 Okay. Well, good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, everyone. Welcome, and thank you for being part of today's virtual conversation on people power in a pandemic, how movements are confronting COVID-19. My name is Maria Stefan and I direct the program on nonviolent action at the US Institute of Peace, which is today headquartered in my apartment. I'll be facilitating the discussion with a terrific group of panelists and with you all tuning in from around the world. And for those who are tweeting, we are using the hashtag people power for peace, people power number for peace. So as we edge closer to 5 million global deaths caused by the COVID-19 virus, we've seen the terrible toll the pandemic is taking on families and communities around the world. At the same time, we've witnessed a resurgence of new forms of civic activism and creative citizen led organizing in response to the crisis. Mutual aid networks have sprouted up in countries around the world, including Algeria and Lebanon, where activists are delivering food and medicine and sanitizing public spaces. In Chile, women launched a feminist emergency plan centered around mutual support against gender based violence. Polish activists have organized socially distanced public protests and drive by demonstrations to challenge government policies. Activists from around the world have increasingly turned to digital platforms and tools to educate the public about the pandemic and to organize campaigns. At the same time, we've seen governments expand and abuse their power in the name of fighting the pandemic, including in Hungary and Hong Kong, where there have been further crackdowns on opposition and dissent. Disinformation and hate speech related to COVID abound on social media. The pandemic has raised a fundamental question for activists and movements, namely, how can they address immediate public health concerns, while challenging abuses of power and while addressing the inequalities and injustices that this pandemic has both highlighted and exacerbated. In other words, how do you link crisis response to systems change. With us to shed light on how activists and movements are responding and adapting to COVID, how they are planning for the future, and how donors and international organizations can best support the grassroots during this time. We are delighted to be joined by three remarkable activists from South Sudan, Syria and Venezuela, along with representatives of the donor community and international civil society. So let me offer the some brief introductions. First, Nelson Nelson kawajie is the director of global programs for defy hate now in Africa, where he leads training programs on fact checking and hate speech hate speech and misinformation mitigation work in multiple countries. Nelson also supports the development of internet and citizens rights through platforms including the network of African youth for development and internet society. Rajah Altali is the co founder and co director of the Center for civil society and democracy, a Syrian NGO that focuses on civil society development. Rajah has documented human rights abuses, trained countless civil society activists and conducted research on women activists and unarmed resistance in Syria, and she's now one of 12 Syrian women appointed by the UN Office of the Special Envoy to the Women's Advisory Board of the Geneva peace process. Elba paroy is a Venezuelan social activists and peace builder with experience in community organizing and citizen training. She has conducted workshops and trainings in nonviolent action and peace building in different cities throughout Venezuela her home country and across Latin America. Michael Silberman is the global director of mobilization lab, an organization that trains coaches and challenges change makers and their organizations to build people power deploy creative tactics tackle root causes and adopt collaborative cultures. Michael has more than a decade of experience guiding social change organizations to achieve greater impact through the creative use of participatory strategies and technologies. And finally Catherine Zavala is the director of grassroots partnerships at 1000 currents, which funds and partners with grassroots groups and movements led by women, youth and indigenous peoples in the global south that are transforming their communities. In her role Catherine supports her team to model long term engagement and commitment to whole ecosystems of grassroots actors working towards collective self determination and social transformation. So I'm going to kick off the conversation with our esteemed panelists momentarily, but I first wanted to encourage folks tuning in from around the world to send in their questions at any point during the discussion. So all you have to do is type your questions in the YouTube chat box and hit send. You can also tweet your questions on Twitter using the hashtag people power for peace. So with that, let me start by asking our panelists, this kind of central question, which is how has the pandemic changed your activism and movement building work. In particular, how has it influenced the strategies and tactics that you are using. So we're going to start with Nelson Kojic. Up Nelson just kick yourself off mute. Okay hi everyone. Thanks Mary for the introduction. So, I'm just going to start by probably stating some of the challenges that we're seeing and then what are the tactics so with respect to the pandemic globally we have seen it had an impact on every facets of our lives and on every level of government civil society. And also private sector. But let me talk about like in terms of organizing and the violations and injustices that we have been seeing around. How are they affecting people here in East Africa, for example, so I stay in Kenya but I also do a lot of work in South Sudan and in other countries in the region. And we have seen during this pandemic. A lot of the central issues are still existing we have issues of injustices we have issues of human rights violation and this, but like with the pandemic that very specific things that are raising up like for example in Kenya right now. The government is demolishing a lot of houses that are not planned. And during the pandemic we've seen also activists are coming to raise their voices around that in Uganda. Yesterday, Selah Nancy, who's a leading activist she was also arrested because she led a march for the rise of people to access food items and stuff like that. In South Sudan, we're also seeing a lot of mobilizations around accountability, but also we're seeing mobilization, like the women march against rape that happened the day before yesterday. And that was in fact, I mean like few days ago and that was in partner stated by a rape of a young girl. So around the region we're seeing activists organizing against issues that are happening around. How has this changed because of COVID-19 in many ways we for example we are seeing manifestation of overstretch of executive power. The police are now at the forefront of everything. And implementing the lockdown rules at times in ways that infringes on people's human rights. What are the activists doing about this we're seeing a lot of digital organizing so people are having chat rooms people are having campaigns hashtags and all this. These hashtags related to some of it related to violations of rights, but also a lot of it relates to accountability and also issues to do with accountability and holding governments accountable. In Kenya, for example, we had a hashtag trending saying 40 billion, because the Kenyan government allegedly spent about our allocated 40 40 billion Kenyan shillings in a span of like a month and the citizens kind of raised their voice against that. So the issues that are being discussed right now are still continuing, but also we are seeing new things coming forward. One of the things that are not being brought up clearly, which people need to think about is what are the long term implications for this, like in Ethiopia, we already seen that the elections has been postponed. Uganda is supposed to have elections next year, and there's already also discussions around that election being postponed. To what extent is that being done because of COVID-19 and to what extent is such actions being taken to in one way or another hijack power or for people who are in authority to overstay their time. And these are issues sometimes it's stretch beyond the constitutional mandate and the laws that are being set in place, because a lot of these laws and a lot of these structural systems have been put in place. So there's no foresight about pandemic or a total lockdown of systems. So activists are also thinking around ways to find to find means of addressing issues that have long time impact on democracy on civil rights and also on the right to freedom of expression, and so many other rights and this continues to be the biggest challenge right now like what is the long time effect of these rules on people's lives and also the livelihood of citizens in the region. Great. Thanks so much, Nelson. You really get at how activists are already thinking of connecting kind of the pandemic related issues, abuses of power to longer term systems change, which is very interesting. So now I'm going to ask Raja Altali to speak about what Syrian activists and movements are doing in the COVID period. Thank you so much Maria for the introduction and for giving the space for myself and other activists around the world in order to talk about how people power are changing during COVID-19 and beyond. So in 2011, March 2011, the Syrian revolution started when Syrian people took up the street to say we want change, political change is necessary and democracy is a right for the Syrian people, freedom, justice, coexistence and dignity is our right and we demand them. In March 2019, March 2020 when COVID-19 started to hit hard the region, not only in Syria but like in the neighboring country, people started asking about the numbers, like talking about like is the information that we are having is accurate. The numbers of people who are recorded as tested positive for COVID-19 is this is the number why the responses for the COVID-19 is very limited and not shared properly between the Syrian people. So while there has been changes between 2011 and also 2020, the movement, the Syrian movement during the last five, six years has been focusing a lot on the political process, especially since December 2015 when the Security Council Resolution 2254 was adopted. Which is mainly focused on the ceasefire, like nationwide ceasefire, but also on transitioning governing body, which we are able to adapt a new constitution, adapt a new election model moving towards change in the political system and but since then, even though we saw a lot of online work between Syrian activists and the Syrian movement, mainly because the Syrian people in all the country were not able to reach each other and being in the same room since 2016 actually, unless if we are using online tools and this is remind us again with COVID-19 that like all the expertise that Syrian activists and Syrian people have used since then in mobilizing online tools could be used here, but it's the first time that even mobilizing on the ground, it is happening online as well. Like before, like you have the local community. So this is mainly the changes that is happening. Like before you have the local community and for confidence building measures, but also for making sure that like you are able to do more peace building on the ground but also mobilizing for human rights and mobilizing for change, you do and for security, you do a lot face to face meetings, while with COVID-19 we changed completely 100% to online tools, which is challenging but in the same time using the experience that we had. And it was very essential and useful for the movement. Maybe I want to mention like four points before like moving that like it was a key pillars during the last two months or like during COVID-19 time that like the Syrian movement have been really focusing on like focusing on national ceasefire have been many calls, especially like Center for Civil Society and Democracy has been calling for national ceasefire and to be implemented on all of Syria. Also calling on a three main vulnerable people. The first one is the kidneys and kidnapped people and especially with COVID-19 we felt that the word are actually feeling more towards the Syrian detainees who have been like disappeared since nine years actually some of them, some of them five and six years in the most notorious detention center, maybe in the word and now like people are feeling with their family who are like seeking information on where they are. And also they are more worried about like the situation of the detention centers with COVID-19. But so the detention center has been a big movement towards it in the Syria context, but also the IDP communities and refugee community. So those are the two other points and maybe I like when some of the IDPs are saying you are nagging or not happy about talking about social distancing, while we are in a position that for us social distancing is a dream. This is give us actually even like more inspiration and more focus towards like what can we do more for the Syrian IDPs and also for the Syrian refugee. Thank you. Thanks so much, Raja. That's poignant the whole idea of social distancing as a dream for IDPs and refugees. So we're now going to turn to Alba Paroy who will talk about what's been happening in Venezuela. Hey. Okay. Hello. Hello everyone. First, I want to thanks to Maria and to the United States Institute of Peace for this invitation. I really feel privileged to be here with all of these panelists, my colleagues from Syria and from South Sudan. Thanks for this time. So I want to start saying that COVID-19 arrives to Venezuela in the right moment that people were on the streets. It definitely changed all our path about how to behave and the people under this system. So, of course, for an authoritarian regime, which is the government we have now, it was the right moment to put the people in a lockdown. That's why they call for an early lockdown and also the sanitary authority alert about the situation. So it had a positive response of the population in terms of the epidemic control. But nevertheless, there were several variables underground. For example, I must say, one third of the population is on food insecurity and 80% of population doesn't have enough income to buy food for a week, for example. They need to live day by day if they don't work, they can buy food. This is something which really is a challenge for 80% of the population. Personally, I would like to say that in my mind, I said, well, what can I do at this moment, which people is perhaps stuck. And I said, I had a survey, a small survey between our movement and another movement around and other activities to ask what people really want to do at that moment. It was around two months ago. Keep them isolated without any action and prioritization, they have condition or looking for creative way to keep the eye on the national crisis, protesting and maintaining a resilient environment, even on the immigration. So that was our question inside. So people, surprisingly, they didn't give up. They want to keep fighting for restored democracy under sanitary compliance, which it was really not an easy state of this now. People were in the dilemma between how to balance the health safety and the possibility of enable their livelihood. On the other hand, this situation is right transforming because I'm talking since two months ago. And now the lockdown to after two months of lockdown, it has sensibly changed. People started to go out freely, not because it's a low it or not because the virus is under control. It is because they needed to go out even more at this time so the presence of pandemic in Venezuela. It has made more visible our current problems. People like become more aware what is really failing in terms of public services, for example. And being quiet at home has been the chance to realize all the deficiencies together. The abuses of human rights has been more visible, because some particular professional like journalists, doctors or nurses have been arrested. This is something that has been clear for many people and outside our country. For example, for simple actions like tweet information about lack of health supplies for medical assistance. And now the gap between political leaders and grassroots communities is widening right now. So from my point of view, this is a huge opportunity for social movement and social people about their rights claims. I think we are in a position where people is still, I mean, lock it and paralyze it, and they want to do something but they don't know how to do it. We have been working around the digital actions, but I think we need to, we still need to learn more about this. So the focus for social activists from my point of view must be how to engage people in coronavirus era. I mean how to attract and commit people and how to increase awareness. So this is a time to increase awareness of people. I will say something like lock it, but no frozen. I mean, still working on it. Okay. Thank you. Great thanks Alba for sharing what's been happening on the ground. I have a point about how the pandemic is just making more visible some of the structural issues, issues involving public services in the like is very, very interesting. So now we're going to turn to hear from more of an of an external actor perspective, starting with Catherine Zavala, who has a lot of experience working with grassroots actors and movements. And what what are you seeing in terms of how your how your work and activities have responded in response to the pandemic. Thank you Maria, and I also want to express my gratitude for being on this panel and sharing it with my fellow peers here. So I just wanted to briefly explain more about thousand currents where a 35 year old public foundation supporting grassroots groups and social movements in the global south, specifically in the regions of Africa, Asia and Pacific and Latin America. And we do this mainly with providing long term flexible funding. Our main focuses have been supporting the intersections between food sovereignty climate justice and alternative in addition to our global grant making work we also have a second strategy on philanthropic advocacy trying to influence the sector to have better practices in their grant making work for 1000 currents whenever an emergency crisis comes up that impacts our partners we understand more than ever that this is a time for us to be nimble adaptive and extend ourselves as a funder. And it's a standard to to prioritize supporting grassroots groups and social movements because they do tend to be the least resource when it comes to emergency responses. As we started to see the covert 19 emerge as a global crisis, we started to understand that it would be an unprecedented type of crisis, which is going to impact all of our, all the grassroots groups and social movements we support. And that our response had to be unprecedented as well. So we became prepared to be more expensive in our grant making and be more open to new ways of supporting our grassroots partners. So here are a few things that we prioritize when, when we saw over 19 hitting at the global scale. We also wanted to send a clear message around that there were going to be no changes in our grant making for the remainder of our fiscal year. A reminder that our grants are flexible, which means they they're unrestricted and they can use it for any of the readjustments and shifts that they have had to do because of covert 19, and that we were committed to building an organization. We also wanted to send a solidarity message saying that we were with them that we were going to be following closely what was happening in the context, open to hearing what was how the impact was, was happening in their areas and the ways their communities were responding. And the other thing that we also implemented right away were a few grant making practices so we committed to send an initial emergency grant. Even though there was a lot of uncertainties two months ago around how the impact was going to reach the global south but we knew it was going to happen so we just immediately started sending those initial emergency grants. We also accelerate all the grants that remain to be sent so that folks could have money right away as soon as possible. And we also offered extensions to report deadlines. The third thing we did was we created what we have the above and beyond solidarity fund which was to raise the money for us to send the initial emergency grants. We wanted to learn that covert 19 was going to be with us for at least the next 12 to 18 months we knew that our emergency respond had to follow those same timelines. And we knew that, and we also know now that we're going to expect an economic downturn that will impact all of our grassroots partners, and that our partners will be shifting from crisis mode to a long term for recovery and resiliency plans. So, once we successfully did raise the initial goal the bother beyond solidarity fund, we decided to extend and raise our fundraising goal to 5 million for the next two years to increase resources to our grassroots partners. And the final thing that I will, that I will share related to our philanthropic advocacy work is that we also made an intention of sharing our learnings with the philanthropic sector about what is happening in the global south, as well as sharing. One of the key practices to take on in this moment. And one of the ways we did that was by doing a webinar last month, where we share what was happening in each of the regions we work with the impact of over 19 thus far, and what were several the global south responses to cover 19 that our partners were developing. One thing I will share is that the pandemic has shown us that we cannot disconnect our emergency response with long term strategy so our grassroots partners have already been building pathways towards a well being just and solidarity based world, taking into account food economy and climate. And so that strategy has not shift for us we remain committed to supporting those pathways to for social transformation. Hey Catherine thanks so much and it's very interesting to hear how philanthropic organizations are applying a move more of a movement mindset to support grassroots organizations and movements during this period so thank you. And last but not least, Michael Silverman you have extensive experience working with larger social change organizations. So what are you seeing these organizations perhaps doing differently in light of coven. Thanks, and thanks as well for putting this together it's such an interesting conversation to be having right now. Yeah, our time has is mostly spent with these some of these more formal civil society actors and I think they are all going through some form of reckoning and it's maybe it's not too much different from how a lot of individuals are experiencing this crisis. Everyone differently. But, you know, many people just as many people have been taking this time to reconsider what's most important to them. These larger organizations are having a similar reflection, which I think is very exciting. And I find, I see as a huge opportunity for shifts in in the civil society and in the whole ecosystem here. I had one one call recently with a large international child rights groups that was saying, you know, we've been quibbling about which, which advocacy campaign to run these different things but now, now it's clear, you know, we need to figure out how we really are looking for children in all of our planning. The, you know the children we aim to serve the children who are most impacted in different one area or another. We need to, you know, we're now ready we've been talking about this on the sidelines on the fringes but now this is the moment, everything is different, everything has changed and so I think these larger groups are looking externally and realizing just as we've been talking about here yeah politics, the political landscape is shifting the economy as you know, Catherine you just mentioned. Is totally different societies are starting to shift in terms of how we collaborate work together with all the mutual aid you started mentioning Maria and so therefore it's now having an internal effect on how these larger groups operate because they're taking pause and saying how do we be effective. How do we still meet our mission in this new world and I guess specifically the part that's most interesting or I think important to notice that you know one of the realities is that the so many of these international groups that work that deliver the results through through partners through local partners ultimately are, you know, there's a critical considerations where they have it, you know, they can't get to those partners right if they were going to travel there previously. And it's more clear than ever that those partners are on the front lines of solving this crisis of being you know, in addition to healthcare workers, the, the most essential part of our collective global response and so yeah local groups community but grassroots efforts, you know, there were continuing to see more and more evidence of these, these groups being the, you know, not only the most essential but also the most under resourced again as Catherine laid out so my, the the opportunity here and like the conversation I'm seeing starting to happen which is very, I think very exciting is, is kind of a read, it's shaking up the, there was a shift the power conversation I think, you know, many here are familiar with where, you know, where these larger international global groups were thinking about localization and ensuring that people whose lives are most impacted are at the center of decision making at the center of solutions are, are co designing co creating those solutions or driving those, all of that work. And, you know, frankly there was that that was also lip service and many, you know, and for many organizations it wasn't internalized fully or it's been a long journey. And certainly is now getting accelerated, or that conversation is being recast in a way that these international NGOs or more formal parts of civil society are reconsidering this question of, of how do they, how do they truly trust the people they're, they're working with or for and and put them at the center. Thank you very much Michael. I mean if the pandemic can result in shifting the power when it comes to donor partner relations that already would be a marvelous development, I would say. So, just to remind folks, please if you have questions for any of the panelists, feel free to type those into the chat box and send them. I have a question, which I will direct to all of the panelists which kind of gets back to a point that a number of them were raising about this issue of governments and other non state actors abusing their powers in the name of fighting the pandemic so the specific question is, how do activists balance holding governments accountable to taking COVID seriously while at the same time protecting and defending civic space. So, maybe we can start back with Nelson who was touching on this point in his earlier remarks. What does it mean in this context to protect and defend civic space. Thanks for the question. It's defending civic space is nice even more prominent than before. One of the challenges that especially being faced right now is the pandemic is like specialist civil society organizations and an activist. We have limited resources and we have limited time span. So there is a lot of prioritization being put in place right now. In order to address the issues that are urgent and also work with groups that needs the most help right now. What dad might do is that like a lot of key issues or things that have already started before my drop from the agenda or might be less prioritize. That isn't. And that is that is just a problem of time and the physical space that we're in right now we cannot be in all the places individuals by themselves. They want to protect their families they want to protect themselves. People's livelihood is at risk here. Even we have a lot of people being laid off and stuff like that. So what happens is that you find that there are so many things that are competing for attention. And then a civil society actors, we need to prioritize the actions that we need to take right now. Like I will just give the example of for example, in South Sudan, there is an ongoing peace process and activists have been advocating so much for the implementation of all the protocols and all this. But as we speak right now, the vice president of South Sudan, as is, it's positive has been been diagnosed as positive COVID-19. What might that mean, the peace process will also have the same thing. So I think this idea of attention is competing and lack of resources and lack of time is impacting a lot of the local actors that being safe. We need to prioritize the issues and see what is the long term impact that we have in place right now. And what are the actions especially that are being taken by governments and by other actors. How can we ensure that these actions do not have because that is the issue that the thing with power once you give it away. It's not just like after the pandemic you're like okay can you give us the power back as a citizen. It doesn't work best way. So how do we ensure that like the current structures that are being put in place does not shrink the civic space so much. Not in fringe into people's right in such a way that after the pandemic ends, it rolls us back few years in all the progress that has been made. So this idea of the long term, the strategic objectives and kind of the getting power to the people should always be there. So we need to work on the other trap of like ensuring that the need the current needs issues to do with people's employment, health, and also the right to have the government take care of them at this time. Those are also. So these two for me, what represents kind of the current priorities for the city space. Great thanks Nelson, Alba or Raja this whole idea of once you give up power it's hard to get it back. How are either of you kind of thinking about, you know, engaging with security forces other actors and kind of preventing an abuse of power that could have long term consequences. Maria for the question I think it's very, very important and I believe CCSD has thought about this like from the beginning when we said that we have a community responsibility to respond to COVID-19. And at that time we said that billers of support for like the social movement to respond for COVID-19 is women, youth, and also society group and media activists or journalists. But in the future that we are mobilizing for better response and also a response that is fair for all Syrian people and like to take COVID-19 as opportunity for changing the course, the discourse of Syria from being like one of the worst the crisis ever since like Second World War two until if we are able like to change the discourse to become like a good example of taking COVID-19 as opportunity to change the situation to become like more better for the Syrian people. And at that time we said it's very important to work towards making sure that we are achieving a peace agreement is a necessity and also achieving sustainable peace is a condition in order to say that we are moving forward. And with that we are talking about like also community stabilization as like a base when we are talking about like the response of COVID-19 including countering violent extremism, which also it could be like COVID-19 is used by different actors and exploited not only so it could be on the group, it could be political group, it could be extremist, extremist, etc. And the third one is protection and promotion of a human rights. And this is including women right as well. It is very essential that we shouldn't be having excuses as actors like our actors that because we are responding to COVID-19, we have the rights to abuse more or like do human right violation even more and from the beginning we put it as a base that those are the three main issue that we need like to focus on that should be the driver for us while we are having the pillars in order to have a better response for COVID-19. Great. Thanks Rasha and we actually have a number of questions that have come in from our global audience so we'll try to get through as many as we can. So this is a really good question. When it comes to mobilizing, educating and organizing movements, what are the practices or beliefs that have not changed with COVID-19? And then the second part to the question was have you seen any new government policies that are good and which are responsive to the problems that people are facing? Alba, go ahead. Yes. Thank you. Well, I think the main belief that we have as an activist hasn't changed. I mean, our proper belief are still there. I say the thing is people is really frozen how to go ahead in this situation and I think it's looking for new ways to organize around this pandemic situation. So, of course, I'm talking about Venezuela is my experience is what I'm living in. So, for example, here we look for some kind of God deeper in some kind of trainer about peace building or about some specific topics. As something somebody said before, God deeper about civil rights or human rights in our context, how to to produce or to increase awareness in our population. That's why I said I said before in my in my first interview in my first call and talk. And I think this is the time to to to go for the to increase the awareness of the of the population, because people is in their homes, and they they can look better. How the, the, the violations and the, and the, and the lack of many public services is going on. So, and I think it's very, very important to take into account this time to go to them to discover new ways to connect with the people and to increase the awareness of the people. Great. Thank you very much. Thanks very much, Alba and Michael, I know that you had a response to that question as well but let me combine it. Your response with a question that actually just came in, if you don't mind, which is as more communication organizing and mobilizing shift to digital platforms. How are activists protecting themselves from creeping authoritarianism in the digital space. I wish I had a good answer on the second one. I think it's slowly is my is my answer and not enough. I think they're that the threats continue to mountain we continue, you know the exercise of balancing, trying to get the work done and trying to put all you know information online and put our information online with balancing safety and security and ensuring we're not providing information to adversaries and authoritarian regime it's in a very increasingly challenge, challenging balance and moving target and I think it's just an added the unfortunate part in my mind is just it's an added burden to all what's already challenging work to be doing. So, I hope people will have there are many resources out there hopefully some folks might share some in the chat here. Yeah, and that is very much changing. I think what hasn't changed to the prior question is, or at least two things, one, the creativity needed in organizing. Over decades, activists and campaigners have been confronted with with challenges and shifting landscapes and unexpected obstacles and in some ways this is no different to that you know this is very. Very different, but the idea of needing to be nimble and find new creative ways around those obstacles, I be not being able to, you know, in many places get in physical proximity with the people were trying to organize. And so that's the. And the second I would say is that you know the need for people to have clear roles in in movement building and activism. The, you know, we know we see time and time again pre coven through coven that people's capacity to contribute time energy resources is almost unlimited and certainly coming from a from more of an NGO NGO perspective like that's that's clear to anyone who is a movement organizer grassroots organizer. That's the lifeblood but for some of these bigger institutions and organizations who have often, you know, they often forget the role that people can play to help scale, scale up the mission and so that hasn't changed. That's only becoming more in focus I think for for many organizations nowadays. Great thanks Michael. So, this was a question about women's involvement, specifically are there stories about how women are continuing to organize under coven both for ongoing socio economic issues as well as the coven response. I would like to take a crack at that. Catherine any interesting stories from your local partners of women's led organizing. Yeah, I think one story that comes up is one of our partners in Peru. One of which is a woman farmer led movement. One of the first things they did when they, when the lockdown happened so Peru took a very intense approach, and one was one of the earlier what countries to sort of lockdown close the borders from outside travelers as well as within the states and the female cutting up is a movement that organizes many local faces of woman farmers around Peru and what they immediately did was sort of identified who were the elders, and who were the single mothers that needed to sort of be protected and taking in this lockdown and so they organized that they became part of family units so that they would be not isolated, because one of the things that we have seen and we have heard from particularly our women rights partners are about domestic abuse happening at home so the whole idea of safe space in the home area is not entirely true for a lot of women and a lot of girls. So that has been really, that has been something that's been highlighted by them. Thank you very much, Catherine. It's a great example. And Nelson you had mentioned earlier the, the women's March in South Sudan focused on gender based violence rate did you want to talk a little bit about that. Yeah, yeah, definitely. So, and that's also like in, in part, also here in Kenya, they have because of the lockdown, and I don't know how the, how is it globally, we've seen an increase in gender based violence. And that was highlighted by the lockdown, because now people are staying at home and all stuff like that. In South Sudan, there was a case of rape of a child. And that led to the mobilization the March, the March against rape and we had the women go on the street. They had social distancing. They also had a lot of yellow masks that they were giving out. But this, this was a very significant thing that delivered a letter to the ministry of gender. But also as they're doing that mobilization. They also used it as a means to connect with the people by giving away the masks. They created more awareness to people go on the street, but also brought more more agendas. I mean, I brought the agenda to the attention of the public. And, and this is a very clear example that like some of the injustice, if the injustice is like the fight against it justice doesn't have to wait, because this case of the rapids came up during COVID-19, the women immediately felt the need to kind of march against against that. And I think it created enough momentum and enough boys to bring justice to the family of the lady who was violated. That's a really interesting example. And as you say, the fight against injustice doesn't need to wait in clearly says who needs women didn't wait in this case. So there is a question from the audience specifically for Raja, which is how do journalists in Syria determine which sources are credible to know more about COVID-19. So maybe I want also to touch base on the woman activism regarding COVID-19 and also I will get back on the journalism and also how they are like the role that they are taking during COVID-19. So I want to highlight the work that I am she network and with the B circle, the woman B circle that they are doing inside Syria where like beginning of COVID-19 around like mid-March, they relaunched a campaign. It's called speaking out loud where like mainly it's focusing on like having women and also men actually activists who are like focusing on making sure that women are supported while they are on the front line of responding to COVID-19. And this is not only in the like the health sector or only in like civil society sector, but also while they are taking care of the family. And this is like especially an extra burden is coming on the woman while they are in IDP camp or they are in refugee camp or refugee, they are refugee in general. And the role that women are taking in organizing in order to get the resources needed to be responsible about to like make sure that they are taking the responsibility of their family, but also their surrounding community. So the woman B circle have been actually doing like different campaigns, smaller campaign that to take care of the elderly who are not able actually to give their houses, but not only we are not talking specifically financially, we are talking also about like psychosocial support, like being together solidarity and coordination among women and among like the people that they need the support during COVID-19. So women B circle have been playing a very important role, and also monitoring the situation on domestic violence and also increasing the violence against women, Syrian women in Syria and also outside of Syria for the Syrian woman has been like I'm she played a very, very important role during the last couple of months. So this is with the example of the woman activism that has happened during is it is happening actually during COVID-19 with the journalist, like the information has been a big challenge in Syria, and not only in Syria but also like with Syrians, like around the world you have the governments who are making sure that their own citizen, they are taking care of if there's any, like if they are stuck in one country and they need to go back to their country. Like if we talk about like US or France or different country around the world, while in Syria, you don't have this body, which is actually could be responsible about their own people, the Syrian people and this is where, like, the lack of information is an issue, but also like you are in a position as Syrian person that you don't want to go to your home country, even though this is like where you feel like you want to go there because you are afraid from detention, you are afraid from different kind of human rights violation. And this is where like journalists has been like very important actor in highlighting the situation of Syrians in the different circumstances and it's not necessarily based on numbers and facts, it's based on human stories and it has been a very important source of information for the last nine years that what we are numbers, we are people, everyone of us has a story when like there's bumping the family who lost one of their family member or they have to run away in the middle of the night, they have a story and the human story has been actually the weapons or they have been the sources of the Syrian journalists for the last nine years. And I think like it's really affecting us every time when we are seeing those numbers of COVID-19, like in all different places around the world, and you know like in 2014, the UN stopped counting how many people were killed in Syria because of the military action and we always like among us as Syrian activists, we ask ourselves, our governments around the world will stop counting the people who are dying from COVID-19 at some point or not. And this is, it's not to compare, it's to show that the tragedy that happened in Syria in the last nine years, it's happening in different way and it's very important that like it's not repeated around the world and also to learn, like if we are able to learn from COVID-19 and to prepare ourselves globally on any other virus or epidemic in the future, this is very important because like protecting the future from what's happening now or in the past is very essential and this is our global responsibility. Thanks very much Rasha. So we have a question specifically for Alba, which is how are you planning to raise awareness on COVID-19 digitally in Caracas as the population is locked down and many have no electricity or internet. And the questioner noted that this could be applied to other places as well. So if you want to kick us off Alba, just unmute yourself. I'm sorry, yes. Yes, very good question because of course I'm convinced this is a time to increase awareness, I'm convinced of that. And not only because we need, I think that the word is not only because we need to protest, I think we need to engage people which is the first phase to strengthen a movement. So when, of course, that's the way when we analyze the conflict and when we analyze the structure of a movement of social or civil society, we need to understand how in which stage we are. And I think when COVID-19 arrived, as I said before, we were in a position where we were out of the threat and then suddenly everyone kept inside. So right now, this pandemic is affecting everybody at the same time, at the same level, I mean, there is no difference between us. And perhaps many people were really in a position where they were really aware of what we were really fighting for. So how can we do that? I think, well, perhaps different actions. I could say we have been doing two things at the moment that I could say can be very successful. For example, chat forum via WhatsApp, which are really very important because we are connecting people for some specific topics. It is an action that takes place for 24 hours only. We connect people in a chat room via WhatsApp with some specific speaker in some specific theme and also we have, for example, we have had some trainers in about peace building also in chat rooms of this type. But for example, I can say also, if it's possible, I can tell this quickly. In a very special place, in a shanty area close in Caracas, where is a really complex area because of crime bans and a lot of scar cities there. People is now thinking how to connect them and they design a specific action like a call cinema roof, which is really amazing because they create a way to connect people around the houses in the top of the roof of one house. And they make a production of the of the cinema and people can watch and more specifically the children around can watch the movie from their own houses and their own windows, which is really incredible. And this is a way to make awareness around the movement these people is is making awareness around there. This is a people where this is an area where polarization is really, really hard. And this people is working hard to connect and to to identify by themselves. I think this kind of actions are the actions we needed at this moment to connect people again and to gain strength with our movement. That's an interesting example of how kind of creative use of arts has been used to connect people and raise awareness during this time when they're blackouts, you know, internet shutdowns and the like so that's a really interesting example. I mean, I'm wondering from from Nelson or Michael from your perspective this perennial question of the digital divide and on the one hand there are these creative new forms of digital activism. On the other hand, of course, not everyone has access to digital platforms and media and so how do you think about organizing in a way that won't exacerbate the digital divide and create kind of marginalization isolation. And at the same time when more people are going to digital spaces. So the simple form of that question is what constitutes kind of effective digital organizing at this stage. Go ahead Nelson. That's a very important question and has like also like it has twofold. One of the prior to the prior to the pandemic one of the questions that people have been trying to form globally is the question of the access to digital technology constitute is it a human right is it is it an essential right that people need. All the time it has been dismissals like no it is not because people have alternatives and even people who don't have access to the internet can still go to school can still access healthcare can still access government information. Now with the pandemic, we've seen a lot of the things have been the attack. So what that implies is, in a very literal sense, people, when people talk about like education, as an authentic to education right now when people talk about like access the internet to get information from the government and most of the information is moving online. Finally, we see that access to basic right is linked to access to digital technologies right now. And that is, and that is bringing a very key question that needs policy makers and people who formulate policy and also structures to view the access to digital technology. So basic right that should be extended to people since majority of what the service is that people need right now is being accessed online. The second bit of the is on the question of there is a lot of optimism that we that the with digital technology, but that that being said, we'll also see that some of the device with the pandemic is also the risk is increasing the gap between those who have access to digital technology in terms of the access to the organizing and those and those who don't like that. The pandemic is also proving that the device is increasing. So what we what we need to do at this stage in a lot of places we find ourselves unable to do the only solution will be to increase access right now. In other places we have seen people trying to use traditional means like in South Sudan and in those other places. We have seen people using microphone and bicycles to go around and create awareness to communities that are not connected to the grid or that are not connected to the digital technology, but you can only do so much with that. So the bottom line for me is like we need to have a different framework on addressing the digital divide, which is based on rights, and also framing the questions of digital divide as a question of access to basic rights. That's really interesting I wonder if there is increased momentum to advance policies around the human right to access the internet if there's been more of a push for that during this time but anyway Michael did you have some something additional. Sure I can just I mean, first of all, yes to digital as a as a human right as, you know, as essential as, and I think that becomes most pronounced especially in, you know, we're seeing it, especially in refugee camps where, you know, people's needs for internet and digital connectivity is as high as their need for, you know, water electricity, other fundamentals today and we should consider that as Nelson said. In terms of organizing tactic I have seen some creativity bridging the divide and specifically, you know, we can look at some of the mutual aid groups who started organizing online and collaborating and using shared spreadsheets and making lists of tools like slack and whatnot in different parts of the world. And then very quickly acknowledged, we're not reaching the most many of the most vulnerable people, whether it's the elderly or anyone else are not on these platforms. Therefore, let's go offline. Let's, those, let's use the people who have digital access as a bridge to those who don't have digital access or ready or the same digital access, or even the same tools, even if they are those people maybe have some digital but not the same digital right and they're not accessing the same tools. So, you know, someone's grandparents who aren't on slack. Do we go and post put fliers out we individually you know safely walk the neighborhood with our masks and put fliers in the right places or on buildings or saying if you need help, you know, here's how you contact here's the phone number here's the place you can leave a paper message or leave a all kinds of creative ways you know put a colored certain color fabric outside your window or outside your door and the network we're building which may be organized online is then including including though that access and in other way in non digital ways. It's interesting, I can say from personal experience I've seen more colored fliers in my neighborhood during this period that in any other time that I've been living in DC yes interesting example of how the kind of went offline really really quickly. So here's another very interesting question from the audience, which is when it comes to resources and access to rights. How do we apply a feminist lens to organizing and mobilization. Catherine that might have your name written on it at least in part. I mean I can share from a funders perspective and that it is a time to support feminism as it is a time to support all all types of social justices in this moment. When it comes to taking a feminist lens lens and we see this a lot with our partners. It's, it's around taking into account the communities that are usually neglected by the government, which can be from women to LGBTI to trans communities and making sure that they're also being reached out to and I think this also touch upon the question around awareness, because we have seen that the government doesn't necessarily prioritize reaching out to remote areas or that are systematic systematically have been oppressed. And so I think that has been really important to support movements who have been prioritizing reaching out. And as many folks have already shared examples, being creative to sort of communicate with them and making sure not only that the information is reaching out to them but it's the accurate information that is reaching out to them in the in the languages that they speak which is another component. So, yeah, so I think it's very important to take that those that feminist lens when it comes to grant making as well as supporting the different realities that feminist groups are are trying to build in their long term strategy. Right. Thanks Catherine. There is a very tactically focused question that we have from the audience which is, is there a place for massive civil protest, such as empty chair demonstrations caravans and the like in this moment. So mass public, or mass civil protest that adheres to social distancing guidelines. Anyone have a particularly good example of that. I mean it brings to mind for me the example that I voted in the beginning. Go ahead, Raja, there was a delay so go ahead. Yeah, so I'm going to give example and also I want to touch on the feminist lens actually. So the first one that in Lebanon, I mean not necessarily like usually I don't give example from outside of Syria but like it was like an important movement in Lebanon because it has actually stopped because of COVID-19 but restarted again for the economic reason and also because of corruption, etc. So it has been like a very important and not necessarily taking the social distancing into consideration while it's taking place the mass movement, but it has been very important one and also it's affecting the region, the whole region because the economic situation because of COVID-19 and also before COVID-19 has hit very hard the region. But also an example in Syria actually and also like in the region using cars to do some kind of sometimes celebration has been like a good example instead of like you do parade instead of the parade you are doing like car parade and also the scouts for different kinds of celebration inside Syria has been taking like some social distancing between them so it's not exactly mass movement but it's also like really responding to COVID-19 and a different way of people power and it's very important why we are thinking that will COVID-19 take long period of time what is the adaptation that like people will be taking in their daily life and also in their like movement and movement this is like to show anger to show demand for change to show like celebration this is all will feed into each other and this is an important angle to look at. Regarding the feminist lens with mobilization it's very very important that to talk about like the gender gap in technology access and especially because we are talking about COVID-19 as transferring or there's transformation with our mobilization tools to online tools in many of the cases it's very essential to really help in closing this gap or like at least decreasing the gap with having the access to technology the gender gap in access to technology and this is with from like thunder perspective but also from organizing perspective we should know that this is will take longer period of time that to make sure that like women are have the same have the same access as we mail when it comes to Raja. Thanks. Great. Thank you Raja for raising that point. So we've only got about 15 minutes left and what I'd like to do is combine another question with the audience with a question that we discussed together as a panel that we'd end this conversation with. So the question that an audience member raised is considering the global demobilization due to COVID-19. What will happen in the post pandemic scenario without the previous momentum and I'll link that to the question that I wanted each of you to answer to close out today's discussion discussion, which is how do you understand in your work the future of people power both after the COVID bent pandemic and into the future. So why don't we start with Nelson and we'll go kind of in the order that we began up Nelson you just need to unmute yourself. Yes. Yes. Regarding the question of my post demobilization and then post COVID-19. I think it's there is part of it that we kind of know and there is a bit that is still unknown because right now uncertainty is all over the world. Even economists, economists developed countries, everyone is not sure about I think one of the challenges with this pandemic is that like this, there are a lot of unknowns, and even people who are experts are proven to be not so. So what am I that mean, there is a lot of, there is a lot of things that will change the post pandemic. There are wins on this. Of course, a lot of governments have been exposed and people's trust in governments have reduced to a great extent. That means this post pandemic we more people will be questioning authority and people will demand accountability on a higher level than than used to. So a lot of questions of like, is the health care system okay, if it is okay to which extent do we have these are in this area do we have so people will become will be asking will be asking those questions on a kind of a deeper level. In terms of some of the losses that we might see. Definitely post the pandemic. We're already we're already seeing this, especially in the regions where a lot of our youth activists, a lot of the people who used to be used to have a side economic activity, as well as also mobilizing people. They are they have also been impacted their lives have been impacted. So that means people will try to find ways of earning a living ways of maintaining their lives. And that will impact the the general focus. That's something that I mentioned earlier on you have a lot of competing attention in your head. I think it will make it very hard for you to mobilize so I think this will also have impact on on people mobilizing, especially youth volunteers and groups who are on the lower tier of the economy, they will definitely mobilizing people together will be a bit harder, do it to the economic impact and the barriers impact on the societal level. Okay, thanks very much, Nelson. Raja, what is the future of people power. So I would like to talk about that present of the people power and making sure that we are pushing the Syrian people the Syrian movement are pushing towards the change that we have been calling for since nine years in Syria. We want to have a political transition, based on a peace agreement that could be done virtually if the actors, the Syrian actors, the regional actors and international actors, agree that this is the right thing to be done now. And it is that I think to be done actually five years ago, even like nine years ago. The peace agreement, which is lead Syria to a new phase of a country which is based on human rights, woman right rule of laws, where a real accountability is done for people who have been actually committed human rights atrocities, even work crimes and the crimes against humanity. This is essential and Syria could be an example of a country where we can sign a peace agreement virtually. This is, we shouldn't be calling all the time for a ceasefire. There shouldn't be actually in the beginning, government or different actor bombing their own people in order to achieve like their own interest. Actually, it's our right to be secure and stable as people. It is our right. We shouldn't be calling for ceasefire. It is actually the case where we are calling for ceasefire. It's dangerous to talk about after COVID-19. It is during COVID-19. It should have happened before and then we would be better prepared for COVID-19 actually if we have more like people, not 12 million people in Syria, almost half of the society, either displaced internally or outside of the country. Doctors who have killed by bombing or under torture in prisons or have been displaced internally or to outside, they could have helped Syrian people inside Syria at the moment. And this is why during COVID-19 people, Syrian people are calling for making sure that sustainable peace is achieved through a peace agreement based on 22%. Thank you, Rajah. That's a poignant remark that it is possible to sign a peace deal virtually in Syria. Amazing to think that that could be possible during this time. Alba, what in your view is the future of people power? Well, I think to say the future is something, is a huge responsibility. But I must say my wish in this situation is, well, I have the social movement must be stronger than now. Because for me, this time has been a time to look inside of us as a human being, of course, but I think also as a social movement to analyze how has been done the things the last time. How can we strengthen the situation and also take into account how the efficiency has been shown to all the people without any differences. So for me, this is very important, and I insist on this, because it's time to connect more people. And something which is really for us really crucial is how to connect people from grassroots to this situation because there are deeper problems who came out and perhaps were blind for many people, but now are exposed to everyone. So I think the pandemic was kind of a storm for us as an activist to move us and think about, I think, out of the box and explore new possibilities. I think we perhaps from my point of view as a Venezuelan, most of the time we were thinking only in a one channel of possibility for protesting. This is a way to open, to have a wider view of this situation, to look inside as somebody asked me before, how can we do, if we don't have electricity, if we don't have internet connection. How can we do that now? How can we go forward on this? So I think it's time to think about and to go deeper in this. Thank you, Maria. No, thank you, Alba, for raising the, you know, the important point of how the pandemic has actually forced activists and movements to think outside the box in many ways. So in the five minutes that remain, Catherine, what in your view is the future of people power. Yeah, thanks for that great question. We already see before COVID-19 that there have already been multiple pathways to where systemic change because of people power. And as many have said, the movements now are learning different creative ways to strategize and build people power different environments. So I don't think people power is going away. We've heard that famous quote from Erudanti Roy around this moment being a portal between one world and the next. And I think that's a real, that's been a real great way to sort of express what a lot of activists have said here about this transition moment that we're hopefully entering into a better new reality. We've witnessed many movements around the world taking this moment to vocalize key demands that are highlighting the failures of the systems to provide general well-being that includes the need for food sovereignty, health support and also economic security that is based more on solidarity and not profit or capital accumulation. So I think for us or for funders, we need to continue to see what ways we can release control and to really support social movements and people power at this moment and beyond this moment. And I think it's, you know, I think it's something that it's hard to do, but I think this moment is calling us for being more accountable to that. All right, thanks very much, Catherine. Michael, what in your view is the future of people power? For the sounding naive, I think it's bright, our issues are challenging, but the future of people power I think is bright. I was inspired by some words of Rebecca Solnit who was writing long before this about how activism and organizing leads to more organizing and activism. So what I think is happening right now is that we are strengthening our political muscles. I think mutual aid is a political act. We're strengthening our civic muscles. And that to me gives me hope because for all the reasons we've just been discussing like as coming out of this, this means we have as more people have realized that we need to take issues and community support and helping one another and tackling the issues that matter in our lives into our own hands increasingly. That's not to say there aren't other pathways that we need involved but as more people get activated and organized, that is not something that I think will immediately dissipate. And so that gives me hope. Alright, thanks so much, Michael. So we're ending on a somewhat optimistic note, but what I heard, you know, many of you saying, drawing on the Aniradi Roy portal metaphor and Rebecca Solnit's idea of activism and organizing leading to more activism and organizing that at the same time that is obviously creating so much harm and destruction around the world. It also potentially is a transformative moment for movements and those who are connecting kind of the issues that have been emerging and made so blatantly obvious in the context of the pandemic and that to some of the more structural and systemic issues. And, you know, in the metaphor of strengthening our social organizing muscles. That's certainly a hope for what comes of this pandemic and also that we're able to globally strengthen our peacemaking muscles. In light of the COVID pandemic. So, we're at the very end of our time here and mainly I want to thank a really remarkable group of panelists. Nelson. Roger Alba, Rajal, Talia Alba, Paroy, Catherine Zavala, Michael Silverman. Thank you all for your very thoughtful and very, very helpful remarks. And thanks of course to the US IP AV and comms team and especially to Miranda Rivers and Nick Zaremba who have been helping team up the questions from the audience throughout today's conversation. So I want to thank everyone for joining us and till the next time.