 introduce you to your host, Jessica Unger, from the American Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works. Go ahead, Jessica. Hello. Thank you so much, Mike, for that introduction. And thank you to everyone for joining us for today's program on how to protect against risks to tribal cultural heritage. This program is made possible with generous support from the Department of the Interior. My name is Jessica Unger, and I'm the Emergency Programs Coordinator at the Foundation of the American Institute of Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works. FAIC undertakes and underwrites programs and initiatives to advance the conservation profession nationally and internationally in all its facets and applies the expertise of the profession in addressing global artistic, cultural, and historic preservation priorities. FAIC promotes the preservation of cultural heritage as a means towards a deeper understanding of our shared humanity, the need to express ourselves through creative achievement in the arts, humanities, and sciences. We honor the history and integrity of these achievements through the preservation of cultural materials for future generations. Today's program is the first in a series of three webinars that will discuss the risks that can potentially affect the cultural resources of tribes. Cultural resources are defined as the aspects of a cultural system that are valued by or significantly representative of a culture, or that contain significant information about a culture. A cultural resource may be a tangible entity or a cultural practice. Tangible cultural resources are characterized as structures, archaeological resources, cultural landscapes, museum collections, archival documents and photographs, sacred sites, and ethnographic resources. So as you might expect, the series will primarily address those tangible cultural resources and how to best protect them. Today our program will focus on risk assessment. It's often a scary prospect to consider the risks that we face. But fortunately we have tools at our disposal that help guide us through the process of considering and sizing up the risk to our cultural resources. Tomorrow we will continue the series by discussing how to collaborate with emergency professionals in order to learn about their processes and share information with them. On Thursday we will learn how to relay all of this information into a preparedness plan. All of these programs are designed with tribal communities in mind to highlight the unique needs of these groups and emergencies. For today's program we're fortunate to be joined by Robert, or Rob Waller. Robert is president and senior risk analyst with Protect Heritage Corporation, a firm dedicated to helping institutions and organizations improve heritage management. His career included 33 years with the Canadian Museum of Nature. He holds a PhD in cultural property risk analysis from Gothenburg University. Robert Waller maintains appointments as research associate, Canadian Museum of Nature, and adjunct professor, Queens University. And has taught, lectured, and served as a consultant at museums and universities throughout North and South America, Europe, Asia, and Australia. He is professionally accredited by the Canadian Association of Professional Conservators, a professional associate of the American Institute of Conservation, and a fellow of the International Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Work. With that, I'd like to hand the presentation over to Rob Waller. Oh, and Mike, can you help us with getting the correct pod set up here? Thank you. Okay. Okay, looks good. Great. Thank you very much, Jessica and Mike, for getting us going. And, oh, looks like we have another participant popping in. So, not so many. Each one of you is extremely valuable to us. So, we are in fact going to have some little interactive bits through this presentation, but I'm very happy that you're with us today. Good morning or good afternoon, depending on where you are. And although the subject of risk to property can be exceedingly boring at times, we really will try to make it as interesting as possible to you. So, we are going to be talking about risks and your collections, and bringing it on behalf of the foundation of the American Institute for Conservation. And as Jessica mentioned, my name is Robert Waller. I'm with Protect Heritage, and we're on the right day, which is good. Make sure I hit the right button here. We all take risks every day. It's something we're all familiar with. This may be a risk of workload avalanche. I know I am sometimes. Sometimes we actually voluntarily take risks, like this person bungee jumping off a bridge. It's not something you'd catch me doing, but we all have different risk tolerances and even different risk appetites. Some people really like to take big risks for the adrenaline rush involved in it. And sometimes we just get ourselves into risky situations, perhaps by not being as aware as we might be of potential problems. And that's one of the issues that we'll be addressing today in this webinar, how we can avoid that as best we can. We manage risks in many ways by providing warnings like this one, caution the content of this coffee mug is extremely hot. Sometimes those are more or less useful. Another example is a crossing guard for young children. I think that's one of the most useful risk management techniques we take. And it's not even just humans, actually all animals of all sorts will take risks. It's very much in their benefit. This little fish might take a risk to find a much bigger pond to jump into. But actually all animals, even insects, will take different amounts of risk. Some of them will travel far away to see if they can find a better place. Many of those don't make it, but some of them will survive and end up with the colony growing quite a lot. And we can take measures to help protect us from risks. As this little mouse is, as he dons his helmet to see if he can get it, that little piece of cheese. So we're all familiar with risks. We just do it all the time from whether we touch a pot handle, not sure if it's hot, or how many cups we juggle as we put our dishes away, all those sorts of things. We're constantly doing that. Now we want to think about our risk awareness. And we all have varying degrees of risk awareness. One is just to watch out and be careful all the time. One is to employ checklists to remind us of what the risks might be and to be aware of them. Or we can do what's called scored checklists. I'll go through each of these in turn. This is just the sort of outline of the next four slides. Or we can actually do a quantitative risk analysis and figure out really how big is that risk. Well, let's start thinking about risk or watch out and be careful as a means of risk awareness. Now this is certainly a case for some industries like ordinance workers. These are people who make bombs, even worse than fireworks manufacturers. And they have what they call the ABCs of risk awareness. That is always be careful. Then it certainly makes sense for them. One of the troubles with this watch out and be careful is we can really get bombarded with too many messages about risks. And some of them can get quite silly, like that warning on the coffee mug or this sign. This sign has sharp edges. Do not touch the edge of this sign. We can really get overwhelmed with precautionary messages about risk. And that becomes a problem. So on the next, if you'll excuse me just a moment, I'm going to turn off that sound and come back to you now. Sorry about that. The higher degree of risk awareness would be to use basic checklist. And checklist can be really useful and important. I know every time that I take an airplane trip, I'm really glad to know that the pilot and co-pilot are going through a basic checklist to say, is there fuel in the tank? Are the tires inflated? And all those sorts of things. They can be really important for our museums or heritage institutions. Checklists are also extremely important for ensuring that routine maintenance is done on things like fire suppression and alarm systems, on roofs, on all kinds of features that protect our collection. We want checklists that the maintenance is being done. But moving a little further along, we can have something called scored checklists. And in this case, we have a list of risks that we're concerned about. But we put some priorities on them, usually by considering how likely is this risk event to occur and how severe might the damage be if it does occur. And that can lead to these things that I'm sure you've seen at some point, these kind of risk matrices where they consider likelihood or probability and severity or impact as it says here. And then we consider things that are high probability and high impact to be high risk. This is the kind of thing that we'll be talking about today. Going a little bit further in our sophistication, then we can go through to full quantitative risk analysis. And this shows an example of what we did at our Canadian Museum of Nature to assess 22 generic risks to 19 collection units. And it's very complex, but we're not going to be going that far today and we don't need to go that far today. We're doing a real initial screening of what might be the most significant risk that you need to make sure that you're addressing at your institution. And we don't have to go to this level of complexity to do that. Risks, what are they? As risks are departures from a goal. And let's explore that in terms of managing a collection. Let's consider this collection of 25 objects. There's five ceramics, five etchings or works on paper, five textiles, five natural history objects, and five paintings. So 25 objects in a collection. And let's consider this collection not today because today we're all busy. We're attending a webinar. When we're done that, we're probably going to have a pile of emails to deal with and there might be a leak somewhere that needs attention or somebody wants to borrow something we need to respond yesterday. We're all very busy. So let's give ourselves a little bit of time and think about the risks that might start occurring to our collections even a year or two from now, a bit of breathing time. Now our goal is to consider carrying this collection of 25 objects forward in time. And we choose 100 years as a sensible kind of time goal to think we want our collections to last very well for 100 years. So we define that as our goal. But as we know, reality is what happens while we're making other plans and it can be different. In this case, our collection of 25 objects, we may find that two of the objects simply disappear over the next 100 years. We may not be sure whether they were stolen or simply misplaced or sent out on loan and not returned, but evidently they are gone. They've disappeared from our collection after 100 years. It may be that a big part of our collection is put on exhibit. In this case, we put maybe a third of our collection on exhibit under fairly strong lighting and over time those items fade out and lose their color. Well, that represents a departure from our goal of carrying the collection forward without any loss or damage. So that would be another risk. And finally, we might have just a chance of a catastrophic risk occurring. In this case, fire might destroy the entire collection with just a chance of occurring over the next 100 years. But absolutely that would be a departure from our goal of carrying the collection forward in time by 100 years. And that is what we define as preservation. It's our goal. Any departures from that goal, we define as risks. Now, to identify risks comprehensively, we consider 10 agents of change or sometimes called agents of deterioration. These are physical forces, which could be an earthquake, could be dropping something, could be something warping because it's not well supported. Fire, whether it's a small local fire easily put out or a fire that consumes the whole building. Water, which could be a flood, a leaking pipe or a rising damp. Criminals, again, could be big events or just taking single small objects. Pass, whether they're rodents, birds, insects, contaminants as pollutants that can come from the outside or may be present in the objects themselves or in storage materials. Light and ultraviolet radiation can do damage to our collections. Occasionally adverse temperature and certainly sometimes adverse relative humidity can be damaging. And the final agent is dissociation or that is the loss of information from objects. All our objects will tend to have some provenance information some other research related information. If we lose the connection between that information and the object, then we lose value in our collections. So we must guard against that as well. Now for these 10 agents of change, as I mentioned for physical forces, they may occur as either rare but severe events, something like an earthquake. This would be like this risk one on this chart. Could be very high severity but tends to be very low frequency. Does not happen very often. At the other extreme, we might have this R2 or risk two fairly low severity but perhaps a high frequency. Now the problem with this kind of graph is it always appears that risk one is higher than risk two because it's higher up. But we could actually tilt this whole chart over onto its corner and then we can see that in fact the rare and severe risk may actually be about the same magnitude as the very common but persistent gradual change. Risk one may equal risk two. We could actually draw this shading of colors to show in the red area, we'd have a high risk, yellow area is a moderate risk and green area is a low risk. And we can put in some examples of this. This picture depicts the earthquake in Haiti about five years ago, absolutely devastating for their cultural heritage. Buildings, collections of all sorts were severely damaged or lost. At the other extreme, we could have continual processes like the wear of the spine of a book that's used quite a lot. Each incident of damage by wear is very tiny but because it's continual it can actually add up over time to be as severe as something like an earthquake. And in the middle of these we have sporadic events. In this instance a visitor is taking a picture of one vase while his bum knocks the plinth of another vase and knocks it onto the floor causing damage. Now this kind of thing should not be happening continually in our museums but sadly it's not even so much of a rare event. It's the kind of thing that might happen every few decades or something like that. Now we can reduce a risk by reducing the frequency at which it occurs or by reducing the severity of a risk incident or by doing both and reducing both the frequency and severity. Ideally we do both if we can but we tend to do whichever is most effective, most cost effective and so on. Oh, now I'm sorry, I think yes I did also label these. The type one is often thought of as a potential disaster and we define it as expecting just one less than one event over the next 100 years. Type two we think of as incidents and they might be a few per decade or just a few per century. And finally type three are the continual processes or at least one event per year. Now moving on, when we can consider both agents of change and types of risk it gives us this framework for thinking about identifying risks. We know we're going to want to think about physical forces type one, issues like earthquake, sinkholes, these very rare events that might impact on us. For water it could be a 200 year flood from a river. Burst water main could be type one risks, really just a chance over the next 100 years. For type two risks for water we might have roof leaks, plumbing leaks, that sort of thing. If you're unfortunate in your location though you might have sheet flooding from rain, those sorts of things we'll want to think about is type two risks. As we go through our set of agents of change we want to think about each type of risk at least for this emergency preparedness we want to think about type one and type two risks and then we want to identify them and define them clearly. I'll just show a few examples here of some specific risks that we'd consider. Whoops, I just got ahead of myself a bit. For this physical force type one risk we might consider earthquake leading to a shelf collapse, leading to breakage. We define risks in terms of the source, the path, and the effect whenever it's possible to use all three. Our second specific risk might be the earthquake causes toppling objects, leading to breakage. Moving on but still a type one risk, snow loading could lead to roof collapse, could lead to breakage in the collection. Now let's consider a type two risk. Handling during use through an accident dropping might lead to physical damage. And finally a couple of type three physical force risks. Gravity acting on a poorly supported, say a woven basket that's poorly supported might distort over time gradually by gravity or accessing the collection through crowded storage might lead to physical damage. So these are examples of specific risks that are well enough defined that it becomes fairly easy to think about how severe they are, how big their magnitude is. Now the heritage preservation and now managed and maintained by the foundation of the American Institute for Conservation came up with some terrific emergency preparedness tools within their risk evaluation and planning program. And one of these is their risk prioritization worksheet. Oh, I don't know what quite happened with some of the texts there is a little bit hard to read. It seems to have copied over onto itself and apologize for that. But these are available readily on the internet. I've put down the link there and Jessica can make sure that we all get that. And here we list a number of hazards and then consider the likelihood of occurrence and the severity of damage. But I was going to say we can see but it's actually a little bit hard to see but risk 1A is simply defined as an earthquake and I'll show you that I'd like us to think a little bit more clearly about exactly what kind of risk that is. The next is flooding due to flooding from a river or a high water table, then a flash flood, then hail and so on. But let's look at how we might modify these to be a little bit better defined so that we can think more clearly about how big the risk is. So earthquake just as an example I split up into a number of particular risks. If we consider earthquake we'd want to consider is the building stable against an earthquake or is there a chance that the building might collapse? Now these sorts of things you're not going to be able to judge for yourself although there are some helpful kind of tools out there but you're much more apt to want to go to your FEMA representative and ask them for some guidance on interpreting the stability of your building or ask them for directing you to somebody who can provide you some guidance. These things are becoming easier to get hold of all of the time. I see now as we kind of loaded this up we must have had a problem with the fonts selected but the second risk, the 1.1.2 would have been earthquake causes suspended objects in the room to fall and those could be ceiling tiles that fall down and strike parts of the collection or even worse would be suspended lights or projectors or speakers anything that's suspended up there that might shake loose and fall on the collection. Earthquake causing shelving collapse would be another one and you want to consider how stable your shelving and cabinets are or might they move in an earthquake or a couple of other ones would include earthquake causing objects to topple over or shelving units to topple over or to kind of jiggle and walk to the end of edge of a shelf and then fall over. So these are all examples of specific risks related to an earthquake and if we want to think about how important they are to our collection we need to become fairly clear in our minds exactly what scenario we're considering. So that's something I really encourage as we look at a risk, sorry, a list of risks that we're considering to actually think them through is to so if this risk event occurs how might it play out in our museum or our institution? What might happen to the objects that we're concerned about? Now just to read this is now I apologize again there's one animation there that doesn't seem to be quite working but what it intended to say was to simply repeat this idea that we want to define a risk by thinking of the source of the risk which could be earthquake, it could be a sinkhole, it could be somebody dropping something those would all be a source of a risk the path that we get from the source to the items in our collection and then the impact on the items to our collection. So to help us with this I wanted to change a couple of things within this worksheet and I've been talking with Jessica about this I can pass to Jessica a kind of revised worksheet that takes this severity of damage which the initial worksheet just asked us to evaluate using a scale of one to five and thinking in some more detail to consider how much of the collection might be affected how much value could be lost to that part that will be affected and then using those two numbers to calculate a severity of damage and I'm going to walk us through a couple of examples with of this so whoops and the scale that I'm using for this how much of the collection is one would indicate we expect less than 10% of the collection to be affected two we'd enter if we expect just the mid-range somewhere between 10 and 90% of the collection might be affected and a three if virtually all of the collection or more than 90% might be affected now let's look at a few examples where we could see how we'd use these numbers and this is the collection I want to offer us so it's a whole set of little shapes of different colors there's some O pyramids some spheres they're a little hard to see because they're so small now some cylinders and that sort of thing and a diversity of colors and let's put them inside a building because I don't think they last very long outside I'm sure some crows or something would come along and pick them up and further let's put our building so that it has a basement and then two elevated floors and let's consider now if there's a flood that comes along and floods our basement now the question that I'd like to put to you is considering our set of one, two, or three how much of the collection would we say we expect to be affected by this risk event now I notice we have a few participants if you're ready and you're able would you mind popping into the chat whether you think we should consider this a one or less than 10% of the collection affected or just put down a two if you think it's 10 to 90% of the collection or enter a three if you think it's more than 90% of the collection I'm hoping we might be able to get some people to pop in a number in their chat just to see if we're all on the same page but I do recognize that some of you may not be ready to or familiar with how to put that information into the chat so I'll just wait for a moment or two I hope a number or two will pop up for us but if they don't I'll offer my suggestion okay well I would think that looking at this collection distributed on the three floors of the building and expecting that it's really the basement that's going to be exposed to this flood I would think that that must correspond to about a third of the collection being affected or in this case we'd call that a two 10 to 90% of the collection might be affected now considering just that part of the collection that's affected how much value loss might be realized in that part of the collection and now let's imagine not so much that it is all these little pyramid spheres and cylinders but it's actually the kind of collection you hold in your institution whether that's ceramics or garments or tools or whatever how much value might be lost if the storage in the basement gets flooded to considerable depth do you expect that you'd lose 10% of the value of that material 10 to 90% or more than 90% of the value of that material and again I notice we have a new participant in so I'm asking for a bit of involvement here if you could feed back through the chat box in this situation where the collection in your institution a part of it's stored in the basement and we anticipate flooding to maximum depth in that basement so we think that the full third of the collection held in the basement is going to become wet I'm asking if you the participants could type in your chat box do you think that that part of the collection that's wetted thoroughly will lose 10% of its value somewhere in the middle between 10 and 90% or more than 90% of its value so I'll give you a moment if you can enter a value in your chat box one two or three I'll be quiet for a moment and let you think but again not noting a lot of chat happening I'll offer my suggestion which is well actually it really depends on the situation it depends on how well prepared you are for this kind of event do you have arrangements that you can get pumps to rapidly get rid of the water to bring in some teams that can respond to all the wet objects whether that is installing fans moving some of the items out either into the open if we're not anticipating rain or into another sheltered space where we can dry them in your next couple of webinars you're going to be dealing with those kind of questions and issues considerably but I would suggest that for many kinds of collections certainly for things like stone tools or ceramics the loss in value is probably going to be quite small less than 10% they can probably be cleaned and recovered fairly well for the most part for some items it may be very high maybe much more than 90% certainly if there's any water soluble pigments that are important then that's going to be lost absolutely if you have no alarms that are going to alert you to the situation and response plan that will get you in there working with the collection and drying it out quickly then you're going to have more than 90% loss if you do have some reasonable emergency preparedness plans you're probably in the middle there you're going to expect some loss probably more than 10% for a mixed collection but probably less than 90% so these would be 2 and 2 for how much of the collection how much of the value lost now let's consider our same collection in the same building but a different situation in this case let's imagine that there's a fire nearby and that it blows smoke into and through the building and now you notice our collections lost its colors it has a soot deposit over pretty much all of the collection now saying all of the collection I've probably given a little hint to this first part how much of the collection do we think could be affected by this smoke infiltrating our building would it be the one, two, or three less than 10% intermediate or more than 90% again I'll wait for just a moment see if we have any chat pop-ups for but I think I kind of gave this one away actually when I said all of the collection I think here we would agree that it really is it's more than 90% of the collection it's pretty much all of this collection is going to be affected but now let's consider how much loss in value for this collection that went from a fairly nice colored pristine state to something that's covered with some kind of soot and smoke residue and that sort of thing again of course it's going to depend on the kind of collection that you have if you have a lot of leather and feathers and that sort of thing then the damage really will be quite severe they're very hard to clean hard to rectify again if you have stone tools and ceramics probably not so much in this case it really can be highly variable I offered here a one assuming that well maybe it's not going to be the deposition of soot is not going to be much much greater than the deposition of dust that we get over 10 or 20 years and that a practice of routine cleaning might might reverse a lot of that accumulation but this is a situation where you really need to think about the contents of your collection and how they will be affected as we do this actually we often find it helpful to take some examples of the kind of material and I'm not saying something out of your collection but say something out of your gift shop that mimics the kind of object that you have in your collection and maybe even sprinkling it with something like some black poster paint and then thinking about well how much damage has that caused to this object this example object again not from the collection but from the gift shop or from antique shop or something just mimic the kind of damage and estimate how much value loss has occurred now I wanted to look at one more example where again we'll go back to our collection as we had it oh dear and this one isn't going to work after we loaded this after we loaded this power point we tried some of the animations but we didn't try all of them and I'm kind of sorry we didn't get this one what I had was a fire sweeping through the building and eventually reducing it all to ashes so we missed the fire part sorry about that but we do get the ashes now we'd ask how much of the collection might be affected and in this case we went from that whole building to this little pile of ashes so we'd say yes all of the collection could be affected by a fire that consumes the whole building how much value loss now again here I think this is almost no-brainer that all of the value of our collection has been lost so this is an example of all of the collection has lost all of its value now I'll just oh I'll just again pulling up this kind of chart that we have we've now put in these values for how much of the collection for flooding it was a mid part of the collection and a mid part of value loss would lead to a severity of damage of 2 or a risk rating of 9 for the second one the smoke we considered how much of the collection all of it but not so much loss in value again the severity is 2 for the fire all of the collection will lose all of its value or a severity level of 5 now that looked it I could have run those to show those three things that deal with the severity of the damage but now let's consider the likelihood of occurrence and in this risk evaluation planning document there is guidance on how you rank these 1,2,3,4 and 5 from extremely unlikely to expected with near certainty for 1 to 5 1 being extremely unlikely 5 almost certainty in fact almost all natural events cover a vast vast range meteorite showers we expect several per year whereas massive asteroid impacts into our planet are fortunately much less common so a nice meteorite shower comes by 3 or 4 times a year usually whereas a massive asteroid impact might affect the earth once every 100 million years now as a rule there's what we call a rule of thumb is that any natural risk event is that is 10 times as severe will probably be 10 times less likely so whatever happens to you typically in a year what will happen in 10 years is probably 10 times as severe what will happen in 100 years might be 100 times as severe and this is important for us to reflect on and think about because as we just call on what we believe our experience has been over the past 10 or 20 years that is not at all a reliable indicator of what we should anticipate over the next 100 years so if we have experienced small earthquakes over 10 or 20 years we have to consider something almost 10 times as massive an event over the next 100 years or so it's something to keep in mind as we're thinking about these extreme events that we want to be prepared for because like the flood in the basement how much damage it causes our collections really depends on how well prepared we are okay almost done now I think how well protected is your collection I think this is about my final slide I hope I've helped you to have a better sense of how you come to know what to expect how we can use a set of 10 agents of change and 3 types of risk to identify a broad set of particular risks that can affect our collections and we can use some very simple estimators to actually assess those risks to at least rank order them in terms of risks that we really anticipate are very unlikely to be a concern say meteorite striking your museum well it's could happen but it's really very unlikely so planning for that as a priority is not going to be very great interestingly the Society for Risk Analysis in just last month's journal had a paper on the global risk of meteorite impacts and doing a careful analysis of that in terms of helping us plan is very interesting but for any particular spot on earth it's not something we need to be greatly concerned about however if you're in California or Alaska or some place like that or even if you're in some other places as Washington recently found out earthquakes can actually do significant damage to our collections how much of the collection is at risk we thought of a way of thinking about that and just in closing here I wanted to remind you of some of the benefits of things like good cabinets well good cabinets can provide a lot of protection from water from leaks coming down from dust and pollutants infiltrating from the outside good cabinets can be such a terrific solution not just to ongoing storage issues but actually to protection from emergency events similarly keeping collections off the floor even just six inches off the floor to protect against damage from occasional sheet flooding how much value loss again being prepared having an effective emergency plan can be the difference between losing an entire collection or really just losing a small fraction of the value of a collection should all your precautions fail and worst event kind of happens similarly having your emergency supplies and the next couple of webinars will be going into those issues in considerable detail but they will feed back into your evaluation of your risk because when you judge how much of your collection value might be lost it will be highly dependent on how well prepared you are how good your plan is how practiced your plan is and how available your supplies are so with that that's the time that we had for this and I'm going to say thank you for your attention and I guess turn it back to Jessica to see if we have any questions I'd love if we could get a little bit of dialogue going that would be great but show you take us over Jessica great thank you so much Rob really wonderful presentation I think it was very helpful for everyone to get an understanding of some of the principles behind risk assessments and to sort of walk us through ways of thinking about the risks faced by our cultural institutions again if you have any questions or comments please do feel free to make use of the chat box on the left hand side of the page Rob has been very generous in providing his email address on this final slide so do feel free to reach out with any follow up questions and of course I will be adding my email as well to the chat box so I'm more than happy to field questions that come up after the fact again this program is a part of a series that we hope in combination will be a useful resource for thinking about how to build the most robust preparedness plan and I'm seeing Amanda Harpool writing in thank you guys for taking the time to present today thank you Amanda for being on the program I guess I will go ahead and take the opportunity now to thank Mike Learning Times for being a wonderful host and great technological support and of course a big thank you to Rob Waller for taking the time to share his words of wisdom about risk assessments today we hope that tomorrow you will be able to join us for a program same time, same place we will be joined by a representative from the Bureau of Indian Affairs who works with the Tribal Assistance Coordination Group discussing some of the resources that are available for tribes during emergency situations and specifically addressing how emergency professionals think about responding to disasters and how cultural institutions can best work with them in order to develop strong relationships and to build the best preparedness plan moving forward so with that again I want to thank Mike and Rob and everyone who joined us today again the recording of this presentation will be available on AIC's YouTube channel which is AI Conservation is the channel name thank you to everyone and have a great rest of your morning or afternoon