 Good evening everyone welcome to tonight's Common Council meeting as as always before we start the meeting We ask our city clerk to read the court for the week Madam City clerk. Thank you Excuse me if you have integrity nothing else matters if you don't have integrity nothing else matters Thank You Madam City clerk Call a 23rd regular meeting of the Common Council of Order. Please call the roll Born Gisha Hannah Heidemann Kittleson Clowness Manny excuse Meyer Montemay or Rinflaich Ryan Smith Vanderweel excuse for hassled and Wongaman 14 present quorum is present at this time is time to pledge allegiance to the beautiful country we live in Allman Ryan, which please lead us I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God Indivisible with liberty and justice for all Before thank you all and Ryan before we proceed with the approval of the minutes I'd just like to remind the older month to please make sure that your mic is on Close to you around this area here not on your hand because when you turn we lose contact And we have had some some viewers Concerned that they're not able to hear clearly. So please put it on as it's not as well as you can Prove of the minutes President Hanna Thank You mr. Mayor. I would do for the approval of the minutes second motion and second to approve minutes under discussion Call them and Heidemann. Did you wish to say your lights beeping? Sorry, okay All right, we're off. Oh, it's still beeping there we go. We are I Take it you don't want to engage a discussion Any discussion there be an island in favor say aye any opposed motion carries Resignations attorney McLean From the sake you're advising that She's resigning from the mayor's international committee working in Green Bay and isn't able to make Motion to accept and file Second motion second to accept and file any discussion there'd be a non-onlying famous a I any opposed motion carries and there's a letter to the mayor from Richard Meyer the manager of the business improvement district advising that Mary Moran he has resigned from the business improvement before And we have motion to file that letter to Any discussion all in favor say aye any opposed motion carries Today I hereby submit the following appointment for your consideration Considered for appointment to the business improvement district to fill the unexpired term of Mary Baronde whose term expires 910 2010 signed by the mayor This will lie over what I will do is ask my secretary to email you a little bit of bio about this individual This individual is being Submitted for appointment by me on the recommendation of mr. Dick Amiris from the bid district And that lies over Thank you very much turn him clean Next item on the agenda is a proclamation for mr. Lucio Fuentes at this time. I'd ask them friend to step over Is there anyone that doesn't know Lucio raise your hand? I Think everyone knows Lucio. I've known Lucio since May 1st 1984 Lucio and I go back a long way. I even worked for him from the first came to Sheboygan We've had our ups and downs both as friends both as colleagues business partners and so forth We've done just about as much as anybody can do in a lifetime together And as I said had our ups and downs, but we've made that full circle to where we can respect each other and respect each other's opinions and differences which is what I see here in the Common Council current lately and That that is very appreciated As I said Lucio has been around the community for a long time He has done an incredible amount of good to the community both as director of our partners Which used to be a community of amigos in 1984 when he first started Lucio is probably one of the ones that will continue to be around after all those are gone When I first came here in 1984 he talked about retiring. He hasn't yet. So he's not going to this proclamation This proclamation is long overdue And it's very well-deserved Whereas on March 1st 1975 Lucio Fuentes began his public service career as director of programs for community amigos And whereas Lucio Fuentes has devoted himself as a servant to the citizens of Sheboygan area for the past 33 years And whereas Lucio Fuentes has provided leadership by being the founder and director of partners for community development Incorporated the founder and treasurer of the Amigo scholarship foundation and the founder and president of superior minority enterprises Serving as a role model and whereas Lucio Fuentes established and built the new headquarters for partners for community development in 2001 and Whereas Lucio Fuentes was the developer of partners made of you townhouses and farm labor housing development in Hartford, Wisconsin As well as developer of partners sunny side townhouses a tax credit a forcible housing development in the city of Sheboygan and Whereas Lucio Fuentes continues his community services by also serving on the Sheboygan civil service commission And as you heard last time he served under four or three or four mayors, which is a long time The Wells Fargo Community Board the Sheboygan Chamber of Commerce St. Clement Church Endowment advisory council and church choir Sheboygan Contractors Association and the National Weatherization Operators of Wisconsin Association And whereas Lucio Fuentes serves as a role model of a true public servant and community leader Now therefore I want Perez by the virtue and authority vested in me as mayor do hereby extend my personal thanks and Congratulations by declaring March 3rd Monday March 3rd 2008 is Lucio Fuentes day Thank you Thank you very much Is this thing up? I think so, right? Yeah, it's very nice to be a recognized especially when you're recognized for something you do and when you love what you do so much I was telling my wife that I'm like those senators and congressmen that I think I'm gonna work until I'm 90, you know And never leave the job Of course, you know, you have to keep your health and and and keep That desire in front of you, but I'm a simple man. You know, I I don't change a lot Find something I like and I and I stick to it I was telling a friend the other day that I've been living in the same house for 27 years And I've been working for the company for 35 years And I've been married to what the same woman for 44 years. He said oh my god You've been married for 44 years that you ever think about divorce. You know, she's just thought about murder a couple of times Yeah, when I first came to Chihuahua again, you know, I was really impressed with the city and The German-Dutch culture has treated minorities very well And I think that's why many minorities have succeeded and light Chihuahua. I Remember when I first came to this area my parents were migrant workers So my my family bought a home in Cedar Grove and I used to live in Chicago So I came to a visit and she told me well here in Cedar Grove the Hollanders They don't do anything on Sundays, you know, they you can't watch the car. You can model on like that I like these people. I think I like to move over here And I get very nervous that's why I'm not a politician because I hate speaking in public But I think that you know the having all these different cultures is an advantage not a disadvantage You know, we learn from each other. We become stronger and wiser. I think the fate of the world Lies on the hands of the United States You know as we get into this world markets and we have to understand other cultures and other languages But we practice here with the people that we know because we have a lot of a lot of different ethnicities in the United States and My mouth is getting dry again That is one of the the greatest benefits of Not only learning somebody's culture and language, but also understanding the differences and being able to work with them. I Accept this award your proclamation. I thank you all I Just wanted to to let those committee members today told you that out If you voted for me, I was gonna buy a car. I was only kidding Thank you very much There would be no one no one on the public forum Next item on the agenda is mayor's comments. I wanted just to briefly touch on some snow issues and concerns. I wonder why Again as everyone knows we've had one of the most bitter winters Very unfriendly and very demanding winters a lot of snow Snow melt freezing ice snow melt freezing ice slippery conditions a Lot of build-up very little salt finally get the salt a lot of overtime people working ungodly hours just to keep our streets clean I Wanted to make a point to the public in particular that We're aware of the situation that just stands right now in Sheboygan and probably all over the state of Wisconsin and other neighboring areas Mother nature has not been very very friendly with us this year We we are aware of the situation and we were trying to deal with it in the best way that we can with the resources that we have available I Wanted to to assure the the public And the alderman of one thing that I keep hearing when I get calls and I get calls I Could say they literally every day lots of them Is that we're not out there? Trying to clean the streets and asking people or move their cars because we want to give tickets In order to make money to pay for our city bills What is being collected from the tickets? There's nowhere near what's going to be needed to cover our over budget and cleaning and overtime this year Nowhere near So for the city to even think that we're gonna go out there and collect and issue citations So we can collect money so we can pay it's not the case The reason police are issuing citations and rightfully so it's their job to enforce the law That is because people still are not moving their cars Everyone that's called me about a ticket got one because they didn't move their car There's no other reason for issuing citations I would have preferred that warnings would have been given out when my emergency proclamation was issued the the Intent was or the motivation was public safety and excess not enforcement It quickly became enforcement and a barrage of citations were issued Rightfully so because people who are moving their cars, but that's where it took a turn And I think perhaps some other public out there Misunderstand what exactly we're trying to do and what we're trying to to accomplish The other thing I briefly wanted to touch on is it's not over folks when this no melts We got potholes lots of I went out there driving for about an hour. I think everywhere. I went I hit two or three in the same block. I Couldn't believe how many potholes there were today. It's just there's just a lot of them People don't like them. I asked the public to cooperate and drive a little slower a little bit more carefully Don't try to swerve them swerve the pothole because what just gonna happen you're gonna hit another car coming around or someone parked It's bad. We know it's bad. We're not ignoring the situation just like we're not ignoring the snow situation the potholes are out there There was an instance when we started Taking care of the potholes because people were complaining about the potholes When we did that and people were calling complain about the black top because it was sticking to their cars And it wasn't adhering to it. So it's very hard to balance the need to cover and and and what people perceive as the work that's being done The key point I'm trying to make is we're aware of the situation. We know what's going out there We're doing the best we can and I commend Bill Bidner and his public works crew for for the job there They're doing it's a job. Most of us don't get to see Because for the most part a lot of us are asleep when they're out there and a lot of us are in our offices Nice and warm when they're out there patching holes or taking care of Drains and drainage and so forth. So just so just so people people know the other thing that I want to just quickly point out is I Want to thank the people who have called with an enormous amount of ideas and suggestions on how to provide a better service Some of them actually sound pretty good and what I've decided to do is sometime when all the dust settles down Is to have a at least one public input session and invite the people to come in and Discuss those suggestions with public works myself and any all women wish to be present So that we can have a dialogue a lot of times Well, not a lot of time But it's possible for what some of us to miss something to miss a point And I think what the public is trying to say is listen. I'm out here in the streets. I'm out here to live in here I'm driving around you're missing this and that may be what we need to hear I'm not saying that everything that they bring to us as input is going to be quickly and immediately Implemented but at least it'll provide us with a forum for the dialogue So we can get some ideas and get get each other talking and understanding what's going on Final point Public works is working extremely hard on godly hours. They're really doing their job and I commend them If you were to call it three o'clock though, I don't know who's going to answer Thank you Next item on the agenda President Hannah consent agenda Thank You mr. Mayor I Would move that all our areas be accepted and placed on file and all our C's be accepted and adopted second motion the second twenty three one two three six twenty six Under discussion Thank You your honor, I guess I just like to mention document number 2320 And to the alderman if I could do them. No, thank you That our wellness awareness Outletter has gone out to all our employees our wellness committee is alive and meeting on a regular basis And we're making wonderful progress. I'm happy to report Just to let you know also we're having an employee appreciation day on Friday March 7th And we're really excited about that as well. There's also the first copy of the HR newsletter Giving you some information as to what's happening as well I'm open to all your suggestions and I welcome your support and even your participation in our in our project We're going to do everything we can to keep you informed on a regular basis as to what's going on So thanks from the wellness committee all the money play kittleson presented and lieutenant Willie I've presented to the staff meeting this morning of Presentation on this particular matter and I would just like to commend all the kittleson and lieutenant Williams for the excellent job They're doing quite frankly, I think The two perfect people were picked for the job. So keep up the good work. Thank you Please Thank you, your honor. I also enjoyed this newsletter. That was funny Great, and thanks all them kitchen for the hundred dollars. Thanks for helping it out The other thing I just wanted to ask a question of salary and grievances in regard to 23 24 the point the appointment of school crossing guards How was it done before this is a change I just was wondering how was it done before that this change needed to All the kittleson, I mean all the payunas Did you want to speak all of them? Okay, all the moment in my own shoes you have the explanation that's okay The explanation is that The way it was being done before is I believe the traffic sergeant would would interview the people and make a selection from a List of candidates and had indicated an interest or applied And that's okay. That was there was perfectly or perfectly all right What happens is there was in the city code a section there that said that all crossing guards needed to be Picked out from a list of qualified applicants that were provided by the Civil Service Commission Why it's there. I don't know it's been there for a lot of years So the code needed to be either enforced or needed to be changed in this case the community decided to change it there's really not a lot of a a lot of need to have The crossing guards go before the Civil Service Commission just like a lot of other city employees do not go before the Civil Service Commission President Hannah, thank you, mr. Mayor, and I think that The new process will keep the kids safe the citizens be safe to be appropriate Interviews by the Human Resources Director. I just think it's a much more Flexible and streamlined process to keep the crossing guards at their stations, right? Thank you, president All my gisha just a quick note that it also includes background checks on all of them. That was brought up at the meeting as well That's president board. That's what I was going to say Anything else? Okay, so we're on 231 to 2326 Police call roll Warren Bauch gisha Hannah Heidemann Kittleson Cleanness Meyer Montemayor Rin Flesch Ryan Smith for hassled and Wongamon 14 eyes motion carries President, thank you. Mr. Mayor. I'd like to pull forward 2235 Under matters wide over Do you like to make a motion put it? Yes, I would like to make a motion The to place the resolution upon its passage Second motion and second to put 2235 on page 9 Upon its passage any discussion There'll be a none All in favor say aye Any opposed? Motion carries. Thank you very much We're part of committees to 2327 by the board of parks and forestry commissioners Recommending adopting the city of Sheboygan comprehensive park recreation and open space plan All in myer. Thank you, your honor. I would also like to pull forward 2328 and 2356 Okay, and those are duplicates and I would like to make a motion to accept and file all our o's and put the resolution upon its Passage motion and second under discussion under discussion your honor I would like to open the floor up to Chad Paula check and and fry wall. This has been a long time coming this plan and If anybody has any questions on mr. Paula check will introduce and fry wall Is that a motion to open the floor? Yes. Is there a second motion and second any discussion? All in favor say aye. Any opposed? Motion carries Please come up for the podium Thank You mayor. Thank you older persons This has been a planning process. That's been underway for like alderman Meyer said for a while prior to me coming on board with the city And it was a joint effort between the planning department and the pop Parks and forestry and public works, and we've got to come to a plan That's in front of you. You've seen it and free wall is which Shri. Branderson's the city obtained them to do The help with us assist with the plan and I'm going to turn it over to her But I wanted to just mention that The people that are from the city in the back all have been involved with this bill bulky bill bit and their Paul Meyer and Paul at Enders So if there is any questions, we'd be happy to answer them with that I will turn it over to Anne with Shri. Branderson Good evening. I know you have a very long agenda, so I'll keep my presentation very short the the advantages of having a Five-year park and recreation and open space plan are many One thing it allowed us to do is to work with this the staff from various departments and also from the public and Some of the stakeholder groups in your park system and Steve who provides the recreation from the school district and kind of take a long Look on the horizon in the next five years and what kind of issues this the city of Sheboygan's a park and recreation departments might be facing it also allows you to to put an updated Report on file with the DNR which will allow you to be eligible for grants for the next five years So that's a plus for the city of Sheboygan The planning process included working with the staff from various departments as I mentioned talking to the public and Meeting with various committees and researching the plans of the county and other agencies that affect the provision of parks and open space in in the city of Sheboygan this plan emphasizes the enhancement and Expansion of your existing parks and parks facilities Preservation and improved access to your rivers and your beautiful lakefront and shoreline of Sheboygan President preservation development of natural corridors and Parkways, which is something you've been working on for a long time and continued development of the city's system of trails and Sidewalks to connect natural areas and recreational opportunities. I've done a lot of these plans. I've been in the business since well for about 20 years and You guys have a very beautiful park system here and you have the beautiful advantage of having the river a couple rivers and the lakefront So and you've taken a nice advantage of it I think some of the things that you might be facing coming down the pike over the next five years We'll be working on various bicycles and pedestrian facilities to make your city more friendly for alternative transportation developing the shoreboy Sheboygan American with Disabilities Transition Plan to catch up with the ADA Continue to replace outdated equipment, which is something you're working on prior to the plan I think you have some a ways to go with that, but you've been making nice progress And then continue to focus on the riverfront and lakeside parks that you already enjoy and making them even more of a destination For your residents and your and the tourists in the area and I could take any questions you might have Thank you, your honor I studied over the document today, and I noticed that through the five years all of the projects are going to come to about Seven million dollars, I believe and if we would be lucky enough to qualify for all those grants What would those grants total approximately? Well, the grants are generally speaking there You want me to ask me? Okay. They're generally speaking there are 50 percent Funding the grants do not fund all sorts of park facilities. They do fund things like trails Riverfront waterfront access that kind of thing. They do not fund active use park facilities Unfortunate that's unfortunate for Sheboygan and for all cities and and towns and villages that are struggling to provide active use park facilities The capital improvements plan that we included in the plan my experience and the advice I give the staff in the park the parks committees that I work with on this kind of work is to put everything in the plan And because it's not in the plan, it won't happen if it's in the plan. It might still might not happen But if it's not in the plan, and it's not kind of a goal set out on the horizon, it definitely won't happen So the seven million in capital improvements plan it could take just a five-year plan But it might take you 10 15 or 20 years to achieve those things the plan gets updated every five years But by no means if I know in any community that would achieve their told everything in the plan in a five-year time frame But it's good to revisit it every five years Thank you Any other questions? Okay, all right. Thank you very much so we have a motion on the floor to Accept and file 23 27 23 56 and 23 28 and to put the resolution on 23 28 And to put the resolution on 23 27 upon its passage Any further discussion? Could we also add in there that you need to file the other two duplicate resolutions get that in there, too? Can we change that? Is you include that who second and who second okay? Okay? Okay? Then the other two Resolution duplicates will be filed. Yep, but pass the first one. Yeah Okay, no no Discussion, please call it back. Yes, uh, Hannah Heidemann Kittlesen Clowness Mayer Montemay or Rindflash Ryan Smith for hassled Wongamon and boron 14 eyes motion carries 2329 to 2342 to be referred Resolutions introduced three 2343 By Olderman Manny and Gisha requesting senator Leipholm and representative and Akron to craft legislation that will change a current Municipality union arbitration requirements Olden Gisha Thank You. Mayor Perez. I moved that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion and second under discussion Mayor Perez if I may I Want to credit Alderperson Manny wasn't here this evening For spearheading this and I thank him for asking me to sign on the spirit of What Alderperson Manny was trying to come about with was twofold one was to allow communities to have wages for its employees represent the community and and the residents With a little bit more flexibility for cities and secondly as the state deals with its 650 million dollar budget Deficit the fear that shared services or pardon me shared revenue sources the monies We get back from the state of Wisconsin Proportionately will be affected will cause an immediate impact in a wait potentially and for future years and if the state is going to Arbitrarily make those changes on us. We should also have the ability to react to those changes They can't really have it both ways and this allows us to help react. Thank you. Thank you any further discussions There being on all in favor say aye any opposed motion carries 2344 to 2348 lies over 2349 to 2352 to be referred 2353 a report of committee 6 2353 by law and licensing Recommendant denying beverage operators license number 6420 based on the applicant's record of violations Related to the license activity and failure to cooperate with the committee vice president borne Thank you, your honor. I move that the report of committee be accepted and adopted Motion in second under discussion Under discussion is crystal downs here tonight She isn't here your honor. Thank you. Please proceed miss downs had two opportunities to appear before the committee She did not and therefore the committee Decided not to deny the license based on our lack of cooperation with the committee and her Record of violations relate related to the license. Thank you Any further discussion? There being none all in favor say aye any opposed Motion carries Okay, yeah, we're gonna take a roll call. Yeah, please go roll. Yes, sir Hannah Heidemann Kittleson Clowness Meyer Montemayor Rinflaich Ryan Smith for hassled Wongamun Boran and bulk 14 eyes motion carries report of committee 7 2354 by salary and grievances to whom was referred RC number 3780708 By the joint municipal court advisory committee who met and discussed the salary of the municipal judge and Recommended that the salary of the judge be established at $35,000 States that the salaries and grievances makes no recommendation and wishes to have the common counsel act upon this Alderman Kittleson Thank you, your honor. I would move that the RC be accepted and adopted motion second Under discussion under discussion. I guess Pursuant to the report of committee. I would like to bring forth the following proposal on this Particular RC and that is that we established the salary for the judge of the municipal court at $20,000 to be retroactive to May 1st 2007 and Then for the two-year term or that we also established that salary at $20,000 for 2008 So that is a two-year term at $20,000. I believe she is receiving $18,000 right now So for 2007 we The salary would be set at 20,000 and for 2008 the salary would be set at 20,000 that being said we this council has never really established that salary for the municipal judge I'd like it be it to be it further resolved that we Establish the salary at $35,000 $35,000 on May 1st 2009 and $36,000 for May 1st 2010 And that would coincide with the next judicial election cycle and Also that council continues to set the salary every two years and coinciding with each election cycle I think in this way council we have one full year ahead of us to measure how well the court is performing and I think I think we would be fiscally irresponsible if we didn't Monitor the court system for just one more year to make sure that it is performing as we expected to before Establishing that salary at a higher rate Motion in a second and then on the further discussion. Are you good time? Thank you president How well, thank you, Mr. Mayor just a question. I know this is a joint operation with the city of Kohler do they need to weigh in on the on the salary discussions? How is that him? Our contract with the mayor of Kohler is that the judge is a city employee. Thank you and Kohler agrees to share in the in the costs including the salary based on their They don't weigh in on Establishing the salary Although they did have input at the joint municipal court advisory committee as a committee member, but that's And as a committee member and as a recommendation to this council next we have all man Ryan Thank You mr. Mayor I Can agree with the salary being 35,000 dollars for 2009 which is the next election cycle the present municipal judge being Elected this past April so that would it's a two-year term But I do not believe that Changing the the salary now, especially retroactive to last May From 18,000 to 20,000 is the proper thing to do with the the judge being an elected official I believe she's at 18,000 and this will just change it to 20,000 and actually You know, I mean you you people run for office Knowing what they're getting into I do believe she's done an outstanding job for my knowledge of it She puts in a lot more hours than what the position was originally made out to be but The judge also knew what she was getting into when she got into it I mean she knew what the salary was so I Myself I do agree that 35,000 dollars in 2009, which is the next election cycle is Appropriate for that position, but I do not agree that we should do a retroactive Pay raise to May of last year. Thank you Next we have my present board Thank You your honor first of all in Just a brief response to what alderman Ryan said. I think Attorney McLean can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the municipal court judge is one of the few positions Elected positions where you can make an adjustment to the salary As long as it's a year prior to the final year of her term So from that standpoint on a legal basis, I think we're we're okay if we decide to do that tonight I'm going to I'm going to support Alderman kiddleson's motion I Would have given judge Dela hunt a raise to 35,000 dollars in a heartbeat If I would have a piece of paper in my hand tonight on municipal court stationery Saying that she was going to continue to do the summons hearings and the the ritz for arrest for people that don't pay their fines, but I cannot support paying her 35,000 dollars a year when She summarily Suspended this although she was kind of doing it on a voluntary basis But then right at the end of the year stopped doing the summons hearings and the ritz and that was what was creating That procedure was creating a lot of her additional hours And as I said if she was continuing to do that and we had some insurance She was going to do that with an increase of salary up to 35,000 dollars if I had it in writing As I said, I would give her that raise in a heartbeat But under the circumstances I cannot support giving her a raise up to 35,000 dollars When we have no assurance that she's going to maximize the collection procedure. Thank you Next we have Alderman bulk. Thank you, Your Honor. I just wondered because the Judge was so Public about this whole discussion. Do we know will this will she stay if we give her this extra 2,000 a year? Has anyone contacted her? Because she was pretty adamant it appeared to me in the shabuigan press that she wanted 35 or she was going to take her Ball and go home. So I guess I would need to Agree with all the person born in that I would want some assurances one. I don't know what she gets for an extra $2,000 I don't know why that would incent her to stay So kind of agree with Alderman Ryan and that why the two is that a gesture of is that a minor gesture of goodwill or what and then Secondly, I guess I would want to make sure before we gave her a significant increase that she was going to maximize our our cash Low, which is what that those rits do? Thank you. You're on both We have next we have all of them in rehearsal Thank you, Your Honor. I guess I would just like to hear from somebody involved with the Municipal Court Committee Or otherwise the rationale for that 75 nearly a hundred percent increase over a two-year period I was at the I remember I chair of the municipal court advisory committee a Lot of the discussion that occurred was discussed in closed session. So I don't know that I can share that with you but the In open discussion the discussion centered on the fact that the council had not established its salary and This is basically what you're doing now is establishing a salary at a whatever amount That's that's your job as a policymaker to establish that salary As all as vice president born has stated there's people who feel that that if she performs Well on her projected revenues and she continues to do the the rits and summons enforcing that that They Establishing the salary at a higher level would would be appropriate some feel it's okay to do that some feel it's not okay to do that As all of them and Ryan has stated Every every Every candidate that runs for office knows what the salary is and if you don't like the salary You have the choice of not running or running and once you get elected. That's what you get paid But that's pretty much that's pretty much what happened there Maybe can I ask I guess the question in a different way I guess either way either we were way off on the duties that we assigned to her when she was brought on board or we were Way off on the pay one of the two that there's such a drastic correction here just a short while after she came on board Well again as the The the job description for the judge was put together but that committee and I don't know that any of you were part of that But my job description does not say that I need to go to Public gatherings and do public appearances on Saturdays and Sundays at nights and then so forth I do that because I want to do a better job at my job It doesn't say that I need to spend 10 to 12 hours a day either it doesn't say anything It's just a choice that you make Your job is Alderman doesn't say that you need to be at every single meeting and be extremely committed And we have one particular Alderman Alderman Kittleson who Goes above and beyond her call of duty. That's just the way it is some of us choose to put more time Some of us put not to put more time. Alderman Ryan has said it. Well, you know what the salary is. That's what you get So I don't know if that's answering your question But I need to be careful that I don't reveal what's discussed in public session because I mean and in close session And that's that's what we'll discuss Next we have Alvin Guesha Thank you, Mayor Perez I've gone all over the place on this. I became aware of the situation in the last summer Spoke many times many times with the judge and I attended some of the meetings of the committee and It's interesting I used to I always say that Mayor Perez is one of the cheapest men I know I say that lovingly and Jim Bourne's a close second and Both of them have interest in raising the salary. I believe if I'm not stating that incorrectly From coming out of that committee and there's a reason for that and I know it's a lot of emotions with just elected raise the salary but I think it was established through that committee that The original salary and the estimate of hours for those salaries was just wrong. It's nobody's fault Nobody did it maliciously. It was just wrong and and the judge voluntarily for the wrong money put in probably three times as much time as as most of us in this room for Not a lot of money and if you're a lawyer making two and a quarter hundred fifty bucks an hour It was a gift to the city During that time and there's a result to that gift We all had on our desk the actual numbers from 2007 Roughly three hundred and ninety thousand three hundred eighty five thousand dollars in net income back to the city Now that money comes right back into the general fund Next year's projection is six hundred and twenty eight thousand dollars That's keeping the rip process going and the flow of backlog of receivables flowing in bringing us in six hundred and twenty eight thousand dollars Now I understand alderman-born saying it'd be nice if we had something on our desk That's just that's not going to happen. It's a separation of powers We have a judicial branch. We have a legislative branch just like we're not going to I'm not going to sit here I'm Jim Gisha alderman stationary and write something like that because that's just being proper to do back to her It's her discretion. She has given assurances. I asked that question I believe three different ways at the joint municipal advisory committee and it was answered as To my satisfaction as well as it could be answered under the separation of powers Yes, she ran on the salary I think she her feeling was let's not kid ourselves or spend some bad feelings about how this came down All right, we all get that but I think her thoughts were look at I produce This is the highest amount of money. We've ever gotten ever even when we were at the county next year. It could double We have a good person We have a good court. I think it's run excellently. I think we have some personality differences and The judge and I have had that discussion between she and I about our personality differences, but what it really comes down to is To have a decent attorney as our judge and our ordinance calls for an attorney to have this and you're going to pay him $20,000 you're not going to get the results There are other communities not so far away from Sheboygan who aren't getting the results because they don't have an attorney And a quality person you get what you pay for in this particular case and the results are here Even if it was $35,000, which I do support The amount per hour for a judge doing this or for a lawyer doing this is is is almost pro bono Please let the emotions aside and the reality Set in of if we don't have her doing the ritz we don't get the money We don't even get what we got last year if we go back to the number We have you have in front of you for 07 not the 628 for 08 if we go back to that number this year Somebody's got to find $300,000 in the budget Anybody have an idea it's not there So Is it a bad situation for us to be in? Do some people maybe feel like they're there it's being a hold up or use another term I can understand those feelings, but And I've gone through those emotions myself with this It just is the right thing to do whether we like it or not My opinion. Thank you We do have four lights going on and we'll take them in the order that they appear on my screen here So just bear with me alderman. We have alderman kittleson next Thank you your honor. Um, I guess I just have to go back To when we set this court up and and I was there and I see how it was structured and and I know what we voted upon um And and people have to know that I I mean This is the way we set it up And the and the reason we I came to that $20,000 mark was because I mean I we haven't established the salary We need to do that. So what that's the starting point we need to start at because it is 18 We didn't go the 18 19 20 I'd like to see it at the 20 mark for this for last year and for this year But we did set it up this way and I think we can give it one more year to see that it is producing and to See that it's operating in the way that we need it to um in order to To increase that salary to that level. That's my feeling. Thank you. Thank you alderman kittleson alderman claytonis Thank you your honor, uh, just a question maybe for attorney mclean When are you appointed or when you have a judge? Are you set up a court? There is a job description There is is there a job description? Was there something published somewhere or was this this court has just become her Her baby, I mean it's it's taken on a life that she has given it And there's really no standard that a municipal court judge should follow about like ritz and things like that No, I believe there is a judge but uh the judge Administratively falls under the district court administrator like a circuit court judge does And they have mandatory training and They have standards that they follow but as far as Some of the aspects that the judge Chooses to utilize for collection purposes Really at the discretion of the of the court and And I am convinced that it is inappropriate for the legislative body to to get into Managing the day-to-day operation of the court the uh where you do have The oversight is in the budget And that relates to salaries salaries of the judge salaries of the staff Numbers of staff and things like that Thank you. Next we have Alderman Rindflash and then Alderman Hanna Thank you, mr. Mayor This one I have two concerns of what we're acting upon right now. I'm a first concern Echoes Alderman Ryan's well. It may be legal to do Um prior to one year towards the end of the term to do I'm so uncomfortable doing that I think it creates a precedent that that may not be appropriate All other elected officials must wait until the next election cycle before anything Is raised. So I'm concerned about that while it's legal. I don't I don't think it's a good precedent Second of all it's how it's it probably is it's minorly and procedural But we have a report of committee in front of us That is usually accepted and adopted the report And the report states that there's no recommendation from salaries and grievances But we like to counsel to act upon this So I'm more comfortable if there was a recommendation either for or against a particular salary that the council can act upon And two if the council wishes to do something that is not within salary and grievances Is to do a general ordinance establishing the salary in the first place Or a resolution that can be put upon its passage that we can all see And those unfortunately do have to be referred and they do take time to do or they have to lie over I'm not comfortable necessarily creating a policy out of thin air In the council session here without going through those steps of at least A resolution or an ordinance change on this one So at this point because there's those comfort levels because we don't have the black and whites Yes, it may be procedural and maybe we need to move forward on this quickly But we don't have a recommendation to act upon And we don't have a resolution or an ordinance to act upon either So I'm uncomfortable at this point in time in acting in that way Lastly, I do want to Comment on perhaps the job description that that's the attorney McLean was just talking about Um The activity what we do as elected officials here and the legislative and the executive under the mayor or judicial under the municipal court Is ultimately decided by the people that elect them or decide to re-elect them And if they choose not to perhaps maximize The the the tools that they have for the city's benefit that's something that then Those that elect them can take up with them. So I am uncomfortable necessarily creating a job description for an elected Official that's not within our own branch of government that we have here in front of us As well So for those reasons I I'm going to vote no at this point in time Not any indication of do I think that the judge is doing a great job or not Do I agree with the salary being set or not? Um, but really I think all those those that debate should be secondary to the fact that we think we need to do it Properly uh, have someone write an ordinance or resolution that we can act upon or have salary grievances Who's whose committee it really comes out of? Uh, have a recommendation one way or the other that we can either go with or go against. Thank you Next we have president, huh? Thank you, mr. Mayor. I just have a couple questions Is there an alternative way that we can continue with the rift process without the judge doing that? That's my first question My second question. Does the original job description will require that the candidate have a law degree? I just need clarification on that A law degree Great, thank you and as far as uh, the rift process You need the judge to issue the rift. It's it's a judicial Decree Next we have all one mayor Thank you, your honor. Um, I agree that the judge knew what the salary was when she ran for this office And I want to make it clear. I believe that she asked for 42,000 dollars The joint municipal Court committee decided to give her 35,000 And after after that, I believe she contacted alderman born and said she would no longer do the rifts I Find that very disturbing Um, I feel like we are being held hostage to give her a salary that she wants and as alderman born explained There is no guarantee even if we do give her the 35,000 that she will continue to write these rifts Thank you. Thank you Next we have alman for hassle Thank you, your honor Listening to some of the alderman speak those who are very close to the issue It sounds like the rifts are almost a necessity to make that court viable And the the viability of the court has been called into question almost from the day of its inception I guess so my question would be is can we make it? I'll ask the the question to the city attorney McLean Can we make it part of the job description? Would it be illegal or improper by this body? To make it a part of the job description seeing that it's such an important part of the job Yes, I believe it would be Inappropriate and really it's a separation of powers that you I don't think the legislative body can dictate what the judicial branch How they function in their the exercise of their discretion Is there a matter of illegality? I guess Question related to that Yes, it's really constitutional separation of powers Couldn't they but this legislative body's Established policy we got a separation of power between legislative and executive they established policy I have to follow it with the same logic apply there I I believe that no, I don't think you can dictate to the judge whether Exercise their discretion in a certain manner and the issue were ripped I think you can Set her salary Tell her where the court is going to be And she's the judge and she's going to run the court And to the extent that the electorate Is to satisfied with What the judge is doing? You have an election cycle every two years Okay We have two more rights all of them in kittleson. Thank you your honor. I just want to go back to the original Document that was put together when we put this court together And it says while state law provides that a municipal court judge need not be an attorney The committee did strongly recommend that the city require that the judge be an attorney Just to clarify that and also Attorney mclean, can you speak to alderman reinfleisch's? questions on whether this is Legal to do are we doing anything that is out of order? Thank you Alderman reinfleisch you don't really have a document before you and the action of this body What I would recommend if you do anything would be to Act to draft a document or an ordinance from the floor that then would be Layed over to the next meeting for for action If you don't have An ordinance and I think the salary should be established by ordinance You don't have one before you so you really can't act on Any ordinance in front of you Follow up. Alderman kittleson. No. Thank you. Yes, then then is it the the proper thing to do is is to ref The proper thing refer back to to establish that ordinance or to establish this To salary agreements is that What we need to do Work from the floor how from the from the floor Sowering grievances telling you that They don't deal with it To decide okay Thank you So the the alternative the your option may be alderman kittleson that your motion that's on the floor now may May probably should be withdrawn and that you draft An ordinance authored by you and whoever other alderman wish to do so introduce it to the council as a document That document can either be referred to salary and grievance, which it probably shouldn't because they don't want to deal with it Or it can rules can be suspended and acted upon the next Council meeting, okay So would you like to withdraw your motion? And the second would like to be withdrawn, but the motion to file still is in place Yes Okay, alderman barn Thank you your honor just a couple of things that i want to comment on As far as the history of this whole matter I got a call on december 26 the day after christmas at eight o'clock five a.m From the judge Saying that she was going to summarily quit doing the summons hearings and the ritziv commitment Uh, I don't know why she called me. I'm not on the uh, I'm not on the municipal court committee I go to some of the meetings But I I guess I'm on the finance committee. Maybe that's why she called me I then called the mayor and informed him of her decision And then this is what what's transpired since december 26 That's that's where we are now also In reference to what alderman gisha said and with all due respect I certainly don't get the feeling from Seeing the uh the judge since that meeting of of the municipal court committee that There's any I have I have not gotten the sense That she if she gets this raise of 30 30 up to 35 000 dollars That she's going to continue to do Uh the summons hearings and the ritz and we cannot Tie a salary increase to telling her what to do because it's her own domain However as a goodwill gesture, that's why I would like to see something from her in writing on municipal court stationary as a goodwill gesture saying that If I get a raise then I'm going to continue with that process to maximize collections, but I certainly haven't gotten that uh From her at all That she's going to continue with the process or she gets the raise. Thank you. We have one more light elman milk Thank you, your honor um Alderman gish's words were very persuasive um, and and he has Won me over from an idea perspective But I I would like to see this document and I agree that uh all the person kittleson has put together What is probably the right plan? I would like to urge her to This body to refer it back to the salary and grievances committee though because I think it's just We convene that body so that they can offer us an opinion on salary and grievances And if they only had a body of four that night So be it I would urge that they form as a body of five and return an opinion to us so we can vote upon it Thank you, your honor. Thank you Alderman ryan Thank you, mr. Mayor Salary and grievances does not seem to be very interested in this and I I propose that we draft an ordinance from the floor Keeping the salary at 18 000 dollars until May 1st of 2009 now this is after the next election That we increase it to 35 000 dollars on may 1st of 2009 um, if our present municipal court judge decides that That would be appropriate in 2009 Um, she will probably run for that office again at that 35 000 dollar salary If she decides that, uh, she does not want to do that. Obviously, we'll be looking for another municipal court judge In the interim between now and then and uh, regardless, uh, that will be in an electable position in 2000 evil of 2009 Um, I believe that We cannot dictate to make the judge put in writing that she will do the writs However, if you are running for a political office and somebody is running against you You may say that if I am reelected to this position. I will also do the writs Um, along with my other responsibilities as municipal court judge So I would like to put that forth at this time yeah More lights popped up Now i'm letting this go a little bit beyond the two per alderman because I think this is important enough But this is a great example of why the council and his own wisdom decided every shot to get every person gets two shots at it Uh, alderman montemayor Thank you, your honor All of the words that were spoken here tonight pretty much were spoken at salary and grievance and we were at loggerheads and it was two to two and with that sort of a The makeup the motion fails it failed because it was two four two against so the motion failed That's why we're asking the council to also hear all this information taken action And I think would be wonderful if we could have five at salary and grievance from now on But I know i'm going to be gone this month for one time and alderman gish is going to be the chair Alderman verhastl may be gone with his work Someone may Also be gone. So um the odds of having five Are not all that good. Thank you Alderman verhastl Thank you, your honor. I just wanted to I guess beg to differ with alderman ryan I don't think the fact that it was locked in a two-two type should indicate any disinterest by the committee I think this committee would love to weigh in on it and had I not been stuck in an east coast snowstorm We would have a decision that this council is so so sorely looking for this evening So I'd welcome it to come back as a member of salary and grievance. I would welcome it to come back to us Special meeting I want to get you next. Thank you Despite alderman ryan's actually setting up a campaign for judge and how they should run their campaign If it's worth 35,000 come june 1st 2009 why isn't it worth 35 thousand dollars now We have the performance. We have more than we asked the judge to do and she did it on her own and on her own time If it's worth it then why isn't it worth it now to keep a good person who has a good track record? It doesn't make any sense You get a new judge the new judge could decide not to do the writs according to It's turny mclean as he's nodding his head. They can do whatever they want We have what it wants to do the writs won't put it in writing because I understand the separation of powers situation is explained by attorney mclean but she She's proven she would do it I'll guarantee if we keep it at 20 or 18 or do whatever you want. You won't get it at all And uh, that's abundantly clear. So if it's worth it, then it's worth it now You have a known commodity Thank you your honor last comment and again, it doesn't feel good the way this is borne out has not been a fun process But alderman gisha, I think At his core is exactly right fundamentally either we want the 600 000 a year that we believe she can generate and the finance committee has seen those numbers and and in the judge's defense when she sat before our body and talked about the next couple of years And the and the cash that might come from that she was pretty committed to running Running her court in a way that delivered justice and Uh and supported itself. So again my inclination for this body is that Uh If we lose the judge if we lose this reputable person who's an attorney and and and can is committed to the performance That was communicated to finance we lose that person That's a lot of money that the people of this body will have to find to make up another way So again, I would urge the committee to find a way to support, uh, alderman kiddlesons, uh, alderman kiddlesons plan Thank you. And we have alderman claviness Thank you your honor. Um, I I agree I It's 17 000 dollars 17 000 dollars difference between 18 000 and 25 and for what we get for 17 000 dollars Uh, the judge spoke to me in regard to the fact that she is an attorney She has put her practice aside Her private practice aside in order to do this But she can't afford to keep putting her private practice aside for 18 000 dollars Because it has become something that's much bigger and has become much more involved We wouldn't bat an eye to give 17 000 dollars to get our overtime for streets plow and things like that You know that kind of money comes out real fast But when we want to um, I think Enhance the respect for the city And I have talked to people in building inspection who say that the municipal court has done wonders for their department This is not just a money thing. It's also the idea that the city has Some teeth in its ordinances and its rules and regulations And she brings these people up to court and she gives them sentences when they don't follow, you know City rules and ordinances and before those things would would sit for months and months in county court in Circuit court because there was such a big backlog of other criminal cases So now the city can get its work done in terms of enforcing its You know its ordinances through its own vehicle and if we're going to stop that Then we're just saying this municipal court is kind of a play thing and you know, we're not serious about it Oh one argument you were one of the originators and proponents any light to shed on the issue? When uh I guess the proposal was originally mine and we began working on it We send out surveys to 35 different communities the city attorney's office drew up a survey and we Got information back from many many cities and everywhere we looked it was a positive sort of a thing And one of the problems just as was uh to stated For instance when I was on the police department, we'd ride snowbird and say tickets bushels of just as they've done now The the courts would circuit court would push these tickets back and push these tickets back And pretty soon we were into august and it's pretty hard to get people excited about snowbird and season august and the city Housing inspectors and city plumbing inspectors Hesitated to write citations because they just never ever seemed to come up And so we needed some way to fix this One of the things we learned was that the state had adopted a Uh regulation and maybe the city attorney can correct me if I'm wrong that If cities need a collection process they can actually go to a collection agency and some cities do that they turn all their Past through things over to a collection agency. Of course takes a portion of it and uh, but we worked very hard on it we had several citizens on the committee and And Most of them felt it was a bad idea when we started but at time we got them They all thought it was a terrific idea. We had convinced all of them So I think the municipal court is something that we need. We had a municipal court for over a hundred years and then the municipal court was uh I guess there was something wrong with the way the courts were set up and they the cities had to Readopt their whole court system and shabuigan chose not to and we were the losers in the long run I think if you looked around the state you found out that we Were one of the few cities that did not have a municipal court system and I think it works very well and uh, I think we need to keep it working well and really if you look at the salary and attorney Generally can make on the outside what what she's getting paid is You know just a mere token of uh So she's she's it's probably costing her money to do this And I I think it's important that we keep this municipal court system going And to say that we have the municipal court system just to make money I think it is is a wrong way to really look at it. What we need is a municipal court system to handle uh municipal ordinance violations Because if you go over to the circuit court and they've got 100 municipal court violations and 15 criminal cases maybe for armed robbery or whatever you can imagine which ones are going to get preference. So Uh, it it's a system that we uh, I think it's extremely important to uh Keep going Thank you Okay, so the motion has been withdrawn. There is a motion to file Everybody understand that? We will Do you need to call the roll in this one? Um, who made the motion to file this with Alderman Kittleson and second by alderman mayer Vice president borne, uh, just a point of clarification your honor, uh, if we file this then what's the next step? It's going to go back to salary and grievance or we haven't decided that yet What the next step as I understand it is that alderman kittleson is going to draft A resolution that will establish the salary and that will be referred to salary and grievances for discussion Okay You'll you'll get help Everybody okay with that? Okay Which school all in favor say aye. Any opposed? Motion carries. Thank you very much. Good discussion 2355 by law and licensing recommends granting taxicab businesses license business license number 25 25 all-star taxi One with the following conditions Uh, vice president borne Thank you your honor. I move that the report of committee be accepted and adopted Motion second under discussion Under discussion, uh, mr. Razo the new agent appeared before our committee Last tuesday night and the two conditions there as he has to clear up some clerical things with the assistant city attorney Uh, regarding a couple of his taxi cabs to make sure he's got the right permits and stickers on those cabs and the second thing is uh That daniel castro the former owner of all-star taxi Surrendered his taxi cab drivers license and also his business taxi cab drivers business license He had 30 days to do that and he didn't comply So we take this on as a requirement for the new license to be granted. Thank you Any other discussion Benon, please call roll hannah Heidemann kittleson clayunas Meyer montemayor rinflash ryan smith rehassled wangaman boron balk and gisha 14 eyes motion carries ordinances introduced 10 23 57 and 23 58 lies over Matters laid over 11 2257 an ro number ro number 5030708 by the city clerk Submitting the 2000 annual report of the senior activity center of shabuagan alvin meyer Thank you, your honor. I would ask that the ro be accepted and adopted Motion and second under discussion There being none all in favor say aye any opposed Motion carries 2235 has been acted on 2236 resolution number 2220708 by Alderman alderman hannah clayunas and gisha authorized a transfer of appropriations in the 2008 budget Establishing appropriations for non-represented employees one-time bonus increases president hannah. Thank you, mr Mayor, I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion and second under discussion There is none, please call the roll Heidemann kittleson clayunas Meyer montemayor rinflash ryan smith rehassled wangaman boron balk Gisha and hannah 13 ayes one no motion carries 2237 resolution number 222708 by all the persons hannah boron clayunas balk and gisha Authorizing entering into contract with leg chart led consulting and cardinal environmental to perform led risk assessments For the 2007 led hazard reduction grant president hannah Thank you, mr. Mayor. I've moved that the resolution be put upon its passage second Motion and second under discussion There is none, please call the roll kittleson clayunas Meyer montemayor rinflash ryan smith rehassled wangaman boron balk gisha hannah and heidemann 14 ayes motion carries 2238 resolution number 220708 by all the persons hannah boron clayunas and gisha Authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 2008 budget Establishing revenue and appropriations for donations received for police department junior police academy president hannah Thank you again, mr. Mayor. I'd move that the resolution be put upon its passage second Motion and second under discussion There being none please call the roll clayunas Meyer montemayor rinflash ryan smith rehassled wangaman boron balk gisha hannah heidemann and kittleson 14 ayes motion carries 2251 general ordinance number 870708 by all the persons montemayor Meyer gisha heidemann and rehassled Amending the municipal code so as to include a change to pay schedule x extra help class 23 All in one to my lord. Thank you your honor. I move the ordinance be put upon its passage Motion and second under discussion There is none. Please call the roll Meyer montemayor I Rinnflash ryan smith for hassle wangaman boron balk gisha hannah Excuse me heidemann kittleson and clayunas 14 ayes motion carries 2252 general ordinance number 880708 by all of them want the mayor Meyer gisha and heidemann reestablishing the salary for the position of all the person of the city of sheboygan All in one to my lord Thank you your honor. I move that the ordinance be put upon its passage Motion and is there a second second motion and second under discussion. Vice president borne Thank you your honor. I would like to make an amendment or a motion that In 2010 the salary for alderman position Be risen to six thousand dollars per year and then annual increases of 2.5 percent there after After consulting with city attorney mclean This proposal would not affect any alder person who currently serves on the council for example If I decide to run again in two years And and i'm elected in 2010 Then I would be able to take advantage of the new salary But for the for the rest of 2008 and the rest of 2009 it would stay at 4668 dollars also the people that are running in 2009 Next year those eight alder persons who are running in 2009 Also would not benefit unless they were reelected in 2009 because it would not be going into effect in 2010 so I'm going to make that motion to adjust the aldermanic salary starting in 2010 Is your amendment in the ordinance there? Is that your motion to amend great Motion and second to amend okay All the amendment only under discussion We have all marion Thank you, mr. Mayor. I actually uh Uh Pushed my button before the amendment however. I would like to discuss it To me To give ourselves or raises is alderman With our present budget situation. I don't think it's is is proper Um, I understand 46 68 is our present salary To me. This is uh, this is public service This is in the park time job So, uh, I do not agree with the amendment. I believe our salary should be held as it presently is. Thank you All in the clearness Thank you your honor, um Alderman mani who was can't be here this evening and asked me to Put this on hold for discussion for him in two weeks I know it might be out of order, but I think there's some more discussion that wants to be had on this issue so I'm just voicing his request at this point. Okay. Thank you Any further discussion on the amendment? They're being on please call the roll You want me to repeat the Motion sure You're voting an aye vote would be to amend this document for 2010 to go to $6,000 a year And then after that an annual 2.5 increase So an aye vote would do that Montemay or Rinflesh I'm sorry. No, thank you. Ryan Smith for hassled Wongamon boron bauke Gisha Hannah Heidemann Kittleson Cleonis And Meyer Five ayes nine noes motion fails And I need a motion to file 2252 if you're not going to act on it Yeah, do it. You have to pass motion to measure. There already is a motion. Hold on hold on a motion to put the resolution upon its passage Ordinance upon its passage. Yep Is there somebody like to make a motion to put the resolution as Upon its passage as is which will keep the salary as is I did. Yep. Oh you did already. Okay. And there was a second Under discussion on that Motion Thank you. I really hesitated on the last amendment Only because I know there's a lot of people in this room were put in just a ton of time And The amount of money isn't very much was a nine bucks a day and I do agree that It is public service however You want to make sure that other people over the years Are encouraged to come into this body, but But because of the budget considerations we have I uh, I will vote to keep our salaries exactly where they are Well, you started something again all the lights went on All in place Thank you your honor Uh, I think you know all noble people that we are and whatever It's it's a it's a reimbursement Basically a reimbursement on expenses gas Paper time and it's not it's not salary at all. It's a reimbursement expenses and can't you can't kid me that anything everything else isn't getting cheaper and I just feel like you know, this could be like the the The landed gentry who Could serve they were the only people who could serve in public office because they the ones that only could afford it You know, I'm saying in other words The the the number could get so small in terms of what people see it to be That well, why should I even bother because it's It's saying that you have to you know, you're not going to live on this. You're not going to live on this stipend But it's also saying something like well, you better have some other means because only people with means could be doing this And in supporting themselves. So I I just take that as a a point of view for you to consider No, we'd just like to say that I understand Why a lot of all women are reluctant to Vote on an increase in their salary. I've talked to other all women in other communities But as has been said, this is an elected position. You know what you're going to get when you when you run for office Which is what I think some of the all women were trying to tell you with the judge the same thing I cautioned her to to Be very observant of your logic as you apply it on one instance and not the other It makes people very uncomfortable For all that matter, you are not required And I'll all the McKelsen. I hope you don't mind me saying that all of McKelsen is not required to be I could literally say just about every meeting But she is she is And she's a good older man. She dedicates herself. She takes notes. She makes she provides input She does it because she's a public servant Every elected official is a public servant And for one rationale to be used to apply to one and not the other disturbs me somewhat Particularly because of the discrepancy and participation and involvement amongst all of us Some alderman have only one committee Some alderman have a few committees. Some alderman like president hannah has a lot of committees 17 17 Some alderman Some alderman go to meetings. Sometimes alderman don't go to meetings Some alderman get more calls from constituents and others That's what it demands of you Some alderman make barely enough to pay their gas their computer their paper their ink All of you every time you're here or at a committee Meeting you're away from your family. You're away from your friends You're away from doing what what you normally would have done It's not a livelihood neither is this judge's position on livelihood her her livelihood is a lawyer So the rationale is somewhat disturbing here and I would ask that you weigh it carefully when this issue comes up again Because I know That the first thing that comes up when anybody tries to run for all of them is that he he or she gave himself or herself a race That's not true quite frankly. I think you deserve more And I'll be beating the public for this, but I think the alderman do one heck of a job And for what you get paid and it may be it may be construed as a reimbursement for what you do But I think it should be a little bit more because I think all of you put a lot of heart a lot of guts a lot of thought Into what you do and quite frankly, that's what's made this community better and better and I thank you for that All of them come out of your next Thank you your honor I sort of wanted to agree with all sorts of things around here But I do want the public to realize that the salary we get we get Is not Added to for gasoline or telephone or meetings that we attend or computer or anything It's that's a salary period and nothing else is added Thank you much president boring Thank you, your honor the reason I brought this forward Is because It doesn't affect anybody that's up here right now unless we run for election again and are reelected That's the only way we're gonna we're gonna collect this additional salary and I thought by doing this in 2010 Would take some of the politics out of this because it doesn't affect us I've got a I'm gonna if I get reelected on April 1st It's going to be 4668 for the rest of 2008 and it's going to be that way for 2009 and I brought this forward Mainly for the people that follow us on the council, but at time 2010 rolls around Half of us may not even be here. We may have some some new faces and also By 2010 all of these costs that everybody Talks about are going to continue to go up. They're not going to go down What are we going to have 450 gasoline by then whatever whatever the case may be so Bringing this forward by no means was to put any money in my pocket Who knows if I'll run again in 2010, but I think it stayed it sets the stage At least for those older persons in 2010 to get some kind of a wage that reflects The amount of effort that they're putting into this job And I would invite any critics of the aldermanic pay the job shallow job shadow Alderman Kittleson for a week alderman hannah and not patting myself on the back I think I'm on seven or eight committees. I'd invite you to job shadow It's for a week or two and see how much time is actually put into this job. Thank you. Thank you Having said all that and that probably should have been discussed in that manner While the amendment was in place. Does anybody want wish to week reconsider? No one. Okay. The motion is to put it upon his passage. Please go roll Rindflash Excuse me. Thank you Ryan Smith for hassled Longamon boron Bauch Yeshah Hannah Heidemann I'm sorry back to Hannah. Did you say I thank you Heidemann Thank you Kittleson Clayunas Meyer and Montemay or nine eyes five nose motion carries 22 53 general orders number 89 0708 by all the persons van der wheel Rings flies ryan smith and kittleson Relating to no parking regulations to remove the existing two-hour parking Eight o'clock a.m. To five o'clock p.m. Except sunday and holiday zone along the east side of north seventh street from the south curb line of north avenue South 250 feet thereof alderman rindflash Thank you, mr. Mayor. I move that the ordinance be put upon its passage Motion and second under discussion Please continue. Thank you. This is actually done at by request of Memorial hospital in that neighborhood there is by the request that we're allowing additional parking throughout the day Thank you. Thank you Any further discussion There is none please call roll ryan smith for hassle wongamon boron Bauck Yesha Hannah Heidemann Kittleson Clayunas Meyer Montemay or and rindflash 14 eyes motion carries 22 54 general orders number 90 0708 by all the persons van der wheel Rings flies ryan smith and kittleson Relating to no parking regulations to add a no parking here to corner zone Along the east side of north seventh street from the south curb line of north avenue south 80 feet thereof Alderman rindflash Thank you, mr. Mayor. I move that the ordinance be put upon its passage Motion and second under discussion Well, thank you, mr. Mayor. This actually goes hand in hand with creating A parking all day along the side of the street It's a very small section between the exit the north exit's tomorrow hospital and the curb on north avenue There's room for basically one spot and it's been a problem in winter for parking So we're removing that parking spot that one spot and creating Full day parking south of that driveway So it's not necessarily by their request to remove this one spot, but we're doing so just to show it for public safety Thank you any further discussion There being none please call the roll smith for hassled wongerman boran bauk gisha hannah heidemann kittleson clayunas meyer montemayor rindflash and ryan 14 eyes motion carries 22 55 general ordinance number 910708 by all our persons van der wheel rinse lies ryan smith and kittleson relating to Parking regulations to remove a two-hour parking 8 a.m. To 5 p.m. Zone along the south side of union avenue From the west side of south 22nd street Extended 470 feet west thereof Allman rindflash. Thank you, mr. Mayer again I move that the general ordinance we put upon its passage Motion in second under discussion. Now once again, this is also done by the request of fresh brands whose property it is joining to Used to have a credit union there and required people to have two-hour parking only so that their Member employees could get in and out of there the credit union no longer is in that building. So They're looking for all-day parking alongside the street across the street from The batters park. Thank you. Oldman rindflash any further discussion There is none. Please call the roll for hassled wongerman boran bauk gisha hannah heidemann kittleson clayunas meyer montemayor rindflash ryan and smith 14 eyes motion carries We're going to do other matters and then when we're done with that I wanted to just mention something to the council. So please don't don't run off on me or make motions yet to adjourn attorney mcclean other matters thank you, ronnie 159 of communication from chad wilson of the fbl Cyclery cycling team requesting permission to use evergreen park to host an annual usa cycling event That will be referred to public works 2360 is an aural by the city clerks of any communication from donald keller of schwoigand morer post number 9156 requesting permission to hold their annual buddy poppy drive from may 2008 Can you say it again annual what now just kidding That lies over buddy puppy 2361 is an aural by the city clerks of any communication from charter cable park to jowell c Notifying the city that they have submitted an application to the state of wisconsin department of financial institutions for the state issued franchise Wish to continue their relationship with the city's point That will be referred to the cable re-franchise committee All mcgisha your honor can i also ask that be referred to finance And finance Make that notation. Thank you Continue That goes to finance 2363 is an aural by the city clerks of any institutions submitted by schwoigand chevrolet Because they take coming from highway pp and That goes to city plan 2364 is an aural by the city clerks submitting a claim from cathleen hill for alleged damages to the mirror I was in a van on a snow plow hit the mirror and knocked it off today That goes to risk management 2365 is A claim from daniel johnson jr for alleged damages to his motorcycle when a garbage truck didn't pull out far enough to make it around his motorcycle without That will be referred also to risk management 2366 is submitting a claim from mone and jorge miller for alleged damages to their repel vehicle on a snow plow hit the park on a wheel That will also go to risk management 2367 is a resolution Granting vfw wolf oleson post 12 30 of july 12 30 and vfw memorial post 91 56 of july 91 56 Permission to hold the annual poppy drive on may 16th 9 a.m. The 6 p.m And may 17th 9 a.m. The 1 p.m. 2000 that one will lie over 2368 is an evolution enforcing the fundraising program for park improvements Called the wildwood rally as presented and sponsored by the shboygan athletic club Which may include naming rights sponsorship for various items in the wild That will be referred to finance and public works 2369 is a committee report by the naming rights committee To whom was referred resolution 22707 By all the first ball pan and kitchen to name the city of shboygan's new heart of conference center The michael mooth convention center through hardware recommends that we attach substitute resolution That one lies over holland balk Actually, I spoke with uh Director bittner this evening. Uh, there's been some more information That's come to light and he'd like to have this referred back to the naming rights committee So they can discuss some other information To do with the uh the amended resolution not the original resolution. Okay instead of lying over it goes It will be referred to naming rights make that notation 2369 naming rights committee Let's continue That one will go to city plan That one goes to law and licensing 2372 is an ordinance amendment section 29-75 of the 1975 shboygan municipal code So it's to change the job code and the job description to the purchasing agent the finance department's table voting basis That will be referred that would lie over 2373 is an ordinance amendment section 29-75 of the 1975 shboygan municipal code So it's to change the job code and the job description of finance director treasurer The finance department's table voting basis That one lies over before I ask for a motion to adjourn I just wanted to Let the council know that Good news and bad news a woman bonnie smith is uh going to Resign two weeks before her term is up Which is bad news Good news is she found a house to buy and outside the district So she has to do that and we wanted to uh, I wanted to personally thank you for your service in the common council um You were truly a good asset to the council and you provided great input and insight and Demonstrated a lot of commitment to the council. So thank you very much And we wish you the best in your future endeavors. I need a motion to please Yes All in favor say aye Oh, I got a change Stand adjourned