 Let's delve right in. Before we talk about the youth development policy, I want us to look back at something that happened in the news, something very general, just as a way of introduction. Our DP, William Ruto, went to the UK to do a speech at the Chatham House, I think it's called. And there were a few royal heads who were there. And in his speech, the notion that people got, especially Kenyans, was that it was more of an anti-referendum speech, or anti-referendum. His notion was more against the referendum. The referendum is something that we feel we need as Kenyans, especially when it comes to youth. There are a lot of changes that we need in the Constitution so that the Constitution can back us up, so that the Constitution can be on our side, so that us as youth, we can be as productive as we possibly can, using all the resources in our nation. And so seeing that the notion was anti-referendum, how does that make you feel as a public policy consultant who is in support of the youth development policy that is in review right now? When it comes to a politician maybe who may share his, someone as important as our vice president, may share a view that this is something that we don't need to change. There are certain things we don't need to include. Basically what he's saying essentially is even that what we're going to discuss today, the policy, the Kenya development policy, that is also not needed. The DP Ruto said that the specific changes to the referendum are not needed. So when you look at the DP's speech, he mentioned about the aspect of including a position of a prime minister and two deputies. So when you look at the aspect of adding additional roles to what we currently have in the Constitution, that in itself I will support the DP, in that our offices are so many we are overly represented. But in the aspect of changing our Constitution to fill the gaps and the challenges that we have, especially affecting the young people, that was really necessary. But the DP really addressed adding more roles to what we currently have, which we know we are overly represented. Kenya is one of those countries that has so many elected leaders and adding more roles will not solve the issues that we have. So I would really support what he said in the terms of adding more roles, but not in terms of filling the gaps that the current Constitution has. OK, so for the notion that there are gaps in the Constitution that need to be filled and you're not in support of that particular side of his speech, well, you are in support of that. But what you're not in support of is the new offices of positions that are going to be created so that people can continue to stay in power with what you would have you. Ms. Lukos, do you have anything to say at all about this? Yes, I believe that the referendum is needed for the referendum. OK. But only in regards to the gaps that we have in the Constitution. So you agree with? Yes, I agree with her. And as the deputy, I also agree with the DP for once. I believe that we actually don't need additional roles. We don't need additional. Why should we have two DPs? Yes, exactly. We're overrepresented. Yes, we are overrepresented. Yes, and even in that overrepresentation, there's not really much work going on anyway. So we first of all need to strengthen. As well as youth representation. Yes, exactly. Then we need to actually strengthen these institutions that we already have. Because when it comes to youth representation, we have NYC. Yes. NYC is a strong body at the national level that could actually be representing youth interests in the different political processes. But now with NYC being an appointive, it's an appointive body. So at the moment, it's appointed. The president, it's the government that appoints the members of NYC. And now we don't feel like we are being represented. Yeah. Yeah, youths feel like they are being eliminated. They're just, it's just a system for rewarding young people who are paying allegiance to a certain political party. Yes. So we need the strengthening of NYC. We need the positions that NYC to be elective. Also, we need NYC to be devolved. Uh-huh. Yes, because it only operates at the national level. We need it to also do at county levels. Yes, we need it to be at the county level. Since everything right now is devolved, let our voices be heard also at the county level. Let us influence the decisions at the county level through NYC. But let it be an elective body. An elective body, I see. Oh, OK. Those are very interesting views. And as much as I'd like for us to continue talking about the referendum, there is another interesting issue I'd like to bring up. In the wake of the dosage to attacks for terrorism in Kenya, a lot has been going on in discussion. And there's still, I think the dust is still settling. We're still getting over it. We're still shaking our heads and trying to put our heads up and put our shoulders back. We're trying to get back on our feet and move on as a country. Our president actually went for a summit that we are calling the African Union Heads of State and Government Summit. It was held in Addis Ababa. And some of the newly elected EU chairman, some of the newly elected people in the African Union were also there attending. These are people like the chairman of Egyptian president, Abdel Fattah El-Saki, and president of the Palestine Liberation Organization, and as well as Mahmoud Abbas. These are all people who shared sentiments when it came to terrorism with our president. And what our president was saying is that as world leaders, we need to find a way to fight against terrorism. We've talked about the referendum and how important it is for this referendum to come in, to change and fill in the gaps of particular areas that are not exactly working. And some of those areas in focus, especially today, like I mentioned before, is the Kenya Youth Development Policy. Now, in the Kenya Youth Development Policy, I feel, as I was reading through it, there are areas where it talks about curbing terrorism, terrorist attacks, and curbing radicalization. We've seen recently that most of the people who are getting radicalized, most of people who are taking in by terrorist groups are our youth people. And our youth who keep saying our Wambuys, our Kerubos, our Akinis, they are everyday people. These are not people who you don't expect. These are people who, it could be your neighbor. It could be someone you go to, I don't know, maybe someone you share something with in any way, shape, or form. You'd be so surprised, the kind of connections you have with people. And this person, you wake up one day, you hear there are terrorists, and they are recruited. And it's quite shocking. It really is quite shocking. And when it comes to our draft for youth development policy, what does it say about curbing radicalization and curbing extremist activities when it comes to terrorism in Kenya? How will our youth development policy assist in keeping our youth safe when it comes to the radicalization or the recruitment of terrorists? First of all, we realize that this is the second youth policy. We had a first policy called the National Youth Policy of 2006. So when we look at the National Youth Policy of 2006, we realize that back then, youth radicalization wasn't an issue. That was in 2006. And we needed to review the policy after every five years. And we can see that one of the reasons why we needed to have a new youth policy was to review the landscape. Like, we have socioeconomic issues that are emerging, like youth radicalization. And that was where the Ministry of Public Service and Youth decided, OK, it's prime time that we looked at the issues affecting the young people once more in the youth policy and came up with the Kenya Youth Development Policy of 2018. Now, what I love about the Kenya Youth Development Policy is that it explicitly states the strategies that the government will take to curb the youth radicalization. Because when you look at the first National Youth Policy, youth involved in crime and criminal behavior are only stated as an issue. There was nothing that the government like set out, developed in the policy as a solution to that issue. So the Kenya Youth Development Policies is very expansive on what the government will do. And we see that one of the measures the government is including is it says it will create more opportunities for youth in education, employment, and other areas. So we know one of the main issues where young people are involved in radical behavior is, of course, economic empowerment. Yes, yes, economic empowerment. I'm glad you brought that up because, sorry, if I could just interject, there is an area where our policy states that there will be an increase in opportunities for education, employment, and political participation amongst the youth. So I've heard most people talking about the fact that lack of employment could be a reason why our youth are so easily cheated into this game. They have nothing to do on a day-to-day basis. There are no jobs. Studying a business could be a little bit difficult because you don't have the capital to begin with. And so someone comes along and they tell you that, hey, there's a job in Somalia. You'll be paid really, really well. And the pathway education comes in. You should, someone who has gone to school or someone who at least is learning something in school or someone who is interested in education would know that Somalia is really struggling when it comes to things like employment. So that should, first of all, as a youth, put a question mark in your head. Because if you're educated as a youth and you would know that there are no jobs in Somalia, then you'd know that this person is lying to me. Therefore, I'm not going to take whatever they're trying to sell to me. And so that being one of the facets, education, employment being another area where you don't have any work to do, you're not educated, you do believe the myth, you believe the lie, you go to Somalia, you're expecting employment, you go there, you find out there's nothing. And you're given new clothes to wear, you're told this is what you're going to do, and this is why you're really here. And if you try and leave, you know, the ABCD will happen to you. So aside from that, what were you going to say about employment? And if you have anything to say, Miss Lucosi, about this, please do feel free. OK, on the issue of radicalization, I remember, I had a classmate at the law school. He was called Abdul, one of the guys who was involved in the Westgate attack, no, in the Garisah. Yeah, in the Garisah attack. He was a law student, and he was a very bright student. So you look at it, there is more when it comes to radicalization than just employment. Because education also plays a role. There is an employment. But then when it comes to representation of the youth, we feel like we are alienated. Sometimes we have the capacities, we have the skills, we have the knowledge. We really want to, we are patriotic. We want to contribute to economic growth and development of the country. But then we don't get the opportunity because of corruption being the main issue that is really crippling this country. We really need to mainstream the institutions. Even the institutions that we have, the political institutions that we have, we really need our youths to be heard. Let our voices be heard. And let us also, not just being heard, but let what we also suggest, let it be implemented. Let it not just be a PR strategy. Yes. OK, yeah. And we will talk about that in just a few minutes. But just to close in the topic, I see that some of the ways that the policy determines to curb radicalization also deals with things to do with building resilience and rehabilitating affected communities through development approaches that seek to provide sustainable livelihood, as well as designing and implementing programs on countering violent extremism. So they have to design and create programs that create counter extremism and teach people, like she was saying, giving our youth a voice and also teaching them that this is not the path to follow. Moving right along, you mentioned something to do with patriotism, that youth want so much to belong into the governance sectors of this country. And one of those ways is through electing our youth into positions. But you're saying that once they do get there, maybe their voices don't get heard. And even if they don't get there to begin with, there is an issue because there isn't any avenue for youth to come in and lead. Yes. That being the case, you mentioned something to do with patriotism. When I was reading through the Kenya Development Policy, I saw that some of the values include patriotism, things like respect of diversity and ethical values, equity and accessibility, inclusiveness, good governance, accountability, and so much more. There's a lot of values in this development policy. And now I'd really like us to get into it in detail. And I want us to, in simple layman's terms, for any youth who is watching right now, how would you say this youth development policy is different from the previous one, the one that was written in 2006? Let's start off with that one. The Kenya Youth Development Policy is a guideline to help the government know how they are going to promote youth interventions in its various national development programs at the national and at the county level. Well, one way we see that there's the big difference between the first one and the second one is that the first one was very broad. It was very vague in terms of aligning what the ministry was saying it wants to do with the government priorities. Right now the government priority is the big four agenda. And the Kenya Youth Development Policy clearly aligns its priorities with the big four agenda. And as well, not only the big four agenda with the SDGs, the medium term plans, the Kenya Vision 2030. And I think that is very important because we have so many programs happening in the country. And everyone is just thinking about different thematic areas. But if we all align our program to what the government is doing, I think we'll have more youths being mainstreamed into government programs. And another thing we see is that right now the Kenya Youth Development Policy focuses more on having youth participating not just as problems in the economy but as active players in that. It recognizes that young people are very skilled, energetic, and creative. And they can be an important resource in the society. Therefore, it promotes the need to have young people volunteer in their communities by setting out a place where they want to develop a national youth volunteering framework. So in this way, we know that a lot of young people have so much energy, so much skill, but they don't want to harness the energy. So the government is prioritizing that volunteerism is very important for young people. And we want to engage the young people more through volunteerism in different aspects of the economy. Lastly, I love this. This is actually the best part of the youth development policy. It states that the ministry will develop a Kenya Youth Development Index. So what the Youth Development Index is, it's a way of monitoring and tracking the progress made in programs that have been done by the national and the county on youth programs. So we have had a lot of... So they'll be able to track and see. Yeah, they'll be able to track. So has there been improvement in it? Yeah, has there been improvement? What measures can we see so that we can know that young people are getting better or young people are getting worse? So that is very important because in the first one, it was just stating strategies. So right now, we'll be able to measure. And by measuring, you'll have more evidence-based policy analysis in the future when it comes to the reviewing of the youth development policy. So that's what is different from the previous youth policy. I see, I see. So there's not just an implementation of a new policy. It's more of a way of even cross-checking and making sure that the policy has been carried out. Has been carried out. Okay, Ms. Lukosi, may I ask what are some of the things you are looking forward to when it comes to the youth development policy? What are some of the things that when you read or when you hear discussions or even following the review on the youth and politics, the youth development policy, what stands out to you the most? What matters to you the most as a youth senator of Nairobi? Okay. I must commend the process. And I must commend also the draft because it is well aligned with the constitution. With the current constitution, which really emphasizes on inclusivity of all people, especially the marginalized groups. Yeah, like the youth. Including the youths. Yeah, and article 55 of the constitution clearly outlines it pushes the government to put in place measures to ensure that young people are well included and represented in social, political, economic, and all other spheres of life. So with the current policy, I've scrutinized it. And I feel like... You've scrutinized it. If you've not only read it, you've scrutinized it. Yes, yes. And I feel like it has really... It has tried to ensure that all different kinds of youths are being included. There is even a provision, I can't remember exactly which it is, but then it categorizes the youths as educated and an educated male and female. Yeah, I saw something about that. Yeah, it's killed and unskilled. And it also provides the measures to address the specific issues affecting these categories of youths. All of them, marginalized youth from marginalized communities and youths in the urban centers, youth in rural centers, rural areas, it has captured all manner of youths. So you've paid attention to the detail that has been given. There is now coordination. Coordination of the youth functions. Yeah, when it comes to governance and youth representation in political processes and decision-making, the major institution that has that mandate is the NYC. And I'm still insisting on NYC. I can see, yeah. Yes, because NYC, it stands out as one body that can actually represent us, the youths. Let it be an elective body. OK, to anyone who does not understand what the NYC has done for the youth, what would you say in very short, very understandable words that you could use? Well, the National Youth Council was established under the National Youth Council Act, with the aim of ensuring youth representation and participation in political processes and decision-making in government. So as we stand right now, I can't, OK, historically, members of NYC have been appointed by the governing body. They got the regime. All right. Yeah, and most of the times, the people who are appointed at the National Youth Council, they are people who are being allegiance to that regime. All right, right, yes. So it's not someone who has been voted in. Yes, and they get in there, so they, you see, they only continue being loyal to the master. Yes, so at the end of the day, if they are loyal to the master, when the master says, this is the way to go, they follow the master, they don't follow the interests of youth that they are supposed to be representing. So that is the issue. But if it was an independent body with its own constitution and operations and maybe the development index of just NYC, let it be independent, we could be fair. Also devolving the youth representation. Yes, let us have the youth representation also devolved. We had suggested that we have youth advisory bodies in all the counties so that we can have youths being, youths in all those different dimensions of life being part of the youth advisory body. And we can have influence in all the decisions being made at the county level. Our voice can be heard. We run a public participation and our voices are heard. Okay, so for you, it's more of, because we do need to wind up the topic a little bit. For you, what matters the most is there being, first of all, development. Yes. Number one, number two, there needs to be more voice given to the youth and not through appointed leaders, but leaders who have been elected in, who have been chosen by fellow youth to say that once and so true present us. And as a youth senator, I do hear what you have to say. I have understood your point of view. And I need... Just an addition. Please, yeah, could you keep it brief? I'm winding up on this process for review. We have a concern that... The review of, you mean of the policy? The review, when it started on Thursday. Yes, on Thursday. On Thursday, it's going up to 14th. Yes, the issue that we have is that, you know, we were not even aware, like it was not made public on the people who are supposed to participate. We would have wished it be just a public participation, maybe in social halls so that all the youths, all the young people that feel aggrieved or they have an issue to raise, they can go to social halls, wherever, just, you know, and take part in it. But now we've just had people have been invited by letters. Some of them, they're not even so much interested in youth affairs. It's just who knows who. That's a very important point. Could you wind up her point of view? Because it's like you share. I can see you nodding and saying yes. So I'd like for you to wind up her point of view for her since you are on the same path. And then I'd like to wind up our discussion. Yeah, you see, if you want the young people to participate in the process, you have to involve all young people. So what is currently happening is we have only invitation by, like, invitation. It's the kind of ideas that you want. If you send letters of invitation, it means that you want certain kind of ideas. But what we want is we want young people to be invited, all and sundry, old. That is where, you see, these letters of invitation, we lead to marginalization of rural youth because it's only the elite and the urban youth will give their representation. We go back to, then we are going against the youth development policy. Okay, so we want a participatory process. You want a participatory process. And as you have heard from our youth senator in Nairobi, Faith Lucosi and our public policy consultant, Irene Wairimo, what they've had to share about the development policy for youth in Kenya. I'm getting the notion that we need to get more youth participating. That's what this channel is all about, for example. That's what we're doing. That's what I'd love to thank you people for coming over because what you have done is you have shown our youth, number one, that they could take positions like yours. They could be able to discuss and divide and really give an intricate explanation of policies such as the development policy like you have been able to do. And so I'd like to thank you both so, so much. And as we continue on putting our faith in you, I'm putting my faith in you people and our future leaders and if any venue there is to vote you guys in, we'll be able, we'd love to do that and we'd love to support you people. And so thank you so much for coming in. Thank you so much for explaining what this means to our youth. Thank you so much for explaining what the development policy is all about. And as we wind up, I'd like to encourage you guys to continue following the review that continues on until the 14th as you've heard so that we can understand what we can do as people. Don't just allow the country to run you, run your own country as well, okay? Yeah, don't let the country run you, run your own country. And so thank you so much for tuning in. This has been Youth in Politics. Why in the morning? Remember my name is Joy Mochache. You can reach me on joy underscore mochache. Thank you so much. Coming up, Val is Valentine Wambui with a wonderful, wonderful discussion on psychology on Man Crush Monday.