 broadcast here on I-24 News Day 52 of the War Day 4 of the ceasefire and fear that Hamas will sabotage the release of the fourth group of hostages. Israeli officials confirmed the list for today's pending release been received, but that there are some issues with it. First and foremost, another potential violation of the agreement that families will not be torn apart, as in mothers to be freed with their children. But our mediators say they are in the loop trying to smooth over the disagreements and avoid delays. Egyptian sources are saying we're nearing that point. Today's dynamic, however, will have a direct impact on a possible extension of the ceasefire and extension Hamas already declared. It really wants. So how many spoons of sugar could Israel take to make the bitter Hamas medicine go down before we unpack it all, all the strategy, all the maneuvers, all the interest It all comes down to human lives. 84-year-old Alma Avraham was released yesterday and immediately airlifted for emergency treatment at the Soroka Hospital in critical condition. This hour, she is still in a life-threatening state serious danger to her life and her daughter is saying if it was another hour or two, Alma would have died in captivity. My mother did not deserve to come back like this. She was severely medically neglected. This was neglected during the entire period of her stay there. She didn't get her meds, life-saving meds. For those who don't understand medically, my mother was on the brink of death when she came to us. The doctors cannot report this, but I can report on behalf of my mother. She arrived at a pulse of 40 with a body temperature of 28 degrees, unconscious, all wounded. She was kept there in unfair conditions. She was abandoned twice. She was abandoned once on October 7th and abandoned a second time by all the organizations that should have saved her and prevented her situation. And these are exactly the instances where the Red Cross would have come into play visiting the hostages, making sure that they're OK as much as a person can be OK while in captivity by terrorists, obviously not the case. Well, we want now to take a deep breath and show you the flip side of it, those moving images that the Schneider Children's Medical Center is releasing this hour, that perhaps explain everything, moving photos from the reunification of the Broadage family after over 50 days, 40-year-old mother Hagar released yesterday from captivity along with her three children, 10-year-old Afri, 9-year-old Yuval, 4-year-old Uriah. This is their first meeting with their father, Avichai, too many more, too many, many more. And we want to turn now live to our 24 news correspondent, Nicole Tzedek, at what is still tragically known as the Hostages Square in Tel Aviv. And Nicole, today is the last day of deal proper, let's call it that way. And yet, without even talking about yes extension, no extensions, there are some issues in today's list of hostages. And when we say issues, we mean something that might risk the deal altogether. What do we know? We know not too much information at this point, Ali, but the Israeli Prime Minister's office did release a statement stating that there are still negotiations when it comes to the list of the hostages that are supposed to be released today, in just hours from now, in fact. And if that list does include about 11 people, which is how many are left after this four days, after the three days so far, we've seen 39 Israeli citizens released so far. And so in terms of this proper deal, as you're calling, where we're going to see 50 Israeli hostages released in four days, that would mean 11 are left. But Ali, I have to tell you, even though we've seen a total of 58 hostages released because we have seen some additional four nationals released due to some other negotiations, in addition to this deal, there's still more than 180 hostages held captive in Gaza at this very moment. And that includes 18 children. So if we see possibly 11 captives returned to Israel today, a handful of them are still going to be children held captive in Gaza. And so when we talk about the emotions and you see some of those families reuniting with their loved ones, it absolutely tugs at your heartstrings. But it also acts as a reminder that as we've seen 58 reunions so far, the families here, the citizens of Israel, everyone who's coming here to Hostages Square, they want to see 240 of those videos. And so just saying a few, it definitely gives a glimmer of hope. But when we're talking about possible hiccups in this negotiation deal, we also have to add, it's not surprising. We continue to see these types of hiccups because you have, on the one hand, a democratic government of Israel negotiating for their innocent civilians, and on the other hand, you have Hamas, a terrorist organization who's going to do everything they can to keep these captives and gain an upper hand when it comes to the Israeli negotiations. So hopefully we'll gain a little bit more insight in the coming hours because the Israeli Prime Minister's office says they are looking as to exactly the list and who we can hopefully welcome home today. And as you've just put it, things are black and white. And as you've just put it, this is such a situation. Innocent children, in captivity by a terror organization, simply put. Thank you very much, Nikola, for this, from the Hostage Square. And Tel Aviv, and joining us now here in the studio for this broadcast, Mr. Yaakov Lapin, military and strategic affairs analyst at the Jewish New Syndicate and the Miriam Institute and our very own I-24 New Senior Diplomatic Correspondent Owen Ultiman. Gentlemen, the Prime Minister's office at this minute is releasing the following statement, the negotiations as for the list of the following hostages is still underway. And we are aware of the tension that the families are currently experiencing. We will add information once it will be possible. And of course, asking to refrain from spreading rumors and such. Bottom line, Owen, we are already talking about extension. Well, today's deal is still far from secured. How can you do the two at the same time? Well, I mean, first of all, just to remind ourselves, this is now four o'clock local time, or three o'clock local time in Israel, right? And the hostages, according to the terms and the understandings of the deal is best we understand them. The release process was supposed to start every day at or before four o'clock local time, so within the next hour. So it looks like we are about to be officially behind, again, the passing over and the transferring of the hostages. We've all gotten used to this routine, right? To those Red Cross ambulance vans that are onward to the Rafah crossing the Egyptians and so forth. And what it also means, El, and you're right, in a sense, the negotiations over this list and today's installment of the original four day ceasefire, right? Completing the number of 50 Israeli hostages to be freed, again, the efforts on women and children, all the terms we've become familiar, that the negotiation over this is happening in the sense at the same time, as a negotiation about the extension. And sometimes in negotiations, in a negotiation theory, expanding the problem, right? And expanding the set of issues on the table actually can make things easier to resolve. Now we don't really understand what the argument is over this list and what the nature of the claims are. It seems to be that the two sides aren't necessarily looking at the same text of understandings. To the best of my knowledge, we haven't actually seen a document released to the public with what the agreement is. So of course, part of the differences of opinion may be Hamas essentially trying to renegotiate and extort on the fly and when it stands to reason that that's the case, and it certainly seemed to be the case in day two, when the Qataris and the Egyptians stepped in so heavily as they reportedly did. But there may be not have been a full meeting of the minds about what exactly the terms were, which may be leading to some of the misunderstandings. Too many elements were left to interpretation? Possibly, I mean, again, don't forget, even at the time the deal was announced, there were two different versions and the two different sides about that issue of Red Cross visits that you mentioned, right? The commitment that the United States and Israel say that Hamas made to allow the Red Cross to visit the hostages that weren't going to be released. We talked about it in our studio here, right? Ait Zendangot, discuss this as something Israel could put on the table. I thought it was a terrific idea, and then we heard Benjamin Netanyahu go to the podium, read from what he said was the text of the agreement saying this was the deal, only that Hamas say that it wasn't agreed. And it's obviously a very significant provision. And of course, as you mentioned, Ellie, it is required under international humanitarian law. It is not supposed to be something that Israel needs to negotiate for. It is something that Israel is entitled to without any negotiation. But never mind about all this. Point being, sometimes in negotiation when you enlarge the scope of issues, they become easier to resolve. Maybe, and I'm putting this out as just a question more than an answer. Maybe that will be the case over the coming few hours, that negotiating this list together with an extension could make it more likely for the sides to get to yes. And yet, to get used to this dynamic of a day where things are going on according to the plan, and another day where everything is chaotic, I don't think, I don't think who am I to think at this point in time. And yet, not sustainable. Not if we're looking potentially towards several more days of extension. And actually, it's a good point because the negotiation, the extension could be day to day, right? And if you look at the way the deal that we know about the deal from the decision by the Israeli government, where there are parts of it that are actually published there in black and white, the extension can be negotiated day to day. So we've only been to be negotiating every day over the list and the composition of the list. We'll be negotiating going forward day to day about whether there even is a ceasefire or not. Ambassador, as they say in Arabic, a good day and a bad day. Mr. Lapin, before we get your take, we do want to go back now to the ground as many children and their mothers who were released in recent days are still at the Schneider's Children's Hospital being treated there physically, mentally. The teams of doctors and medical professionals are providing round-the-clock care for them. And I-24 news correspondent, Pirkola Chandler, is right there. Pierre, unfortunately, we opened this broadcast by an alarming update from the daughter of 84-year-old Alma Vam about her life-threatening condition to this hour. But what can we say on the other's physical and mental status? It's very difficult to decipher the mental status of the nine kids that are on the third floor here with two mothers. It's very difficult because they don't talk much. I'll give you a few examples. Avigay Leidan, who marked her fourth birthday on Friday and was-and was reminded by US President Joe Biden. She's an American and she's an Israeli. She saw her parents murdered. She was covered with the blood of her father, Rui, her mother dying, Smadda. She run to the Brodach family next door in Kfar-Aza. And they were all taken captive. The chance in that terrible sorrow is that she was kept with the family and they knew each other. So in a sense, it was a bit easier for Amalia, for Avigay, sorry. And when she came here yesterday at 10.30, imagine a four-year-old girl so small, looking up all these strangers around her. She was frightened. She kept smiling. She's courageous. She kept smiling according to her grandfather. And she asked about Mikhail and Amalia. Mikhail, nine, Amalia six, her brother and sister. They hide in a closet on October 7 for 14 hours before the IDF managed to extract them from the fury of the massacre. And that's what she's asking for. She knows her parents are dead. She doesn't talk about it. And when they asked her yesterday before the shower what she wanted, she said, I want a little bagel and grape juice. What the kid eats at kindergarten. The other kids, Ohad nine, who has already released from captivity two days ago, the medical personnel encouraged the kids to invite their friends. So invited these schoolmates. And they all came yesterday. They shared pizza. They shared Lego games. They played hide and seek in the corridors that are well kept from us. And they spoke. And he shared his experience to them. It's much harder for a kid to share his experience to a stranger with all the good intentions of the psychologists. It's going to be much harder to open up to them than to open up to his friends. And that's what happened. So the medical personnel is really encouraging the kids to invite their friends, their schoolmates, their kindergarten mates. That's all the men and great kids. And give them a sense. Right. And try to give them a sense of friendship, a sense of being taken care of, a sense of normalcy or this abnormal situation. But the problem is not over, of course. They've been malnourished for at least two weeks because there was a shortage of food. They were fed with rice and pita bread. They slept on the floor without mattress or on plastic benches or plastic chairs. They couldn't distinguish between day and night. They had no clue about daylight. All that has to be relearned. And aside of that, they need to be relocated because their homes have been destroyed during the October 7 massacre. So it's a difficult situation, but the parents are brave. The grandparents are brave. And they try and hug them as close as possible, telling them, this will never happen to you again. Yes, you know, Pierre, I'm listening to you. And when we saw the images of three-year-old Yahel two nights ago or four-year-old Abigail yesterday, come back home, your immediate reaction to it is, oh my god, a three-year-old girl is coming back home. And then you're saying, oh my god, a three-year-old girl is coming back home from captivity, incomprehensible. Indeed, a long process ahead. Pierre-Claude Schindler, Head of Schneider's Children's Hospital, thank you very much for this. And before we show you parts of interrogations of Hamas terrorists and first reports now on what is happening behind the scenes, CNN is reporting that despite the understandings, the agreement stipulating that families will not be torn apart as in mothers released with their children. Vice versa, the list of hostages today, to be released today, includes nine children and two elderly women, the US, according to this report in CNN, on CNN. Not know if there are any American citizens in this list. And also, this report is suggesting that Hamas is using the ceasefire to relocate the hostages. And that makes sense, if we're connecting the dots to what Hila, 13-year-old Hila, was released earlier. This week said she was kept with her mother and separated from her right before the release, just because Hamas wanted to keep them apart. All right, before we get back to studio, the interrogations of Hamas terrorists who took part in the October 7 massacre continue shedding more light on Hamas' vicious game plan. This afternoon, more parts of it are cleared for publication take-off. He said, there is a group next to him, he said, take this. He said, what is this? Because he put it in his pocket. He put it in his pocket. He put it in his pocket. And we arrived at the police station. The station was closed. The station was closed. We went inside. We went inside. When we entered, there were two small barricades. The small ones, they had a building. When we entered, they all entered. They entered and there was a barricade. We thought the farmers didn't know what was going on. The barricade and the young man, and the young man from the other barricades that you don't know in the first place, they took one and went inside. A barricade? A barricade, yes, they went inside. There was a barricade. The barricade? Yes, the first one to enter. Who are we? Me, Amad and the young man that I don't know. In addition to the barricade, the barricades. We went back to the city. There was a barricade. Amad stopped, and we went down to the barricade. They were gone. We went down to the barricade. I went up to the barricade, and the other barricades were there. And I went up. And Abu Khaled, and the young man that I don't know, of course, went down to the barricade. We went up to the barricade. The barricade was a barricade? And we went up to the barricade. Abu Khaled asked him what's your name. He didn't understand what he was asking. He replied that he would do this in Thailand. We were both from the same sex group. We didn't know each other. And Abu Khaled was Amad. What's your name? I'm Ismail. I'm from Hawas. Where are you from? I'm from the Zatun tribe. What's your position in the Hamas? I'm from the military. Okay. Tell me, what happened to you? I'm from the suburb of the Zatun tribe. What's your name? I'm from the Zatun tribe. I went to the barricade. I told him I was done. I went with him. Where did you go? I went to the barricade. We went to the barricade. A man came to the barricade. He didn't know where the barricade was. He didn't know where the barricade was. We told him that he was in the suburb of the Zatun tribe. Are you from the Zatun tribe? Yes. Abu Khaled asked him to go to the barricade. The hospital? Yes, the hospital. He was caught by a man who didn't know where the barricade was. He went to the barricade. He took the two men to the barricade. We were standing in the barricade. He had to go to the barricade. There was a man in the barricade. He was alone. Yeah. He was outside. There were two men. Two men inside. And two outside. There were two groups of people who came to pick them up and took the young man with them. We went out to the door of the building, to the west. There was this jeep, and I came out from the right side of the building, and the young man, and the guest, and the young man. Ten minutes later, they came back to Abu Khaled, and they came back to Al Juhah. They put on their masks, but they couldn't see anything. The patient didn't say anything about the mask. I heard that there was a guy in Thailand. Thailand, Thailand, and he closed. They took the young man with the mask. We took him and put him in. The same way as the first one. Without the drama that we've seen two days ago, without the drama that we're seeing today, and yet there was something very abnormal about yesterday's release. These are the pictures of the hostages taken through packed neighborhoods in Gaza City with armed Hamas terrorists, with the crowds cheering, indicating that if the notion was that Hamas lost control in the northern part of the Gaza Strip, it's not the case in all areas there. This was likely in a pocket of eastern Gaza City where the IDF has not taken control of, but most of northern Gaza is under IDF control. The fact that over a million Gazans left that part of northern Gaza in Gaza City is an indication that the Hamas regime is actually, to all intents and purposes, not in existence in that part of Gaza. And I think really what we're seeing here is Hamas trying to desperately buy itself time another 24 hours. It's separating families and committing war crimes to try and build more war crimes, of course, to try and create insurance policies to try and extort Israel for that extra day because what they're really hoping for is the creation of some kind of dynamic that will make this ceasefire long enough for them to start to regroup, to start to think about the survival of their leadership. And I think they're completely delusional if they think that that's what's going to happen. The Israeli War Cabinet and the Defense establishment are utterly united behind the goal of destroying Hamas, resuming the war once every effort is made to get people out. At some point this is going to come to an end if we zoom out and that's when operations will resume and I think we'll see the IDF moving very quickly south to Hanyunis and to other areas of southern Gaza where Hamas survives. But this audacity, really, of releasing those visuals from yesterday, it indicates on a certain level of resilience on Hamas' side. 100%. I mean, they're a very resilient and stubborn enemy that cannot be destroyed in six days. We're not in the six-day war era. This has to go from neighborhood to neighborhood street to street and until the IDF takes full control, they're going to continue to operate in areas where they have yet to be cleansed from. So yes, absolutely. It's very frustrating to see that and it's clearly frustrating for the Israeli people to see that. But really, I think if we zoom out, Hamas is on borrowed time and all of these psychological terrorist efforts that are being made will not ultimately result in what Hamas wants, which is to somehow solidify this truce into the long term so that they can survive. I don't see that happening at all and hopefully Israel will be able to continue to rescue as many hostages as possible, the sanctity of life, the fact that families are being separated is horrible. A re-victimization of these people who have already gone through hell and our hearts have to be with them. But we also have to steal ourselves, I think, for the long run. There's going to be months of high-intensity conflict ahead of us. And especially if now we're talking about the easier, quote-unquote, easier cases of hostages as children, women, elderly women, humanitarian cases when push comes to shove and we're talking about men and soldiers, it will be even more difficult. 100%. The fact that Hamas is keeping men and soldiers as sort of the last card that it wants to keep for the bargaining chip is going to be very difficult on them and their families, their last in line. It's all part of Hamas' sick agenda and it's something that these Israeli people are going to have to prepare themselves to deal with going forward. The more the military operation progresses, the more opportunities there will be. Also, potentially to conduct negotiations with the hostage-old holders once the leadership is destroyed. It may be easier to make them offers directly to them without going through this long circle. And very alarming that the indications that Hamas is not holding all the hostages. Gentlemen, thank you very much. We'll be back at the top of the hour. Israel is in a state of war. Families completely gunned down in their beds. We have no idea where she is. Our soldiers are fighting on the front lines. But the general perception is something that certainly needs to be fought as well. Correspondence throughout the world brings the truth from Israel to hundreds of millions of people in scores of countries. Families completely gunned down in their beds. De la Frontière qui sépare l'Israel. A state of emergency and war in Israel. Bringing Israel's story to the world. i24 News Channels, now on Hot. Welcome to this special broadcast here on i24 News. Day 52 of the war. Day 4 of the ceasefire and fear that Hamas will sabotage the release of the fourth group of hostages. Israeli officials confirmed the list for today's pending release been received but that there are some issues with it. First and foremost, another potential violation of the agreement that families will not be torn apart as in mothers to be freed with their children. Qatar mediators say they are in the loop trying to smooth over the disagreements and avoid delays. Egyptian sources are saying we're nearing that point. Today's dynamic, however, will have a direct impact on a possible extension of the ceasefire and extension Hamas already declared. It really wants. So how many spoons of sugar could Israel take to make the bitter Hamas medicine go down before we unpack it all, all the strategy, all the maneuvers, all the interest. It all comes down to human lives. 84 year old Alma Abraham was released yesterday and immediately airlifted for emergency treatment at the Soroka Hospital in critical condition. This hour she is still in a life threatening state serious danger to her life and her daughter is saying if it was another hour or two, Alma would have died in captivity. My mother did not deserve to come back like this. She was severely medically neglected. This was neglect during the entire period of her stay there. She didn't get her meds, life saving meds. For those who don't understand medically, my mother was on the brink of death when she came to us. The doctors cannot report this, but I can report on behalf of my mother. She arrived with a pulse of 40 with a body temperature of 28 degrees. Unconscious, all wounded. She was kept there in unfair conditions. She was abandoned twice. She was abandoned once on October 7th and abandoned a second time by all the organizations that should have saved her and prevented her situation. And these are exactly the instances where the Red Cross would have come into play visiting the hostages, making sure that they're okay as much as a person can be okay while in captivity by terrorists, obviously not the case. Well, we want now to take a deep breath and show you the flip side of it, those moving images that the Schneider Children's Medical Center is releasing this hour that perhaps explain everything, moving photos from the reunification of the Broadage family after over 50 days, 40-year-old mother Hagar released yesterday from captivity along with her three children, 10-year-old Afri, 9-year-old Yuval, 4-year-old Uriah. This is their first meeting with their father, Avichai, too many more, too many, many more. And we want to turn now live to our 24 news correspondent, Nikol Tzedek, at what is still tragically known as the Hostages Square in Tel Aviv. Nikol, today is the last day of deal proper, let's call it that way, and yet without even talking about yes extension, no extensions, there are some issues in today's list of hostages. And when we say issues, we mean something that might risk the deal altogether. What do we know? We know not too much information at this point, Ali, but the Israeli Prime Minister's office did release a statement stating that there are still negotiations when it comes to the list of the hostages that are supposed to be released today in just hours from now, in fact. And if that list does include about 11 people, which is how many are left after this four days? After the three days so far, we've seen 39 Israeli citizens released so far. And so in terms of this proper deal, as you're calling, where we're going to see 50 Israeli hostages released in four days, that would mean 11 are left. But Ali, I have to tell you, even though we've seen a total of 58 hostages released because we have seen some additional four nationals released due to some other negotiations in addition to this deal, there's still more than 180 hostages held captive in Gaza at this very moment. And that includes 18 children. So if we see possibly 11 captives return to Israel today, a handful of them are still going to be children held captive in Gaza. And so when we talk about the emotions and you see some of those families reuniting with their loved ones, it absolutely tugs at your heartstrings. But it also acts as a reminder that as we've seen 58 reunions so far, the families here, the citizens of Israel, everyone who's coming here to Hostages Square, they want to see 240 of those videos. And so just seeing a few, it definitely gives a glimmer of hope. But when we're talking about possible hiccups in this negotiation deal, we also have to add it's not surprising. We continue to see these types of hiccups because you have, on the one hand, a democratic government of Israel negotiating for their innocent civilians. And on the other hand, you have Hamas, a terrorist organization who's going to do everything they can to keep these captives and gain an upper hand when it comes to the Israeli negotiations. So hopefully we'll gain a little bit more insight in the coming hours because the Israeli Prime Minister's office says they are looking as to exactly the list and who we can hopefully welcome home today. Sometimes, Nicole, sometimes in life, things are black and white. And as you've just put it, this is such a situation. Innocent children, in captivity by a terror organization, simply put. Thank you very much, Nicole, for this from the Hostage Square. And Tel Aviv, and joining us now here in studio for this broadcast, Mr. Yakov Lapin, Military and Strategic Affairs, and also the Jewish New Syndicate and the Merriam Institute and our very own I-24 New Senior Diplomatic Correspondent, Owen Alterman. Gentlemen, the Prime Minister's office at this minute is releasing the following statement, the negotiations as for the list of the following hostages is still underway. And we are aware of the tension that the families are currently experiencing. We will add information once it will be possible. Of course, asking to refrain from spreading rumors and such. Bottom line, Owen, we are already talking about extension. Well, today's deal is still far from secured. How can you do the two at the same time? Well, I mean, first of all, just to remind ourselves, this is now four o'clock local time, or three o'clock local time in Israel, right? And the hostages, according to the terms and the understandings of the deal as best we understand them, were supposed to be, the release process was supposed to start every day at or before four o'clock local time, so within the next hour. So it looks like we are about to be officially behind, again, on the passing over and the transferring of the hostages. We've all gotten used to this routine, right? To those Red Cross ambulance vans that are onward to the Rafah crossing the Egyptians and so forth. And what it also means, Ellie, and you're right, in a sense, the negotiations over this list and today's installment of the original four-day ceasefire, right? Completing the number of 50 Israeli hostages to be freed. Again, the efforts on women and children, all the terms we've become familiar, that the negotiation over this is happening in the sense at the same time as a negotiation about the extension. And sometimes in negotiations, in a negotiation theory, expanding the problem, right? And expanding the set of issues on the table actually can make things easier to resolve. Now, we don't really understand what the argument is over this list and what the nature of the claims are. It seems to be that the two sides aren't necessarily looking at the same text of understandings. To the best of my knowledge, we haven't actually seen a document released to the public with what the agreement is. So, of course, part of the differences of opinion may be Hamas essentially trying to renegotiate and extort on the fly. And it stands to reason that that's the case and it certainly seemed to be the case in day two when the Qataris and the Egyptians stepped in so heavily as they reportedly did. But there may be not have been a full meeting of the minds about what exactly the terms were, which may be leading to some of the misunderstandings. Too many elements were left to interpretation? Possibly. I mean, again, don't forget, even at the time the deal was announced, there were two different versions on the two different sides about that issue of Red Cross visits that you mentioned, right? The commitment that the United States and Israel say that Hamas made to allow the Red Cross to visit some of the messages that weren't going to be released. We talked about in our studio here, right? Discuss this as something Israel could put on the table. I thought it was a terrific idea. And then we heard Benjamin Netanyahu go to the podium, read from what he said was the text of the agreement saying this was the deal, only to Hamas saying that it wasn't agreed. And it's obviously a very significant provision. And of course, as you mentioned, Ellie, it is required under international humanitarian law. It is not supposed to be something that Israel needs to negotiate for. It is something that Israel is entitled to negotiate for, but never mind about all this. Point being, sometimes a negotiation and you enlarge the scope of issues, they become easier to resolve. Maybe, and I'm putting this out as just a question, more than an answer, maybe that will be the case over the coming few hours that negotiating this list together with an extension could make it more likely for the sides to get to yes. And yet to get used to this dynamic of a day where things are going on according to the plan. And another day where everything is chaotic, I don't think, I don't think who am I to think at this point in time. And yet, not sustainable, not if we're looking potentially towards several more days of extension. And actually it's a good point because the negotiation, the extension could be day to day, right? If you look at the way the deal, what we know about the deal from the decision by the Israeli government where there are parts of it that are actually published there in black and white, the extension can be negotiated day to day. So we've only been to be negotiating every day over the list and the composition of the list. We'll be negotiating going forward day to day about whether there even is a ceasefire or not. You're a Basel, as they say in Arabic. A good day and a bad day. Mr. Lapin, before we get your take, we do want to go back now to the ground as many children and their mothers who were released in recent days are still at the Schneider's Children's Hospital being treated there. Physically, mentally, the teams of doctors and medical professionals are providing round-the-clock care for them and I-24 news correspondent, Pirkola Chandler, is right there. Pierre, unfortunately, we opened this broadcast by an alarming update from the daughter of 84-year-old Alma Wama about her life-threatening condition to this hour. But what can we say on the other's physical and mental status? It's very difficult to decipher the mental status of the nine kids that are on the third floor here with two mothers. It's very difficult because they don't talk much. You know, I'll give you a few examples. Avigaili Dan, who marked her fourth birthday on Friday and was and was reminded by U.S. President Joe Biden. She's an American and she's an Israeli. She saw her parents murdered. She was covered with the blood of her father, Roy, her mother, dying, Smadar. She run to the Brodach family next door in Kfar-Aza, and they were all taken captive. The chance in that terrible sorrow is that she was kept with the family and they knew each other. So in a sense, it was a bit easier for Amalia, for Avigail, sorry. And when she came here yesterday at 10.30, imagine a four-year-old girl so small, looking up all these strangers around her. She was frightened. But she kept smiling, you know. She's courageous. She kept smiling according to her grandfather. And she asked about Mikhael and Amalia. Mikhael nine, Amalia six, her brother and sister. They hide in a closet on October 7 for 14 hours before the IDF managed to extract them from the fury of the massacre. And that's what she's asking for. She knows her parents are dead. She doesn't talk about it. And when they asked her yesterday before the shower what she wanted, she said, I want a little bagel and grape juice. You know, what the kid eats at kindergarten. The other kids, you know, Ohad nine, who has already released from captivity two days ago, the medical personnel encouraged the kids to invite their friends. So invited his schoolmates. And they all came yesterday. They shared pizza. They shared Lego games. They played hide and seek in the corridors that are well kept from us. And they spoke and he shared his experience to them. It's much harder for a kid to share his experience to a stranger with all the good intentions of the psychologist. It's going to be much harder to open up to them than to open up to his friends. And that's what happened. So the medical personnel is really encouraging the kids to invite their friends, their schoolmates, their kindergarten mates in order to try and give them a sense. Right. And try to give them a sense of friendship, a sense of being taken care of, a sense of normalcy in all these abnormal situations. But the problem is not over, of course. They've been malnourished for at least two weeks because there was a shortage of food. They were fed with rice and pita bread. They slept on the floor without mattress or on plastic benches or plastic chairs. They couldn't distinguish between day and night. They had no clue about daylight. All that has to be relearned. And aside of that, they need to be relocated because their homes have been destroyed during the October 7 massacre. So it's a difficult situation, but the parents are brave. The grandparents are brave. And they try and hug them as close as possible, telling them this will never happen to you again. Yes, you know, Pierre, I'm listening to you. When we saw the images of three-year-old Yahel two nights ago or four-year-old Abigail yesterday, come back home, your immediate reaction to it is, oh, my God, a three-year-old girl is coming back home. And then you're saying, oh, my God, a three-year-old girl is coming back home from captivity, incomprehensible. Indeed, a long process ahead. Pierre-Claude Schindler, Head of Schneider's Children's Hospital, thank you very much for this. And before we show you parts of interrogations of Hamas terrorists and first reports now on what is happening behind the scenes, CNN is reporting that despite the understandings, the agreement stipulating that families will not be torn apart as in mothers released with their children, vice versa. The list of hostages today, to be released today, includes nine children and two elderly women, the U.S., according to this report on CNN. Not know if there are any American citizens in this list. And also, this report is suggesting that Hamas is using the ceasefire to relocate the hostages. That makes sense. If we're connecting the dots to what Hila, 13-year-old Hila, was released earlier this week, said she was kept with her mother and separated from her right before the release, just because Hamas wanted to keep them apart. All right, before we get back to studio, the interrogations of Hamas terrorists who took part in the October 7 massacre continue shedding more light on Hamas' vicious game plan. This afternoon, more parts of it are cleared for publication take-off. We're back. There's a lot going on. There's a lot of people coming in and out. I got in. One of them came and heard me scream. He said, I don't like white people. And he stopped. I was in the car and we left. We left a little while ago. Before we found my uncle, he said, there's a group of people. I said, take this. He said, what's this? He said, put it in your pocket. He put it in my pocket. He put it in my pocket. We arrived at the police station. The station was closed. The station was closed. We went inside. We went inside. When we entered, there were two small barraques. There was a building in front of them. They all entered. They entered. There was a barraque area. I think we were criminals. I don't know why. 2nd barraque was closed. The people who knew them didn't know the way. The same people who entered were视. And opened the door. Was there a coded police line? Yes, there was. There was a police station. Was there? Yes, the one in the first. We went inside. I, my uncle, and the guy I didn't know. We also entered. The closed barraques. We went inside the house. There were fabrics in it. We stopped and we went down to the second floor. The second floor? They were in a hurry. We went down to the stairs. I went up to the stairs, to the stairs of the stairs and to the other floor. I went up. Abu Khaled and I went to the stairs to the next floor. We went up to the stairs. The stairs were in a hurry? We went up to the stairs. Abu Khaled asked what's your name? He didn't understand what's your name. He replied that he would do Thailand. Thailand. We understood that the two of us are the same gender. We don't know each other. We don't know each other. What's your name? My name is Ashraf Ali Hawwaz. Where are you from? I'm from Giza. Where are you from? I'm from the military. What happened to you? I'm from the army. What do you mean? I'm from the army. We went up to the stairs. We went up to the stairs. What did you go up to? I went up to the stairs. We went up to the stairs. I went up to the stairs and I didn't see a sign of you. He looked at the other side of the building. He asked if I had a problem or not. Are you afraid? Yes. I was going up to the stairs. What did you go up to? To the staircase. He saw a letter with a phone. He went up to the stairs. Then I looked at it and was surprised. We went to the 2nd floor of this building. We went to the 2nd floor of the building. We found a dead body in the building. The other one was in the living room. One of the bodies was inside. There were two bodies outside. Two were inside, not one. Two were outside. Two of them were with me. They came and took the young man. We entered the building's door. We went to the west. The body was inside. I came out of the building. The young man was inside. The young man was inside. We went back to Abu Khaled for 10 minutes. We went back to the building. They put on the clothes. The patient was not wearing the clothes. He was not wearing the clothes. I heard that there was a word. But Thailand. Thailand is closed. We are closed. They are closed. We took a person. Back here in Nassir with Mr. Yakov Lapin. Mr. Lapin, I do want a circle back to yesterday, that was allegedly a smooth sale a day. with the houses being released without the drama that we've seen two days ago without the drama that we're seeing today. And yet, there was something very abnormal about yesterday's release, and these are the pictures of the hostages taken through packed neighborhoods in Gaza City with armed Hamas terrorists, with the crowds cheering, indicating that if the notion was that Hamas lost control in the northern part of the Gaza Strip, it's not the case in all areas there. This was likely in a pocket of eastern Gaza City where the idea has not taken control of, but most of northern Gaza is under idea of control. The fact that over a million Gazans left that part of northern Gaza and Gaza City is an indication that the Hamas regime is actually, to all intents and purposes, not in existence in that part of Gaza. And I think really what we're seeing here is Hamas trying to desperately buy itself time, another 24 hours. It's separating families and committing war crimes to try and build more war crimes, of course, to try and create insurance policies to try and extort Israel for that extra day, because what they're really hoping for is the creation of some kind of dynamic that will make this ceasefire long enough for them to start to regroup, to start to think about the survival of their leadership. And I think they're completely delusional if they think that that's what's going to happen. The Israeli War Cabinet and the Defense establishment are utterly united behind the goal of destroying Hamas, resuming the war once every effort is made to get people out. At some point, this is going to come to an end if we zoom out, and that's when operations will resume. And I think we'll see the idea of moving very quickly south to Hanyunis and to other areas of southern Gaza where Hamas survives. This audacity, really, of releasing those visuals from yesterday. It indicates on a certain level of resilience on Hamas' side. 100%. I mean, they're a very resilient and stubborn enemy that cannot be destroyed in six days. We're not in the six-day war era. This has to go from neighborhood to neighborhood, street to street. And until the idea takes full control, they're going to continue to operate in areas where they have yet to be cleansed from. So yes, absolutely. It's very frustrating to see that. And it's clearly frustrating for the Israeli people to see that. But really, I think, if we zoom out, Hamas is on borrowed time. And all of these psychological terrorist efforts that are being made will not ultimately result in what Hamas wants, which is to somehow solidify this truce into the long term so that they can survive. I don't see that happening at all. And hopefully, Israel will be able to continue to rescue as many hostages as possible, the sanctity of life. The fact that families are being separated is horrible. Re-victimization of these people who have already gone through hell, and hearts have to be with them. But we also have to steal ourselves, I think, for the long run. There's going to be months of high-intensity conflict ahead of us. And especially if now we're talking about the easier, quote unquote, easier cases of hostages as children, women, elderly women, humanitarian cases when push comes to shove. And we're talking about men and soldiers. It will be even more difficult. 100%, the fact that Hamas is keeping men and soldiers as sort of the last card that he wants to keep for the bargaining chip is going to be very difficult on them and their families, their last in line. It's all part of Hamas' sick agenda. And it's something that these Israeli people are going to have to prepare themselves to deal with going forward. The more the military operation progresses, the more opportunities there will be, also potentially to conduct negotiations with the hostage old holders once the leadership is destroyed. It may be easier to make them offers directly to them without going through this long circle. And very alarming that the indications that Hamas is not holding all the hostages. Gentlemen, thank you very much. We'll be back at the top of the hour. To the special broadcast here on I-24 Newsday, 52 of the War Day Four of the Seized Fire and Fear that Hamas will sabotage the release of the fourth group of hostages today. Israeli officials confirmed that the list for the pending release in the coming hours have been received, but there are some issues with this, with it rather first and foremost. Another potential violation of the agreement that families will not be torn apart, as in mothers will remain in captivity while their children are released. Diplomatic officials are voicing careful, cautious optimism this hour that those sticking points might be solved. And also voice some optimism about the prospects on reaching an extension, meaning more days of ceasefire in exchange for more hostages being released. But how long could Israel endure those tricks and games by Hamas? We want to welcome now here in studio Brigadier General Mesokharan Geffen, former commander of the 8200 intelligence unit, the IDF, and our very own I-24 News, the senior diplomatic correspondent Owen Alterman. Thank you, gentlemen, very much for joining us. So those reports by each stakeholder in this agreement are changing by the second, really, if a few minutes ago. There was cautious optimism now with major sticking points and vice versa. To your understanding, Brigadier General Geffen, what is happening? What are the odds, what are the chances to power through and to see a fourth batch of hostages being released tonight? In this kind of situation, I try to see in the long process and not the minutes-by-minute changes. And what I believe is the basic facts is first that the Hamas is urging for ceasefire, not because it's Hamas, because the population. I'm listening to the Arab population and all the channels that's available. And you see the people, 1.7 million people are living in shelters in temporary locations. And the fact that Israel will start again is horrifying them. And I believe there's a huge pressure on Hamas. Thus, Hamas will try to be as forced as possible. The question is, is it possible? Where are the locations? Does the Hamas control all the hostages? And where about the hostages? I believe that Hamas' capabilities to play around with the categories of people, not soldiers and not above 19 years old, is diminishing by the day because the threats are growing on the Hamas. So I believe, if answering your question, I believe today will be accomplished. I believe they will do their best, even trying to change the agreement to be more lenient, just to keep on for another day or two, they need it. That's what I hear from the listening to the voices that come from Gaza. But Owen, no matter how you look at it, whether it's control by Hamas of the situation or lack of control, the bottom line is that it is playing games and making Israel sweat with the lack of a better phrasing. Yeah, I mean, these are apparent violations of the agreement, Eli. And we have, of course, the situation of the 13-year-old girl who was separated from her mother just two days before. Right. Just two days before she was released and the mother was not. And Hamas saying that they couldn't find her, even though they knew exactly where she was two days before. And in the interim, there had been at least mostly, if not entirely, a ceasefire, without the kinds of conditions that would make it hard for them to keep track of the hostages. So obviously, that raises a lot of questions, to say the least, about Hamas' good faith and honesty in terms of the claims that it's making. But look, again, you're right, making Israel sweat. Just to remind viewers, we're now past the four o'clock hour here in Israel, which is the time where the process of transferring hostages was supposed to have started, right? And the now familiar routine of passing them along to those ambulance vans of the Red Cross and then the trip onto the Rafah crossing to the Egyptians and onward into Israel and then to the hospitals. That was supposed to have started already. We don't yet even have an agreement about the names on the list. We went through this two days ago. And in practice, what we have is a negotiation over this list and a negotiation about an extension of the ceasefire and the further freeing of the hostages happening at the same time. Yes, yeah, yeah. And as you've explained to us earlier in the day, oh, and sometimes as part of the negotiations, the in order to solve an issue is to expend a problem. That's right. Perhaps this is the case. And one sentence before we head to the field, yeah? Yeah, I would like to add one more thing. Israel is looking for the next steps or the next categories on the list, the soldiers and the girls soldiers. For Israel, it is the same. And I believe if we watch what Israel is doing, both diplomatically and in the field, you know, there are aircraft flowing constantly over as the southern part of Gaza, they are well fit. This creates some anxiety there within there. And this is in order to make sure that the next steps are all because the soldiers are the same importance, have the same importance to Israel as the children and the mothers. Of course, of course. And what Hamas sees as an opportunity might turn out to be exactly the opposite. We want to head now to the Schneider's Children's Hospital, where some of the hostages that were thankfully released are currently at. The S-24 News Middle East correspondent, Ariel Ansaran, is standing by there, awaiting, hopefully, a fourth batch of hostages to be released. But for the time being, Ariel, unfortunately, 84-year-old Alma Avraham was released yesterday and immediately airlifted for emergency treatment is still in critical condition, still in a life-threatening situation. Right, Ali, we have 39 hostages who are returned through this ceasefire release deal. Are in hospitals across the country. 11 of them are in Schneider Children's Hospital right behind me, where I'm standing. Nine children, two mothers, women who, all 11 of them arrived last night after being released from over 50 days in Hamas' captivity. Now, according to the hospital, all the children and the mothers, they are all in stable physical condition and continue to undergo physical as well as psychological evaluations. Now, obviously, for many, these are also sad moments because their family, almost all of the kids either has family who was murdered on October 7th or family who still remains in Hamas' captivity. That is a situation with some of the released hostages. But also reunification of families. Also, it's a bittersweet moment for almost all of these hostages. But as you mentioned, perhaps the hostage who was released in the most severe critical condition is an 84-year-old Elma Avraham. She was taken directly from Gaza Territory via military chopper to Soroka Hospital in Berksheva, the hospital there, saying that she is in poor physical condition and severe clinical condition. Now, we spoke earlier with her daughter, who explained a little bit more about how critical the condition her mother is and that she basically was released perhaps hours before she potentially died. Doctors are still fighting for her life. Let's take a listen to what her daughter said. My mother did not deserve to come back like this. She was severely medically neglected. This was neglect during the entire period of her stay there. She didn't get her meds, life-saving meds. For those who don't understand medically, my mother was on the brink of death when she came to us. The doctors cannot report this, but I can report on behalf of my mother. She arrived with a pulse of 40 with a body temperature of 28 degrees, unconscious, all wounded. She was kept there in unfair conditions. She was abandoned twice. She was abandoned once on October 7th and abandoned a second time by all the organizations that should have saved her and prevented her situation. Aria Lasser on Night 24 News in Middle East correspondent at the Schneider's Children's Hospital. Thank you very much for this Owen Alterman here in the studio. This is precisely what the Red Cross should have done, preventing these situations from happening, which brings me to ask Owen, because as part of this deal, at least according to the Israelis and the Americans, there were assurances that the Red Cross would get access to the remaining hostages, where the last day of deal proper, still not the case. And my question to you, perhaps too many loose ends in this agreement, such as the issues of families not being torn apart, such as the issue of the Red Cross access, just too many question marks. Right, well, first a couple of comments on the Red Cross and then the agreement. First of all, under international law, the Red Cross should have access to these hostages, who, of course, it's a war crime to take civilian hostages in the first place. But once you do, you are supposed to give the Red Cross access to them. It's not supposed to be something Israel has to negotiate for. But it's not the Red Cross' fault that the Red Cross didn't go to visit them. How many guns has the Pope? Divisions has the Pope? How many divisions has the Red Cross? The Red Cross doesn't have the ability against Hamas' will to go and visit the hostages for obvious reasons. So it only gets to access once Hamas agrees to that access. And you're right, Ellie, according to Prime Minister Netanyahu, this is one of the provisions that Israel negotiated for in the agreement. And of course, although Hamas is obligated to allow the Red Cross in, they're obviously not going to do it, given what Hamas is. But if it's negotiated for, then presumably they could be incentivized to bring the Red Cross in. And that's what Prime Minister Netanyahu stood at the podium, reading from what he said was the agreement and told the Israeli public that that was going to be the case. Hamas has not said that that's the case in the agreement. The visits by all accounts seem not to be happening and not set to happen. By the way, not only Israel saying this was in the agreement, it's the United States as well. That is saying this is in the agreement. It's an important clause. If it's a clause in the agreement, it is a material clause in the agreement. And if so, Hamas would be in material breach of the agreement, which brings us to the last part of your question. Was this actually in the agreement? Or more to the point, was there an actual, or is there an actual agreement? This agreement has not been publicized. It's not been made public. There are elements of it that are enshrined in the decision by the Israeli government and are there in Hebrew text in black and white. This is not one of them, by the way. There is an annex to that decision, which is classified, which includes what is presumably the agreement. But I don't think it's entirely clear if there is an actual text that both sides have agreed to. Even if there is a text that both sides have agreed to, does that encapsulate the full scope of the agreement or understandings? Are there looser understandings around the text, which give rise to more arguments? And if we talk about what's happening at this hour, is this A, an attempt by Hamas to extort Israel at the last moment, to use psychological warfare against the families in the Israeli public at the last moment? And or is this an outcome of an agreement that wasn't a full meeting of the minds, right? Where not all of the provisions were firmly agreed to by both sides where they can hold each other to them. Again, it's an and or, right? It may be both of these. But the fact we have one consequence of there not being a publicized agreement is, we don't really know who's right in a sense and whose feet should be held to the fire because it's not entirely clear to the public what both sides committed to and it may not be clear to the sides what they both committed to. There's too much room for interpretation, so to speak. And Mr. Raffin, before we get your take on what should we expect in terms of the operation on the ground, not if, but when the ceasefire will end, let it be tonight, tomorrow or in a few days. We do wanna head now to the hostage square in Tel Aviv. Our 24 news correspondent Pia Sakalbach standing by there, Pia, today is the last day of the deal that was agreed upon, putting the extension talk aside. And yet, we still do not know whether this final group of hostages that, again, was agreed on will be released. Right, Ellie, well, this is the last opportunity for families, as of now, if we leave aside the talks about an extension of the deal to get their loved ones back, we are hearing that families have received a preliminary list, those families whose loved ones are expected to be released tonight, but they were also told to not rejoice yet, to not talk about it yet, because it is preliminary. And as you can see, or here, possibly, here at the Hostage Square, a group of women are meeting here on a regular basis to sing, to sing a prayer for the return of all of the hostages. I'm sure you can hear, they're here just to create a sense of being together. This is really what this square has been for. People just trying to create a sense of togetherness. People coming here, also, not necessarily only relatives of families, obviously, but people who want to come in to show their presence and to show their support for the families and for the hostages themselves. I'm sure that you've already seen this table here that has very much become the symbol of this square here, the table, where still you can see there is a plate for each and every hostage still on that table, because even though we speak about the deal that has seen, really, a lot of hostages released, the vast majority still remains in Gaza and what we've been hearing from families. Also, families of those who've already been released is that they will not give up their struggle until really the last hostage is released and this is very much what this table here resembles. Now, there are many, also, other art installations here at the square. People are coming together here. Now, the weather, winter is coming to Tel Aviv. The weather is quite gloomy, but that very much matches the atmosphere of tension and of sorrow, but I'm sure once the evening comes closer, and now you can hear even a shofal here, once the prayer continues, once the evening comes closer, more people will come here and to actually be together in these hours where we can actually expect the release of the hostages, Eileen. Yes, hopefully some moments of relief later on today with the potential release of more hostages. Back here in studio with Brigadier General Ghanan Geffen, Brigadier General Geffen, there seems to be this gap here, because on the one hand, Qatari officials are saying, well, the honest truth is Hamas is not holding all hostages. It will need to look for some of them being held by their Islamic jihad or some gangs or some random civilians. And on the other hand, we are seeing demonstrations of force or the very least of chutzpah, of audacity on behalf of Hamas, you know, of flexing muscles. So what is the real situation? We are now probably at the end of one of the phases, which is the first phase, they try to gain some trust, some ceasefire. Hopefully the Israeli society will be splitted, but they've seen it in the past, you know, voices coming from their families, stop the war, and nothing of this happened. The rage in Israel is so high, and it's not, it's even growing every day. We hear more evidences of what happened. So this kind of hope, they don't, they have to look for other things, the other size. To hang on to, yeah. Now we are entering a phase where Israel, we have to look for the, as I mentioned already, the soldiers and the others left there. There will not be any Israelis willing to. I would like to add another one, a very psychologically one. The military is really, would like to finish the Hamas capabilities. The 7th of October, I don't know how to call this, what happened in those 24 hours. For the military, it seems that have to be wiped out, not only because of the, of trying to revenge, but we have to reshape the minds of the other side. They believe that this is, as Nassara said, a weak country that 3,000 Hamas people have caused so much damage. That has to be overturned. We are in a situation where many of us said, we are back in 1948. The same time we have to reestablish our presence in the Middle East. And this is, we have to remember it. This would be the consideration of the military and the government. And obviously, before we head to the field to talk about the preparation of the Israeli forces to get back to the battle when the order will be given, Hamas is just confirming another death of an official, Mohammad Hamad, the official spokesperson for the city of Jerusalem, another Hamas official. In this respect, Hamas is now also seeing the toll. OK, we want to turn now to the Shiba Medical Center as the doctor there is updating on the status of the hostages. This is the thoughts that were released from captivity by Hamas. Productivity issues, we will get back to that later. But according to the Hebrew language, update there, the physical status of the hostages that were released is OK, thankfully. We want to cross now to the Israel Gaza border, to I-24 News correspondent Zach Andrews, standing by there with the I-24 News team. Zach, today, is theoretically speaking the last day of the deal as in midnight 01, the ceasefire expires. There's, of course, already much talk about the potential extension. It seems that this is the direction we're heading towards. And yet, the forces underground are ready to defend that the war continues in a few hours, get back to business essentially. Right, and today's hostage situation resembles somewhat Saturdays with the media reports that are coming out saying there is some strain and contention in the list in who is going to be released. So we're keeping a very close eye on the developments that are happening there. The parent reports that are coming out of both the prime minister's office and from the US appear that there might be some problem with the children being released with their mothers. This was a part of the deal. Hamas agreed to that every release would include, if a child was to be released, it would also be with their mother and potentially that that has become a problem today. We're still waiting to hear exactly what specifically could be a problem here because earlier today there were reports that potentially some of the hostages are not even within the domain or control of Hamas that the Palestinian Islamic jihad potentially has some of these hostages that were agreed to on the list. So we're still keeping a very close eye on that. Yes, and until this hour, theoretically speaking, 20 minutes ago, the deal should have, the process of releasing the hostages should have started already, not the case. Again, today, Zach Anders on the Israel Gaza border, thank you very much for this. Back here in the studio with Mr. Halan Geffen and our very own Owen Alterman. Owen on the sidelines of everything. Yes, a high-profile visitor would use that definition. High-profile visit today in Israel, Elon Musk, who's been making many headlines throughout this war meeting Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, Israeli President Isaac Herzog, touring some of the communities down south. What do you make of this visit? Controversial, it's not a scoop. Look, Elon Musk, by the way, last spotted in Benjamin Netanyahu's office at the Israeli parliament watching the IDF video of the atrocities, the now famous or infamous, and by all accounts, extremely difficult to watch, 43, 44 minutes of video. So there's a picture of him and Netanyahu watching that. Met with Isaac Herzog, the Israel's president, and Eli also seen at the Knesset with Benny Gantz, of course, a senior minister now in this government identified, traditionally speaking, with the anti-Netanyahu block in Israeli politics, of course, entering this government as part of a national unity government and a wartime government. This is a very controversial visit. The argument in favor of it, of course, is that Musk has a lot of power, that his political opinions is a raw material that he uses in deploying his power and in directing his more than 100 million followers. And of course, he owns the platform that has so much influence, right? And how he directs that platform and how he directs his followers is extremely important in shaping at least a slice of global public opinion. So to bring him here, to get his attention for the day and to show him the communities, he was in Kfar Azar in that visit and going to see the communities that were attacked in October 7th and watching the video, meeting with Israel's dignitaries, that you can influence him to then influence others. I mean, that's the argument in favor of the visit. What are the problems? There are many. Number one, a finger in the eye to American Jews, right? At a time where American Jews have come out with such heartfelt support for Israel across so much of the political spectrum there to then take your finger and poke in the eye of a figure who American Jews see as someone who is fomenting and enabling anti-Semitism against them is extremely problematic for Israel diaspora relations at a time when they're really at a high against all of the odds of what we've seen over the last few years. So that's number one. And number two, again, the idea and the theory behind the visit, I think, is to influence him, but how much can someone as volatile and temperamental Zeland Musk be reliably influenced, right? According to the, even into the medium and long term. Does the fact of what he sees on this Monday affect what he feels and what he transmits next Monday, let alone a month from now? And if not, then what you have done in this visit is again, because don't forget Prime Minister Netanyahu flew to San Francisco essentially to meet Musk, right? On his way to the United Nations just about two and a half months ago by bringing him here, have you essentially re-legitimized him so that when he comes out and has opinions and does things that you dislike a week or a month or now, he gets, he has that stamp of approval in a sense from the Israeli government who brought him here and hosted him here and showed him all of these places and gave him access to all of these high officials. So a very controversial visit, a visit with tremendous cost and even greater risk. But of course, there is the potential for payoff from Israel's perspective as well. Yes, time of many daring risks that all those involved are taking. Major General, Brigadier General Geffen, excuse me. What we're likely to see at the end of this ceasefire, let it be tonight, tomorrow or in a few days, is to an extent rising international pressure not to go back to a full-blown war. With that said, Israeli officials, Israeli military officials are saying there's no other choice. We're not even close to it to finish the job. Right. First of all, the hostages, because the only thing that moved the Hamas we know, we see every minute now we can feel it is the pressure of the military in the next street and the next location of their command. And then there is a very clear decision by the government and by the public at the same token that Hamas should not be near, the existence of Hamas should be eradicated, eliminated, whatever we choose, because people will not come back to Gaza, to the Gaza area, and they are around over 100,000 people. Yeah. And today, or the day yesterday, the mayor of Zderot said, if Hamas is standing Gaza, we are not coming back. We will not come back to Zderot. And obviously, we are back to back to what's happening in Zderot. And I believe there is no other choice. The military will find its way. They've done so magnificently in the last two months, and we'll find a way to go in between the demands of the national press opinion and the international opinions and what we need to do. Yes, and we're in the spectrum between the long-term and short-term still awaiting the release of today and a potential extension because you're General Khandengif and Owen Altman. Thank you very much for this. We'll be back at the top of the hour. Israel is in a state of war, families completely done down in their beds. We have no idea where is she as our soldiers are fighting on the front lines, but the general perception is something that certainly needs to be fought as well. Special broadcast here on I-24 Newsday, 52 of the war day four of the ceasefire and fear that Hamas will sabotage the release of the fourth group of hostages today. Israeli officials confirmed that the list for the pending release in the coming hours have been received, but there are some issues with this, with it rather first and foremost, another potential violation of the agreement that families will not be torn apart, as in mothers will remain in captivity while their children are released. Diplomatic officials are voicing careful, cautious optimism this hour that those sticking points might be solved and also voice some optimism about the prospect on reaching an extension, meaning more days of ceasefire in exchange for more hostages being released. But how long should Israel endure those tricks and games by Hamas? We want to welcome now here in Studio Brigadier General Mesokharan Giffen, former commander of the 8200 intelligence unit at the IDF and our very own I-24 Newsday, senior diplomatic correspondent Owen Alterman. Thank you gentlemen very much for joining us. So those reports by each stakeholder in this agreement are changing by the second really, if a few minutes ago, it was cautious optimism. Now it's major sticking points and vice versa to your understanding Brigadier General Giffen, what is happening? What are the odds? What are the chances to power through and to see a fourth batch of hostages being released tonight? Well in this kind of situation, and I try to see in the long process and not the minutes by minute changes. And what I believe is the basic facts is first that the Hamas is urging for ceasefire, not because it's Hamas, because the population. I'm listening to the Arab population and all the channels that's available and you see the people, 1.7 million people are living in shelters in temporary locations and the fact that Israel will start again is horrifying them. And I believe there's a huge pressure on Hamas. Thus Hamas will try to be a force come as possible. But the question is, is it possible? Where are the locations? Does the Hamas control all the hostages and whereabouts the hostages? I believe that Hamas capabilities to play around with the categories of people, not soldiers and not above 19 years old is diminishing by the day because the threats are growing on the Hamas. So I believe if answering your question, I believe there will be, today it will be accomplished. I believe they will do their best, even trying to change the agreement to be more lenient just to keep on for another day or two, they need it. That's what I hear from the listening to the voices that come from Gaza. But Owen, no matter how you look at it, whether it's control by Hamas of the situation or lack of control, the bottom line is that it is playing games and making Israel sweat with the lack of a better phrasing. Yeah, I mean, these are apparent violations of the agreement, Ellie, and we have of course the situation of the 13 year old girl who was separated from her mother just two days before. Right, just two days before she was released and the mother was not. And Hamas saying that they couldn't find her, even though they knew exactly where she was two days before and in the interim there had been at least mostly, if not entirely a ceasefire, right? Without the kinds of conditions that would make it hard for them to keep track of the hostages. So obviously that raises a lot of questions to say the least about Hamas's good faith and honesty in terms of the claims that it's making. But look, again, you're right, making Israel sweat, just to remind viewers, we're now past the four o'clock hour here in Israel, which is the time where the process of transferring hostages was supposed to have started, right, and the now familiar routine of passing them along to those ambulance vans of the Red Cross and then the trip onto the Rafa crossing to the Egyptians and onward into Israel and then to the hospitals. That was supposed to have started already. We don't yet even have an agreement about the names on the list. We went through this two days ago and in practice, what we have is a negotiation over this list and a negotiation about an extension of the ceasefire and the further freeing of the hostages happening at the same time. Yes, yeah, yeah, and as you've explained to us earlier in the day, and sometimes as part of the negotiations in order to solve an issue is to expend a problem. That's right. Perhaps this is the case. May I enter? Yeah, and one sentence before we head to the field, yeah? Yeah, I would like to add one more thing. Israel is looking for the next steps, the next categories of the list. The soldiers and the girl soldiers. For Israel, it is the same. And I believe if we watch what Israel is doing, both diplomatically and in the field, you know, there are aircraft flowing constantly over as the southern part of Gaza. The welfare, this creates some anxiety there. Yeah. And this is in order to make sure that the next steps are all because the soldiers have the same importance to Israel as the children and the mothers. Of course, of course. And what Hamas sees as an opportunity might turn out to be exactly the opposite. We want to head now to the Schneider's children's hospital where some of the hostages that were thankfully released are currently at. I-24 News Middle East correspondent, Ariel Ansaran, is standing by there, awaiting, hopefully, a fourth batch of hostages to be released. But for the time being, Ariel, unfortunately, 84-year-old Alma Avraham was released yesterday, immediately airlifted for emergency treatment, is still in critical condition, still in a life-threatening situation. Right, Ali. We have 39 hostages who are returned through this ceasefire release deal, are in hospitals across the country. 11 of them are in Schneider Children's Hospital right behind me where I'm standing. Nine children, two mothers, women who, all 11 of them arrived last night after being released from over 50 days in Hamas' captivity. Now, according to the hospital, all the children and the mothers, they are all in stable physical condition and continue to undergo physical as well as psychological evaluations. Now, obviously, for many, these are also sad moments because their family, almost all of the kids either has family who was murdered on October 7th or family who still remains in Hamas' captivity. That is a situation with some of the released hostages, but also reunification of families. Also, it's a bittersweet moment for almost all of these hostages. But as you mentioned, perhaps the hostage who was released in the most severe critical condition is 84-year-old Alma Avraham. She was taken directly from Gaza Territory via a military chopper to Soroka Hospital in Belsheva, the hospital there, saying that she is in poor physical condition and severe clinical condition. Now, we spoke earlier with her daughter who explained a little bit more about how critical the condition her mother is and that she basically was released perhaps hours before she potentially died. Doctors are still fighting for her life. Let's take a listen to what her daughter said. My mother did not deserve to come back like this. She was severely medically neglected. This was neglect during the entire period of her stay there. She didn't get her meds, life-saving meds. For those who don't understand medically, my mother was on the brink of death when she came to us. The doctors cannot report this, but I can report on behalf of my mother. She arrived at the pulse of 40 with a body temperature of 28 degrees, unconscious, all wounded. She was kept there in unfair conditions. She was abandoned twice. She was abandoned once on October 7th and abandoned a second time by all the organizations that should have saved her and prevented her situation. Ariya Lasseron, Night 24 News, the Middle East correspondent at the Schneider's Children's Hospital. Thank you very much for this Owen Alterman here in the studio. This is precisely what the Red Cross should have done, preventing these situations from happening, which brings me to ask Owen, because as part of this deal, at least according to the Israelis and the Americans, there were assurances that the Red Cross would get access to the remaining hostages where the last day of deal proper, still not the case. And my question to you, perhaps too many loose ends in this agreement, such as the issues of families not being torn apart, such as the issue of the Red Cross access, just too many question marks. Right, well, first a couple comments on the Red Cross and then the agreement. First of all, under international law, the Red Cross should have access to these hostages, who of course, it's a war crime to take civilian hostages in the first place. But once you do, you are supposed to give the Red Cross access to them. It's not supposed to be something Israel has to negotiate for. But it's not the Red Cross's fault that the Red Cross didn't go to visit them. How many guns has the Pope? Divisions has the Pope? How many divisions has the Red Cross? The Red Cross doesn't have the ability against Hamas's will to go and visit the hostages for obvious reasons. So it only gets to access once Hamas agrees to that access. And you're right, Eli, according to Prime Minister Netanyahu, this is one of the provisions that Israel negotiated for in the agreement. And of course, although Hamas is obligated to allow the Red Cross in, they're obviously not going to do it, given what Hamas is. But if it's negotiated for, then presumably, they could be incentivized to bring the Red Cross in. And that's what Prime Minister Netanyahu stood at the podium, reading from what he said was the agreement, and told the Israeli public that that was going to be the case. Hamas has not said that that's the case in the agreement. The visits by all accounts seem not to be happening and not set to happen. By the way, not only Israel saying this was in the agreement, it's the United States as well. That is saying this is in the agreement. It's an important clause. If it's a clause in the agreement, it is a material clause in the agreement. And if so, Hamas would be in material breach of the agreement, which brings us to the last part of your question. Was this actually in the agreement? Or more to the point, was there an actual, or is there an actual agreement? This agreement has not been publicized. It's not been made public. There are elements of it that are enshrined in the decision by the Israeli government and are there in Hebrew text in black and white. This is not one of them, by the way. There is an annex to that decision, which is classified, which includes what is presumably the agreement. But I don't think it's entirely clear if there is an actual text that both sides have agreed to. Even if there is a text that both sides have agreed to, does that encapsulate the full scope of the agreement or understandings? Are there looser understandings around the text, which give rise to more arguments? And if we talk about what's happening at this hour, is this A, an attempt by Hamas to extort Israel at the last moment to use psychological warfare against the families in the Israeli public at the last moment? And or is this an outcome of an agreement that wasn't a full meeting of the minds, right? Where not all the provisions were firmly agreed to by both sides where they can hold each other to them. Again, it's an and or, right? It may be both of these. But the fact we have one consequence of there not being a publicized agreement is, we don't really know who's right in a sense and whose feet should be held to the fire, because it's not entirely clear to the public what both sides committed to. And it may not be clear to the sides what they both committed to. There's too much room for interpretation, so to speak. And Mr. Raffin, before we get your take on what should we expect in terms of the operation on the ground, not if, but when the ceasefire will end, let it be tonight, tomorrow, or in a few days. We do wanna head now to the hostage square in Tel Aviv at 24 News Correspondent, Pia Seckelbach, standing by there. Pia, today is the last day of the deal that was agreed upon, putting the extension talk aside. And yet, we still do not know whether this final group of hostages that, again, was agreed on will be released. Right, Ellie, well, this is the last opportunity for families, as of now, if we leave aside the talks about an extension of the deal to get their loved ones back. We are hearing that families have received a preliminary list. Those families whose loved ones are expected to be released tonight, but they were also told to not rejoice yet, to not talk about it yet, because it is preliminary. And as you can see, or here possibly, here at the Hostage Square, a group of women are meeting here on a regular basis to sing, to sing a prayer for the return of all of the hostages. I'm sure you can hear. They're here just to create a sense of being together. This is really what this square has been for. People just trying to create a sense of togetherness. People coming here. Also, not necessarily only relatives of families, obviously, but people who want to come in to show their presence and to show their support for the families and for the hostages themselves. I'm sure that you've already seen this table here that has very much become the symbol of this square here, the table, where still you can see there is a plate for each and every hostage still on that table, because even though we speak about the deal that has seen really a lot of hostages released, the vast majority still remains in Gaza and what we've been hearing from families. Also, families of those who've already been released is that they will not give up their struggle until really the last hostage is released, and this is very much what this table here resembles. Now, there are many also other art installations here at the square. People are coming together here. Now the weather, winter is coming to Tel Aviv. The weather is quite gloomy, but that very much matches the atmosphere of tension and of sorrow, but I'm sure once the evening comes closer and now you can hear even a shofar here, once the prayer continues, once the evening comes closer, more people will come here and to actually be together in these hours where we can actually expect the release of the hostages, Elin. Yes, hopefully some moments of relief later on today with the potential release of more hostages. Back here in studio with Brigadier General Geffen, there seems to be this gap here because on the one hand, Qatari officials are saying, well, the honest truth is Hamas is not holding all hostages. It will need to look for some of them being held by their Islamic jihad or some gangs or some random civilians. And on the other hand, we are saying demonstrations of force or the very least of chutzpah, of audacity on behalf of Hamas, you know, flexing muscles. So what is the real situation? We are now probably at the end of one of the phases which is the first phase. They try to gain some trust, some ceasefire. Hopefully that the Israeli society will be the split. But they've seen in the past, you know, voices coming from their families, stop the war and nothing of this happened. The rage in Israel is so high and it's not, it's even growing every day. We hear more evidences of what happened. So this kind of hope, they don't, they have to look for other things, the other side. To hang on to you. Now we are entering a phase where Israel, we have to look for the, as I mentioned already, the soldiers and the others left there, there will not be any Israelis willing to. I would like to add another one, a very psychologically one. The military is really, would like to finish the Hamas capabilities. The 7th of October, I don't know how to call this what happened in those 24 hours. For the military, we think that have to be wiped out, not only because of the, of a try to revenge, but we have to reshape the minds of the other side. They believe that this is, as Nassara said, a weak country that 3,000 Hamas people have caused so much damage. That has to be overturned. We are in a situation where many of us said we are back in 1948. At the same time, we have to reestablish our presence in the Middle East. And this is, we have to remember it. This would be the consideration of the military and the government. And obviously before we head to the field to talk about the preparation of the Israeli forces to get back to the battle when the order will be given. Hamas is just confirming another death of an official. Muhammad Hamad, the official spokesperson for the city of Jerusalem, another Hamas official. In this respect, Hamas is now also seeing the toll. Okay, we want to turn out to the Shiba Medical Center as the doctor there is updating on the status of the hostages. This does, that were released from captivity by Hamas. Connectivity issues, we will get back to that later, but according to the Hebrew language update there, the physical status of the hostages that were released is okay, thankfully. We want to cross now to the Israel Gaza border to our 24 news correspondent, Zach Andrews, standing by there with the 24 news team. Zach, today is theoretically speaking the last day of the deal. As in midnight 01, the ceasefire expires. There's, of course, already much talk about the potential extension. It seems that this is the direction we're heading towards. And yet the forces underground are ready to the event that the war continues in a few hours, get back to business essentially. Right, and today's hostage situation resembles somewhat Saturdays with the media reports that are coming out saying there is some strain and contention in the list and who is going to be released. So we're keeping a very close eye on the developments that are happening there. The parent reports that are coming out of both the prime minister's office and from the US appear that there might be some problem with the children being released with their mothers. This was a part of the deal. Hamas agreed to that every release would include if a child was to be released, it would also be with their mother and potentially that has become a problem today. We're still waiting to hear exactly what specifically could be a problem here because earlier today there were reports that potentially some of the hostages are not even within the domain or control of Hamas, that the Palestinian Islamic jihad potentially has some of these hostages that were agreed to on the list. So we're still keeping a very close eye on that. Yes, and until this hour, theoretically speaking, 20 minutes ago the deal should have, the process of releasing the hostages should have started already, not the case again today. Zach Anders on the Israel-Gaza border. Thank you very much for this. Back here in the studio with Mr. Halan Geffen and our very own Owen Alderman. Owen on the sidelines of everything. Yes, a high-profile visit. I would use that definition. A high-profile visit today in Israel, Elon Musk who's been making many headlines throughout this war, meeting Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, Israeli President Isaac Herzog, touring some of the communities down south. What do you make of this visit? It's controversial. It's not a scoop. Look, Elon Musk, by the way, last spotted in Benjamin Netanyahu's office at the Israeli Parliament watching the IDF video of the atrocities. They're now famous or infamous by all accounts, extremely difficult to watch. 43, 44 minutes of video. So there's a picture of him and Netanyahu watching that. I met with Isaac Herzog, Israel's president, and Ellie also seen at the Knesset with Benny Gantz. Of course, a senior minister now in this government identified traditionally speaking with the anti-Netanyahu block in Israeli politics, of course, entering this government as part of a national unity government and a wartime government. This is a very controversial visit. The argument in favor of it, of course, is that Musk has a lot of power. That his political opinions is a raw material that he uses in deploying his power and in directing his more than 100 million followers. And of course, he owns the platform that has so much influence, right? And how he directs that platform and how he directs his followers is extremely important in shaping at least a slice of global public opinion. So to bring him here to get his attention for the day and to show him the communities, he was in Kfar Azza in that visit and going to see the communities that were attacked in October 7th and watching the video meeting with Israel's dignitaries that you can influence him to then influence others. I mean, that's the argument in favor of the visit. What are the problems? There are many. Number one, a finger in the eye to American Jews, right? At a time where American Jews have come out with such heartfelt support for Israel across so much of the political spectrum there to then take your finger and poke in the eye of a figure who American Jews see as someone who is fomenting and enabling anti-Semitism against them is extremely problematic for Israel diaspora relations at a time when they're really at a high against all of the odds of what we've seen over the last few years. So that's number one. And number two, again, the idea and the theory behind the visit, I think, is to influence him. But how much can someone as volatile and temperamental Zeland Musk be reliably influenced, right? Even into the medium and long term. Does the fact of what he sees on this Monday affect what he feels and what he transmits next Monday, let alone a month from now? And if not, then what you have done in this visit is, again, because don't forget, Prime Minister Netanyahu flew to San Francisco essentially to meet Musk, right? On his way to the United Nations just about two and a half months ago. By bringing you here, him here, have you essentially re-legitimized him so that when he comes out and has opinions and does things that you dislike a week or a month or now, he gets, he has that stamp of approval in a sense from the Israeli government who brought him here and hosted him here and showed him all of these places and gave him access to all of these high officials. So a very controversial visit, a visit with tremendous cost and even greater risk. But of course, there is the potential for payoff from Israel's perspective as well. Yes, time of money, daring risks that all those involved are taking. Brigadier General Geffen, excuse me, what we're likely to see at the end of this ceasefire, let it be tonight, tomorrow or in a few days, is to an extent rising international pressure not to go back to a full-blown war. With that said, Israeli officials, Israeli military officials are saying, there's no other choice. We're not even close to it to finish the job. Right. First of all, the hostages, because the only thing that moved the Hamas we know, we see every minute now, we can feel it is the pressure of the military in the next street and the next location of their command. And then there is a very clear decision by the government and by the public. At the same token that Hamas should not be near, the existence of Hamas should be eradicated, eliminated, whatever we choose, because people will not come back to Gaza, to the Gaza area, and they are around over 100,000 people. Yeah. Just today or the day yesterday, the mayor of Zderot said, if Hamas is stealing Gaza, we are not coming back. We will not come back to Zderot. So for me as well, and I believe there is no other choice. The military will find its way, have done so magnificently in the last two months, and will find a way to go in between the...