 Julie, did anybody say they weren't coming? No, I didn't get any emails. No. So I counted, it looks like we still need eight people for a quorum. Nicole, for that five week class, which I met every day? No, so it's actually an online class. So that's the other thing. Okay. Yeah, so I have them, I have it set up where they have class on Wednesday and Friday, or at least that's an assignment to do. So when is the five weeks over? June 25th. Oh, that's right. Coming up. So part of their assignment is to review the comprehensive plan. So. Oh, wow. Yeah. Hello to all. Hello. How are you? Good. How are you all? I couldn't get to you earlier. We have two minutes before we go live before the meeting start. Three. One minute before the meeting start. I missed a snail. I'm glad to know that you got the invite. Okay. Yes, I did. Thank you. You're just one person away from a quorum. So now we did change the agenda. We're going to let the housing authority to go first. It's now six o'clock. Good thing I was on time. I think I'll give it one more minute, Julian. Okay. All right. Good evening everyone. Thank you for joining us tonight. I'm going to call the meeting of the. Thursday, June 9 affordable housing implementation committee to order. We are hoping to have a special guest later and I'll let you know. I did want to mention that Stella Adams, unfortunately has had to resign for health reasons. And we'll talk about vacancies later in the meeting. But thank you all for coming. The first thing is roll call. Juliet. LaVon Barnes. Laura Beatty. Cal Balsman. Diane Katate. Here. Here. Lucia Constantine. Yes. Nicole Deeds. Tiffany elder. Here. Courtney James. I Jarvis Martin here. Sorry, that's, this is Courtney. Okay. Thank you Courtney. Thank you, Mr. Martin. Rita Aura McDaniel. John Parker. I'm here. Okay. Okay. The next slide. The next one is for the monitors here. Timothy Stahlman. Here. Angela. Big Lewis. Roll call is complete. Thank you, Julia. Next is to review the agenda and ground rules. And I believe you can all see the agenda on your screen. We've made some minor adjustments. But. We'll go over the ground rules. We'll approve the minutes of both the March 3rd and the May 5th We'll hear updates from the Durham Housing Authority, followed by the Community Development Department's financial report. We'll talk a little bit more about subcommittee engagement. And then if we have any attendees, we'll have public comment and wrap up. So thank you again for joining us. Juliette, can you pull up the Gram rules again? Yes. Okay, so we've been doing this a while now, but please show respect for others and opinions, presume goodwill, be fully present. We'll have just one speaker at a time for our virtual calls and please remain muted until called upon. And committee members can raise their hand to speak. We will do public comment later and comments in the chat will be reviewed and addressed as feasible. Sometimes between meetings, we've been able to get to them lately. And please, in your comments, use specific examples and enjoy the process. So next up is Tiffany with the two minutes for March and May. Okay, and we do have a quorum. So first, are there any amendments to the March 3rd meeting minutes? And if not, do we have a motion to vote and approve these? So move. And the second. Second. All right, all in favor of approving March 3rd, 2022 as submitted, say aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Minutes approved for March 3rd, moving to May 5th. Are there any amendments to the May 5th minutes? Okay, do we have a motion to approve May 5th as written? So move. Second. I can second. Thank you. All in favor of approving the May minutes, the May 5th meeting minutes as submitted, please vote aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Any approved? Any, any opposed? My brain. Okay, May 5th meeting. Juliet, Courtney seconded the second one. Perfect. Thanks, Tiffany. All right, we'll go straight to Durham Housing Authority staff for your updates. Thank you. Good evening, everyone. So we will proceed with our updates and as per usual with the last, really since the pandemic started here, we've been giving you updates on what's been happening with our rental situation for a lot of our families who have been struggling to pay rent during the pandemic. Next slide, please, Juliet. Next one. So the program, which we call a fresh start was designed to make sure that we could prevent unnecessary evictions due to people's inability to pay rent, particularly because there's been impacted by the pandemic of 2020. Next, you could go and click all the rest of these, please, Juliet. So most of this you've actually seen already. It's showing you what the updates are for the various rental assistance programs when being ERAP-1, which was administered by the county. All assistance payments have been received from that, from those folks that applied. And then for ERAP-2, which is administered by Legal Aid, we had an estimated number of 277 individuals that have applied. We've received thus far $37,000. With respect to that, the estimated amounts that were applied for were $437,000. And it is our understanding at this point that we will not receive any additional funding from that ERAP-2 program. We are working with the city on a potential way to be able to assist more families, but that is where things stand at this point. We have 418 families that have entered into repayment agreements with us. The remaining balance on those 418 families is $729,000 plus. That 277 that you see above in the 418, there is overlap with those two. So you don't add those two numbers, you deduct some of the 277 from the 418. We don't have the exact numbers on that yet, but it's safe to assume that most of the 277 are part of that 418 households that are currently under repayment agreements. Next slide, please. And I will turn it over to Mr. Anthony Snell, who will update us on what's been happening with our redevelopment efforts. Okay, thank you, Mr. Scott, and good evening to everyone. Hope you are doing well. I just wanna spend a few moments with you this evening to update you on the progress at JJ Henderson Rehab and then our new construction at JJ Henderson. As you know, and I don't know if we told you at the last meeting, we have actually branded or named the new construction at that site, The Joyce. And that, oh, I'm sorry, I was reading the note from somewhere in there, I thought it was a note for me. But with respect to The Joyce, that name came from a former board member who happened to also have been a resident at McDougal Terrace and also was the first female to complete the Physicians Assistance Program at Duke. She was not only the first female, but of course, the first African-American female to complete the program there. So we are very honored to have The Joyce as the name of our new construction project there at JJ Henderson. This is just the general slide of our projects that are in the DDMP. We can move forward from here, Julia. So just a quick update on the JJ Henderson Rehab. We are moving along quite well at that site. We are anticipating completion for the fourth quarter of this year. We are reaching that 75% of construction completion at the project. I think when I did this early on, I said 104, but I'm sure we are exceeding more than 104 of the units that have been completed of the 177. And then we are planning a fourth quarter ribbon cutting ceremony in which we will be extending invitations to you to join us for this event. And you will get an opportunity to tour the building and see the actual improvements to the building. Next slide, please. I started out talking about The Joyce, which is our new construction, our old seniors' new construction that's taken place there on the JJ Henderson site. If you recall, these are 80 new units that are being built on the site. We are projecting completion the first quarter of 2023. We are now at 45% construction completion. And again, when I put this slide together, we were talking about the third floor framing, but now I think we are now on the fourth floor and then we should be topping out the building very soon. We were, right now we're trying to plan a small topping out ceremony in late June for the site. So we're making very good progress there at the JJ Henderson, the new construction. Next slide, please. And this is just a slide showing the progress that we've made. I guess I said every time when I see the grassy node there, I think back just about a year ago in August where we had the groundbreaking ceremony. And now we're coming up on almost a year and you can see the progress that we've made in that time. And we are very proud of the work that has been done by our development partner, LSR. The other thing I wanna update you on is DDMP phase two. We're calling it phase two. As you know, we went through the process last year and selected our development partners for Fayette Place, Forest Hill Heights and the DHA office and the County Criminal Justice Center site. So we made those selections and then on May the 19th we had a developer community meeting where we invited the community in to meet our development partners and to have them to present their proposed plans for the site. We are in that process. We are now in our community engagement process for each of those sites and we'll be sharing additional information with you on that community engagement. But this is where we are actually meeting with the residents, meeting with the community and discussing the proposed plans for the site, getting input into that process. And this is where we go through the process of making the adjustments to the final master plan for those sites. And that will be later on approved by our board but this is part of our community engagement process. Now, as some of you are aware, this is just this phase of the community engagement, the actual community engagement for the entire DDMP has been undergoing that had started and Mr. Scott can correct me, but I think they started this process back in 2019 or even earlier with respect to the community engagement for the DDMP. But here, since we have made our selections of the developers, we are going through another phase of that community engagement with respect to getting feedback on the proposed, the exact plans for those sites. Yeah, Anthony, we actually started our community engagement in 2016, much more earnestly in 17 and we had a much more focus, if you will, in 2018 as we began to take all of the feedback that we were given and crafted it into examples and plans and schemes and then the final version of that was in 2018 where we brought folks together to kind of comment on a lot of the feedback that we received and that led to the plan being completed in 2019. Thank you, Mr. Scott. Next slide, please. And here is just a couple of slides showing the meeting that we had on the 19th. As you can see, we have pretty good turnout as far as the community is concerned and we have presentations from our developers for each of the sites where they share their vision as part of the process. Next slide, please. And finally, I want to share with you an update on the HUD, Chorus Neighborhood Implementation Finalness Interview. Well, we had that interview today. So please forgive me if I'm stumbling a little bit because we were probably exhausted from starting an interview process this morning at 9.30 and ending at approximately 3.30 today. Well, we are happy to report that at this particular point that we are one of five finalists that have been selected for the Chorus Neighborhood Grant for this current fiscal year. So the interview process is under the weight. We were the second of the five selected finalists to be interviewed and that took place today. And as we reported out earlier with respect to this Chorus Neighborhood Initiative, our lead participants in this process include Durham Housing Authority course. We were the lead applicant along with the city of Durham. We have a downtown Durham Inc. They are a neighborhood implementation entity, Lowell Street residential, our housing implementation entity and Durham Children's Initiative is our people's implementation entity. We applied for $40 million. There's approximately $218 million available for this funding cycle. Just to give you some idea of what we are proposing to allocate those funds towards if we are successful, our housing strategy with 519 East Main and Liberty being our targeted site. We are proposing to invest $22.6 million into our housing strategy, our neighborhood strategy, which consists of critical community investments and there are five primary community investments. We were talking about $6 million there for the people's strategy, $6 million and for the administration fees and costs and relocation $5.4 million. So along with the city today and a number of our community partners and the mayor participated and the city manager this morning in the interviews that started at 9.30. We had a full day with HUD presenting further details regarding our plan and flushing out some questions and responding to questions that they had regarding our plan. I would say overall today was a success. The process is ongoing. We are hoping to receive some positive indication sometime late summer, maybe August or September on the outcome of today. Mr. Scott, you may have some further color if you wanna add to this process. No, sir, nothing new to add. We think that we did the best that we could on our proposal. I feel like we've got very good feedback from HUD team. So we just hope that the results of today leads us to a positive outcome. I saw a couple of questions that pop up, Anthony, do they want us to respond to them or? Sure, okay, speak a little bit more about the neighborhood and people strategy efforts. So go ahead, Anthony, you can take those. So on the, and hopefully I'll recall all of them, Mr. Johnson, maybe you can help me too. We, there are approximately five CCCs, I'm gonna say critical community investment strategies that we landed on with the assistance of the city. Those investments included, help me out, Mr. Scott. I know we have a basically a street improvement initiative coming from the Hay-Tag community for approximately. So Anthony, let me jump in a second. I think it'll be good to set the stage for what the Choice Networks grant is and how it's different. So this, the focus of this is what's said earlier, was around the 519 East Main Street and the Liberty Street Department site. The beauty of a Choice Neighborhoods grant, as its name indicates, is it's about more than just the site. So those two components that you heard about, the people component and the neighborhood component, are the ones that essentially take us outside of just money to help support the housing development. So with respect to the people component, there is a plan to provide ongoing interaction, engagement and assistance with the families on its site for at least up to six years. And that's part of what that $6 million would go towards. Our lead partner on that is the Durham Children's Initiative. That organization will be the lead on that. They have a whole host of partners, all of which they currently work with, with their DCI program in general, but they're specifically gonna be our partner with us on our families on this site. With respect to the neighborhood component, as Anthony was mentioning, there are five different components to that, but one of the key aspects of this is how do we connect the downtown area to the HATI community? And that's an important aspect of this. And frankly, we got a very strong reaction from HUD as we talked about this that we thought was very, very positive. So it gets at the ongoing challenge of how do you connect HATI to the rest of downtown? How do you connect HATI to Black Wall Street? So there is funding being set aside to help with improvement of the Fayetteville Street corridor, particularly going up to at least to the HATI Heritage Center. There's funding placed in there to provide facade improvements to the HATI Heritage Center, as well as an additional pot of money going towards the HATI Heritage Center. What was it? I think it was 250 for that. I can't recall what that was. Or that was the interior improvements. So all told, there's about a $750,000 of the grant that would be spent specifically on the HATI Heritage Center. There's a portion of the funding that would go towards improving that in creating a much more pedestrian friendly connectivity from HATI to crossing the 147 freeway. And that's a sort of big picture in terms of what that's for. And we can provide you with more details at the next meeting. I don't want to misstate some of our things and both Anthony and I are a little wore out from today and actually leading up to today. So rather than trying to fumble through it, I think we can come back and give you more details at the next meeting. I hope that's helpful. Thank you so much. That is exciting news. All the best with that. Before we move on, Juliette, I just wanted to mention we have several committee members that have joined us. LaVon, Lucia, Rita, Angela and Laura. Laura's having trouble getting into the panelists email, but she's on as an attendee via phone. And then also I'm pleased to mention that the newest Durham City Council member, Monique Holsey-Hyman has joined us. And Monique, if you're available, we'd love to have you make a few remarks or give you a few minutes to just say hi to the committee. But thank you for joining us. Yes, hello. I am so sorry. I'm trying to get my video to work, but we just got out of the council meeting. I'm actually still in my office at City Hall because I knew I couldn't get home and get to this meeting. So I'm trying to work out my video because for some reason my video is not working. But I want to just say thank you so much for having me this evening. And I am looking forward to working with this committee. Thank you so much. We're looking forward to working with you as well. Madam Chair, can I start real quick? Yes, please, slow down. I mean, it is being very generous out here. She is a former CAC member, so I need to represent that as the chair. So I'll put that up here. Great. And I'm no longer a former because I've been appointed that committee, so I'm back on. So good to see you. Thank you. And looking forward to working with you with some more. Good. Before we move on, are there any other questions for Anthony or Anthony? Okay, hearing none at this point, we'll move to the community development department and we get to talk about the long-awaited city financial report. So thank you, Reginald. You're on mute. Hope everybody's doing well. And, you know, I was in the same meeting that the asking is for and so it's been a long day, but we're going to keep pressing on as we do to serve our community. And I do want to say that the housing authority did an excellent job today in representing Durham. And so as we proceed, I'm optimistic, I'm optimistic. But going to the task at hand, if you remember the task at hand was to share with the Affordable Housing Implementation Committee the financial report, we've been working on that for quite some time. And so I'm glad to be able to share it. I had elected not to prepare a separate PowerPoint and have the financial report. I'm just going to speak from the financial report, but I do have a few comments to make. Of course, you know, you see this, it can be intimidating for some because it's aligned with a lot of the words and even more numbers. But it's actually relatively simple. We're going to kind of talk through it. And the first thing I want to do is orientate everyone to the document and do a little bit of refresher before we begin. And so just to recap, if everyone will remember and impart the genesis for the Affordable Housing Implementation Committee, the city council basically approved a $160 million, $159 million affordable housing plan. The cornerstone of that plan was a $95 million bond referendum that went before the voters and passed with 76% of the vote. So the resources that we had were the bond referendum with $95 million. And then we had five years because it was a five-year plan, five years of entitlement funding. What that means is that five years of funding from community development block grant, five years of funding from the housing opportunities with AIDS, hop or persons with AIDS, five years of funding with emergency solution grants, and five years of funding with home investment partnership funds. All those come from the US Department of Housing and Urban Development. There were five years of funding from the dedicated housing fund that we generate locally. And then there were the operating costs from the funds from the general fund that fund the operation. So when you add all those together with the bond referendum, over five years you come up with $159 million. I'm around up to say 160. And so $160 million. That's the affordable housing plan. And so what I'm going to do is show you where that is so we can all get orientated to that on the sheet. So what you have going across the top is you have this first column that says original budget. And then you have some other columns. I'm gonna talk about those later. But then that's going across. But then if you look going down you have the various categories. And so if you remember that with the $159 million that was divided into several categories of funding that were used in various areas on this spreadsheet, they're actually kind of color coded. And so what are we gonna do is first we're going to find $159, $160 million to start and then we'll go from there. So Juliet, if you go back to the top and then look in the once he's the original budget column and then you see the category. So the first category in green here is homelessness. Scroll down slowly, Juliet. Okay. Then you see that there's a category, a subcategory emergency shelter and rapid rehousing total. And that was one of the categories in the bond. And you can see we projected to spend. That was a projection when we created the bond referendum to spend $3.4 million. Then we had another category of how homeless system investments. The amount of money we thought at the time and remember we passed the bond in 2019. We discussed the bond and then started in the beginning of 2019, the late 2018. And there was a committee that worked on it before it went to the over the summer before it went to the voters in late 2019 and November 2019. So these are those dollars that we're talking about. Then there was another technical category, technical assistance and capacity building with 300,000. And then there was Hopwell assistance, $1.3 million. Those were the categories under homelessness and the homelessness grand total was 10.4, basically 10.4 million dollars. That's what we thought we would do. That was our goal to be able to spend that over five years. I'm gonna go into the next category just to give another example is multifamily rental. In multifamily rental, we had a category downtown revitalization and the support for the D8 Durham Housing Authority. And you've been getting updates on that project, those projects, but that was a total of $58 million. So if you remember, we talked about $58 million of the bond referendum would go to support the work of the Housing Authority. And so that's where that number is $58 million, $59 million. Then there was another category, downtown, paying acceleration, a new low income, 4% low income housing tax credits. That was a total of $16 million. And then there was another category of multifamily production and preservation. And that was $25 million. And preservation outreach was $360 million. For a total of the plan for multifamily, was $100 million over five years. And if one will remember, remember when we started this plan that our goal was to produce housing for the most need. That's the reason we were helping those and those who reside in public housing or otherwise impacted by the work of the Housing Authority. Then we go to the next category, which was neighborhood stabilization. And then under neighborhood stabilization, we had the small category, small scale production and preservation, which was $7.5 million. And remember, small scale in neighborhoods dealt with for units that were less than six, some single family homes, a range of things that were smaller and impacted neighborhoods and were not big apartment complexes. Then we had home repair and rehabilitation at 4.6 million. And then we had what we call property tax outreach and homeowner education at 650,000. And then eviction diversion was 2.3 million. And then we had the employment pilot was about basically $2.5 million for a total of just under $24 million for neighborhood stabilization. Then the next big bucket category was leveraging financing pilots. And we had the Durham Affordable Loan Fund that was one category under that, in that bucket that was one and a half million. And then the preservation, well, naturally occurring affordable housing and accessory dwelling units, three and a half million dollars over five years. And so the leveraging financing pilot ran total with $5 million. The next category is labels, salaries operating in the section 108 loan. These are more administrative costs that we knew we had to incur. And so that comes to a total of 16 and a half million dollars. And so when you have that 16 and a half in the bond issuance cost, which is just the cost of administering the bond in the section 108 loan over five years, you come up with a grand total for the salaries operating cost in section 108 loan of $20 million. When you add all that together, that's $159 million. So that's the foundation of where we are. Are any questions at that point before I go further? I have a question. Yes. Thank you for explaining the budget sheet better. This loan, property loan and the housing bond came out before COVID, correct? That's correct. Oh, absolutely, absolutely. So has there been a cost, would you say we've spent more than the budget allowed since COVID or is it the same amount of money that was allocated before COVID? No, I would say just like everything else, we've been impacted and we've talked about that earlier, but I'm gonna talk about it here, haven't gotten to that part yet. But the answer to your question is absolutely. The categories and the expenditures and I haven't talked about expenditures yet are impacted by COVID and will even more so be impacted by COVID in the future. If you remember, I talked about in a presentation that we had some projects that are having to deal with cost overall runs because of increasing costs and increasing interest rates. Does that help you to your question? Yes, so, but the cost of living rising, wouldn't that impact it more? Oh, absolutely. And this is how it happened, it's simple. It's just as simple. The more things cost, the less you can purchase with that amount of money because it's more. So how will that impact between COVID and the cost of living pack the budget as a whole? Well, we have to borrow money from somewhere else in order to keep the money to where it should be. No, we won't have to borrow any more money. What we will have to do is we probably will have to do less. Than what we originally planned. And that's what this chart will reflect when I finish working through it. So if we have to do less, and it's already, we already have several projects planned and we have to maybe cut out one or two, how will those get paid for in the future? Or will we have to ask for another housing bond? We may have to ask for another housing bond or come up with additional resources out of the $159 million. The $159 million is fixed. That's a fixed number. So it's not gonna go up or down? It's gonna be fixed at $159 million. Fortunately, we do have some money that's not in this plan. But for this conversation, we can adjust it up but unless we get some money from somewhere else. Thank you. Does that help? Yes, sir. Okay. And I'll talk about some projects but generally the point is what can we get and what are we going to get from what we originally planned? What we originally planned was in 2018, approved in 2019. Before we even heard of a thing called, well, at least for me, a thing called COVID-19 and all this impacts and the economy and all that. And so we've had to deal with two years of that and the midst of that. And so, yes, it has an impact. So now we know the budget that we had planned during the time 2018, 2019 and what we document that you have in front of me shows where we are to that point. So what you have this column called Revised Budget. So this column, and I'm gonna start with, I'm just gonna do homelessness. I'm not gonna go line by line. But the point about this category is that when we decided we didn't know each category to be able to create this budget. And so this is just a breakdown of the Revised Budget. And that's what the column is and it has more detail because you see families moving forward in line 1-8, 87,000. And this is actually entities and money that goes to those entities for them to provide services. So it's more detail. When we had the plan, we only had a number. And then we needed to fill it out as we started work and have started plans, making plans and providing services. So that's what the detail is on column G. Now, if you look at column L, column L is what we call the actuals. Well, actuals mean the dollars that have actually been spent as of February 28th, 2022. And the reason we use that date, that's the date we prepared to report. We have to do a pick a date and because we're constantly spending and you could run a report like this, or try to prepare a report every day because money is going out. But this is the date that we use because we were actually in the budget process. And so we had to have a cutoff. And so what's in that column is actual money that's in the reason call it actuals because it's actually been dispersed. Is everybody with me on that? Okay. Then we go to the next column is the budget. This is the budget for FY22. This is the current year. The fiscal year for the city runs from July 1 to June 30th, every year. And this is what we budgeted to spend. This is not what we spent for this year. And then the end of the budget year, if fiscal year, excuse me, is coming up in a couple of weeks. So this is the project what we budgeted to spend. And then what we're gonna do, we're gonna have actuals after we close the year out. What did you actually spend? Okay. Then the next column is the projected budget for FY23. So the FY23 year starts on July 1 this year of July 1, 2022. That's when the FY23 year starts and runs to June 30th. This is what we're gonna project. And this is just a projection saying that what we're gonna do and what categories and with what organizations that we're going to spend. And it's also based on how much money we have left from what we've already spent. Because remember it's fixed, as I mentioned, when I was asking, who asked the question? Ms. McDaniels, who asked the question? And I was saying that the amount of money that was fixed is fixed. So you can't add any more money to it. You have to only deal with, still have to balance out at $159 million. So Juliet, if you would go back up. And then, but because this is a projection, what we're trying to do is do a projection on what can we get for the $159 million? You know, knowing we started in 2018, the budget was approved, the bond was approved in 2019. The official year started in 2019 that we started counting on July 1. And the question is, what will we get in what spending that we will have left? And so what you see here is the next year, FY 20 fiscal year 25, we start on July 1, 2024 and runs through June 30th of 2025, what we would project to spend in that year. And then you have the grand totals. And if you look at the grand totals, and Juliet, if you go all the way down to the bottom, you see the $159 million. That's what I mean when I was sharing with Ms. McDaniels that the number was fixed. So this is after 2025, that was spent 25, sorry, get a little tongue-tied, $159 million, $150 million, okay? Yeah, I lose anybody with what I just shared, okay? Juliet, if you would mind going to the multi-family category. Is that the one you want? We're still on the same spreadsheet? Yeah, we're still on the same spreadsheet. Okay. So the first thing that I want to look at is multi-family, it starts with multi-family. Okay. There you are. All right. So we're gonna do a little walkthrough on this when I'm going to ask Ms. Lotto to assist a little bit so we can talk about this one in details because this gets to Ms. McDaniels question a little bit. So this is, we're gonna start with the first work with the housing authority. Remember that we have $59 million for the housing authority and downtown revitalization. And this is ours with line 10A. And that was a go, we just knew it was $58 million. Now as we have moved forward, you see that the one sees that we then began to work with the housing authority and you heard reports on that and defined, what was that gonna actually look like? We kind of had some ideas when we started but this is what the detail looks like. And so when you look at the revised budget you actually see different projects. These are actual projects, Commerce Street Family Apartments, Commerce Street Seniors, Durham Housing Authority, we actually should have put the list name there. DHA, Headquarters, Criminal Justice. And these are the parts of the DDNP that they were just talking about. The Main Street Bridge Loan, Dillard Street Project, the rest of the DDNP is nine, you see that 19 million. And then Elivibus Street and JJ Henderson Senior, $250,000, $56,000. So- Mr. Johnson, can I interrupt just- Yes, sir, please go here. I just wanna make it clear because the way it's labeled, it might be confused that that is to, where it says DHA, Headquarters, Criminal Justice, that's the site, that's not that money is going to a headquarters for DHA. That's correct. That is just the name of the site. So for everybody who may not know, that is not to build a headquarters for DHA. It is to build housing on our headquarters site along with the land that surrounds the Criminal Justice Building. That's correct. That's correct. And so when you look at that, based upon as of February the 28th, we had spent $2.9 million at that junction. That was the actual. Now, we've talked about how we have different plans that are underway and things that are under contract or that in development. But this is actually money that in what I share with people that's actually walked out the door. So you can plan them to spend a lot of money in different things, but until it walks out the door, it's not expended. That's what the 2.9 million means. And then when you look at column M, that is the projection of the budget for FY23. And then you see for the next year, that's actually what we project to spend on these various projects because what's going on is there in development under the early years, and now they're actually gonna be underway. And we think that there'll be one to weigh in the expended money. So that's the reason we have to project that we're gonna spend that money in that year. And then you see in FY, the next year is $12 million and the next year is $28 million. And they'll be doing more work during that time. And of course, all of that's the projection to see how things are going. And then you see after the five years, you get to the $58 million that we started with. That was something somebody was raising their hand for a question. My answer, I did this Karen, and I just wanted to jump in and clarify your point that for the projections, the numbers when it comes to the housing are actually the years that we expect to commit the funds into actual projects. The expenditure will happen over a couple of years after that. And that's one of the important things with housing because any deal is like a three-year cycle roughly. We commit in year one and which means we have a contract and then we'll actually see units typically in year three. Correct. So could someone explain to me what FY 23 means? Is that the year? So FY 23 is that next year? So FY 23 means fiscal year 2023. It begins on July 1, 2022. And it runs through June 30th, 2023. Now, is there a certain amount of things that's supposed to be finished in that year? Or is that where the money's gonna be spent? So in this particular chart, that's what Ms. Lotto was just saying. On the out years, it's when the money is committed. That means if I'm doing a project, I have to have all my money up front. And that's the year that I'm getting that money. Okay. And that's the distinction that she was making. It wasn't the year that the money is expended. That means it walks out the door. So Reginald, this is Terry Porter-Homes, the fiscal assistant director in the department. So Reginald, I think probably what happened once you go over to the matrix spreadsheet that will answer the question that I can't remember who was just speaking. That would answer the question because if I heard it correctly, it seemed like they were looking to see what are we gonna, when are we gonna see it and what will we get? And I think that was shown on the matrix spreadsheet. This here is all about money and what's budgeted. Thank you. So I was just sharing, so Terry is correct. Terry is correct. And the way she's talking about is that the other sheet that you have deals with the number of units that you get in a particular year when that is gone, but that's a different document. Right now, we're only working with dollars. This is all about dollars. Okay. Let's go, Juliet, let's go to the next category, which was still in the multi-family, but this is downtown revital, I'm sorry, downtown plan acceleration and new. So at the time, we thought we allocated 2018, 2019, $16 million for this category. This category was designed because we thought that there might be the possibility depending upon how things go that we might need to accelerate the DDP, the downtown plan, and we might need resources to help support the housing authority, or also we may need resources to do 4% low-income housing tax credits. Most of the low-income tax credits that we've talked about previous this were 9%. And basically the difference between the two is that the locality needs to come up with more money itself for 4% with 9% you got to come up with less money. And there's a major difference between the two. That's the difference. And so we have not been doing 4% because we have not had money to have 4% low-income housing tax credits. And this was designed as a bucket to be able to do that. As it turns out, if you look at the projects that are listed here, it's a list of projects that are 4% and 9%, well, 4% I'm sorry. And you've seen these before, but I'm gonna ask Ms. Lotto to kind of run through these and refresh everybody's memory on the projects that we have here. Yes, sir. So if you start at line, what's a row 68 or line 12A, ashton place, that is the second phase. If you recall the Willard Street Apartments, thank you, Juliette. This is the second phase that's being built on the remaining parcel of land next to the bus station. I believe it's 51 units for seniors. The second Farrington Road Apartments is 80 units being built out in Southwest Durham on Farrington Road, hence the name or near Farrington Road by Laurel Street Residential, that's a new construction project. That's actually being built on a parcel of land donated by a market rate developer. Hardy Street Apartments is 132 units of new construction rental in East Durham. The RFP there you see is actually four projects that we are in the process of making funding commitments to that total, I'd have to do the math, but I think it's somewhere around 400 and some units, 500 units somewhere in there. These are all 4% new construction deals. And then the last two projects are essentially a combination of a 9% tax credit and a 4% tax credit on a parcel of land that the city owns in Southside adjacent to the first two phases of multi-family. And that will yield 100 units of affordable housing. Thank you, thank you so very much. I really appreciate you allowing me to give me a sip of water. Why you weren't doing that, because thank you. So I would say the distinction between the F and the G column, remember the G column is what we planned and then the G column is what is actually turned out. We didn't know these were gonna be the exact projects. You know, at the time we came up to $16 million and what it's actually turned out is that we have projected that we would spend more money because one, we needed to produce more units and then some people had some good projects and we were able to get these projects and weigh in different forms. And so that amount of money increased. But of course, when you have a fixed amount that means it needs to come from somewhere, okay? But then we talked about what did we actually spend to date is $410,000. And then in FY 22, we budgeted $1.1 million and then you see begin to see based on when these projects will start, when they need the money committed, that's what you see in the projections. So some projects will start right away. Some start projects will start in two years. Somebody will start in a year, some you will start in three years. It depends upon the complexity of the project and when the other funding will be ready because our funding is just one piece of the funding for the entire project. It's not the entire project itself. And so you see that in this category, we projected to commit money in 24 and 25 at eight and four, eight million and 15 million. And then you see the total, there are 35 million that's in column G and that means that you run in a deficit in that category, meaning you spent more money than you said of about 19 million. Well, I say spent and committed because it's not just spent because you hadn't spent it but you also say projecting you don't commit. So I'm gonna pause there for questions. Did I have a lost anybody? I had one to ask the question on the Southside project. I know a couple of months ago, you said that the project was a possibility being put on hold because of the parking. So are you saying now that that project will be going underway? So no, I can't say that it will be underway. And I'm not remembering that I shared that it was gonna be on hold because of parking. The reason what the project is and the posture of the project is submitted a tax credit application for a 9% tax credit. That just went in in May, at the beginning of May and we won't know until August if the application will be successful. If the application is successful for the 9% then the project can proceed. And it was two projects the site is one site, but it's two projects, one for a total of 100 units, one has 60 units and the other one has 40 units. But it looks gonna look like it's one project with a total of 100 units. Okay, thank you. Does that help? Yes, thank you. Okay. And so what we have to do is even though they have not been successful and I'm glad you asked that question actually caused me to bring up another point is that the city council has to commit money to that project and show the part of the application that the city is committed. That's the reason we have to have the money committed upfront and show that we have the money. So in event they are considered and are accepted that they have the money to proceed from us on our portion. There's some other portions they have to get but we have to have any time we say that we're going to do something we have to have all the money upfront, basically. Okay. So I think, you know, I've spent quite a bit of time talking and we don't have to try to go through all of this but I think Diane, I know you had some questions. I did. Thank you, Reginald. I really appreciate this. And folks, when you review this in more detail if you have questions, feel free to email Tiffany and I or Reginald directly and we can try to respond to those. Reginald, I had a question that I had shared with you earlier from Jim Zvara about the CDD-OEWD DHA employment pilot. The revised budget shows roughly 2.5 million and it shows projected budget in FY24 and FY25. So is that the answer that that has been postponed or is that one work will begin? And to your point about units when it's actually training and people does that occur in the year that it's projected as opposed to any lag? Good set of questions. I'm going to ask Ms. Lotto to respond to that but I would also share that this is an example of something that's been impacted by COVID, Karen. Yes, sir. So first to answer your last question first went because this is a services, the year that it's shown as projected is the year that we expect to spend it. Right now, we have been working with our colleagues at the Office of Economic More Force Development to develop a construction training program to try to take advantage of some of the construction work that is happening that's being funded by the city through Forever Home Drone. That project has been kind of very slow moving and was really put on hold during the pandemic because the pandemic resulted in a great big limitation on the ability to do group training. We are just now picking that back up and are entering into a contract with the state and the North Carolina Home Builders Association to provide two training courses a year that will give opportunities for 16 people to be trained. And then OEWD and the city will provide or follow on support with employment to folks who go through that training program. In addition, we are also, OEWD is in the process of identifying and contracting with a couple of vendors who will also provide additional construction related training and then and kind of follow on employment support after that. So we expect to start seeing people going through training classes next fiscal year. So actually we hope to start spending money sooner than we have shown in these projections but we were taking a conservative approach. And then to continue spending and training people for the next three years. Diane, is that, I'll answer your question. Yeah, sorry, I was on mute and speaking. So thank you, Karen, that's very helpful. I guess the question is, if people are particularly interested in watching training, is it best that they look for updates quarterly or that they write directly to you for additional information? Once we have training up and going in a real way, we will be posting updates definitely on the website and we will certainly be posting training opportunities on the website. If people in between they'll want more information, I think it's always okay to reach out to ask. Great, that's helpful. Did anyone else have questions? And otherwise I guess we'll continue on. Okay. Raise hands, okay, go ahead, thanks. All right, super. I have to step up to close the door, I think. All right, all right. So I would, Karen, if you would talk about the preservation outreach. Yes, the preservation projects are just the outreach portion. It's the outreach portion, it's the outreach portion itself. So the preservation outreach is another area of work that has been slow moving and somewhat impacted by the pandemic as well. The goal there is to really try to proactively identify preservation opportunity projects of two kinds. The first is really to get ahead of projects, currently income restricted projects that are coming towards the end of their affordability period to begin conversations with those developers about their interest and ability to maintain those projects as affordable going forward. And the second has been to really try to identify market rate and the kind of naturally occurring affordable housing purchase opportunities. We have the affordable housing loan fund in place to really provide capital for some of those quick purchases, but it's been more of a challenge to actually identify those purchases. I will say at this point, we are just starting with some market assessment work and really trying to figure out what the scope of the opportunity is in terms of preservation of naturally occurring affordable housing. The reason is there is so much private capital in the market right now in Durham that units are selling so quickly without ever and for kind of above appraised value that it is very hard to figure out how to really get a foot in the door as an affordable housing developer and whether that is the best place to spend our energy versus trying to preserve some of the existing affordable housing that we have that is already income restricted and is potentially at risk. So we are still at the early stages of trying to figure out where to go with that. And at this point have sort of a limited pool of capital to deploy. So we're going to have to make some decisions in the coming year about which direction we're going in. Thank you. So if you look at the line 20 on the multi-family rental grand total, you see there was a hundred million dollars. We talked about the original budget and because of the projects that we have it comes up to 106 million. And then if you go all the way to the last column, next to the last column, you see in 106 million total that you is the revised budget and you see the difference between the original and the revised budget is a negative 16 million. That means you're over six million in that category. And that's what the projection is over the life of the five years. So next we'll go to the neighborhood stabilization and Juliet, how long time? Yeah, about seven more minutes. I'm keeping up. All right. We will just work until my time. And then we'll continue the next time. So the next is the neighborhood stabilization category. And remember, this is the category that was focused more so on neighborhoods and projects in neighborhoods. And so they had small scale projection and preservation. We projected said that we plan to spend seven and a half million dollars over five years. And then when we develop the projects, we only have one project. That's defined with the vendor right now. And that's with DCLT, but we actually go planning to issue some requests for proposals in future years. And so that's what you have here. So it's no, nothing that's actually spent to date to February, 2028 of 2022. There was nothing budgeted in FY 22 the current year. And then the projections, you can see when we project to commit money, but those are going to be based on RFPs requests for proposals that will be issued at that time or near that time. And so that's what you see in that category. I would also say that this is also an area that has been delayed putting part due to COVID and due to staffing challenges that we have had during and just before COVID. Five more minutes. Okay. Thank you. The next category that we have is home repair and rehabilitation. And I asked Ms. Lotto to speak to that, that category. Yeah. So that category includes two different and related activities. The first is minor repair, minor repair or smaller repairs are, are for own homes owned by seniors or people with disabilities. We currently that program was significantly impacted by COVID because we really couldn't do work during the pandemic because no one wanted people coming into their house, even if though the workers were willing to go in, people didn't want vendors coming into their homes during the pandemic. But we do now have a contract, a new contract in place with Habitat, which is our, our partner to do those repairs. And they are active working very actively. In addition, Habitat is also responsible for doing intake, which is to say identifying eligible households and homes for our other program, which is the substantial rehab program. The substantial rehab program is a, a loan program, a forgivable loan program also for seniors and people with disabilities who may need larger scale repairs. So repairs, you know, in the, you know, typically in the 20 to $50,000 range in order to make their, and make them keep their home habitable. And Habitat's role is to identify potential homeowners. And then the city actually works directly with those homeowners. And, and organizes the repairs and enters into the agreement with the homeowner. We actually have our first homeowners coming through the system now. So we actually hope to start doing some of that work in over the summer. But that is an area where we have been delayed both by COVID and by staffing. And so we really are, you know, playing catch up at this point in time. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Karen. Diane and Tiffany. Please go ahead. Being that the cost of living is still on the rise. And no one has control over that. Is there a possibility that AMIs could be. Lower. I guess I was, yeah, lower. I think that's the case. I think that we should, we should match. People's incomes. Because. What. People were able to afford five to 10 years ago. With their AMI at certain levels. Because the cost of living and the cost of materials and things. Have gone up so high. That. There are no longer those same people are no longer to. Keep. for housings with AMI at the same rate that they looked at them five or ten years ago. So has the city or the county ever thought about lowering the AMI because of the cost of living and COVID has impacted people's income so much? Ms. McDaniel, can I ask a clarifying question? When you say lowering the AMI, do you mean targeting resources to lower income households? No, no. Lowering the percentage, like you will say hypothetically, this apartment is for 80% of a person's AMI income. Could that be lower to match today's standards, I guess I would say? You raise a really good question and so let me take a step back and say, so these area median income, these calculations that are given to us by the federal government so and they are the eligibility criteria for our federal programs and it's the language that is used in the affordable housing field to kind of define level of affordability. What is going on right now is that incomes in Durham are, when you look at what the area median income is, what someone who earns 80% of area median income earns now, it's significantly higher than it was five years ago. The issue is that's not because people who were necessarily living in Durham are making a lot more money, it's that what is happening is that people who are moving into Durham in Orange County, people are moving into Durham in Orange County, they earn typically more than the people who were living in Durham in Orange County and our AMI and I say Durham in Orange County is because the AMI that we work with is actually for the Durham Orange County metro area, Durham Chapel Hill MSA and so we see so what is now a 60% AMI rent is now higher because the incomes overall in the area have gone up. The problem that that's creating I think this is what you're talking about is that there's a whole bunch of people who've been living in Durham all through this whose incomes have not gone up and so that what is affordable housing may not be affordable to them because that number that is 60% AMI is creeping up because overall the area is growing and it's growing with people who earn more money and that's pushing our percentages of income up but it's not necessarily helping people whose incomes are not rising. Am I tracking Ms. McDaniel with what you're talking about? Yes so my next question is I know that the city and the county have lawyers so why don't the lawyers get together and take it to the federal courts and say look people's incomes and the cost of living is not matching up but they're asked to create affordable housings as it was once known as but no longer is. I hope I'm making myself clear just a lot of stuff is going through my head at the same time. And I think you and I think you I think so what what the city and the and can't do is change how the federal government defines area median income. What we can do is say all right we want to focus on housing for people at you know at this area median income you know 60 percent 50 percent 30 percent whatever it is we can choose to do. We can we can do that knowing that the lower we go in the income spectrum the more it will cost us per unit to house people. And the reality is because we rely on federal programs like the Longham housing tax credit to bring subsidy into most rental housing in particular and I'm thinking about rental housing. We really rely on the federal government for the first layer of subsidy and then the city is the second layer of subsidy. We we have to recognize that right now that the Longham housing tax credit is is pegged to 60 percent of area median income. The state could choose to allocate credits in a way that cert the target's lower income households. State has the latitude to do that. But the overall program is really pegged to 600 area median income. So the only thing the city can do is is really try to layer in our preferences. We do that some now where we say that any any project that receives state in order to receive city funds you must set aside 20 percent of the units at 30 percent of area median income. I think the challenge is the number of units that are being generated at the very low end of the income spectrum are just not enough to meet the need that exists or nowhere near enough to meet the need that exists there. And it is it is a challenge to increase production because both of the cost associated with those units as well as the need that developers have to ensure that their projects cash flow and and a sufficiently to cover their operating costs. So and typically the more very low income units you have in a property the greater difficulty it is for the property to actually cash flow and cover its operating expenses. So there's a there's a natural cap usually at somewhere between 20 and 30 percent. So and I'm sorry so the answer to you is we can do more very affordable housing. We can as the city choose to do that. We just need to know that in doing that we will generate fewer units because every unit will cost us significantly more. And I hope I answered at least some part of your question. And you did. So my next question and I'm sorry for hogging up the meeting tonight but there are other materials being used to build housing at a lot of cheaper costs than what we're paying for it now. So Rita let's save that question for a bit and try to get through this. OK. Other people also have questions. I see Tim has his hand up. Tim I don't know if you need to jump in right now. John also has a question. But I love we are going to extend this conversation to at least 735 and drop some time out of subcommittee engagement and wrap up. But so thank you. I'm finished. Thanks. I just had a follow up to Rita's really excellent questions which was and maybe for Karen I know that folks sort of treat the AMI as gospel truth but I don't think it's necessary that somebody at Census Bureau and an OMB is making a determination that Durham should be part of the Chapel Hill MSA for the purposes of calculating the AMI. And it would seem to me that there ought to be an appeals process for that determination. There usually is for census decisions like that process to go through where a municipality can go to the Census Bureau and say actually we don't think we should be in this MSA actually we think we should have our AMI calculated separately. And a question that I've been sitting with a lot in this process is yeah like what does that process exist? What does it look like? Obviously it might take a very long time and it might not have a big impact but we are continually seeing the way that Durham's AMI doesn't actually reflect Durham the economy of Durham and that causes that poses a big problem for affordable housing and it seems like there ought to be some way to petition the the eitherhood or the Census Bureau to change their account because some counties they calculated the county level and some calculate counties they calculated the MSA level it's not it's it's different from place to place. And so the answer would be there may be an appeal process I would have absolutely no idea what it is and how to go about it. One thing that really drives though whether it's at the county level versus larger is how big your county is and Durham's a relatively small county. So we actually used to be with Wake County Wake Durham Orange and then they split us off from Wake because Wake got big enough to be its own thing and so now we're Wake Durham Chapel Hill. I don't know to be honest how small they will go. One of our challenges we have as a county is is that we're a relatively small county. But I'm going to walk back and say the relative impact of that because keep in mind our AMI is rising in Durham as well. We're you know our incomes are rising overall the challenge that we're having is that we are layering on a whole new set of hiring people but we're not necessarily seeing the incomes of long-term Durham residents rise. The implications for us are you know the federal programs so it's probably biggest for the long-term housing tax credit they're going to say that projects must serve 60 percent of area median income and they're going to define that based on the MSA. That's that's where we really do see the biggest effect in terms of affordable housing and it's not trivial because the tax credit is our biggest source of subsidy for rental housing. The rest of it in terms of where Durham puts its own money including its own federal money is not it's not limited by the by where HUD says is 80 percent of my we could choose to spend all of our money you know at lower incomes. It is always a trade-off though because one we have to say where is is that we're just going to produce less because every unit is going to cost us more. The other is we can't build a you know we we we can't build necessarily 100 percent of our units in a building at a very low income because that building will not cash flow and so there always has to be a balance. You always have to look at some kind of of mix of incomes even if it's between 0 percent and 60 percent because you need the building to be healthy because you need to be the developer that owns the building to be healthy and so that's part of the challenge as well. But you're right I mean it is it is a real issue when it comes to the long-term housing tax credit program that the rents that they're targeting keep rising every year because our overall income on the MSA is rising but part of that's being driven by Durham. It's not all Orange County that's pulling us up and I don't know enough I can't do enough math to separate how much is which is which. And it is weighted so the relative size because we are much larger than Orange that's a good point weighted to Durham yeah in terms of population. Yeah we are more than twice as big as Orange County. Orange County's income is higher than ours but we are twice as big so the MSA number is weighted. Thank you both. John did you have a question you want to jump in here? I do it's been a really good discussion and very valuable I think I've learned a lot. I also you know before I ask my question I'll try to make it quick but I just want to say what a great resource our two Anthony's and Reginald and Karen are and thank you so much for continuing to participate in what's been a very long day. My question basically about wiggle room wondering how much wiggle room there may be in the budget Reginald there's a if we're not spending a lot of money on preservation outreach or the down payment assistance program it seems to me that like for preservation outreach if we had more housing vouchers that were being used by more landlords we're preserving the housing stock is there is there any consideration that can be given to have find the wiggle room to move money from one one category to another to make a difference you know the the down payment assistance program is there a way that we can support people that are on the housing vouchers to help them support them more and have money go towards down payment assistance that's that's my question but I'd also I saw that Bill Bell was kind of in the audience I'd be really really curious to hear what he'd have to say about all this too thank you. So I would say in part of the answer is yes we can trade off from categories and what we're ending up doing is some of that from one category to the other I would also share with you that we have this little thing called COVID that's in the midst of that too and so the impact of COVID is that some money that we have and that we will need is to keep the projects particularly the multi-family projects going so the wiggle room that you're talking about may actually accrue to keep those projects that are midstream going so we can get them to face the rising costs and rising interest rates that was part of the presentation that I shared earlier Karen you may have something else to add to that. I think Reginald that you've covered the high points that one we are looking at where we think maybe we won't be using all of the funds kind of within the time period that we've given ourselves and can we reprogram those funds we've done a little bit of that already. We are as Mr. Johnson has been very clear we are facing cost increases on our projects and we have to keep those in mind as we move forward but we really do want to as we get further along in the program see where there is there are funds that perhaps we aren't going to utilize in the buckets where they originally were and see if we can reprogram them to places where perhaps maybe we have fully utilized all of our funds. Thank you um Reginald were you going to cover any more of the chart? Yes I can I was just trying to gauge you know whether we get any information over so I'll keep going. Thanks we'll give you another five ten minutes I appreciate all the questions I think this is really important absolutely absolutely and so uh uh the next category we talked about the home repair and rehabilitation the next category was the property tax outreach and homeowner education this probably falls into the category that we just talked about and I asked Ms. Lotto to talk about that that one um yes so down payment assistance is so home ownership is an area that we are we truly are lagging um in uh in our and we've been impacted I would say mostly by staffing um on in this area in terms of getting some of our our home ownership we're going we do have our um contract in place with community home trust that is operating our down payment assistance program um and the challenge that we're going to have now is this is a really tough market for home buyers to find a product that if you are at 80 percent of area median income or below and that's our eligibility threshold it is really hard to find a home that you can afford so we are watching that program working very closely with our partner um to um see if we need to pivot and make changes um um as we go along to make it possible for homeowners to buy homes um that is really I think the primary activity that we have here is the down payment assistance program um and it we should we hope to see our first purchase is happening next year um as homeowners are able to as we knock wood that homeowners are able to find affordable product thank you and uh Karen could you just do uh the eviction diversion and we'll close with that one um yeah so eviction diversion um that is our our ongoing contract with legal aid of North Carolina we are currently in the second year of a three-year contract with them that's that 1.545 number that you see there um and we are envisioning that there is that that contract will end um at the end of calendar year 2023 and we expect that we would enter into a new contract um in 2024 but that work is is proceeding it was also impacted by COVID because of the eviction moratorium um we legally continue to work with people but what we saw was a lot of of cases basically being frozen because evictions were frozen and now we're seeing a real unfortunate uptick in evictions um and legal aid doing everything in their power to keep people in place but we're going to see a spike of evictions this year because landlords are evicting in the process of evicting people who um were they couldn't file on during the moratorium thank you uh Tiffany and Diane what I propose is that we uh conclude here and then we'll pick up at the next time and then the other document is actually the units provided and the services provided and I want to be able to go through that one too this is just a financial document right here right but for reference for people if they do pull up the other one the um the row numbers correspond even though that takes more space to get to it the the headings are the match so you can directly uh see what the expenditures are supposed to cover so that'll be very helpful thank you um we can entertain a few more questions if anyone is interested Karen can you mute thank you so much oops I don't see any hands raised so um if there are no questions or further questions um I thank you both very much all of you Terry uh Karen Reginald this is really great information it's the nuts and bolts and really important so thank you um at this point I'll turn it over to Tiffany to talk a little bit about subcommittee engagement and then we'll do probably about 10 minutes for that and then we'll move to public comments we do have seven or six attendees if any of you want to comment we'll get to you in about 10 minutes thank you thank you everyone and thank you for that info that was um quite comprehensive and very helpful uh just wanted to go back to the conversation on subgroups and the topics that individuals mentioned uh that they were very interested in doing a deeper dive on and uh it's taken a moment to sort of pull together the idea of how to implement subgroups for um this committee um but we have received confirmation that uh the subgroups might want to consider um the the specifics of which will be forwarded out to you um thank you Juliette for sending that info over the subgroups will need to be well first of all the subgroups of course are volunteer it's not a requirement of this committee those of you who um stated an interest in doing a deeper dive on topics are welcome to explore those and sort of shape what that conversation looks like within the parameters set forward by the affordable housing implementation committee as a whole and our charge um another thing to consider is that uh we have confirmed that they must be run similarly similarly to these meetings so they would have to be a public meeting um that would be organized through the clerk's office there would have to be someone leading that meeting um you know taking minutes uh bringing that information back so it would be more of a formal process as opposed to an informal sort of subcommittee meeting uh and we were looking into additional information on how those meetings would need to be set up because staff assistance for that would be very very very limited uh if uh available at all and that's something to consider so uh and again the subcommittees are self-forming uh we're going to be shooting out the information uh on the groups that you all said or on the topics that you all said were of interest to you um so that you can you know pull together uh with the names you see on there um for people who have similar interests and and you know figure out how to set the groups up but wanted to put that out there again um since forming subcommittees under this committee is a more formal process we wanted to make sure that that all of the t's were cross and i's were dotted and that information was available to get to all of you but if you have any questions now definitely questions or concerns feel free to ask uh other than that the info we've gathered will be forwarded out to everyone moving forward. Tiffany I think you had suggested that if people wanted to get together over the summer since we aren't meeting in July and August and then um ideally report back to our group in September. Yes certainly questions can come up between now and then and um so right okay that's it were there any questions for Tiffany or on this process Tiffany would it be helpful to see a show of hands from people if they are still interested in pursuing subcommittees or now that you know the requirements of such it's perfectly okay if people don't want to take this on um so I think I will ask actually okay so I'm seeing Venus and Nicole so I'm assuming you are still interested is that what we're thinking the uh hands raised I just had a question I had a question go ahead Nicole um because I was interested in doing site visits if it has to be more formal like we've taken notes and making sure that that this is documented in some kind of way I'm not sure exactly what that would look like yes understood and and I cannot answer that question as of yet right now okay oh thank you and so if if you don't mind I'll elaborate so if we were going to do a site visit to let's say Willard Street and the committee wanted to do that what we would do would advertise that and say the committee was going if if it was a majority of the members if it was just a minority of the members no we can organize that so that's what it's for because we don't want you to be unless you want to be you know have a meeting and so there's a process for that so site visits are a little bit different than having a meeting where you're discussing business okay that that makes more sense because in my mind I was like I'm not sure it's actually how this works and I can't remember how many people were interested in site visits um but I will raise my hand for still you know being a part of that committee great thanks Nicole right now we have 14 members so I think if we stay under well certainly under seven but under eight we should be okay in terms of not having a quorum and not needing to advertise but perhaps Juliet you can confirm that with the clerk um and and we may choose to do site visits twice and keep the group smaller so there can be some discussion um I will say Laura said she is still interested in subcommittees and Tim is saying he'd be interested in site visits so it does look like there's still some interest and I know there was another hand can be second did anybody else have any other comments on this I've seen a goal has it or is the hand still up Nicole's hand is still up I apologize I'll put it down Courtney's thing she's still interested in site visits um and subcommittees so sounds like um perhaps when people respond to you Tiffany they can be very specific about roles they're willing to take on in terms of meeting a group or taking minutes um or communicating with the clerk and advertising all those things so um well thank you all for your interest great all right at this point if um oh thanks Lucia see you later um at this point we can move to public comments so we have seven people well sorry one of them is Laura that had some contact trouble so if any of you are interested in speaking um sorry Julia why don't we let them all in and then I'll recognize them by hand that's probably the easiest way to do it right one second okay great we have roughly 10 minutes for public comments so okay a few people have everyone should be in okay I'm now only seeing three people but do any of or any of you interested in commenting at this point uh Philip Azar please go ahead you have two minutes for a few I want to thank you for recognizing me with our focus on units coming on and also the point was raised that with long-term affordable units and permanent affordability there's sometimes need for subsequent uh subsidies is there a way for the matrix that Mr. Johnson referred to to not only show units coming online but units rolling off and the expected cost of maintaining affordability I don't think we would need to really reserve that number and count it against any budget but um before we did the last bond it seemed like at least the affordable housing community advocacy community lost sight of the cost of preserving affordable housing second I would just say and this gets to the idea of the AMIs my impression is that the housing bond was very much passed in part large part on the narrative that we would help long-term low-income residents of Durham particularly people of color and we should be I think tracking overall how we're doing against that and by provider how we're doing against that I understand legally we can't steer there are constraints around what we can do but when city council acts in a legislative capacity they might want to know who's doing a good job and the community overall want to know how we're tracking against that goal when we look at a subsequent housing bond if we do in fact look at a subsequent housing bond and then lastly in terms of costs I would assume we're tracking costs in any number of ways by AMI by provider by city and county funds by total costs but there's also in the I think it's the action plan there's this overall statement okay I'll leave it for another time thank you very much did anyone else want to comment Juliet I still see three people as attendees that didn't move in as panelists I keep promoting them to panelists and for some reason they are parents I'm not sure if they can control it on their end okay I don't see any other hands raised I'm willing to give Philip another minute or two how much time would you like well it's two two and then we'll say thanks I think I can definitely keep it under that so in in in costs in the action plan we've always had this statement that affordable housing must be material in all ways and appearance to market rate housing and we did when we did south side rolling hills it got into stainless steel appliances marble countertops which were of course used potentially big cost drivers it seems to me what we're looking for very much is the idea that affordable housing should not be in any way stigmatized but there's a lot of costs that may exist between the gap between non-stigmatizing housing and housing that's identical in all regards to market rate housing and then there was another I think member of the the task force that also talked about materials and more innovative ways of building things but I think we need to be much more open-minded around those things so thank you very much and I really appreciate the extra time thank you does anybody else have any other comments or questions at this point all right seeing none I'm going to remind everyone that the next meeting is Thursday September 1st followed by Thursday November 3rd and that will finish I believe finish out our meetings for this year um and Reginald can you clarify I thought I heard you say that we will get an update to those financial numbers after the end of the fiscal year so sometime after June 30th and you're on mute so no actually what I was saying was that we will have actuals for that column that said uh FY 22 but I'll have to talk with the fiscal staff about when we would have those so it wasn't the update to this entire document it was update on the actual since we have to go through the process of closing out the year and so what I was saying was what we had planned for FY 22 that was budgeted for that year we'll know what the actuals are but that's a closing out the year process okay if people are interested in looking at the numbers I always refer people to the AHEC presentations and meetings for details but is there another place on the website that these numbers will be highlighted I know um or is the best place to do the deep dive into I mean so if somebody has questions we haven't put these numbers on the website yet will we be doing that yes we will be doing that but we have not yet you all have them okay and we've discussed them with the city council as well and shared the shared them with the city council but yes we will be putting them on the website but we it's a process we need to go through with that but if anybody has any questions or wants to discuss them I'll be glad to do that between now and the next time we meet one of my concerns was that this was a lot of information and for those who may not you know look at it every day it still may be confusing and so I'm willing to meet with smaller groups of individuals or talk with to help to help with that and help facilitate that I appreciate that I do know that people are interested in starting to ask questions about what's been spent and where and so I would encourage us to put it on the website with caveats and cautions but as soon as possible so I appreciate that um let's see Madam co-chair yes please Julie that's right you may need to know they are on there every presentation that we have from the meeting is automatically posted on the website so the numbers are there if I need to take it down I need to be informed this is the question that I have this is Terry um Diane what website are you speaking of are you talking about the forever home Durham or are you talking about the cities no I was talking about forever home Durham I tell people to go to the partner site and then go to the affordable housing implementation committee and then to look by meeting date where all the presentations are posted but I was hoping that it might go in a less buried place um that might be a little easier for people to find right and I understood that that was your question so the minutes from this meeting in the report from this meeting goes on the website now and Juliette would will do that and she says she's already done I understood you to mean uh a more prominent place on the forever home Durham website and just to let you all know as it relates to the actuals for the closing out of this year the books do not close until the latter part of July so we will not be able to start pulling actual numbers in until beginning the first week of August so I just want to give you a little time frame about how long that will take place that's helpful um depending on what else needs to go on agenda our agenda perhaps we can revisit this at the September meeting and do an equally deep dive just to see where we're at so that'd be great um Tiffany did you want to share anything else uh actually no I think we're covered our next meeting September 1st you will receive a follow-up by email on the subcommittee topics and hope everyone has a wonderful summer stay safe great thank you all for attending and thank you Councilwoman Hyman for joining us this evening so