 Jefferson theory versus Jefferson practice not always on the same page Unfortunately, I think in particularly in ways that we're going to dive into further on the next episode But but since we're this all kind of has a little bit of a defense aspect in it as well Just one other point about Gallatin that you you highlight that I think is really interesting Is that agree to which he also had an understanding of the military industrial complex, you know in an early sense Where he warns about the way which defense spending creates a vested interest group And and obviously when we're seeing a rise You know, you we have not only at the end of the Adams administration Do we have the tensions between France and England? But as you mentioned briefly earlier You the Barbary pile of pirates hassling American ships of fueling a military response Which you highlight navy secretary Robert Smith who had a background in the shipping industry in particular May have had a role and and really a fattening the the physical response to The the triply war and perhaps an example right there in practice of gallatin's concerns about vested interest groups in foreign policy Yeah, absolutely So there was this issue with the the Barbary pirates and this is a lot of mainstream historians They say well, this is our the United States had to show with its supremacy on the on on on the world stage You had these clear what might be considered terrorists nowadays Or at least of like 10 years ago. They were Kidnapping American pirate American sailors, etc. This is in North Africa. This had to be stopped. So, you know, we had to send You know the navy and in doing so this is our first war We showed that we were a government to be respected with and you know, yeah, you got to do all that stuff And well, a lot of people they forget that they don't talk about that how people like john adams Mentioned that actually they were looking for tribute in that while this tribute may or may not have been just I mean, it was it was unjust. They were basically looking for taxes The the Barbary pirates is that it was going to cost less to pay them than to go fight them, right? So from the visit from the fiscal side, it's just well, let's just let's just pay them off basically in that Yeah, you know instead of fighting them, uh, you know, that that that was probably the the the the proper response to to do You know to do but jefferson didn't want to do that He wanted he was he was against the Barbary pirates from the 1780s An additional thing and this is something I talk about in my book is that he wanted to bring disgruntled federalists into the republican party and what better way of doing that than pleasing The various naval interests who at the time were basically located in new england And in shipping centers like baltimore and they were overwhelmingly federalist and you look at jefferson's various appointments related to the the trapoly war, etc and this is Yeah, it's a clear instance of this and that he's supporting this law I mean he's supporting this war partially as a way of pleasing the federalists And of course when you look at america's wars as I do throughout this book and as well as many other scholars have done There's a lot of cronyism that goes into wars that goes into the financing of the wars that goes into who's going to be the contractors for said war So on and so forth and that this is clear and that there were various Vested naval mercantile interests that were benefiting from this. This is uh, albert gallatin was against it John randolph was against it. Both of them were against the war. Unfortunately, they couldn't persuade jefferson to back off of sort of uh, his bellicose demands