 How can science science as we know it be so wrong about consciousness? I mean, we're talking about a situation where pole after pole shows that 90% of people in the United States completely disagree with this biological robot meaningless universe brain centered idea that we have about consciousness. So the real question I guess I have is how can we really trust science going forward? You're a great advocate of science. You speak eloquently about the scientific method about how beautiful science is done properly. But I guess I turn it around. Can we really trust science when they dropped the ball so badly already? I agree that the current theories of consciousness among my scientific colleagues really do drop the ball. They really start with an unconscious objective reality of space time and matter and they try to boot up consciousness from that. And of course I disagree with them. I think that that's not the right way to go about it. And many scientists still have a feeling that, you know, if that's what spirituality means, then I will have none of it. And the other aspect to it is they feel like, look, science made great strides in using the assumption that space time and unconscious matter are the foundations and it's truly stunning what's happened in the last three, three and a half centuries. It's completely revolutionized our understanding of the universe. The technology that's come out has been stunning and it's raised humanity's level of life dramatically. So there's this feeling among the scientists that look, the physicalist framework was our way of getting away from the weirdness of the spiritual traditions and breaking free. Look what it's done and it has been dramatically successful. So that's part of where they're coming from.