 Vice chair birch if you would go ahead and test your audio and visual for us, please There you go Thank you Just go ahead and leave it on Michael. I was gonna ask everybody else to turn their video on if you could please turn your video Okay, looks like we have a quorum. It's not quite 430 We'll just hang out here for another 30 seconds Then we'll be more congratulations Thank you Now you're gonna have fun I've had fun here Thanks for all the support Okay, and with that it is 430 So I'd like to call the regularly scheduled meeting of the city center of the design review board to order Though I lost something on the iPad I apologize With that, I'd like to remind everybody why we're still here in a virtual setting Pursuant to government code section 549 5 3 e and the recommendation of the health officer of the county of Sonoma Designary board members will be participating in this meeting via zoom webinar members of the public can participate virtually at www.zoom.us slash join or by toll-free telephone dialing 1-877-853-5257 and for both the web address and the toll-free telephone number you can use the meeting ID 876 204-5098 Public access to the meeting is provided through the zoom platform. You can provide comments during the public comment periods Additional information related to meeting and participants is available at the city's website at srcity.org slash design review board The meeting will be live streamed on the city's website at Santa Santa dash Rosa dot Legistar dot com slash calendar you click on the in-progress link to view the meeting can also be viewed on Comcast channel 28 And is also available on the city's YouTube channel at YouTube com slash city of Santa Rosa So with that I'd like to turn it over the recording secretary for a roll call Let the record reflect that all board members are present excellent, and it looks like we don't have any minutes to approve do we Or We do not making no Okay, cool. So we'll just do approval minutes at our next meeting. Hopefully so with that we'll move on to public comment and this is reserved for public comment on items not on the agenda for the evening but the public may comment just on Items that are within the purview and jurisdiction of the city of Santa Rosa design review board So with that I'm gonna turn it back over to the recording secretary to see if we have any hands raised in the zoom platform and recognize those folks for their three minutes to speak and Also, if you'd like to raise your hand via zoom press the button to raise your hand if you dialing in via telephone dial star nine Thank You chair weival it doesn't look like we have any hands raised at this time Okay So with that I'd like to close public comment not seeing any hands raised and with that we're gonna go to item for which is board business, which is where we Read the statement of purpose of the design review board and that comes from zoning code chapter 20 dash 52 Dot 030 F project review the review authority shall consider the location design site playing configuration and the overall effect of the proposed project upon surrounding properties and the city in general review shall be conducted by comparing the proposed project to the general plan any applicable specific plan applicable zoning code standards and requirements Insistency of the project within the city's design guidelines architectural criteria for special areas and other applicable city requirements e.g. City policy statements and development plans So with that I'd like to move on to board member reports And I think we I mean we do have some pretty big board member news pretty exciting I think but I'm gonna let board members staff say that himself because I think board member of McEw I probably already spilled the beans, but congratulations mark and you can tell everybody you're you're good news. Oh Thanks, thanks. Thanks John for raising the issue So yes, I was fortunate enough or looks like I'll be fortunate enough to be on the on the city council here starting in December I'm gonna miss DRB. This has been a very helpful experience So, thank you. Yeah. Thank you for letting me be part of the group And I'm looking forward to finally meeting some of you besides John in person We've got to have some in-person meetings at some point But with respect to the DRB my understanding is that I'm eligible for this meeting in the next one And then I and then I'll need to step away But you'll you'll have to put up with me for it looks like at least at least two more meetings So thank you. Thank you for your patience and again, thank you for letting me be part of this group It has been very very helpful to me. Thanks mark and once again, congratulations I think you're what are you representing district for now? Is that correct? No district to John John Sawyer decided not to run That's right district to he's my representative Well, excellent. Cool. All right. So with that any other board member reports this evening all right, so With that we'll move on to item five department reports and I'll turn it over to Our illustrious board liaison Amy Nicholson Thank you chair Weigel and good evening members of the board Um, definitely congratulations to you board member staff We've appreciated having you on the board and it'll be great to continue working with you on the council Um, I don't really have a whole lot to report except that we are looking at moving to hybrid meetings finally, I know I've mentioned this a few times over the last year and a half but um We need to go hybrid by January 1st of next year um, so what that will mean is um The board can Present in the chamber or be present in the chamber members of the public are able to be in the chamber as well um, and I will be in the chamber And there's options for remote participation Given if there are certain Um circumstances, um, but it will be more or less what it was like pre-covid so As soon as I have additional information, I'll be sure to share that with you all but just So you can sort of plan ahead and we do expect to have a meeting On the 1st of December and likely also on December 15th as well I know we had a few canceled meetings in a row there. So I think that's all I have to report happy to answer any questions and thank you all for being here Thanks, Amy. Um, yeah, I think you know, we kind of jumped the gun. Uh, maybe what was it? Several months ago. We kind of like tried to have a hybrid meeting. They were like, whoa, wait, maybe we're not going to do a hybrid meeting So it all worked out. So I'm looking forward to that. Um, so great. Uh, so we will I guess we'll move on to item six statement of abstention So anybody have to abstain from the item 8.1 today No Oh, awesome So with that we'll move on to item seven, which we don't have anything So then we'll go on to item 8.1 which is our schedule item for this evening and, uh, that is meadow creek townhomes concept design review 533 fell view avenue prj 22-011 and, uh With that we'll turn it over to, uh Uh, I think uh, one of the city's newest city planners who happens to be a former City of Santa Rosa design review board member Sheila Wolke So, uh, good to see you again Sheila And so we'll turn it over to you for a staff report Great. Thank you chair weigel. Let me see if I can get my screen sharing going I'm good to see you all and congratulations to board member stop. That's great news And could you let me know if you're able to see my screen that would be helpful Okay Okay, awesome All right. Well, I already said good evening. So that business is taken care of Um, so we'll head right into it, uh tonight You'll be considering a concept design review package from the applicant for meadow creek townhomes development proposal This proposal is currently in the pre application stage Which means the applicant is looking for the board's comments and recommendations on their concept site plan Landscaping and elevations to inform a future formal application to the city To get you oriented the property we're talking about is outlined in orange here and is located at 533 belview avenue In the city's southwest quadrant It's across the street, which is burgess drive from the lc allen high school baseball fields right here To the north is the southwest estate subdivision To the east is the land tana home subdivision And also over here is the approved colton creek village project To the south is colgan creek and belview avenue And across the street belview avenue are these larger Country properties that are located in the county of sonoma's jurisdiction and outside the city's urban growth boundary Here's a little closer view of the property outlined in blue You can see a stand of trees here in the southwest corner. These are eucalyptus trees and otherwise the rest of the property is vacant Uh concept design review is really the applicant's opportunity to show you the different concept elements of their project and receive your feedback and recommendations However, I'll go over some of the project details to provide you with some context before we see the applicant's presentation The proposal includes construction of 63 two-story market rate attached townhomes These townhomes would be arranged in five plex and six plex clusters throughout 12 separate buildings They're all proposed at three bedroom units ranging in size from 1500 to 1800 square feet Primary access would be off of belview avenue They're proposing 190 parking spaces And you can see how those would be configured below in the little bullets There would be a common open space with barbecue fireplace and seating area and private courtyards and patios The multi-family use is permitted by right I've highlighted where we are in the process tonight, which is concept design review by this board And if a formal application is received this project could receive reduced review authority consideration by the zoning administrator for design review Since it's located in a priority development area However, there is discretion to keep this with the design review board Small lot subdivision and tentative map consideration would be done by the city's planning commission This slide provides you with the map showing the property outlined in orange The general plan land use designation is medium density residential and the zoning is mostly r 3 18 With a little rectangle of r 1 6 up here The property is 4.78 acres and could allow for development of up to 18 acres per 18 units per acre or 86 units This concept proposal is for 63 units with the density of 13.18 units per acre, which is mid-range Since this is a pre-application concept design review request under CEQA. This is not considered a project Tonight, we're just looking for your comments and feedback on the concept We held a neighborhood meeting last wednesday evening. It was a small but very passionate group I've highlighted the concerns that were brought up at that meeting with the top four being directly related to this project And i'll just run through those for anyone Um, well for you and for anyone in the public, maybe who wasn't there Uh Folks who attended found that the project as proposed would be adequately parked There was concern about removal of the eucalyptus stand and nesting alzare and other wildlife Concern about developing near colgan creek That lights from lc allen high school would impact homes on the site Uh and concern about the uh cumulative impact of development in this area and loss of nature Evacuation concerns, uh with all the two lane roads in the area The notion that more people would contribute more trash to colgan creek A lack of services in this area and the things that were mentioned were a library grocery stores and slow bus service That this area is considered by the folks who attended as a high crime area with excessive litter Someone mentioned that traffic studies are being done at inappropriate times not reflecting accurate conditions From the city's end, we're encouraging residents who have and i mentioned this in the neighborhood meeting Who have concerns about development and where services are located to become active in the city's general plan update Which guides lin used decisions And that's currently underway right now, but I think you can see in general there was a sense of Uh dissatisfaction with the amount of development that's taking place in this area So again the purpose of tonight's concept design review is for the board to provide comments and direction to the applicant on their conceptual plans So they're able to put forth a formal application that can be supported This concludes my report and I know the applicant team is here with a presentation for somewhere I would like you to note that i've added a couple landscape slides to the applicant's presentation that were not included in the packet materials These two slides are at the end of their presentation and will better describe the proposed tree planting As well as the conceptual furnishings and amenities for the proposed outdoor common space So that is it from me. I'm gonna stop sharing Um, and I'd like to check in Whenever it's appropriate. I've forgotten how this works already, but uh, I know one of the applicants was trying to tune in from out of country and maybe having some issues so That's what's going on on this end for their end Thanks, Sheila. Um, so typically Yeah, I know it's been I don't know six months nine months as you've been on the board. Uh, something like that, uh So what we what we have been doing is we've been doing a staff presentation And then the applicant presentation if they have one And kind of saving up our thoughts and comments and then we're going to public comment And then we're bringing it back to the board for questions of staff and applicant and then we're going to comments That seems to have been working pretty good for us. Um in terms of You know trying to collect, uh, you know any public thoughts and kind of meshing them and melding them with our own so That being said, uh, we'll turn it over to the applicant now for their apical Excuse me applicant presentation. Um, and it looks like, um, we have all the applicants. They're listed as attendees um, and so Sheila if you want to bring up their Presentation and screen share that'd be great and we'd get rocking it all with them We'll turn it over to them. Um, hi, uh, can anybody hear me? We can indeed Oh, okay. Um, if you also are able to unmute jay, I believe he was able to dial in by phone. Um Are you able to unmute him too? Um, it looks like can you hear me as a panelist now? So, yeah, yeah, he's uh, there we go. Yep, we can hear you jay. Thanks Okay, I'll let savannah Excuse me. Savannah. I'll let savannah do so. It sounds like maybe he's still having some problems. Yep Looks like he's logged out again. Anyway, so, um, savannah if you could go ahead and uh, She'll go through the slides and uh You guys can hear me. I'll just go ahead and get started going through the slides here. Um, we also have our for, uh, consultants, uh, present, um, who will also be able to answer any questions after the presentation Um, so to get started, um, we are, uh, in the process of, uh Presenting the meadow creek county homes. Um, so the front slide is just a backdrop of the site um, and it right next to our current, uh, residential, uh, subdivision meadow creek, which is While we already have the logo meadow creek, um, because that's currently, um Almost finished and then we're also building the second phase of, um, meadow creek, which is, um, kind of on the other side of the street Uh, you can go to the next slide So first I wanted to tell all of you a little bit about, uh, Our writer homes in case you don't already know Um, we have been around for 60 years since 1959. Um, we have won multiple awards for design, including best new home products Um, we were the 2019 and 2021 builder of the year in northern Nevada Um, we design the homes so that, um, each new project is specific for the community that it's intended for and we don't replicate, uh, floor plans So we've built over 7,000 homes in California, Nevada with over 500 in the city of santa rosa Most of them actually in this neighborhood that, uh, the meadow creek town homes will be in So you can go to the next slide Um, so we are also family owned and operated. We're not just a big, uh, public builder Um, and so we have three generations. Um, now with j And ned and myself Um, so these are just some of the things that homeowners have said about the homes that they have purchased from us. Um, People tend to really think that the quality is superior compared to other Uh Homes that are available on the market, um and our sector. Um, and they think that our standard, um Finishes and appliances are better than a lot of the other places So this is the neighborhood context map. Um, and she also showed you the location. Uh, we have Uh, the meadow creek subdivision to the north, uh, lc allen high school to the west Colbin creek to the south, uh, residential property to the east Site circulation will be the north south orientation with buildings in the east west orientation Now you can go to the next slide These are some photos of the site that we have included from different angles. Um, and in the photos, you can see the orange fence. That's the salamander protection fence Um, you can go the next slide Um, so this slide, um Is uh the first slide about the um elevations. So it's going to be farmhouse We're proposing like Sheila mentions 63 townhome units 15 1800 square feet The density we are aiming for the mid Of the uh zoning which um would be 13.18 units an acre Which is kind of bright in that middle Range and then the proposed project is going to target buyers in the economically price segmentation of the santa rosa housing market Um, so that will be the lower end of market rates You can do the next slide. Okay. Um, these are the floor plans. Um, so we have Uh, five plex buildings and uh six plex buildings Um, so this one here is one of the five plex buildings Um, each of the buildings is two stories I can do the next slide This is the second floor The five plex in the next slide This is uh An elevation uh front and rear. We're going to have two car garages. Um, there's going to be uh little um patios in the front um You can go the next slide Uh in the next one Um, so this is the preliminary site plan Um, like I mentioned, we have both five and six unit buildings. There are two story alley loaded A total of 12 buildings Um was private courtyards and patios for each unit The front entries um are mostly along green space elements with an eyes on the street approach to the neighborhood Um, here we see the landscape plan um And if you go the next slide This is the colored rendering. Um, so in this beautiful colored rendering you can see that A large central park Presents itself as the primary focal point When entering the neighborhood and provides pedestrian connection through the site with a peseo element running from the cooling freak access Through the site to a passive garden between buildings seven and eight Um, you can go the next one So this is uh one of the added slides You can zoom out a little And this shows some of the Tree um elements and uh the proposed tree palette Um, and you can go the next slide Um, and here we have um Just some conceptual, um ideas Such as this overhead shade structure Fireplace without proceeding and picnic table Um, which you can see these elements In um the big green space area that we're proposing And then now just if you have any questions, um either Jay if he's back on here, um, or myself or any of our Uh consultants can answer the questions. Um, are we able to unmute them as well? So savannah, uh, like I was saying earlier typically what we do is uh After your presentation we go to any public comment that um That might be uh Had from members of the public On your project and then we'll bring it back to the board and we'll we'll ask questions then And uh, typically the recording secretary, um, you know can Unmute and mute Whoever's attending the meeting as uh as they see fit. So that's what we're going to go ahead and do Um, it looks like your yeah looks looks like your consultants are are all in the meeting and they're flagged appropriately By city staff. So that's great. And uh, so with that, I'd like to go to public comment from members of the public Uh, so this is a this isn't a public hearing, but we still like to Be here, um from members on the public on concept items And so it looks like there might be some folks from the public here right now Who may want to speak so if you could please raise your hand Uh, and the recording secretary will recognize you If you're a member of the public wishing to make a comment You can do so by selecting the raise your hand icon at the bottom of your zoom screen If you're calling in, please press star nine and that will enable the raised hand feature Chair weigel, there are no hands raised All right, cool. Um, so no hands raised So if that will close our public comment period and we'll bring it back to the board and uh, we're just gonna play hot potato today And I think I'm going to put um board member staff in the hot seat because he doesn't get many more options to get put in the hot seat here So, uh Mark, do you have any questions of staff or the applicant? Um, one question that Sheila may have answered, but I missed it. Um, What is the what's the minimum required amount of parking? Uh for development like this in this area? You know board member staff we We have not even done a formal look at this application, but we know enough to know that they're adequately parked um, so I don't have a firm number for you But this is adequately parked for what they're proposing I was actually thinking about it from the other direction. Um about Just the amount it there seems to be a sizable amount of parking and we can take that up in comment period But I just I wanted to know whether there was a minimum that they had to meet with this number and and it sounds like they They've likely surpassed it Yeah, once we get a formal application, we'll do that review. Um, right now We can we can kind of sense that it is adequately parked, but we haven't done any analysis yet Thank you. That was my question. All right. Uh, any other questions mark? Are you good? Excellent. All right, uh, we'll go to board member Sharon questions of staff or the applicant Good evening everyone And thank you chair weigel um and Thank you planer wolski Uh, great to see you great to see uh senior projects starting to come through the pipeline too Happy for you and happy for the city as well. Um, and uh, congrats mark. Um, look forward to To hounding you to keep the city beautiful and well designed over the next four years. So don't forget where you came from Um, and I also want to apologize first. I'm pretty sick. So if I Cough her at the sneeze or whatever. I apologize. So, um, all parents out there probably will Commiserate and understand um I want to um one second, uh, um, board member staff's Question about parking. Um, certainly seems adequately parked. Um, certainly seems over parked And would like to get a firm number on what is the minimum as he requested the minimum number required Um, because it seems they were Um, somewhere over. I can't remember the exact Uh number but over two per unit. Um, um, so Just want to know about that and um and how that also relates to the, um I saw that street parking was included in The parking count as well. Um, just want to know some more information about about that and encourage the applicant. Um for uh, when we get to um Past conceptual design to look at ways to Make parking as efficient and minimized as possible. Um, and encourage Um, alternative forms of transportation. Um, like parking You know, um access to the buses and transit lines. So what's going to be a big thing? You've already had two questions about that so far. So I think that's one thing we're going to focus on. Um, Uh, and question for staff But we are conceptual just wanted, um to see, uh, we have this has not been seen by Fire or traffic or anything yet. Have they even made an initial pass of this as fire made an initial pass at the application at all? They haven't no Okay, great. Um, that's that's cool. I I thought so but I wanted to make sure make sure because I, um Uh, have some thoughts on the um layout access and circulation as well I'm I wanted to see if some of this was driven by, um other concerns, which it is later on in the process But for now, it's not um And that, uh I think should do it. Um, I did have one actually question. Um Is uh, no, that should do it. Actually, no I will cut myself off. Thanks everybody. Um, I do have a comment, uh, based on what you just said, uh board member, um Sharon. Yeah. Yeah, Sharon. Yes, sir. Thank you. Um, so according to j Fire did look at the previous site plans Okay. Yeah, I imagine they looked at it. Maybe they haven't given, you know, official Conditions of approval or anything yet. So, um, but that's good that they they took a look at it. Um, already So thank and thank you for the answer I'll set chair All right. Thanks, Adam. Um Board member mckew questions of that and or the afghan No questions. All right Thanks, john And uh, vice chair birch Questions of staff and applicant. Yeah, probably question for staff What is the uh, what can you tell us and I'm I'm probably Sicker than board member Sharon. So I hate to be a one upper, but um, there you go. So I'm very croaky Apologies to everyone. Um, what is the The meadow creek southwest estates to the north Um, those appeared as though they're going to be six single family lots in that r16 zoning Is that right, Sheila? Yeah, let me check that out And I saw it, you know, I didn't get out to see the property See the project in a but a slide that I saw Just of the site it appeared as though that was on That was not Not developed at this point Hey, uh, michael, I actually I have an answer. Um, let me find this. Um rider homes actually has a A site plan on their website that I was looking at earlier So let me pull that up and I'll hold it up or something. We'll figure that we can assume and maybe so then this becomes a question That's great. And maybe it is a question for the applicant since they would be Very familiar with the project. Um, that that would be a backyard fence at that location alone the uh north edge of the project then From the adjacent development Jane will Attacks here on what he wants to say Um, but I think most likely Can you hear me? So, yeah, so there you go, michael. Yep. I think we're talking about Uh, right right this side got it. Okay backyard fence and landscape it appears Yeah, that was uh and it's Six homes one two six homes great. Now flapjack way flapjack Um, that was that was my only question for now Yes, flapjack not to be confused with blackjack caddy shack or applejack Oh boy, uh All right. Um, and then I guess the only question I had Uh for the applicant was Um, they and they may know this off the top of their head What's the plate height of uh Your the the single family housing to the to the north. Um I'm taking a educated guess On the elevations that the plate height looks like it's like nine foot, but I wanted to confirm that Because I know the plate height for your duplex development. Yeah, so, um, that that was a Correct about the um crease with the fence. Um, they just confirmed that Um over text message and he says that it's the nine plate nine over nine All right, there we go. See uh Oh, thank you for that. Uh Yeah, I was looking at the elevations on your website and I was kind of like yep, if it's an eight foot door Yeah, so wanted to make sure I Have that right for the adjacent development if you will Excuse me. I am not sick. I just had a cough Um, it seems like everybody else is sick tonight. Uh, so with that, um If everybody's got their questions answered, uh, we'll bring it back to the board now for comments on the project and uh Oh, um, I had a comment. Go ahead. Um, so, uh, Scott, uh Adams, um from the Simeon Lagone architecture. Um, Let's have an answer on, um, what we were talking about earlier About the parking. Um, we're at approximately 3.0 to 1 on site and required per city ordinance is 2.0 Resident plus 0.5 guests equals 2.5 to 1 minimum Uh, so yes, we're over and some uncovered all could be remit Okay, great. Thank you so much Adam and um, Mark, does that answer your question that you guys sat on the parking? That can help you out with your comments Excellent Cool. All right, so with that then we'll bring it back to the board here and we're uh, going to go through comments Um, so with that, I think uh mark is in the hot seat again tonight And so we'll go to mark for his comments on the project All right, I'm gonna try to take note and yeah, and I'm gonna try to take notes like I always do Just so you know at the end so we can try to summarize for the applicant What's going on Perfect, um, well back to back to the parking for a second. I think everyone can see where we're going with this If we could free up some of that parking space For some other use on that site, whether it's to expand the the the park area Or add at other green space elsewhere Something it would be great to it would be great to to not have some of that, you know, not have as much space simply asphalt it over for parking Um, I'll also I'll also note the um, the letter the late correspondence that we received from I think was allen montas I thought his comments were were um, were relevant and that the um, the sides of the buildings were were Not we're not we're could use a bit more design. I think was the the summary of this point Um, especially since they were facing into other residential neighborhoods or street side Um, so I think are those the east west east west elevations Um, but to spend more time on on those sides of the buildings to make sure that they're that they're Attractive whether to use from the streets or from the residences Uh, adam, you are hinting at this with the with the traffic and the fire. I'm curious to see the traffic studies and the and the The ingress egress issues along that site as well. I mean belby's a fairly narrow road um, and so Paying paying attention to ingress ingress egress there and the traffic issues is going to be is going to be important And I think that's I think that's it for me actually Again with with emphasis on freeing up some of the parking space for other other more productive use if we can That's it for my comments. Um, oh, I actually let me let me let me um Also, I should I should have let off with this. Um, it's great to see this kind of development out in that area I mean, I love I love the I love the townhouse format. I love the idea of having more residential right there We do need other services out there We're gonna have to we're gonna have to do a lot of infrastructure work in that area But having a development like this like this in that in that area is great. So I commend the developer um, and I look forward to Seeing the next iteration of this project And now now I'm finished. Thank you Thanks mark. Um, yeah, just to touch on that I think you know, I was kind of hoping that we have public comment And the reason I was hoping to have public comment Is because we actually just saw a project not too too long ago That is directly adjacent to this project to the east a long colgan creek And it's a also a small lot sub development Small lot subdivision development But that one Actually had an adu component Incorporated into it in addition to single family homes So each single family home had an adu as part of it But it wasn't a separate adu it was an integrated adu so and they were kind of duplexy Um, if I remember correctly and uh, I'm blanking on the developer right now But it's uh, if you look at a google map, it's the the green Area right adjacent to this parcel and there's an existing development to the north It's very similar to I think what got approved to stout in terms of the size of the The development and so that me I think what she alluded to in terms of the uh The the public comments that she had at the neighborhood meeting in terms of the Amount of development in the area, right? There's a lot of projects That have either been approved By us or are coming through the pipeline. It seems like in this area So I hope that gives some context To what's going on. I know that that was something that's something I always look at when I'm You know looking at a project is what what have we approved recently? Is there something coming up in this area too? You know that kind of stuff so but anyway, I thought that would give some context To some of you I think mark's already great comments. So with that We'll go to a board member sharing Thank you drew because I was going to bet to chime in on that as well Excuse me, um Yeah, the um the the adjacent property that was presented to us, uh, we one of the things we did talk about with that layout was um access to lc lc island high school and this potential lot and Potential access to cutting through or working together because it was brought up that this was going to be potentially developed in that meeting so one glad to see this Moving forward and you bringing this um this proposal, but also, uh, we'd like to encourage You know Like being good neighbors and access and you know, not having The need necessarily for kids to even go down to Bellevue to get over to the high school But um, potentially there's a way to actually work with these developments all working together creating A set of or excuse me creating one neighborhood rather than a set of neighborhoods that are self-contained It's one of the things about subdivisions that is um uh an unideal is is how um Separate they can they can be so there's one thing to think about with with this Proposal is is ways that you can work with surrounding landowners and also creating permeable barriers permeable out barriers is a is a loaded word, but um permeable edges to to mesh this with the surrounding uses developments and um Yeah, um, you're in early days, but um, you know This is stuff that we'd love to see with this because there is a lot of development going on down in this section to town Big um article on the paper today about the potential city Park that's been going in so encourage you as the applicant team to If if you haven't really um get a pulse of what's going on in this part of town Great that you did the public meeting. Um Very recently really glad to see that Um, uh for my comments Um, yes the let's see here Um, yeah, uh The let's see I can start with the um, let's start The actual texture itself. Um, I think that uh, the the proposal that you've had Um for us today is very simple and clean and and straightforward. Um, I I do like where you're you're headed with the overall aesthetic Um, I think that it's going to fit with um, you know This part of town with the the sort of rural edge neighbor Or uh rural edge character down here as of now. Um, you know looking 30 years from now who knows if it'll Be similar. Um, but uh, but these this I think is going to be you know, potentially classic. Um and timeless Design as you as you have it here. Um There there's precedence. Um Definitely around the city for things like this. I get I think there's reminded me in specifically of the Sonoma ranch development up in larkfield um You know that you know that kind of genre of of um of architecture So I like that. I like where you're going with this. Um, keep me it clean and simple, you know Contemporary but not modern. Um, this is Not everything has to be flat roofs and you know lime green punch outs or anything like that um That being said, I do I do think that um, it's it's You know, we are conceptual here and you know in that case I think that you're thinking primarily about how you can use the site the type of units you're getting here Um, the you know general fabric of what you're you're trying to propose so you can really Uh get down to specifics as you move forward. Um as you're moving forward, I would um, I'd encourage To think to take this classic style that you have and attempt to to You know customize it to to your own Um uses to uh to you know kind of spice it up a little bit. Um really make it human. Um He you know, it's it's uh Some of the facades are a little flat and I mean the color color options are pretty muted. Um gray Um And so again, not everything has to have lime green in it, but um, you know, some something a little bit warmer Um could could add and also I think that you've got a nice rhythm starting with the ventures style You know those those flatter flatter Faces that you have, you know, I'm thinking of the the garages And you know as the the late course plans brought up of you know, anything that's outward as well really, um Looking at our our design guidelines the four-sided architecture All edges of the Um Really, uh, you know, we would like to see You know the those those customized detailing is is where we would like to see when this Turn to design and uh Here today is Um, I think that being said, you know, I think that you're um, yeah, you've got a good start But it it I'll be excited to see where you you've got Balance the concerns with with cost and affordability as well. Um, thank you for keeping that in mind as well um, you're trying to hit This point, um, it is lacking. So, uh, thanks for doing that um Now moving into the site and um and and parking Um circulation as well, um Yeah, I I would say that this is over parked. Um, you know, I Keep keep an eye on that, you know, it's it Uh We want to have adequate parking, but we also want to um, you know, we don't need to to bend bend over backwards Just to for all the cars. We're creating human developments not car centered developments Um, especially you're across the street from a school. Um, and there are schools around in the neighborhood You're creating family developments as well. Um, a lot of these three bedrooms. Um, you know, hopefully families are going to be in there You'll have kids running around That moves towards Making the site as um as human focus is possible on human scale. Um And yeah, my question about the about fire and circulation. Um You know, um, you have the central entrance, uh with we have you're calling a street right now. Um, and um, wondering You know you know one the rationale behind that um and Two if you can think about taking that out and create that peseo as as being a full peseo Go all the way to the all the way to, um, Burgess go from one side of the um development to the other but In that way, you're you're creating a potential connection. Um, pedestrian connection across the street to the high school You're creating more access. You're creating more open area. Um, you Uh in your description, I've mentioned having a large central park um Wanted a quibble with it being large to being central It's sort of in the middle, but it's not necessarily smack dab in the middle You want to have that that large central portion create this this? You know two parks on the other side of this central Main street, you know, think about this development as a you know City as a neighborhood in microcosm. Um, and so here you're creating a main street. I'll have your eyes be looking towards this central both driveway main street in the middle there if this is the the layout you want to do Main street right there eyes on the street, but then also eyes going east west with that peseo that's there Potentially take out a street. Um, have that be you know have the center be Really the center of the of the um the parcel And create create that the the focus the the the actual warmth the heart of this little neighborhood As that peseo there, um, you know that that could be you know, think of you know, again creatively you're creating Crosswalks going across here. Maybe taking that whole intersection there That now is an intersection removing a street, but then you're creating something in the middle there Maybe that that central square think of it as the commons of this neighborhood that that is painted. It's a different texture. It's a different surface material Potentially this piece of artwork or there's four pieces of artwork all around something like that really, um You know, you've you you've got your first proposal of Providing housing now provide the amenities provide the neighborhood provide the actual flesh to what you have You know neighborhoods are are wonderful But you know a lot of you know The suburban subdivisions are just housing and you drive in and drive out Or at least over the past 50 years. That's how it's been you drive in drive out and then you know, that's it create something That's more pedestrian focus. That's more of a home place rather than just Everyone's sequestered in their their own town home and then they go to work. They go to school Create create a destination here. Um, you know in a self-contained home unit With that I think you can um You know reconsider your circulation. Um, this is all of course in with uh within the eye of whatever Fire has to say about circulation and access of course too. Um, uh, they're gonna have some, you know pretty strict guidelines on that and uh Again referencing The the exterior of the the site the surrounding uses Preferences surrounding developments as well. Um, does this need to be you know fenced and closed off? Can there be permeable edges? Can you can you? You know have uh pedestrian access between all these other developments Also thinking in terms of the natural surrounding context. Do you got colgan crepe right there? it's it's it's edge here and As it is you've got the town homes um to the southern portion of this of the lot just um backing up almost the to the property line setback and um, you know, I don't necessarily see anything that says like hey, we've got this beautiful Uh creek that's there because colgan creek. There's been a ton of restoration work. Um by the city over the past Uh, I don't know 10 years. Um City staff can correct me on that if it's not enough time But I know that um, they've been doing a ton of work on colgan creek and it's continuing and there's been a ton of work Just on the edge of the lcl and high school campus as well. Um, that the school has been very much Involved with. Um, I know that's outside of your parcel. I believe it's outside your parcel. Um, but uh, At least referencing and nodding toward that and that can be again You know creating the eyes towards that. Um, or um, the your use of plant material or your use of trying to bring that creek in Um, that that creek habitat, uh, your you know, storm, why you can be in the storm water Uh treatment plant palette give me the trees that you choose It's you know, there's lots of things to think about um, and there's a potential to think of other partnerships there One that's a great thing. It adds to that human scale Um, but it also provides a really nice educational opportunity for this this portion of town And it knits you into the community more. Um, really one of the things it's I think it's difficult with with a lot of developments in this part of town is that They feel like they're being plopped into this part of town that hasn't had developments and um, I think one of the things that is that has been important and will be very important Both just for how this section of town is is built out But then also for the current residents feeling like they have buy-in And they're being listened to is to see how your development Can be a part of this overall neighborhood and that's everything from right close by to bigger, um go thinking referencing, um, roseland in general um So, um, you know roseland is not necessarily a Grain and flat place. It's uh, it's pretty vibrant. Um, lots of Culture and food and beauty and natural resources and uh, you have a great opportunity here I think you have a really good start and um, I'm going to be excited to see where you go I'd say push push your ideas. Um, really think creatively keep the budget budget in mind, but you know Uh, let's buy stuff a little bit. Uh, thanks for what you're you're you're bringing and um, Yeah, I look forward to seeing your next iteration. Thank you so much Thanks, adam um, so with that we'll go to board member McHugh's comment One of the things that, uh, uh, I want to say is I'm very supportive of the project Uh, reading through reading through the materials. I also was was interested in the, um Alan montay's comments regarding the, um, You know farmhouse and and some of the other Aspects of you know desert modern You know, I'm not an architect and so, uh, I don't know How that how that all works, but what I what I was Thinking about was as I was looking at at your presentation that the buildings seem kind of I want to say this I would like a little bit more spice. They're a little dull um, I would like a little bit more, um Um attention to You know looking at how you know, I I like this comments in terms of too much stucco and and and not enough um Not enough character. I guess is is is what I'm saying and so, uh, I also you know support, uh, the idea of making this a, uh You know creating a sense of community and I and I uh endorse the comments of Alan's comments with regard to You know, how this relates to what's around it Now, I know you did kind of walk around in the neighborhood and kind of look at what Uh, what's out there and some of the work that you're doing, uh with the Single The the homes you're building the single single home since you're building um north of the of the project and You know, I'd like you to just be maybe a little bit more creative. I That's I mean just that that's that's probably it. I mean, I I'm uh, I like to say I'm supportive of the project Um, I'm not you know, I'm sure there are architectural things that one can do to improve But as I say, I'm not an architect. So I rely on my architectural colleagues To help me out with that So that concludes my comments Thanks, John. Appreciate you. Uh vice chair birch your comment You bet. So a couple of um Couple of a couple of different tracks here Um, first track, I'll stick with the architecture. Um, and I'm going to agree with I'm going to agree with uh, board member Sharon that I think this is a this is a really nice starting point in terms of looking at maybe a single front elevation and The attention to detail the rear elevation rear elevation um, the the broad comments I would have around spicing things up is that um I think you know, it's difficult because we we're getting these concept design presentations and We don't even necessarily have a material uh called out, right? So we're assuming when we look at these drawings Stucco we're assuming hardy plank, you know with the bat board and bat Appearance we're seeing we're making some assumptions about the quality and the level of detail of some of these things Are the canopies that we see over the front doors. Are they a metal construction? You know with the with the pan deck roof and it's painted and it's a very high level of detail Or is this going to turn out to be kind of a dash together? Um, you know roughs on For and I'm not certainly not assuming not pointing the finger at the rider team and saying this is what you guys do but bottom line we have a Very limited level of detail. So Adam. I did appreciate your comment that This is a good As a start and it's just looking at it without a lot of detail. This is a great start in my eyes as well Looking at uh, is it Sonoma States? I think 38 north, you know quality of materials different projects around that We've approved and we've either had a little bit more information or more I guess authority to sort of help make those decisions I'm going to assume we're at that level of detail. I think the design is nice as a starting point For for spicing things up. I think that you probably wouldn't need more Than some than some modest color variation between buildings, you know, that's a starting point And and I'm just on the front and back elevations right now. I'm going to get to the side elevations But I think some variations in color. Maybe there's a little bit Maybe another little material block gets introduced But the bottom line is I find it balanced and calm and just bringing some basic Variation from building to building across the project may really serve you Is it is it more than two color palettes? Maybe not, but I do think that that would be a good starting point My my issue with the side elevations is that they are vast stretches of stucco And they address Burgess Which is essentially the drive in and then, you know, to a lesser extent But let's be fair facing the Lantana subdivision To to the east So I do think that some articulation needs to be brought to those Elevations I know you're working with the floor plan and the window placement for garages and bedrooms and all sorts of things But we really don't have any sort of Color or material blocking going on on those elevations at all That would give the that the appearance of what is required by our design guidelines Whether it's us talking or the zoning administrator talking then that is foresighted architecture And and this is really not foresighted right now. We need to bring that foresighted element To to these elevations. So I really would encourage you to take a look at how to bring A little bit of character don't have to dress them up like they're the front of the building I think is, you know in in elevation world We look straight at this big plot of stucco I know in reality that we're driving down the street and we're seeing the back in the front of a building And there's a lot more going on but this is a large expanse of of stucco at this point So doing some work on those side elevations would be really helpful to this I think really becoming a nice foresighted architecture Based on the pattern of what you've already got going on the i'm going to call out the fronts and the backs the front doors and the garage doors That those are my comments on the architecture as far as the site plan goes i'm going to do a little um North south Comparison here. I think on the south side facing Bellevue in the creek. I think it's very appropriate to have The front side of the building the the ceremonial front door although we all know the garage door is the front door, right? But the ceremonial front door Is there on the south side at the creek facing Bellevue and that's a that's a that's a really that's an attractive presence To the greatest number of travelers that are you know drivers that are going to see the project um I'm going to come back to the to the north side in a minute when I say or to the south side in a minute When I tell you what I have a concern with about the north side um From a site from at this end of the project. I'm not a hundred percent sure that addressing six back yards with the front of the um Building of the two buildings that are there on the north I don't know that we're not throwing away our better opportunity for the overall You know the overall quality of the project to not get Some of the front door On to what is the garage side? So the south side of those two buildings? And so I can spend 12 of the parking spaces that we've been talking about And see if we couldn't split that back facade Into a garage door And a and a porch and a front door that comes in in a different arrangement I believe if i'm looking at the 10 foot setback on one of the drawings That we'd be able to to drop the building back to that 10 foot setback line. I hope i'm right i'm i'm Pulling this out of air We could drop the building pull the buildings to the north 10 feet Pick up front yards pick up a front door. So we'd have a combination of a front door and a garage door Changes up the floor plans. You guys like different floor floor plans according to company history But I do think from a site plan Perspective and an overall project quality perspective. It would be nice to see front doors on the front side And then be careful about windows on the north side there because we're going to be looking into the backyards and the homes of Six lots would be my thoughts. So You know love to leave the architecture on the on the north side of those buildings somewhat intact, but I would love to see the front door on the other side Bringing that back to The south side and the two buildings at the south end of the property facing belview As much I do love and I would love to keep the appearance of the ceremonial front side of of the homes Facing belview. I would love to lose a parking space there and split those back garage doors as well and have The entry, you know potentially be off of have something that feels like an entry Can't do as much with the set back there. So that's not something that I would live and die for We don't want just a front door on to necessarily an asphalt piece. That's a little bit more problematic So those are just some creative solutions to potentially plan around the site plan a little bit to I think get a little bit more interest in into the project itself and And those are my comments Thanks vice chair birch So it's it's interesting how you heat off on a couple of things because I think I kind of heat off on them as well And also adam In many ways, I have a couple of somewhat different thoughts kind of around the same I'm gonna riff on the same tune, I guess, but maybe play a slightly different jazz melody or something. I want to call it Um But uh, I think the first thing that that that I noticed that it's probably a new item that I don't think anybody else has discussed But I think adam kind of talked about it just in a different way is um, I actually think uh, b street Where it's currently located is is like the wrong location for it And what I mean by that is I think you need to move b street to the west And by doing that It will enlarge the park on the east side of b street And so what you would do is you would take um I think building Building three four five and six and you would turn them into triplexes instead of five flexes And you would take building 12 11 10 and nine and turn those into seven flexes So effectively we have less like front entry drive, right? And so you have less front entry drive But then you get more park And so you get more public space for the people that live in this development Um, so you're not losing any units. You're not, you know, so same amount of parking so many units same But I think this is it's a creative way to To shift something And which but then you get something for it, right? We're losing paving which is fantastic for stormwater runoff, right? We're losing, you know drive isle But we're gaining, you know public park, which is I I think you should really pursue that option or some variation of that option I mean, I I understand why you did what you did in terms of creating an axial relationship To the site, right? You've got a rectangular site. So you created actually actually put a Axi east-west you put an axi north-south and you went from there, right? I mean, I get that but I think this Being a little asymmetrical may solve A little bit of this I think what I've heard from Numerous of the board members about some more amenities right on the site And losing some street So that's one idea Related to the north-south building orientation. I I agree with michael in many ways um I'm not in love with So the south I actually have a little bit of a different Hot take if you will on the south While I don't disagree with michael about the ceremonial front entrance is facing colgan creek There is a substantial setback between belview avenue and The beginning of this parcel I mean, so I'm not like We don't have a situation where the front of the homes are facing Uh, you know the front street or the major thoroughfare. There's a buffer And so I actually would be in favor of completely flipping The buildings and having the garages in the back and so By doing that you have to introduce a new alley in the backside, right in some way um, which may not work I know but uh, I think it's worth potentially exploring And I think that there's actually some nice advantage to having the backside of the buildings open out onto the creek because You know, that may be a place for, you know, folks to go Walk, there's a creek trail. I think I mean, there's some other things like that um Related to that so that may be an idea I think you can do the exact same thing on the north side where you take the building and you flip it And create an alley on the backside for the garages and thus increase The distance between the backyards of the adjacent single family development Um And so just have a you know an alley back there to pull into the parking And then you know, so it's just an idea I don't know if it'll work because you'd have to play with obviously the whole entire north south orientation of what's going on here Um, and I know we're limited in terms of you know The alleys and accesses to parking garages and things like that, but I think it might be something worth looking at As an option So Because I think that might you know, I create some opportunities for the buffer between the north and south um That that uh that that I think to to the adjacent parcels and whatnot Um, you do have a there is a buffer on the east side in terms of what looks like a bioswale or Stormwater treatment area. Yeah, so that's probably not so much as of a concern to the adjacent Uh, you know projects that we were talking about there. There is a little bit more going on there. There's uh 23 and a half feet it looks like so less than issue to adjacent property there um Okay, um You know architecturally I'm not For some reason i'm having trouble with the 223 foot Um townhomes and then the 21 foot's in the middle Um, it just I don't know I think there's there is There's a nice variation in floor plan In terms of you know, you since you have different um, obviously you have different widths you have some variation floor plan, but Effectively you have three floor plans, right? You have Kind of uh, you know a on the outside b in the middle and or b, you know kind of flanked and c in the middle Kind of like three football linemen um, so you got a center Two-card or two tackles and two-card whatever um So I just I don't know if if you know, maybe If you know, it's maybe it's 23 21 Or 23 22 21 Or something like that where that it gives you actually a little bit more flexibility to create some variation in floor plan in terms of a width factor um Because it's just I I don't know. I'm just i'm struggling with it for some reason I'm not exactly sure why maybe it's just equity among units what i'm struggling with um I I think, uh This is just me being a nitpicky architect um, I think you could flip the primary bath and the The master closet on the two end units. Um I just I don't I'm never a fan of Closets on the front elevation of the building. I think it's kind of like wasted space that could be utilized better Like eyes on the street sort of scenario um So I wonder you know if you play around with that um You know the way that uh the the three interior floor plans are laid out is nice in terms of what's facing forward, right? You've got a bedroom facing forward or a bathroom or a staircase. Which is kind of nice um The reason I asked about the plate height is I I think eight feet is a little a little too short Um, and I'd actually be a fan of a nine foot plate height Which would match the adjacent single family development that you have um, I know the building would get a little bit bigger, but I still think you'd be under the uh Required 35 feet. I think it's 35 feet from the fire department um So and I think that might I think increasing the plate height would give you a little bit more verticality of the buildings particularly if you consider going to a seven flex And so the verticality might help. Um Instead of making them kind of look squat squat buildings And then um Related to boy with both michael and uh adam said about and and also john About four-sided architecture and and both the fact that the kind of the left and the right elevations need a little bit of love I just had an idea. What if you pushed out the stair tower and the And the bathroom you pushed them out so that way you had some variation in a You know plane On those sides of the building. I think that might help a little bit in terms of what? You know, I think I'm only talking like a foot To push it out, you know, that would give it some relief from that mass expansive stucco That's kind of happening and would give you the opportunity to introduce You know a board and batten or a different sighting or something like that That would transition easily to stucco on either side. That's something that you wanted to do With that being said, uh I also think you know the front elevation is a good starting point Um, but the rear elevation does need a little bit of Love as well. I mean, there's a lot of flatness to the rear elevation um and a general lack of kind of attention to What's happening on the front in terms of you know, the gable ends and things like that I think you could introduce a couple or just maybe one in the middle Um, if that you know pushed instead of or pulled instead of pushed if you will Over that that Middle garage that could be that could be an interesting element in terms of creating. I mean, you've got a very balanced Building layout right now. So a central element on the the drive aisle there might be interesting And definitely as you're driving by since the buildings are oriented kind of this way You would you would see that and it would create some nice shadow lines and some good variation. Um I think that's Pretty much it for my thoughts. I mean, I I agree on color. I agree on materiality. I think there's a possibility of introducing another material. Um You know, I I like the idea of of the stucco coming up to where it comes up in terms of the the bottom sill plate Of the windows on the second floor But I think it would be interesting to introduce kind of a you know, maybe a A belt of a trim and then instead of stucco, you know a different a material siding material some type on a couple of the The you know gable towers, if you will that are going vertical That might be an interesting way to introduce A third material while really not adding it adding much cost if any You know stucco and fiber cement live in Kind of the same economy upscale these days So that might be an interesting way to to freshen up a lot of the stucco that's happening On most of the building To introduce that And I think um You know, I would I'm a little hungry for like Three building elevations giving the number of the building on the parcel Um, obviously the floor plans could all be the same but you could you know Have three different elevations kind of building a b and c And mix them up as you see fit color and materiality But obviously all in kind of the same vernacular kind of you know modern farmhouse farmhouse style I think that'd be really nice That would give some some kind of place of ownership You know somebody could say oh, yeah, well, I live in the second building in the the red house with the You know blue door or whatever, um, you know, that's really nice. I think for people, uh, if they can, you know Give directions to their house, uh that are related to kind of how the architectural is architecture is composed as opposed to hey, uh, you need to find my house amongst the other 50 that look identical to my house and Uh, try to find the number. Good luck. You know, I think that's always a challenge Um, and so to create a sense of place, uh, I think it's really important And you can do that very easily by introducing some color and some small variations in elevation without really adding cost Um, so I think that's it for my comments Um Does anybody have any additional comments? Expand upon anything I've said I've said or anything I anybody else has said I just wanted I just wanted to share that There were a handful of of site plan ideas And I think that one of the things that probably we're responding to is that the site plan is is A good starting point, but it's but it's very symmetrical and very clinical and I don't think it's addressing the livability um, and some of the um It's mostly the livability issues really with the site plan and I think that it just needs to good good starting point This is what you would draw up to say here. We are we got this now. What do we do to? increase the amount of usable, uh You know public space Minimize pavement, uh, you know get front doors facing the right side of the project, etc, etc So good starting point just a little clinical little symmetrical And it would be fun to see what you come back with when you played around with it But those comments about the site plan. I think from three of us It's a it's a bit of a word jumble, but I think there's a lot there to think through so Thanks Michael anybody else All right, um, also, yeah, just wanted to um Get talk about that that um that livability It seems is one of the things that we've been kind of hitting on and that that kind of that You know when it, you know, it's it's instructive that you know Almost all of our first questions were what about the the parking and about circulation? And that you know is interesting just from What rises to the surface and when we're critiquing design, but it also Maybe gives clues about you know your starting point for the applicant team's starting point for design Where did they what did they you know focus on first today? Hey, okay We would really want to have this type of development. Let's work from here You know, I don't necessarily think that they wanted to do something that is car centric and with lots of paving But there there was there was a way of saying hey, we want to have um These these number of units we want to provide Um good we want to provide adequate parking We want to provide good circulation and be for people to be able to get in and out I think that that's a nice place to start But I do think that you know another way you can Frame that is those are some of the concerns, but then look at the livability too. That's the amenities That's the beauty. That's the design the real like you know kind of intangible tangible thing that we Discuss as designers You take functionality and then you also make it beautiful and and Making it so it's it's really human person focused What are the you know? Yeah, some of the comments about about that livability about creating destination about Um Michael's comments about the that destination front door. Where's the front door aspect of it? Um really? We're trying to we want to see Uh You know those little um personalized touches. Um, one of the things that caught my mind one, you know, I'm You know a landscape architect Focused person. Um, I you know My first thing seeing with the the landscape conceptual landscape plan Seeing that the the Gazebo that you have there It's nice to have a gazebo definitely. Um, you need gazebos. Um, but the what you you've chosen to to show It might not be that that that thing in the end that exact specific product number But what you've proposed is is going to kind of It's indicative of what we're we're hitting on it's utilitarian It's off the shelf It's not customized. It's metal and concrete. It's looks like community park gazebo Create something that is is is warm. It's it's personal. It's it's for families. It's soft. It's it's welcoming rather than say Economic and efficient and we're good. Um, we want to see, you know economic efficient and The design aspect of things. Um all the other agencies and stakeholders that you're going to be presenting this to are going to be giving you that Certain conditions that you have to hit and like the fire like fire says you need this and that's that's a lot of land That's what you do for us. We hit those gray areas and we want to see those gray areas. Nice Those edge zones are beautiful. And so keep going with that Um, yeah, I don't know. None of us are are shutting you down at all. Um, this is uh, you know, you again Take what you've got is a really good start and just keep moving with it really look forward to seeing what you you guys come back with I think it's gonna be fun. Thanks Adam anybody else All right, so I'm just going to do a quick summary here and then we're going to ask the applicant if they've got any questions of us Um, typically, you know, sometimes we have some some crazy ideas that may not be feasible Or you know out of the questioning like that Um, and so it's good to know, uh, you know, if there's a limitation or something like that. So, um So just in summary, I think we've we've had a couple of comments about the site plan and potential alternative ways to look at the site plan in terms of orientation Or location of access roads location of and size of the park location and size of The north and south in terms of how those units are accessed Um, we'd like a little bit more love on both the left and right elevations For sure and also the south elevation a little bit We still have some traffic and fire concerns, but obviously those won't come out until We have a full proposal. Uh, that's been looked at by, uh traffic engineering and fire and then we can kind of comment on that Um, adam really talked about we all talked about four-sided architecture and you know, customized detailing Uh potential to create a full peseo as you enter Uh more creative on the design variation of each of the unit of each of the buildings Um And uh, it's a very good start Um, but there's a you know Because it's that kind of a conceptual stage there is some information missing And so of course if you come back we'd like a little bit more detailed, but there was some good detail there Um And that's it. I think from a quick summary. So, uh, savannah And j do you guys have any questions comments for us? Anything seem crazy? See you guys see What j says, um here over tense. Um, I'm not sure if he wanted to just wait um Just give him a moment And then I think another thing that's nice about our process. Uh, just if you're curious, um I think you're welcome to meet with any members of the designer view board individually. Um, should you choose? We just have to disclose that Um, once you have your official hearing, uh, you know, your your your actionable item But you feel you can feel free to to send an email to our city email address And if you want to talk with us separately, you know independently, that's totally okay And also, um city staff is fantastic. Um, and they know how to get hold of us and if you need to do that But but yeah city staff is great as well. Uh in terms of any questions you may have about the process or you know, Maybe things you've heard tonight. They're they're great at taking notes and kind of understanding. I think where we're coming from. So anyway, uh question Okay, uh Obviously can't talk because of his, um remote Had a country situation, but um, he said that Uh, he would like it if um, I think scott, uh, adams, uh from the city of lagoona. He just had a summary um, uh Some comments and then we can just end with that and um That would be great. Okay. I think I think we kind of summarized them But scott, do you have any additional thoughts questions? Well, I need to make sure everyone can hear me Is that is that something that's happening? That is we can hear you. Okay, so um I've listened to a lot of the comments and I and I think they are you know things that we can You know try to roll forward with but I will tell you that the Site plan which I was in charge of that's my role within the city of lagoona architecture and land planning is I head up our firm's land planning operations and This the diagram and I use that word very specifically the diagram for this site concept I think is doing some pretty extraordinary things the way we presented the site right now and that is the function of front doors Being loaded in with private yard spaces on the same side. That's what a road town home effectively does But if there's anything that celebrates the community connectivity in spades, it's that kind of concept And we have it on a street as we come in off of burgess It is a way to come into the site And if you look at almost all the edges over on the south end of the site at colgan We have an orientation there. What we're doing is we're trying to really truly celebrate front doors Interconnectivity of residents where they may be sitting in their private patio areas And instead of it being a cloistered and sequestered backyard that nobody connects with anybody This is the exact opposite by having The the front doors where people can wave to their neighbors can even stop and say hello That in conjunction with sidewalks leading all over the place as far as throughout the community And then even we did stubs even to the offsite edges knowing there are future connectivity things This is not a subdivision that's got a community wall that makes it a wall fortress of suburbia from years ago This is a very open porous concept that I think really will Encourage community connectivity and so we were pretty focused on that with our concept I do want to at least make one more comment And I realize there's a lot of things that we heard and wrote down and can take You know into consideration but one thing as far as where the north south b street is And trying to shift it more westerly Where maybe there's three plexus on one side on the west side and sevens on the other It would create illegally long dead-end fire drivelile lanes where the garages are They can't be over 150 foot dead end without service to the far end And so that's something that was part of our consideration was a technical nature to the site So it is balanced. It's even I I understand fully trying to increase the community park area But we know that the the volume of it at two tenths of an acre for the number of units served We'll have a lot of nice Community epicenter features to it. So there's there's some really good comments that came out tonight But um, and we'll we'll try to you know, kind of roll some tissue over some of this and and kind of come back With some interesting But it is it is a carefully considered site plan as presented Well, thank you so much scott Yes, good to good to know about that. You know the fire lane stuff, you know, I you know, I'm an architect and Obviously if I was working on this I try it 10 different ways and then I'd be like, oh wait, what about this? Let me check the code. So I you know, I think it's you know, it's just an idea um, you know kind of off of what everybody else is saying or something that I saw or Whatever and we don't necessarily always look at the code compliant issues I mean, sometimes we do and we catch, you know things that are code compliant being presented sometimes You know, we just present You know an idea as an option and and you know, hopefully you guys consider it and and if you don't that's okay And if you do that's that's great too. I think, you know, what's great about our board is that I think we're very Generally speaking pro-projects. We want to see projects come through the process and but at the end of the day We'd like to see great projects come through the process. And so I think we're all really Excited about the possibility of helping projects reach that next level if possible So thank you for your comments. We appreciate that and with that um I'm not hearing seeing anything else Any any final thoughts? Well, I would like or I would like to I would like to follow up to say as you can imagine, I've Been and made I've made a number of presentations in my life about site plans and things like that but just the tone and and kind of the demeanor of of your group is so refreshing And positive to know that we can talk about design features and try to achieve something that is Literally for the common good and for certainly the good of the of the town I'm encouraged by that right there. Thank you so much Yeah I was very delighted to talk to all of you guys today as a city planner by my background So it was great to be in a design concept review meeting Excellent. Yeah. Well, thank you. Thanks Scott. Thanks, Savannah. We're we're we're excited to see projects. I think I think I know me personally I I love uh driving around town. I'm like, oh, yeah, we approved that project six months ago under construction or You know, something gets finished and uh, that's a really great feeling You know when those things happen So we just I think all of us would love to drive down Bellevue Avenue in a year and see a project under construction That'd be fantastic. So with that I think we'll Close this item Everybody's okay with that sounds good and Excellent. Thank you. So with that we are on item nine, which is adjournment. So six of three Uh, everybody have a great weekend. Uh, great Thanksgiving holiday and we'll see you back in december. It sounds like for another Uh, drb meeting. So have a good one He's health officially adjourned Have a healthy everyone. Happy Thanksgiving