 we're going to call the local control board to order those of you that haven't seen the agenda we have three different boards we're going to call to order tonight um the first is the local control board which is for cannabis sales um and first up is public comment so this would be comment on anything for the local control board that's not on the agenda i don't know if this would be i mean i am the owner um yeah we're gonna get to you you're on the agenda just uh you are the agenda so seeing nothing then we'll move on to approval of the agenda treanie is this time for comments for the school select board yep if you're going to talk about the local control board for cannabis yeah no okay thank you thank you sorry we'll go through this again when we do the liquor control board yeah um so next up is approval of the agenda motion to approve the agenda second all those in favor hi hi there somewhere just pop back on so i'm trying to see what that's yep so consider retail cannabis license for poll star cannabis so this is our maiden voyage of this process and we are on the front end i think um in terms of there just is there aren't a lot of reps statewide in municipalities in terms of how many times people have done this in the summer you voted to form a local control board that's what you're convened as this is so that you can consider the license you could condition approval on any local bylaws that might be one of those things that we see in renewal periods i mean we're thinking it's going to function a lot like a liquor license would that's what the guidance seems to suggest that's what some of the practices and other municipalities seems to suggest some of the wrinkles are different in terms of how the applications flow to us and what's included in this so we got an even mark in particular who's ill and not able to be with us tonight um i was working with the cannabis control board to try to figure out sort of how this flow would go what we heard from them yesterday we got a note that they have not yet approved this we're tied together they want to prove it until we approve it we need a formal referral from the cannabis control board is how we're understanding it we were seeking clarity if that was what this process was or if there was some other sort of formal referral the applicant is poll star cannabis john erdman who introduced himself a little while ago is the proposed owner i guess the applications the address of the establishment is not public information is what i'm seeing in the email from the ccb and so really you could consider this like you can consider a liquor license is just a retail license only we could ask the applicant any of the details of the business we don't have much more from the ccb because if you remember with liquor licenses they kind of somebody fills them out they almost flow to the liquor control department at the state level back through the clerk to you you make a decision as the control board we get it back to the clerk who then gets it back to dlc and there's a chain of information that kind of flows to and fro and we just to and fro to and fro um we don't have that for this and i don't know if that's how this process is going to be different or it's just part of working out the kinks so i guess the question before you do you want to consider it issue some kind of approval conditional on formal referral for preliminary determination wait and take formal action i guess your next or a meeting in in january would be next i don't know how that ties into some of the other planning so what comes first the chicken or the egg in other words is the referral is the referral the cannabis boards signing off you know i'm saying it's not clear to me what the distinction is we have two boards right we have a state board and we have a local board right so when you're talking about things you've been following through those are things that are coming from the state level yeah okay they're going to you but with liquor licenses customarily they get approved at the local level and then process it to state level as are you saying this situation is reversed or is it similar based on what i'm seeing here from the the folks at the cannabis control board they'll take the application in do all of the initial assessments analysis look for compliance with anything that's relevant and then they make a formal referral to us at that point we get a redacted version of the application to consider is how we're understanding this will flow you'll convene as a local control board consider that see if you want to condition it on anything when we say local ordinance we're probably not talking about zoning we're talking about things if we had a noise ordinance if there was some sort of loitering issue if there was some sort of other kind of that broader ordinance authority umbrella and then you would make a decision whether you approve it and then it goes back to the state for that final approval to begin operating as a retailer that's how i've understood it when it's been explained to me however if anyone else has a deeper understanding what do we have in zoning for this this was going to the planning commission i thought to identify areas and whatnot so at some point it seems like we got to have an address or something to be able to say it's in compliance with that right there is an address on their website interestingly yeah okay so i'm happy to provide it if that 24 plus so right from my recollection of the conversation the planning commission about this okay you cannot limit this any different than you would any other business it's a retail establishment so if retail is allowed here this is this is follows the same guidelines you can't pick and choose isn't there in the statute they can't be near a school or different levels that may i mean on a statewide level that may be part of the requirements so yeah that flows from the statewide stuff so there's a buffers on around the school so this map that's up on the tv screens here in the room with us you can see the two different school areas and then this red line that goes around it represents that buffer zone there and then if we're at 24 pleasant street we're down over here right so it's outside that buffer zone so do they consider and i do they consider like the the daycare at gifford to be a place they have to stay around away from or are they those kids young enough they're not worried about that type of thing did they restrict it just to schools i think it's k i think it's k through 12 i think yeah i don't have because i know they have a preschool there but i remember correctly it was around the school areas and that red line that drivers put up there is what i recall seeing public schools but other than that you know i mean if you have a retail district that's it's there whatever's it whatever's in the zoning ordinance is this applies to there is whatever the i'm not sure it's not commercial group services and it's something else it's just like our retail component right so wherever you allow that you allow this that's been my understanding the zoning you can't discriminate yeah from this versus any other so what is the role of the local control board like if everything's decided at the state level and by zoning are we doing like we're just here in case there are nuisance to not renew them like we do some of the liquor i think so i think it's almost that you're putting a flag in the ground for later should you need it and so that think about how you use your authority i mean because in the liquor control situation you have a similar amount of authority or lack there however you want to look at it but if we had a seller who was a there was some sort of nuisance component that might come into account before you got into license renewal in that case because you have to know their problem underage sales frequent bar fights whatever it might be we had the noise and the red line in and all that issue yeah for a few years well the sidewalk that was our yeah that was our time to deal with that was the outside consumption permits and whatnot and it may also dictate you know if you have issues it may dictate the shape of any ordinance to come in and i think there are some state prohibitions in there about where you can use cannabis products so if we have issues in a public space those things might work together but really we're likely talking about a renewal scenario because we don't have any thing of a data set for retail cannabis to say this worked in the past or this didn't or this is the potential pitfall it's we almost have to assume it's like the liquor license application that follows it's a retail operation people are going to enter purchase leave and hopefully use responsibly somewhere else do you know if i ask this is a proprietor do you know if there is a or maybe you'd know trevor is there an inspection system that's up in other words liquor control board representatives can walk in and they can come in with somebody who may or may not put underage and may or may not have false ID and then they nail the proprietor for selling to underage or whatever do you know if that system is in place absolutely in fact i've i've contracted with a company called green path and they are training and you know in their training it it repeatedly says that at any time the ccb can send people unannounced probably just like the liquor scenario but at any time they can come and and you know one of the reasons i'm here tonight i mean shame on me i i it was through discussions because um my my application my understanding was my application was complete and it's a pretty arduous process to get all the information they want and the last step is is a site visit from somebody so i was calling and trying to contact somebody um to see when we could get that scheduled and it was in that conversation with the director of licensing at the ccb she said well does just ran off have a local control board and i said well i don't think so i think i would have heard about that um but of course you do or you had you had said that you would which is great i'm happy to be here um but so my my site inspection for the licensing process is happening this monday and and that was sort of to me like the last big step and then then they the inspector makes recommendations and they could theoretically approve at the state level the issuing of the license at their next meeting um which is on the 14th next wednesday they meet every wednesday and approve licenses um so that's that's kind of how it went and um then i got in touch with mark and uh he said and they have your security plan already before them and that kind of thing yes right yes i i've been through follow this process with someone else that i know okay so i kind of know what you're going through yes uh sophisticated security system um you know cameras interior exterior uh yeah obviously alarm system right sensors everywhere uh so it's a very secure building at this point at least you know my space you know but it is you know it is a shared floor between um the over studio and movement of all so okay i would say or i'd say everybody's pretty well protected now um anything that happened at either exterior door is going to be you know 30 days you have to retain the footage so you know obviously uh complied with all the specifications um i've been working with the my canvas solutions the attorneys in in uh in burlington to try to make sure i didn't leave any stones on turn but but here i am because i didn't know about this stuff but you know i'm i'm excited to be in the town and get to know people and um so here i am it sounds like we're just in the same process as liquor control so it's a you know and i don't believe i've heard anything that gives us a reason to not award it but there's anything that's come up in this process today where we say we have an issue with so the motion you're recommending is contention upon cannabis board approval it might be what we do is um if you're comfortable enough and it's one of those things where you'd prove tonight or you'd approve it later maybe take the motion to approve the license tonight and if it has to be after a formal referral we'll just we'll come back and have to do it then it sounds like he needs this but it might be them to move forward if this unlocks the rest of the process at least we've covered that if for some reason they got to come back so i'll make them we'll be better at it next time i'll make a motion that we approve the the control board approve the license for um pulse star cannabis contingent upon um completion of the referral process from the cannabis control board i'll second that first and motion in a second conversation i have one question i mean what he's putting together i know it's going to be a good secure thing and around she talked about this outline of he has to be outside of the safe area i don't believe he's going to find the problem at the store it's going to be outside that safety area because far as i mentioned you would have his store right in the middle of the safe area and his building's still going to be safe it's the stuff after it gets out of the store what do you have planned for that action what what do you mean there's nothing going to store and buy it that's of age long down i mean you can with alcohol too yeah he's no different liquor it's a state what what what do you wouldn't have for a long reach forecast or plan for this or do you we don't because we're not required to have that i mean that's where the sheriff's department far i mean i'll one more thing than i'll drop it because my wife told me not to come down make a fool of myself is that it's great that you want to pass this and say yes is what and he is going to do it but it sounds like in it i have seen how far as i'm concerned i've already seen it you guys approve things the zoning board approves things then after it's all been approved you drop it so i think i don't think this is going to get dropped i think the state is going to be monitoring these pretty closely him selling the stuff is great but what i'm saying is outside that red line people can buy it in store and bring back over the red line so the red line is the area around the school where there's no sales allowed right but far as i'm concerned you could have the his store right across the school and be safer than where it is right now and don't look into that look i know because i lived in town with the school there was a store right across the road and this gentleman didn't sell cigarettes and sell booze to any of these it was the story that was down the road two miles he says hey they're watching him and i got all the things to work with down here so i'm just i'm just putting it down the way i feel about it it's it's up to law enforcement well you you has been a slight one you are considered a law enforcement yeah right but it's not our on this it's not it's not our role to enforce someone who is over 21 selling alcohol or cannabis products someone who's under 20 really saying it should be a concern yours oh it'd be a violation of state law which would be enforceable through a law enforcement certified law enforcement officer in this case it would be orange county so it'd be the sheriff's department for somebody who's doing open okay so yeah 18 vsa 42 30 a subsection to a person shall not consume cannabis in a public place and then there's a fine structure yeah so we would expect local law enforcement to enforce the laws around this just like we do alcohol and just like we do for anything else that we do in town you know the state legislature passed the laws around retail cannabis and the governor signed it and our community voted in a public meeting to to make it happen and so this is the next this is the next step and yeah well we're going to be working with things as as they occur but this is really something that is is part of the process of much bigger process that's been you know set in place um by you know the community and every branch of forces and there'd be the opportunity like we said earlier it's the renewal period that you might even be looking at as well if there are issues that pop up they can also be addressed the ability to pull our support too right so there's a problem three months down the road the select board can vote to pull that and and that's why we decided to have this board in place to begin with we didn't we weren't required to have this right at all joy well the town actually voted right well the town voted to have the process but we chose to have a local control board we didn't have to have a local that's true yes that's true and it's all on the state if we didn't have this step yeah which at least gives us a modicum of at least it gives us some input anyway and it gives us at least some control it gives us it gives us what we can do basically yeah we have um nope hang on we've got one on the screen sarah oh i thought she wanted hi everyone can you hear me okay can you hear me you got sorry to to interrupt i my name is sarah rate i work as a senior planner with two rivers out of creature regional commission and fortuitously i'm here for another reason but fortuitously fortuitously i'm here also when you're having this discussion i just wanted to share a little information that might be helpful as i'm responsible for i'm our office's liaison two towns to support them in their deliberations around cannabis regulations so my understanding of the sort of delegation of powers as it were is that the local cannabis control commission really only has authority to act on the basis of its zoning laws and any sort of sign and public nuisance ordinances that you have and that's a very circumscribed envelope of authority that you have so if if there is a problem down the road and you wish to revoke a license you can only do so if it is in direct contravention of your zoning bylaws or signage or public nuisance ordinances that you have on the books also um i wanted to note and this is a conversation we've been having with a bunch of other towns right now um the state is not responsible when they do their review of your application of the application for any any cannabis establishment not just retail they are not checking compliance with local zoning bylaws because that is firmly within the purview of the town so it is the town's responsibility to verify that all of those ordinances and requirements have been met locally um technically and what this is what i've been told is that applicants are supposed to have submitted a copy of their zoning permit with their application so theoretically the local cannabis control commission is just sort of rubber stamping what the planning commission or your your za or your zba has already done um with the permitting process but i wanted to flag that for you because i just want to make sure everybody understands that the state is not checking compliance with local bylaws and they are not responsible for enforcing compliance with local bylaws so there's a very sort of strict wall as it were in terms of um the the powers that the lcc has and then that the state is is retaining i mean i hope that helps yeah thank you thank you one more comment um yes sarah really took care of mine but i was going to say too much so thank you i just want to add that um you get another crack at this presumably at renewal time it's like i said it's going to have the same rules as alcohol so if you decide that you blow it understand or you wanted to put in some more stringent rules i think that was the whole point of the local control is you have some ability to do that despite the limitations that sarah just said so it's not like it's done forever there can be more of a problem all right we have a motion and a second on the floor all those in favor hi i proposed change motion carries lose pat we did oh no he's there i see it's under his lesson i said run down top french gas i didn't get his boat right entertain a motion to adjourn this board second those in favor i can i call the liquor control board to order first up is public comment and this is comment on anything for the liquor control board that's not on the agenda no christmas samples that's not dang seeing none approval of the agenda some second all those in favor hi next up is to consider the liquor license for bobs m&m beverage the move that we approve the liquor licenses is a classic annual renewal right so yes i'm not knowing of any issues with bobs i would move that we approve the second-class liquor license for bobs m&m beverage welcome all those in favor hi hi post stained motion carries now we will call the regular select board to order i must do your ear first up is public comment this is anything that's not on the agenda i believe you're first yes i have over the last few months i have been kind of pushed from one place to the other place first i started out i get well i left my name for the town manager to call me he didn't call me and i thought didn't know can you say your name my name is kevin nysha i live at 2502 ridge road thanks and i was directed to mr shane brah was the town agent and from him i got what i thought i would get from him from an answer because i've known john for a while so i'll get to what i'm after out in a minute i went back i called i think it was you the select one about this i think it was him i'm not sure what it was and he was going to follow up on my my complaint i never heard anything i stopped back in here the other day because what was happening the other day was the straw broke the camel's back i stopped in the secretary says he was busy working on his budget i said i don't care i want to talk to him well finally yes i got in there to talk to him and he can sit down and shake his head well what my thing is is i want to know why i want to know why we are buying trucks without load covers on one there's only 13 states in the united states that don't require load covers it's a state law the state of ramon comes out of tuggers pit loads are all covered most of the other towns coming out of there the loads are covered because of the law unless you get into what they call the six inch rule and you're getting the six inch rule you're spending another on the israeli will be spending another hour a day making sure the load is all within six inches of the size of the truck and what mr shane growl told me in the first place we're in the state of ramon we don't need i work for a destruction company for 30 years and loads were covered they didn't matter it's private whatever and i'd like to know why we think the town ran off as well so special we don't need them the reason i went to him last week was two of the six wheelers were hauling product out of tuggers pit i would say they were on the margill of almost doing over the speed limit i don't know for sure i don't have speed gun but they get to the end of the ridge road to take the left and all sudden there's material on the ground i have spoken to mr shane growl once before about this so material on the road right there stones in your windshield but no load cover automatically says you're going to pay for the windshield even if it wasn't your stone they broke him off your truck i know this from being in this business and i just think it should be brought to some of the tension these load trucks when they're bought be bought with load covers for $2,300 you're getting this is one of the better ones it's one that goes over instead of barely coming back locks the cover down and why aren't we doing why are we more special than anybody else like i said even the state of ramon does this i want to know why or at least you guys can talk about it and give me a question my other question when i'm bringing questions up about i asked about that it's just like the quarry up there after the quarry got approved everything kind of got robbed and everybody's moaning and groaning now that spray just cut the whole tree line off along the ridge along that road well you know if somebody on the road i could care less because i grew paid me well for 30 years i'm not going to argue something that paid me well and supported me so i could retire at 65 but if they'd get out then instead of trying to fight to keep it closed they could get the trees for the sound barrier in there because now the sound comes right over everybody's house and if anybody knows when they're fighting this thing in the first place instead of the people up on the upper part of the ridge road screaming if you got people on the bound down side of the road ridge road would have said something because that sound would break down the valley sound won't travel up and go over it just and the other thing i see i cannot see us buying tandem trucks and putting 10 or 12 foot straight blades on this town's got too many back back roads that are rough and you're going to break these plows even the ones you buy the ones with all angle plow you're going to break them you need a dustpan that rolls over and you need single axis of plowing because you need a mile and a half to turn tandem around with plow on it okay hadn't done any comments i don't think we have anybody sitting here that can give you an answer right off the top but i gave the town manager that thing i was going to hear a week ago yeah well um you're in front of the board now not the town manager right so all i can tell you is i'm more than willing to have the conversation and look into it for you i mean i think it should be looked into because anybody can buy a car anybody buy a plow but for $2,300 you can save you that and windshields i know you got two of them two of the trucks one of the small trucks that the tires broke last and they were replaced it i don't care what a driver says it takes too much time they're all electric now when i first was doing it you got out there with the old 2x4 roll the 2x4 up and put it up on the head bar when you did thunder all you have to go out and hold it down and i can't get out to these other trucks and go just say you guys go put your car down well randolph goes into it i mean for four years i have up there on the ridge road i have got off the trucks for using the drake brakes too much and the one thing i love about the most some of the younger guys while we need the drake brake i say guys let's back down i'm almost 70 i drove the trucks when you have twin sticks in them and no drake brake and especially the old max you wish had an acre you could throw out so most of these new trucks are just to break some old stop you don't need the drake brakes most of them have been nice enough to shut the drake brakes off and these are the things you guys probably don't hear no but i'll look into it and get back to you okay i will all right we're gonna keep moving on this agenda though um betsey were you trying to come in on public comment yes please thank you we just wanted to give you an update on the east randolph community group and our work towards the renovation of the hall we have a business plan just about ready to send to the board for next month's meeting and it's also dovetailing with the arpa application that josey has been spending a lot of time at the arpa meetings and has got pretty much ready to send in the and if we if we get the arpa money it will hopefully cover most of the cost for renovation to get into the hall to be producing some money to help take care of the maintenance and other things in the hall so just to just to add to what betsey's saying what we are what we've worked on is a mutually reinforcing you know a business plan as per the select board request which was a great idea and the arpa application so that we are in the position of offering uh income as well as hoping for outlays in the direction of the hall so it's a two-way street and uh stay tuned i think you'll like it all right thanks any other public comment i'm not seeing any we'll move to approval of the agenda all those in favor hi folks motion carries um next up is a public hearing on the proposed amendments to the traffic parking and speeding ordinance so this is a chance for anybody that came to talk about the new ordinance changes these will have to be specific to the changes that are in the ordinance okay just a comment from one of my neighbors the other night when i was talking to him he was going to come but he's busy so he couldn't make it he was going to suggest to the select board and people here on this board why don't we just stay down the speeding signs because they aren't helping at all because the sheriff's department isn't doing their job because the ridge road is just like a racetrack signage work the signage is out there but if you got no one forcing the enforcement to be signed behind the signage it's not going to be good so it's um it's actually the bermont state police that are supposed to be patrolling the ridge road well that's their territory you see on the ridge road so when police the state police go down you see one car then about five minutes later you see a no one tagging behind them any other public comments seeing none we will close that part of the meeting and move on to the consent calendar which is meeting minutes and warrants to approve the count sub calendar and warrant all those in favor hi hi posed motion carries next up consider our acdc salisbury square allocation request this looks like it's um allocation that was approved before and they didn't do the work within the two-year window so they're asking to not have to go back through and pay for and receive an allocation again is that pretty much the summary of that that's how i've understood it yeah i have not been on the front line this one i don't believe so no so they they paid at least some of it i don't know if it was the full amount so embedded in that i don't know that we had anybody on who was scheduled for it looks to me like it's they just don't want to have to go back and pay what they've already paid so it would seem to me it's fair to say yes you can keep the credit for what you've already paid but you still owe whatever the difference is to get your full allocation right i'm not missing anything there i think that's exactly where i would see this so what i'll do maybe is take that back gather chris and mark together we'll figure out what that looks like in terms of if there are any dollars that are required but can we approve that as a motion that simple they don't have to double pay sure they get credit they get keep the allocation and get credit for what they've already paid but they still have to yep basically pay what was spending a period of time yeah yeah so i'm fine with that is that a motion sure all those in favor hi hi post motion carries we're probably not going to hear any of pat's votes make a lot of noise pat if you don't like something random senior citizen center tax exemptions data's request for public meeting or for town meeting and that's me emily daniel okay hang on just a second let trover give us an introduction oh i was gonna yeah we're gonna let her let her ride there it's kind of nice um so the senior citizen tax exemption that's voted on this would be the expiration of the five-year period so they'd be up for renewal this is the one where you get 10 years the first time out and then it's five years each successive time two ways onto the town meeting warning by petition or by action of the legislative body because it's nice and early we figured we'd have them before you to ask for you to put it on rather than to petition that way for some reason you wanted them to petition they'd have plenty of time to do that so that's really the question is whether or not you'd want to place it on the town meeting warning that's roughly what we did last year with the Randolph center fire association i think it's been done that way in the past for some others that that rebate me yeah um and so that would end we just used uh you know there's a version of the question mocked up in terms of how it would likely appear in your packets it's pretty simple and straightforward and that it says you know basically will you authorize a five-year extension here's the statutory reference and and then that exemption gets baked into our local agreement rate so that that would remain unchanged as well relatively speaking at least then the voters just yeah vote on it and that's it that's fine i don't have any problem with that approach anything to add to that are you all good with us just saying go do you need a motion for that probably sure yeah by the way i mean you'll you'll you'll authorize it now and then you'll approve the warning as a whole thing later yeah maybe want to make a motion to just add it to the ballot i'll i'll move that way add that appropriation to the ballot as indicated also all those in favor all right i proposed motion carries an application for different grants for kimba library this looked like it was two different grants two grants mind if we scoot you out well go ahead it was great to meet you all thank you very much thank you see you all tomorrow this was two different grants no town funds in either one they just need the town to apply for them i think it's yeah it's just in in accordance with our policies the authorization authorization to apply in one case i think it's retroactive because the deadline just passed i think it was the energy related one amy's on and can maybe provide you a little more do you want more detail on the grants are you good with them amy's good with it i'm good with it okay is that a motion to authorize absolutely so i'll second it okay that's easy all those in favor right i proposed motion carries thanks amy next up is the branch would parcel say assessment update so here is where sarah actually was joining us for to provide an update on that it was helpful that that she was here earlier for sure so so this is really just give you a sense of where we're at with the site assessment and planning process for the branch would pass awesome can you hear me okay hear me okay yes awesome um thanks so much for taking your time to chat this evening until let me do it to give you an update on where we're at so for those of you who aren't familiar the the branch would parcel is of course a town owned parcel um it had the old branch with mail on there um and that burned down about 20 years ago and the parcel's been vacant ever since the town had a really great sort of community visioning process around what um folks were interested in possibly seeing that parcel redeveloped as and there was a lot of interest in um sort of a mixture of housing and retail space and then also like public park space um especially serving younger younger kids so um the the process of moving that parcel from a a contaminated parcel to a redeveloped parcel is is one that's overseen by the vermont department of environmental conservation through their brownfields program and the town has enrolled in the state's limited liability program which effectively um it is a commitment of the town to go through all the steps for assessment and remediation that dc may require for that site to ensure that it's safe or public use and enjoyment um into into perpetuity in the future and it's also a sort of leg up when it comes to access and state funding both for assessment and for cleanup because they give preference to people who are in the limited liability program and especially to municipalities so the the town is in a good position in that in that enrollment um where we're at with assessment on the site to rivers has been very fortunate to have grant funding from um the US Environmental Protection Agency as well as from the state to assist um towns and private landowners and prospective purchasers with assessing brownfield sites around our region and the branchwood site has been a big focus for our program for the past um a couple years and so we put quite a bit of money into the site at this point we did a phase one assessment back in 2020 um and then that basically the phase one was a desk review with a brief site visit um visual inspection that made recommendations for the kinds of contaminants that could be present on site that should be investigated for and then we paid for a phase two to be done at the site which is really where you start actually putting holes in the ground and testing um and determining what contaminants are present um on the site and that uh study was finished in uh late 2021 um just about a year ago and that site based that assessment basically found that there were two um classes of contaminants present in the soil on the site and those were dioxin purans and then also polycyclic polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons or pHs and those are contaminants that are basically found in almost every developed community in the country right there they're pretty ubiquitous they just sort of go hand in glove with normal development um but they were at concentrations that were higher than the standards that DEC considers to be safe so um also that study looked at groundwater and found no contamination in the groundwater whatsoever which is very encouraging so all told um you know the findings of that phase two investigation were very encouraging because we we could have seen far worse contamination on that site given its long history um of economic use in the town so really it's it's not bad um for for all the years that it's of service that it's given um and fortunately the two classes of contaminants that I mentioned are pretty inert um so they they don't really wash out in rain um there's we don't expect any problems from stormwater runoff coming from the site we also don't expect um then to have any impacts on the air so they're not going to volatilize and people it's good it's not going to be a problem for people breathing them um the real concern comes when you actually start putting shovels in the ground and um moving the earth and people come in contact and of course you know if if the town were to build houses there or to um build a park there as was discussed during the community visioning process and then you certainly don't want kids crawling around in that dirt um so typically when we see this kind of contamination on site um dc will will look at the phase two report and they'll say okay do we feel confident we have enough information dc looked at the phase two report and they said well we we did a whole bunch of soil sampling across the entire site and it's quite a large site it's about two acres um we did all this soil sampling but we only went down to one and a half feet um that was the depth of the soil sampling that we did and so we would like to confirm that there's no contamination below that level so what they've requested is limited sampling we're talking about maybe 10 um deeper soil samples across the entirety of the site that's going to go um as far down as five feet below ground surface so they're gonna they're going to do sort of two levels of testing they're going to go down to about three feet below ground surface and they're going to go down to five feet below ground surface if they find contamination at the three foot level so um that's sort of the request that dc is put out there the consultant that two rivers has been paying to do all of this assessment work vhb has come up with a sampling plan to acquiesce to dc's request um and that sampling plan is currently on dc's desk waiting for review it's been on their desk for quite some time now um i was able to have a conversation with our dc site manager um last week i think the days are running together not too long to go um and she she recognized that it needed to be reviewed and she said she would try to push it up her priority list they're unfortunately their office is way understaffed right now and they're all under water so they'll do the best they can to get us um some feedback on that plan and hopefully keep things moving in the meantime two rivers has run out of um grant funding to help anybody in the region um with assessment of these kinds of sites which is um very very depressing for us because we like to be able to assist folks we have applied for more funding but that funding's not going to really kick into gear until um later in 2023 at the best shot so what we are looking at is a cost of approximately 36 grand is the the latest estimate that i've seen from vhb for conducting this supplemental site investigation that dc is requiring um dc can provide funding assistance to help the town if you're interested in seeking that funding assistance from them and so basically that process would be and i've already had a preliminary conversation with the site manager about this when i was talking with her um just just a week or so ago and said you know two rivers is out of funding is there any possibility that dc could kick in some funding here and she said that that is a possibility there's a process for doing that um and that's to fill out an application that then gets sent sent to dc for their own um internal budgeting process two rivers is more than happy to assist with that application if and when the time comes at the town would like that assistance um there's also potentially uh a new grant program that's opening up to help folks with assessment of brownfield sites as far as i've heard the latest i've heard that that application is not available yet but the money will be coming through um the department of economic development through the accd agent agency of commerce and community development but again we're still waiting for that application to drop so there should be two sources of funding potential funding at least um that the town could chase after in order to fund this particular supplemental site investigation um so i hope that gives you sort of a good overview of where we're at right now i'm happy to take any questions and i'm always available um if anybody wants to give me a call at the office and we can talk further so sarah the progress that's made till now does any of that have a shelf life on it or can we just wait until late 23 to till you guys get the additional funding to go to the next step so that really is going to be determined by dc um they they sort of drive the timeline for um when assessment needs to be completed that said obviously they haven't gotten back to us for a good three months or so on or maybe even longer at this point um on the the site plan so this is clearly not a big concern from them in terms of like keeping things moving quickly um even though i know i totally recognize that they're their workload is preventing them from getting a time but i don't think i think if this was a site of major concern for them they would have bumped it up the priority list earlier so i don't know if we're going to get like a request from dc to actually say you've got to get keep get this moving faster um it's very possible that maybe we could just wait until funding becomes available however um i think it's a conversation that we need to keep fresh and keep talking to dc about just so that everybody's on the same page um so once we hear back from dc on the site plan that's when the funding conversation will start um and again three of us is happy to be part of that if you would like us to um and and that's sort of when dc can make some decisions about okay well when is their funding available and how soon do they really need the town to act on um the next steps for this regulatory process that sort of thing so i'm sorry i don't have a clear answer right now but it's all it's all really driven by dc when we started this and we're asked if we would participate in this there was going to be no cost to the town so it feels like we're now at a point and you're saying dc could force the town into doing something which would cost us 36 000 so when we started the process it was i hope i can interview you clearly that you know we can assist as far as our grant funds allow right so we we have grant funding it's not a limitless pool of funding um the dc has a lot of funding too and so does accd so the chances are very very good that the town can get funding from those other sources plus you're in the brella program which gives you priority consideration amongst the applicant pool so it is there's there's a possibility that maybe funding doesn't become available but i think the chances are very good um and because especially because you're a municipal applicant they do give preference to those as well um so that's that's the best answer i can give right now it's really something that we've just got to continue talking with dc about and potentially accd as well and your members is happy to assist with that process well i think if they're happy to assist with the process then we'll just go see we need to money yeah because otherwise we're going to do nothing with this property and it's just going to sit there longer and longer and longer and generate nothing so the sooner we figure out how we're going to get something done on that property the better off we're going to be so i would say you know if they're willing to help us try to find some funding here that we go down that path and see what's available i think it's it's interesting that dc wanted the additional holes drilled and literally the map is a site map with some dots on it yeah and it's was there a specific area that you found where there was more concentration or was it just broadly on that site it's pretty evenly um distributed the pahs are concentrated on the north side of pearl street um so just the northern portion of the site and there's no exceedance of state standards for pahs is on the southern portion of the site for dioxins and purans the exceedances are pretty um uniformly bad all the way across the entirety of the site okay that's the question i don't think we have much choice yep go ahead now on these uh tests more are you doing you say the only one down a foot one half why didn't they go down deeper in the first place because you don't in the first phase you don't because a foot borehole wasn't going to give you much of anything basically all you get out of foot is what's on top you could be on five feet hit everything fresh i have seen this in in the construction business before i mean we're we're going back to the town you're asking for the town to pay more money to do a job the second time so the initial procedure oh sorry so i'm just looking for an answer so the initial procedure that was taken for the phase two was to drill i don't even remember how many holes but there were tons and tons of holes to get a sense of the horizontal distribution of contamination um that was an extremely costly study to do all of that testing but it was it was an attempt to see okay horizontally where is there where are there hotspots for contamination um with the idea that if you found a section of the property that had no hotspots for contamination that nothing was showing up then it wouldn't make sense to drill deeper in those particular areas the results of this study were that unfortunately the contamination is is distributed pretty evenly right so thankfully what we're seeing though for this site plan is that we don't have to drill another hundred deep holes right we're only going to have to drill about 10 holes so we're they're very targeted um sort of they're considered representative samples so we'll dig we'll dig in certain areas of the site and if something comes back with you know significant contamination DC may require additional investigation in that area this is sort of the normal course of brown fields assessments right where we don't um we can't test everything because that would cost literally hundreds of thousands of dollars um and it's not necessarily the most efficient approach so you try to take an approach that is both cost of cost effective and will give you some information that will at least lead you to the next step um and that was the purpose of the phase two um many sites go through a phase two plus a supplemental site investigation if DC requests it and sometimes they have additional investigation beyond that if something weird comes up in the supplemental site investigation again that's just the process that the town committed to when they signed up for the brella program was to to say okay we'll work with you DC to figure out the full extent of the contamination on the site thank you this isn't on the agenda for any action but it sounds like we want to keep two rivers engaged and I think you should be pushing for the plan to be approved by DEC but also in helping find funding to pay for the supplemental funds are out there and those resources I think you would move it along and just see what comes up you know they came back and said oh well let's we can do you know 90% of it and I'll end we can talk about that when you get to that point but I think they're 100% funding that DEC has it no no buy anything that's 100% funding anything at this point sir I think the direction is to keep hounding DEC to approve the plan and then work with the town to see if we can locate funding through DEC probably to pay for it happy to help who should I be working with I know that josh has obviously left the town who's the best point person for me to work with on the site moving forward we're going to connect you with Mark Rosalba who stepped into the role josh had um we'll probably be the the best one to coordinate kim who's sitting next to me we'll we'll make that connection wonderful thank you great for the questions thanks sarah thank you have a good evening thank you all next up is to consider the appraisers errors and emissions and homestead changes this is basically the annual reconciliation yes um it's in accordance with title 32 section 4261 the listers with the approval of this left board because it's not just the appraiser it's like the board of listers would like to correct the following errors and emissions from the grand list and these are just I have assigned one from the listers for you guys to sign just showing like the homestead changes that have occurred since the as bill or grand list has been launched um and these are people filing changes of business use of their outbuildings or their business rental use after the as bill and um it says appraiser but I am an assessor I don't want anyone to think that I have appraiser credentials anybody have any questions on the list referring to your skillset colloquially did anybody have any questions on the ones that are there no pretty much the standard anybody want to make a motion to prove it oh sure go ahead and sign the version you have make the motion to approve that or the version he has if you've got signatures on yours we'll roll with that one okay yeah and this one we'll get like freeable funds can put behind the as bill grand list and it comes off this was that a motion I did to prove it yep was there a second a second all those in favor hi hi opposed flipstein mention carries pass that around and send it right back to you I've got a pen 24 budget goals and priorities I don't use those right did you use your finger I just excited anything anymore just nothing digital that's true digital initial so this so I know it doesn't really matter but since we don't really need to have a motion and a vote and sign like does it kind of like one of the other usually now you have a motion and a vote to accept it and the signatures are requirement a law same as when we sell plots when we do liquor licenses we sell sign all those after we take motions one's for the record one's for the court someday if somebody thank you smelling of my name that's quite all right happens all the time I would I would be a wealthy wealthy man if I had even a nickel for every time I've gotten er instead of re I don't know why mine is built my father changed the name legally because he thought it was easier to spell worst thing that I did budget goals yep so this was put on there was some conversation about whether or not we should set some budget goals and priorities based on various questions community feedback so it's really do you as a board want to set some sort of level of parameter on the budget development process we're a little bit later than we would normally be in producing a full draft that ties into all kinds of staffing fluctuations and whatnot but we're making progress toward that we're having a complete version I've got something I can share with you okay but I'll put it up on the screen this is a summary look at where we're at with what you could consider the fixed costs in so these are our personnel costs of health insurance projected wage increases the library's numbers which came in the other day are included in this summary it's got our insurances for property and casualty workers comp all those things are in there our debt service payments are updated so all the things that we've essentially committed at least at some level into paying it does have a few new things in there which I do a formal extremely rough there so these are just some summary numbers like I said we haven't begun to program in some of the other operating numbers there are some large cost centers or some volatile ones that are in here when you look at the highway fund we aren't currently projecting anything as a change for fuel costs for example but we know that that's you know pinning down what that number should be and trying to project what it'll be in 18 months is an exercise we have to do so this is just to give you a snapshot of where we'd be starting from should you decide to set goals that are at some point different than these percentage or number increases here so some of this is obviously it's an easier exercise if you want to add money and close to 20 years local government you'd be the first ones to ask me to really do that so we're just going to want to hold and or take some direction in the other action so you can see general fund when you add everything up that's about 7.2 percent to start highway fund we're at about a little less than 4 percent the library funds came in at 8.31 so different than the numbers you guys submitted Amy just because I added your property and casualty and workers comp numbers came in from VLCT the other day and I'll send those back to you we added those just before show time predicting no change in the police district contract this assumes that that contract stays in existence at the rates already agreed to 40 hours already agreed to so there's potentially some variability there and the waterfront and wastewater fund really have any debt service issuance and personnel costs embedded in those so we still also have here chemicals in particular have been one of the cost centers there that's had a little volatility through the inflation period so those would be some pressures that aren't showing there so just to give you an idea of where we'd be starting from an order of magnitude if you wanted to do something at various percentage rates and or if you wanted to go into say a level fund scenario sometimes what boards consider our level tax rate scenarios that involves some additional mathematics we want to make sure that we're pretty well confident in our non-tax revenues what our grand list is going to do and then from there we can start to work it backwards it's still roughly you can see in the general fund between here and last or the current fiscal year you're about 250 thousand dollars different what to note about that those are those there's that huge increase in the ambulance one they came forward with a 10 or 11 percent increase and that was on top of years of under budgeting that figure the budget was looking backwards when it should have looked part current part forward so we're assuming that's what's going to happen moving forward so that's about 53 thousand dollars what's embedded in the general fund too is going back to an earlier conversation about zoning administrator capacity in the addition of a full-time person there that there's about 105 thousand dollars of cost when you add up everything from salary to benefits we have to assume this person's on a family health insurance plan that's 29 thousand dollars in change so that's about 105 of that so of that 250 you got about 150 a little more of it that's tied up in those two things some of the other increases is we had luck and prior years in people who came on or already on their health insurance went from family plans to buyouts or two person plans to buyouts or they generally trended in the more cost effective direction in terms of overall dollars we've gone the other way with some of this cycle so there's quite a few different change in addition to that new zoning administrator and then you look a little bit throughout people have changed plans or we've hired people who are on family plans replacing people who are on a two person or single that's anywhere from 15 thousand dollars you know 8000 to 15 thousand dollars swing depending on that retirement costs are up again we knew those were coming but that's another couple of percent that goes on with any salary changes so that number is going to be a little bit bigger by a factor anyway so those are the main things in the in both the general and the highway fund they're like I said there's still some things that are unknown if you just took this right here and the grand list remains unchanged and our non tax revenue does what we think it's going to do based on really no increases in most of it except for the current use and pilot payments based on sort of the assessor's estimates or some state figures we got within the last month or so you're talking about five about five and a half cents would be the increase on the property tax rate that was going to be my next question yeah and so that's 200 to 300 thousand dollars a year you're talking 110 to 165 dollars for the year would be the increase on that home range so anywhere from nine to 14 dollars a month last year we were in the six to ten dollar per month sort of range so just to kind of give you a sense of where you're at least starting from and what that encapsulates it's all of that if you want to take 250 out you grab the 150 that seems easy somehow I mean the ambulance you're probably just moving out as a separate question so it's not in the general fund you're giving the voters direct access to it otherwise we'd have to make up that money somewhere else in there you're really getting into there's a little bit of level of service there's some things we can do on the operating side that might reduce costs we've got an increase in technology baked in there we've been burning through that line for years so it was really more of a true up than an increase but we could look into that what's gone into that some of that has been the consultant pay so as we've been financed director free some of that's been booked in there because Nemrick has filled in and that's where we've generally paid for them probably not the best spot for it but that's why you'll see spikes in addition to the server needed to be upgraded a little earlier than expected that was in the last fiscal year so we've had a few things like that so there we can probably twist those down a little bit but even still you take miscellaneous changes you're not getting it all so it might be fortune service levels look like and if it's not I mean it's really it's either people or capital funding other than the two big cost centers that that are left and if you do capital transfers we'll have to reorient that plan to the available resources and it might mean some things happen later than expected some pieces of equipment stay later than than what a replacement schedule would be it's those are the types of trades you might make we can also get creative and try to use we were talking a little bit earlier you know for paving for next year it's been a while since we've had a class 2 paving grant and we look to build a program for next year kind of around that as a centerpiece if we're able to get it that's a what they're 175 thousand dollar max I think right now so you can stretch that out if we've got an eligible project of course I mean that's that's part of the trick but so we can look to try to do those things too to take existing resources and keep them moving but if you cut those transfers down this year then that's the latter back to it at some other point so um we can make a math equation to come up with whatever it is the goals are it's just sort of what are the operational pressure points along the way so the concerns that I've heard are affordability is what the big one is and that the constant increase increase increase and the problem is the town budgets only a fraction of the property tax bill the school budget which we have no control over is what has been driving the big increases but you know there's a lot of people that are on the edge of being able to keep their homestead together with income and you know they're facing huge increases with fuel and and whatnot right now it's just I just thought it was worth the having the conversation of do we try to at least control what that increases and and what we're doing and and actually take a hard look at what our programs are doing and do we need to do all of it is it you know where should we be looking at this you know an increase every year adds up yeah but at the same token all the things that we're doing are getting increased you know fuel labor it's kind of hard to swallow all that and it's happening in the homes yeah it's across the board you know there's a certain amount of sort of background inflation which always happens which you know it's just part of the normal world so we expect things to go out at least you know somewhat from year to year I mean that's that's that's just that's just normal and then so I think what we're talking about here really is more you know how much do we want to buffer our local residents from the extra sort of extraordinary increase in inflation which we've experienced as a nation right in the last year or two and so I think you can just kind of think of it through that lens of we always know we're going to go up by a few percentage points just to kind of keep everything going that's just year in and year out we have this special sort of time right now and so the question is you know I think you know have the folks in the community who are we going to ask to pay for this have their wages been increasing along with inflation some people's have some people are doing well some people have had wage increases along with the inflation but some people haven't so figuring out you know where well there's people that are on fixed incomes that aren't even drawing a wage you know they're right those are the ones that are affected the most but like social security has got the biggest yeah they just gotta increase it along in a long time so when your wages set on what you earned 40 years ago you know even 20% on top of a $800 a month social security check is that much right but if we're talking about increasing taxes by 8% and someone got a 20% increase in social security then it's that they're better off than they were before it's not fortunately it's going because you're buying well you you're buying power is lower today $800 three years ago bought you a heck of a lot more than $800 today buys you well of course i'm not talking about over time i'm talking about just from one year to the next right that's that's what we're talking about here but in the last year the cost of fuel has skyrocketed food has skyrocketed medications have skyrocketed electric bills are jumping what they got a huge rate increase all those pieces pile up on these folks with a limited income and we sit here and say well our increase is only 2% they can handle 2% well it's 2% from us what is it going to be 6% from the school and you know a 20% increase in fuel and and an increase in food and you know it's the problem is the piling on of all this you know we've got some people in this town who have owned their houses for 50 60 years that aren't able to quite make the ends meet right and they're going to have to sell that homestead because all of these costs are piling on it's not just the town it's everything and it's like at what point do we start saying what is the role of the town what what should we be providing and you know do we have to have all these increases and it's not just us i mean our piece is small in the tax bill compared to the school the school bill and it's gonna is the one where we could really make a dent in affordability i think right right all right i agree and and and then when we talk about the tax bill for the for the town you know half half our budget is the highways which my understanding is we've been underfunding already for a long time so and we see it in our infrastructure you know and so what's the you know there's the cost of doing stuff but then there's also the cost of not doing stuff and we often find that in the long run the cost of not doing stuff ends up being more costly more costly so you know how much has a grand list grown over the last five years five years that's a huge problem in my mind we're not we're not growing the grand list values here to help with this problem so as long as our grand list continues to grow by one or two percent you know at the most i don't even know if it's that much no i don't know about five years but when you go back to and we set the rates the last couple of years we were talking i think a percent or less in each case that and therein lies part of the problem these kids we're not we're not growing the community to bring in new business or new buildings or new whatever to to use some of these services more efficiently and picking up their tax you know picking up taxes on that we have that same conversation every year well yeah i've been having it for seven years i know i know the graph it looks like this and guess what we're we're now approaching this point here where this is now becoming a bigger issue because we're not growing that grand list at the same pace that the increases of expenses to the town are growing and we're in more of a pickle right now because of the inflationary costs which we might ever review and it's bringing it to light everywhere you know we this whole came up because at the state level we're having the same conversation you know salt prices increase 30 percent and fuel prices jump 20 percent you know if you start taking those numbers on a bigger scale it gets even worse the alligator mouth goes much bigger like the towns is going like this the states is going like this it's just it's brutal we're we're setting aside projects the money's just not there and you just can't go out and and print more have an anti-business environment this result you're going to get to the point where people can't pay the taxes and then you're going to have a receivable you won't have the cash to do it either so you're in quite a pickle you're in quite a pickle employment situation is bad not growing businesses is bad and it's all starting to rear it's a little ugly head here so up there at the legislature you get there think about that a little bit because workforce is an issue and workforce is a problem because businesses can't hire people so therefore they're not gonna they're not coming they're not expanding they're not expanding and it's a problem so I guess that's an answer the question no I guess in my mind it's like okay well figure out where you can level out without having too much of an effect and figure out how much we got to increase it okay it's inevitable that you're gonna have to do something it's not sustainable so that's me putting it back on you a little bit one of the things we can create to is a it's almost a scenario table if you think of it that way and so we can identify I'll take a little bit to put together we can identify basically what are some of the options for taking the number you know presumably down we're not going to build it so I mean you could it would work either way but so maybe there's a menu you could sort of choose from to see what combination we could show you different combinations based on percentage targets so just to say if you wanted to be a 3% from last year here's how you get there from here and or here's what's sort of left undone and or here are the things that we need some sort of policy or operational decision on there's that if you level we could do that so then you can kind of see let's just start to program in some of those fuel costs those types of things you'll have a fuller picture of exactly just just how much wiggle room you've got in there and or what some of those additional pressures really are it's coming at a bad time to have all this cost spike because we're also at a time when there's an unprecedented amount of federal money out there and we need to spend some local money to have the engineering to a point where we can go get it and going to get it then cuts down our maintenance costs right because we redid the road or we redid the water sewer lines and it's just a vicious place to be but it's the this question is the one that unlocks the rest this is the the point in the maze where we've got three or four pathways whichever one you pick because when we think about how to build the capital plan you know next year in the four years after flow out of of whatever the decision is so it's just some of this is also kind of come down to like the whole conversation about the town projects to go into the ARPA funding like does that move some of the highway projects or some of the the water wastewater projects that are we're seeing as creating part of this increase into that funding so it doesn't become tax funding you know it's it's balancing some of that in with it i think but i'm not sure if the timeline for moving that and how that's going to marry up with this it seems to be very lagging yeah it would be nice if that list of projects in priority order was here as we were doing the budget if you did your budget in may there's only one other town that does that but if you did it may for example there'd be that really nice ability to marry those two out but because we're in march we're just going to be you know the suckboard has the ability to make the decisions on using that funding we could say like we're taking x $100 of that now so the applications for priority here is only have this dollar amount now because we're going to balance some of this some of the things that are in here are there that are in here we talked about an engineering services agreement being baked in there that's not in this model yet because if we had to figure out how to make numbers come down that's you know five seventy five hundred ten thousand whatever we ended up this sort of a service level it does have a mowing two-year mowing contract for the east randolph and randolph center cemeteries that's a 30 35 thousand dollar proposition based on what it costs last year that's a item that we ought to for which there is a going into because there's yeah we had a couple hundred bucks 300 bucks for a cemetery pot and then we're responsible to maintain it for the perpetuity like that rate to me seems pretty low actually looking back i think it was only it was 85 dollars in the sixties for one so we haven't gone out much from the sixties only because i found our families indeed the other day yeah it would be nice if the cemeteries broke even or it came close i don't think you're going to see that because if we're spending 35 000 a year in mowing on them yeah well it's and you sell it's it's a problem at one point yeah you know well i think it's a good i think it's a good fair conversation to have i i asked the even before trevor was here i asked the doffa for sort of a breakdown of like what does it actually cost us and annually to run to run the cemeteries and um and what's our how much money do we revenue do we have and and i we still don't actually know i don't i don't think there's two don't have good figures on but there's two parts of it right there's the what's the revenue coming in and what we're charging and what's the service level you know we're is our service level there the amount of times we're mowing and weed whacking and whatnot at a higher service level than what we need there you know like i don't know how they they go what every week my my understanding is that we don't actually have figures the way buildings and grounds doesn't break out cemeteries from the rest of what they do we do now because we do it on a contract yeah this would be a little bit easier with the contract and the fact that we're we didn't do burials last summer so if you looked just to last year you could probably come up with something closer to a cost but for the other cemeteries that's just baked into the labor cost and the general equipment so we have to spend a summer i think trying to track it so now we can then record it in either the the budget or somewhere else that we could say you know there were x number of hours spent here here's what we did while we were there most of it's more trimming but it might be worth sitting down with that cemetery commission and having that conversation of you know what is the real what's the balance here but that's not going to be a lot of president on the cemetery maintenance sure i was matt morowski um having driven by the pleasant street cemetery for 15 years and talked to plenty of people in town towards a going joke that it is the most mowed boat piece of property in the village and it looks worse than every other property in the village and so i think it's probably we're not getting our money's worth of the contract it gets mowed and then the grass gets burnt and then there's nothing to mow but they mow it anyway it's mowed and mowed the same tracks until it's scalp down to nothing it's not oh golly yes yeah and then the one in history adopt the grass gets to be this tall right well no because the neighbor won't sit down the guy next door had this is the one that got the contract in the a frames there okay but you know does it have to be mowed every week could we go three times a month in the first part of the summer and then twice a month later in the summer when the grass slows down you know i think that's some of the other way to control those costs right it's kind of have that level of service discussion for that you'll have to lean on the you know the leads and those departments in order to make those decisions and just yeah i'm just calculating out some numbers here the majority of this you know this increase boils down to if i'm not mistaken you know it's a lot of you know staff type cost and i don't know how you get around that because you're not going to hire people for less once you paid them five years ago and you know to be competitive and have people here we've all seen what we've got to do so it doesn't matter whether you're in business or whether you're you know running the town you're still going to have people and you've got to be able to be competitive so and that's like seeing the cost of not having people in these roles exactly and we have yes exactly we've that is another thing we've all experienced so yeah it's a it's a tough place to be and so you know there's like i said well it's done to less economic growth not keeping pace anyways does that give you what you need do you want me to try to mock up a couple of different scenarios and those will serve almost as a set of choice tables for you we do like a level three percent nine five percent just so you can see the iterations too i don't know if that makes sense that's i broke it down in one other community that way and it seemed to be helpful in i don't think we want to go with more than a five percent i mean some of these are eight or more i mean you've got an eight percent increase in the library so you just i think that's a tough one see what happens yeah we might be able to find you know some might be slightly higher might be able to cut some others right and you know your point about the highway is right like your bigger increases your fuel your broad salt whatnot that's where it's hitting so that one we've got the employee costs and the material costs it's a brutal year it's just a brutal year okay and again i just think we really need to just be careful when we you know when we decide to you know make try to make do with less that it's going to have cumulative effects in in you know in the years going forward in that we'll have we'll likely have to make that up somehow probably in a more expensive way in the future and that if we're looking at trying to grow the local economy where you know the local economy depends upon a lot of this stuff and you know for years we didn't have an economic development coordinator because we didn't want to spend the money and we've seen now what bringing that person on has you know that role more than pace for itself absolutely and so i just want to make sure that if we're talking about not funding things that we're not setting ourselves up in the long run to actually make that that divergence of those curves even worse um then better because we're really focused on this you know on this one particular year i do worry about the staffing component just because it's we've been a year in this and we're just about there feels very much like we're you know collectively sisyphus we've made it the rocket's just about at the top i'm just afraid it'll let go and we'll start again and the impact's a lot but um but maybe in doing the exercise we're able to find insulation or find opportunity but i i think they'll be the lower you go number wise the harder the choice is to get which you guys already know but and and you know i do feel like we've done a really good job of paying attention to the budget and you know and really spending on money on essential stuff and it's not like we're you know spending gobs of money on all sorts of things we don't need it's been a pretty careful pretty trim budget at least as long as i've been on the on the board we have done a good job it's just this year i think we're going to get a lot more pressures right i'm just saying that because of that though yeah it's it makes it harder to be like oh we're just going to cut this program which we just really wanted and thought we could afford but we don't really it's like we there's not a lot of that kind of stuff yeah i don't think you don't have that much no that's not a lot of fluff left in it we found it off that's how we kept the percentages low for so many years yeah i think you get the school side to do that it would it would help a lot so just as a little for if we had a just two percent grand less growth we're talking at nearly ninety thousand dollars of more money coming in so that 250 becomes 160 just for example that's why i want to continue moving forward with the branch work project because the branch work project is worth a lot of economic growth and grand list value so i don't want to you know you know we're waiting for Salisbury square to materialize you know those kind of things need to happen so yeah so yeah we all got you know you get the wind taken out of your sales here during the pandemic but it's time to you know try to push this stuff along and move forward here to find those kind of growth areas two percent at a time going back to when i was in Essex we did describe that as an emic oh i know we're describing as what an emic just it's how that's times in places change yeah yep okay well thanks all right let's move on to discuss the town arpa list kind of connected kind of connected so you've done a couple of different things throughout the arpa process one was create the committee create a scope of work the idea there was in no small part public engagement solicit projects through some sort of public avenue make recommendations to you after some review the committee's working pretty hard at that they've been underway for a while now they've taken in a few still probably first round of submission is the maybe the broadest way yeah first round submissions are 24 yeah and so they were going to process the same time there was always the idea that there'd be a town list that would fit in there as well and so the idea is to try to talk about some of the projects that you might envision as part of that town list and then we get to start to run down details costs those types of things one that's come up a few times internally externally that ties into pandemic resilience is website upgrade e-commerce capacity expansions and digitization of records um so that's one of those ones that I just need some costs to sign but it's a few different departments so that if we had to close our doors unexpectedly we could still process a bulk of the business and provide a level of access to anybody with those means and are there were there greater sort of labor efficiencies embedded in that as well if we had these kinds of procedure processes in place that potentially would require less staff time and stuff like that it may cut down for example on the trips to the window especially if we're integrated with recreation registration some of which a lot of which already happened online anyway dive you could somehow do dog licensing that way tax payments were easier to do water and sewer payments were easier to do records research some of the things you'd still have to do at the window just because you need proof of who you are so and that needs to be notarized things that have to be recorded so that fees can be calculated based on the size of the thing so a lot of this would be affecting the the clerk-treasurer office more than the rest of the finance and then really it's um from an internal impact it can create some efficiencies and some 21st century good governance stuff on that end but this is really an upgrade for for the public and anybody who's a user of the building who because these are tools that would be there in a pandemic they'd also be there for some reason people are sick people are out records research can continue because we've digitized those pieces we don't necessarily need to maintain some space up there so maybe we can reallocate the spaces in the back i don't know if they have a higher purpose but we'd at least be able to figure out if that is a case you know can copy and equipment go there rather than a kitchenette so there are those and then the other ones that have come up along the way have been sort of energy related everything from dv charging stations to any kind of solar installations we've talked a little bit about um water quality projects for one that we're going back to sort of the original eligibility for the use of funds um and the way we've talked about that that's a good way to spread the money to the different corners of randolph because water quality projects that we have that touch all the corners stormwater is a big one um so what do you think of like the projects we did on howard hill through the grants and aid we've got some road sections out you know north randolph headed into east randolph those are the ones that would be prime for that and get that money to different spots um we've been a little bit of talk about bike pad stuff um but nothing project-centric other than maybe it helps us with some of those we talked about the missing links um or the connector pieces we could really benefit from someone who could come through do an assessment and essentially hand us a maintenance plan we've been good at building sidewalks we're a little up and down with what happens after they're built um so though i mean those are just some very broad ideas things that have come up when you all have talked in the past or just that have come up internally but really it's about other ideas or things based on sort of the budget and this might be an iterative process for you too um as you see what happens with the budget but things that we could embed in there we've stayed away from projects that have identified funding sources through other mechanisms so paving projects there's the reserve there was a year-end surplus that voters had put a chunk of it into the paving reserve that was a nice little turbo boost to that um and it's got consistent funding so we've stayed away from those types of projects that other committees have done um and then have stayed away from the north reservoir and well project um to sort of reflect that there's service to the enterprise district there and the goal has always been how is the can you make the case of the impact as broad as possible um and does that one sort of fit there there's certainly some funding issues with that project based on on the construction costs but we've got identified potential avenues to go and get it um so if you don't use ARPA funds there are pathways so some of those those are the bigger dollar ones that we have kind of in a in a capital programming frame of mind and then we have money going aside for just gravel road improvement those types of things just in looking at what other towns are using it's a real mixed bag some are are taking requests as they come in they might be community project focused um on pillars planning to use some of it on one of their larger projects they've got planned on I forget if east state street or another one that's on water sewer storm water sidewalk paving ball of joy a very expensive project so I think there's benefits to looking at going like with the digitized records and e-commerce I mean that definitely meets in with the resilience the goal of the funding it's also something that we're never going to do it's never going to reach the top of the list but it's something that we should do but that's that's not that's like other records that's not like your land records and all that stuff right because we get revenue from that too right and it would be the idea would be to to essentially charge the fees as if you came in and did the research and made the copies and I think there are programmatically there are ways to do that whether it be subscription fee with a true up or something as a per record basis yeah that's way New Hampshire does it yeah I there are a couple of communities that have that we can reach out to them I want to say Colchester has been doing this for a while yeah I could be getting wrong but I'm pretty sure that would be good too if you can get those on there but I just don't want to see it impact the revenue side we need that and so those are those um those projects are coming to the board and then the list from the committee for the the board to decide what to fund yeah it'd be nice to somehow maybe marry them together a little bit before that just so that everything melds there's a chance to review it to see how the things fit together but timing may dictate if they meet here or at sort of the committee level but the hope is that we can join them up earlier especially since the committee has really been living in sort of the rules the considerations um take advantage of the time and energy that's been put into it what type of projects are you seeing coming in as a variety some infrastructure stuff water system improvements time beautification some recreation related things improved rec facilities some things are uh I was paving in the year I can tell you the committee just generally as a committee we were trying to encourage projects that that aren't things that would normally be funded by general fund stuff so I mean it sort of takes this one time pot of money and moves the town forward in a way that otherwise wouldn't happen but people are submitting things for things like paving and so um some fair amount of recreational stuff solar solar charging facilities youth and community center gives you a flavor of things child care center I just didn't know that in terms of the cost some of these projects just didn't know the letters 10 10 10 to $50,000 in summer more than $300,000 so it's it's quite a range we've asked people to do is um take it only takes about five minutes or so to submit a project here and then we are going to rank them in we're taking what we've said is we'll take these submittals through the end of the year in January we'll rank them and we have sort of four criteria that we're looking at and then we'll get past them on to you these projects and how they score and what we recommend and it's obviously up to you to take the recommendations or not you can do what you what you want there's the criteria that we are looking at that we've decided is important as one is the connection to the intent of the funding in terms of resiliency and and how the town benefits in the event of another pandemic or something similar second thing is community benefit how widespread are the benefits in terms of geographic reach and demographic reach so that's connection to the intent of funding the community benefit next thing is project viability like somebody if somebody comes up with a great idea but it's sort of pie in the sky we're probably it's going to rank pretty low because it's just not going to get done so when we look at that we look at as there's been a conceptual plan done already has there already been some investigation done are there people who can be champions and managers of the project available so we look at sort of project viability that's our favorite criteria fourth thing is connection to economic growth how does it benefit the town long-term doesn't avoid creating future financial obligations for the town it doesn't leverage additional funds can be used for instance as match money for something for another project that's already been funded so those are the four four things we have sub criteria under each one of those but again those are the four things connection to the original intent of the funding project viability i'm sure community benefit and connection to economic growth those are the four ways we decided the four buckets that we're looking at so when we give them give you the recommendations a lot of scoring in those four categories so from the committee perspective would you like the the list of the town projects to score along with the ones coming in from the public i think that would be the cleanest but in the course of an hour or so talking to trevor and kim we could put it into this matrix and score the same way i don't think ideally they're not going to submit a sheet for each one well we we make a table that would provide sort of a distributed wouldn't look probably terribly different than the scoring sheet even where it's what's the project we might identify sort of what set of policy goals we're aiming to hit and then order a magnitude for cost and then timeline and some of the not the trick but really does identifying the projects coming up with those cost estimates those are the the two pieces of labor that go with it and the cost estimates one's the one that we'll have to run down do the best we can to at least ballpark them accurately enough one um one project that came to my mind recently one that's been talked about a lot for for many years now that i which is another one which would be like we'd love to do but we never you know kind of love to do but there's never enough money for is is putting in a multi-use path between Randolph downtown and Bethel along the river and originally i thought maybe this would this that would be a good project to to use some arpa money for planning purposes to kind of get that ball rolling and then my understanding is that there's there's a lot of money out there for those kinds of projects that is non-arpa money and that granting agencies are looking for this these kinds of projects in a bigger sense and so they double the warwick grant money the warwick money got i think it was way more than double double right and that's where that would qualify yeah i i think it's there but i think you can get a transportation planning grant too right so yeah um to do the planning work and then go for the board act so so anyway that that was one thought that i had that i i would like i'd really like to see us this is a would be a multi-year process of you know planning getting funding and doing construction and um i think it's something that we should start you know kind of getting the ball rolling on some sometimes sometimes students start talking to people in Bethel and see if they're they would be on board with you know doing their end of things and working together to to do it it would have clear economic development impacts people would come from all over the place to go on a flat mostly multi-use multi-use path between nature right through absolutely you know away from cars in a protected area where it's flat you can go biking on trails around here but good luck going more than a couple of miles before you head to hell um and so it would be great for people with young families it would be great for older people it would really um be and again this is all these aren't my ideas this is something that people have talked about in the community for a very long time now and it's been talked about for a year we've been doing a lot of the sort of the easier projects in terms of paths and stuff like that but this would given our experience with all that other stuff it seems like the community is really ready now to do something of this magnitude and I think we could easily develop a lot of good relationships with various groups and other communities and get a lot of momentum doesn't two rivers provide won't won't two rivers help with that type of thing I think when we were talking about the sidewalks and Randolph center I don't if I remember right Peter Gregory said they have somebody on staff that'll help write the grant to go through and get the transportation planning grant for it and then they'll staff it and do that study that you're talking about basically look look at what the what it would look like and you know the town of Randolph and the town of Bethel could both sponsor it and I thought I'd let them do the heavy lifting yeah they love those grants because it pays for their staff right truthfully you don't have that many landowners you have to deal with going down through there either I mean it's not like it's all it's not a ton but no there's but there's there's a few big ones who would need to be persuaded for it to be viable might be able to persuade them with some form of tax benefit and I mean that's always been the that was one of the vastest strategies years ago which you can never seem to get across the table was that you know people who you let people use a snowmobile trail should have some form of tax benefit to that hasn't happened but because it voids the recreational law that hold you harm yeah I know there's a problem with it but it seems like it could get worked out somewhere as a legislature so would would it make sense to approach um to rivers about this first before like because having having a path that goes to the Randolph line and back it'll probably be nice but it's not quite as compelling as one that goes all the way to no different people kayaking down river right now you park our here somebody parks a car down there and you kayak down the river yeah it's the same kind of thing you know so well I guess what I'm what I'm wanting to know is from from a process point of view is this something that we should like start to team with folks in Bethel first and then talk to two rivers if I call two rivers because they'll hold the they bring back I would call and talk to two rivers and let them pull the meeting together we'd end up in Bethel and have that conversation so talk to Peter and be like hey so Matt was that kind of was that one of those things on the list was a rational path of that magnitude um no that's not I don't think that's the right funding and that's in terms of the criteria that we've established that's a project that would score a thing very very well until you get to um uh for viability only because it's so far off it's not that it's um on google it's a good project we can clearly do it but it just has such a long horizon for getting it built that it's getting it constructed might score relatively low there but the other thing is that it's horribly high you got nobody managing it you got no project outline you've got a lot of ways to go before you get to that point yeah yeah actually Larry and I talked about that project and like a project like that if even if we put together a very conceptual plan showing possible routes or something it moves the project a little bit further along we also talked about that's an example of a project that may have plenty of other funding available uh I mean municipalities all over the state have been getting transportation planning grants to do to do bike paths we just haven't I think it's a pedigree discussion yeah yeah yeah let him put together and I those those grants that I believe have matching requirements um to remember right the last time I worked on one of those and that would be an excellent use to apply to the match put that on your town list yep and um and I I um mentioned this to uh to mark the other day and he said that there's um TAP money as a grant is that and I don't but I don't know what that stands for but it's a it's a it's something that which is open right now there's a program that's open right now that we you the league put out something that we're not we may not be eligible for it maybe a different program uh maybe it's I don't know I it's a familiar acronym he doesn't he doesn't oh transportation alternative oh yeah it is a it's a v-trans program that's the same one is that the same thing that you were talking about yep okay we're not eligible for COVID-19 related pay leave grants that was what it was um but again you're thinking that this is something that would be more appropriate to to run through two rivers than to try to I would they'll staff it they'll do everything they'll write the grant application they'll get the hole on board with us they'll start a committee to oversee the study and okay well I can certainly get in touch with Peter Gregory and I think that's there tell them that we're that we're interested in seeing where this might go and see what he says the problem is we just don't have the staff here to that's going to take some energy and a consultant and there'll be some engineering to it there'll be some you know wetland delineation that kind of worked to stay away from that where does the path to go railroad goes down through there some challenges there okay it sounds like we've got direction there Jeter financing proposal kept it on in case we were ready to go we've got the down payment or the deposit was paid using wastewater reserves so it's our machine and it's being built we still have to work out the financing proposal we're trying to get something from municipal lease consultants at Grand Isle I just haven't yet so we've got to follow up with them so it's really just finding out about that we've programmed it into the budget assuming minus the deposit what it would be similar interest rate to the loader and that seems to be where they are so in the six and a half percent range so we've got that for the five-year term so we are planning for that debt service payment one way or the other we just have to work out exactly where we finance it from the options right now one called Great Western is what the equipment vendor provided but it'd be nice to work a little more locally with someone so we're still working on it I kept it on there in case we were ready to ask you to take action any other business I had a quick question and I don't know whether you were going to cover this in the manager's report because I didn't take a look at it do we have any update on the animal cruelty case that occurred up at the mobile home park and Armstrong do we know if that's being pursued for prosecution I believe so yeah that's really the update yeah yeah would that be a combination of Milo and the state police presumably I think usually these have been the state police I guess the game wardens have taken over a lot of the investigative response work it was a short-term MOU type of arrangement that looks like it's going to extend and so it's really been more of the game warden working with the county and the state's attorney and the one dog passed away the other one I think has even it's been rehabilitated if not physically yeah the last time yeah it was foster I don't know if it's been rehomed but it was good they got the dog back up to 85 pounds yeah yeah from 35 pounds and that's pretty just I just I'm concerned because it's now the third just in my tenure on select board it's the third sort of manual the other two weren't animal cruelty they were you know vicious animal issues but it just feels like something we need to get a better handle on that's one of the most horrific situations I've heard of yeah I mean whether there's you know emotional mental illness or whatever component it's still it's just and how we could ever have you know I don't know how we ever could have known what was going on there but I hope that the courts in this state and it's something that I know Jay is looking into at the legislative level and the courts in this state we do an awful job in this state of animal cruelty intervention we really do and I just I want to follow this one because it's just it's so horrific I don't know whether there's anything we can do at the state level to tighten up tighten up our animal with the courts just dismiss these things so so cavalierly and you know behind every animal abusers a child abuser and a spousal abuser and you know but there is there's a whole legislative package coming good on that that was part of the march and the stuff that took place in month earlier last week we had another incident that might head to prosecution too not involving dogs but pigs actually so there's there are a couple of different ones in play but it seems like the combination of Milo and the game warden and the state's attorney has there's been some action on these sooner than later I would like to follow that closely any other other business we do have a request from sunny to appoint a select board rep on the planning commission his request was for Larry okay I don't see how I can say no you're being requested unless unless uh if somebody else is really it's important I'll arm muscle you over if that's something you want Pat uh he's muted that's why we have it he's actually not muted he's not muted he's just not talking well I would I would take the place but I'm already doing cdrb I'm just waiting for something the drb I'm just waiting for something to come before them it's talking to Chris Recky the other day it's been a while since there's been anything on there which feeds to the grand list issue which yeah absolutely all right all right managers report nothing much to add from what you have there um other than with the staffing by the time we hit Christmas we'll be down to just the finance director's role in terms of the vacancies well that's an impressive this is the closest we've been to a full set what about the director actor assistant do we have like a part time we do have some part time hours that are in there um I don't pay just talk to a few different candidates and options so we could add that um there is some some some help we could use there but in terms of the full time positions longer sort of impact um and we just we had three scheduled we held two interviews for finance director and we'll probably bring both to a next round um that's very good so it's looking more positive than uh trying to be very sure I don't want to jinx it like been closed before we had the fish on the line in the boat and somehow um and in the cooler and yeah right uh executive session there are three contracts personal appointment of an evaluation of a public official and legal or potential legal ones really just sort of an update the legal piece yep or once they go once they make the motion all right I'll make the motion so you gotta do to find that the second is necessary oh did we do that that's the first okay okay you're making that motion sure I'll make that motion all those in favor hi hi and now the motion to go in maybe now I'll move to an executive session second all those in favor I those motion carries