 All right, welcome back. It's still the breakfast and plus TV Africa. We'll be focusing on roadblocks, checkpoints in Nigeria. As the lawmakers are asking the Inspector General of Police to dismantle all illegal roadblocks, checkpoints. And let me just give you a background to that particular story. The House of Representatives on Wednesday called on the Inspector General of Police, Osman Babat to dismantle all illegal and unnecessary checkpoints in the country. This resolution was a secret emotion of urgent public importance moved by Ifani Mooma on the need to investigate the death of 20 persons along the Orale Onicha Road in the Ihal area of Anambra State. We have joining us this morning, Chidi Omeji Heiza, Security Expert and Editor in Chief Nigeria Security Digest. Thanks for joining us on the breakfast this morning, Mr Omeji. Good morning. What's happening to me? Yes, it is indeed our pleasure. Now the lawmakers are asking the Inspector General of Police to dismantle all roadblocks, illegal checkpoints in the country. But I am tempted to ask that, this particular question. This is not the first time that we have talked about roadblocks, checkpoints, and what's the reason sometimes they cause on the highway. But then again, why do we keep on acting as if we're going in circles when it comes to policy and statements concerning the lives of Nigerians and of course of road infrastructure? Right. This issue of police checkpoints and all that. Just like you rightly said, it's been there something we've heard over and over again. But every other Inspector General of Police that comes on board, the first policy announcement we make is we're going to dismantle every roadblocks, roadblocks, checkpoints, and no matter what. Time to pass. I don't know what is stalling for implementation, but I think time has come really for us to understand that it's not just secure the community or the society only through roadblocks. Sometimes we don't block across a whole lot of problems. I don't know if I've gone, if I've driven, let's say, between the makers up to or to be made down to Alicia. You will count almost 1,000 roadblocks. If you are going towards, let's say, from Alicia to Wery, distance of about an hour, you will see not less than 50 roadblocks. If you are coming from Utopa branch up to Obolafo, you will count not less than 20 roadblocks, manned by police and sometimes the military guys. Now, my problem is not that there. My problem is that the constituted all manner of security breaches in itself. I do not belong to the house member who put up that debate. And then, I would think that the police should man up this time around to look at this, because the people are complaining, and there's not a thing that's given us the best of security staying in those roadblocks. So how come we have so many of them? Yes, you see how many of them are keeping up and doing all kinds of things up in the long run. So it's something that we need to look into, because people are complaining. I mean, government is all about people. I'm not happy about this. And they are actually justifying their outlets. So that might be what I understand that there's a need for police to shake the report. It should be maybe born out of, let's say, reports. And then they have to now come up and stop people for a while. So that they're going to live there every day for some reason, collecting bribes, you know, doing a lot of things that are terrible. So to me, it's about time we get rid of those guys that are not very effective. That's not fair state to me. All right, Mr. Chidi, Omeji. We'll just hold some of your thoughts that you have concern in this particular issue and incident. We'll take a report on that particular issue and we'll come back and talk some more. I stole the breakfast on Lost TV Africa. By the time the IG looks into these illegal checkpoints, you do not, it's common sense. How can you put a checkpoint, a police checkpoint at the end of a slope that would be engulfed in between two-four stations? What if a trailer that is carrying a tanker loses break and something happens and it goes into flames without taking cognizance of the fact that there are petrol stations on the right and on the left? And the most annoying part of it was that afterwards, the police that were at the checkpoint absconded. We lost over 20 people in our community due to the roadblocks and a particular point which ought not to be. We've cried to the authorities that people that be, we've raised alarms over now, before this time, to make sure that the proper things are done. But as it is, nothing's happening until that same Sunday where a trailer carrying container load had to run into that roadblock with the traffic gridlock on that point and killed a lot of people, killed peasants, women, children that were on their way to go about their normal business. All right, welcome back to the breakfast in Placeve Africa. We're still looking at the fact that lawmakers have called and are asking that roadblocks across our roads be dismantled illegal roadblocks and police checkpoints as well as military. We still do have Chidi Omeji, who's a security expert joining us from Abuja. Once again, thank you for joining us, Chidi. Thank you, thank you. Now, it's been also reported that, of course, that incident that happened, which is also the major reason that this lawmaker or the lawmaker has raised the concern that checkpoints and roadblocks are responsible for some of the accidents that we have on our highways and our roads. Do you agree with that argument? Of course not. I mean, a number of cases we've seen that because of these guys' illegal blockage of the road, oncoming vehicles who may not know that they are there, who just wanted to demand that, you know, you see chains and chains of accidents happening occasioned by this particular accident. Look, we are modern people. We should understand that we cannot get stuck to a particular process of doing things. We have seen that this particular roadblock talk, of course, even more grievous crime to society than intended accidents. So, does it mean that this is the only way police can... I think the only way our police force can... They're second, or they're already blocked, you know, and even if you see how these guys mess up the express, they will, you know, they will constitute traffic great luck with all these manner of... They will put tires, put logs of mood on the road, you know, looking as if we're in a war zone of goodness sake. I will not defend people. Look, I know that, yes, we have the communication. But there are better ways, more effective ways, more civilized ways that we can do these things which are in danger to the people, to the community that we think we are serving. So how long can we continue to screen this? How come that these guys are not able to come out any other approach, this method? What can somebody be generous enough to come up with a different way of manning our roads without the walking road? You know, having fast food is actually what I'm talking about. Let me tell you something, I'm from the South East and I traveled to the East, just three miles ago, and from that to Papua, I think it went wasted, going to Obolafo in a local state. My God, it is a horrible sight. Every damn meter, as you see, lots of mud by policemen, very uncouth, very well civilized, very corrupt, users and corruption are not low. These guys should be there. What kind of thing is this? To me, I don't know why we have to wait up to this point or wait for an honorable member, or whatever I call them to bring it up. This is something that the people have complained about and nobody gave me a touch. Hey, if it wasn't for people to take a lot to their hands or to disobey them that we now take a look at it. So to me, it's very annoying, really, that we are now able to continue to this point and become a great news anchor to the people. Yeah, Chidi, I understand you have this passion position concerning all of this, but then again, the House of Rep member who raised that particular incident talked about illegal checkpoints. You are a security expert, just walk me through. How does it really work in saner climes? How does it really work? What's the best international best practice is concerning checkpoints? Because in my understanding, most times they put checkpoints on roadblocks if they are on a particular alert or maybe on a trail of some criminals and they just have felt, and that's the policeman that is, felt that those criminals would go through that particular route. Are roadblocks or checkpoints supposed to be a permanent site on our roads, really? Let me tell you, in the past, you used to have what you call highway patrol. These guys are very mobile. They have the mobility of action. But these guys are talking about people who are those, even though they're sitting around there, you see them sitting somewhere, you know, they are going to sit somewhere in the shade and then they will set up their, you know, those blocks of roads on the road and then they'll be extorting drivers and all of them passing. There is no security. What I'm suggesting, again, the best practice is that you work with intelligence. You work with information. If there is a breach, maybe there is a particular information. Now, you have those mobile highway patrols. You know, that's why they call highway patrol. They patrol the express. So that they can even, you know, solve issues. But these guys, I don't know if they are going to play collecting bribes and we know it, we see it. Everybody see that this is by extorting business. So they will say that they, you know, they remit this money back to offices. That is why they are resisting. Because if it's only them that, if the guys are there for another money, I'm sure the people in the authorities would have stopped it. But because you have to remit the BPO, you have to remit the EREH commander, EREH commander of the commission. And this is, we know this when I did that. We are not a few century, you know, political system. We are moving forward with the awareness of the world. And the rest of the world works with information. They work with technology. They work with, you know, in the late, not just one of these talks, to a particular method of policing that we have adopted for the past 50 years. What sort of thing is that? Have you solved any problem? I want to see them having kidnapping on the express, or having accidents or occasioned by these kind of roadblocks. How come we are not looking at this? What about the issue of, on this issue, a great lot of the cost people. It's up to people because it's not because some guys think they are doing work that is not, you know, very, very... Anyway, let's not be angry. This is what we are talking about on radio, but these guys are not helping us. Most of the truth. Okay, so, but let's also look at the fact that, because I'm very concerned about how we say these roadblocks are illegal. And they've also been manned by civilians or, you know, ordinary men. But they are manned by, you know, men of the Nigerian police force. And in most cases, you also find men of the Nigerian army manning this checkpoint. So how do you now say these roadblocks are illegal when you have police officers manning these roadblocks or manning these checkpoints? That's the first question. So how do we now differentiate between legal and illegal roadblocks? Well, when people say that those are illegal roadblocks, let's say that they are not because of this, not because that we are seen as visible or, you know, the results coming up. But because somebody said it all, to get to escort Nigerians and remit to, okay, we know this. So that's why we say it's illegal. And don't forget, I want to remember that one of the first statement made by this current IG that we're going to get smart to all the roadblocks, we're going to withdraw policemen from, what do you call it? Person of the private protection, all manner of things. They're never going to do this because the reality is that the chains of police command rely on this thing for their pockets. We know it. So we're mostly talking about it. We are Nigerians, or this is our society. We can't be seen these things and not talk about it. So that's what the second question is, how do you distinguish between legal and illegal roadblocks? As far as I'm concerned, the very fact that the IG had told us when he came in that we're going to withdraw them and they are sitting there, then the illegal roadblocks come from, no, I've allowed them, let them stay. We now say, okay, fine, it's there. But the fact that he told us that he is going to, that those guys are dismantling. So that's taken up on daily basis because they know that they're making, you know, some money from it. Are we going to do talk this, do we need to worry about legality or illegality? We know that it's illegal. We are not glamorizing this matter. It's something everybody knows. So how then do we now protect our roads from, because you can't take out the fact that crime and criminality, criminal elements would always apply these roads. How do we then now protect our roads if we take out? I've told you that there's a little bit that, there's no more effective method other than have a mobile police patrol. That's not the only thing I want to say. But I will be going down once in a while and then we'll cross paths, you know, and walk with intelligence. Walk with, you know, so we don't sit down. And by the way, how come between, in the kilometer, you'll find about KT roadblocks? What sense does that make? Within a kilometer. Look, if you don't know what I'm talking about, don't try and pass through that a two-pound branch if you want it, up to Bola for any reason. And it's what I'm telling you. If you don't know about that, it's not passed there. Pass from Legos to Bini to Onisha. It's what I'm telling you. Now, even with the presence of all these guys there, have you stopped exactly happening along those routes? Have you stopped crime taking place? Have you stopped the result yet? We are given all this level of inconvenience and you don't want to ask people to talk about it. So my idea, the best method is to have a very mobile, very, you know, the kind of patrol that's stored there. I'll talk about patrolling, not domiciled one place. One place, you see them, you know, the other action action, you see them, you know, they're patrolling paths, you know, playing around with local, they're not even, you know, that's how most of them, most of them, they take them on their ways because they're living around what they're not going to be able to extract money from. Everybody knows about it. Every Nigerian knows about this. Okay? Okay, yeah. So invariably, Eve, I got you correctly. You are just saying that all roadblocks, all checkpoints around Nigeria should be removed completely, quote Turkey as in right now, we shouldn't even see any presence of, you know, these checkpoints. So invariably, you're talking about a mobile highway patrol. Over time we've had, you know, highway patrol like you have said before, but indeed it was not really so walkable they were dismissed and this, we now saw the presence and the resurgence of, you know, roadblocks and checkpoints or whichever term you want to use to call them, you know, but don't you think that is a bit of a policy somersault? Today we say we have a highway patrol. Tomorrow we have checkpoints, we have, you know, roadblocks. Over time, don't we just see a situation where we would almost run out of option as far we keep on doing the same thing I get that we're expecting to see different results? I didn't quite get you, but if what I heard was right, look to me, I'm not saying that we have to take away all the entire roadblocks, right? What I'm trying to tell you is this, that if you concentrate this roadblock along the stretch, because it's not necessary to do that. And by the way, roadblocks can come in, they must not live there forever. They can set up a roadblock based on information, based on intelligence report that probably certain things have been or other people are passing through. You set the roadblock to restrict movement to an extent. So that point is now that we are able to solve the problem. We're talking about that these guys that domiciled the permanently constituted nuisance. How many of these people see there is something that we know. So it's not something, what I'm trying to advocate here is, even if you're going to have roadblocks, let it be the type that are not permanent. There's a set of roadblocks to solve a particular problem. And we move on, we move on to other parts of the export. And let us have a very police activity on the express, not domiciled roadblocks, constituted nuisance. We have to be patrolling the express. We pay them for that, but then they decide to stay on place to extract body from us. So we can't take it no more. That's all the point. Thank you. But some of the roads are actually deserted. I mean, if you apply some of these roads, you find out that you really do not find houses or any structure. And so they're quite lonely. Don't you think that it's still still necessary that as much as we're saying dismantle the illegal checkpoints, it's also still good to ensure that we have some form of control? I do not know why I don't get to hear you clearly. What is that easy question? I'm so sorry. I'm talking about the fact that the roads, some of these roads are very deserted. They are lonely parts. And taking out these checkpoints might just pose so much ricks and danger. Now, if you have such roadways described, it's not even better to have a police system that patrols, that is quite mobile. If you are domiciled the patrol place, even the bad guys know where you are. They won't point you. They have got a particular route. But if you're mobile, they won't know where you are. This is as simple as that. So what plan you guys are saying is, let's have a mobile police system along our road. What guys will do in place cover the bigger portion of the road and transport, I want to call it, commuters will be suffering to assess roads as long as you get there. And they will be suffering. So I'm talking about the effectiveness of this police system. So this particular one, we have seen this over time, that is why you didn't resolve. So why can't we try another one? And a highly mobile police system along our road, something we can be. All right, actually, thank you so much for your comment. But then again, before we just wrap up all of this now, what would you suggest? I just want to get a practical example. You said that there are too many checkpoints. What's the practical move to make for maybe a one or two kilometer stretch of road that just how many checkpoints should we have or have if it is actually necessary? Good question, I think. Now, you and I know that policing and security agents work better with intelligence. They work better when they have information. Now, what we're saying is, in a particular stretch of say, a kilometer or two, it will have a roadblock, why? Yeah, so that it can assume movement to an extent, a very minimal extent, all right? So the bulk of your police activity should be very, very mobile. Problems to commit crimes. And if they know that this is the sport you are, they will naturally find a way to beat you. But if you're mobile, they don't know when you come in, nobody come upon them. And so it's not, look, I cannot say here and say, okay, one check point for a kilometer. No, it depends on the density of that particular area. Okay, look, I'm talking about the two-part branch because I assessed it very simply. And it was a refinement that I saw. Do you know that between the two-part branch to let's say, orachram or something like that? No, no, orachram to, I don't know how to call that. You don't have to tell me that. Do you know what you have up to? About 20, 60, 20 blocks. With security guys looking like Nebel, they can go and then extort it every single part of the path. It's terrible, but we're not fighting those that way. Thank you. All right, thank you so much. Indeed, we have been speaking with term cheaty, Omeji, a security expert. He is the editor in chief, Nigeria Security Digest and we have been trying to make some sense out of the request of them. The lawmakers asking the Inspector General of Police to dismantle all illegal checkpoints. Would you appreciate your input on cheating? Thank you so much, I appreciate your input. All right, it's still the breakfast and last TV Africa will take a yet another break. We'll come back and we'll focus on Omicron and some concerns and what we need to do to ensure better protection for ourselves here as Nigerians in the moment. Don't go away.