 For the current government, I can say without missing words, that it is decision by the British government to rule Nigeria on the Red List just because of less than 2,000 cases of COVID-19, which, by the way, did not ordinate in Nigeria. It is unjust, unfair, primitive, indefensive and discriminatory. The decision is also not to be by science or common sense. For the current government, I can say that it is unjust, unfair, primitive, indefensive and discriminatory. The decision is also not to be by science or common sense. The decision is also not to be by science or common sense. For the current government, I can say that it is unjust, unfair, primitive, indefensive and discriminatory. For the current government, I can say that it is unjust, unfair, primitive, indefensive and discriminatory. The decision is also not to be by science or common sense. The decision is also not to be by science or common sense. For the current government, I can say that it is unjust, unfair, primitive, indefensive and discriminatory. The UK's decision was based on discrimination and he said that it was not scientific and that he also said it was prejudice. Do you agree with his position? The UK, they are not banning those other countries, you wonder if it is discriminatory or just political. I am not sure what that is. Based on science at the moment, I think we are still at that particular phase where we are not a threat to any country at the moment. Let's also bring in the Commissioner for Health, Cross River State Dr Bata Adu. Once again thank you for joining us. You are welcome. You also have some of these countries that have cases of Omicron variant. You have Germany, Belgium, Canada, Denmark, Israel, Hong Kong. The list is almost endless. How come Nigeria is put on that list and Africa as a continent? First, I just think very strongly that the decision taken to ban flights from Nigeria to the UK was absolutely unnecessary. I also strongly think that stopping visa issuance to Nigeria school intent to visit the UK was equally very unnecessary. It is very, very clear that the Omicron variant, even though it is a new variant, will not or cannot be as virulent as habeas but as other COVID-19 variants that we have seen over time. And this has been scientifically proven. Like you said, there is Omicron virus in the United States. You have it in Canada, you have it in Germany, you have it in France, you have it in several other countries. And this ban, this red listing, this red flag was not raised on those countries. Why Nigeria? Over the spirit of the pandemic, it has been very, very clear that Nigeria has been put up in strong response that has prevented its citizens from dying. The expectation was that people would die like flies on the road in Nigeria in Africa. But that's not happening. The response has been fair enough. And so if we are not putting a ban on you because you had too many cases and we are afraid that you come in with your cases into Nigeria, it's unfair for you to put a ban on us that we should not come into the UK. Remember people have businesses, people have different socials, meetings and the rest of it that could help them open up the economic space and then you're stopping all of this just abruptly. Really, really, there's no scientific basis for this. The World Health Organization has stated very, very clearly that there is no scientific backing to punish countries who came out to tell you that look, we have this variant. It's like saying the Delta variant. Why didn't you stop us from the Delta variant which was even more virulent than Omicron? Why didn't you stop us from the new variant or any other variant that was in our country or in the South Africa or somewhere else? Really, really, we need to review all of this. And I want all of the UK government to please take up that ban. It's completely uncalled for and it's not necessary. All right. I'm Kenechroko. The presidential sharing committee is saying that they will respond appropriately soon. But then don't you think we have been to reactionary to all of this in as much as we have been banned from entering the UK Nigerians that these shouldn't we be doing maybe some sort of retaliatory move? And then again, if you look at it, would you really say that it's like a regional vendetta on Africans, really? Yeah, I absolutely agree it's regional and then the part of retaliation I think is very necessary because so many people, so many countries out there looking at Nigeria and what UK did at the moment is a way of looking down on Nigeria as a whole. Nigeria is a powerful country in Africa. And then when you treat us this particular way, other countries that are in Nigeria somehow should be looking out to see what Nigeria is going to do. And I think on the Nigerian part what we should do at the moment is show a diplomatic retaliation because it makes no sense where possibly in the UK we have more Omicron cases. And I think about daily we have British Airways flying into the country with hundreds of people coming in from the UK and then putting us at risk of even increasing our number of Omicron virus but they are moving first to ban Nigerians from coming in. And just like the Honorable Commissioner said, banning Nigeria is one thing. But then moving forward to stop visa issuance is another thing that means it's not about the Omicron virus because you can issue visa and if there's a ban people will not travel. I mean nobody's going to get your airport and fly away and probably go into the country. So there's probably something beyond the Omicron virus that they are trying to go after but they are using Omicron virus as an excuse. And at this point Nigeria is a big country in Africa should think towards diplomatic retaliation. Okay so we also have Dr. Betha right here with us. I would also like to share your thoughts on the AU, that's the African Union. Of course we know that they are saddled with the responsibility of ensuring that the fight against emergencies in the continent is properly taken care of. How would you describe AU's response to the fight against COVID-19 and other variant and the response of African leaders to the fight against COVID-19? In all fairness I think the AU and indeed African leaders have shown a lot of resilience and leadership as it concerns the COVID-19 pandemic. The response from African leaders was really really not expected. Different countries created a presidential tax force and there was direct support from the countries budget into fighting the COVID-19 pandemic. And this was really very epic first of its kind. Even the private sector came into the space to see that they can help. I think AU has done well however AU needs to emphasise on the need for African countries to begin to produce vaccines. On the need for African countries to increase the number of vaccinated persons. I think this is where the attention should go right now. If we have most of our population vaccinated whether it's Omicron or it's Delta or it's Mu or it's Betha or it's whatever name it answers right. We're not afraid because we know the majority of the population is covered and they have heard immunity already right. But AU has not been able to push effectively on this. We've been able to get some donations of vaccines from different countries but it's not enough to feed the African population. I think AU should move on with governments of various countries to ensure and build vaccine companies. Manufacturing companies that will manufacture vaccines in Africa. That way we have a sovereignty. That way we can be able to give our own citizens first before sending out to anybody. Imagine India. India is almost a country where a lot of persons, the population is really really large. And of course they have most of the issues that we have in Nigeria but they are able to produce vaccines, save their own population and then even go to save population in developed world and in other countries that are requiring their help. We need to move as African Union to take this bold step, produce vaccines, give to our people and let them use it to protect themselves. More importantly, AU should be able to speak up at points like this. When African countries are being blacklisted, redlisted, banned and all of it, AU should be able to speak up for us as African countries. We have a voice, we have a say and we should be able to provide diplomatic global politics that is going on to ensure that trade and economy continues. Let our borders not be shut for any reason because look, if we are developing, we need politics to develop. So at this point where we have recession in several countries where COVID has got things to it all, this is not the time to joke about it. AU should be at the forefront, pushing for all these bans to be taken up of all African countries and at the same time providing vaccines for the general population. Yes, because just before I let my colleague in at this point in time, the major concern, if you look at the bitterness and the argument and the spaces across the board, you will find that when China, when the virus actually broke out, I mean there were a lot of pressure, there were a lot of ways where China was going to be. We constantly had the former president of the United States, Donald Trump constantly saying that it was a Chinese virus and that was totally fought against. There was no points at any point or in time that China was actually blacklisted and so it's quite worrisome that up until this point I really haven't had any response apart from the fact of course that the Nigerian government has reacted. But how many African countries have actually stood up and what is the leadership of the AU doing in this direction. But we're hoping that, you know, like you have rightly mentioned, they would wake up to this cause and we would also understand that the continent has a strong leadership. All right indeed, no doubt Dr. Betty, Betty talked about trade and economic activities actually being affected. Let me bring in Dr. Kenechiko, you are a businessman, you know, let's just look at the economic impact of all of this policy right now. The AU is not actually putting a strong firm stand concerning this. No doubt the nations aviation, the visa and immigration policies are being affected right now. But then again, what is the exact impact, if we have to look at statistics and figures, what would you say or how much of an impact would it really have on industries and people doing business here in Nigeria with this particular trade. But although it's just been about a few days, so what's the main impact as we speak right now, Kenechiko? So it's going to be of great impact, especially for example for the travel industry. First of all, like I said earlier, we have a whole lot of Nigerians travelling to the UK every single day and then we contribute greatly to the economic situation over there in the UK. Now if you look at the healthcare sector, you realise that we have a lot of doctors flying into Nigeria from the UK to take on very big cases like surgeries. And then this travel ban is definitely going to stop a whole lot of things because some of these doctors who are resident in the UK actually are probably not citizens of the UK. And then when you look at doctors who are flying out of Nigeria to visit the UK for technical maybe courses for them to know how to probably like use like proscopic surgeries and stuff like that. And all these things are going to be shut down at the moment because of the travel ban. Now if you look at the cargo side of it, there are so many other companies who are dealing with cargo. There are people who are doing express shipments and they are using these airlines to bring in their shipments. And because of the turnout of people who are travelling to the UK and not travelling to the UK at the moment, there is going to be like a break from Africa connecting to UK. So the impact is very, very great in different sectors. But what they are not looking at as well is the impact to their own economy. I am not sure if they are looking in that direction because we contribute a lot to their own economy. And then in as much as we expect them to open up the border and stop the travel ban, you would also look at the coin in two sides as well. When you talk about South Africa and the ban on South Africa, South Africa has like a very great communication and system at their airports. But then if you look at what is happening in Nigeria, I was in the UK like two weeks ago. And then before I fly into the UK, I have to actually book my COVID test in a reputable company over there in UK. And then once I get into the UK, I am registered as a traveller that just got into the UK and then I go straight to isolation. And then the sample collection kit is going to be sent to my office. And then after the sample collection, I send it over for them to send in the results. Now if you look at on the part of Nigeria, you realise that we pay for COVID testing hours before we depart to Nigeria. And then upon arrival, you realise that so many people at the airport, not just the travellers, but the people in Nigeria at the airport are not observing COVID. You know what I mean? So if you look at what is happening in the Nigerian airport and what is happening in countries like Ghana and South Africa that are very organised, you would understand that this is actually, I wouldn't want to say the word racist but somehow you can say it's racist because some of these other countries have it all figured out like Ghana and South Africa. And if we talk about that based on that and based on protocols, maybe you would be saying Nigeria but when you involve these other African countries, it makes no sense. And that's why the AU needs to comment. Is this a deliberate move against Africa? Because Africa at this point in time is not even anywhere near what they forecasted for Africa when it comes to COVID. So economy wise in the whole of Africa, this is a big problem because other countries are probably going to look at the UK and start buying African countries like there's something going on in Africa but there's really nothing going on here. So this is not just about the UK. They can ban us and maybe we can deal with that. But when countries like maybe Germany sees that, France sees that, Netherlands and these other countries and they come in to start buying Nigeria, there's a whole lot that is going to happen because we will have no choice but to want to retaliate. This is diplomatic and then when we retaliate, it ends up affecting our economy as well because so many Nigerians depend on moving goods from one country to the other and then we cannot survive this. Okay, so let's also bring in Dr. Betai do at this point in time. The WHO says the issue is with low vaccination driving rural areas. And you also have reports saying that about 3.6 billion doses of COVID-19 was administered globally and out of that you're looking at 78% and out of all of that, the one that gets to the African continent, 1.3 billion people, is less than 7%. So what is the issue here? Is it that the problem is with the low vaccination drive in rural areas in Nigeria? The fact that countries that are not part of the G20 cannot afford this vaccines or the vaccines is haunted. Which is the issue please? So very clearly African countries suffer from vaccine inequality and all of that. We have suffered from it. So we are not on the A list, we're not even on the B list, we're just down the line. So first and foremost, countries that produce the vaccine will give the vaccines to their countries. Case one, they will give the vaccine to their own population. And then after that, they are those grade A countries which they will also send their vaccines to. So even an Indian production will end up in the US or the UK or somewhere else which is the developed country. Right? Because they are most on the list. And then what you get is just paid for vaccines being donated to African countries. So far in Nigeria, we've received only 12 million doses. Only so far, only 12 million doses. And remember that each person is supposed to take at least two doses. So basically that can feed let's say 6 million Nigerians with a population of 200 million persons. That is completely impossible. It's not equitable in any manner at all. It's not equitable. So this discrimination, this global politics that is going on has affected vaccination in the country. So beyond us saying whether it's getting to rural areas or not, the vaccines are not even available. Nigeria as a country has paid for 14 million doses. But these doses have not arrived up until today. They have not arrived as we speak. They are saying between now and early February, the doses will come to the country. They give us the doses in small bits. So today, they give you 2 million. Tomorrow, they give you 1 million doses. Next tomorrow, that's the leftovers. Of course, we are grateful to the UK and the US for donating vaccines to Nigeria. Right? But however, how many is it compared to the population that require these vaccines so that we can get herd immunity. So you cannot deprive us as a country but in the adequate number of vaccines that we need. And then you switch over and say we have not vaccinated enough. The vaccines are not there. That's the truth. So now apart from vaccines being there or not, we have issues at the local government levels and the rural areas. In the main LGAs of the states, that's the headquarters, you will always find at least 2 ultra-coaching equipment and you will find a lot of coaching equipment that can carry these vaccines. However, when you move away from the center, when you move away from the headquarters or the state capital, it becomes very critical to get coaching equipment and sustain the process over time. We have also deployed different strategies, mass vaccination, using the polio vaccine strategy and other things to see how we can increase the number, fighting vaccine hesitancy every other day. But the truth still remains, the number of doses that have come into Nigeria can only vaccinate basically 6 million persons or 2 doses and if they should take booster doses, it will be less than 6 million doses. So a lot still needs to be done to bring in vaccine and I hope Nigeria can take up this challenge in Africa and set up a vaccine manufacturing company that will manufacture our own vaccine to serve Nigeria and the African region. This is one of the things I believe a issue coming. Do you think we have the capacity to do that because I also remember that recently you talked about molecular labs has been a challenge to the fight against the recent Omicron variant. Do you think that as a country we have what it takes to set up these centers because we cannot constantly depend on a handout of vaccine from these countries? So like you said, we can't depend on handouts. We cannot at all. Secondly, from the report at the NCH last week, NAFDAQ has confirmed that they have gone through the processes about 843 processes that were required for Nigeria to get to the point where it can get vaccines. They have been able to achieve almost all. They have less than 48 left. But 8 of those processes left to take the checklist and then we'll be ready to produce vaccines in the country. One of it is research and we have a bio bank in Lagos that have been storing these life cells of the COVID-19 virus and they can be used to study that way it qualifies us further to be able to produce vaccines in the country. But most importantly, we will require investors and then the federal government must be committed to the vaccine production, not just vaccine for COVID. We can use this as an entry point to begin to produce vaccines for several other diseases, hepatitis, polio and the rest of it. Remember that Nigeria gives billions of naira every single year out of the country just to buy these vaccines that will be given to the population free of charge. This is a chance for us. Use this window. Build your own vaccine plant. Produce all the types of vaccines you require there. Strengthen the research and bring experts in to build our capacity in the country. All right. Thank you, Dr. Betti. But let's bring up Naman into this conversation. The doctor has said a whole lot of economic angles to this. I don't think investors both locally and internationally should look in the direction of maybe some sort of a PPP, public-private partnership. And invest more into vaccine production, like she had said, not just for COVID, but for polio and other illnesses that the continent is actually being ravaged by. This should be an opportunity for Nigerian investors. Don't you think in the money? So like the other commission has said, I would explain this point of view. She said they are discriminating against Africa for not putting us in the forefront of receiving these vaccines even though we pay for it. Now there is something I would like us to understand. This is global politics. And in all diplomatic sphere of communication when it comes to either putting your country first, I want to believe that Nigeria is not playing the game well. Now when you look at vaccination in the potential of vaccination, COVID is a huge cash cow for so many countries. You realize that Nigeria is actually not discussing diplomatically with some of these countries because for you to get vaccine, pay for vaccines and get vaccines first or last or in the middle, you need to actually play diplomatic games. I'll give you a very typical example. Four or five years ago, I used to export sesame seeds, peanuts to China. And these peanuts are readily available in Nigeria. But then Nigeria is on the red list of China for bringing in peanuts into their country. But Senegal is on the green list to bringing peanuts into China. Now it's very, very straightforward. The peanuts we have in Nigeria is going to produce more oil when Nigeria is on the red list. Now the question is who is meant to go through that diplomatic negotiation with China to make sure Nigeria is bringing in peanuts into their country and for us to make much more money. So you realize that we are actually moving into these countries and focusing on what we are exporting as crude oil and so on and so forth, forgetting that there are so many other diplomatic conversations that we are meant to have to boost our economy or to boost our relationship with other countries. And if you use this case study with peanuts, you realize that it's almost the same thing that is happening with COVID. COVID, the more you don't have vaccine, the more you need to buy COVID kits, the more you need to test your people for COVID. So you need to understand that some countries understand this dynamic, some countries are manufacturers of COVID kits, some countries are manufacturers of molecular equipment and reagents. So if you need your country to be part of those countries that are probably buying less of the reagents, molecular equipment, COVID testing kits and move towards vaccinating your people, you need to play the global politics involved. That means if India is a manufacturer for COVID vaccine, you need to have a diplomatic agreement with India. Now the question is what can we bring on the table because for you to have a diplomatic negotiation with any particular country, there should be something on the table. There should be something in it for them. Now Nigeria, we've been that country where a lot of investors are coming into the country because of our forest situation, so many other situations and the crisis happening in the country at the moment, the insecurity and so on and so forth. So how do you expect to have a COVID vaccine and invite investors when it's even difficult for you to invite investors for other things happening in Nigeria at the moment? So these are the dynamics that we need to look at and as much as yes, we need to produce our own vaccine. We are all pro-vaccine production. We are all about that. But when you look at the dynamics, are we really to produce vaccine at the moment? Can we sustain vaccine production even when we start? I think there are certain things that should be put on the line. First, diplomatic relationships, improving our diplomatic relationships and making sure that our country is conducive enough for investors to bring in their money and repatriate their money back. Nobody wants to bring in millions of dollars into this country and leave it to be spot down here in Nigeria. Airlines are complaining as well. So these are the things that we need to look at before we say okay, we should go ahead with bringing in investors because as much as we have the numbers, it doesn't make sense for any investor to bring their money here and they can't take their money back. Well, I'm also hoping that because I feel like the dependency on the western world is becoming too much for the continent. And I'm thinking that the collaboration is time that the entire continent come together and look inward and find out how all of this relationship can be between themselves and of course will come out as a formidable force against the western world because of course they would always protect their interests as much as we try to push for that. Well, we do really appreciate your thoughts and thank you so much for being part of the conversation. Thank you very much. Thank you. Well, that's the much that we can take. We've had a fine lady and a gentleman, the Honourable Commissioner for Health Cross-Eversity, Dr. Bhattarindu and also Namani for also being part of the conversation and expert. We'll take a short break. When we return, we'll head straight to the second conversation. Please stick around.