 And welcome once again to the breakfast on plus TV Africa first major conversation for today We're going to be talking about transportation and of course a mix in that conversation with transportation and technology We're speaking this morning with the founder of boss boss His Oluwa Toby Fakao D. Good morning. Thanks for joining us Good to have you here All right, so let's let's talk about because I think in the last 48, you know hours We've had lots of lots of conversations talking about their transportation Mostly because of the traffic in Lagos and you know how how stressful it is with the The struggle also that it it we got to see you know with it gets in rescue vehicles to Iqoi You know where there's a beautiful building collapse So let's talk about the challenge with transportation. First of all that you've noticed here in Lagos Where would you say the biggest challenges? Yeah, I think the biggest challenge in transition in Lagos if we're talking about Lagos is it's traffic um traffic has has been a very major impediments to Productivity to efficiency and if you look at Lagos, uh, it's been tough for a lot of people to get things done I usually tell people, you know, if you live on the island or you you live on the mainland You work on the island to actually get things done in a day You really can't do more than two three things and has to be planned So the problem with traffic is because of rapid urbanization Everybody all over the country once they graduate from school or from the village as we watch in Hollywood movies Everybody wants to come to Lagos and if you got the statistics, you realize that Lagos is adding over 500 000 people to the population every year. So clearly the roads are not increasing the roads are not expanding And and and people have to work people have to leave people have to move from one spot to another Expand this, you know to the whole of the car the whole of Nigeria not just Lagos now Yeah, to the whole of Nigeria. It's also um a reality that rapid urbanization affects traffic affects Mix congestion reality in urban areas because most people want to move from Other areas to the urban areas because they believe the urban areas where it presents them more opportunities more More opportunities basically, you know and everybody wants to leverage on more opportunities and the environment where they'll be able to make better things for themselves And the idea is that it's in the urban center So and because the roads in the urban center are not increasing and some of these roads are poorly maintained There's high population in the urban areas and there's very Little road so aside that there are also a few other challenges that we've had in the in the in the road transportation All transportation generally in Nigeria one of it is the fact that Aside the fact that This congestion some of these roads are very, you know, not they're not properly maintained You know and because these roads are not properly maintained it causes This traffic if you have a situation where the roads are properly maintained You realize that the traffic is going to be reduced And secondly, apart from urbanization, apart from the fact that roads are not properly maintained There's not not adequate master planning of the of the cities, you know Most of the at the time when most of these roads were being built They didn't envisage this population explosion So there has been no infrastructure created for these roads and for for these roads to Be expanded and to be maintained a couple of state governments are doing that right now Because of I mean the reality is that in the if we keep this trend going in the next five years It's going to be a very serious deal for everybody. So some people are having to break down houses break down other things to create larger expanse of roads so road maintenance traffic congestion Those are the critical critical and lack of planning. Those are the critical Challenges I see face facing something in Nigeria. Okay. So, um, let's talk about, you know, technology now We know that in transportation you have to talk about moving persons from one point to the other And goods and what have you what's the connection with? transportation and technology Okay, uh I mean in simple terms in the simplest terms technology is The platform with which life is made easier Is made more convenient and it's made more efficient, you know, and for transportation anything that makes Us more I mean more able to move people and goods from one place to another It's it's technology. Okay. Now, uh technologies. So I always I always tell people that technology has been A game changer in transportation for several reasons Are we going to talk about um 10 years ago when If you wanted to to other to to hire a cab You're living on the island. You're going to the mainland or whatever you want to hire a cab You have to send somebody to go to the road. Yes, and get you that cab, right? And uh, god help you that you are not even um You live far from the road. You have to go to the main road Stop a vehicle, you know, but now what do you do? You just pick up your phone and you check your phone and you order a ride So these these are some of the things that technology has done Before you realize that if you want to take your bus, you have to stand in the main on the main roads to take your bus Right right now with uh new ideas coming out and new startups You realize that with the click of your phone, you can know the next bus that is coming You can you don't have to start queuing at the bus stop. You can actually go to the bus stop So these are some of the things that that are happening on the larger scale. You can see what is happening with um with uh tesla You know with sustainable energy, you know with um Battery powered vehicles fuel efficient vehicles hybrid vehicles. There's even technology now for sustainable roads So these are some of the things that technology has been doing for the transportation sector and with ai and data Technology is helping us to better Maximize even on the side of the of the of the operators So also better maximize profit to make the vehicles more durable and so on many other things So so you're you're the the things that you do now. How do you merge all of these together? Oh fantastic. We right now for example, but we uh, we have a Vehicle sharing technology, which we use for land and even air allows people to share A vehicle it's called right pulling so essentially what it does is that For somebody who's going maybe from the island to the mainland or somebody lives on the mainland and works on the island You know, uh, you can you can actually pick up two three people On the way to work, you know, and we also have the boss healing technology that helps you to um, I mean to to Be able to pick as many people as possible You know who are going the same destination? So what all our technology does is to take as many people as possible as close from the origin as possible And drop them as close to their destination as possible. That's regarding the land What we also do is that we aggregate charter vehicles So as opposed to scenarios with other companies where you have uh, you have to you know, order the ride You don't know the driver that is coming you you you you have surge You know, and then if you have multiple things to do you have to order a ride wait the vehicle comes You know, sometimes the drivers cancel on you and others. So we have uh technology that helps Aggregate all car car charter vendors. So you have daily charter. You have a vehicle to yourself for the whole day You know as opposed to waiting changing if you have, you know Multiple trips to do and also it also helps you to know exactly how you spend how much explaining for the whole day You know, you know that you have a driver waiting for you and this is good for business executives It's good for people who are traveling from one state to another people who are doing interstate travels and also One of the major advantages that we have is that it ends up giving you transportation at a at a cheaper cost Because at the end of the day, for example, if you're taking a One of those ride handling companies you're taking them from legal From the island to maybe say bad aggregate. You end up spending about 9,000 10,000 now Okay for like a two hour journey at the end of the day you realize that with bus bus you have If a vehicle and a driver attached to you with fuel for about 20,000 nine So at the end of the day, I mean and that's for the whole day So which is cheaper you realize that what we have done is that we've been able to create a system that makes transportation cheaper You know, I'm doing the same thing for air too that allows the people who are traveling Private jet services to pull pull passengers together who are going the same destination Okay, so let's also talk about because you know, we talked about the challenges of transportation And you mentioned the issue of Legos traffic and all of that amongst other issues that you have mentioned. So how can technology solve Some of the challenges of transportation that we're faced with in ijir and in legos to be precise Of course, you know legos major like you mentioned is traffic and technology That technology can solve traffic Challenges and it has been doing that for a while. Okay in in in this case for example um Let me give you an example. We have a I just talked to you about our Right pulling technology. Yeah So with our right pulling technology and our boss healing technology You realize that people don't have to take their cars to work Okay, and then you can share the space with like-minded people business executives The working class, you know, not just any kind of people, you know So at the end of the day what cash sharing technology does is to reduce the Amount of what of vehicles on the road, but that's not the case in legos But now yeah, and that's the technology that we are bringing to the market to change the game and the face of the industry You know and a couple of other technologies are also available that can reduce traffic You know in legos once people start to share Um vehicles you this are these have actually been done long ago in the in the 80s You know in legos states, you know So these are some of the things that we need to start thinking about and find creative means to solve all the problems That we have in transportation. There's a there's a person. So if i'm even driving to ikej ideally from phase one Yeah And a person wants to hop on You know this ride Who gets to fund the trip? Of course you who are hoping on the ride. So what happens is that? Whoever is going to be on on that platform, of course has to register the vehicle on our platform One of the vehicles registered and we have a very extensive kyc that we do on the Driver or owner who's who owns the vehicle who's using the vehicle? So um, just like your standard ride helen, you know, you you are going you you can then we now have weekly Subscriptions monthly subscriptions where you can then open the ride Okay And then and and then you can pay for your trip you can pay for your trip per day You can pay for your trip per week you can pay for your trip a month and that's easier because a lot of Working-class people want safe and convenient place some of them going to the brt and by then they are coming out I mean those are these are some of the stories that made us even go to the drawing but to To get these products done by then they're coming coming down from but you dress up You're looking nice and kinky and then you come out of the bus and you're smelling like you're smelling of goats You're smelling of Body sweats you smell you're getting me. So these are some of the things that have faced the Working-class in Lagos and and and and essentially in Nigeria and these are some of the problems that we're solving no, so apart from that also You know the issue of uh, you know our roads like you have mentioned that deplorable I'm not thinking that you know technology is going to pave way for that We probably need to fix the roads or do you think differently? No, no, no, no, we have to fix the roads There's no magic wand to to fix roads. I mean even though that I mean that the technology is now sustainable technology that use With where we can use use tires use tires as opposed to What as fouls but they wouldn't just fall from the sky clearly So so this is where our big daddy the government our big brother the government has to come to play You know, we understand that the roads that we have were not properly planned Okay, and we understand that the population explosion that we have seen in urban areas did not Did not was not putting concentration when these roads were being planned However, now that we are here even the roads that we have can we please maintain it properly? You know, can we ensure that immediately we have things like potholes. They are being fixed You know, because lives are at risk here You know, aside from traffic congestion lives at risk I was talking to somebody who was telling me that Nigeria is one of the most expensive places to maintain a vehicle And I understand why because the roads are bad You know, the roads are bad. You have to change your tires. You change your tires sit Two or three times sometimes a month. So what's the point? So we have to have a scenario where our government invests Properly in road maintenance and road expansion Okay I've also seen that With regards population growth and the amount of vehicles on the road and I know that's what you know leads to all the traffic, you know with Things like trains it reduces the amount of vehicles on the road reduces the amount of you know traffic that you have to deal with And so that's also a totally different, you know, level of Technology and how it helps In what ways would you want that the the Nigerian government partners with You know private Technology companies in order to get these things sorted. Yeah, I mean It's it's a no-brainer that government cannot give us all the solution that we have to all our problems You know, but but all over the world um Governments have have found a reliable partner in the private sector And if I must say in technology for example, uh technology Has been I mean we've seen the very various startups in Nigeria and the successes that they have Have achieved with with with tech either in fintech or in other spheres of technology and this has not been Uh, essentially because of the government. This has been in spite of the government because the government has not really been Fantastic with supporting technology. In fact, they have been more impediments in the way of technology However, my advice to governments to ensure that they continue to partner with a private sector In with private sector, you I mean there are a lot of transport technology Companies in Nigeria. The government is to continually engage them. You know, the government's got now engaged them to Help make commuting easier for example And with the more partners you have on the road with the more with the more operators you have on the road Definitely supply is going to crash demand and sorry Supply is going to ensure that demand the price is is crashed You know, so with these kinds of partnerships, you realize that And I like what fellow government is doing presently with the roads You realize that they are bringing back the the tolls, you know to ensure that the roads are more properly made And it's a ppp arrangement So I mean public private partnership has been has been for for time in memorial And I think that is the way to go for government to partner even with technology companies to make transportation more Effective and and one more thing I must say, you know, if government must improve if transportation must improve We must have data, you know, and you cannot have data without working with tech companies And we are ready to partner with government at any point in time to ensure that Transpiration is made easier for Nigerians. Is safety also concerned with a carpooling? Yeah, clearly safety is a concern and that's why we do what we call an intrusive and extensive um KYC know your customer, you know, we ensure that everybody that is coming on our platform, you know, because we have seen the The failures of the other right-hailing platforms So we ensure that every vehicle and every person and every driver that's coming on our platform is is well Well-schooled, you know, well investigated to ensure that, you know The people that are are carrying other people are people of repute and secondly I am also make make boats, you know that our model unlike other models We are in control of our drivers We handle our drivers. We train our drivers. We report our drivers, you know So and that really makes life a bit easier on like other platforms that that really do not Really own or manage the drivers in this case Okay, so apart from internet access that you have mentioned are there other challenges of, you know, tech transports Like technology and transport in the country Yes, yes, um, you know that the first Challenge I see is infrastructure, you know infrastructure is a huge challenge With transportation because on what infrastructure will transportation even work if if there's no infrastructure But I think another challenge we're having is data and statistics because Uh, I mean your truth of matter is that 80 percent of most of statistics that fly up and down Wrong or inadequate, you know, and this this really affects what we do So we really need to deploy technologies to ensure that we have real Real time information as regards data as regards, uh, uh, infrastructure, you know that can be and and I must also say that internet access even even though you you shrugged it off. It's a very huge matter You know in order for the economy to be inclusive and to first to run a knowledge economy there has to be Cheap internet access available to to people to use And effective as well So what would you say are the what would you be your top three Most vital things that would change the narrative with regards Traffic and transportation, you know challenges in Lagos The first thing I would say is Boss boss boss healing and right pulling And you know why okay, the reason is because for us to get Walking class in Lagos. We're stuck with our cars We're stuck on our cars So the first thing is we have to start right sharing So somehow some way that there needs to be things done to reduce the amount of cars on the road Yes, we have to reduce you see we cannot sustain the level of 500,000 people are coming to Lagos every day. They will buy more cars They will come to the they will come on the road every day and they have to move from one place to another father mother children Teenagers they have to move and at the end of the day the roads are not expanding next year another 500,000 people Will come into this city. So if we don't do something now We're going up. Yeah, we are definitely heading for the wall. So that's the first solution I would say car sharing and more ride ride ride hailing and ride sharing companies have to come to the phone The light rail you know made by 2022. I believe so that should help So can I ask you a question? When did the light when did the light rail project start? 2015 or 2016? I believe it was meant to be finished in 2017. I don't remember I know it was meant to be finished and it was promised to be finished in 2017 And then okay. Well, okay. Well, let me give you an example of the is it called the blue line the one that was coming from Tokyo that project started in about 2003 And I was in it now Oh, it started in 2003, but it it was was it suspended for a bit? Well, because I remember the last time that I heard about it. You see the bottom line is that I for example, you cannot really rely on other Okay, if you have a project that's supposed to be three years and for four years And this is 2021 2021 years. Yeah, and we're talking 19 18 years down the line and We still don't have it. Do you know when we're gonna have it? Well, the last interview we had with commissioner. He said He said it So the reality is that if you're looking for a real Problem-solving. Yeah, it starts from the private sector If you're looking for real problem solving, it's with creativity and innovation Creativity and innovation solves problem faster than government will and that's the reality So, um, I would say that we need to find more creative solutions to our problem if we wait for the government No, as much as uh, you know, the the idea of sharing cash sharing as a solution to you know, reducing traffic You also would never take out the fact that you will still have cars on the road And so you also have others just like you Seal on the road, but another concern which I was hoping I think that that necessarily might not have the private sector come through is the fact that we need alternative roads Alternative roads because right now if you look at the roads that we have, everyone is going the same way It's just the one way in and one way out and that's also a major issue. So, uh, I just wanted to tip that Yeah, so if I may also say something on that, I mean to be honest the the the the latest the government for example have been quite proactive in their approach to ensure that traffic is reduced For example, the expansion of roads that have been going on. Um, yeah, at least in the last five years, you know It's has been worthwhile Also the maintenance of the roads that I have seen especially on the island and in some parts of the mainland Have been worthwhile The action that they have taken regarding the drainage system because that also causes a lot of Traffic because once rain falls Everywhere is flooded and and once everywhere is flooded Cars cannot move. So that also has also affected To help to reduce traffic, but one one very key thing I must say is that Aside that we have to also explore other alternative means of transportation like air and water I like what they're doing with the cables though. We have the same issue some of these projects have been there for 10 years But the water transportation is a very effective means that I believe that the government should really look at In expanding our options of moving goods and service from place to another look at their papa ports, for example The only way to move uh move goods from a papa port is by the road Yes, you know imagine if a train a cargo train goes into that place or imagine if There's water transportation there. We have a fantastic inland waterway in in in Nigeria. Okay, so water should be one of the options that Government should look at in expanding other means of transportation The problem we have with road transportation is because road transportation covers about 96 percent Of the means of transportation in Nigeria and that's it's in itself So which which other do you think would be as lucrative as you know road transport about from? Which will be the next It has to be water for lego step. For example, it has to be water Water is where water is available naturally. We have coastal fronts. We have inland waterways and the inland waterway is very effective in moving Goods from one place to another So if we're able to create and and and we have very some some very fantastic inland waterway channels, you know So if we're able to expand and invest in our water water infrastructure You will realize a lot of people will not even go on the roads and that will make road movement For example, the the water infrastructure the way people move from the island from Ajah, for example The jet the the water pressure from Ajah to Ikorodu You know has really helped to reduce even make make travel more convenient for for some people You know and we can explore that from from badagria. We can explore that from Where did they call this place? From the other parts of the mainland and we can connect the mainland and the island by water And that is going to reduce traffic congestion on the road for for a lot of people It's a lot of I think it's just a lot of investment in you know and Interest really and people also getting to see the value in these things because you know Yes, I understand that there's some water transportation into the island and the mainland, but it's it's not enough No, the infrastructure is not enough And it's not it's not affordable It's not affordable and aside from in fact that it's not affordable It's it's not viable for private sector investment in every city in the world and you cannot mark my words in every city in the world that have Efficient water transportation system The government subsidizes it It is it enjoys subsidy from the government and transportation like I've always said is the matter of national security In time of peace in time of war people must move from one place to another Goods must move from one place to another food must move from one place to another and if these three things are unable to happen because there is no Good infrastructure, then we'll have a problem also. I must let you know that the Level of infrastructure development in transportation is also somewhat directly proportional to the level of economic growth and economic Efficiency of any nation, you know, so transportation has to be taken very seriously by the government You know, they would the same way they take every other critical sector of of the economy. They have to take time to show No, we'll see how boss boss boss You know infiltrates legos, you know, and I hope that Because I I'm always going to be speaking about the security, you know aspect of it Yeah, so nobody jumps into a vehicle and doesn't come out And for those who can afford to also pull on private jets Yes, yes, we we we are deploying artificial intelligence to and and data Okay, data action to ensure that we are able to make transportation more affordable for people So from the right-wing companies the international ones and local ones that you see here With with right-sharing Transmission is going to be more affordable with boss healing. It's going to be more affordable for the for the For the for the social bracket of people that that's that we serve Okay And the idea is to ensure that we deploy technology to make it's more affordable for people and more profitable at the same time for the For the for the operators. All right Um, his name is olua to be fakai today is the founder of boss boss And then we've been talking transportation technology and what legos and Nigeria generally needs to do in order to improve And uh to be better. So thank you very much for your time. Thank you very much. Thank you for coming plus tv. God bless you Thank you. I'm looking forward to speaking with you again. Yeah, thank you And this is where we will be wrapping up. Yeah, and of course if you fail to catch up on the conversation Do not forget to follow us on facebook and instagram as a plus tv africa and on youtube You also find out the conversation there plus tv africa. I am messy. Oh, oh, don't have a great day And I am a saugi of born. See you at nine