 Hey everybody, welcome back to Lynxcash, I'm Matt. And I'm Tyler. If you're wondering what we're laughing about, you should join us live every Thursday around three o'clock in the afternoon. Eastern time, you can look up your own damn work spaces, damn it, your own damn time spaces, time zones, that's the word I'm fucking looking for. This is gonna, if you're tuning in, bless your little heart, because this is going to be a horrendous episode, maybe not from Tyler's end, but I can't find words. Words are not in my vocabulary because it's horrible. There's only one category, keyboard. Keyboard, you know what, that's a new subreddit, keyboard porn, there is a mechanical keyboard. I guarantee it already exists. Mechanical keyboard subreddit does exist and it literally is awesome and I subscribe to it obviously, because of course I do. Where do you think the fetish came from? I mean, you gotta spend all that money on the keyboard somehow, all right? And you don't just start spending it just cause. You get to dive down the radical. Normal people buy like a $20 Microsoft keyboard from Best Buy and say, oh, this is pretty good. It has letters on it and buttons, it works. Me, new, I think definitely has a key logger in it. I'm just saying, if you didn't build it, you're shit. That gets the Dell keyboard in front of me, he goes, ugh. That thing is so mushy. I've got $400, where can I throw it at? You're gonna be making fun of me for my keyboard thing. I'm gonna be making fun of you for Windows forever, even though I did tell you to switch back to Windows earlier. That did happen. Yeah, sadly, I don't think there are any witnesses for that. He did tell me to switch back to Windows. That was before we started streaming, so there are no witnesses, I deny it. All right, anyways, Tyler, what have you been up on, on Linux? Fuck's sake. So what I've been up to in Linux, I have been, well, obviously using Fedora 35, if you've been cubing up with my channel, I've had a myriad of issues with Linux. I went over to Windows 11, for one, because I hadn't really checked out Windows 11, so I was talking mad shit about it, but I hadn't actually tried to use it, other than installing and crapping on it in a VM, but that's besides the point. So I actually gave it a shot. I updated the BIOS, of course, with laptops, typically from Dell and stuff, if you're gonna update firmware, all that stuff, it has to be done through tools and Windows, which is awesome, thank you, Dell. But I updated the BIOS, did all that stuff, and everything was working fine in Windows, except for the fact that my microphone removed my soul, and, well, OBS was pretty much broken on Windows. So I hadn't tried out Fedora, I went back to Fedora. Fedora fixed, or I hadn't tried out Fedora on this laptop, but I tried out the live environment, and everything worked just like on Windows. My microphone was fixed. However, even though everything is working even better than on a Windows here, I still am looking forward to getting away from GNOME, and I'm probably going to try, after doing all of the BIOS updates and firmware flashing, I'm gonna see if other Linux distros are now working as they should on the laptop. And now this is not something I put in my show notes, but it does need to be addressed. Discord on Linux is terrible. It is terrible. Like Discord on Windows is still not great. Discord is just kind of shit in general, but the quality of Discord compared to Windows to Linux is, Linux gets the shit into the stick. On Fedora here, Discord is my most unreliable program. This thing will, it has memory leak, which apparently has gotten fixed. It stopped doing that, but now it still acts up like crazy. Discord, I'm trying not to wanna leave it, because I know there just aren't really better options. Yeah, we tried, what was that? We tried to element that one time? Was that, I still wonder what the dialer was for. Like random dialer in your application, like I wanna know what it's for. Elementary, or not elementary, good Lord, man. Words, fuckin' words, man. Discord is an electron app. That was the correlation between elementary and electron as they had the same letters in the fuckin' word. Apparently that's the way we're gonna go there. But anyways, Discord's an electron app, so that's probably why it sucks so bad. I don't know if it's an electron app on Windows though. I'm not sure if that's true. You gotta remember I haven't used Windows but one time, probably in the last three years. So, yeah, you tried Windows to be fair and honest about your experience with it. I don't care, I'll bitch about it without using it. Just wait. Well, I mean, it's not like it's perfect. It's definitely got problems, but what computer doesn't have problems? Let's be real. We should just not use computers anymore, dude. Dude, there you go. So much happier. Yeah, we should just all get iPhones. We don't have to worry about file systems or audio systems, there we go, right there. We should all just be having an iCloud account and reveling in it, that's what should happen. I still can't believe I have an iCloud. I still can't believe you got bullied into buying iCloud. That's hilarious to me. I have pictures on my phone and in order to back them up, you either back them up to Kukul or you back them up to Apple and the stupid fucking thing is I pay both of them. So... But because I have so much email in my Gmail inbox that I went over the 15 gigabytes that they gave me for free, so I had to buy the more space. God, just delete your emails. No. Like I have receipts for things like the, I mean, I don't know, I have probably like 30 or 40,000 emails all saved, and the funny thing is I actually had them all downloaded to my computer now because I use Neomut, so. Okay, but let's talk about this. So the receipt for the game that you purchased on Steam, when are you going to need that? I don't know, but I kept it. You never know. But that's my point, like. Hey, you know what? They're all in really nice organized folders, so I know where everything is at, but I do have a lot of stuff. So it's like having a very organized hoarder, you know? Yeah. And that's my point, like you're hoarding emails. But I'm a digital hoarder, like I keep everything, like you should see like every single graphic that I make, like for the channel and for the blog that I ran years ago, like probably. All right, so when I first started podcasting, it was, I had aspirations, like I remember I was in college, so I was like, I had dreams back then. It was before we realized that your dreams never gonna come true. So, like it was like back then before student loan debt beside was crippling, like it was all that stuff was in the future. And it was, it was a hoon of a ton of times if you know what I mean. Anyways, I had a dream of running my own tech blog because everybody who was into technology wanted to start their own tech blog. So I did. And that's how I got into podcasting because I was promoting my stupid fucking, I started off as, I mean, seriously, I was just as bad at naming things back then as I am now. So I came up with a stupid name, which I'm not even gonna repeat. And somebody actually read that stuff and that was Ricky and we became friends and started our own technology podcast which we did every week. And he and I and then Vince came in like a half a year later, we've been podcasting ever since. And I don't know how I started off onto this conversation. Because you have all of that stuff saved. Oh yeah, that's where it came from. Like I have all that stuff saved. So like, we went through like four or five or six different tech blogs because I haven't done it with this, like this podcast, but I loved changing the name of that podcast. Like we started off as T3KD weekly and then we just changed it to T3KD and then it was the Untitled show and then it was not safe for work. And then it was the three cast and then we went back to something else and then we finished, I changed the name a lot. Please tell me, you didn't spend a minute wondering why not a lot of people watched it. The Untitled show, how is someone gonna find that in Google? I thought it was a fantastic name. It didn't last but three episodes, okay, man. It was all right. It's a three cast now. We stuck, I've been with that now for six years. I haven't changed that name, I've been good. But the point is every single time we made a tech, like a blog to go along with the podcast, we've had like dozens and dozens of posts and so I guess. So I saved all that, those pictures. So I have all those pictures on an external hard drive. It's like 70 or 80 gigabytes of that stuff. Like I have pictures of like when Steve Jobs died, I have his like, a picture of the website for the cake. It's hilarious, like I'm a horror. It's okay to let go. It's okay to let go. Is that awkward laugh? No, it's not. I'm keeping all that in it. It's, someday you never know, I might need a picture and it won't be on Google. It won't be going Google images or something. See, here's what's gonna happen. It's like in like 25, 35 years, like your kids are gonna start going through your hard drives and they're gonna be like, like it's gonna be one of those things where they don't just judge you. They go, why? Why? They're finding all of these old podcasters and they're like, oh, we have to go through all of this. Like I'm going to stop you right there because God forbid that I ever reproduce. Those poor, poor little children in the future, like they have much bigger problems than going through my hard drive with all of my technology pictures and shit. Thank you pretty much, I agree. If I got kids, I got bigger problems than going through my shit. Tyler, we have been recording now for 16 minutes. You haven't even gotten to what you've done this week in Linux. The hilarious thing is it was supposed to be next week where we didn't have a topic where we're just gonna bullshit for an hour. That's gonna be this podcast here. All right, I need to get started. I need to get going. All right, so what I've done this week in Linux, good Lord man, I can't take any breath, it's gonna be all right, you can come up with words. So for all of you guys that don't know, I write words for a living. You wouldn't know it from the way I talk because I can't talk or the damn. But I write words for, I edit a historical magazine and I still do quite a few writing articles and stuff for it as well. So I write between probably 30 and 70,000 words a week. It's a lot and there's a reason why I hated that keyboard with blues, Tyler, because the actuation force on it was so heavy, writing that many words, it just hurt my fingers. I didn't have- Yeah, it made you feel strong. Yeah. Well, no, it didn't make- Oh, oh, oh, oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. No, no, it made me feel weak is what it did. So if I'd stuck with it, I'm sure I would have built up the muscles, but I'm so used to using Reds, which have a much lower actuation force. But anyways, so I mean, I write a lot, but most of that work has always been either Google Docs, which is the company that I work for uses Google Docs extensively. Just shoot me now. Can't stand Google Docs are so bad. So when I, about maybe two years ago or so, I got into just writing everything in LibreOffice and literally copying and pasting it over into Google Docs once I was done. And so about a week ago, maybe five days ago or so, I decided if I'm gonna go through the trouble of just copying and pasting or uploading or whatever I've been doing, I'm gonna, and I don't like LibreOffice either. Like I don't really care for it at all. It's better than Google Docs, but it's not very good. It's still bloated as fuck. What I decided I was gonna do is just write everything in Vim in Markdown. Because I learned Markdown in college. And I decided I was going to go through and do that. And man, it has been so much fun. It's made my writing so much more entertaining because I love Vim so much. And it's just like, maybe it's just because it strokes my nerd, you know, gland or something. It just makes me feel like, you know. That nerd gland. Yeah, I'm sure I have one. I'm gonna pass that on to my children too, hopefully. Sounds like you're talking like a reptile portion of your brain. Yeah, it's definitely something part of my brain. I don't know what it's gonna be. But anyways, I've been having so much fun doing that. And yeah, and then I've been just been, you'll see later when I do my pick of the week, but there's some Vim plugins that really do a lot of good stuff for Markdown stuff. So yeah, that's been a lot of fun. Whether or not it will continue, once I get used to it, probably won't, probably won't still be having a stupid smile on my face every time I'm sitting there writing, but for the first time in a long time, I've actually been having a good time writing again. So that's just because of Vim. Oh, that's good. Yeah, so yeah. Especially since that's what you do for a job, if you enjoy what you're doing for a job. Okay, so there's a reason why I took the editor's job. Like I moved away because I used to be a writer full time and then I was writing probably closer to a hundred thousand words a week. And granted, a lot of that was rewriting and stuff like that because you always, you know, you send in a first draft, it goes to editor, they go through and do their Markdown and shit on it and they send it back to you and you gotta rewrite it. So I decided to take that job because I got sick of them telling me what to do, but also because I was just kind of sick of writing the same listicle over and over again because there's only so many times you can write top 10 generals that played a part in the Civil War, you know, like because you have to deal with fucking Google SEO and all that shit. So I was just kind of sick of that. So it's kind of, it's been kind of nice doing the editing portion of that. And it's also nice that I can kind of mix them together because variety is the spice of life. I mean, Vim is better. Like let's just be real, Vim is the best. Vim is so good. Fools that use Emacs, I don't know what's wrong with you. I'm so sorry. I'm just kidding, man. I'm just kidding, I just wanna, I just. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not, Emacs is bad. I'll just say it, Emacs is not a text editor. The Troll, the Troll Gland, which is right next to the Nerd Gland decided to toss that out there. God, this is war. I just, I just take too much enjoyment out of calling Emacs not a text editor because it just really gets people started. It's a game engine, obviously. This is what it is, it's a game engine. If you come with games pre-installed, you can't call yourself a text editor. Sorry. All right. Anyways, now that we've pissed off an entire portion of our community, we should just move on now, shall we? If you wanna get in contact with us, you can do so at The Linux Cast on Twitter. You can subscribe to all of our audio news feeds and stuff like that at thelinuxcast.org. You can contact us via email at email at thelinuxcast.org. You can support us on Patreon at patreon.com slash linuxcast. I will do the call out for all of our patrons at the end of the show. And I did remember to get the Patreon seen up in OBS this time. It only took three fucking weeks. You can subscribe to Tyler, who is on both Odyssey and YouTube and various things. Now, Tyler, you've went over 1,000 subscribers now. Have you set up a vanity URL so that I can actually read out your URL yet? Not yet, no. You need to do that. Seriously, man, what's wrong with you? Actually, I think I already have one. It should be slash C slash capital Z, Zany OG with a capital O and a capital G. Well, we're going to find out right now. YouTube.com slash Z, A and Y. Well, it's slash C for channel and then slash Zany. Yeah, you don't actually have to have the C. Oh, okay. And yeah, that actually works. So you can follow Zany at YouTube.com slash Zany OG. That's awesome. I'll make sure I put that. Because that way we can get rid of one of those bitly things there in the thing. I should definitely subscribe to him. All of his stuff is awesome. You've been doing a lot of gaming stuff lately, so that's good if you're into gaming, because you'll never see gaming shit on my channel. High cardly ever. Anyways, you can also subscribe to thelinuxcast at youtube.com slash linuxcast, and we're getting very close, very close, my friends, to 7,000 subscribers. Wee! Like, I don't even know. I mean, thanks everybody, seriously. I don't, like every subscriber I get, I'm like, I wanna meet this person. Like, why are you subscribing, man? There's like, MrBeast is right over there. I'm not gonna give you any money. I can't give you, I have no money to give away. Why are you subscribing? But anyways, thank you for subscribing. Did you watch that MrBeast, what was it, the Squid Game? Squid Game, no. You should watch it, it's actually pretty cool. I had no, I had no clue what Squid Game actually was, but I watched it and it was cool. Then I had to look it up, I was like, it's like a Netflix thing. It was like a live anime or something. Like, you're reminding a lot of anime because of the subtitles, right? Well, it's, yeah, it's a Japanese TV show, and it's literally been made for pretty much every single country in every single language, like almost every major language. It's been translated into. We'll give you money, but only one person gets money. We're gonna kill the rest of you and all of you, and we just decided you're gonna stay here. Dude, it's a really good show. It's a fantastic show. But with that being said, MrBeast on the other hand doesn't have any Linux content, which is very unfortunate, you know? Can you, I mean, like we have Mudahar, he's like the king of promoting Linux, kind of, because he has like two million, three million subscribers now. If we could get one, like 10 million subscribers that actually know how to use Linux, because obviously Linus Tech Tips does not know how to use Linux. I was like, click on the fucking font and click on the font. Yeah, or poor, poor Luke, just thinking the font's name is literally a font. Yes, obviously trolling something. Buddy, I understand, it was bad, okay? We get it, we get it, buddy. All right, so go a second in the chest is, wait, there's no money? There's no money? Sorry, man. I spent it all on the keyboard, I'm sorry. I was told there would be a... Yes, he hasn't started stealing from his family yet to feed his keyboard addiction, okay? Soon, though. But that's not too far off, so he definitely doesn't have money to give away. Like I'm gonna be living homeless in a box, but I'll have the keyboard. He'll have the finest keyboard around. Yeah, it's gonna be great. I'm gonna keep me warm at night, it's all right. Just people are walking by a cardboard box and all they hear is just a thawky keyboard just going and just like tears. And it's just you sad, like crying, which you're just tapping on your nice keyboard. Like Homer Simpson. Oh. Workspace two, workspace three, workspace four. I'm just, I'm just imagining someone walking by and seeing you like talking to yourself as you're setting up like key bindings when the keyboard's not hooked up to a key, like to an actual computer at all. I don't have the keyboard I had to sell it. I can't, I don't have the computer anymore cause I had to sell it to get a new keyboard. You were like, but it was so worth it though. Oh, but did you hear the thawk man? Did you hear the thawk? All right. Remix wants to know what's so funny, you're gonna have to rewind because we can't, we can't recreate that. All right. Every single week, Tyler and I scour the internet and oftentimes we come up with news articles that are actually thought provoking and discussion enticing this week. Well, we'll see. Yeah, we'll see. It's given that I read mine like five minutes before we started recording. That's true story. Anyways, so the first one, Tyler, why don't you tell us what your news link of the week is? So mine is, so there is Zorn OS 16 Lite. I didn't know that this was like, I didn't know that Zorn OS had a lite variant of it. I don't know how long they've had it or what I just, I didn't know this existed, but apparently what it is is. It's the free version. Oh, I didn't, they still do the paid thing. I thought they stopped that a long time ago. No, they still do the paid thing, yeah. Had no idea. Well, okay. Well, the free edition is kind of nice because it's XFC, so it's pretty lightweight and fast. And if you're looking at the article here, Zorn OS has made XFC look really nice. I mean, really nice. I also took GNOME, it made it really nice too. So they have another free version. It's just like just regular Zorn OS, I think. And then they have Zorn Pro, which is the paid version. But the one that is, I believe it's GNOME anyways, is really good looking too. Yeah. I'm very much like their look. So yeah, if you're into XFC, consider giving Zorn OS a look. Are you, is Zorn OS, like you're gonna be your next distro? Highly doubt it, highly doubt it. So it looks good, but it looks good for other people. Well, I'm not huge on XFC. I've never had a problem with it. I've just never been very attracted to it. It, this does make XFC look very good. However, I don't need to be burning out my eyeballs with even more white. They have a dark mode. That's, yeah, but. Even in XFC, they have a dark mode. It looks really good. Fine, you know what? I'll give Zorn OS 16 light a try. Okay, fine, I'll give it a try. The funny thing is I don't even like Zorn OS. I made you try it. I get it, I don't care. I don't care for them the way they sell their stuff, but wrong, wrong way. You know, so I might try it out and then become a shill for them. You should definitely. Then you might not like me either. No, that's not true. I don't always like you Tyler. That's so untrue. I come in here with Windows and all the friendship, all of the respect is all lost. No, no, no, no. I said I like you. I didn't ever say that and respected you. I mean, there's two different things. So good. If we did name titles for that, it was like, I like you, but I don't respect you. That's so good. All right. It just warms my heart to know that I can make these jokes and not make you, like anybody else would be just pissed off, right? Like, well, fuck you then, man. Well, fuck you very much, you know? Tyler knows I'm joking. And I don't think we ever, I don't think we've ever had a miscommunication where we thought the other one was ever talking about about the other. I don't think that's ever happened. Other than there have been times where I've, you know, completely neglected you. And that's kind of a problem. Well, I mean, you have a zero AD of it. That's a good point. At least your zero AD addiction is cheaper than my keyboard addiction. Of course. Of course, you're, we're talking about addictions, of course that has to come off. Of course it does. I do very much like zero AD. I mean, there are worse addictions, I suppose. All right, so my news of the week is that GameBuntu is a thing. First of all, great name, GameBuntu, good name. But anyways, it is basically a tool that you can install. I'm assuming it's probably a Buntu specific given that it's using app and stuff. But it will go through and install pretty much everything you'll need to be a game streamer. So it'll install Steam, it'll install OBS, it'll install Lutris, PulseFX, Wine, and the Hero game launcher. The only thing I wish you would install would be like Proton and GE. Like I wish you'd install Proton GE because installing Proton GE is, I mean, it's easy but it doesn't use a package manager. It uses, you know, you don't want to get and build it. And the Wine dependency hell thing is what gets a lot of people. Yeah, so if it, A lot of people don't follow that. If it did that, it also goes through and it switches the Linux kernel to the real-time Xanmod kernel which I've absolutely never heard of before. Like I've heard of Xanmod. I've heard of it. I've never actually read about it, heard anyone talk about it. Like, I've heard it in like passing but never heard anyone say anything good about it. Yeah, I'd never heard of it before. So I mean, that's gonna be something that, I mean, messing with somebody's kernel from an application sounds a little sketchy to me. Like I wish it was optional. But maybe it is optional. I don't know. I don't know. But also go through and update all your graphics drivers. It will install the noise torch, real-time microphone noise cancellation noise suppression app and will enable click to minimize and, you know, and also installs VLC and coding media center and mango HUD all with one click. So if you're a gamer and you don't mind the messing around with your kernel, this sounds like a, actually a pretty good thing. Now it's a lot of things that it's, looks like it's gonna scare some people away cause it does open the terminal like in the background. But you don't actually have to interact with it. But it sounds really cool. Definitely if you're using Ubuntu and don't want to have to go through and install each one of these things, you know, piece by piece, it sounds like a really good option. And it's also, it's also available as an app image and snaps. So when, I guess. The app image, not the snap part. Right. I guess. All right. We don't, we worry, talk about that. We don't need to get into it anymore. All right. So for those of you who are watching live, you probably looked at the title and said, well, what's the main topic for this podcast? And the main topic is should distros charge for Linux? And we didn't use that as the main title cause every time we use anything regarding paying for Linux in the title, it just absolutely flops. So we were cheating. We're big lying cheaters who cheat. But what can you do? So the main topic is, well, I mean, technically it was, I don't remember how you phrased it. I rephrased it for you. Well, the way that I wrote it was, should you pay for Linux? So they're basically the same thing, right? Yeah. So should distros charge you when you, Nana was a snap. Crazy chicken. Why you must you be so crazy? Like, so I seriously, why don't you and Dylan just go over there and have your good times together? It's our, both use your nanos and control X to get out of it, you know, right? Gross. Anyways, so Tyler, take it away. Would you? Yeah. So when it comes to paying for Linux, I feel like you shouldn't necessarily be charged up front out of the gate. I guarantee like, you know, 10 bucks gets you this Linux distro. However, I feel like you should at almost at every level for every Linux distro monetize it in some way other than donations. Like, whether you're making, maybe, but I feel like a better way of doing it would probably be that there is software, like first party software made by your distribution that integrates and does a lot with the distribution. It, you know, it sells itself, makes some piece of software and sell it where it integrates into the system very well. Of course, people would go around that and get it for free, but the kind of advantage there is at least you have a selling point for support. Like paying for support is, it's kind of irrelevant on most Linux distributions. Like the Zorn OS pro, like I don't know why in the fuck I'd pay for that. Like why? Like what, what support are you gonna give me that the community won't? Like calling and calling and messaging someone at Zorn OS is the same fucking thing as me. Texting or messaging someone on my Discord or Reddit, you know, like it's the same thing. So, I mean, if you're gonna try and make money providing support, the best way of doing that is having your own first party applications that are kind of the method for making it enticing to get support. Cause if you're someone who really loves a Linux distro and like let's just say, for example, MX Linux, if they have two or three first party apps that are really great, you might end up paying the support just to make sure that those three apps always, you can always get direct support on those specific things. That's kind of my view on it. It's kind of how you should make money selling your distro. Instead of selling the distro, sell the support and first party apps that make the distro great. Might just be me there. All right, so I have many thoughts about the monetization. So I don't care for the idea of charging for a distro upfront. Mainly because maybe if that's the way we'd always done it, it would be fine. But the biggest problem with monetizing any piece of software is that everybody uses a different payment processing system. So some people use PayPal, some people use Google, some people use Amazon, some people do it themselves, whatever. And I would give to so many more open source projects if their payment processing system was good. Like I tried to give money to Xmonad. When DT did his video saying that Xmonad was needing money for support, I was like, what are you going on? I have $10, I'll give them $10. But I couldn't give them $10 because it wouldn't go through. And I've experienced that audio is bad for Matt. I hate to tell you this, but- You sound fine to me. That's because it's coming from your end, bro. There's like a, somebody running a dryer in the background or something. Sure. Anyways, yeah, it's not me. And the reason I know that is because the OBS meters go, stop now. I don't know, we all know. Audio sucks on Linux. I mean, seriously. But anyways, where was I? Yeah. Okay, apparently everyone's saying that there's a lot of noise on your side. Yeah, it only comes though when you're talking. Oh, yeah, no, that's because my laptop is not compiling a kernel, but yes, it is essentially taking off right now. So it's the fan that we're hearing. Okay, it's the fan, guys. It's all right. There's nothing we can do about it. I can only cut it out in post. We'll get rid of it later. Anyways, I have no clue what I was talking about now. I totally lost my tears. I am so sorry. Thank you, chat. Appreciate it. Good job, guys. Don't blame the chat. I mean, so you were talking about paying in Linux and... Oh, processing. I give to so many more FOSS projects if there was a single place to do so. Like every single FOSS project should have Patreon. Like seriously, every single one. And I'd give to so many more. Like I'd give to OBS. Like it's only $2 a month, but I give them $2 a month. There's a new YouTube channel that I've been watching called BuzzFeeds, eBuzz Central, Buzz Central, something. It's a Linux guy, about 2,000 subscribers. I tossed him five bucks a month. I did Linux Scoop five bucks for a couple months, because they're on Patreon. And guess what? Patreon's frilly freaking easy. I just go through there and subscribe. It has, they have my credit card. So if you are a FOSS offer, use PayPal, or not PayPal, but Patreon, I'm there. And maybe that's just me, but I think that a lot of people are like that. If you use a service that a lot of people use and make it easy, they'll give it. The problem becomes, I don't like the feeling of saying, like Elementorius does this, like they say, here are the monetary donations, and you have to manually fill in zero. It makes you feel like they're guilting me. You know, like I feel guilty changing that to zero. And I think that that's their point. Like, really, you can't give like a couple of dollars for this. Thanks a lot. You cheap bastard. You know, it's like, there's somebody back there. Well, I understand that mindset, but also at the same time, which we even notice that you weren't giving them money if you didn't manually have to change it to zero. There's something about FOSS stuff that makes me want all of the money that I give to be completely voluntary. And maybe that's the wrong way to look at it. Well, yeah. Cause I mean, like think about it like this. You love DWM. The only reason you even consider giving Suckless any money is because of your experience with trying, of being reminded to go and give X-Monad some support. Yeah. Like you, I mean, you wouldn't even think about it. Well, until today, I didn't even know Suckless had a donation page. Like I didn't even know. Exactly. Yeah. So no one's going to go out of their way to check. So pretty much the only way that you can get someone to even notice the fact that like, hey, you can support this. Like it's an option, you know, is to sadly make them feel like shit. Like because they have to manually enter it in. Yeah. We know the sounds is bad. It's he can't, I mean, he could start blowing on his, his laptop and see if it'll cool down, but I don't think that's going to work. I've lifted it up. And so hopefully the fans, fans will spin down here in a second, hopefully. We'll work on it. Sorry. It's going to be good. He'll, he'll get like an actual cooler attached to the bottom of it or something. Matt, give your keyboard. No, he can't have my keyboard. My keyboard doesn't have a fan in it. Okay. It's not making any sounds. Not yet. The new one will. I was watching somebody on YouTube. They built a mechanical keyboard. They took a, like a key crown keyboard. And then they three 3D printed something underneath it and put in one of those Intel nooks right underneath it. Oh, like, dude, I want that so much. I mean, granted, it puts you, it was like two inch, two or three inches thick. So your keyboard would be quite a bit higher than normal. So you'd have to have wrist rest. But man, that just sounds so. But then you look, man, it would only cost you like four or five hundred dollars. Just just go ahead and do it. It's nothing in the world of keyboards. Pocket change, brother. Pocket change. I totally got an off track again. I'm playing the chat. Definitely playing the chat. This is the problem with doing things live. You always get distracted with whatever they're talking in the chat. It wasn't the chat's fault. It was all my fault. But anyways, the, I don't know. We've talked about monetizing, you know, and there just doesn't seem to be a good solution because you can't just say, you just can't outright, you can't just outright charge for things and not expect to lose a good portion of your audience because a lot of people just won't pay for software these days. But I think that the thing is, so let's just take the elementary app center and let's just assume it was good and had a lot of software in it. That's a big assumption and it's not a true assumption, but let's just go there. And let's just say, because what I'm trying to come up with is a correlation between them and the Apple App Store. People buy stuff off the Apple App Store all the time, but you wanna know why they buy stuff off the Apple, the iPhone App Store is because it's easy. Like it's literally, I go in there, I find an application, I wanna see that it's, oh, it's 99 cents. I double clicked home button, I bought it. They have my credit card information. I trust Apple not to lose my credit card information. Maybe I shouldn't, but whatever. I trust them more than I trust a small Linux distribution, no matter how trustworthy the small Linux distribution is. That's why I keep coming back to, you have to don't charge up front, but make it easy and still like, if you're right in the DWM thing, I wouldn't have even thought to check on it if we hadn't been talking about it today. But that's because it's not in my face. So they need to have some way, like a mailing list or a button on the front of their website or something. Yeah, but a mailing list is not in your face. No, but it's more in your face than what it'd be right now. You'd still reach more people than hiding nine links down on your website is what I'm saying. Put a big, gigantic donation. Wikipedia does this all the time, whenever they're on like a funding drive or whatever, they have a big pop-up on the front of their, on every single article that says, hey, we need money, you know, do something. Or just like, you know, the place on the website where you know people are gonna go, like I don't know, like the get clone link for DWM, put it there. Yeah. Kind of makes sense. And like I said, that's one part of it. But also you have to make it easy. Like someone was making fun of it. You spent $400 on a keyboard, but you won't give money to the DWM. Well, that first of all, that's not true. Like I would give money to DWM, but it has to be easy. You know what I mean? It's like I'm a busy guy. I'm too busy hugging my keyboards in order to do this. So if you're gonna get me to do this, it has to be something that is easy. That's why Patreon is so good because literally when I find someone I wanna support, if they're on Patreon, I go to Patreon, I select the level I wanna support them. Like Zany, I give him money every week or every month, you know? It's much appreciated. I think I was your first patron, man. I think I should. You were? So, Tyler's like, thanks a lot for your four measly dollars a month, man. Hey, it's the first four dollars I got. It means a lot. As you should, like only like 20% of it goes back to Patreon, but the point is, is that when I see that, it's easy. And I keep coming back to that. It has to be easy. It can't, and PayPal, everybody's like mentioned, well, PayPal's easy. PayPal's not easy for everyone. First of all, not everyone has PayPal. Second of all, you have to, granted, it's the same thing that everyone has Patreon. So that's the biggest problem. What service do you use to make it easy for everyone? As many as you can. Like, so hold on. So here's kind of the stupid idea. So I am trying to make videos. I spend an egregious amount of time. I've spent time talking with the people around me about this. I spend an exorbitant amount of time live streaming, making videos, creating thumbnails, doing all this stuff. It makes no sense for me to feel like any, the whole point of trying to support yourself. If you spend a large portion of your time doing something like making a Linux distro, running a FOS project, whatever, the whole goal should be able to support yourself while you spend most of your time working on that thing. The whole idea of I need to pick one thing and that's where everyone's gonna find me, that's a self-defeating mindset. You have to spread your eggs out over multiple baskets. So any project should be doing Patreon, should be accepting PayPal, should be accepting Payoneer or Stripe, whatever. You should have as many revenue streams as possible coming into your project or whatever you're doing for your time. You should have as many revenue streams as possible. And I think that's a big problem. I don't know, I think that's the biggest problem that kind of is being highlighted. We don't really need a different method of charging people for stuff. We just need projects to actually try to make money. That's really what it is. You can't be a FOS project and have your only method of being donated to be GitHub payments. Because you wanna know what? Yeah. Very few people have their credit cards attached to GitHub. And that, so you're not gonna give very many people, you're exactly right. It has to be multiple things. And yes. The only reason I'm making money off of YouTube, I haven't made a damn thing off of YouTube ads yet. Now that I've just hit 1,000 subscribers, that's a possibility. But I've started, I've made us merch. I'm doing Patreon. I've got a Libra Pay, although I don't think anyone really uses it. People can donate crypto to me. I also do Odyssey. So I've got multiple different revenue streams and that's the only reason I've ever made any money off of all the time that I spend doing this. You mentioned your Libra Pay. I've had it for several months and not a single, I don't think everybody's ever clicked on it. I don't even know if it's set up right. Like nobody's ever, like I'm assuming it. The one person I've ever tried to donate through Libra Pay too, didn't have it set up. So like I never ended up even giving them money. Which was kind of sad. Like I have a link and I think I set it up right, but nobody's ever tested it, so I have no clue. Then Patreon just seems a little bit easier so that seems to draw the people. Surprisingly enough, I thought that when I managed to enable the YouTube subscribe join button thing that you get after like a certain amount of subscribers, I thought that would be more popular, but it really hasn't. I just figured, well I mean everybody has, a lot of people have given Google their credit card. So I figured that people would just hit the join button because it's just a couple clicks, but it hasn't, Patreon's still much more popular. But again, it's all, like you have all those things. Like the only thing I don't do is the crypto thing because I'm not smart enough to do crypto. So. It's a hassle. It's really not that you're not smart enough. It's a hassle. You've got to learn a lot. Yeah. And that's. I'm sure that I'm losing out my ability to become a Bitcoin billionaire by not doing that, but I always feel. I mean, you're on Odyssey. So you have a ton of cryptocurrency. You're not exchanging it or doing anything with it. Like you say that, but I actually only, like in the last three weeks got added to their view, their coin per, their LBC per view or whatever, where you actually get paid for every view. I only just got added that because they didn't do it for me automatically. I just assumed that I was, I needed a certain level. Apparently I was supposed to be getting it all along, but apparently I had emailed them to get them to enable that for me. So I have like 800. Well, I ain't that bad. I mean, if you took your, like the way it works on Odyssey, it's weird. You got to take your tips and then put it like on supporting your channel. And then all of your videos will instantly start doing better on the platform. Oh yeah. Everything I just, like seriously, it's worth like four cents. No. So I mean, I'm not ever going to take that. Again, maybe if that thing goes to the moon, you know, I will take, if that goes to a hundred dollars a coin, I'll, sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, man. I'm gonna give all that stuff out. But I don't think that that's ever gonna have. Anyways, that was beside the point. We should do an episode on cryptocurrency. That could be fun. That'll be a topic for next year. Anyways, I think, do we have anything else to say on this topic, Tyler? I don't really know. I mean, really in all honesty, just, actually. We need Linux projects to just start trying to make money. Yeah, I think that they would be surprised if they opened up their options for like, if this, if suckless had a Patreon account, I'd support them through Patreon for sure. I don't think, I don't know whether or not I'd do it through PayPal because PayPal never works for me. Like I have a PayPal account, but I think it's frozen for some reason. And the stupid thing about Patreon, or not Patreon, but PayPal, is you can't like chat with them through a chat client or whatever. You have to call them like it's like the 1930s or something like that. And for me, it's just literally not worth it. Like, because, especially when they haven't given me a reason, like, am I under some kind of federal investigation and the only account they froze was PayPal? I mean, did they freeze my account? And it's almost like they have an app where they could send you a notification and tell you what's going on. They could literally put, you know, like account status, all it says was account status frozen. Like, okay, why? It's dumb. Like, it's fine. Obviously, it doesn't matter. But anyways, if they had other options, I would definitely, but I want to talk about this before we move on just a little bit. The question is, should you feel guilty for not supporting the software that you use? What do you think? Depends. I think it genuinely depends on where you are. If you've been using it for five years and you've got the money to give on them or give to them, yes, you should feel guilty for not. Although if you're just someone learning, you know, you're not in a career or anything like that and you just need software, then no, I don't think you should feel guilty for it. I mean, like genuinely, I think the real question is, is do you have the money to give them? Like, that's when you, if you've got the money to give them, and you've been using them for a long time, yeah, like the guilt that you're feeling is kind of warranted. But I mean, if you can't afford to pay them, why would you feel guilty about not paying them? They don't ask for, I mean, they're not demanding money. They're giving it to you. The whole point is that if you can't pay for it, you can still use it. So yeah, like you shouldn't feel guilty. The way I've been doing it is rotating because there's no way I could afford to, I mean, I could cut down the keyboard, I understand. That's not an option, I understand. It's a addiction for a reason, man, all right? The way I've been doing it is rotating through like developers and creators and stuff that I want to support. So like one month I'll support ARCO and then the next month I'll support another project. So my level of commitment is always around 50 bucks a month, but different projects, I kind of spread it around a little bit. I've been trying to do it. I don't always succeed and I'm much more likely to maintain like a donation if it's a subscription service or a service I trust, like Patreon. I know that keeps coming on. By the way, patreon.com slash Linuxcast, patreon.com slash what, Zany, the official Zany? AKA Zany. AKA Zany. You really need to be consistent on your URLs. I know, I know. Well, the thing is, is like when you choose a name like Zany. Right, yeah. A lot of those links are taken. Yes, indeed. Anyways, so if you don't want to support real developers and real open source projects, you can definitely throw money our way. Well, I mean, Matt also does have some dope merch. He should be providing the link in the description as well. I believe it is. I actually haven't even checked. I believe it is in the live description. I believe it is. I must verify. Yeah, if it's not, I'm gonna feel. Yes, it is. It is. Good, good. Oh, so I have a relief. Anyways, that is it for the main topic. Let's go ahead and move on to the apps of the week or as we should probably start calling them the thingies of the week. Although they are actually apps or things this week. They are things. Anyways, Tyler, your thingie of the week. Mine is EasyFX, which is a great little gooey application for like messing with pipe wire and pipe wire applications. So you have like, it comes with, if you read the about, it's got a limiter, compressor, convolver, equalizer and auto volume and a ton of other plugins for messing around with pipe wire and your audio on your system. So if you're someone who likes messing around with audio, you need something to manipulate your audio and you like, you know, gooey applications. This is definitely a great project to go and check out. And it's also, like some people would consider this a plus but it's not written in, you know, Python or Rust or any of those controversial languages. I love, I saw a post just commenting about that. Like just, they were talking about a program and they just mentioned the fact that it's not made in Python and Rust and all of these controversial languages. And I was like, oh my God, it's just a program. It works, it does what it's supposed to do. That's all that matters. I don't care what it's written in. This looks cool. Now this is like a rewrite of the pulse effects, right? But for pipe wire? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay, that's cool. I'm not gonna use pipe wire just to go try this out. Oh, I figured. Wait, you're telling me this is not a selling, like a selling point for you now you use pipe wire? These guys have a libera, a libera pet. Don't, a little bit. The word problem is coming back to that. Like I did a good job in the middle section. I was like, fucked up at the beginning. I did okay in the middle. And now all of a sudden my tongue is both the size of a cow. All right, anyways, I don't care. Anyways, come on. So as I talked about at the beginning, I've been going through and using markdown a lot in Vim last week or so as I've been doing all my writing in Vim. And I needed a good way of previewing that to see how it would look on like a website or whatever. So usually you could use something like Pandoc or you could use something like, maybe LaTeX or something. I've never used that before, so I have no clue. But I wanted to do something that was live, like literally live. And there's a NeoVim plugin called Markdown Preview for NeoVim. And it will actually go through and it opens up in the browser like and you can go through and open up Vim like right next to it and edit your document and it'll literally scroll right along with you as you go through the document in Vim and show your changes live. And it is so cool. I've only just begun to play with it. I only found it yesterday. So, but it looks really good. And it's not abandoned. It's granted it's been about nine months since their last update, but they still have been going through and updating stuff. So a lot of times you come up with, you find a really cool Vim plugin and you're like, wow, that's a really cool Vim plugin. When was the last time it was updated? Oh, 2002, you know. Yeah, cool. You know, so. I saw one that was like 2006 and I'm like, oh, come on, brother. That sounds really cool, but now I can't use it because it probably has security holes the size of the Golden Gate Bridge. Anyways, this is really cool and I'm gonna continue to play with it because I love the idea of having it just live right side by side. It's really cool. There are a lot of like GUI applications like Upsidian or whatever that do this like in a GUI, but this is for them, so. You know, that's really cool. Yeah, like if you just watch the GIF, the GIF or whatever that's on their GitHub page, like watching them do that, like, that's awesome. Yeah, that's the reason why we use Markdown. Anyways, so that is my choice. All the links for everything we talked about today will be in the show notes or the video description depending on where you're watching this. We do record this live every Thursday. Usually we do about 15 minutes of a pre-show where you can usually hear us just, I mean, seriously, half the time we start the show laughing like we did this time because it was just, it's just a lot of fun. So definitely join us live that way you can join the chat which we have a lovely time with. Sometimes we do Q and As with the chat. Sometimes we don't. Like today we're not going to just because it's like, we've already been going for an hour. Surprisingly, we made it to a whole hour which is surprising to me because it just zoomed right on past. It was like a lot of fun. Anyways, coming up next week, it's going to be a little bit of a weird show because this is our last episode of the year. Like seriously, the year's over people. Like, where did this year go? Like, so the thing is we all thought 2020 was really bad and it was really bad. 2021, so much better. You know, yes, we got out a little bit more. Like people went back to work but not everybody went back to work and everybody decided to quit their jobs and now everything costs 12 times more than it did before. And not a great year, but we did 36 episodes of the Linuxcast this year. We'll have one more to go. So we'll end season five on episode 37. And the reason why I talk about this being the last episodes because next week we have no topic. There's literally zero topics for next week. We're not doing news. We're not doing pics of the week. All we're doing is bullshitting for an hour. We're not writing anything down. So this is going to be like Tyler's podcast before he started writing stuff down. It's going to be full of tangents. It's going to be great. It's not going to be full of tangent, man. It is going to be a tangent of itself. It's going to be good. So just prepared for that. If you're interested in the whole structured thing that we normally do, that won't be next week. So just prepared for that. I was thinking about doing like a trivia game, but it's way too much work. You know what I mean? It's the last episode. Let's just have fun. It's the last episode of the year. We will talk about Linux. It will probably start off with something Linuxy, then we'll just go wherever the hell we want to go. So that'll be next week, last episode of the year. After that, we'll be taking two weeks off and we'll come back in early January. So I think other things, thinking patrons, that's all we have to do. Yes, 2021 was a continuation of 2020, that's for sure. Anyways, so before we go, I would like to take a moment to thank my current patrons. And I do have the Patreon slide here, so winning. Like seriously, Matt, it only took you three weeks. Devon, Chris, East Coast Web, Gentoo's, Funtru, Patrikko, Primus, Siddy, Marcus, Meglin, Jackson, I have tools, Steve, a Mitchell Arts Center, and Mateus, Merrick, Camp, Joshua Lee, J-Dog, the BSDs, Rock, Peter Ray, and Crucible, brand new patron, welcome. That is it. Thanks everybody for your support. Thanks everybody who's subscribed to both of our channels. We both really seriously appreciate every single one of you. And for all of you who have, all of you have joined us live today and listened to this utter nonsense. Thank you. We'll see you next week. See ya.