 At the stroke of midnight on New Year's Eve this year, did you make any New Year's resolutions? Did you perhaps decide to dust off that stationary bike that's been sitting in the garage for a while, or maybe cut out those nasty seed oils out of your diet for good this year? Or did you decide perhaps that 2023 would be the year you learn more about your faith and in particular about the saints? Because the saints are the greatest friends we will ever have in this life and they want to impart their virtues to us. They want to do so much more than just help us find our keys. The saints want to help us become saints. Hi, I'm Mary Harrell with Tan Books. Thank you so much everyone for joining us today at the Tan Roundtable. Today you're gonna learn some about our faith's greatest, Eucharistic saints, Eucharistic miracles. You'll learn about the miracles of St. Padre Pio. You'll learn about how one American bishop is immersed in the authorship and reading of St. Francis to Sales and we'll talk a little bit on Pope Benedict XVI, his life and death, and perhaps if St. Hood is in his future. Joining us today are our guests. Coming on shortly, Bishop Thomas J. Paprocki, as well as author Dr. Jared Stout and rounding out our panel is author and blogger Mary O'Regan. This is the Tan Roundtable and you can find a new live conversation here every month. We're giving you unprecedented access to our authors and our guests in the most pressing topics concerning the church and the world. Back to our speakers today, Dr. Jared Stout specializes in systematic theology, the evangelization of culture and Catholic education. He has taught at the Augustine Institute since 2009 and he currently serves as an associate superintendent for mission and formation at the Archdiocese of Denver. I'm sorry, he's changed. He's now with Exodus 90 out here on the East Coast. That's right, I'm sorry, that wasn't updated. Dr. Stout's books include renewing Catholic schools, how to regain a Catholic vision in a secular age as well as his upcoming title with Tan, how the Eucharist can save civilization. Jared, thanks so much for being with us today. It's a pleasure, thanks for having me. Mary O'Regan was born in the mountains of Westcork, Ireland and then lived in London as a journalist for 10 years. She's based now in Los Angeles where she's blessed to be able to attend the Tridentine Latin Mass as often as possible, love that. She's currently working on her upcoming book, Padre Pio and You and her chief field of study is his life and influence. Mary's blog, The Path Less Taken gets hundreds of thousands of clicks each year. Mary, welcome to the round table. It's true, you do. It's more, I think they kind of come to the blog for Padre Pio, I'm just his servant really. Well, and a wonderful servant at that. Lastly, joining us after he gets through a few technical glitches, but he'll be here, Bishop Thomas J. Paprocki is the Bishop of Springfield, Illinois. He was appointed to that post by Pope Benedict XVI, nearly 10 years ago. We'll talk about that a little more later. He was formerly a lawyer and a parish priest in very poor Chicago neighborhoods who would do pro-bono legal work. His excellency went on to complete doctoral studies and become a canon lawyer as well. Just, you know, I guess he was bored. He needed some more challenges. Pope John Paul II appointed him to serve as an auxiliary bishop of Chicago in 2003, after which he served in many roles for the USCCB. He has completed 24 marathons, 24 marathons raising over a half million dollar charity in the process. He'll be here soon. That just makes me tired and impressed hearing it. It's just incredible. Just a little housekeeping before we begin. We'll be giving away an amazing set of books. Hello, Your Excellency. Nice to have you here. We'll be giving away our St. Alphonse's Liguri set of books. Those are a bundle of 10 books, valued at over $120. His books, including The Way of the Cross, Uniformity with God's Will, The Glories of Mary. Just by being here on the webinar, you've been entered to win. Make sure you stay tuned to the end to see if you're the winner of that. Also, we'll be giving you a 40% off discount code so you can order some amazing soon-to-be-released books from 10 books at an amazing price. That will be the St. Francis De Sales signature set for beautiful, hardbound, embossed volumes. Some of the prettiest books we've ever made, along with Dr. Stout's upcoming release, How the Eucharist Can Save Civilization, an amazing book coming out later this month, as well as Wounds of Love, The Story of St. Padre Pio by Philip Campbell. Stay tuned for all of that at the end. So to start us off here, I would love to hear from each of you what is your favorite tan book and maybe what book are you in the middle of right now? What's on your book stack on your bedside table? Bishop Paprocki, if we can hear you, I think we'll start with you. Yes, sorry, I had some technical difficulties there at the switch computers, but hopefully you can hear and see me now. So my favorite tan book I would say is this one. It's by Robert Conrad on St. John Fisher and Thomas Moore. I have a particular devotion to Thomas Moore and John Fisher because they're my patron saints. And so I was baptized Thomas John and I asked my parents if they had any particular saints in mind and they did not. And so I was able to kind of choose my own saints over the years. Of course, all Thomas's go back to Thomas the Apostle and then as I went on with my education, of course Aquinas was the great scholar and thought, well, maybe Aquinas would be a good patron. And then as a priest, I also went to law school and got a law degree and then became Chancellor of the Archdiocese of Chicago. Thomas Moore was a Chancellor and a lawyer. So he became a good patron saint. And then when I became a Bishop, this interesting story with that as well, I was named Bishop in April of 2010 by our late Holy Father Pope Benedict XVI. And I called Cardinal George, our Metropolitan Archbishop here in Illinois and asked him if he had a date where I could be installed as the new Bishop where he could come for my installation. And he said, he looked at his calendar. He said, well, how's June 22nd? And I said, well, that'll be perfect because that's the feast day of Thomas Moore and John Fisher. So after my installation, then I asked priests in my diocese when they say the Eucharistic Prayer to invoke their Bishop Thomas John using both of my names. So this book by Robert Conrad really talks about both. It's unusual, you often see books about Thomas Moore or John Fisher, but in this book he talks about both. And the book that I'm in the middle of right now is this one called Manual for Conquering Deadly Sin. And it's a very good book that takes the deadly sins, but then also takes that in conjunction with the virtues that can be counteracting of those deadly sins. So it's by Father Dennis Kolinsky, who was one of the Canon's regular St. John Canches with whom I worked in Chicago. And now we have some of the Canon's here in Springfield. So I would recommend that book as well. Excellent, amazing recommendations, especially in a time of somewhat religious persecution, really important to keep up to date on your martyrs for sure. Dr. Stout, would you be next? Yes, my favorite Tan book is the Life and Revelations of St. Gertrude the Great, who was a medieval mystic. She was a Benedictine nun and spread devotion to the Sacred Heart before St. Margaret Mary. So she was a kind of a forerunner of that devotion. And I am a Benedictine oblate. So I just love getting deep into the Benedictine spirituality, which is based upon the liturgy. And so you see this in her revelations where she's really praying through the mass in the divine office and throughout the liturgical year. So I've been very inspired by that book. And I'm currently reading a monastic classic, St. John Clamacus' Ladder of Divine Ascent. And he was a monk of the monastery at Mount Sinai, St. Catherine's. It's very intense, but like the Bishop's book, it's really great at helping us to root out sin. And one of the things that I've found most compelling about the book is it helps us to see the ways in which we're giving into anger, sometimes without even realizing it. You know, are we harboring different elements of resentment and annoyance at different things? And sometimes we kind of lash out without realizing that we've been kind of building up to that in our spiritual life. So that's been a really helpful insight. But it's a very strict book, you know, meant for monks, but I'm able to take, you know, these kinds of gems out of it. If you're working for Exodus 90, you're kind of living that monk life anyway. So that fits, that works, that's right. Mary, would you round us out? Tell us your favorites and what you're reading now. Okay. So my favorite Tan book, I owe Tan a lot, and I'm going to get round to why the very first time I saw Padre Pio was when I saw a Tan book. But my favorite Tan book is this one. Oh, wow. Now, it may seem that I have read it a few times. I've read it many times. Like this, it didn't always look like this. As I said yesterday when I was talking to Tim Hill about my favorite Tan book, it used to have the cover on before it kind of disintegrated, but I've read it just so many times that, you know, it's the Tan book about purgatory. And this is my favorite book. So whenever I'm going anywhere, this always goes in my handbag first, my purse straight away. Going on an overnight, it always goes in the overnight bag. It always goes in the suitcase first and foremost because I just never want to forget their plight, the plight of those in purgatory. And they are very forgotten in this time, I think. And just to pray and to make sacrifices for them and also that deep connection that the saints and the mystics had with the souls in purgatory. And I think the souls in purgatory are the loves of my life. And my friends joke that Mary has a reputation that the souls in purgatory know to seek me out for prayers or for help. So as I said, yeah, Mary has a reputation among the souls for, you know, they might come to me. But then it's strange because if ever someone really needs a favor, I'm like, we've got to ask the souls in purgatory. And someone that they may not believe in purgatory until like this dramatic prayer request is answered by way of the suffering souls. So that's my favorite Tan book. And my second favorite Tan book, oh, sorry, sorry about that iPhone slip, is this one. Because this was the first time I ever saw the face of Padre Pio in a normal way. He appeared to me when I was growing up and I didn't know who he was. He didn't introduce himself. And then it was only when I saw him on this book that I knew he was Padre Pio. So that's my, this is the kind of our co-equal. And I love the groovy orange. Never change it. You must, you know, some new addition is coming out where you want to, you know, make him more accessible, make him, put him in blue or something. Never change the groovy orange. He died in 68. We have to have some homage to the groovy orange. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Absolutely. We'll send that up the ladder to keep the orange. It's important. Wonderful, amazing recommendations. That's terrific. As we begin talking about the saints, I'd like to start with really, what is the Catholic understanding of saints? What can they do? What can they not do? What can they hear or see? What can't they? Your Excellency, would you give us, in our viewers, a little bit of a primer, as we begin talking about the communion of saints? Well, I think first of all, when we talk about the communion of saints, we should try to understand what we word mean by the word communion. In English, we use communion in different ways. We talk about holy communion, of course, which is the reference to the Eucharist, but communion in the wider sense of the Camunio is a Latin word that's kind of hard to translate into English. Sometimes it's translated as fellowship, but in the church, it's really much more than fellowships, not just a bunch of people getting together and enjoying each other's company. Camunio is, from the Latin words, like common and union, a common union. So we're in a common union with each other. And so when we're baptized, we are brought into an effect, the communion of saints. In fact, the early church used to refer to the members of the church as the saints. And we tend to limit that word, the saint, to think not only of someone who's in heaven, but a canonized saint. And so like when I do confirmation, I like to ask the Confirmandi and their sponsors and parents, how many of you want to be a saint? And I get kind of these sheepish little boy, maybe, yeah. But I think they're kind of intimidated by the idea that to be a saint means then there's going to be a formal declaration by the pope that you're in heaven, which is a canonized saint. So then I changed the question. I say, well, how many of you want to go to heaven? And then all the hands shoot up. Everybody wants to go to heaven. And I say, well, it's the same thing. It's the same question. If you want to be a saint, you're going to go to heaven. The communion of saints, I think it's also important for us to understand that when we talk about saints, then we're not just talking about those who are in heaven, but the communion of the unity that we have with those who are in heaven, that there's not sort of this great chasm or separation between heaven and us here on earth, that even though the communion of saints are no longer physically with us here on earth, we do have a union with them, a communion with them, as they now share in God's kingdom. And so that's why we pray. We pray for the intercession of saints. We don't pray to them. We don't adore them or worship them, but they have a special place in heaven and hopefully they have God's ear. And so we pray to them for their intercession. And so that's why our relationship with saints is so important. Well, absolutely. And Dr. Stout, one of your books that I did not mention in the intro was the beer option, brewing a Catholic culture yesterday and today and to the bishop's point, we go when we think about saints as people that live lives of unattainable holiness that we cannot emulate ourselves. And perhaps people give up on the idea of becoming saints just like Saxonsley is saying. So do you think there is that tendency to believe that saints are not people that were at least somewhat like us that could enjoy a pint of Guinness and just live these extraordinary lives without really being people we can emulate every single day? Well, I think one of the best examples of a saint who fostered community and fellowship through beer is St. Conrad of Bavaria who was a porter for the Capuchins at Altatang, the Marian shrine in Bavaria. And he used to give all the pilgrims who came two glasses of beer because of course they were walking to the shrine and they needed refreshments. So it is true that we can look at the saints as if they were already otherworldly and in some sense they were through their communion with the Lord. But the saints show us what it means to be truly human. I mean, ultimately Jesus Christ is the one who shows us what it means to be truly human. But every saint is an icon of Jesus Christ. They're more human than we are. And so they're able to appreciate the good things of life in an ordered way. So you might think, well, who appreciates beer more? You know, the guy who's at the bar every day or St. Conrad, you know, who's serving pilgrims and promoting true festivity. It's always gonna be the saints, right? If it's genuine good that we are enjoying in an ordered way they're gonna show us how to use the things of earth more properly. And each of you I know have deep devotions to particular saints. Mary told us a little bit about Padre Pio. Your excellency, I know you have a deep appreciation for the writings of St. Francis the sales. Tell us about why he inspires you so much. Well, his favorite, my favorite book of his that he wrote is Introduction to the Devout Life. And I read that, oh, probably about almost 30 years ago. And I was just struck by how down to earth he was with his writings. He was writing at a very critical time in the life of the church. So he was born in 1567. And in 1602 he became the Bishop of Geneva in Switzerland. So what was happening then? This was right during the time of the Protestant Reformation. And so in Switzerland a lot of people were leaving the Catholic church and they were following the Protestant reformers. And so he was trying to win them back. And he had a saying that you attract a lot more flies with a spoonful of honey than with a gallon of vinegar. And so he took the approach of trying to be positive. And the introduction to the devout life, one of the points that he makes in there is that holiness, this relates to our conversation about being a saint, that being a saint or being holy is not something that is reserved for ordained priests or consecrated religious sisters or deacons. But that everyone is called to be holy no matter your state in life. So he talked about whether you are a farmer or tradesman or a soldier or housewife, the homekeeper, whatever you're doing that you should try to sanctify your life. And so I think that's a great message. I also find it very interesting that in the 20th century there was a very similar message that was proposed by St. Josemaria Escriva and Opus Dei, which means the work of God. And so St. Josemaria was very influential I think then in the Second Vatican Council because the Second Vatican Council in the 1960s also picked up on this theme that the sanctification of everyone, not just priests and religious, but everyone is called to holiness. And so these are ideas that are recurring. They were not new to St. Josemaria. They were not new in effect to the Second Vatican Council but I think we see those, not even really new to St. Francis De Sales. I mean, it goes back to the early Christians they all tried to sanctify their lives but I think in particular St. Francis De Sales is the one at that particularly crucial time in the church's history that was calling all the Christian faithful back to sanctification. Were you reading these books, St. Francis De Sales books early on in your vocation or is this something you came to in some degree afterwards maybe after some decades of maturity or was this something you started early on in your 20s? No, it was actually something a little bit later when I was a priest already. So just picking up different spiritual books and reading them. And so I'd heard a lot about St. Francis De Sales and so I thought I'd read his book and I found it, it was in the 1990s so I was ordained a priest in 1978. So already I'd been a priest for a while but trying to continue to grow in my faith and continue with my education in different ways. So in fact, one of the devices that he used in his homilies, he always ended his homily by saying, may God give us this grace and I picked that up. And so every homily that since then, since like the 1990s, I always end with that line which I think is a beautiful way whatever I've been talking about in my homily, I close it with what an effect is a prayer may God give us this grace. Also then people know my homily's over. That was beautiful, very beautiful. That is beautiful. Mary, go back to that story of seeing St. Padre Pio as a teen and not knowing who he was, what happened after that or before that? It's quite a dramatic turn of events. I was, I was 14, I was a teenager in Ireland. I didn't have any belief in Christ at the time that I really have to be frank about that. And I was, my family and I were on vacation and I was just visiting a house and watching a very, very trashy horror movie from the 70s, dreadful, dreadful horror movie about a woman who could be in two places at once. And the woman who was, I was her guest, she turned to me and she said, I've only heard of one person who could by locate and that was Padre Pio. But she said it with such intense reverence, his name, Padre Pio, that I was just struck by a sort of the love she had for him. But also the minute that happened, and this doesn't happen to most people, it needed to happen to me because I wouldn't have come to fate without his help. I really would not have come to fate without this very strong mystical connection. The minute that happened, the minute I heard the name Padre Pio, he was just there in front of me. Padre Pio was right there and I was mystically in San Giovanni Rotondo. I was in his cell. I could see everything that it was. It was a six by 10 cell, it was tiny. And I remember at the time thinking that this was just imagination that I had conjured the image. But I'm not from a wealthy background. There's no way I would have been able to. Still, I've never been, I've never had the financial means to go to San Giovanni Rotondo but I feel that Padre Pio took me there mystically and that that's sufficient. And it was then, it was very, very strange because a little while after that, I was in a library and suddenly, oh, sorry, sorry about this. Suddenly I saw this book and it was the same person who had appeared to me. It was the exact same, it was seeing this, I knew that Padre Pio had come to me that time to invite me to faith. He wasn't terribly happy with me when I was 14, when he first appeared to me, he said, he had these kind of calming lips and he had that stare that just riveted me to the spot. He had these eyes that could split an oyster, could split a stone, his stare was so strong. And he said to me, I am waiting for you. And I didn't understand what that would mean or why he would be in any way interested in me. I still kind of quite understand that, but he wasn't terribly happy with me. I was going to be hard work for him. And I still am hard work for him because I'm just a horrid sinner, horrid. But that's how I came to know Padre Pio. That is not the typical story of 14 year olds and their faith, that's beautiful. Dr. Stout, to you, there are saints that we kind of put broadly in a category of Eucharistic saints or saints who had a great fervor for the mass, one of those, of course, being St. Padre Pio. But who are some of these other saints and which ones did you include in your book, How the Eucharist Can Save Civilization? Yeah, I tried to show saints from throughout the church's history. So there are some early saints, St. Ignatius of Antioch was already talking about the belief in the Eucharist as the flesh of Christ and that he himself wanted to be ground up as wheat and his own martyrdom, which I think is evocative of the Eucharist. St. Tarsitius who was a young martyr who died protecting the Eucharist during the persecutions of the church. St. Francis of Assisi who had a very strong devotion to the Eucharist and to the mass, he said that we should embrace poverty and all things except the liturgy because we should really pour out our devotion and lavish what we can on the Lord's presence there. St. Thomas Aquinas is a very important saint for me, but he was not only a great theologian of the Eucharist, which of course he was and really laid out to the church's teaching on transubstantiation, but he was also a great mystic and poet of the Eucharist. And so when you think about the hymns that we sing when we go to Eucharistic adoration, they were composed by St. Thomas Aquinas for the feast day of Corpus Christi. All right, so he was a theologian and a mystic and poet all at the same time. Some more modern saints, you know, we were talking about a fondest legore and I love the devotions that he wrote for Eucharistic adoration and also his prayer of spiritual communion, which I recommend to people to pray very often so that we can just continue to remain in the Lord's Eucharistic presence. And then my own confirmation, St. Pius X who worked to bring renewal in the liturgy and to promote Gregorian chant and a deeper prayerful participation in the Mass. He also encouraged a more frequent reception of communion if we were properly prepared to do so. And so that was an important point, right? That we can receive so many more graces from the Lord in the Eucharist if we properly prepare and enter into the Mass with devotion. I like what you said before about focusing so much on the liturgy. That reminds me of St. John Viani, right? Who lived, I think, largely on potatoes for the vast majority of his life so that every penny could go to bettering his church and everything within it. Bishop Paprocki, it's evident, as you've said, St. Francis's sales an amazing, an effective preacher and homilist for sure but also a priest deeply devoted to helping souls love God like he did. Helping suffering souls, finding solace. What other saints would you put in this category of saints who effectively used apologetics, not just to convert souls to be Catholics but to win souls with love and zeal for the church? Well, I would say one of the saints I mentioned previously was St. Josemaria Skriva, a priest from Spain, a very difficult time in Spain in the early 20th century when the church was being persecuted and yet he was able to start with just a very small group of people and start this movement of the sanctification of work and looking at our everyday lives. We all have work to do, whether that's paid work or volunteer work or work in a home but it's how do we look at that work and the things that we do in everyday life to sanctify our lives. So it's not just doing tasks in order to get a paycheck or just doing things because we have to do them but doing things, looking at I'm doing this, I'm gonna try to use my gifts to the best of my abilities because in doing so I'm showing love for the person that I'm serving. So even if it's somebody that's a cleaning person while you're cleaning somebody's house in their bathroom you have that person in mind that you're trying to make this as beautiful as you can for that person. That's one way of looking at it. Another way is simply to say do everything I'm doing, I'm doing for God. I wanna give honor to God but God has given me certain talents and abilities. I don't wanna squander them, I don't wanna waste them so I will use them the best I can. So I think St. Josemaria has given a great example how to do that. Another saying probably the most influential saint in my lifetime in many ways would be Pope St. John Paul II. I'm Polish American by my ancestry. I grew up in Chicago, I was ordained in 1978 the year of three popes, the year that he was elected pope. In fact, I remember very clearly where I was when I found out about that. I was in law school and I was waiting for the elevator and one of my classmates came to me and he said, did you hear the news? They've elected a new pope. This is October of 1978. And I said, no, I hadn't heard that. I said, who is he? He said, well, he's Polish. And I honestly said, what's all right? What's the punchline? I thought he was going to tell me a Polish joke frankly. And it wasn't a joke, it was that we had a Polish pope. And what an incredible pope he was. The volume of writings that he has, the numbers of encyclicals, apostolic letters, apostolic exhortations. I mean, you could just spend years reading through that. And then most significantly, I think, well, from my point of view, I'm also trained as a canon lawyer. So he promulgated the 1983 code of canon law, which is still in effect with some amendments, but basically it's the code he promulgated that I'm working with almost every day. And then also the catechism of the Catholic Church. There were people who said it couldn't be done. A catechism like that hadn't been written since after the Council of Trent. And people were saying the current climate, we couldn't do that. Well, he pulled it off and promulgated in the 1990s, the catechism of the Catholic Church, which is a wonderful compendium of the Church's teaching. So if you want to know what does the Catholic Church teach, go right to that catechism. And then a third saint I would mention is so influential, would be his successor, the late Pope Benedict the 16th, who just died as we know last week. But he was very close to John Paul II, then collaborator. So he was the prefect of the congregation for the doctrine of the faith under Saint John Paul II. And the difference between them was that John Paul II was more of a philosopher. And while his writings are very profound, they can also be a little difficult to navigate. What I found with Pope Benedict was he was much more approachable in that sense that people could read him and get a very clear idea of what he was saying theologically. So I think he also had a very profound impact. And so their writings, may they rest in peace, but their writings will still have a, I think a very profound influence on the church and on people for many, many years to come. Oh, absolutely. And Dr. Stad, I was gonna ask you on the subject of Pope Benedict and his deep love for the Eucharist and Christ in the Eucharist, he's featured multiple times, many times I believe in your book and his writings on the mass. So how did he influence you in researching this book and coming to write the various chapters on it? He impacted me very deeply. One of the things that I learned from Joseph Ratzinger, Pope Benedict the 16th, is that God must be first in all things. And so the liturgy is what fundamentally grounds our life in Christ that we are constantly ordered towards the Father within and through Jesus Christ and that shapes our entire life. And so this is something that was very complimentary to my spirituality as a Benedict and Oblate, but that we are sanctified through the liturgy by entering into the mystery of Christ. And that the liturgy of course is a great sign of God's own beauty, mystery and transcendence. And so Benedict was a great prophet, kind of pointing us to the centrality of the liturgy, how it should fundamentally shape the Christian life and all that the church does. And that we need in our time to really emphasize its sacred, mysterious, transcendent and beautiful dimensions. Well, absolutely. And thinking about our death, thinking about I think whenever a pontiff dies, we have as a church collectively, we begin to think about death more. Mary, some of the most popular posts on your blog have the relation to the four last things, death, judgment, heaven and hell. How does St. Padre Pio or even the death of Pope Benedict to you help you focus on those topics and really help guide people to remembering, remembering their death and to strive to make it a holy one? Well, there's something that your excellency said about John Paul too. And he's no longer with us, he's gone to God. But one point is that Padre Pio and him were friends. He was a spiritual child of Padre Pio, John Paul II. And I have a devotion to Padre Pio just to be forthright. I don't have a devotion to John Paul II. I'm just not called to hold him as, to hold him close. But as a point of truth, Padre Pio did tell him he was going to be Pope. He didn't tell him directly, but Padre Pio was one who bore the wounds of Christ by way of his stigmata. And he was speaking to one who would be the vicar of Christ when John Paul II came to visit him. John Paul II was a very big believer in Padre Pio. He never doubted him. And also John Paul II was the pope who canonized Padre Pio. So when he asked, he went to visit Padre Pio in Southern Italy. He was not Pope at the time. He was a bishop at the time. He was Bishop Wattilia. And he spoke to Padre Pio. And he asked Padre Pio a question. What is your most painful wound? Now, anyone who came, any cleric who came or any man of a cloth or any prince of the church or any prelate, had to have permission from the pope in order to ask Padre Pio about his stigmata. But the reason we know that Padre Pio knew that John Paul II was going to be Pope was that he gazed at answer unreservedly. He never asked for any permission or any letter of authenticity to say that he could answer as to his stigmata. And he told John Paul II, John Paul II was the only person he ever told that his right shoulder was the most painful wound that he had. And that is true to what St. Bernard of Clairvaux was revealed to him as regards the most painful wound that Christ had. And it follows that the most painful wound Christ had and Padre Pio's wound, the wound that was the most painful. And going back to that, so that's what I think we would say to people who have a vocation that every priest who follows after Padre Pio has to be in persona Christi. But there's also something that Dr. Stout said about St. Gertrude the Great and that's your favorite book is the revelations of St. Gertrude the Great. And there's something that she said about she was given a revelation. So saints don't have to be priests and nuns. I thought that myself that in order to be a saint I'd have to be a nun or maybe consecrated or something like that. I'm neither. And she was given a revelation of the high places that married people who live holy lives can have the highest places in heaven. And even John the beloved apostle that there's some married people who can have his level of height that they can have his place that they can have a similar place to him in heaven. And that chimes with something that Padre Pio said because there's one instance in his life when he said that there was a saint there was a person who had a better soul than his. And for Padre Pio that was his younger sister. So Padre Pio had an older brother and he had three younger sisters. But his favorite person was Felicita. Felicita was his younger sister and she was a very, very, very beloved person. And he said that her soul was better than his. But she was a married person. She wasn't in religious life. But she had a very unhappy marriage, unfortunately. Her husband was very unfaithful and rather abusive, but she forgave him entirely. And as a married person she had things to forgive that Padre Pio would never have to forgive because he wouldn't have a spouse, a flesh and blood spouse. And that's just something that we have to remember that people, if they follow their vocation be it to religious life or to married life there is a path to sainthood for them that is as unique as they are themselves. And as we see from the life of Padre Pio his sister was the married and yet she was the best soul that he has ever... He described her very much but she was a very, very beloved figure to him. That's a beautiful story. I'd never heard anything really about his siblings and all the reading I've done about him. That's a very moving story, amazing. Bishop Paprocki talking about a soul's path to heaven, to sainthood. It's common to chant now, santo subito, right? Sainthood now. I heard that that was also chanted down. You know, at the Vatican, right? So do you think we have sainthood for Pope Benedict the 16th in his future? And if so, not that you can always immediately tell but if so, what do you think in his life would merit that kind of honor? Yes, well the Holy Father is the one that ultimately makes that decision but I could say based on what I know about the saints and the experience of seeing the canonization process I would certainly think and believe and hope that Pope Benedict will be Saint Benedict someday. In the early church before they had the formal canonical canonization process that we have today which is very demanding in order to reach that moral certitude of sanctity. In the early days it was really just by acclamation that the whole community would just sort of rise up and proclaim that person to be a saint because it was just so immediately visible to everybody. And so I think we saw that at the funeral of Pope John Paul II where the crowds just started chanting santo subito which means an Italian saint right away. We want him right away to be a saint and that also erupted at the funeral of Pope Benedict last week. And so I think that's an indication that if the Christian faithful recognize the holiness of a person well then I think true canonization cannot be that far behind. I mean you just look at his life and the way he lived his life and not only his theological ability but his holiness, his sanctity, his prayer life and then the last 10 years almost that he was in retirement he basically lived as a monk almost as a hermit very secluded in living a life of prayer. So I've been fortunate in my life to actually have met two canonized saints and the daughter of a saint. So I've met Saint John Paul II several times when I was doing my canon law studies in Rome from 1987 to 1991 which you might say was sort of the prime of his papacy. It was shortly after the assassination attempt on him which thanks be to God and as he would say the intercession of our Lady of Fatima he survived that but it also I don't know if it was so much a new energy but maybe an urgency about what he was doing. And so then the late 80s, early 90s before his health started to decline he was really at high energy then. So I got to see him sort of you might say it as prime. Also during the time that I was in Rome I used to celebrate Mass for the missionaries of charity in their convent at San Gregorio right behind the Coliseum. And one Saturday morning I was celebrating Mass there and I saw this little figure huddled next to the stove and it turned out to be Mother Teresa. And so after Mass she came in the sacristy to thank me for saying the Mass. It was the early 1990s I didn't have a cell phone so I don't have a selfie with Mother Teresa but I did meet her and then just a few years ago I met the daughter of Saint John Amola, Dr. John Amola and what a powerful story that was too. So I've met saints and a daughter of a saint and so I tell people the idea of sainthood shouldn't really be that so distant or far away for us. The saints are real people and I've met some and we could be saints too. Does that make you a third class relic? Maybe second class. I guess so. We've got to take care of you. But really that must be a very small circle of people to have met both living saints and the children not living saints to have met saints before their death to have met their children. That must be a very exclusive circle and what a blessing, amazing. Yes, thank you. Dr. Stout can't let this webinar close out without talking about your incredible book coming up how the Eucharist can save civilization. Such a powerful title. You write that Western civilization verges on complete collapse because we lack a supernatural framework. We are reverting back to being barbarians. I think you only need to look at the recent vote on the Born Alive Protection Act for children born alive after abortions to see that we are becoming barbarians. But that the remedy is a return to a Eucharist centered life. So how can studying and praying with the saints we talked about New Year's resolutions at the beginning of this year. How can Catholics resolving to restore that framework to their own lives personally help our culture return to that supernatural framework? Well, the saints are a model, right? When you think about the most powerful force in the universe, would you say, nuclear fusion or whatever it is? No, we would say it is the Lord's sacramental presence in the Eucharist. Nothing else even compares to the spiritual energy that we receive, the grace that we receive, the participation in the divine life that we receive from the Eucharist. That really is the answer to every difficulty. But how does God solve problems? He doesn't just kind of wave them away or give you a blueprint. He changes the world by changing people. And so we see in the lives of the saints how God has fixed problems in church history or in the world through holiness. And by drawing us into a Eucharistic communion with him, intimacy with him, he wants us to impact other people. He wants us to really bring renewal to the world. And you gave the example of the Born Alive Act, right? And so I think our Lord can really inspire us through our faith and through his grace to bear witness, yes, to supernatural goods but even to natural goods, right? Because we're undermining the foundation for faith and for grace by eroding our nature, by eroding reason. And so we need to recover our humanity. And once again, it is our Lord that shows us what it truly means to be alive, what it means to be a full and complete human being. And so he is our model and he wants to bring about renewal in us so that we can bring about renewal in the world. On Bishop Propriet, I wanna throw the last question to you here, you're the Bishop of a very large and active diocese, you must have many ministries that have sprung up in your time there, ones that are active and growing. What are really the signs of hope and increase in faith in your own diocese that you have seen going into this new year into 2023 that give you hope for what Dr. Stoud's talking about here that that supernatural framework work can be restored in both your diocese in our church in the world? Well, we have some very exciting things happening and our diocese that I think are coming through God's grace. I mentioned that I met the daughter of St. John Baratimola, I was going to the Napa Institute in 2019 and flew into Sacramento, California, which is about an hour away from Napa. And so they arranged a van for me to transport me and some other guests who were gonna be at the Napa Institute and one of those persons was Dr. Gianna Amanuella, Mola, the daughter of St. Gianna. And so for that hour that we were in the van, she was talking about her mother, very animated as Italians like to talk with her hands and but it was so cute the way she talked about how every morning when she gets up to say her prayers, she prays to St. Mom or an Italian Santa Mama. And so we just had a wonderful conversation about St. Gianna, those who aren't familiar with their story as St. Gianna insisted that her daughter be born and that if there had to be a choice between her or her daughter that they save the baby. And she did give birth successfully to now Dr. Gianna, Mola, but unfortunately the mother died like a week later. So Dr. Gianna has no living memory of her mother, she died a week after she was born and she has a tremendous devotion to her. So she and Cardinal Burke came to Springfield about a year later and said they wanted to have the St. Gianna and Pietro Mola International Center located in our diocese. And so they have a plot of land and they'll be building there. She wants to do a replica of the family home there. So that's a beautiful thing. We also have in our diocese now venerable Father Augustine Tolton. He is the first African-American priest in the United States in the 19th century. And he's buried in Quincy, Illinois. He was declared venerable by Pope Francis a couple of years ago. And so we're hoping for his cause. And then of course there's Bishop Fulton Sheen who's buried not in our diocese but just north of us in Peoria. So we're praying for all of them to be places of shrines and devotion. So we have a little bit of a Sainsley triangle here in central Illinois for people to come and visit. So some very wonderful things that are happening here I think through the intercession of the saints. No excuse for not getting to know at least one of them better this year than you know already. That's going to do it for us today at the Tan Roundtable. Again, the books we've talked about today, 40% off through January 19th with coupon code tan talk 40, tan talk 40. That will be for how the Eucharist can save civilization. Dr. Stout's book, the preorder of that book as well as the St. Francis to Sales signature set a beautiful set of books, 40% off that as well as wounds of love, the story of St. Padre Pio by author Philip Campbell. We have a winner of our giveaway today. Congratulations to Jerry Lovahill. Jerry, you have won the St. Alphonsus Leguri set of 10 books, Uniformity with God's Will. We've talked about these today. Amazing set of resources for you, for your household. Congratulations. Join us next month. Tan books is Tim Hill will be hosting our February Roundtable on Thursday, February 9th at 2 p.m. Eastern. He'll be discussing essential Lenten meditation with guests, Bishop Earl Fernandez and Father Paul Keller. Lent is coming folks, gird your loins. It's coming up fast, don't miss that one. Before we finish here, Bishop Paprockli would you please give us a blessing on us and our viewers? Yes, at the beginning of this new year we ask our Lord to be with us and give us the many graces that we need to be saints so that we can all one day share in the eternal life in his kingdom. And so we pray, may Almighty God bless you, the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen. Thank you, Bishop. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for a wonderful conversation, everyone. Thank you very much. Thank you to each one of our guests for taking time to be here today and share all of your wonderful stories and advice with our viewers. Again, from Tanbook, we wish you so many blessings in 2023. Stay close to the saints. Take care. Okay.