 Hello everyone, I am here with Jordan Sheridan of status coup. He's been reporting on the Flint water crisis now for years He released his documentary flushing Flint last year We brought him on to talk about it and he just broke a giant story for vice and it is not getting Any attention from the mainstream media, but this is really just it's incredible stuff what he found and he's here to talk about it So Jordan, thank you so much for coming on. Welcome back Hey, thanks for having me So I read both of the stories you just broke two articles basically and the way that I Read all this was it felt like a mafia movie like you see Genuine like organized crime you see payoffs, you know This is really it's not necessarily anything that's surprising, but the revelations nonetheless are still really shocking I mean to me it was clear that Rick Snyder was a criminal He was criminally negligent, you know at a minimum, but now it's clear that this goes really deeper than that Just to go over a couple of the facts here and we'll link to the articles down below So he tried to get the mayor of Flint, Michigan Karen Weaver to quote-unquote have Elijah Cummins back off which you know is interesting in and of itself He possibly lied under oath about, you know, the timeline of the Legionella outbreak He knew about the hazard that you know transitioning to the Flint water supply would pose to the residents here and In the background of all of these things are, you know The way that he used his fixer and the people around him to cover this up So can you talk through some of these really worst offenses because there there's so much the story is honestly Overwhelming because there's so many moving parts here Yeah, that's how I actually wanted it to be three stories, but vice wanted it to be one so My partner Jen and I we go to Flint routinely I've been going for years and we always kind of heard a lot of these rumblings, but it's a hard thing to put it together So last year we were there and we uncovered that the governor's right-hand the governor's right-hand man had allegedly made some Deals with the loudest residents To basically quiet them down, you know, it's like a protest movement people corporations or governments try and identify the leaders so the governor's right-hand man was basically going off and Trying to neutralize threats to the Snyder administration particularly threats that would threaten What really was like a PR campaign to sweep the water crisis under the rug when we figured that out we then figured out that Snyder himself was under criminal investigation by prosecutors that had been fired and Snyder's chief of staff had been privately subpoenaed his treasurer had been privately subpoenaed and his Right-hand man by all accounts was described to us kind of as his fixer or enforcer had also been subpoenaed So having those documents and then you know reading through the transcripts of the interviews with the special prosecutor It took us in a bunch of different directions And we got enough evidence that the governor was actually warned in 2013 So this is like seven years ago a year before The water switch that if Flint used the Flint River as a water source there was bacterial risks to public health There was carcinogens that could develop with your cancer-causing chemicals And then we learned that what he told Congress he said he learned about it the deadly water outbreak legionella Which is a bacterial Disease from water he said he learned about in January 2016 and held a press conference the next day Not so he actually first became aware of it in October 2014 Which happened to be a few weeks before his reelection for governor and his administration basically squashed it from coming out Which is really important because I mean it was six months after the water switch But still early enough that if the administration would have listened to another Bomb shell we found a key whistleblower that was screaming You know Flint needs to be moved back to Detroit's water system Which it had before if he would have listened if they would have done so lives definitely could have been saved if Governor Snyder isn't Prosecuted then I don't think there's going to be any hope or legitimacy for our justice system because you know part of the Question that I was concerned with when I had you on last time was whether or not there would be any justice in the form of him getting Prosecuted and there were investigations and whatnot, but with everything now that you've brought to light Do you honestly feel any different or encouraged about the prospect of you know? Prosecution for Snyder because it seems like there's no question that he committed a number of crimes now This is improvable legally speaking yet, so it has to be you know, he needs to be tried But what do you think is going to happen with all of this? What do you hope will happen? You know, I think with Flint and a lot of times people will see Flint in the headline on YouTube or Just Flint and it's not that they don't care But they don't they think it's just Flint and they don't realize that the Flint water crisis is not just about a city in Michigan and it's not just about water It's about America because it's corruption that it has led to these things and what happened in Flint is actually happening a lot of Other places it might be the water in other places. It might be education in other places It might be pensions it might be but basically the Flint water crisis was essentially a privatization scheme gone very wrong Republicans are privatizing Democrats are privatizing America is one big public-private partnership Which is essentially just fancy terminology for the United Corporations of America, which is corporations buying our government So really what I'm hoping this story accomplishes and I'm glad, you know, it's not an easy read. It's long But I think people need to realize that if there is no accountability in Flint and again We've proved I think within it without a shadow of a doubt to take a courtroom Phrase that the Republican governor had advanced warning before he allowed that water switch to go that bad things would happen When they learned after the fact that things were happening. They didn't do anything He lied to Congress his right-hand man I throw in allegedly because you know you have to as a journalist, but we found out the prosecutors were investigating and They the prosecutors were investigation and we were told that they were Investigating payoffs by the governor's right-hand man. So you'd have to be you'd have to really think does the governor not know What his right-hand man is doing is this guy just freelancing so I hope people understand that It's not the fact that it's not surprising you started out with this is not surprising is the problem Yeah, the fact that it's not surprising that our government whether it's Republican It's not like Democrats aren't involved with cover-ups the fact that These things would have been covered up, you know It's one thing if a government makes a bad decision it poisons people But then as soon as you even suspect it you take immediate action Obviously there could be fault with the initial decisions, but at least you're taking immediate action The cover-up in this case was almost as bad as the crime because it killed people, right? So the other element here is You know the after part I Mean if you think about Flint like let's say the Russia investigation there was a Robert Mueller in Flint There was a special prosecutor in Flint Well imaginative Robert Mueller was investigating for three years and then like a new attorney general came in and fired him and dropped all the charges If there were charges so that's what was happening here the previous attorney general and a special prosecutor had built up a case and Our reporting indicates they were building a case against Snyder himself and then a new Democrat attorney general came in and Dropped all the charges and it's been a year since they almost a year since they dropped all the charges There's been no other charges and the statute of limitations just passed for not all charges But specifically misconduct in office. Well, we obtained audio of the governor's right-hand man allegedly paying off a Sick flint couple to silence them. They've had it since September. So I'm not a lawyer But I mean I live and breathe this story I heard on the audio incriminating things because I know the story So I'm assuming the Attorney General's office also has incriminating things So I think this is a bipartisan thing the Republican Governor and his administration did this and now it's kind of like a Democratic Attorney General You know my reporting indicates you might get misdemeanor charges against Rick Snyder I don't think that's gonna fly in Flint and I also think nationally Don't mistake it if there is no accountability whatever that looks like whether it's Snyder or other top officials That just gives other public government officials nationally Nationally locally state level. Hey, if they can get away with it there, you know We won't think twice about what we're doing in your neck of the woods. Yeah, I mean the story details basically Alleged crime after alleged crime like you have literal bullet points explaining everything that happened And this was kind of something that struck me is that if there's no accountability here with the Conspiracy the cover-up then there's literally never going to be accountability if any other governor or public official does the same thing because this is so vast This is so outrageous that if you can get away with this then you can get away with with anything And I know that that's a cliche, but there's just there's so much here and the audio you refer to Was of Adam Murphy now you've had him on your show. This is an individual who protested during a town hall in January He was experiencing cognitive impairment and whatnot and they basically tried to pay him off So can you talk through that a little bit because you have the audio and explain what happened there? And how they kind of tried to silence him because I think this is just fascinating And I think this is where you kind of get into this mafia description. Yeah, it seems to me So, you know flight Rachel Maddow shows up people show up in five minutes You know in 2016 and then all the cameras leave because Trump was you know the big thing So once all the cameras left, that's when the real story story starts. So January 2017 There's a town hall. I wasn't at that one, but I've covered many Flint water town halls and a really sick guy Adam Murphy He was having seizures He was driving and having to call his wife because he was forgetting his route to get home You know water related Elmans he just went off at this town hall, which you know is understandable screaming at state officials, you know This this is all talk. You're not doing anything other other residents felt the same way So he was removed by police officer who told him, you know, maybe I could get you in contact With the state official that could help your family fast forward a couple weeks The governor's right-hand man is in his living room joined by an army colonel a State trooper and a representative from the health department So if you're a sick person and your wife is sick and by the way, they're newborn was born with lead in his blood Because she was pregnant during the water crisis You know, oh governor Snyder's advisor is here and maybe they really are helping so we thought you know, unfortunately, we didn't have it when the vice story published we got it after but Basically the governor's right-hand man presented it as you know, if you call something a pilot program, you could do anything So said I think we could try to get state fund the state to pay for Your treat medical treatment. They wanted to do something called chelation, which is a holistic treatment It injects chemicals to extract lead out of your body A lot of people don't realize that after 30 days lead kind of gets stuck in your bone So even if you get a test all of it won't show up because it's already kind of deep deep in your system. So We're gonna pay the state's gonna pay for it But you can't talk about it. You can't go to the media You can't tell people the state are paying for it. And if it works for you, you know, this pilot program We'll we'll we'll try to make it available for other Flint residents So, you know, my my indication is neither the husband the husband and the wife at the time They're not married anymore. I don't really think they like actively thought like oh, we're doing something dirty here They're just desperate. They're sick. The husband's falling apart So they they took it and they he said, you know, you're gonna be my lead poster child So if it works, you know, we'll make it available to other people both of Christine Adam and Christina both said he said I'm gonna go back and tell the governor about this I don't know if he did or he didn't but he said he was going to so It was it did help. I mean his let his lead levels went dramatically down the seizures stopped Cognitive functioning got a lot better. So they're telling the state health department this the governor's right-hand man this and Expecting like hey, I'm you I'm your lead poster child. Can we expand the pilot and make it available to other residents? No, that didn't happen Adam and Christina split up when that happened They the state completely cut off communication with Christina who by the way they had told we're gonna make this available to you when you're done Breastfeeding your newborn didn't happen. So we found out that we I mean we saw emails and text messages that verified the state was paying for the treatment but Governor's right-hand man is going around telling other residents. I'm a philanthropist. I'm paying for it out of my personal pocket, which wasn't true We also found out that as part of the criminal investigation Prosecutors were look investigators were looking into other payoffs He might have made including potentially giving cash to certain residents And we also have another resident on the record that she she's basically to me like the Aaron Brockovich of Flint She's the most outspoken resident. She's lobbied Congress. She's been a real she was a thorn in the Snyder administration side This right-hand man to Snyder basically offered her I'll come in a new water heater a new interior plumbing Everything but the kitchen sink basically if you'll be quiet So she is on the record saying, you know, I offered I said if you do that for everybody absolutely So it was essentially and I've told other people the main action the Snyder Administration took instead of just fixing the problem It seems like they did a really grand scale PR campaign and part of that was making sure that threats because again Adam getting removed from the town hall got media attention That's why the governor's right-hand man is in his living room and I think it just gets to forget legally Well, if you think about it legally, I'm not a lawyer, but there's two options either the governor knew that his top advisor was doing this or he didn't know and you then you get to gross negligence that Your administration is doing these things because he wasn't going you know If you're making private individual deals for certain Flint residents that pose a threat And you're leaving the rest of Flint to basically fend for themselves. That's obviously kind of Poisoning and then leaving people to die Yeah, it really is hard to take in all of this information and before when I when I you know I either watched or read your reporting from Flint to me It was this question of you know, is this incompetence or malfeasance? I mean really it doesn't matter. This is a distinction without a difference But now this story proves beyond a shadow of a doubt like this is malfeasance like they knew what they were doing They had the information and they did it anyway. It was just that you know, Rick Snyder didn't care now Moving on to another element of this story Which is just really heartbreaking is that there's been silence from the mainstream media and you've been told that the reason Why they're not necessarily talking about this huge story Which should be just on the minds of everyone like people should know about this is because of COVID-19 So what has the response been like? Why do you think we haven't heard from CNN MSNBC any outlet who wants to you know expand This story and talk about it because this is this quote like you said Flint is a story about America this can happen in any neighborhood in any city and People aren't going to care unless they realize that this could happen to them. So why do you think there's been silence here? I Think there's a macro reason and a micro reason. I think the macro reason is frankly our media is predominantly made up of Coastal cosmopolitan out of touch elitist They care for about five to ten minutes about stories that happen in communities. So Flint Rachel Maddow does a town hall the media is all there for a week and then it's kind of out of sight out of mind I don't think it's because people are bad people I just think we all kind of live in our bubbles if you live in New York, DC, California, whatever I'm I used to live in a bubble too. You know, it's not that I didn't care if I was presented with something But we all kind of follow the day-to-day Who's up who's down and the progressive sphere? We do things a little differently But you know all of us on YouTube and other places are kind of covering the same things to an extent So I think that if flint if there's like a flint water update or this bombshell story I don't know if the Brian steltas of the world really care again not saying your CNN, you know It's media critic. I don't think it's that he's a bad person I just think they think the biggest thing in the world is what Trump has said or tweeted Within the last couple hours, you know and to me and I tweeted it earlier It's obviously connected to coronavirus indirectly I mean right now Genesee County, which flint is part of has a eleven point four percent fatality rate Due to COVID-19. That is way above America's average, which last time I checked was like five point something Flint makes up almost fifty percent of the county's cases. Gee, I wonder why if a city Was devastated if people not just elderly people, but of all ages are severely immuno compromised Why they are making up such a large chunk of this county's cases and it's not just flint look at Native American Reservations with uranium mining look at areas with mass fracking going on I mean, there's a lot of communities that are uniquely at risk Black and brown communities with where they usually dump this in these industrial projects on so I said to Brian I said to others with all due respect I agree coronavirus is the top story But I kind of think the biggest environmental cover-up of the 21st century is a close second And I think CNN the New York Times to Washington Post the Detroit Free Press Detroit News Flint Journal who pretty sure they have enough resources to like Haven't have a nighttime editor They all have them that unlucky guy or gal stuck in the night shift or the weekend shift to do like a 400-word write-up because really it's journalistically a crime because I would say at this point Maybe 50% of Flint has no idea what was just uncovered So if 50% of Flint doesn't know how do we what do we expect in terms of Michigan? What do we expect nationally and on the micro level, you know, I do think that some time and it goes to progressives, too I mean, I mean whatever. I don't expect the young Turks to do much Related to me, but it hasn't been covered a wide scale in the progressive independent space And I think unfortunately part of that is Even even progressives and independent media sometimes get stuck on like You know, oh Biden's terrible or oh DNC corruption Democratic and I get it that's all very relevant But we don't realize that this stuff that's happening on the local level is basically Neoliberalism remember this happened under this happened under Barack Obama. Let's not give him a pass He did not a federal disaster was not declared There's a difference in a federal disaster and a federal emergency Emergency is a state level federal disaster would have sent the Army Corps in to just dig up those pipes It would have been done in a year that was not declared for some reason Obama went there You know took a sip of water which Michael Moore and others suggest wasn't even Flint water at the time So, you know Joe Biden he likes to take credit for everything. Obama's done. What about the failures should Biden answer to why? This is going on still in Flint. We haven't even gotten to the point Mike that the water is still contaminated six years later so to me Unfortunate and maybe I'll write a book one day It is really hard to gather information like this and break it But that is not even close to as hard as getting the media to pick this up I've had I literally had one person from the Guardian say to me Yeah, we just think your sourcing is kind of not great here. I said you think Document highly confidential documents from a criminal investigation is not enough sourcing for you The former mayor of Flint on the record that Governor Snyder Tried to obstruct justice tried to get her to get Elijah Cummings when he was alive to back off isn't like that's not enough I said by the way the anonymous sourcing like you do know for things like that like certain Certain individuals that might have knowledge about a criminal investigation Will not go on the record because if they do there's there would be problems for them So it was just bizarre and honestly, I don't have an answer It's very very disheartening because in a sane media system If you break a massive story like this, it doesn't matter whether you're independent whether corporate If you break a story where you have the receipts It should be on a front page front pages and when it's not it's very difficult to get accountability Yeah, I think this kind of speaks to a broader issue with the media model and just capitalist media generally speaking You know if it's not sexy if it's not sensationalized then they're probably not gonna cover it because you know It's not going to be monetarily beneficial for them and you know to me I find this completely outrageous because you know you spent Years now covering flint you've broken multiple stories if not dozens and you know you're doing all of this and You don't even necessarily know whether or not there's gonna be any payoff like for me Like I'll put out a good video and I'll feel like man I want everyone to see it and I'll be so gutted when it doesn't get like the views and clicks But that's like one day's worth of work like this is year's worth of work and it's not just that like you you're Revealing these issues and there's no faces like to me the biggest thing that kind of keeps me glued to this story is the fact that We've been introduced to certain residents You've interviewed them and then you've brought them back So we're kind of seeing the progress or lack thereof that's being made and it's just it's It's hard to deny you know the emergency. It's hard not to be fearful of your own water supply So I do want to get an update before we go About the actual water crisis because you know, there there's been funding there's been The initiation of the process to replace, you know, the contaminated pipes Where are they at? Like when are we looking at clean drinking water for the residents of Flint because it seems like at this point It's just it's never gonna get done Yeah, and I just want to real quick about the whole sexy thing I think a lot of media outlets don't understand that there's a massive demand for this For this kind of investigative reporting, I think they just lazy Yeah, and they see oh, it's cheaper to just put two schmucks left side right side and have a food fight Yeah, but I mean status coup for example. I mean, we're not like gangbusters We don't have like corporate fat cats, but like we've grown to like over 2,000 paid members Doing this this kind of stuff. We yeah, we do live streams and things like that on day to day But like people will support Investigative reporting because there's such a void. Yeah, so I do think a lot of media outlets are wrong You know, maybe the term isn't sexy, but this is certainly desired You know one thing we broke two years ago Mike that we kind of rolled into this story in addition to all this Snyder's environmental department was cooking the data. They were literally cheating which I think I came on with you about Yeah, I think we talked about this. Yeah, yeah So they the numbers that they used for Snyder to kind of declare like his mission accomplished without the fighter pilot They were going into the environmental officials were going into Flint residence homes and just running their water right before taking tests Which common sense you're flushing the let out. It's against EPA regulations, which the EPA confirmed That I broke again crickets a back story to that is Newsweek magazine killed that story We were doing with them like a day before which is a whole nother whole nother thing so Basically, I could only tell you what I see and the residents I speak to the media has regurgitated this Nonsense that the water is is back and restored or whatever if you go to Flint You will quickly meet people that are still getting rashes from that water six years later You will meet people that are losing hair. They're they're quoted in this story Not to mention the long-term effects Anecdotally, I drank the water, you know, just sips here and there it's like being punched in the face So it is it is not normal They haven't even changed the majority all of the pipes and they didn't even touch So there's three pipes the mains under the street the service lines from the curb it to the house And then the interior plumbing all they did was change the service lines Which are curbed into the house What do you think the Flint River water just skipped over the mains in the middle of it and didn't damage the interior plumbing actually our story Reveals mayor Weaver is also on the record that the current governor Kretchen Whitmare who as you've seen the media has been really really like propping up as potential Biden VP She basically told her when the mayor was trying to get additional funding to change people's interior plumbing Sorry can't help you. There's there's Flint fatigue quote Flint fatigue in the legislature So what do you do? You got a Republican leg a Republican governor that did it his officials tried to cover it up Flint Flint and Michigan votes for this Democratic governor. I could tell you the residents of Flint were very hopeful She actually vowed coming in she's gonna reopen the Flint water pods that were free water bottles Stations around the city. It's been 16 months. They're not open She told the mayor. Sorry. I can't help you. There's Flint fatigue in the state legislature Well, I don't know you're the governor. Maybe you could fight for it It's both morally right and like good politics That has also been totally ignored because CNN MSNBC. It's kind of like Trump during the campaign Governor Whitmare is basically living in their green room virtually. She's on all the time now She should be on because Michigan has been hit hard, but nobody's mentioning that like wait a minute this relatively Newer name in politics is being anointed as like a top five potential pick for Biden She she she has not kept promises to Flint, which is a major environmental calamity still So bottom line. There's it is very doubtful that the water is safe They shut down the water pod So, you know Flint is 42% impoverished a lot of people are back to drinking from the tap because they can't afford To keep going and bought up by cartons of water So it's a dicey situation and you know, I'll say to the people watching A lot of people I mean shockingly sometimes I get grief Jordan cover other things you cover flint too much This isn't just about flint flint is america. It used to be like the beacon economically of america general motors is born there You want to know why donald trump won he won because a lot of people in places like flint have had their jobs Sent to other countries so I cover flint continually and i'm not going to stop covering it because again if Accountability is not come it does not come here if there's no truth If it is not revealed how this poisoning happened and how the cover-up happened who is continually Not doing anything talking about the current governor That's the playbook for other areas and and and by the way Whether it's biden whether it's trump whoever the congress people that are elected are at the end of the day If this continues in flint if there is no justice it's coming to a neighborhood near you Yeah, and that's why I don't understand personally why there's so little interest because like I fully understand that there's so many crises happening You know the genocide in yemen. Um, just in our own country. There's so many crises But out of self interest people Should you know worry about what's happening in flint because as you said there's a lot of vulnerable cities right now that are Going to be dealing with this if not now in the future Um, so, you know if we don't fix this in flint Then this is kind of a precursor to what may happen in other countries in other in other cities Um, so it's really frustrating. Um, but yeah Is there anything that you want to leave us with in terms of like this story that you just broke and what you want People to take away from this because it is a big story It's a really long read but it's worth it because you go through all of the details You and jen did a phenomenal job. Um, but you start like at the very beginning So you're gonna get all of the details. It's a long read, but it's worth it Anything that you want people to take away from the story that you just uh broke We're not done. I have a follow-up I don't know when this is publishing but we have a follow-up coming out tomorrow Because we found some pretty interesting information about the current attorney general who dropped all the charges Might be some conflicts of interest in her office related to the water crisis. So that that will drop tomorrow Um, you know what I'll say mike. I think that book behind you really says a lot manufacturing consent because you asked why Is it that there's not broader appeal because manufacturing consent works multiple ways One of the ways is to manufacture consent for things It also works in manufacturing consent for what's important So the media through what it chooses to cover relentlessly Trump The horse race who's up who's down? Uh, it's it's a formal programming particularly in older americans. No offense But that's the general cable news audience to the york times readership Obviously, uh younger even like under 50 and under 40. We're starting to realize aren't really that demographic But if you never see stories like flint Uh, like east chicago indiana that has a major lead problem We haven't even gotten into kifas, which is a cancer-causing chemical from the manufacturing of teflon Being found all over water bodies around the country Guarantee a majority people watching right now have no idea that the hedge fund uh, sleaze bags in new york One of their big investments the last few years water Because they think water might be the future oil and there might be a shortage of clean water So all of this is massively important But why would cnn on by atnt? Why would nbc owned by comcast? Why would amazon owned by jeff bezos? I mean, why would any of these places find it important? Right, they don't find these things sexy So what viewers find sexy or not sexy is largely informed by what the media declares is quote unquote sexy So that's why that's why we started status coup. I don't want to like be like to bring sexy back But we started this we started this because I think people honestly How we have uncovered this is I've been there 15 times jen has been there seven times But we've largely like just given the microphone back to the people and you really learn where all the bodies are buried When you go into these places as journalists. I don't talk to pundits. I don't talk to experts first I talk to residents because that's who knows who's corrupt. That's who knows So the the thing I'll leave the audience with is number one We do have a youtube channel status coup. You might not know that because youtube is straddling the hell out of us So status co up subscribe if you can if you want to support this reporting It's status coup.com says join low as five bucks a month and most importantly You know spread the word. I mean I on my twitter The story is right at the top Unfortunately, we're not going to get action unless public officials are shamed. That's what I've really had in the media Shame the media. Detroit free press only covered this because the attorney general's office came out Basically threatening, you know our source They want to find who the sources sound familiar to trump They want to find sources kind of subtly, you know, I think threaten us to not continue reporting, which isn't going to work So this is super important. It's not just flint It is connected to corona virus as we've spoken about and Hey, I think bernie said it best Are you willing to sacrifice for someone you don't know? Yeah, exactly and really what's important for people to know is that It's not just the simple, you know flint still doesn't have clean drinking water Which we see people tweet occasionally just to kind of remind individuals of this crisis It's it's a lot deeper than that. It's a lot more complicated and the deeper you go the more troubling the details seem to be so, you know, just if you have time I'll link to all of these The the articles as well as the videos down below. So definitely check them out I want to shift gears because um recently you stated on twitter that you tested positive for covet 19 And I think that it would be informative for people to kind of know what you experienced How you were able to get a test maybe how you think you came into contact with the virus. Can you just talk through that? Honestly to this day, I don't even know how I got a test. I I randomly my girlfriend's friend mentioned this doctor's office, uh, Oh one medical, excuse me. They're not paying me Which I guess does has an app and does like virtual appointments, too So I was doing virtual points appointments with them and then my cough got so severe with the fever I decided to go to the office and they had a test. So I guess I don't maybe I lucked out. So that's how I knew I had it They actually did say that there's a lot of false negatives too. So a lot of people are being Told they're negative and the tests are not foolproof um, honestly I think for me it was uh amp maybe Made worse because when you have something like this the the suggestion is rest And I was like in the home stretch of finishing this vice story So like I was working 14 hours a day Uh, it's it's stressful. That's not good if you have a virus So I think I mean my cough Luckily, I haven't been coughing to this interview But it kind of like I think it's gone and then it comes back. It hasn't been going on for like a month Uh, but the best way to describe it is just uh, in my case severe cough that was hurting my back Uh, was hurting my ribs a little bit because You're coughing non-stop at one point. I was coughing non-stop for at least nine days um, and The fever fortunately went away after three or four days never went higher than 101 I didn't have any breathing problems but I think people should realize like the my even the mild version some of these like Idiots on twitter are like, oh, it's just a cold. I've never had a cold this bad I mean it was not just a cold and frankly I'm lucky because the people in my situation that weren't didn't have the breathing problems didn't have the hospitalizations like Who knows what makes it Go that direction, you know versus another because there's people healthier than me that have died. So there's people like Super athletic. I don't really exercise that much who died. So it really it's it the jury's out on how certain people respond For me, I'm just guessing but I think I got it from a supermarket Uh, because I was wearing a mask We were wearing gloves, but you know, new york city is very dense You could try to stay six feet from people but New york city people who just were you know I've always said there needs to be walking lanes because everybody's just in their own world Walking in the middle of the curb and not really, you know bumping into you Uh, so I'm pretty sure I probably got it that way which tells you you can get this even wearing a mask gloves You know, I think the experts even like first it was six feet Then they said well, it might need to be more then they said, oh, well You could get it just if you walk past someone that breathed Like so I don't really know how I got it, but I got it. I'm lucky. Uh, you know privileged in a way I work from home when I'm not traveling I what you know, there's amazon workers that I've spoken to that Think they have it but are going in anyway because they can't afford not to get paid That's another scandal that they don't have paid sick leave unless you test positive Um, yeah, but it's it's not been pleasant. Uh, it's been going on. I thought I was better But I'm starting to cough again I'm I would hope I'm out of the woods for anything more serious Uh, and it's also, I mean just to be honest with you It's it's affected the business a little bit because I haven't really been going live or doing videos that often Uh, I actually to tell you the truth got worse Because the day I broke the vice story I went live because it's like I'm not, you know I want my audience to know about this that we want to play this up But I was still like deeply sick. So I just going live for an hour took a hell of a lot out of me I mean my girlfriend even said like it's like you just Ran like a marathon. So, uh, this thing is exhausting and I really am very very Uh, dismayed to see all these morons Governors and you know, oh, we're gonna reopen the economy slow by slow like as we pass the death toll Of the vietnam war, um, I know people are going crazy cabin fever, but I don't understand Maybe you have an answer you can't contact trace in new york city You can't contact trace in these major cities How the hell do you know who passed me on the way to the supermarket or who who was in the supermarket with me? It's just asinine. So, uh, I don't know what the answer is But I don't think the answer is reopening these gyms and hair salons and all that Because you might be willing to take the risk, but that's not fair to other people who are not willing to get infected by you Yeah, absolutely. It's something that if we just all hunker down for a couple of months And wait until this blows over that's the best case scenario because I think that you know staying inside getting cabin fever That's a better outcome than getting the virus Um, I wanted to ask you when you started to experience symptoms Was this like something that was gradual like did you feel a tickle in your throat? Um, and then did it kind of build or did you just wake up one day with like a huge like horrible cough? Because I have a friend who just tested positive. She's in healthcare. So this isn't super surprising But it's just you know the way she describes it is this is horrible. There's no energy Um, you know, you don't you don't want to get out of bed. You just sleep Um, so how did this happen for you? Was it sudden or was it gradual? I started coughing a little bit on a set on saturday Like weeks ago sunday the cough became severe and then monday I had a fever. So it was pretty quick I mean mild cough next day severe cough then fever. I didn't have it as bad as your friend. Fortunately, I could get out of bed I wasn't like super super exhausted. Um But I think the worst part your your body you get fatigued from coughing non-stop for seven days So I was just exhausted from the coughing Uh, and mentally I'll be honest with you again, like just people dying. So I'm not complaining But mentally it does take a toll on you because at least when I didn't know I had this You know It's it's said like you can go outside to take a walk if you're keeping distance, you know So at least you get that like 20 minute half hour break from being stationary, you know I live in a one-bedroom apartment. So when you're literally quarantined for I was in here for two straight weeks You get a little kooky. I mean I I was getting a little kooky Because it's just Tough to be confined in that area again, like people are dying or hospitalized. So I don't have it You know, I'm not complaining but that was uh one component and uh, the other thing I'll just say is I think that um It's really a shame that in this situation Uh The media is ignore it's it's kind of like with school shootings. They're doing the play-by-play instead of talking about the root I don't see the media talking about like there's zero discussion in the media corporate media Why are why are we even paying rent right now? Why are we paying rent? Why are we paying mortgages? I mean you look at europe The government's either paying for like 80 to 90 of people's pay companies payrolls or in some cases just like You know mortgage paused uh rent paused not like paused and then you pay it all back in one lump sum just like erased for now And your landlords mortgages So they don't they don't suffer like the fact that corporations run our government and I've said to my audience like it doesn't matter Biden or trump wins because I mean, I think trumps a little worse But the bottom line is neither of them make the decisions. It's their donors that are making decisions but there's no like deep discussion about Why is it that in the united states of america When something like this happens Why are 20 million people now out of work and no health care like it's mentioned But there's no that is a disaster and it could be fixed like right now And it's a scandal that the democratic frontrunner Is not saying yes right now medicare for all we'll talk about it You know, I disagree with it permanently, but right now medicare should just pay for all this It's completely scandalous and the future is bleak. I'm going to talk to richard wolf Later this week, but it's going to be like 2008 mic I mean these companies are not hiring back all these workers when times are good. They'll do more with less So you're going to have You know talk about angier yang the jobless economy is going to be expedited quicker A lot of these people are not going to get employed back Not to mention opioid epidemic getting worse because of unemployment depression Suicides those kind of things and there's very little talk of it and you know, I love bernie, but he has not organized his army to They can't protest in in physical space now But he has not organized his army to demand these things Now is the time I don't agree with some that are going off the rails and bernie's a sellout and a coward I don't agree with that But now is the time to just say straight up like no, we're not paying our rent This is absurd. We we don't have jobs Like it's crazy. Um, so I think there's a broader discussion than just the health pandemic And uh, I I hope also, I mean, look, there's a reason that african-americans are being hit disproportionately downtrodden communities So I hope that these parts of the discussion enter into it, but yeah, i'm fine. I'm gonna be fine and Hopefully nobody else gets this. It's not pleasant. Yeah, well, we're glad to hear that you're doing okay I think that like hearing you say that you tested positive for a lot of people like this makes it really real If you don't know someone who's had this I've known a couple of people now who has had this But if you don't then like hearing from someone who comes out and says it I think it really makes it real and I think it it's important because it encourages people to actually be more responsible Because you hear about these stories in the news we're overwhelmed every single day But it doesn't seem like a real thing unless you actually put a face to it and like having you come out and say it I think there's a real utility in that and you know just letting people know that this is serious and you need to take it Serious, you know, thankfully, you're okay. It could have been worse for you, but it's still it's no walk in the park You know, so um, thank you for sharing that. I really appreciate that Um, and yeah, uh before we leave one last time. Can you plug your website? Yeah youtube.com slash status coup that's c-o-u-p status coup.com and uh, yeah, definitely subscribe If you got a couple bucks, uh, it's five bucks a month status coup.com slash join and um Super super important right now support independent media whether it's us mike if you can do all As many as you can obviously people are hurting themselves, but I think we've seen from this campaign Manufacturing consent is on steroids these days And I think part of a large portion why bernie lost. I mean just think about it There's biting at a hundred million dollars in free advertising between south carolina and super tuesday That's not my opinion. That was reported. That's so and I'll and the exit poll showed Uh, I think 50 of people that voted for biden decided in those final days, so It wasn't a definite that he was going to clean up on super tuesday. Remember bernie was like to declared He was basically the frontrunner on 60 minutes like right before them So I think uh, we need to support independent media to counter this day after day propaganda So definitely uh, check us out if you can on youtube status coup All right. Thank you so much jordan chariden once again I'm really appreciated whenever you're writing the stories We'd love to have you because I think this is important and people need to know Thank you mike. I appreciate you having me on and caring about flint