 friends and happy Independence Day. This is, as Sonali said, the seventh edition. Every week, Saturday we do this three o'clock edition which talks on one subject, either on investment and how do you intelligently invest. Second, we talk about scale, how do you scale and prices and then we also talk about value. And we do this in a series structure. So last time when today's session is all about investment and we pick up one topic which is today's all about angel investment because this is now becoming a buzzword and a lot of people, especially the lot of people who have now started looking at angel investment. These days at French and Indian Business X we get a lot of demand coming in people, coming and saying that look I want to invest and I can be an angel in an investor and a lot of retail investors which I call people who first time investing also look at this as a criteria. So I thought this would be very interesting if you really go out and understand how you should really look at if you're looking to invest into that and also for some entrepreneurs, fellow entrepreneurs who are looking to raise on their startup something how they should really understand from that because eventually how do you attract a right angel would really depend. So it's very important that we grow in the depth of that because if I have to really see the journey at the ecosystem of French as India, Business X and even entrepreneur is also part of French as India. We are probably the largest platform for the entire ecosystem of startups and we've seen a lot of startups and I've seen personally startups which have been actually launched on our platforms and have become very big and some of them have come actually a billion dollar enterprises and so on and what we have also really seen a lot of failures. I personally invested into many of these early startups and some have done well while my investment is always strategic, I always look at startups which are more driven from franchising and scaling to franchising so that's kind of an investment I do on a personal level but I know a lot of people are friends of mine who have invested into companies which got very good scale and they were able to build a good portfolio of their investments and some got very good exits and these examples actually encourage a lot of other people to really join the dynamic. While India is nowhere in the global angel investing space, if you look at the mature markets it not only will it not take every example to US but if you even take other markets in Asia even look at China, even look at other markets you will see this is a very very mature market and very mature structure. India also I would say a significant work has been done on the angel investing, we have about 100 odd credible platforms today available in the angel investing so every city has one platform you will have Mumbai angel network, you will have a Delhi network, there is an Indian angel network, there are a lot of other networks where very very credible people are running. We are also at business x work with all these people and encourage that the platforms can be used. I personally worked at a lot of these platforms, we did a big event where we connected almost all these angel networks together and really did a selection of their startups which they were promoting at that time and that was led by an entrepreneur and we reached about 2000 odd different startups which I personally was involved in interviewing and so on so forth. So we have seen a great success story but we have also seen a lot of failures and lately especially and now particularly in this situation also a lot of disruption has happened if you have already invested into a startup and because of six months, seven months of not trading and a lot of burn continue to happen and the potential to further raise the raising ground is becoming difficult. So a lot of changes are happening, a lot of angels who have invested into particular assets now are going and re-looking their portfolio and if the portfolio still the asset looks still strong they are considering to further invest into that to keep that floating because it's very important that the state startups keep on the gas going and we need to maybe look at maybe you are not able to look at outside funding the start the early angels that are coming together and maybe reinvest again in the business to get to at least some window that it is sustained itself but a lot of or also withdrawing you know this also we've seen that some commitments you've made in the business but now because this all changes has happened that the business is not looking that relevant and you don't think that I think a lot of people are while whatever you invested is obviously done but if there was further commitment a lot of people are not making that commitment so these changing times are really giving us a lot of insight but I feel that if I have to put my my personal viewpoint on this I would say this would be the greatest time this would be greatest time to not only look at the new startups but also the lot of startups which are already there in the market and and they already have some kind of a you know a proof of concept or a little bit incubation done this would be probably a very good time to really invest and look at investing into that so if you if you're really looking at what I call I mean there is always a debate of saying what is a passive investment strategy and I really call there is no real passive investment you know every investment has to be relatively active you need to monitor your portfolio very closely but if you if you really still want to call it a passive investment where you put as an angel into the fund because you're not day-to-day running and operating the business from that perspective but you need to really monitor it very very strongly and I feel that it's even more important that how do you really monitor and what is the mechanism that this whole startup has really created to demonstrate to the angels that how they are their business and are their investment is moving up and sometimes it becomes very difficult because they are very very tightly held small businesses run by founders and some early teams and sometimes it's bringing that kind of transparency and bringing all the different it becomes very very challenging so how do you really do that so couple of things which are very important before we really get on to the today's discussion you need to really see this spot six things which I say before you even get into thinking about getting becoming angel or investing into as an angel investor first I think if it is not a long-term plan for you to really be a angel just don't do it just don't do it for fashion you know so people just find it fashionable to be investor into investing I've seen a lot of people have jumped into doing this kind of angel investing we have no clue why they're investing and what was their long-term goal on that only and only very structured who have kept their very clearly time portfolio and very structured approach to the entire thing have been very successful otherwise it's absolutely wasting money it's like a gamble you just don't want to invest into something which which as absolutely no you don't have an idea and you are a not a long-term investor from a mindset so first tell yourself that if you really want to get into angel investing then you need to really have a very long-term viewpoint of that then only any results would come otherwise it's just about a lot of people lose money every year as a very large money they lost in stock market because people just get into the fun of it and then they don't have understand they don't understand how to build the portfolio maintain a portfolio find right kind of exits all that and not all money get wasted and all money got stuck for or you're not able to get anything out of it so at least not a long-term return planning on that so this is where in public market it's still it's okay because you still have a stock with you in which you can obviously sell and there is a obviously a listed companies have benefit on on terms of you deciding when you want to really exit out of that investment but when you come into angel while the upside looks very very attractive for you but it's even more dangerous because you're predicting that exit and defining that exit and equitation of that as it has become very difficult so couple of points I will give it to you this is more starting point for us to really see first you need to really see the timing you know what is the timing telling you what is the stage you are in like today if if you really have to look at as an angel to invest in see the portfolio from a perspective of two to three years and you need to really see that in two to three years what is going to happen to your startup which you are investing what is what is the likelihood look like while investing a long-term viewpoint put a longer investment horizon but really see the business from a two to three years very tightly structured way and say what is going to happen what is the timing telling you and what kind of businesses you really see would thrive and do well and would be able to fund the foundation because startups have all other it might be the greatest idea but it has a lot of other variants around it which can be even more difficult in current times so how do you really define that timing and how do you really predict that second is if you are an active investor always do diversification don't invest into one businesses and and particularly understandably have a very strict strategic advantage on that like for example french as india has an investment arm but we invest into businesses which we we feel that we can also contribute in through franchising to take scale them up so there is a strategic advantage we have anything which you say investing if you have some strategic advantage on that then you can go and build maybe more on on that particular domain itself it's much safer to do that a lot of i see a technology guys essentially limit themselves in technology businesses because they understand technology well a lot of people who are i've seen a lot of retail investors who have a very strong understanding of that industry who go and invest into that some are media people who have been very successful media businesses in past and now investing into media startups and and so on so depending on if you have some kind of a domain capabilities or a strategic advantage on that then you can obviously stay in there otherwise if you are just a purely financial investor and you want to bring in and then devastify your your portfolio and and don't overdo it keep it tight keep it structured but devastify third is a investment in research i think even before you get on to this whole life cycle of entire thing i would say there are many many platforms which are available where you can research yourself there are a lot of now global Indian tools available which you can see a lot of different pitch which are coming in put yourself into the network and start doing a lot of research on this and i would say before you make the first investment maybe put yourself into a six months of training yourself that how you can really become a good angel investor or any stage investor another thing which you need to really understand how it is a monitoring going to happen for you what you investing on and what is a mechanism of monitoring and what all small data points which you really have to a monitor on a regular basis and fifth point would be how do you rebalance your portfolio and you need to really continue to really rebalance because if you really on on this journey and you earmarked some capital and say take out say one crore and one crore i would like to invest over maybe seven or eight assets maybe 10 lakh rupees in each asset or something of that nature don't over indulge into one asset and don't go alone also in one that's there are some thumb rules for investment don't don't if you are especially if you're not somebody who's strong from that domain itself never take the lead and we'll talk about that how how you need to really see that but you need to follow somebody else who has more credibility on that investment portfolio so so how do you really put this entire thing and how do you continue to rebalance every six months go and see your portfolio how it is improving and how your equity is improving and what is a what is a current valuation telling you what you invested on and what is the current valuation almost and finally there is a clear exit cycles which you need to really understand and there always would be a temptation for you to stay invested or go indulge more or and say in that thing sometimes you hear a good good piece out of a early startups and you want to become more greedy to buy more equity in the business and things like that these things are very dangerous in businesses and I've personally passed through this and sometimes you you're starting over indulge in a particular startup which is which is not a good situation especially for an angel angel has to by nature feel angels were your actually your family your friends and and people who are close to you that's what they were called angels so they essentially come and put you some kind of a risk capital and help you to grow and build your idea and that's how the mindset is so you need to really limit yourself that you're creating a foundation but you're not generating growth capital you're not putting that in that so limit yourself let the asset and the founder find it's a next part of their investors encourage them help them out to get the entire thing but don't overindulge yourself so that's a fundamental of and last is your exit planning in terms of how you how you really want to liquidate and this is the biggest problem in in this startup and I've seen a lot of angel have invested into that and they they talk to me and I end up the discussion by saying that what what is a exit what type companies you've invested a very good quality invested into say a different pretty different company and I can tell you there are people who are in multiple businesses and invested in that thing but when I ask them and say how many companies you were able to really come out and able to book profits and they will not have an answer and that's something which is a big problem and very few I know good investors and especially and there are some seasoned investors also and from now it's a very successful investors are out there in the market who are investing in their personal capacities and they are very good because obviously they're they're coming on any investment now even Rathan data is investing into a lot of early stage companies but if you would invest into anything it even takes the credibility of the asset up and and he drives the valuation himself so so it's it's it's a good call you know I I encourage that but not everybody is is having that marquee name to really add to a asset and the asset's value would go up and and people start looking at that business more seriously and everything starts coming around and all other investors will also trust it more because somebody more credible is coming but you need to really see through that how your exit is going to come so I I call it a you know the so to say a risk and reward kind of a structure so what what if I would have to invest and this is clearly my my viewpoint on on how I would look at investment so if I have to look at investment I would always see from three pieces and I just limit myself in these three pieces and I would say the first is a founder I will I will see the founder who is he what background he comes from and and we talk in detail about that so I'll see the founder I'll see the consumer side very clearly because this is going to be where is the customer is a new customer is a shift of the customer where is it coming from who's buying who's buying this whatever you are offering who's going to buy that and sometimes that clarity is not very sharp enough and very clearly predictive enough so that's very important and third if I'm not somebody who understands that domain I would like to know who else is the investor who comes from that domain you know so if I if I have to really place this independently without having influence of anything to anybody there can be a good founder but has not located the right answer for consumer and also has not a very clear lead investor who comes from that domain so I if I don't get these three things I might not like to look at an opportunity obviously it's a these are three things if I match then asset looks to me very interesting another area which again from a risk angle viewpoint I will look at then also I will go with the three things I will say again the founder if it's too much dependent on that which means that the founder itself is so critical in the business that if tomorrow he is not there or the business has to be in that thing or he's too too attached to this entire thing he doesn't want to let it go and and also very friendly to invite a lot of investors around it he's not a guy who's who's too much of listener and we get that kind of fussy investors found founders who are who have their own way of looking at things and and then you obviously cannot open up the company because you obviously open up between unlocking that equity and inviting other investors to also have their viewpoint on that and that becomes a very big roadblock and and we've seen a big failure because sometimes it becomes an egoistic ride of driving their own you know without having solid data backing them to take decisions which are more fighting impulsive and and structure so who's the found how's the founder behaving on that that's very important which is more behavioral second is I feel that a lot of good startups particularly I've seen failing because of two reasons largely one is there was a bigger disruption which was already done or was about to be done and that is a very clearly I would say research and the timing issue so if you're not researched enough that there is something which is already happened in some place which is already has changed a lot of things the way business is done then I would not touch that asset and second which is the biggest problem I have seen in the startup space is a lot of people create great products and great services but they lack distribution they have no no real platform of distribution and distribution takes a much longer than what they predicted and these days people create innovative products and create some diving and the first thing I really ask them what is your distribution idea how this is going to be done and and when I hear the answers which is very conventional scaling up and things are that it looks like that in 10 years he will still not be anywhere right so even and this is not business which you're looking at from a perspective of somebody would take a so long to go to market and how the faster go to market can happen that's why technology companies are great because they're much faster go to market and they must faster in scaling up and conventional businesses and conventional startups have a big problem because of that so what is your and third I would always look at that what is the ability of this asset to raise future capital because if if you get into as an angel and and the ability and and it's a business is on a burn and goes to a certain level and then you're not able to see the end then obviously where is the next round it's going to happen and how ability of this current team and structure in the boundary would be able to attract the next level overall and how and what is a milestone on that what milestone you will be able to do that so these are things which which one has to really understand and structure so we divide this into maybe a six things which we would put as a criteria as an angel investor so first as I said the quality of the founder which is how the founder and his passion and his background and his integrity another big problem which has happened in in Indian startups is that a lot of time you raised money and deployed in the places where you're not supposed to deploy and we have a lot of answers of a good marquee angel investors who've invested and some of the investors have really complained and put a lot of feedback to us in some some investments which have not have the best of the integrity of the of the founder so you really have to see through who are you investing with and what is I mean I mean while there is a limit to what you can read but is there a foundation to it is there a you know sometimes these senior executives who are very good pedigree good schooling good college and everything else tells you a lot because they're trustworthy they're ethical they have they have some kind of pedigree impacts which can demonstrate their integrity another second point is the market opportunity and how well it is researched and backed with the facts you know and this is where are the areas which I feel that it's not personal assumption I always say data gives you decisions if you're not understanding the data you should not take decisions and and make yourself at least for a 15 to 20 days just to go by the founder to present you data and also you do your own research then only you should be good data should do right decisions for you you should not take impulsive calls on that only data should take decisions and set the data what you want to really want to rate on that's very important again your third is a business plan how how business plan and what is the evidence you can clearly see that this business is ready for go-to-market because at that stage you just want to want to read a plan which which looks very far-fetched for go-to-market and I've seen a lot of startups we've invested into startup which change the model in between which is fine because the markets can react differently and you can adapt to things in that but their ability to at least whatever they were proposing and go-to-market was clearly visible that's very very clear another thing which is important is the what is the intellectual property in each of the asset which you invest in if the intellectual property is not very clearly visible which can grow which can create a bigger value I would not at this stage invest into businesses and this is one of the areas where we are now started looking at when we look at investment we clearly look at where is the intellectual property what is the unlock value which is being built in this what is intellectual property they're building and sometimes intellectual property is not looked in a very strict way so I I would say now these days technology is must for almost every company what is the technology in this is there anything which is very strongly proprietary in this what is the intellectual property the overall if you're not able to look very clearly that intellectual property which is very significantly a big differentiator and has a ability to continue to grow that's where the value would be built and that's what we did in the last valuation when we did the episode on valuation we really talked about how the intellectual property is in that and as I said another very important aspect is that because you want to raise future rounds and that six point which is at what stage this value would be built in this intellectual property that you will be able to attract that kind of a company so and another thing now let's go into talking about when what should be an angel look at an entrepreneur and I'm not talking more from an entrepreneur perspective that if you are going to an angel and and you're looking from a perspective what do you really expect from an angel in that one I think the pitch the elevator pitch which you call or the first pitch you need to do it has to have a much deeper working and I've seen so many people sending me these decks sometimes and information and because of business exchange because we get a lot of these people writing to us I feel that they're absolutely nothing in this nothing you can really see and data's are not really real time our data's are outdated and most of the times the information that statistics and everything else was absolutely not there they're not able to do that there is also very simple and very simple executive summary which you're able to present because sometimes the angels are not from your domain they don't understand your and so you need to really put up a very strong executive summary you need to also define in terms of our product and services where is the prototype how is the prototype either done or is ready to go in the market because too long a decision of a basic prototype if it's not is or not there then I think it needs to be done and finally who are your early adopters who are the customers which you can get tomorrow if you get money right now who you can get really tomorrow what are the early adopters telling you and that's a very very important aspect another area which is very important that when you you are working with a with a with an asset to invest very clearly defined that how much money they want to really raise and where they want to deploy it and if for reasons they are not raising that complete money what happens to your account so there is always a some kind of a and that's what these networks do because they they collectively come and subscribe and if it's not getting subscribed they don't they withdraw so your money is much safer you cannot go and individually invest into somebody and and and the full subscription never happens you know I've seen a lot of people who have been falsely invested into startups and they found that whatever was the raised count was not completely done and so whatever little you put burns very very fast and so it never went to entirely so normally it is a from a very clearly a prototype to a commercial early success of the business that's the life-prime you have to run that business from and if you don't have enough gas to really go from this to commercial first commercial success of the business you will not be able to bring in the next round so that has to be very clearly understood and another area of now we will talk about the second part we will talk about the founders and how they really represent and we now have to really talk about I would say that the the biggest area which is outside this is the customer acquisition you know how how the customer acquisition really needs to be done and and these are very important aspects and and sometimes very definite answers don't come and I've seen this piece because to me that would be the biggest biggest point for any asset to get qualified that how is the ability to attract the right clients or consumers or whatever who's going to make the purchase decision if this comes out tomorrow and how fast this can be done and lame answers like will do more marketing and we do this and I think we have no meaning to you know so there there has to be some kind of a very clear natural demand being significantly demonstrated so that marketing can give you reach it can give you more reach structure but where is your early adopter who's your early adopter why they would come in in time so how do you really use you know all the other pieces and I've seen the decks which have talked about a lot of things on the marketing then you will do a lot of social media and this and that all that is fine that's actually amplifying the opportunity and taking it to the next level but where is your early adopter and one of the companies which you are currently working which is invested and and I was very impressed very clearly because he converted a existing small pharmacy stores into a generic pharmacy and very clear structure was that he wanted to take up percentage of their business which was not there and that conversion model to me was very clearly defined and he demonstrated by converting few of them and that also defined that there was a clear value in terms that he can convert these not so organized pharmacies into a more branded pharmacy and this is exactly what GeoArt is now trying to do how technology better experience better distribution backhand can convert and help these businesses to convert so these are very important aspects before I get to the last part of my discussion because we already done about 30 minutes and this is a short episode we do it every time this is a risk involved in angel investment so don't really think that this is this is just goes only on the best in a best case scenario which I have done if you have a portfolio of eight ask yourself that two or three would never give up you know they wouldn't they would not be able to this would be probably sunk money for you and and then some would not give you you know the kind of returns which you expected you might balance it out and you might but two or three good ones can really give you enough to handle your portfolio but I would say don't go into the in the mindset of putting too much too soon in the market understand the the the long-term viewpoint on on the aspect and also you know understand crippled things you know like monthly burn monthly burn rate is very important for you to really understand where is the burn rate and how far it would have to go because I feel that that if you're not predicting and sometimes the answers are like look at housing now housing was able to attract a lot of good investors and so on but there was no end to I mean there was nobody was able to see through when this company would ever make money right and that's how the the whole issue started happening with the founder and the investors because they got into a huge huge problem because the fundamental was that the founder was very clearly and he became a blue-eyed guy at a one-point time everybody wanted to look at him and why because his way of approaching the business was very his own way he was not listening to any of the investors we when investors are not come for your passion they want to see the commercial success of the business and commercial success has to be demonstrated at a certain point time while you can give the breathing time for a business to come up to that level but if it is endlessly burning and your monthly burn rate either continue to increase because you're indulging more you're expanding more and there's and even more distant commercial success and profitability is there then it is would be a very very difficult to do that I also feel that a lot of assumptions and data is very important to really pack the financial projections sometimes financial projection is the art of excel you know you just keep multiplying in terms of showing your growth and unless and until you have our relative data or a comparative brand or comparative asset which has done and performed in the same manner which clearly defines you that this can be achieved and also understand the other cost components and which are available in this structure so put all the heads and put some kind of a micro economics to this and see how it is priced and finally you need to also set the right valuation for what business you are investing in a lot of times I feel and this is my more suggestion to you know early startups they unlistically value themselves and unfortunately the valuation structure of the way we value is actually discounting cash flows where we would put a five year projection and then your projection and unrealistic valuations coming and these are make no sense to you especially when you're doing early down you need to really be very very realistic and while I think it has to be not agreed at both ends that the startup has to be very realistic in the valuation and but not offload too much of activity you should offload and a realistic valuation the small equity while the valuation has to be right but again over indulgence from an angel should never be there they should also understand there has to be multiple rounds which are coming out to come and there has to be enough window and breathing available with the with the founder so that the founder is able to you know raise for the rounds and so forth so these are very important aspects when you would look at angel investing so this is where today's discussion what this is what and if you are anybody who's interested to either raise or or you want to actively participate in as an angel then you obviously can reach out to us at business x business x is a platform we are among the one or two more credible platforms available in the country today which is linking investors and opportunities we at a business x I have largely two aspects of business one is essentially we are in a big business resell where we sell running businesses to future owners so we do a lot of business resells value the business and sell that that's one part of our large part of our business and we really want to scale that part in a much much bigger way because I feel that India has 30 million businesses and and given a choice one third would sell and not sell for that they're distressed but sell for value also so that mindset is now open so people look at positively exiting their businesses where are they doing it because they have some of their interest to pursue and things of that nature so so that's one part of our business second part of our business is helping companies raise capital especially early stage companies because that's the ecosystem which franchising the group really enjoys and we are very proud that we are one of them and also especially non technology also while we do technology but I know in technology side there are many many platforms also available but when it comes to non technology businesses they don't find any ecosystem if you say you have a retail idea if you have a some kind of a brick and mortar health care idea like a generic medicine I gave you example which was able to attract the investment and things of that so these kind of businesses come to us more because they see us as being a platform where we need to do it and if you have any idea which can be scaled through franchising then franchising there also can be a part of your early investing stage if you have a strong credible idea which is also again prototype for us is very important and if you are able to see that there is a prototype there is a success which in build then we can also be very very interested to look at that business model we are committed to invest into progressive entrepreneurs very clearly very progressive entrepreneurs who have very credible idea but for us at franchising their direct investments is only ideas which can be scaled through franchising that's where we look at our direct investment otherwise we will obviously be a facilitator as a platform to help you to reach out there so this was a small short episode on how do you really invest if you are as an angel next episode on investment we'll take up another part of investing and so every series we are we are going to talk about either investment one time on scaling up business and third is how do you build value so over to you Sonali for your thank you note to everybody and if you have any questions for me I'm more than happy to take thank you so much sir for your wonderful insights yet again yes we do have a few questions lined up and I was just looking for the questions and a lot of the questions that we have are on similar lines so the first question is from Mr Anurag Gandhi he's asking what are the sectors you are looking at for three to four years of investment similar question we have from another user who says what are the major investment sectors or avenues today like stocks real estate etc about long-term investment sectors so now I mean I'm presuming what you're saying is that you're talking about all the asset class and and looking at so again I'm saying this would be very personal choice what what is the investment you want to do what is a horizon of investment and house how patient how much patience you have for holding on to investment so it would depend on that and and and at what stage you need the liquidity all these have to combination have to come through then only I think you can define an asset if you also always want to have obviously liquidity available that you can liquidate that asset then I think between obviously they're either stock or real estate would make money any financial structured product which means you can obviously liquidate anytime and and real estate also largely I mean given a window of if the asset is not bad they've given a window of 90 days to 120 days you can you can normally exit and find liquidity but I would say then I would go more on the financial side if you always you want to have the reason of liquidity available and you always want to have that then I will obviously put more marks to it not even real estate because real estate also is a little bit of our long-term investment cycle and and so I will give clearly and last four months if somebody really understood then stock has obviously given very good return then hopefully I mean I think continues to give for the balance here because I know a lot of people have actually survived this crisis because our markets perform so so that's a that's a good news especially on some stocks really did extremely well I mean the reasons for it because of the excitement in karma and things of that nature so all that happened and help the markets and so so that would be a long term but if you're looking at investing into businesses and then I would obviously as I said if you investing as an angel then I would say two to three years of price in businesses very clearly businesses which would have a little bit of positive impact or businesses which can you know change in the in the current time with consumer behavior is significantly changing anything which is which is absolutely matching the trend I would look at those businesses and obviously for me some of the sectors which makes a lot of sense still from purely from a market penetration and from the opportunity viewpoint I always say this is at that is very close to what I think is I think healthcare again technology link I would say I've just made one investment in e-clinics you know this is one investment which we did recently and these e-clinics is and again very strategically we don't really comment because we feel that this can be scaled up so e-clinic is where you can digitally connect and engage and run a polyclinic with doctor not being present physically but through digitally available I think that's future while there would be a lot of evolution of that model would happen over the time both going to technology and and also by the capability of execution so all that would take is on time but I have no doubt that that would be industry but multiple industries we can really talk about and and if you have some outside I always say this and that you really ask yourself what else you bring in outside the money and take decision more on that than only capital capital is only one part of it what else you bring in what else you you have and that should take your calls of investment any other question so we have another question from Mr. Anil he's saying how much percentage of scientific approach can ensure success in retail franchise model and what are they what how much percentage of scientific approach can ensure success in retail franchise model yes retail franchise model if I have understood the question I'm still not very clear about what you mean by scientific approach are very clearly have a very in in true sense there there are certain fixed matrix in every every retail or franchise model say if you say the retail food business the metrics are very clearly that there's a food cost which should be 10 30 percent your occupancy cost should not be more than 15 percent your HR should be another 10 percent and so all that if you number down the utility your royalties and other things you give and I think you left it but 15 to 20 percent return on sales so these are metrics which are very clearly defined for almost every business if you take fashion if you take salon if you take a pharmacy if you take a jewelry store when margins can go as low as 2 to 3 percent in gold jewelry so so all these businesses have a very clear per square feet throughput which means that what businesses can do per square feet so when you you clearly can understand what kind of a potential this sales wise it could have the all that scientific data is available and and then you need to do your cost analysis to see the viability of a business partner and that's very easy because these most of the retail franchise models have a lot of a comparative data available and problem happens in in businesses when you want to invest where there's no comparative data available and that's where you know intuition starts taking over and when you start taking intuition then you can go wrong or absolutely extremely sometime very good but I feel that stake very connected to the three points I have said stay connected to understanding the founder spend a lot of time with the founder understand the consumer side where is the consumer who's early adopter why would they come how compelling that answer is to you and get a person along with you who has a domain experience on that business if you are able to do these three things largely you will not go wrong so we have another question from Mr. Nura Gandhi he's saying can you help us find out the existing business brand value to sell to pan india business having existing turnover of 16 cr how much you said sorry you can repeat the question again it's from Mr. Nura Gandhi the question is can you help us to find out the existing business brand value to sell pan india business having existing turnover of 160 cr I mean it was a very very specific question I mean 160 crore why I'm just I'm a little curious that why only 160 crore you know this is a very peculiar question I've no I mean I've never heard a question like this that find a business which is doing 160 crore that's something which is a you know while we can obviously find businesses around that there are a lot of business developers depend on that but I think the best way to approach is which industry you really want to invest and and you know 160 crores in in a commodity business is nothing in a service business is very very big so it depends on where you are in terms of what your investment interest is I think then we can obviously you know more than happy to help you out and if the if the benchmark is a certain amount of turnover because a lot of people have and I understand the reason sometimes then obviously you can find a lot of assets around it and there are many assets available in this this range actually the mid market we call the mid market is is full of assets available very good high quality assets available now in the market which business X has mandated on which we were more than happy to do that so you can if you want to reach me and we are more than happy to discuss any other question no sir so other than that we mainly have queries about people wanting to register as investors on business X and they're wanting to know so anyone who has any doubts related to that please feel free to reach out to me or to Boris sir and we would be more than happy to assist you with the same Mr. Novel, Mr. Kiran and Mr. Anurag I have looked down your name so I'll go to you as well but other than that anybody who wants to reach out please feel free and yes sir so that is it for the Q&A section. So if you have any interest on investing or acquiring any running business or even scaling up your own business or raising capital please reach to Sonali and and she will be more than happy to take it up and if you want to reach me for any questions I'll be more than happy to write my email id and and we will be more than happy to really take up your questions this is my direct email id gm at DwaroMaria.com send your queries and we will be more than happy to really take it up so thank you very much stay tuned with us and and if you are in you know in the series of investment or looking to scale your business or even looking at how to value even sometimes if you're taking this is a consulting assignment this would be series can be very very interesting for you to continue to that these are simple points we don't want to really in the series talk about you know things which are it's a very very simple way of approaching how these three things should be done investing scaling and building value in enterprises so thank you very much we'll see you in the next edition Saturday three o'clock next week thank you Sonali for hosting this