 My name is Robert Kibaya and the TechSoup Global Connect Uganda chapter and we usually organize meetups. We call them Tech Meetups, special good. And we usually meet on a weekly basis whereby a member who has a skill, he comes in to share with other members who are free of charge. So we don't charge for our events and everyone's actually free, like to become host for a program in this or country. And we just have to get in contact with the TechSoup Connect Global Coordinator, Eli, who is not here with us because right now it is in this country, it is at 4 a.m. So maybe it would have to find the recorded session. Allow me just one minute as Karen is setting up a presentation. You can set up, then we'll begin. As I talk to Ronald our second presenter is trying to call, yeah. Please go on, Karen. So the technology is giving everybody trouble today and that's what we're talking about. We're talking about implementing a sustainable e-learning program in Africa. And for me, this is something that's really close to my heart in terms of how do we really get everybody access to e-learning? How do we get people to be empowered by e-learning? So I've put together some thoughts. They're not necessarily the only thoughts, but it's one of you. And I would love your comments and things in the chat. So what do we need to effectively implement a sustainable e-learning program in Africa? Let's explore. So, and Spiro Corva and Hamilton wrote this paper in 2019 and they spoke about sustainability requirements for e-learning systems. And I've taken their academic paper and I've elaborated on it, I've adapted it slightly and I've looked at that in terms of our context within Africa. But what they spoke about was they first of all said to have a sustainable program we need economic stability. So we need positive economic value and capital and that needs to be insured and it needs to be preserved. The next point they said is we need to be environmentally sustainable. So the program needs to think about the natural resources that are protected from human needs and human waste which is a huge thing, not just in Africa, but globally. The third aspect was the technical sustainability in terms of the technology coping with changes. And we know technology is evolving and changing so very quickly. So looking at how is it changing in a fair manner respecting the natural environments? And I think that's really important. The fourth one was social sustainability, the relationships, looking at society. So equal equity across different people's diversity, connectedness and democracy in terms of individual views and not just looking at countries or at the relationships within countries. Aspect they looked at was human sustainability. So is the individual protected, supported with dignity, improving the quality of life and no threatening of people? And if we think of our continent, these are all issues in lots of different spaces. And then I added this if we wanted to be sustainable. Each of us as individuals need to think about our own role in terms of an e-learning system and it being sustainable. So how are we committed to that system? And how are we being responsible digital citizens so that we are digitally sustainable? So let's explore this further. So what is e-learning? E-learning is classroom spaces, whether it's face to face and the children are on laptops or tablets and the learners could be at a distance but within a digital learning space. So they're using digital for their learning, the e-being electronic. What is blended learning? Well, blended learning is an aspect of e-learning. So it could be in a classroom face to face. It could be in a blended learning space, could be with or without technology. So if we're talking from an e-learning space, it would be with the technology. And your blended learning could then have aspects of online learning, which don't actually have to be taking place in the classroom. They could be online and not in the same space as the teacher. And so blended learning is this mixture of where the teacher is sometimes seeing your children and sometimes not seeing the children. So what is remote learning? Remote learning is where it is digital completely in this instance from an e-learning point of view and the teacher is online and the learners and children are online but they're not in the same space. So they're not on the same school grounds, they're not in the same classroom. One will be in a different space to another. So now if we look at each of these aspects, if we look at technical sustainability where it's talking about technology must cope with changes and involve in a fair manner respecting natural resources, the most important aspect in terms of our continent and in terms of an e-learning platform really working is internet connectivity. And we know that that's a problem. Across our continent. So how do we improve that connectivity? How do we have people have access to data? The other thing is looking at the different kinds of technologies we want to include on this platform. What are we going to consider and how will that impact the technical aspect? So what about artificial intelligence, including 3D printing where they could be sending files to a station and have them printed and maybe the objects then sent back to students or teachers? What about adding robotics in a similar way where they're working with robots, perhaps building and learning about robotics and 3D printing on these platforms or perhaps activating robots, but from a distance? Virtual reality, something I really love. How do we include that? Would it be something to include on the e-learning platform? What about augmented reality and how you could be getting the learning from that point of view? Do include things like the internet of things? Or what kind of devices is this platform going to cope with? Is it just going to be for tablets or is it going to be for computers and tablets? Are we even going to consider having a mobile friendly kind of space? So all of these things need to be considered. But on top of that, there are all these other technologies that have been developed over the last few years. And what we really need to think about in terms of what we want to put on the platform and how do we look at it from a technical point of view is taking and thinking about responsible choices. What are the things that are most going to suit the people who are going to get it? What are we going to be upskilling them for? How are we making them aware of these new kinds of changes in terms of e-learning? And what kind of courses do you put on the platform to really upskill people to become self-empowered? So we then need to also think about what is the infrastructure that's needed for this platform? Well, most old systems use in-house server type infrastructures. But today we've got cloud-based learning and cloud-based access from a range of different providers. We would need to think about which type of platform would you use? And when we're using that, the advantages of a web-based or cloud-based platform is that it's really easy to access. It's much more cost-effective because you don't have to worry about extra security and protections and not getting data installed and up, we've gotten the words, up making your services or the sensors or the computers more reliable by upgrading them and getting them to be more effective coping with the newer threats in terms of security. So a cloud-based system generally protects you from a lot of that. So that makes much more sense and it's much less hassles in terms of running an online platform. We then need to think about what devices should we consider in this space? Are we going to use it so that teachers can use it on data projectors or interactive whiteboard type scenarios? Or are they going to be using just laptops in a space? Are we going to think about tablets or iPads? What about the students' mobile devices? Is the platform gonna work on something like that? Or 3D printers? Or looking at things like Raspberry Pi's or Arduino's? How are they going to be included? Or what about robotics and coding? Thinking about if you're having devices and they belong to a center or a space, storage and charging needs to be considered. What about teaching students about drones and other types of technology? So all of this needs to be considered. And then on top of that, you need to think about what type of learning environments is this going to be streamed to? And what kind of access do the people who are gonna be using the platform going to be using? Is it going to be where everybody's just gonna bring their own devices? Are they going to be spaces where a presenter or somebody could go and hire or fetch a shared cart and then take it to a center where people can share it? Or are they going to be libraries or places where students can actually go and hire out of the bus to do the courses? All of that needs to be considered. But if you're talking online, data is still the most important thing. How do we make sure that the students or the people wanting to use the platform have access to it because they have data? So how do we make sure they connected and can stay up to date? The first thing we should do is we need to conduct an audit. We need to make sure what is already in that space and how this platform is going to be used. So what devices are going to be used and by whom? What infrastructure is going to be used? What staffing requirements are going to be needed to run the platform? And will there be offerings of professional development to teach people how to use the courses or to develop materials for the platform? Will you need a physical space? Will you be looking at rooms or changing buildings or building a new building? Do you need to upgrade facilities such as electrical or water facilities? Are there policies in place in terms of the platform, the device usage or access to the platform? What about digital security on the platform that people's data is protected? So developing an implementation plan is really, really important when thinking about this online platform. And then you need to think about the budget. It's not going to come just from people giving their own time. So you need to consider what is a successful implementation? The infrastructure, the devices, the productivity suites that are going to be used or the management systems that are going to be provided? What training is going to be provided for the developers, for the people who are going to be using the courses? All of those things need to be considered. And you need to think about what are the budget constraints that you need to put in place? So planning carefully is really, really important. If we then look at economic stability, so looking at a positive economic value and capital in terms of this platform so that it is insured and preserved, we need to think about how do we create access? So if we think about technology, every part of our lives is impacted by technology. And then if we think about Africa and we think about the growth of educational technology and think about how this platform could really be used to empower people even more. Think about the lack that we have in our continent in terms of resources available because of language diversity, because of cultural diversity and just because of localization. So if a platform like this could be created that could address all of those needs, that would be incredible. So if we look at the global education technology market in 2020, it was $89 billion. That's a huge amount of money. And if we just look at some of the African startups, there are a large number that range from education for tiny little children all the way up into higher education. There are whole groups of education systems that might want to belong to a system like this. There might be individual courses or projects or products that people sell that would enhance this kind of program. So think about including those within the space. So if we're thinking about it moving on from an environmental point of view, we're now looking at natural resources protected from human needs and waste. So if we start off by our big global tech providers, for example, Google is really trying to make all their data centers to be environmentally friendly from the way they operate to the way they work. If you hop onto Google data centers, it's a fantastic website to go and look to. They created with UNESCO and a couple of other organizations, this Go Carbon Free 24-7. And so there's this whole movement by these big tech companies to say, how do we become carbon free? Google has a range of different kinds of offerings and scenarios and suggestions on their carbon free website. So saying, how do we get rid of electronic devices responsibly? Or how do we reduce city transport? Then if we look at IBM, they've just put out a note saying that they're committing to a net zero greenhouse of gas emissions by 2030. And Amazon too has their data centers and offerings where they're looking at being sustainable and responsible. So we need to think about who are we partnering with? What are the companies we are joining? And are they meeting this environmental sustainability role in terms of the e-learning platform? But then when we think about the platform itself, we need to think about, so are we teaching sustainability on this e-learning platform and so that it can be implemented in schools or in communities? So for example, water conservation and monitoring could be a course that could be done. And students could be building the electronic components and that could be linked to taps that are dripping or bathroom areas so that students are aware of water that's been wasted as well as teachers and the rest of the community. What about energy conservation and monitoring? And if you look at the picture in the bottom with the graph with the blue and the red and the yellow flags, that's in a school in South Africa where the children can actually go and see as well as the teachers, how much electricity is being used and monitored in the school building at that particular time live. Imagine having that everywhere in all the different schools to create an awareness. What about waste management and waste reduction? What about recycling and reusing projects and products that could be online? What about vegetable gardens with digital tracking and watering monitoring systems? What about aquaponics or bird life tracking making students aware of the nature around them in their communities and their schools? Or what about plants and tree life? So we can make projects really practical and still be teaching them about the environments and how to be respectful at the same time learning about new technologies. Another kind of aspect that we should look at is the social sustainability. So the relationships within a society is it equitable, is it diverse, is it connected and is it democratic? And when we're creating this platform, we need to consider that in terms of how we're creating it. So we need to think about who is going to be using the platform. So when we create it, isn't respecting the different religions and cultures and beliefs of other people? Are we seeing each other being able to teach and learn from each other as individuals, seeing each learner as a separate individual? Are we treating everyone fairly and respectfully on the platform? And are we setting an example as teachers in terms of how we're engaging with our students or community leaders so that everybody feels comfortable and the platform creates a space for that? If we then look at sustainability in terms of social dynamics, there are so many different cultural beliefs and there are so many prejudices that exist within society. So how are we, when we're developing the platform and looking at being aware of our own unconscious bias? Is everybody welcome within the platform? No matter their gender type, are we considering how we are coping with accessibility and people with needs? How are we making the platform accessible so that young girls can even go during the period months and can't actually attend school but could still be attending an online session? How are we making these kinds of scenarios accessible for everybody? Thinking about every individual's needs and not stepping on people's toes. When we think about this and we're developing a platform, we need to talk to as many different people as possible. So the platform says it will involve everybody and everybody is then seen as valued. So building a community to put the platform together and thinking about it, whoever the community is, you need to get everybody on board. Whether it's government education departments or educational leaders or the educators themselves, we need to think about how we can get the inputs so that the platform suits them really well. Think about the governing bodies of school organizations to support them or maybe their unions or other areas of people. The parents and the school community should be informed. The whole community should know about the platform and have input in terms of what they think will really benefit their community. And definitely the children from younger ages to older ages should be asked their opinion in terms of what would be needed for this platform so that a real e-learning sustainability platform can be created for a whole community. We then need to think about human sustainability. Think about the individual protected and supported with dignity to improve the quality of life and not threatened. In Africa, people are threatened often and we feel vulnerable. So how do we create a space which we know is securely protected where individuals' data and information is protected on that space? We will be monitoring things like bullying and cyberbullying so that people who are not behaving appropriately would be flagged and perhaps there are courses that they could go on to actually help them to treat people nicely before they're asked to be removed. How do we actually think about changing mindsets within the space? So thinking about civil society in this digital age and how we protect people's data. If we then continue thinking about the human sustainability because it's people who are gonna be using this platform we need to think about our personal protection in terms of the data and how that's gonna be protected on the platform. And then you need to think about what are the other tools that are going to be included? For example, resources so that accessibility tools will be able to be linked in and people who are blind or deaf would also be able to use the platform. If we then think about young people and how we need to consider changes. Young people are often considered as screen ages because they're always on screens. They have a digital footprint. They are seen as digital natives. They demand access. They see it as a right and not as something which they should just have time to do. They are often seen as social gurus and really comfortable on social media. So we need to think about how we consider that within our spaces. So understanding the benefits of e-learning for learners is really important. That our children and learners are changing and use technology. That everyone should be engaged in interacting on their devices. And so how does this platform engage with that? Encouraging collaboration and interactivity, being relevant and authentic and real world is really important for a platform like this. Individualized and personalized learning that you can create your own learning pathway that suits your needs and interests would also be really relevant. So there are lots of positive reasons for having a platform like this. And then if we think about the educators who might be developing the content or using the content, if we look at this platform, this box at the bottom is a teacher who is teacher centered and doesn't really use technology. And if we look across, you've got Bloom's Taxonomy growing across. So the type of questioning they would ask would be knowledge and recall type questions. In the block above D, this person is using some technology, but they are still only on asking the lower order thinking questions and using direct instruction. Whereas the teacher who is in B might still be looking at a teacher centered approach with little or no use of technology, but they are getting the children to think and they are getting them to use higher order thinking. And their lessons are probably more constructivist than they are direct instruction. But the teachers that we really want them to get to is a teacher who can use a range of questioning from knowledge and recall right the way up to higher order thinking and is using technology in a really wonderful way of reflection and collaboration. And so you would want your teachers to be skilled enough to get into level C. So you need upskilling to do that within the teachers. So the teachers become comfortable with technology and will encourage children to use this e-learning platform, will themselves perhaps begin to develop courses to put on to the platform and that they will see it as a benefit and not as a threat. And so professional development is vital within the space to make it sustainable for this e-learning program. Whatever courses you decide and however you wanna teach the teachers is really, really not important. What is important is that teachers begin to use technology and feel comfortable with using the technology. We need educators and teachers to realize the benefits of using e-learning because children are changing and they use technology and so the lessons should as well that they should be collaborating with their learners really easily using the technology. Saving time, for example, using auto marking tools using the data for personalized learning. Instant feedback is just the best thing ever and getting to know where your learners are at and that the learners know where they're at as well. Reducing your admin load when you begin to use technology is also really relevant. There are a wide range of content opportunities that you could be using on this type of platform to get teachers and students really engaged and we're preparing the learners really for the future. So taking away the fear of teachers, getting them not to use technology and not to fear technology, but to use it. The greater fear is if our teachers don't use technology at all and children are not exposed. So this type of platform is really relevant and again, there are lots of positive reasons and so the last aspect is looking at us as individuals. What is my role in terms of an e-learning platform that I keep learning both technology and pedagogy that I stay up to date that the teaching strategies and methodologies are used are relevant and the technologies are relevant. That we learn about internet safety, keeping ourselves safe and the people which we are working with. That we think about sustainability and the long-term use of the devices. That we think about how we're going to dispose of the devices responsibly. That we think about our social footprint and are we posting socially responsibly if somebody Googles our name, what comes up? And then are we teaching responsibly in terms of the social media and the apps that we're using and the technologies we're using? So as individuals, we should all take that responsibility where the parents, where the teachers, where the parts of the community, if somebody Googles your name, what comes up? And so we need to say, we need to ask ourselves what is my digital footprint? How do people see me digitally? And am I being a responsible digital citizen? So we need to make the shift to complete the technology integration, have access on this platform to all sorts of subjects as many as possible, that there's active engagement in a platform like this, that there's a blended learning opportunity for those perhaps who need to download content and work on it and those that can work online and get immediate feedback. That you could even be using this platform for flipped classroom scenarios, that you could be getting children to research stuff on the platform and then go and discuss it in a real classroom space. That there's problem-based learning where we're getting children to think and solve problems and not just giving them the answers and that we're really inspiring creativity with this platform. And so if we're investing in the future and we are saying that we need to consider all of these roles, we need to upscale our teachers but we also need to make this platform really inspiring and exciting so that children want to attend it and want to go on to it and learn on it. So why do we need to do this? Well, if we look at this UNICEF result from last year and we look at just the African result, how many children are not connected within Africa is really, really scary. And so going back to my very first comment where we need connectivity and we need data access is exceptionally important but our children need this kind of access and our continent needs this kind of platform and access and our world needs it because they talk about Africa being the next stepping stone. And so we, the continent who has the largest number of young people should be creating a platform that is really inspiring our children. So how do we do this? We do this one step at a time where we can implement e-learning to empower our children, where we can build knowledge, we can prepare them for the future and we can truly create a sustainable e-learning program. I hope this was useful and one snippet or one angle of view but thank you to everyone for your time. Yes, thank you Karen for this wonderful presentation and for all that information. I actually was so interested in the platform and then the point where you mentioned that when you're actually thinking of a platform then you need to consult with different stakeholders and who are going actually to be interacting with that platform. I think that's the learners and then the parents, policy makers, yeah. Maybe for your information for this lockdown after the parents first challenge where schools we are coming up with a number of strategies or now to keep the learners busy during the lockdown. So whatever that we are trying on again towards not working out as parents thought it would be like Zoom as as they found themselves like even they don't now manage Zoom parents themselves even the school administrators themselves. So really it was a very big problem and we organized this event. I think we should have one another session like we need to have the policy makers like where I live, I contacted the people in charge of education in my district. I think they are connected somewhere because I talk to them and say, oh, I can listen to her. I need to figure it out with TechSoup how they connected these platforms. It seems that we are logging in here but other people again, they're able to listen to us and different platforms. So we should have a number of them joining in like to get all this kind of information because CDR stay we don't have a strategy for e-learning especially for the primary school and the secondary school like here in Uganda and even government itself it was trying its level best. They tried the television, it didn't work out because there are questions what about those in the villages who don't have electricity? And then they tried the radio again, how can you manage a class on a radio station with maybe those kids like below five years or just beginning their education? And also if their parents are not themselves illiterate so there are big challenges. But then we looked at how is it done with other countries like South Africa? You can see some children we are actually continuing with their education like here in Uganda a friend came from US with his kid and he was learning on a computer they have those special computers which they use and he was continuing, yes. So I think- And not even special computers it's just connected to the internet. So things like Google classroom, Microsoft Teams those are really quick and easy but the same challenges you described in Uganda we had exactly the same challenges here in South Africa where parents and teachers were very frustrated didn't know technology the schools that could do it were the schools that had implemented technology schools which hadn't implemented technology which is the vast majority of schools here had huge trouble and the same we saw here we teachers were desperate principals were pulling their hair out it was so frustrating and sad to see. Yeah, so does- Yeah, we should have more discussion on that and our leaders are able to listen like our local leaders so we can come up with a better strategy and now like we can implement a sustainable learning program for the children maybe other participants if you have a question you have an issue to bring to attention of current then you are free, please. I don't know if we have long idea our next presenter. Yes, please I'm available, I'm very sorry. I know we are sorry or other participants but you see TechSoup, they are so much in technology so I don't know how they link like they have different Zoom platforms but like we are looking here and other participants are scattered in other rooms and they are listening but they are not able to come to this main session. Yeah, so you are most welcome. Maybe we have this, if you have a question or issue to raise to Karen, please do it. Then we can have Leonard, we just have to extend some time or explain to TechSoup because we are the first challenge. Yeah, he has again vanished, yeah. So Karen, for the platform bit of it like if you live in Africa, you know most of the challenges we have here which kind of platform? Oh, like if you are designing a platform for a learning for our children what do you think we have to focus at? I think we first need to think about what is the scale? So is this platform going to be for a whole sort of countries kind of space or you're saying it's going to be a whole African one? Because I think the first thing you need to think about is how many people are going to use it? So if you use something like Microsoft Teams or Google Classroom, the scale can't cope with millions and millions and millions of people. So first of all you need to think about where are you wanting to end up? And then you need to think about so who is this for? Is it for like you said primary school children? But in South Africa, we've got lots of children that fall off the bus. We've got lots of children that are not in school. So for me it's like how do we reach those children as well? And is this platform going to help children who just can't get to school? So therefore I think something like a mobile friendly is really important so that it can work on a phone and I heard of a platform the other day which is even a phone friendly but not smart phones. So the version before smart phones that there's a platform that'll work on something like that. Now imagine if you had apps and things that could work on those really entry level kind of phones as well. So you can really get to the poorest of the communities because if we look in South Africa, I don't know about the rest of Africa but in South Africa we actually have more phone contracts than we have people. So there are phones but the grandmother who lives in the very rural areas who is looking after the children, she gets the hand me down. So she's got the phone that's two or three generations old. So the platform needs to be able to cope with that kind of phone so that the children she's looking after would be able to do that. And then I really think it's governments talking across the continent to network providers to see how we can get the price of data down. I saw an interesting study the other day which Google presented called TARA, it's T-A-A-R-A and they're testing it in Uganda but that is taking data and sharing data using light. So they're looking at it across like river gorges and things like that to get access to very rural areas but imagine if our data could be spread like that. The cost reduction is just ridiculously low and you'll be able to have greater access. So getting things like that right, TV white space that they keep saying they're going to make available. So really as communities we should be putting pressure on governments and community leaders to say how are you giving access to everybody so that costs are reduced, so that people can have access. Hi everybody, my name is from Mali, West Africa. I would like just to make a comment about the point that here first to share Mali and experience because during the lockdown period we as everybody in the world faced some challenges about education school were closed and the government tried two strategies. First they tried to, because most of the population here have not access to internet or some internet services. So they tried to make a program on television but there are even some regions here where there are no television so they have no access even the television. They have all the only radio to show this kind of course. So this were many challenges facing to this situation. And the second thing they tried is this is for the higher level, for the university level to release some data free for students. So the professor can just send the list on to WhatsApp group or something like this. And even for that it was very, the amount of data they released were not sufficient for this kind of because most of the time they contain videos and many lectures which are very heavy and it demands a lot of data. So I think and the third and last one is about the language challenge because as you said it is important to discuss about implementing a platform is good but you know here in Western part of Africa most of the countries are French-speaking countries. So if we want to make a sustainable and efficient platform we should think at the beginning about the languages how many languages are we including in this platform? Local languages, international languages and try to find to see which languages are most spoken in different regions of Africa. This is some comment I wanted to make and I'm willing to help. I'm very concerned about education. I'm a medical doctor. I'm also at the university training. I finished my general practitioner degree. Now I'm partied to specialise and I experienced many eLearn platform taking course from different university around the world and it was very helpful. So I'm very concerned and I know it could be very helpful if it is very well done. Thank you. Thank you for your comment and I don't know if Karin you have any reaction to us. I think those comments are all really valid. And so what I would even say is you saying find the languages but if it was a scalable platform we could even use a platform like that to preserve languages. So I know that what's happening here in South Africa is that some of the languages are almost dying because people's children don't speak those languages anymore or they don't speak them enough and so they're fewer and fewer people and I think it's something that's happening to lots of small communities across Africa. And so you could even say a platform like that in the long term could wear small groups of people could develop courses for their language and those languages then can be preserved could be another way of looking at it as well. So that's why I'm thinking a platform like this should be something that could easily scale and be really diverse in nature. So it should be easily adaptable, easy to use and can be customizable even by country or by district perhaps. I have a quick question. Is there any possibility to make a platform less taking data? Because I think we are the first time beginning to do some meeting with Zoom and they try to implement some other platform which take less data. So is this possible? So yes, there are platforms that use less data. So yes, it's possible. For example, Google Meet compared to Zoom and some of the other platforms actually uses less data. And if you use it on your phone, it recognizes that you're on your phone and it uses even less data. So if you connected to this call via, if it was a Google Meet call and you connected by your phone rather than a computer, it uses less data. So a video call, you can get platforms. But for me, an e-learning platform isn't just video calling. For me, an e-learning platform could be self-paced courses and you could almost have an option of whether there are videos or whether there are no videos. And so that would impact the amount of data. On some courses, what you can do is you can download the videos and maybe it's linking with something like YouTube Go. So YouTube Go is a African, was developed for Africa. And what happens there is if you like, if there are videos that you like on YouTube, you can download them on YouTube Go and they cashed on your phone. And what happens then with the caching is that after two or three weeks, they get taken off again. So if you've got enough space on your phone, you're not gonna use data every time you want to watch it. And so maybe it's finding features like that. I believe Overdrive, which is a really big book, a global library space, which works with communities and governments and public libraries because they believe individuals should get free books. They have a similar system. So if your community library is an Overdrive provider you use the app, you go in and you get whatever books that you want. It's cached on your cell phone on the app and after two weeks, the books automatically pulled off and as if it's handed in. If you haven't finished reading, well, bad luck. So I'm sure if this technology is there, we could find it to use on digital platforms. Okay, thank you. Yeah, thank you, Karin. Yeah, I think we are coming to the end of this. We're sorry, Ronald, maybe I was chatting with the internet. So yeah, he had sent in his presentation, maybe we shall share with everyone on the group because we are like 20 minutes past the time which we had proposed to have this session. But we are so grateful, Karin, for the presentation and we are going to continue to engage with you, especially with my district here in Uganda. I read the talk to the governor and those people in the education system because as a member of the COVID-19 task force in my district, the number of challenges we actually faced with the education system how to make children continue with the schools. Right now we face a big challenge with the pregnancies because children, we are not doing anything at home. And so we propose that we have to have a strategy because we have not to wait for another pandemic, but this has opened our eyes and we have to think on how actually we can have a sustainable e-learning program which can actually accommodate most of the learners. So we just have to think around that and then we have to work with professions like you just to make sure that we do things right because I'm also a parent and we have been paying money to schools. So we have now Zoom, connecting Zoom is not working, and then Ronald is back, actually Ronald and his friends, their company, they have a report us a lot, like what you've mentioned, those downloadable videos, they are producing a number of that and then sharing with the parents. And when I looked at that, then I saw this is something which can lead to work for most of the parents and being a young company and then we have to figure it out like how it can work with the external partners and then these technologies work done well and we have a well-laid program which can help us to understand which can help us all, yeah. So, Ronald, welcome back, but we are really closing, maybe we can, you can just talk to us like maybe five to 10 minutes where you summarize your presentation then we'll close this. Thank you so much. Thank you very much, Robus. Once again, I apologize, but the network issues that have been disturbing me and yet I'm in the middle of a tunnel. I've missed most of the presentation that I'm really sorry about that, but my task was to present on the challenges. First of all, there are advantages of e-learning and then the challenges that we are facing. From DT Points e-learning center, one of the young e-learning platform that we just formed last year, in July to see how a professional teacher of physics and mathematics, together with my colleague who is a computer scientist and who is also teaching computer skills, we came up with this platform to see how we can engage our learners while they are at home. That's how we came in with DT Points e-learning center. We have two types of e-learning. It's one of real-time like the one we have, but for us we had opted for the one which is not real-time where we do record the lessons and the same they can download. That was to address the challenges of real-time e-learning platforms like Zoom when the network is very unstable and somebody has to get off and ceremoniously like a bee. So that was the main thing to see that we can address some of the challenges of e-learning or network. We actually thought we would even opt to be offline, but still remain on e-learning whereby we would ban our haunted on the CD and the delivery of a parent to the counter office and the bee such that there is no any challenge of network that is encountered. And at first it was working out before the second lockdown which started in June whereby there was no any movement. That was for you to come to the office and pick material through a flash or a CD and put yourself and come to the office. And now with the second lockdown there was that challenge of movement and we had now to provide links to send to the parents such that they can be able to download the content. Now about the advantages of the listeners and the viewers Dear listeners and viewers, there are many but I just sorted out five. I sent you Robert my summary. I don't know which I'll be able to show this but e-learning can take anywhere. That is one of the advantage. You can be home at any geographical place for as long as there is network or you have the content in an electronic form. You can learn from anywhere. Then e-learning can also be that is repetitive. You can miss out something but you go and read or watch the video, watch the lesson and this can improve your retention or understanding unlike where you will be able to miss if you went to a physical class, if you cannot attend then you have missed out a lesson. But here you keep repeating. Now e-learning is actually very cheap it makes the learning very cheap as opposed to the physical. For example, as Robert you were sending the content free but that would be our material is good and later we thought it would sell to you cheaply. Hello? Yeah, please go. Yeah. Okay, that's it. Thank you. Thank you, Robert. I think I can be heard. Hmm. Okay. So we were estimating for a primary child who is paying around $500 or about $100 or $50 with e-learning and that makes it really attractive. So say if I'm a mental friendly if we in electronic form flat then we want to pollute the environment and the environment will be clean with the use of e-learning work is sent exercise done through work is marked electronically sent back feedback is sent back and therefore the environment will not be what littered and not be damaged. Now I grasped my disadvantage here listeners and the viewers now with the disadvantage is especially to us the teachers and the learners there is lack of social interaction. The learner will be isolated in a room where he's learning from or will not be able to interact with the other children, which is also very important. e-learning becomes very hard for us to instruct whenever it is a practical lesson. I when I go in I had the presenter trying to teach us on how we can use tools. But however, the lack of computer literacy it makes it very hard. For example, for me a physics teacher try to make a lesson very practical on the e-learning platform. Much as when I was trying to animate my videos I tried to make sure that they are as attractive and they try to bring the picture. For example, I would animate for example in a typical way that I would make something which shows that a web would travel like this but to do that you have to be really innovative to make the lesson appear practical but they are not very practical. Then another thing is how do you determine that the assignment you gave the learner is the one who did it. He was not able to just watch the video and was able to understand and give you feedback. It is very hard to determine and that is the challenge you get in the e-learning. We were able to give mid-term tests to the learners and yes, we were able to mark it but you would see someone tried but you see someone who behaved but that was just imaginary. So that was also a challenge. Then e-learning also tends to be very destructive. Somebody has to be very focused or self-disciplined to watch the video. Otherwise, when you're online, these destructions, these days we have hard zone, they pop from anywhere on the computer and if the learner is not very focused, we'll be distracted by that and we will not really concentrate on the subject matter. However, the African challenge is that I can, Robert, do you have time? Let me give you just two or three challenges on the course we will first hand on this. Thank you, thank you. Now, the biggest challenge we have faced Robert is the challenge, the poor attitudes of both the parents and the learners that they cannot learn via e-learning or via electronic material. They do not actually believe that they can watch a video, a pre-recorded video and they understand. I have personally moved from home to home to market our content but the biggest challenge I faced was the attitude to the attitude is so poor in our preconceived as per now. The second challenge is the challenge of the lack of gadgets to be used. In our, the lack of gadgets to be used by computers, when for us we're coming up with this platform we've reached everyone irrespective of the income class whereby if somebody can afford and the TV would be able to access our material. But even then we found that some homes could not even afford a TV set whereby you can just. So the lack of gadgets in the families or the heritage of the income that they have has become a very big challenge. This comes both like the previous presenter said both as the teachers, the parents and also including the learners are now setting in Africa quite a few people who are computer literate. We can send the work, even if we're sending work freely somebody fails to download because it's being challenged by the application of downloading the material. So unless there is serious sensitization we cannot easily have sustainable in Africa here in its civilization. And lastly is the problem of financial resources. Financial resources have really limited us even with us ourselves in the DT points to produce the content in the time we require and the quality we want. You have to get animators, you have to train them, you have to get the teachers, you have to train them to produce. So all that needs to have enough resources to assemble all those labor resources and gadgets to produce quality work for sustainable e-learning. Robert, new to time, let me still here. Thank you very much. Yeah, thank you for this time. You're welcome. Thank you, Ronald. And yes, we understand the internet challenges. Thank you. Yeah, thank you. Thank you all the participant and our presenters for the time and we are so very sorry for this long, for this event, supposed to be one hour. Maybe if you have like a few one, two questions to Ronald please feel free and just use like three minutes, then we'll close. Yeah, maybe we don't have end of the moment. So thank you so much. I can see all the messages. Thank you. And yeah, thank you for the presentation. And as I promised that we are not going to leave this here because it's a challenge that all of us have faced and the pandemic has actually brought in a number of other problems, especially to the learners. So we need to do something for this cause because we can't continue like this. You find that for example here, like more than two years, children at home, they are so vulnerable especially the young girls. So we need to think with the policymakers and we have to make things work. We need to partner with people who have the skills and then we come up with something which can be at the communities down here. So thank you so much, Karen. And we are going to continue engaging you. Send a report to my local government and then we'll see how we can carry on with these efforts. Yeah, thank you so much. Thank you very much. Thanks, Rogers. Thanks, Robert. Thank you. Okay, bye-bye. Bye-bye.