 is Dave Osmondson. He, him, his. I am a resident playwright with Spectrum Theater Ensemble, and I am really excited to be hosting this panel on the intersectionality between LGBTQ plus issues and disability. I am joined here by two amazing, amazing people, slash artists, slash humans. Um, so before we dive into our conversation, I want to, um, get in the chance to introduce themselves and tell y'all a little bit about themselves. So, um, so Damon, would you like to go first? Sure thing. Uh, the name you see there is my Facebook handle, but my name is Damon Neighbors, and I am from Chattanooga, Tennessee, and I was diagnosed late. Um, but since then, I have been increasing my advocacy. I, uh, have planned two autistic-led symposiums here in the South. Uh, I formed the Chattanooga Neurodiversity Alliance to educate about neurodiversity in the deep South. And, uh, I also do speaking engagements, and the focus of my advocacy is, um, the intersection of queerness, transness, and, uh, discussing gender and dating on the spectrum, as well as our vulnerabilities. Um, I also do a lot of, uh, talking about, um, the difficulties we face in institutions like, uh, jails and rehabs. So thank you for having me. Thank you for joining us. Uh, Hailey. Hi, my name is Hailey St. James. My pronouns are they, them, theirs. I am a Boston-born, um, currently based in Boston, but normally, if it wasn't for the pandemic, I would be in New York City. Um, I am a, I am also like Dave. I am a playwright. Um, I mostly write about, uh, myself and my communities to make sure that they're represented truthfully. Um, so I mostly write neurodivergent, queer. I write, I write characters that, you know, live truthful lives. I write characters that I hope other people who are like me can see themselves in. Um, I had a reading with, um, Pride Plays last summer, um, through New York, uh, in New York. Um, it was virtual. It was a industry reading of, uh, my play for Leonore or Companions, which is a, uh, queer autistic, um, love story, um, magical realism. Uh, I mostly just, mostly considering most of the pandemic, just writing and honing my craft. Um, and I'm really thrilled to be here. Great. Well, we are really thrilled to have both of you here. So, um, the first, um, kind of jumping off point or question that I want to pose is, um, in terms of, like, media presentation of, um, either neurodivergent or disabled people, um, a lot of the narratives like tend to focus almost exclusively on straight white men. Um, I can only think of a few where, um, queerness plays a part into it, like, Netflix, uh, Netflix is a special, for example, which is very good if you haven't watched it. But then you have shows like, um, The Good Doctor and A Typical, where it's centered on, like, straight white men. And I'm curious why, um, as, uh, as a queer folk, why do you both think this has been the dominant central narrative in the media for so long, despite statistics reporting that neurodiversion people especially are likely to identify as LGBTQ plus? And that's kind of a big question we're diving right in here. I feel like it's pretty simple that we live in a, uh, incredibly patriarchal, cishet white society. Um, and unfortunately they dictate a lot of, you know, the media and what we see in the media and what's presented to the population. And unfortunately, since so much of the science for so long had, you know, always just focused on the cishet white male people with the diagnoses, that's what we ended up seeing in the media. And unfortunately, since so much of it is, you know, based on that very small percentage of the population as opposed to the entire autistic queer population, or just autistic population in general, they mostly just get stereotyped. And whatever representation we get in the media, so much of it unfortunately is the same stereotype. So, you know, the man child or the, you know, the savant is like the big two that we always get, which is very annoying. I don't watch the good doctor or a typical because I know that their representation of people with autism is, will set me off. I did like grow up watching a lot of the big bang theory. Even though Sheldon and Amy are not like canonically autistic, they were the closest thing to representation that I had on TV growing up as, you know, as a teenager really. So I'm so grateful for that show, even though I don't really love the writing on the show. Those two characters were the most consistently well written, I thought, and still pretty much like, I mean, they're not perfect, they will not like defend them outright, but I still like appreciate them as like a comfort watch. But yeah, unfortunately, it's just, you know, patriarchy really. I absolutely agree. My first impressions of seeing people like me on screen were a little earlier. It was, and far more insultingly stereotypical. It was things like Steve Urkel. And I knew that I had things in common with him and that I was a stereotype. And it's, and that happens when you're queer too, before, you know, there was Ellen and everything, you would just see Paul Lind in the Hollywood Squares, and you'd go, hmm, you know, other damaging images in the media that I've seen were on Saturday Night Live. They did Larry the Affeminate Heterosexual was a running skit on SNL as was It's Pat. Yeah, yeah, which was not only a cruel stereotype of non-binary people, it was also a cruel stereotype of autistic people. And that whole nerdy kind of androgynous thing. So that's what I was facing things on growing up. And it wasn't until, you know, I was completely full grown and already a blackout drunk that like, I first heard the term non-binary, and it was such a relief. Because I finally had a word. I was always like, I don't fit, either. I don't know what's going on, you know. But it was such a relief to finally see younger generations leading the way on defining other than just L's and G's. I watched a lot of like clips from like Urkel as a kid because I enjoyed Julia White because I had a Sonic the Hedgehog phase when I was in middle school. So like I was like, oh, Julia White was the Sonic the Hedgehog. I'm going to watch a bunch of Urkel stuff. And I was like, I didn't ever really caught on that Urkel was, you know, an autistic stereotype. I just thought, you know, he's like, you know, the classic nerd character. But the more I do think about it so much of the media that depends, nerd characters does have an overlap with autistic characters, as I said, the Big Bang Theory. It's funny because for me, when I don't think like, I didn't like fully realize I was non-binary until only about four years ago, really, even a little bit before then. But recently I've been like thinking about things or like actors that I really like hyper fixated on growing up. And like, recently, because it's been 20 years since Spy Kids came out, and I didn't. And when I was in like high school, I was obsessed with Alan coming because I was like, oh, he's so delightful and, you know, flamboyant and androgynous. And like, he's, you know, this fabulous Scottish imp man. I love him. He's amazing. I saw him on Broadway and a bunch of things. And I thought he was super cool. But I didn't really think of anything about it in terms like gender. I was like, Oh, I just think he's neat. And then when I graduated high school, during my first gap year, I saw the off Broadway in the tent production of Natasha Pierre and the Great Comet of 1812. And that was the first time I ever saw Lucas Steel, who played Anatole. And I had never seen this person before. And he walks in. And he's this beautiful androgynous alien looking blonde boy. And I'm like, who are you? I will follow you anywhere. And that was the first time I really ever felt gender envy. So, you know, years went on and Great Comet moved to Broadway. And I saw it a bunch. And I was like, I'm going to cosplay Anatole. I want to cosplay Anatole. Anatole just is super cool. I love Lucas Steel. He's so cool. And when I started really doing that, I was like, wait a second, like, this feels right. Like, I don't know. There's just something about him that just feels correct for me. I don't know. Like, he's a bit of a muse. But then he said an interview that he was trying to channel like David Bowie's sort of androgyny and like transcending gender and I'm like, Oh, transcending gender. I really like that. I feel that that's how I feel. I think that's how I feel. And I had to juggle with that for a while. Because it was like, am I am I non binary? I don't know. Am I like demi non binaries? Like, most of 2017, like, I'm demi non binary. Like, you can use they them pronouns for me sometimes. Like, I'll tell you when I feel like it. But then by 2018, I was like, no, like, this is me. I'm non binary. I transcend gender. Thanks, Lucas steel. And I got to tell Lucas last January. He was in a show off Broadway that I saw a lot right before the shutdown. And I'm just really grateful I could tell him that he was like, the big sort of, I saw him and I was like, Yeah, I realized. And I'm just really grateful for that. But I can't really think of like, you know, queer, you know, non binary, like, rep. I wasn't really didn't really get to see a lot as a child. I just sort of imprinted on actors who they gave me those vibes. Even they may not even be non binary. I just like, wow, I feel that with myself. I don't know. Yeah, I often sorry, Damon. Yeah, I just thought of a few things. I have always kind of known I was non binary, but didn't really understand the full extent of what that meant until later on after I had gotten my autism diagnosis. I had begun the process of unmasking 40 years of persona. I was I bought pink everything and was hyper femme, except when I couldn't stand it anymore and I cut all my hair off. And a lot of that is because of particularly disabled queer people are dependent on family. And you have to be a certain way, especially, you know, I come from a part of the country that especially in my early teen and teen years was having a toxic discourse about LGBTQ people. And it's never really led up. But the gender roles were very demarcated. And that is so much a part of my mask, being feminine and being neurotypical. That it was only when I processed my autism, I was able to go, okay, well, that doesn't really explain everything I've been going through. I've been going through a lot of things and, you know, self harm and eating disorders and substance abuse and just never being able to work. And it was always hard to know whether people were being nasty to me because I'm odd or because I'm gender non conforming. It was just, it didn't matter how femme I dressed, it came through, you know, other queer people would just look at me and go, you know, because I was dating men and I still do. And that's very confusing. I was diagnosed when I was very young, but I wasn't aware of my, I wasn't like made fully aware of my diagnosis until I was about 16 or so. So most of my life, like I had the same psychologist or psychiatrist really from like elementary school into like my first two years of college, which I mean, looking back was not really ideal considering I should have had one that had one ever, you know, between like, you know, elementary school, then middle school, then high school, should have had one that grew and changed with me and I'll have the same one throughout because I was just under the assumption until I was 16 that I just had very, very high functioning ADHD. And so, yeah, when I was in school, like for the most time, like I was kind of oblivious to like, I wasn't even really sure if I really had like bullies or like people who like made fun of me. I mean, maybe one or two that I was definitely aware of, but mostly I was just kind of oblivious to everything because I was so bad at reading social cues that I just sort of assumed everybody thought I was fine or at least now looking back like did people just tolerate me. I'm not even fully aware. And I didn't really fully start to unmask until I left for college at the first time. And I started to like, not have to live with my parents and wanted to live on my own. And it was like, because my senior year of high school, I took AP psychology and that was when I was like, wait a second. Yeah, no, I was like, yeah, autism, I like, I wanted I write up on it, like, you know, in my textbooks, like took out books, like, yeah, yeah, this completely tracks. How did I not fully realize this sooner? And then by the time I finally live on my own, I'm in college, I mean, the first year of college were awful and theater saved my life. And I realized I was going to be a playwright and not an actor. And I became more comfortable in like being open about my labels and open about my autism. And from there, I just have been a lot more just I'm grateful they don't really have to mask anymore. But at the same time, since the pandemic has happened, I finished college, like literally, month before the pandemic started, I graduated. It took me a few years to study transfer schools. So by the time I graduated, and like, I'm living in New York, I'm living, I'm finally doing what I love, I'm independent. And then boom, pandemic, I have to move back home in the middle of summer. I immediately start regressing. And it's been really hard. But I'm just grateful that like, I mean, today we're literally recording on World Autism Day. And it's been really, really cathartic to be able to just talk about the experience of being autistic, and not being afraid of having to mask. And I mean, granted, I wish World Autism Day was every day, because it should be. Yeah, I think you're getting at something really interesting, Haley, about how your relationship with both your queerness and your autism has kind of evolved over time. And that just gets me thinking a lot about like my relationship to my own autism and my own queerness, because I was diagnosed, like you, I was diagnosed very young. And I knew about my diagnosis when I was very young. And it was kind of like portrayed to me as a defect of mine, almost, or something to be overcome. So I kind of framed my own story the way that everyone around me framed it as like this great story of triumph. But then when I got to college, like you, I also had a very, my undergrad experience was rough. My grad school experience was a lot better, but the first, especially the first year of undergrad, like it was rough. And I was just like, you know, I don't feel like I have overcome anything even at this point in my life. And in terms of representation, a lot of the narratives that a lot of the autism narratives that kind of, I guess, consumed or that I was either present that was presented to me were stories of parents who had to take care of autistic children and not really stories about the autistic characters themselves. Exactly. And like on one hand, you know, those like Sarah Kerchak writes about this beautifully in her memoir where she, she and her mother are in Vegas and she's experiencing sensory overload and she has to like, she like her mother reaches out to touch her and she kind of like jerks away. And she has to go to a bathroom to calm down. And she writes, you know, like the story of the mother of questioning her child loves her, can't bear her touch. Like, that's the moving story that wins awards. And it's valid. But there's this whole other story going on. And it never really occurred to me to be like, I had to think about, was this my parents struggle or was this my struggle? Because I was the one going through all of this. That actually leads me to my next question. I know we like to talk a lot about like, you know, problematic portrayals of autism and clandestine in the media. But I kind of want to shift to like, what are some of the least problematic or best examples of neurodivergent and or disabled LGBTQ representations you have seen in the media? I will start off with that. It's slowly getting better. There's more of a, of a, like, I don't know, a zeitgeist, a consciousness of what neurodiversity is. And one of the portrayals I like the best are Rue and Jules. And before you for a great show. Still need to watch it. When they're introducing Jules character, it is about kind of her trans journey. But it also she is described as having very specific autism symptoms, recurring thoughts. You can't, you know, having trouble forming words. And with Rue, so many of her things might be attributable to something like bipolar disorder or something. But she is very heavily coded for neurodivergency. And they are both queer, you know, and it's a, it's a very touching relationship. And I just really enjoyed that representation. For me, it's, it's kind of interesting because it kind of ties into my play that I wrote for Leonore Companions. But there's a wonderful show on Freeform called Everything's Gonna Be Okay, which is the first time that I have seen an actually autistic actor play an autistic character, let alone multiple actually autistic characters playing actually autistic characters. And so the show, if you don't know, is about an Australian guy played by Joss Thomas. He's gay. And he finds out his, his stepdad has passed away. And he has to move to America and take care of his stepsisters who are teenagers in high school. And one of them is her name is Genevieve. And she's, she's definitely coded as like having like some sort of anxiety or depression. And she's wonderful. But her older sister is named Matilda. And she's played by Kayla Cromer, who is actually autistic. And Matilda is autistic. And she's, you know, a teenager, and she's figuring out things about her sexuality for the first time. And throughout the course of the first season, she realizes that she likes girls. And there's another autistic girl in her class at school named Drea. And they, they start, they fall in love. And it's really, really wholesome and feels very authentic. And as someone who is a, who is an autistic lesbian, and who has been longing to see, you know, because I mean, yeah, there are some like autistic gay characters in things. I can't really name all the stuff in my head, but like indefinitely plays. For example, Dave, your wonderful play, Light Switch, which I love so much. But seeing Matilda and Drea's relationship was the first time that I had felt completely seen by a television show, not only just because the characters, but the actors were also autistic. So it was extra authentic. And it's really beautiful. I'm actually, they're doing a panel right now with Autism Society on Facebook about season two that obviously I can't be at right now, but hopefully it's good. And they talk more about Matilda and Drea's relationship in season two, because I'm concerned because, I don't know, TV loves to do drama and be like, Oh, wait, maybe that was just season one. Maybe they'll work out. I don't want them to break up. I love them. But that show, at that point, the only other autistic lesbians that I'd seen in the media was a play I'd written myself, which was for our companions. And so when it got chosen by Pride Place to be, you know, have an equity reading, they were like, Okay, so you're very part of the casting process. Give us names. Who do you want in these roles? And I was really like, I want Kayla. I want Kayla or Lillian who plays Drea. I want either of them has Nora, who is our autistic main character in Forley and our companions. And I got to work with Lillian, which was incredible. And she was such a gift to work with. She was so wonderful. And, you know, she felt seen by my work, which was all that really mattered to me more than anything like, Oh, hey, I'm getting industry reading. That's super cool. No, I was getting an actual autistic actor to work on a piece about an actual autistic character that I put a year and a half of my life into writing. Like I wrote this play most of it in college. It wasn't my senior thesis piece, but it was a piece I spent most of my last year and a half of school working on and writing. I submitted to the to the festival on a win. So when I found out I got in, I was very overwhelmed. But the fact that I got to work with someone who is actually autistic, who's also playing an actually as a character on a nationwide television show, just it felt really, really, really good. And everything's going to be okay. It's such a wonderful show. And I'm really grateful that it's on TV and got a second season, because so many things I love like rarely get, you know, renewed for things are like, no, they're cult things. But like this show is popular enough to get a second season. And I'm really happy that it's normalizing not only autistic rep but queer queer autistic rep, which is so, so important to me. As I said, your play is incredible play. No, I think it's no, I think you're really tapping into something Haley about how you're able to create your own representation, which then allows other performers who have who are at those intersections that representation as well. So it's like, you give them that gift and then they have that and like you're able to provide the representation that you want to see, I think that's really, really incredible. That kind of leads me to like my next question. So when you are going about representing the perspective of someone who is disabled, neurodivergent, and LGBTQ, like what goes into represent representing them from your own, either autistic or advocacy practices? Well, I'm not a playwright and I don't create characters. But there's a lot of things I would like to see. I would like, gosh, in the queen's gambit, there is a trans character who is just the piano music teacher at the academy. And it was so good to see representation like that because it wasn't about her being trans, it was about her being the music teacher. And I would just like more intersectional characters to be represented because it seems like when you're doing characterization in a show or a movie, everybody is just kind of like, there's just one difference for each person, you know, and they're parceled out and it doesn't ever express the complexity that is within an individual. And I would just like to see more complex characters. And I think that's going to help a lot of us deal with our multiple things. I agree. For me, when writing autistic characters, because so far I've written three autistic characters between my two full length plays, because in my other full length play, I got a full small affair, it's not outright stated in the text, but it's definitely like, it's in the character description and like, it can be pretty much inferred that, oh, Luca, who is a non-binary stoner who is visited by the ghost of David Bowie, is autistic. Their big hyper focus is David Bowie. For me, like any of my characters who tend to have hyper fixation special interests, I do my own dramaturgy on my work so far anyway, because I haven't gotten to work with professional dramaturgs yet. So I do a lot of my own self dramaturgy and not only making sure that like the elements of their autism are represented truthfully. So like, oh, does this character stim? Does this character, like, what if their hyper fixation or special interest? Do they have like specific like texture things? They have like, you know, sensory processing things. I really like put into consideration a lot of these things. I take lots of elements from my fellow friends who are on the autism spectrum, because I have friends of, you know, all places on the spectrum, which is wonderful. I mean, neurodivergency in general, I'd say it's all in 90%, if not 99% of my friends are neurodivergent in some capacity. So I really take into consideration like, oh, has, has, have any of my characters explored this before? No, okay, I'm going to like, you know, really like, I do a lot of, I mean, I like to research when I, I want to make sure my characters are as truthful as possible. And when it comes to their hyper fixation, special interests, I deep dive myself. I end up, you know, gaining sometimes a new special interest or hyper fixation in four linear or companions, nor is special interests is the Oz books. I myself had a massive special interest in the Oz books when I was in elementary school, middle school. And then it came back to me when I was in college, when I moved to New York, and I could go to books of wonder, which is a children's bookstore that actually specializes in antique children's books. And the Oz books is like kind of like when they're flagship, like we print these on demand. So we have a lot of them. And I could actually finish my collection after 14 years, which was very cool. But, and for God of Small Affair, Luke is obsessed with David Bowie. For me, like, I mean, I always was aware of David Bowie. And this ties into like the non binary and, you know, gender stuff, being able to like really deep dive into David Bowie and realize, wow, like maybe it was like my use in terms of, you know, kind of transcending gender and just doing art for art's sake, and sort of just presenting, you know, as you know, this, you know, it's David Bowie kind of impossible to describe, because he's just that freaking cool. But really getting to deep dive into that and like channel my thoughts and feelings about, you know, becoming, you know, having a special interest in this person for the first time into this character, who's also autistic. It's just, I love doing this with Mike. I love doing this as part of the research and the ending process of my plays. It's like my favorite thing. Actually, it's harder to like write the actual script than it is to like sort of create my characters, because the character stuff is just so natural for me, because these characters are parts of me. And I just try to, as I say, I make these characters as truthful as possible. They're from my life. And as I said, I try to make my own representation. So I'm just, that's really all I do with my work. So representations like your own form of advocacy, you would say? That's actually yes, between that and like my constant, you know, sharing fellow autistic peoples, you know, stuff on social media, you know, support and other, you know, autistic and queer and lots of overlap. I know I went to your, I went to your production at ASU, the virtual production. I, you know, I mean, it was wonderful. I just honored to be there. I mean, I'm just trying to support as many fellow queer autistic creators as possible, a lot of overlap, especially in the circles of Twitter that I'm in. So it's really nice to be able to support fellow queer autistic people. And that's really, yeah, my advocacy is supporting others, but also, you know, creating stuff, which is my own advocacy. Great. So Damon kind of already answered this question, but I'm curious what you both kind of hope for disabled neurodivergent LGBTQ plus representation in the future. I think not just in the media, but also in like real life in general. Well, recently, there was the big kerfuffle over Sia's movie. No, we don't have to be. I will say, I actually, I just did an interview somewhere and they asked me like what they thought of that movie. I was so glad I had seen it because I could like go off on, go off about it and be like, yes, I've seen it. So I can actually back up my opinion. This film really is. Anyway, yeah, yeah, this is a, this is a no good things to say about music zone. But about that, it's just, I hope that the industry learns a little bit about how badly it can go when you do not consult autistic people when you're putting together an artistic endeavor. It's just the most frustrating thing about advocacy for me is just, you know, I was already having to go plenty of rounds with people to be heard just being female. And then I came out as autistic. And, you know, now I'm trans masculine non binary. And it's just like, there's all these layers of trying to be heard. And I think artists who are creating, especially drama and stories, that's just so many hurdles. And of course, I would love to see more actually autistic actors and producers and camera crews. You know, I think that would be amazing. The best, honestly, the best non fiction representation of autism I've seen in the past year is I am Greta. Yes. I love Greta. Yeah, it showed how we all struggle. And but that we also shouldn't be praised for doing things that, you know, regular people do like going to a dance or something like that. But we should be recognized for the things we are doing that are extraordinary, you know, but with respect to how much more difficult that is for us to pull off in the first place. So that's what I would like to see. I'm absolutely here for all of that. I want to plug a friend of mine and my friend, Emily, who has circle palsy. She is in a movie that premiered this year. Was it was a South by Southwest? I won the South. I won a screenplay award at South by Southwest last year, if you know is the canceled, but it's actually coming out fairly soon on digital. It's a movie called Best Summer Ever. It's from a company called the Zeno Mountain Farm, and they're super committed to having an entirely inclusive, integrated, abled and disabled cast. And it's a movie musical. And the cast is a mix of, you know, a lot of disabled actors and abled actors. And it's, it looks really, really cute and wholesome and delightful. And like there's actually, you know, disabled voices working behind the scenes, on the scenes, co-writing everything. It's, I'm, I read a review that basically said this is basically everything Cia wanted to make, but couldn't. And I was like, yeah, that's exactly how I feel. So I'm really looking forward to that movie, because it's, it's going to be really nice to see like this such a big step, like it's, you know, I don't know how mainstream it's going to be, but like I'm just really happy that this movie even is being made and is coming out. It was, they filmed it in 2017. So it took them, like usually I find it a distributor, like it was going around festivals and stuff. And I'm so happy if I got a distributor. I'm very looking forward to that. But on top of that, just in general, they obviously more actually autistic, you know, autistic, neurodivers and disabled characters in any sort of media, everything really. I mean, and also just not even media. Like, obviously, like I would love to see, you know, more, you know, autistic and queer people, you know, in our government. I saw a thing, I can't remember. I think she's Senator from Delaware. And she's one of the first trans senators or representatives in Congress, which is super cool. There's just a lot of, I mean, I think Mayor Pete is now, you know, he's Secretary of Transmission Pete, which is awesome. We have, we have a game in, in like major cabinet position, which is super great. But obviously, like, it would be just really nice to see more openly queer and autistic people and disabled people, you know, running for office. I agree. I think it's, we need full representation in society, you know, legal representation. We need representation in mental health services. We need just support autistic and neurodivergent people who are having trouble in, in academia. I got a full scholarship to college, full ride. And I did, I had trouble with the transition from high school to college, ended up losing that scholarship. And I have most of a special education degree, actually, that's where I found out about Asperger's syndrome as it was called then, you know, not until I was full grown and in grad school, you know. And I was just like, oh, that's it, you know. But I wholly encourage people I know, people within my network and the advocacy advocacy community who aren't just doing advocacy work. My best friend is a neurodivergent trans woman who is just about to graduate from law school and go do an internship in New York at the Center for Constitutional Rights. And we're just really spitballing a lot of ideas about how to make things better in general. And yeah, I hope we get more neurodivergent and queer neurodivergent queer people in academia as well. Right now I'm taking online musical theater writing classes and I'm taking a music theory sort of course with an actor friend of mine. And they are the first as far as I know, queer and neurodivergent teacher that I've had, like ever, that's like both. I've had queer, I've had a few openly neurodivergent openly neurodivergent is the big thing I've had a few openly queer teachers before mostly high school and college. But not until like post college when I'm taking like classes for maybe an associate's degree. And I can get a teacher who is also a friend of mine, but is also just the first openly neurodivergent and queer teacher I've had is super cool. Yeah, when I was when I was for a class that I was teaching a couple of years ago, you know, we were at the beginning of the semester, we were asked to share a little bit about ourselves. And I was like, Okay, what is it about? What can I say about me? That's actually interesting. Oh, I'm autistic. Okay, I'll say that. So I kind of like offhandedly said, you know, I was diagnosed with Asperger's when I was three, I'm autistic. And that was kind of bad for me. But then after the class, I have like, three different students come up to me and say, Hey, I'm autistic too. So thank you for like being open about it. And I was like, Oh my God, like this, like, people are actually impacted by that. And it was like something that I didn't even think about. So that's why whenever I'm teaching, I try to tell my students, if you've never met a queer neurodivergent person, congratulations. Now you have. I love that. I love that so much. It's really interesting in the past year, since like I've started like having plays, having readings and whatnot. And since I joined new play exchange, and my stuff is out there. And I openly, you know, like have it in my bio, like it's the first thing I like all my bios and everything that like, Hi, I'm an actually autistic, non-binary lesbian. Like, Hi, this is what I do. But in the past two months already this year, like between January and April, I've had two separate people DM me saying, Oh, hey, so my college acting teacher, like we were reading your early in order in our class, and I got to read it. And this is the first time I felt seen by theater before. So thank you for writing and like, helping other students, because I mostly write for younger audiences for the most part, but like, you know, my my generation, because I'm I am a 94. So I mean, we're 94. So I'm like, I mean, technically I'm a millennial, but I feel closer to a zenial just because I mean, I'm, I'm on the autism spectrum. So I tend to, you know, my hyper fixations and my interests tend to be often a little younger than my actual, my actual age. So I am, I'm very aware of that. And even then most of my internet friends are younger than me. Most people don't realize I'm nearly 27, because I just am so nice. And it's one of the perks in way of being autistic is that, I don't know, sometimes people even think you're really mature for your age, or, you know, you're actually really, really useful. And like, kind of in that sort of like, middle zone of like, I don't know, like, and it's kind of nice, because as an ordinary person, it's like, wow, that's like, kind of the ideal really, because I'm not super young, I'm not super old, and I'm just not really a gender. I'm just sort of here and I exist, and it's cool. And I feel really empowered by that. I don't know, just strange how you were mentioning about seeming or looking younger or older. When I was a child, I was considered like extremely mature, professorial. I got along better with adults and never got kids my own age. I only I was friends. I was that kid who was friends was best friends with their teachers. Like, I'm, I'm, when I was in high school, really specifically my all my history teachers were like my best friends, which was, I was an English teacher. I am a writer. I just write fiction, I have a blog and stuff. But as far as representation goes, y'all are a little younger. I cannot tell you how vastly different my life, my adult life would have gone. I have not been mentally stable until about four or five years ago, after I finally got out of, you know, the criminal justice rehab system the last time. But it's because I never saw myself. And if I saw vague and often insulting, insulting representations of myself, that was negative. It taught me to hate myself more. And if you can't see yourself, you can't know yourself. And it just contributed to my general dysphoria with the rest of the world. You know, everybody knew I was different in these odd, sort of vague, undefinable ways. But, you know, there was no name for it. And because of when I was born, I was not diagnosed in childhood, because it just wasn't considered, especially since the new science hadn't trickled down to the Deep South. And I am female, assigned female at birth. But otherwise, I was such a stereotypical little autistic boy, you know, it was just great. I had boy interests, I was into dinosaurs big time and science fiction and trucks. And, you know, but of course, just like being learning to put on the mask for neurodivergency, you learned how to put on the mask on your gender, too. Yeah, I mean, I when I was growing up, most of my is funny. Still to this day, like, yeah, I'm a lesbian. And I love I love women. I love, you know, I love non binary lesbians. I just it's it's interesting because so many of like my hyper fixations and social interests have been very, you know, male mask oriented. And like as someone who is I consider myself, I mean, at least, you know, mask of center, because I don't really consider myself having a gender at all. I'm just very proudly androgynous. But when I was a kid, like, yeah, I was big in dinosaurs, big into like, you know, marine biology, and I don't know, like fantasy books and science fiction books. And I played a lot of Pokemon, I still play a lot of Pokemon, video games in general, like I said, big, weird Sonic the Hedgehog phase in middle school. Um, I mean, I'm most of my friends were like, I mean, I had like three like best friends who were girls, and they're still my best friends. But so many of my friends growing up were boys. And then, you know, once I figured out about sexuality and figured out I was I was not really into guys, or at least figuring out slowly that I was not in the guys, you know, trial and error. But by by the time I fully figured out, you know, came into my own, figured out, you know, everything about my identity, and personal personal who I am, like it all really kind of clicks and makes sense. Like, I was looking back like, oh, wow, I had this ever fixation on Alan coming, like, yeah, that makes sense. Because, you know, I'm super, super queer and, you know, super androgynous. I just I definitely had a lot of those, you know, and I said I didn't really realize I was masking until, you know, I fully came into my own. Like, I just sort of, as I said, I was so oblivious treating social because I didn't know I was masking. I didn't know that, you know, I was autistic and like, oh, after school, I'd go to like, you know, these like social pragmatics groups and like, you know, have like specific, like, doctor, I don't know, they're doctors, you know, like, you know, therapists, people who I like go to and talk to. And like, they talk to me about like social stuff. And I guess I played along, but I thought all kids in my generation did that. And then when I realized, no, wait, I just, that was just me. Like, I knew it was in like one or two late classes in school that were specifically for like special needs kids. So it's like, yeah, because I have a really bad ADHD. Okay. But then once I fully was like, yeah, no, it's autism, it's Asperger's. I really hate using the term Asperger's. But the time like, I was like, yeah, I have Asperger's. And then by the time I was like, no, by the time I was in college, like, yeah, no, I'm autistic. It's autism. It's autism. Don't be afraid to use the word. Because frankly, Asperger himself is not a very great person. So I prefer to just use autism. It's just been really interesting to like chart that course of what things stayed the same, which things change, because there was a point like right before I fully came out as non-binary, I was super ultra. Like maybe the most femme I'd ever been 2017 was just a mistake. It was actually, it was 2017. Like, I was my hair was the longest it ever been. I was wearing dresses all the time. It's like impress guy in relationship that I was in that was really toxic and gross. But I was like wearing a lot of dresses. I was just being very looking back like, wow, that was such a mistake. And that was like me like, basically rebelling against how I really felt about myself and what I knew about myself deep down. So by the time now that ended in 2018 happened, I was like, yeah, no, I'm going to be my true self. And everything is so much more comfortable. I was so confused for so long. I am pansexual. To me, that means that when people filter potential partners, they'll usually run through the gender filter first. Is this person the gender I'm attracted to or not? But I've just never felt that way, even from first grade, I got crushes on little girls and little boys. And just, but again, part of my masking was the path of least resistance, which meant I ended up dating a lot of bisexual men and closeted trans women. And it's just hilarious looking back on that and going, oh, I was always in queer relationships. Relationships are always very trippy because I was so desperate. And like once I figured out, you know, sexual stuff, like for a week until maybe I realized I liked women when I was 14, my first trip to New York to see theater, I saw Laura Benanti in Gypsy. And I didn't even know, I didn't know what stripping or burlesque was. So this is the first Broadway show I see. And it's literally, Laura Benanti is, you know, is a burlesque artist. And I'm just like, who are you? You're the most beautiful woman I've ever seen in the world. But I'm like, you know, Tanty slings downs. I'm seeing Daniel Radcliffe in Equest tomorrow. And so, and I saw it. And I was like, yeah, a lot of them. Okay. And like, yeah, like, yeah, I mean, sure, yeah, he's a great actor. And I was like, kind of very unfazed by everything. So it's like really interesting, like, chart, like, yeah, so I figured I wasn't super into men. But the thing is comp head, compulsory heterosexuality pretty much dominated my life until, until what least, you know, my mid 20s. I mean, about, I mean, right before my mid 20s, really, like early, early, early 20s, really. So once I, you know, after, you know, multiple relationships with men that just were not great, one was good, but like, we broke up on completely mutual terms, and then other men were just mistakes. But then by the time I was like, Yeah, no, I love, I love women. And I just felt really comfortable with that. I mean, I'm still, I can still panromantic, because I have romantic feelings for so many people. And like, it can be between, you know, it's because I have a lot of love for us. And I'm also polyamorous. I'm in an open relationship with my girlfriend of five plus years. I mean, I'm just very open about sexuality and stuff. And I did better with, I did better with open relationships. My most successful ones were open relationships, because I felt like that took, I was at the sole focus of another person. And it would take up all my spoons. And I couldn't be everything to one person because I barely take care of myself, you know, my open relationship with my main partner, like still felt, you know, solid and secure. And just, I mean, it's interesting to just, I mean, it's always different things are constantly changing. I mean, I'm still, it's still open relationship. And it's wonderful. You know, see pandemics make things harder to like, you know, try to find more people, you know, pursue more people to, you know, not of course. I was just starting to get out there again. Exactly. It's like me finishing along. And I was just like, no. Like I'm done with college. I can go, I can go to, I can go to the cubby hole like whenever I want, because like, I never got, I never got to go to the cubby hole. It's a famous lesbian bar in New York. And finally I can go here and say, nope, pandemic. Sorry. I'm at my regrettable ex who's a male at the cubby hole. Talk about irony. And for me, it was like, my dating life wasn't exactly great before the pandemic hit. So when it did, I was like, let's change the all. Yeah, it's, it's really interesting to process. Like, because my play, God was with me, there's so much about relationships and quarantine and polyamory and touch starvation and, you know, long distance relationships. And I mean, as I said, like one of the main characters is like autistic and is into polyamory and is in, you know, a, it first starts out to play in a long distance relationship that's like made long distance because of the pandemic. And then, you know, let's have to read the play to find out. Love and the time of COVID. Pretty much. Pretty much. Well, hopefully with, well, Damon Haley, with people like you, you give all of us a lot of hope for the future of LGBTQ plus slash disabled slash neurodivergent representation. I just want to thank you both so much for your time and for your words and for your wisdom. And I want to thank Spectrum Theater Ensemble for hosting us. And I want to wish you all a great day. Thank you for having me. Of course.