 Welcome, welcome. Hello, I'm just going around to make sure that everybody has the new zoom link for our new meeting home. It's going to be exciting to see how many people follow the new link. Yeah, post around on discord and all the slacks and all the things. Sure exciting is the right word but our meeting notes still being held in our Google file. So they're in the wiki. So if you go to wiki.hyperlegio.org and go to labs, there should be a cardiac page now, just like, you know, areas or any of the other projects. Hi there. Thank you. It took me a couple of tries to get in. I don't know if others might be having that experience. I'm going to post in the discord channel Kayla were you able to join the discord channel. I was, I don't have the app though, I have to get that security approved before I can download it. But I can go to the discord. So can you see my hyper ledger foundation in the screen. Sure can. Where are the notes in this. Oh, I was just getting there. You would log in in the upper right, that would be the first step with your LF ID, and then go to labs at the top menu bar, I believe. And then in the left hand column there's cardio lab. And that's our main page. So then if you go on the left hand column one more time. There's 2022 cardio meetings, or 2023 excuse me, whatever year we're in. And then we would just need to copy one of the previous meetings and make anyone. So, I would open up maybe 427. And then go to the three dots in the upper right hand corner and copy. And that's where it's going to live so you said copy. And then you can edit title. And then you can get rid of copy of. Remove copy. And then delete or add as much as you'd like and then hit publish and then other folks can pop in as well. Or just hit publish now and then Kayla can go in and edit or what have you. The whole world. Well anybody with an LF ID can edit. It's very exciting being in hyper ledger. Now, it's all here, all the pieces are there. And I know there's about four different conferences going on today right now. For the that pertain to the identity community in the open source community specifically Linux foundation open source summit in Vancouver and European identity and cloud conference in Berlin. But there's a women in tech conference that's happening right now there's there's lots of things going on so this might be one where we send out the recording to folks so they can see the conversation after the fact. That will be better than we had in the past. The attendance is going to be slower but the support for the wiki pages and all that is a lot nicer. Sure is. Yep, they pay for all the memberships for all the things which is really handy to have in a community like this. And then I what we could do is go through just at the top here or maybe after the conversation just grab like 10, you know five minutes at the end of the call to walk through how to put the calendar invite like where to find anything but maybe just jump into the, I'll hand it off to you Caleb that's something I had in the back of my mind whatever wherever you think that best to have that conversation. Sure, sure. And I believe we have a guest speaker today, if I'm not mistaken, but before we get into that we can just go through our, our sort of kickoff, and some of this will change so this probably the last time because we're just organizing ourselves with the hyper ledger leading pages because they have some materials that we should be covering instead of our legacy stuff but just to go through that. Welcome to the May 11 version of the cardiac working group. This is our first time fully transitioned over to the support tools from hyper ledger so if you've made it here. You've, you've done well today. Good job. Anybody straggling over in the other zoom so that's great and I'll go ahead and cancel that moving forward. We are under the Linux Foundation antitrust policy so that means we're not talking about very explicit business opportunities here, or business dealings dollars things, etc. You can read that there, as well as the cardiac code of conduct which will probably shift to also leveraging a hyper ledger in short, the goal is to be nice to everybody to encourage participation and collaboration and to ensure that everybody has a voice in this community. If you have any concerns you can always reach out to Ken or myself as co chairs, and we'd be happy to to to help and if you have other issues of course you can reach out to hyper ledger as well. Anything else to add before we jump into today's agenda. Well done. Excellent. Excellent. Okay, and worse, we're on what you're seeing here is what we covered last time which was a lot of the ins and outs of our formal transition over type or ledger so that is all in the meeting notes where you can find things. Helen's done a great job trying to summarize and communicate on all of that as well. And if you've made it here, you've sort of your halfway there. So nice work. All right, excellent. So I believe that we've got our guest speaker for today. I don't know. Thanks Helen for putting that in the chat also so organized. I think we may be good to jump into things. I do have a anybody who wants to do a formal introduction of our speaker. Is there anybody who wants to introduce themselves. Thank you that as well. Elizabeth green or biomedical engineer and a certified for steward I've been attending hyper ledger meetings, usually with climate accounting and healthcare for the past two years over. Wonderful very nice to meet you. And as this is our first recorded meeting and hyper ledger I will go ahead and introduce myself as well my name is Helen Garno I am. I do marketing for in DCO I support cardiac and a lot of the communications efforts. I'm also chair of the hyper ledger marketing committee. And I've contributed in kind of fostering the growth of the community across hyper ledger projects including Indian areas over the last, I don't know five ish years. So happy to have cardiac here at hyper ledger and excited to see where the project goes and where the community takes us. I'm in real quick. This is Steve Davis. I am director of technical architecture at Shatskin systems. So I work directly with Kila. And yeah, nice to meet you guys. If nobody else. This is Ivan. The HR house CTO. I'm really interested in your program. Welcome. I didn't catch the company name Ivan is HR house. Ivan is that correct. Ivan. What did you let you add. Oh, perfect that works. Thank you. And Elizabeth I didn't, I didn't get your company affiliation correctly either. Because I don't have one. Would you like any attribution next to your name. Negative. I will leave it at Elizabeth Greenland. Anyone else today with it would like to introduce themselves. Hey, I think we are missing our guest speaker. So that is interesting. I think Trevor had booked them. So let me reach out to him. In the meantime, I can stall a little bit while we talk while we walk through how to sign up for our calendar invites. Excellent. I think we should cover. But let me just shoot Trevor a quick note to see what's going on. Great. I'm just getting to the right place to help sir can take notes. Also, you could also say that I'm kind of heading up the payer group right now so it's hyper ledger healthcare payer subgroup. Oh, on Monday is really early, 7am Pacific time. So you're all welcome to join what we're studying is kind of, I call it for short polluter payer healthcare. I'm basically a way to find out who's causing the damage healthcare damage and turn them into payers for the healthcare damage over. Excellent. Very nice to hear all of that. And if we're, if you're Eastern like I am 7am isn't so bad. 7am Pacific. Okay, I sent Trevor a note. I can go ahead and share my screen if that would be possible. Okay. Let's see here if I do the right thing I'm going to share my desk top. Yeah, there we go. There we go. First off in discord. If you join the hyper ledger foundation discord channel, which I'm not a super handy discord or quite yet I'm kind of a new. But anyways, if you join the hyper ledger foundation channel and I think I can somehow share it in some capacity. I put the chat I put it in the chat earlier. But you can find us if you scroll down to do, or like the labs I think there's probably a search at the top to, if that helps, because there's a lot. Yeah. There's a lot of search. I'll just scroll. They said fabric, not fabric, not indeed. Lab special interest groups. Community. There's a non creds cacti caliper firefly selling turns that labs here we go. Here's labs. There's cardiac under labs. There's the top here, the mailing list, and then the calendar which is kind of part of that groups I owe mailing list, and then this is the discord channel and then the GitHub, the new GitHub where they moved everything over to. So if you get to discord, and you click on this mailing list, this is what you should see something like this. I'm actually an administrator so if you have any questions please let me know I can help you please feel free to reach out. Make sure you log in with your LF ID up here in the upper right hand corner. Here all my groups, but once you're on this mailing list you should be able to hit join groups which will kind of be down here there'll be a button down here right around archived messages that you should be able to click on to join. From here you can go to the calendar and you can see today here's today's event. There are two separate events that you'll need to download and go through this process I'm about to show you. So one is for our second Thursday of the month call and then the other one is for the fourth Thursday of the month call. So you click on that item, you hit download event. And then you should have that that attachment. So then what I do is I go to my calendar, and you go to settings. And then here, if you have Google sorry this is for folks that do Google calendars because this is the most trickiest one because they don't love downloading these these files, but you go to there and in your left hand column. You can import, export. And then you can select your file, select your file, upload it, and then it should show up on your calendar. But you want to do that again for both the second Thursday and the fourth Thursday event. And then once you're on there you'll get all the they'll push you the reminders and you'll be able to ask questions on the discord channel and your life should be a lot simpler. So those are all of the notes I had. And then in terms of, you know, adding to the notes that that Kila is working on right now. You know that we that we use during these meetings. Yeah, again, just make sure you have your logged into the wiki the wiki hyperledger.org with your LF ID and then you'll be able to also contribute to those meeting notes as well. Yep. And you just popped him into the chat. But that's all the housekeeping. I still don't see our speaker that Trevor had booked and he again he's at a conference so let me see if I can ping Heather if she's with him. Okay, I think we can cover just one more housekeeping item which is that the recordings of these are going to go to the hyper ledger. It's going to be on YouTube channels and it'll be in a specific playlist that you can subscribe to. So if you do miss any meetings, the meeting recordings will be much more available since they'll be on YouTube, which is super helpful. Because I know that had been a lot of labor that went into managing our video or meeting recordings. And so now that that should be much more accessible there's some auto magical things happening in the background to make that happen. So that's a great way in case you can't make it to a meeting. We do. We probably should, for those of you who are attending for the first time I guess one question I have is, would it be helpful for us to do a high level walkthrough of what exists today, do you feel like you have some awareness of that already. It would be really nice to hear from those of you who are attending for the first time if some of that context and background would be helpful for you. No need. Go ahead. Okay. All right, excellent. Just sort of wondering if we should go back and do a, you know, what is cardio where what is the what's built what are the agents that we have available so far. All right, let me see. And we didn't come up with the backup agenda. In case our speaker wasn't coming. But I think what we have laid out a couple of goals for what we're going to work on and be interesting we have some healthcare people here I personally am a healthcare person just for context and background. So what we have, you know, where we started was our use case around COVID and that really, you know, slingshot it us forward with implementing a solution that works in a, you know, a comprehensive ecosystem around verifiable credentials that intersect in the healthcare sphere. As the COVID use case has diminished. We have several directions in which we can go and we think verifiable credentials would be valuable in the healthcare space. But we haven't really isolated one as the main new direction we have a couple and those couple of use cases include for example. Drug testing for the purpose of verification of employment. That's a good one because that's obviously very sensitive and private information and you want to be able to control who you share it with, but also to eliminate duplicate drug tests. For example, we had talked about, you know, if you work for both Lyft and Uber, they may require drug testing. And they each do it independently. And so that would save both the patient, but also the companies. Similarly, we had talked about other verifiable credentials, for example, for the purpose of school based health and educational requirements, but also provider credentialing, right, where you have a whole bunch of criteria, whether it's school or employment where there is an intersection with healthcare data. So for example, if you work in a healthcare facility, you need to be TB tested on a regular basis, you might need certain immunizations like your annual flu shot. And so getting that data exchange and incorporated into authorization for employment is a great application. For, for verifiable credentials and healthcare and the cardiac toolkit. And I don't know if you have anything you want to add to those use cases or sort of where directionally we're investigating. So those use cases, I think are illustrative of the capability, but are not by any means of limitation on what can be done. Those use cases were selected because of the minimal amount of effort required to take what is already existing in agents that are currently able to issue, hold and verify medical credentials. And with minimal modifications come up with additional use uses for the data besides the COVID testing vaccinations or exemptions that were supported previously. So those are the criteria used to select them not based on most usefulness nor viability in a particular market. So those are the selection criteria that were used, what's simple, what's quick to demonstrate that the technology can be expanded beyond the current limited use case that was targeted originally for COVID travel. And the schemas that we had drafted for those verifiable credentials included lab data generically, right, a lab test result. So, for example, TB could fit into our existing infrastructure as could some other lab tests if that were critical. And then also immunization, again, neutrally. So if you really want to talk about COVID vaccine or you want to talk about yellow fever for the purposes of travel, both of those would fit any of the vaccinations. Yeah, any of the vaccinations required for school attendance. Exactly. Either at a university or primary through, you know, K through 12 education, both of those are covered as well. We designed everything upfront to be generic for the type of data, not specific to a particular disease or particular type of tests. So generic tests results and generic immunizations are the two schemas that were initially put together and also exemption schemas for whatever reasons vaccination might be exempted schema creation is kind of a minimal effort. And the trickiest part is defining what types of data fields you want to have included. And then once that's done in a basically a JSON format, you can create new credential formats and new schemas for those credentials very quickly. Correct. Yes. And right now we're working in a non creds. Which we, you know, we did on purpose because there's the ability to control release of specific pieces of that information, right? Selective disclosure of revealing only certain attributes from the credential or predicate style proofs that give a date greater than grade equal equal to or less than any of those types of comparisons is a member of a set. Without revealing the actual values. Those are the types of privacy preserving features that the non creds schemas signature style allows for a presentation of the data to preserve privacy among only those fields that need to be revealed. Yep, exactly. Yeah, and I was going to add, you know, there is, especially when we talk about the healthcare space, there's obviously, you know, those standards implemented by HL seven. Those we have talked about integrating those and how we would work, for example, other structures into credentials but there's discussion around that that's needed to make sure that we can stay in the limited disclosure. Selective disclosure, excuse me, which we find so valuable. So I do have, let me just bring up through the interest of buying our speaker another minute. Or maybe not because she maybe is not going to be able to attend today. Wonderful. So let's take another minute then and I will just pull this up anyways. And just facilitate, of course, some of this discussion. So here are the components that exist today and we have the issuer agent, right, which is able to issue those credentials based on what we've just discussed. But again, as an agent, you know, there's there's room to expand on the formatting of those credentials that we've we've drafted to date. So we have the primary verifier agent as well, which can do both the verification of a credential, but then also the issuance in this case, it says trusted traveler, but this would be a derivative credential that would be passed back to the patient person. So that they're not having to then redisclose direct health information. So for example, it may be if we're talking about the school scenario, they may share with the nurse agent, you know, person agent, their health specific credential. And the nurse gives them a credential that says you're cleared for school from a health perspective across a variety of requirements. And then so then they would potentially have two credentials in their wallet at that point, right? The initial health credential plus the derivative credential. And then moving forward when they check in for school and they finish their registration, they might verify that with a secondary agent, right? Maybe that's like the final enrollment check if we're just taking on the school model. All of this is built on top of the schemas that we've drafted related to those specific credentials. Again, we have a few, but primarily a lab based schema, but and also a vaccination or immunization schema. And it's all sitting and leveraging what was previously known as machine readable governance now known as decentralized ecosystem governance. Yeah. D, E, G. So that's a little bit about sort of where we've spent our time and the components of what we have today. Can't you have anything to add to this? It's currently built on top of the hyper ledger indie networks because of the support for the non creds but other credential formats can be supported, and other ledger types are also supportable. But we selected the most privacy preserving ones to kick off the work and be able to demonstrate the highest level of security for the persons, the patients data as they're working with it. Because of the involvement in the patient actually doing the sharing, they receive the credential, they share the credential. Consent is built into the transfer model to require the consent of the user before any data is shared. Looking further down the road we looked at what are consent credentials that might allow patients to authorize the sharing of their data, or the use of their data in other ways for research or for other purposes that they can can also consent to and looking at a specific consent credentials that might be exchanged to both provide the consent and then a receipt back indicating what consent has been recorded on behalf of an organization. And because we have someone with us today, Elizabeth, who sits in the payer space, one, for example, one use case here would be that the health plan is the issuer of a coverage credential that could be then used. Or, for example, you could also do like pre authorization credentials I think there's a lot of opportunity in the payer side and I know that has. There has been some activity in the healthcare sphere related to credentials in the health plan or health insurance sphere. Do you have, do you want to not to put you on the spot here but do you have ideas about how verifiable credentials fit into the payer space. Yeah, that's putting me on the spot. You have to come to my meeting and ask me there. Okay. I, we look forward to engaging and learning about what you guys are doing and your interest special interest group. Excellent. Okay, well that's a little bit of background on sort of what we've got today where we're thinking this would go. So, although we're open to exploring other applications for what we've built, whether it's a very easy transition like another immunization or lab based use case, or if it's a slight pivot from that. I think there's a lot that we could do with the toolkit that we have today. One thing that I think I was talking to Ken about earlier this week is just the idea of having other representatives from different parts of kind of the healthcare industry come and talk about their like challenges or experiences with secure data flows, and how cardiac could be applied so one of the people that it are in that is in our kind of ecosystem is had successfully run a drug testing kind of startup and and had some experience with how to convey drug testing results from DNA to point B to point C, from the subject to the lab to the employer, etc. And so having them come and talk if anybody, you know, for interested, I could extend an invitation to that person as well, and see if they would want to come and talk about drug testing because I know that was one of the extensions that we talked about for cardiac. Yes, and I believe that that was on our plan to have them as a guest speaker for two weeks, the two weeks from today's meeting, and hopefully we can, I would like to see that continue as we're in this exploration phase to bring in outside people so that we can assess their needs and how well the technology matches up with what they're trying to do to see if we're solving real world problems, real world problems always make for a much more interesting and viable project. I think we've got the technology and it solved a real world problem now let's see if we can expand that to a greater set. So, let's see if we can get the invite. Over to our person on the drug testing side of things that were basically a corporate drug testing for employment so I think that would be an interesting one. I think our shuffle today on our first meeting move may have caused a little bit of problems for our original guest speaker for today but I think that having a slot of 1520 25 minutes on allowed for various parties to come in and present what their real world problems are will help us better focus the work that we're doing. So I'd like to see a continued set of those as many as we can find who are interested and willing to share. I was also introduced by the hyper ledgers staff to the folks at the healthcare special interest group and I couldn't remember at hyper ledger I couldn't remember did you guys present to them already in the past or no. Yeah. I don't think so can and I talked about this the other day as well. I think we are planning to attend get so that we can get a feel for it and then potentially plan to present or further engage. Okay cool yeah I they made that kind of outreach and introduction so happy to pass that along to you all. So you can work on next steps. I think that would be ideal that would let us become more familiar with what they're doing and then they can see what we have to offer and see if there's any synergy there I think they're likely will be. And so we feel and I both feel like that would be a good introduction to make a mutual introduction to make. Nice, I will reply and CC you guys are at you did that thread. And also just pop in the chat here the link to the blog that went out yesterday the announcement blog that went out on the hyper ledger website. Let me hit everyone there we go. So this is sort of the formal coming out party for Cardia. And please feel free to share in your networks as well it all it has links to many different things, lots of links in there. But if you click on Cardia at the very first word of the very first sentence it'll it'll go to that wiki page that has all the, the meeting information so that truly is the quickest one click way to join and start participating in the community. It's exciting to me to see the different pieces of technology support and community support that hyper ledgers made available to us it's a heck of a lot easier to to run the meetings and take the notes and get them published and the getting the videos posted and everything it just makes the f the overhead part of it be reduced so that we can focus on actually getting stuff done. I agree very exciting. However, I think one of the victims of that transition of the overhead and all of the exciting stuff is that we didn't get our guest speaker on to this meeting today so we apologize everybody in advance we do have a guest speaker that we will have rescheduled. She is not to spoil her introduction for the future but engaged in the immunization space specifically around the national US national network of immunization registries and some support services around that so that's certainly an area that we've been looking at how it can support I know personally working with those immunization registries there's a lot of room for improvement. And so we look forward to having her at a future scheduled meeting as similarly as the drug testing contact that we've mentioned here so we've got those two guest speakers lined up. We'll continue to work on queuing up some others if anybody has recommendations or can think of someone who might be valuable. Please reach out to can or I or throw them in the chat now. We'd love to get them on the docket for future meetings as we push both the who do where do we want to position cardiac for the future in tandem with some of the technical updates that we're working on. All right, can you have anything else you want to add otherwise maybe we'll give everybody back little time. I think that it would be prudent to give people back time this week. And I think we can juggle between the two different speakers find which ones best for in two weeks and which one would be best for one month from now so that we think there's anything in particular that would preclude us from having either one speak in either slot so let's see which one fits best for their schedules and schedule appropriately. Excellent. Elizabeth you did have a question in the chat. Do we just want to try to discuss that quickly before we formally adjourn. Yeah, so I was kind of wondering if you're going to be adding to the ERC 1155 that the climate group is finished, or is still probably still working on the token, or if you're going to try to make your own tokens, because they should be multi purpose and I think there's a soulbound aspect to this token there's a locked any T function. I didn't see any only owner function but it looks like the auditor has different permissions from the emitter. And so my question is when you, you know why not use the same token. I can use the same ERC 1155 and maybe either add to that emissions token, or I guess if you make it a different one, can you make it compatible at least. Can you look through the code there and make sure that it's compatible so that somebody who has say health data, and they want to use it in the future for to get a carbon offset they could do that swap using the code that's already been established or do you already have code that has been established and maybe the climate action people should be trying to make sure that we're compatible with. The idea itself has does not have any interaction with tokens at this point in time. It is possible to facilitate that but we have not done anything to this point to either produce or consume tokens we have only verifiable credentials in the data model right now and decentralized identifiers. I mean, it's something we can take a look at but it's not an area of our primary focus up to this point. So, looking at the link you have there, we can see what they've gotten evaluate how it might interact with what's going on at cardiac. Okay, great. So we can maybe do that as a takeaway and come back with some thoughts for the thoughts on that at our next meeting is that fair can. Yeah. Okay, and I've added that added that to our meeting notes as well. Okay, excellent. Well with that said we're gonna will adjourn early give you all a little bit of time back apologies for the mix up today we look forward to ironing these out moving forward. So, very nice to meet those of you that are new faces and welcome. Thanks everybody. See you in two weeks. Thank you.