 Okay, we're back live here inside theCUBE. This is live in San Francisco. This is theCUBE. We're here in San Francisco for GE's industrial cloud. This is our wrap up. I'm John Furrier with Dave Vellante and Jeff Kelly. And it's a big announcement by GE talking about their relationship with Pivotal Amazon, really expanding on the industrial internet, the internet of things. Essentially everything's connected from sensors to mobile devices to essentially the industrial of business internet. And our own Jeff Kelly was on stage with Werner Vogels, the CTO of Amazon as well as the CEO of Pivotal, Paul Moritz. And Jeff Kelly, the number one big data analyst introducing new research. Guys, welcome to the wrap up. Jeff, congratulations on your awesome presentation of the data. So let's talk about the event. Let's first get into it. You were on stage with those luminaries. And wikibon.org, Wikibon project introduced some significant research. Again, another groundbreaking report by Wikibon. Cutting edge in the emerging sector of industrial. What did you share with folks on the panel led by Beth Comstock, big time GE executive, and she was moderate on the panel that you were a domain expert on. So share with us what you talked about. Sure, well we talked about kind of the development of this new platform to really leverage the industrial internet and some of the requirements that such a platform needs to have. When we look at the industrial internet and what it's really all about, I mean there is certainly a scale question. There's the data in the industrial internet sector is growing twice the speed of other big data sources. But for me the real story is the potential value of leveraging all that data generated in the industrial internet. So when you talk about the industries that we're talking about here, we're talking about healthcare, we're talking about energy, transportation. These are sectors that touch all manner of society. They cross political boundaries, social, geopolitical. So the idea here is that really the value of bringing together all this data associated with the industrial internet, leveraging that data, analyzing it, optimizing processes and ultimately allowing companies in these critical industrial sectors to develop new business models, new ways to serve customers and citizens. It really impacts, you know gonna have much bigger impact on a kind of a relative size percentage, size-wise than the commercial big data world, if you will. So that's kind of where we, some of the key findings we had in our research. You had David Floyer on I think earlier today and he talked a little bit more about some of the numbers in terms of the spend. We see this moving to about a $500 billion spend environment in 2020, I think it's gonna create somewhere in the order of $1.2 trillion in value. So it's obviously a big opportunity, both for the vendors involved but also for kind of society at large. So one of the things that was tweeted about obviously the 2x growth of the data versus other sectors was one notable. The other one was this business value. Just elaborate on that. That seemed to get a lot of great reactions on Twitter and within the audience and among the panelists. This notion of value because the value proposition kind of is in the eye of the beholder. I'm sure he's driving some predictive analytics for ads is one thing. But you know for the example you use was getting medicine to a patient. You expand on the other areas of value that you point to here. Right, well as I said because of the very nature of the industries involved the impact of outcomes in those industries just are just kind of dwarfed in terms of their impact. Kind of just dwarf the value and the importance of some of the activities you'll see in the more commercial side of big data. And that's not to say that some of the things that we're seeing in the commercial side like retailers looking to understand sentiment analysis in the tweet stream for instance or place the next best ad in front of a consumer on the internet. But when you think about the outcomes in healthcare for example. So think about the consequences of delivering the wrong advertisement to a online web surfer versus the wrong medicine to a critically ill patient. Or think about the implications of a jet engine failing mid-flight versus not having a system crash that's supporting a commercial application that sells widgets. So they're both important, they're both delivered value but I think clearly on a societal basis we can most of us can agree that some of the healthcare, transportation, energy use cases are really going to drive significantly more value and just have a wider impact across society at large. Dave Vellante the co-founder and chief analyst at Wikibon, obviously the co-founder of Wikibon. Great to see your research up there being highlighted. What's your take? What's your analysis? Well, this is big as we've talked about. In fact, you and I John collaborated on a piece when GE made the announcement that's going to invest $105 million into Pivotal. And what was significant about that in the collaboration that we had was this is the next wave of big data apps and it was a real differentiator from sort of the traditional Hadoop distributions and we've always seen that as sort of a commodity. But I will say this, so this huge opportunity Jeff just talked about half a trillion dollar TAM. There's a lot of work to be done here and that's why I think GE is pretty ambitious. I mean, this is big money and it's big challenges. So there's some real headwinds here. There's a real lack of data standards. These have to be developed and it takes a company like GE and it takes an ecosystem to allow those standards to emerge and it needs leadership. And GE, we heard from Bill Rose providing a lot of investment, a billion dollar investment over a few years. It's going to be up to I think a thousand, he said a thousand engineers in its facility out here. So they're putting the investments in but still again, a lot of headwinds. The other piece is there's real no industrial internet platform. We talk about the industrial cloud but so you've got sensors that are capturing data. They're processing data locally. They're distributing that data. They're connecting to other networks that will create value. They're providing what I call industrial analytics on top of that, no standards have emerged as to what that platform is. And I think that's what GE and Pivotal are trying to build out with its ecosystem. So it's a very early days. And I think the third really challenge here in terms of adoption is engineers. Engineers that are used to, hey, this works. I don't want to hyper automate it. I'm afraid to hyper automate it. So you're going to have to, there's going to have to be a cultural shift as well. And that's why you need a company like GE that is a recognized leader. And I think you need others. There was a question today about, well, what if another big competitor comes out and announces it's industrial internet? Well, let's hope they do. And in a way, IBM's smarter planet initiative now has really high quality company. I think you'd like to see Hitachi in here doing some similar types of initiatives and then coagulating some standards around that because this is an enormous opportunity that can have huge impacts on GDP, improvements in productivity, improvements in people's lives. Yeah, Dave, you and I have always talked about the, going back to the Wi-Fi wireless days, we saw sensors and you saw them on wireless devices. And I'll say with video surveillance post 9-11, that created essentially Homeland Security. Now we've seen all the dilemma with the NSA and surveillance, but ultimately now with mobile and connected devices on the consumer side, that certainly has shown the business model on the industrial or business side. You're talking heavy machinery, manufacturing, turbines, airplanes, telematics, a lot of automobile conversations in healthcare, et cetera. So the question I want to ask you guys is, that's great, the consumerization has led the trend. Jeff, what are you finding in the data with the technologies? Because still, we've seen the cloud war still on the consumerization side, as well as the IT side. So if it's consumer, IT, and then kind of industrial in that order, in terms of adoption, we're still kind of in the middle innings of the just consumer business, never mind the early innings of the enterprise play. What's your take on the stacks, the tech, and the offerings? Yeah, we're very much at the beginning of this process. I think the low hanging fruit, really, I think it's a very easy to understand business proposition when GE or someone else comes in and says, look, we can help you run your machines more efficiently using this data kind of on a machine to machine basis. But then to extend that to a network of machines, whether it's not just one wind turbine, but all the turbines that make up one wind farm and making those work together. As Dave said, the standards aren't really there to kind of connect all these devices, multiple different types of devices, different types of data. And if you think about the level of orchestration and workflow that needs to go into this, in order to really leverage this, where a machine creates a certain data type, analytics take place, it needs to kick off another series of processes, which then, in turn, create their own data, which need to be analyzed, then kick off more processes. So these all need to be connected, they have to be intelligent. So we're looking at things like machine learning open and hopefully commonly accepted standards to improve communication and networking of these devices, applications that actually deliver on value in terms of business value, in terms of real use cases. So there's a long way to go. Certainly, I think GE understands this. GE's an interesting position because they're coming at this from the machine perspective. They are the industrial equipment manufacturer maker. So they're coming at it from the machine perspective. You look at somebody like IBM, they're coming at it from the software perspective. So I think it's, in GE's part, a really smart move to partner with someone like Pivotal. They recognize that they were going to need the help of smart people like Paul Moritz and Scott Yard to help build this new platform of the future, and they're really going to try to leverage this platform to serve across all their lines of business. So Dave, I want to get to you in this wrap up, because this is where we kind of have to play your, you said you talked about horses for courses. Their races aren't even being run yet, so they don't even know what kind of horses they need to run on whatever course of it. So the message of open seems to be GE's take. So is that a good play for them? Obviously, it gives them a little bit of an option to play whatever that comes down the track for them. Yeah, well, John, I was going to say, and ask, I wanted to have you weigh in here, because one of the things I'm personally excited about is the degree to which open source is really now finding its way into virtually every technology business. Now, the latest is industrial internet. So John, I mean, you are one of the most, biggest proponents of open source that I've met. I mean, what's your take on this? Well, I think my, well, first of all, I love the internet of things. I've always been fascinated. Since 2001, really, when the wireless hit the scene, I loved, it was pretty obvious that this vision was going to take place, when and where, and to what the platforms would be, would be the question. I think now, to me, this industrial internet, this industrial cloud, I think it's just kind of pre-packaging of what will happen. And I don't think there's a name for that yet. I'll give you an example. To me, you know, in 1993, the word was information superhighway. That basically described the internet. And then, you know, Tim Berners-Lee started the web, HTTP protocol, and HTML became the web, and the web became what we all used. So back then, that was the word. So to me, this feels a lot like the information superhigh. Sounding, a really killer sounding word. It's impressive, but ultimately, that's not what became the reality in the marketplace. And I think that's something that I'm seeing. Also, with open source, you're going to see things like OpenStack and the Cloud Wars continue to expand. I think at the end of the day, it's going to come down to SLAs, who can deliver? Because I don't want my airplane turbine data going across, ops are down, plane's not functioning. So you need real time, you need really high-end ops. And I think that's going to be a challenge. I think it's going to be very early. What did Ed Double call it on the Cube? The data superhighway. The data superhighway. And I think he's right, breaking down the silos. But at the end of the day, data is like what packets were. So to me, another metaphor we brought up earlier was the local area networking days, internet-working, you know, TCPIP, as you remember, Dave, we was in the industry then, enabled massive wealth creation. You know, 3Com, Cisco, those companies were born out of that new standard. So to me, I think your question about open source is the issue. There are no more standards bodies anymore, in my opinion. It's all about the communities. Open source communities are the new standards bodies. And that is where things will get ratified. And I think from there, you'll see the market really lift. And then as people get direction, the fog will lift around where it goes. But ultimately that is going to be the detail-tale science. What happens in open source? What happens in cloud? And what happens at the edge of the network? That's mobile, that's probes. So software at the edge, that's data. And data, data will be the packet. So event management, processing, event streams, these are the tech. These are metaphors we've seen with network management. And again, networking. So I think networking is going to be a kind of paradigm. We'll see, instead of packets, it's data. And the stack I said of TCPIP is going to be some sort of interoperable fashion. And there's a lot of propriety in the machines that are installed, you know, that GE sells. And EMC's never really been a big producer of open source technologies. But that's the beauty of open source. I mean, you saw IBM turn on a dime. You know, Luke Gerson called it a recovering alcoholic. And they became a huge proponent of open source. And that, I think, is the beauty of this model. And then I guess the other observation is you've got companies like GE, obviously a lot bigger than EMC. But both of them, you know, it's the old Jack Welch. You want to be number one and number two in your markets. And you want to focus on markets that are large and growing fast. And that's something that I know personally from watching EMC all these years that they've done very, very well. Clearly, GE is going after, you know, a next wave of value creation for its shareholders and its customers. And so those are two very exciting trends that, let's just say, a lot of challenges. But challenges mean you need big companies with a lot of resources to solve them. And the end result, potentially, is a lot of reward. Well, that's to wrap up any final thoughts. Jeff, I'm happy to sit next to some pretty big names up there, Paul Moritz. Did you get him on, you know, put a Q plug in there? We did our best, yeah. Paul, you have to come on the Q, we're waiting for you. We've got a spot for you, Paul, whenever you're ready. The other fascinating thing that I found out, this was Leo who does the M&A for Pivotal laid out on the Q here, Dave, was fascinating because we've been watching the Inside Baseball on VMware, EMC for years. And to have him kind of give us some insight into a lot of the Pivotal gaming that was went on around how to organize, you say misfit toys, but the different components of VMware, which weren't materializing very well under the current, the old regime of VMware. VMware was too big of an organization, had too much legacy going on at the data fabric layer, and obviously, you know, vSphere and among other things with virtualization. That was just too much for Pivotal really to get any kind of traction. And to me it was just, they didn't have enough, you know, runway. Yeah, and EMC was a storage stove pipe, essentially. And so now they've extracted those and boom, put them into this hot new entity. It's a great move. My prediction is that you're going to see, you know, the architecture of what Leo put together with Joe Tucci, Goulden and Gelsinger, and Maritz is essentially an organization that's decoupled, okay, and highly cohesive. So you're going to see some great interaction. You're going to see Pivotal probably expand heavily. I think Pivotal's going to have a nice run. I think I've got all the elements. I've got a lot more work to do in the white spaces, which, you know, he didn't really answer the white space question, but I think clearly they're going to be on an M&A spree. I think for Pivotal it'll be interesting to see how they develop, because they have taken some heat in the Hadoop and open source community for taking a bit of a proprietary approach with Pivotal HD. And so we're here at the G event talking about being open and open standards and things like that, so. Well, they use open standards, but for their solutions, for proprietary. So again, this is going to be the question that we've always asked on theCUBE, will there be a red hat for Hadoop? And I think the answer is slowly becoming the only red hat of Hadoop will be red hat, which will buy Horton horse, possibly, or somebody else. So the only red hat of Hadoop will be whoever they buy. The red hat. And then the red hat will be the red hat of Hadoop, and they'll have their own distribution. But the answer was staring us in the face the whole time. I think the Hadoop distribution is a standard, but you can sit on top of it so that we're seeing some emerging paradigms there. Whether it's security or whether it's API management, that's going to be something we're going to watch. Well, and I do think to your point that Pivotal will have to become more of a contributor to the open source community. I think it's going to become a fundamental requirement over the next five years. And frankly, I think they will. I think the market will drive them. EMC, VMware, they're very market driven. So maybe they don't have to be the purest of Hortonworks, but. All right, no one's not suggesting they need to be purest, but one of the key questions about this business is where do you add the IP? And how do you monetize it? Open to proprietary. I mean, that's the equation that all these vendors need to figure out and they're all kind of taking different approaches. Right, but services is one way, but it's not the only way. It's a good way. I love services. Well, I mean, Dave points it out. I mean, many times on the queue, he has the guests today. It's the service provider, the technology providers, our solution provider is going to provide, you know, for every dollar they sell, the practitioners will be getting a multiple of that meaning the delivery or value. So, you know, I think to me that's pretty clear that's going to be the edge of the network. It's going to be app developers. That's going to be, you know, the in-between essential. I see Accenture, you know, essentially prototyping Accenture and giving that out to the channel. So I think Accenture's strategy is pretty relevant. I mean, I like what they're doing. Instead of trying to be the guys to do it all for everybody, they can prefabricate this middle layer, orchestration layer and provide that on. So I think that's where the action's going to end up going and if Pivotal can pull it off, that's where the developers will really make money. Well, and so you mentioned Accenture. IBM's obviously got the smarter planet. Tons of services there. You know, look for Deloitte and PWC to get into this game. I think they're logical partners of GE because there's huge opportunities and they have deep industry expertise as well. And those four are really the top ones. IBM, PWC, Deloitte and Accenture, the top four in IT. And I think you'll see them all doing stuff in this space. Right, well, let's not forget, looking at from the machine perspective, you've got GE's competitors like in technology, Siemens, you know, that whole. Hitachi, right. So they're not going to sit back and just let GE take this market. So you're going to see this is going to be the next wave of activity. It's going to be among these players, the ones you mentioned on the software and services side. It's going to be on the industrial equipment maker side. Going to see a lot of strange alliances potentially and it's going to be really interesting to see how this plays out. Okay, this is the cubes, looking angles here on the ground in San Francisco, documenting and covering the emerging space of the internet of things, the internet of everything, industrial internet, industrial cloud, whatever you want to call it, Beth Comstock was on stage with GE, with their executives, Paul Moritz, Bernard Vogels, Accenture and Wikibon all on stage leading this trend and those are the companies that are going to start taking some of this emerging space. So great event, go to the hashtag industrial cloud to follow all the coverage, we have tweets, we have content, of course go to wikibon.org for their recent report on this. It is cutting edge and obviously go to Silicon Angle for all the coverage. This is a wrap up here in San Francisco and we'll be at the Velocity Conference starting tomorrow so keep on, keep watching theCUBE. A lot more events happen into the air and thanks for watching.