 Another thing that I want to talk about, and you do get that sense of what you were talking about done in the book, one thing that I think that people don't talk about enough is that the fountain head actually has a lot to say about cancel culture and the way that sort of group think drives cancel culture. And I'm not talking about rights here. And I'm not talking about the fact that a company say has no obligation to employ someone that they don't want to employ. Obviously, that's true. I'm talking about the larger phenomenon and why it's happening. It's something that Rourke struggles with for nearly the entire novel. There are so many examples in this book of the way in which these institutions, these intellectual monocultures can expel anyone who thinks differently. In fact, I couldn't help but think of this atrocious new concept of ESG. That's exactly what I was going to raise as soon as you started talking about this. Do you want to elaborate on that? What is ESG? Can you explain that to my audience who might not have heard of that? I mean, ESG kind of arose in the investing world. And it's the idea that we should judge companies and judge them financially, like as investors, not primarily or solely by how well they do in terms of achieving profits, but by how well they accord with certain ideas about environmental. That's the E, social, things like diversity. That's the S, and in governance, things like CEO pay. But really what it amounts to is egalitarianism and environmentalism. It's our companies following the ideals set out by environmentalists and by egalitarians. And it's this idea that was, I mean, Yaron and I talked about it a few short years ago, I think two or three years ago, I was like, had you heard this thing? And he kind of heard of it. And it was bubbling. And now it's everywhere. And basically, you can't explain how it got everywhere by a whole bunch of people thought, yeah, you know, what really is going to make companies great is if oil companies stop producing oil. And if we instead of hiring the best people for the boards, we look at their skin color and try to judge them as that this is clearly an intellectual fad that got taken over for a number of reasons. But one of the driving reasons is conformity. And you really see that in the fountainhead. Ayn Rand is often put as, oh, all her heroes are businessmen and all businessmen are heroes. That's definitely not fair in Atlas Shrug, because some of the villains are businessmen as well. But in the fountainhead, what you really see is she thinks that the businessmen, even though she admires businesses and enterprise, there's so much conformity. There's so much hostility towards innovators, because it's dominant in the culture that you we live in a secondhand culture, and that it's a real achievement for anybody to innovate and do something new. And that there's a lot about the dynamics of how kind of conformity works and how it's cashed in on by people who know that they're in effect have useful idiots at their disposal. And you get a lot of really deep dynamics about how that plays out in a society. Yaron, I would love for you to follow up on that, Yaron, if you wouldn't mind. Yeah, I mean, one of the I mean, the villain of the novel is is an intellectual who understands the dynamics of of conformity, understands how to shape kind of popular views. I mean, if he was a real life person, he'd be the guy behind the ESG movement, in a sense that he'd be the guy who wrote all the newspaper articles, wrote up ads, appeared on television, made the argument, if you can call it an argument for ESG, and then everybody conformed to him. He's the guy telling people who should be canceled and who should not. And he admits this. He, his goal in life is to destroy the achiever. It's to celebrate mediocrity and to tear down achievement and innovation and success, and really to destroy the hero of the novel, how it works. And so you get very much kind of the intellectual atmosphere of cancel culture. You get the conformity, you get the intellectual leadership. But what Rand presents is the antidote to cancel culture, which I think is so lacking in the culture we have today, and then his courage. You know, she has a character who basically says, I don't care. I mean, you cancel me. I'll fight you when it's relevant. I'll walk away and ignore you when that's the appropriate thing to do. But I'm not going to let you change my values. I'm not going to let you change my life. I'm not going to let you put me in any substantial way. I'm not going to go power. I'm not going to go gravel. I'm not going to apologize. I'm not going to admit there's something wrong. There's so many in our cancel culture who attacked tend to do. They tend to grovel and they tend to compromise and they tend to appease. He never appeases. He never compromises. He never gives an inch. And she shows that when you do that, and I think this is still true even today, you can win. And indeed, you will win. You'll win not just professionally as he does, but you'll win in life. You'll win by living a successful, fantastic life. So the solution for a lot of people for cancel culture, the people being canceled, is to stand up to the bastards. And I think that is really illustrated in the front of it. I appreciate that. And yeah, just reading, and the past couple of weeks, the past month or so, reading this book, you have all of these corrupted, rotten institutions that have no real standards, but who basically police the field of architecture and work to keep the atmosphere of architecture this kind of self-dealing fraternity. And you guys pointed out second-handers of what Rand would call second-handers. And I feel like Rand really gets at the way that these guilds and these professional associations work so tirelessly to gatekeep and make sure that people like Rourke are locked out of the profession. I mean, like in the very first chapter of the book, you can't escape this, which is why I've been telling people this is a novel about cancel culture. In the very first chapter, Rourke is being expelled from the Stanton Institute for refusing to design buildings that essentially have no integrity. And so I think in large part, this is a story about, in part, this is a story about this phenomenon that today we would call cancel culture. Just the way that the unions and these different guilds and academia and the government and the press all collude to like snap into gear to keep someone like Rourke from achieving any success and for me, that's one of the most exciting aspects of the story. And I think it has so much to say about what we're going through today that Rourke is surrounded by conformity and we're constantly asking, will Rourke get to display his genius? Will he finally be able to convince someone with power and money that his work is brilliant or will he have to sacrifice his integrity? And Rourke is a hero, I would say precisely because he is the one person who will never sacrifice his integrity. He's constantly being canceled. I mean, there's this, you pointed this out earlier, Yorone, there's this long stretch of the book where Rourke is just like locked out of the profession. And he has to work at like a granite quarry because no one will hire him. And not because he isn't good, but precisely because he is good. And so the whole book is just filled with suspense and tension. Will someone give Rourke a chance? Will he finally get his big break? And so I wanted to ask you, Yorone, and then we can go to Don, is what does the found head ultimately have to say about cancel culture and also how to beat it? Because there are solutions from the new right, which is to say how to beat it is to use the government to stifle industry, to engage in protectionism. Yeah, the new right wants to use cancel culture to beat cancel culture. It just wants cancel culture in its control. Which is the equivalent of using racism to beat racism? Yes, which is what the left is trying to do on the issue of race. But I think the most important issue here is to understand, and this is what Ayn Rand illustrates in the found head, to understand where cancel culture comes from. And it comes from the hatred of the innovator. It comes from the hatred of genius. It comes from the hatred of success, of prosperity, of happiness, of somebody who is living his own life by his own standard. So Howard Rourke is hated because he's the good, because he's successful, because he's self-interested. Cancel culture comes from a society that doesn't want people to stand in their own two feet, doesn't want people to live their own lives by their own standard, doesn't want people to achieve and be successful. And in a sense, the only antidote to cancel culture is a rejection of this philosophy and ideology of envy, which is hatred of the good for being the good, hatred of somebody because of their virtues. It is a rejection of the idea that people should not see. The thing that's so destructive about the morality of altruism is not so much that people are running out there to become Mother Teresa, because nobody wants to be the Mother Teresa. Nobody actually goes out and becomes Mother Teresa. The real evil of altruism, of the philosophy that says that what matters is other people, not you, is that you don't matter. That is, the real evil of it is it teaches us not to think about our own happiness, not to think about how to live the best life that we can, not to think about our own integrity, not to make the most of our life, not to be great innovators and successful and stick to our values and be how it works to the extent that we can give an ability. And the only way to get rid of that kind of envious mentality is to get rid of the ideology and therefore the morality that makes it possible, which is a morality of selflessness. It's a morality that tells you not to be self-interested. And as long as that is a morality that's dominant in the culture, you will have various forms of cancelling. Look, the church canceled Galileo for thousands of years. Tribes and societies have basically burnt at the stake, which is an extreme form of cancelling. Any innovator and any genius who challenged the status quo, I mean, the cancelling going on today is mild as compared to the cancelling that the Catholic Church engaged in or the cancelling that religious societies have engaged in for thousands of years and the tribal and national societies have engaged in for thousands of years. So we have always, society has always gone after the individual list, gone after the man, woman who stood out, who lived differently, who lived by their own standards. And that's what has to change. And to change that, you're not going to get government involved. You're not going to get, you have to adopt a different set of ideas. You have to adopt a different philosophy, a different morality. 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