are we missing? Well, well, I am from my living in China in Asia. There's a new global standard, right? I mean, I mean a ray, but Jay you can call me Ray. I'm getting confused But there's a new global standard and that is that in Asia the new standard is Not only the language Chinese but also English English has been taught there for 40 years It's a it's a core requirement. So the youth that grow up Can't speak English can read and write English and so that's the standard And so the the question that big three raises is we want to be global. How do we do it? Why I think language is important key and for example, we only speak and learn English here and Now the big language is here. The main four languages are going to be Mandarin and Spanish Aha Which one would you pick first? Which one would you pick Ray? well, since Hawaii is geographically close to Asia and the all these statisticians point to rise in Chinese tourists and visitors and an investment that follow and and of course of the need for a bilingual Workforce from Hawaii to do business in China and Asia. I think Mandarin is is quite a good good option going forward Yeah, what's interesting is that tell me if this is a syllogism or a tautology? Asia is speaking English Everybody in Asia now speaks English Therefore the 21st century if the 21st century belongs to Asia and I think it does You know, it's then the 21st century belongs by reference to English. It's already there. We already have that don't we? I mean, there's no place in the world that doesn't speak the Taliban ISIS they all speak English. They communicate in English So it's a message here. However, it got this way. The world is now Communicating mostly in most places not only Asia, but it's communicating in English And one thing I'd add what Bray has said is that picked up is it's the language of money What's the language of money these it's Mandarin and I've been there for quite a few years 13 years and as way back when I first arrived in China, Koreans were studying Mandarin and College kids from Korea would spend a whole year studying Mandarin and now I even see Japanese students There's African japan from Japan coming to China to to learn language So but which ways are going to go? I mean, it's a provocative question Is it is everything going to go to English or is everything going to go to Chinese? It's sort of it's it's relative to you know Economic success. It's relative to power. It's relative to who knows which way the wind blows But just as easily as you can say study Mandarin everybody You know, we can also say study English everybody, but the deals are done at the dinner table And you're all speaking Mandarin. That's the difference and the agreements are drafted in English because if there's an international dispute the body of laws are much more Developed especially the Chinese money is going off out. They expect that it's going to be English language will govern some of the agreements But the point is the deals are made in Mandarin So, you know, there's still I think what the second largest accounting Maybe the third is Japan a third now third now because China moved into this acquisition But you know strikes me that what happened to Japan? Why? Why isn't Japanese as? As attractive as a global language as as as popular as a global language than Chinese Well, it was if you go back to the 80s, we remember There was a rise in the Japanese yen the Japanese economy was driving Japanese manufacturing Everybody looked at the decline of the US and Japan is number one by Harvard professor Vogel. There were many things going on In fact in in Hawaii, I think what happened though that we didn't strategically kind of plan this to deal with the enormous Tsunami away from Japanese visitors. It just came to be there was a pool of Japanese speakers for example, my Mother worked in retail in Waikiki. She she was part of this post war, you know Immigration of people who married you know Like people like my father moved to Hawaii and there was a pool of people who could speak Japanese and Years before that there were many people who studied Japanese. So we didn't have to suddenly begin a program to educate Teach Japanese there was a pool ready to deal in a duty-freeze with the lawyers and and CPAs and all kinds of real estate brokers there were already a pool of them and That we kind of stumbled into and did well, but we really didn't plan for it Right. It just came our way. We were lucky and we we were happy with being lucky But you know, I don't think we took any affirmative steps about this It just happened we had an affinity with the Japanese. We had a connection with the Japanese So it fell in our in our trap. However I just want to add that my sister teaches Japanese language at Farrington High School a DOE school in in one of the last advantage to our neighborhoods districts in Hawaii in Honolulu and Most of our students are not Japanese They're Filipino Samoan native Hawaiian and others Micronesian whose parents working Waikiki And there was an economic incentive for them to tell their children to learn some Japanese That would get you ahead of job in right get you ahead in Waikiki in in the hotels and so that's an added value So Ross and I always talk about there has this economic incentive What is that economic incentive to you know invest in your child to learn a language? Yeah Oh good point. But what about the Japanese kids in Farrington? Why aren't they taking good and natural? If I grew up in an household and we spoke Japanese I'd have an advantage Well, that's a whole decline of Japanese language instruction in in In Hawaii there used to be many like the Danny know is would write about you know running from Japanese school before the war And then of course during the war everything was shut down the Japanese instruction and culture and religion was suppressed after the war That was it's something that the Japanese language never really Came out of and then the 50s saw People like the Danny know is coming back and learning English to go to law schools right law schools and politics and Government and joining the big five that all took English Yeah, and to excel in English made it made you a better soldier a better government worker a better Well that that did happen And we can't let Russell off the hook here because it happened with the Chinese the same way Right, you know if I offer a course in Chinese and Farrington high school the Chinese won't go They don't want it anymore. They're beyond that. They're assimilated. They know these these truths You know that Ray is talking about I want to get ahead speak English But what happened there? Well, you know, it's really interesting while we were talking the subject I was just at the University of Hawaii up thinking maybe I should sign up for a Mandarin course to keep my madman boy. I show up in there I don't see a lot of white kids these kids are from the mainland it looked like and so You know it's part of not only Rays pick the word Planting somebody's got a plan this and think down the road. That's why China has Had the economic miracle because they plan even it was a comedy state. They said we're to have our kids learn English And start from first grade. So that's the language of business that's the language of law and I teach at a law school in China and All my students English or in Chinese in English and they're all excellent English speakers and I have them right in English and Most of third of them now to half now are going to US law schools Very good schools Columbia and why you including master's degree master, but now it's they're doing JD degrees and all these major law Schools the top 20 are going to China to find these students to speak English because they get their New York license And they work in the US and they have understanding of Common law practice as well as a huge disparity I think and then in the Chinese equation Yeah, the Chinese come here. They have English. They learned English early. They can cope in the schools It's not a barrier for them But we don't have a population of kids that can speak Mandarin and they don't go You know you have so many situations where you see that disparity. It's only one-way street And we really have to fix that and and the sad thing about it is Hawaii Theoretically is in a position to fix it, but Hawaii has not fixed it Hawaii hasn't sent anybody really of any consequence You know in numbers to China to learn anything in either Mandarin or English even though You know, you could also go to a school and learn it in English like from you. So We're missing something don't you think well, I Kind of differ on you slightly in the 1880s to King Kala Kawa sent Hawaiian students to China and Japan. They're still there. No but Program to jumpstart the economy for Asian exports, so but you're correct that That when I was at Harvard once at the Harvard Baker Library, I saw newspapers Like the China Daily in Chinese I'd realized there were students taking MBAs who were from mainland China The reverse is not true yet. We don't have people from Hawaii You know going to China and and becoming part of that yet, right? Yeah, well it take it will take an immersion program That takes students from when they're like infants to be immersed in a lot of language and for the Two languages to be at the same level go ahead and I think I think would raise touch upon I think it's it's something that it's a new concept of bringing language here in our schools and it's it's important because We're not going to go there Why not have language being taught here and and and I think that again the word that we talked about is planning Somebody's gonna have to plan and think go ahead Somebody's gonna say this is good for us, and and I think the problem is I don't think it's just limited to Hawaii I think the fact is Americans. We have a higher standard of living We are very comfortable Differentiate Hawaii Hawaii is you know a place with a lot of Asian people You know families who are Asian and they stand a better chance I somehow of learning these these family languages, but they don't do it and the schools don't do it And if you went to DOE and said my name is Russell Lou and I want you to teach Mandarin or my name is Ray Tsuchiyama And I wanted to actively get these kids involved in Japanese. You have a lot of resistance They would say these kids have other things to do They don't have time for this and we're not going to have that program And so we we we have left it all behind when we've talked about the Geneva of the Pacific and all that We want to be the Switzerland of the Pacific We really have to have multilingual capability not just fall back on local language can't do that And that's very important that multilingual capability is important because it's a human resource That's going to draw investments Investments in the operative term draw investments. It's a human resource We talk about the grand ideas lawyers talk about we want of international arbitration, but let's face it Do we have Interpreters do we have people in the finance area who can speak the language of Mandarin? Where you want to bring these disputes here? And it's a great idea American companies and Chinese have disputes middle between the two places and we're in a culture. That's Western Asian great But you know what we don't have the human assets. We don't have the resources We don't have the language capability and that's very important That's why if we look it back at the China lesson for them to succeed for them to draw investments They had to make sure that their own people could speak English in the early years 70s and 80s When they wanted the foreign money to come in they wanted American companies come in They had to have and they planned it that way to have a working force that spoke English You know we had a show on think tech radio and HPR a long time ago And we had a woman named ho I came up for her first name That'll come to me and and we and she was she's the one who for years and years ran the Mandarin program at Punahou And we had the the dean of a language school at UH and the very distinct impression I had out of it was that Punahou was doing a better job more students more interest more, you know productivity and And I don't understand why that would be Because Punahou was a private school we can't have that and if you go to Farrington right now, do they teach Chinese in Farrington? Yes, I'm happy to hear that. I mean that's harder because that's not all the coin of the realm in Waikiki But I you know if we want to do we want to be globally relevant We really have to do this and that means we have to get off the standard curriculum and put other things in there and Make these kids speak multiple languages. They don't you know I mean you'll have to agree with me that since your day Ray Fewer and fewer people fewer people speak Japanese on the streets. That's that's correct 90s when they all came around Everybody was belling up to that by learning but they're not here now and so we don't do it And it's even worse because you know people from Peoria when they look at Hawaii think that we know everything about China and Japan Contemporary business technology products and experts and that's not true But you have an excellent point and and I'll give you a country that bet the farm on the future Singapore and now Singaporeans all of their Chinese But they spoke Hakka Cantonese more than Mandarin But they chose to simplify Chinese to teach to read and write and that's the way of writing on the mainland mainland China so again, they took a long-term view of Business and and developing you know relationship with mainland China So they did it the Chinese, you know mainland Chinese way unlike Hong Kong and Taiwan which has a different writing system traditional So triangle Ray says is why can't we be the Singapore in the US? Singapore's small place. We're small place But they chose to bring that Chinese world there and it's great for the opportunity You know, I as I say to everybody being in Asia for quite a while the last great opportunity for money For anyone globe is the Chinese That's where it's going to be at You know, we cut with cutbacks in military here There's cutbacks in federal spending. So what do we have to offer again? It's a human resources and it's the people that can speak the language and I and then you're right because I think that this is a In culture environment here that fosters both different cultures by cultural as support New plan on In break, but I'm break now. Okay, right to Tiana Russell Lou will be right back. You'll see Aloha, I'm Shantel Seville the host of the Savvy Chick show Which you can watch every Wednesday at 11 a.m. On think tech Hawaii calm on the Savvy Chick show We are all about inspiring and empowering women and girls to be the best they can be by having amazing guests from all around the world So we hope you'll join us every Wednesday at 11 a.m. Aloha Aloha, I'm Kirsten Baumgart Turner host of sustainable Hawaii. Thanks for watching think tech this summer We have a lot of terrific shows of great importance And I hope you'll watch my show to every Tuesday at noon as we address sustainability issues for Hawaii They're really pertinent as the World Conservation Congress approaches in September and the World Youth Congress that's focusing on sustainability Next year as well. Have a great summer and tune in at noon every Tuesday Back and Ray was saying during the break where he went to school They spoke multiple languages like five languages for the dean of the school Referring to the early 20th century Fern elementary Mayor Elementary here. Oh, yes in Cali. You went to Fern elementary. That's right. High school. No, no, no but joke and their fern was One the first election for what was new whole new city and county and he spoke What I've read at least four languages and again, it was a time when when schooling was not Institutionalized remember the always started to with Thomas Dewey's idea on the new American 20s and 30s was a great vibrant time with mainland instructors coming in teachers from very good Colleges looking at Hawaii as people look at Congo Yeah, third-world country of Vietnam and going to Maui. My father had Shakespeare and Proms and and the mathematics and Latin at Maui High School class of 37 So but it was focused on English. There were no other language except for French or you know Or Latin at that period. So creating a new American was was the key there and what is but we're the 21st century What is the new American today? He's not multi-lingual sorry to say well that just to add with race talk But the reality today is is that the new America is changing the new America includes groups of people that Historically, you know, we're not there now the Hispanic populations rise so Spanish is important But then you know, I think getting going down to this thing There's a really answer we can look into of a small place in Minnesota called Minnetonka and Minnetonka has come up with out of the box thinking and They have a language immersion program that starts kids from kindergarten learning Mandarin and They're they speak Mandarin And they learn Mandarin up to the I believe the second grade and in the second grade then they're brought back into English programs and so It's incredible what they're doing Why can't we do that? We can Well, can we do it at the State Department of Education level be practical Ray? What do you think this is? Again at the top levels of the state What is the strategy going forward for our society moving forward to make us special 20 30 make us proud To make us global to make us relevant to make us and you know in other countries like a Canada Where there are provinces that are Officially bilingual officially in many many ways that you take One language up to fifth grade or sixth grade and then at a seventh or sixth grade you take all courses engineering history And and science in the other language Wow Because that's the only way to learn sure why is language restricted to just language or literature, right? you know, why can't you explain physics in in French or Spanish, you know, oh that would be so great. That's all you do. That's all you do, but that's the bilingual Promise government, but again why I met the people who put their Children who are English speakers put their children in French Immersion schools because the government hires only people who are Profession native in those two languages. So there's an economic incentive economic incentive What if you know at a certain time in the future you have to be proficient in two languages to get a state job or city job? For example, and that would change the nature of the society So we have a lot of people who are becoming proficient over the past what 15 20 years in in Hawaiian And I think that it's not exactly what we're talking about Is it because that native Hawaiian language is not going to draw people from all around the world? I went to Alamo one. I don't go to Alamo one much I went to Alamo one last weekend and I said to myself this place is really global every brand You can think of from every major city in the world is here. It's huge. It could attract it does attract people from everywhere So why can't we sort of ride, you know coattails on that and make this an international place? Where the clerks in these stores can speak any language? Let's become a European or an Asian city and be able to handle every tourist from everywhere Won't that help tourism answer? Yes. Oh, yes. Yes, and the good thing about it is that You know as I travel around the world also. I'm finding that Many times I can use Mandarin in Europe I can use Mandarin in places you would not think and there is interest around the world and So I think it's becoming language. It's becoming much more standard in business I've talked to people for African lawyers in Mandarin and I've talked to Koreans in Mandarin. They don't speak English, but they speak Mandarin So it's it's not only just it's a it's becoming becoming a ling a lingua franca and lingua franca And it's it's happening now, and I think what it really takes here is is is Planning the right steps and okay, so you're talking about action what action we have to do and who does it? I think we can follow this Minnetonka model. We can start a small program We can do it in certain schools government or private with this is this should be in the public school system The private schools can do the same but and it's interesting because Minnetonkas is Minnesota The University of Minnesota did some research on that and they found that these kids that they took in that were an Immersion program top Mandarin from kindergarten second grade that English started second grade and By the time they're fifth grade there because their ability to use the language their English level is that of a 11th grade student 11th grade student, but I want to add something I used to think and you probably used to think too that when you're young it's easier to learn language But that's not entirely true You can learn it as an adult also and why don't we teach the adults to in an immersion program? Yes, and then again, I guess it because adults maybe have more obligations no time when you're young You have the time and that's and and they said that the research showed that when your child you have You have in your mind system. You have the ability. There's more In your mind that allows more open. Yeah more open to learn the language a second Yeah, and so as I've shown especially in New York Times that a beam bilingual trilingual delays to mention Also, and that is a great boon. So I'm in B12 according to the New York time But that's a big boon in terms of insurance Hospices hospitals all kinds of societal thing goes back to bilingualism but and and but I want to stress this and this is the You know, we can talk about thinking our box and about bilingual programs, but I think there is a great assumption fear that back going back in the 50s and 60s that bilingualism of trilingualism especially with Hispanics in the US that it delays English that that you cannot speak both Languages as well. You see that's not true and that you come up with people who are Not profession in either language, you know, Spanish nor English and that is a consideration We have to fight against because whenever you do that. Oh, you're in a merchant school That means you're going to be speaking later, for example, and our daughter did speak later but it doesn't mean that You can develop a you know databases of words in your mind to language and so forth and There are other people like Joseph Conrad who wrote his first book on a darkness when he was 41 years old in English And that was a third or fourth language Vladimir Nabokov English was Mindset that yes, we can do this. Yes. We can be multi-lingual I mean to think of Europe all the people in Europe who speak four or five languages It's not hard. No, it's a matter of saying well, I have to do this. I'll do it. Oh, we're out of time you guys I hate this part, but since since you guys are such pros Ray I want to offer you the opportunity to wrap up and to say farewell to our listeners and Russell will follow you But could you would you mind doing that in in in Japanese? That's a little too much for me but I think You Violent with people like myself we speak Japanese and English all the time. I think it's very easy to speak two languages It's not hard. It's not difficult It's very hard to interpret because you want to be very precise in that word because it doesn't exist in other languages And I spoke I always spoke both languages a home and again That's another thing that parents When they put their children immersion language, which is outside what they speak. It's a great risk. It's a gamble It's it's it's an investment also But again, what how does that child turn out, you know 10 20 years later? That is a wholly different Exciting individual who can contribute to side. You've got to build global kids and people Russell Can you close and can you give me some Mandarin anyway? Okay, just want to say that I think that having a second language opens doors it really opens doors to the world You're able to communicate with people. There's a self satisfaction and today's world is economic opportunity It's all about that and it's really relevant and I believe that by having a second language You are really living a global world and today's world is a global world Let's let's not kid ourselves and to be part of the global world We need to be tuned in and that's important having a second language Yeah, and the other side is if we don't do that We're gonna pay a big price going forward and so are our kids in the future of this state Russell Lou, Ray Tsuchiyama, they're great Asia in review today We've been talking about the new globalism of language right here at home in Hawaii. Thank you so much you guys. Thank you Thank you