 Okay, we're all green. Okay. Good morning, and welcome to this week's edition of N-Tempest Live. I am your host, Krista Porter, from the Nebraska Library Commission, not at the Library Commission at the moment. You may notice that I am on a separate camera from the people who are there at our usual location at the Nebraska Library Commission, Lincoln. I'm actually remoting in from a state in New York where I'm enjoying the holidays with my family, but I'm here this morning to do the show. So N-Tempest Live is the Commission's weekly online event. We are a webinar, and proud of it, will recover a variety of things related to libraries. Both of the hosts, N-Tempest Live is broadcast live at 10 a.m. central time every Wednesday morning. If you're unable to join us on Wednesdays, that's fine. We do record the show every week, and it's listed to our website, and I'll show you where it is. Well, we'll show you where it's embedded, then. Both of the live show and the recordings are free and open to anyone to watch, so please do share with your friends, neighbors, family, colleagues, anybody who might think be interested in any of our shows. We do mixture of things on N-Tempest Live, interviews, book reviews, many training sessions, demos of software and products, basically anything that we think may be of interest to libraries across the state. We have Nebraska Library Commission staff to do sessions for us for things that we are doing locally, and we have remote guest speakers that come in sometimes. And this morning, we're going to mixture of that. What is this morning? You'll see, first, there is a colleague from here at the library commission. Also, Tom also says here, he's on the slide there as well, from the Nebraska Information Technology Commission. So he's from Nebraska, and then also there, my co-host, Sally Snyder, from the library commission there, getting things going in Lincoln. And this is a session that Tom and Holly did recently, a few months ago, at our Nebraska Library Association and School Librarians Association annual conference in October about getting some really good high-speed internet to our public libraries and doing some partnerships. So I think I'll just hand it over to you guys to take the way and talk about what you've got there. Very good. Thank you, Krista. As Krista mentioned, my name's Tom Ralfus. I'm an Education IT Manager from the Office of the CIO. That's a state agency and also the Nebraska Information Technology Commission. That's my contact information for any questions or comments following today's session. And I have with me Holly Wolt and my primary responsibility with the public libraries is working with the Public Computing Center area and also I, if you have a broadband issue or internet speed issue in your library that you might be frustrated with and people to work locally with, you often, well, you're welcome to contact me. I do have libraries contact me to see if there's anything we can do to help out as far as some different ideas. Very good. We have some helpful links at the bottom of this slide. And as Krista mentioned, this was a session given at the NLA conference back in October. And we operate under three basic assumptions for today's session. One, the libraries need faster internet or maybe they may want faster internet. Also that we operate under the assumption the libraries have limited resources. And thirdly, that all of the Nebraska public libraries are within the neighborhood of a public school district that is already connected to scalable fiber, which means infinite capacity for internet. So today's agenda, we're going to do a quick overview of Network Nebraska, the statewide network. We'll go through three different levels of school library collaboration and interaction. And then thirdly, we'll give you some ideas of things you can do right now, action steps that you can take in a rural community to help out your library. So first of all, I need to drink the water. That's a good thing to do while you're going to be talking for a while, be prepared. Yes. Very good. Thank you. So just quickly about Network Nebraska, it's a statewide network that unites public schools, private schools and colleges throughout the state. It connects every single school district in the state. So you don't have to worry about which district is connected and which one isn't. It's at 100%. We buy a significant amount of internet, 85 gig for the entire state. And we serve over 425,000 students and staff every day. And it is a collaborative project. Network Nebraska was born in 2006 by order of the legislature. And that's a brief excerpt of the statute. And no, although we do not talk about in the library specifically in the statute, we consider them obviously a branch of local government. So therefore they're eligible to participate fully and directly with the network. And right now, as of this moment, we have only two public libraries connected to Network Nebraska. And that would be Grand Island Public and then the Lincoln City Libraries. So here's a slide just showing quickly the summary of the different sectors that belong to the network. And as you can see, we're at 100% for most of our public colleges and K-12. And then private colleges are 50% and private schools at 20%. Here's a graphic image of the statewide network and its backbone. Every one of the magenta triangles represents one of the 291 members. And each of them sponsor a fiber circuit, excuse me, that connects to one of the yellow stars that are on the map. And then the role of Network Nebraska is to interconnect those aggregation points so that every single member can see and connect with each other as well as five major sources of internet. So this is a graphic image of what happens when you have the entire state work together for a similar cause. We've been able to bring down the unit cost of internet by over 99% over the last 10 years of operation. It's rather dramatic and significant. And as we bid statewide for internet access, we see the rates going even further down in the future. And then we pass all those savings on to our members as they're able to buy commodity internet at the normal, basically a wholesale cost. In Network Nebraska, we participate fully with e-rate. And as this slide or matrix shows, we do it mainly for the statewide internet. We file on the statewide backbone. And starting in the next fiscal year after the coming one, we will be taking over all the circuits between the school districts and libraries and the state backbone. And we'll file e-rate on their behalf. If a school district has circuits that interconnect their lines, that is outside our responsibility. And that's the first row or line of the matrix. So now we'll start into why we put the slides together in the presentation. And these are some of the facts about school districts. Well, we now, though, that all of them are connected by fiber. They all participate in e-rate. And public school districts have access to more internet than they could ever use on a daily basis. And so we're in a position to share or reach out with that internet to other public entities that are eligible to participate in Network Nebraska. The probably most striking, somewhere between 15 and 17% of our state's population have insufficient internet at home. That means that they're either without internet completely or that they have internet so slow that they can't carry on basic activities, particularly those involved with education. And this is a statewide concern and issue. And then if you add on to that, many of these students are using laptops or tablets or devices that are paid for by the school district with tax dollars. And yet they get home and they can't get on the internet. And we know that's where libraries come in in many rural communities. Sure. So we know that 85% of the public libraries report internet speeds below 25 megabits. And that number has changed. I know about any of you who've been around for a while know that about five years ago or six years ago when we had our VTOP grant that we were able to upgrade speeds at that time for a number of the libraries that participated in the grant. And in fact, we had funding to upgrade sometimes twice the speeds of the local library. But in the time since then there has not been that much movement in the speed. But we continue to probe libraries to consider and find ways that they can increase their speed. And about two-thirds of the public libraries do not apply for any rate. And we know that there are a number of reasons why. And some of it is just the difficulty of using the USAC website space or the fact that make the library as philosophically the library decision makers are against filtering. And these are things that we'll try to address as we go on with our conversation here and for the conversations. And only about four percent of the public libraries have begun applying for e-rate category two funding. I know that Tom and I also had a presentation at the Nebraska Library Association conference. And we talked a little bit about that. And I think some libraries just weren't aware that it was available. And I think that that's just a matter of making sure that we get this information out. And it continues to be available at least for one more year or so. And that's something that you may want to be looking into. And that, you know, one of the things that we know, as people who work with the libraries, it is considered the most important location in the community for internet access, especially in small and rural communities. Oftentimes when we travel to visit with communities, the library is the only place that has free Wi-Fi that's available. And even though the speed is minimal, it does allow folks who are traveling or even some of the folks that come in from out on the ranches and out of town to come in and be able to get to the internet. And that the public school districts and public libraries historically have not collaborated to achieve faster internet. And this is, of course, what our presentation is about. In fact, other than those libraries and schools, libraries that are co-located in the same physical structure, we cannot find one example out of 250 opportunities where the school district and library are working together. So that's the whole essence of this presentation. And we're going to describe some potential pathways to break the ice on that. So here's our provocative question. What if there was a way, a legal way, for public libraries to receive a share of the district internet to supplement, or as you'll see shortly, to actually replace their existing internet that they get from an internet service provider. So now we're going to go through a series of three different interactions and the criteria or characteristics of each. And as we go from level one to level three, it becomes more involved and more interactive. So the first level one interaction, and we'll show a graphic image in just a moment that'll help paint the picture is for the school district to actually drop new internet into the library in addition to the internet that's currently being purchased. And Holly, if you'd like to quickly run down the public library side. Well, with the public libraries, if you can go ahead and set up like a home or hotspot featuring the school-owned computers and tables, et cetera, in the library or a place that the library is able to supervise. And one of the other things is to be able to advertise that the school Wi-Fi is for use of student and staff for wireless devices. So when we're thinking about this, it is the school staff and it would be the K-12 students that attend the public schools. And the one thing the library may need to be thinking about is how these students would be supervised during the time when they are in the library, especially after school and on the weekends. If you find that you have a plethora of students coming in because they've been finding out about this free Wi-Fi and fast speeds, then you may need to think about additional supervision. And that's something to be thinking about. And then it frees up the ISP internet for use of adult patrons and for the home school students. And this is something that as I travel through the libraries with the grant and when I visit a library, oftentimes there might be one adult in there and they say, oh, I just can't get any speed. And when I'm in here in the afternoon, I'd like to try to come in in the morning to do my work. And this would be a way that that could free up some of that internet usage by students for the adult patrons to be in there. And so the family actually could come in and use a zero or a tiny network Nebraska monthly fee. So that's the good news for the public library. It often has no funding or little funding. So on the school district side of the ledger, what we're talking about is more of a pilot, a temporary fix or internet augmentation. And the school district would actually use fixed wireless equipment and drop it right to the rooftop of the library and then connect up a brand new what we call an 802 11 EC router. That's the newest standard, the fastest, most advanced internal connection device. That's also eligible for funding by E rate. And then this router would be managed by the school district as well as the internet and then permit what we call single sign on because every student and staff member in a public school district has their own login and password. And they would be able to do that through the new router and they would see the school district network even though they're within the library. And in terms of internet access, literally skies a limit. This equipment can go up to 100 to 200 megabits. So if you're a 12 megabit library in rural Nebraska, this not only would be an offload of many of your daily patrons, but it also would be a demonstration of super fast internet. So here's a graphic image of what we're talking about. The library internet access from the ISP stays in place, but we create a tiny node of the public school district network within the library and both of those networks can coexist. And it would be only for school district patrons, students and staff. And this is another picture that would show the kinds of equipment that would be on the road. So we're talking about a wireless connection, mainly because it's very affordable. We're talking only a few hundred to maybe a couple of thousand dollars. And the distance limitation, although we see in the slide four miles, this equipment can go to the horizon, which would be up to 30 miles, a distance between the library and the school, but the rooftops must have to see each other in order to make this work. A level two interaction, Holly will take the library side. Well, it will join the school in the library and a mini consortium for E-Rate, which is entirely legal as we were talking about legalities earlier. And it will terminate the internet contract with the ISP and the ISP bids on the school to library circuit. So it's just the circuit that's within between the school and the library, nothing else. And that we'd have to offer to supervise student patrons after school and on weekends. Again, that's another piece that would be important as we wouldn't want to have school kids or youth there without some type of supervision and expands the programming to the community through virtual field trips and other high ban applications. And this is the most exciting piece to me is to think about opening up these small communities, not only opening up for them to see many more things and be right in their library to see it, but also the fact that they can show themselves off to the big wide school. And it says it pays a .25 network, Nebraska monthly fee at about $58 per month. Correct. And on the school district side by having a mini consortium now, any circuit connecting the school and the library is now eligible for category one support statewide that average discount is about 67%. And you would know by checking in with your local school district what level of discount you would derive by being part of this consortium. So now what we're really talking about is ejecting or jettisoning the wireless connection if there is one or go straight to this level of interaction where you would bid for the circuit between a library and school and now it's eligible for e-rate support. And then the entire network would then be directed to the school district and we could replace all the equipment with brand new 802.11ac router as well as wireless access points. And again, the internet that goes to the school district can be shared from network to Nebraska to the library because they would now become a member of the network even though they're not directly connected to the school district. So in this case, in this graphic image, the internet service provider is no longer in a relationship with the library. And we have checked a reality check with many providers and we got positive head nods that they would welcome the opportunity to bid on the circuit between school and library and no longer be responsible for internet. It's not only the cost of doing business but they would no longer have to answer the calls about internet outages because the internet would actually be coming from the public school network from network Nebraska. Now we'll go on to level three interaction which is very similar to level two but it requires more involvement by the library in the management of the internet that would come to them. So again, it's the mini consortium and terminates the internet contract with the ISP and the ISP bids on the school library circuit but the library deploys and manages their own 802 11AC router and our wireless access points and filtrants. And that would be something new that again, there's training available on that. So we need to be a part of that to work with the library if they were considering something like this but it's completely doable and again, it expands the programming because you have that extra bandwidth and you can be on video conferencing very easily from the library and the cost is still the same. Exactly and so as you can see this is very much like the level but if you go to the right side of the slide and the third bullet in this case, the school district would create what's called a VLAN a virtual local area network from their network and basically hand it off to the library and they can manage it as they see fit and it would appear to the school district that it's just another public access VLAN that they would have inside their own buildings but it happens to be shared with the public library. So in this case the slide is very similar but notice the purple arrow or magenta arrow that interacts or intersects the school district before it gets inside their network so it would not be threatening to the school district it would not present a security risk it would basically hand off network from brass internet to the library who would then be responsible for the management of that internet but again it would be infinitely scalable because the circuits coming into the public school districts are on average about 200 megabit and it can be completely filled with internet. So Holly, why should they collaborate? Why shouldn't they maybe should be the question but we know that most public libraries need faster, more reliable internet and in some cases I would even venture to say the school has a unique situation that they actually are able to provide a higher speed than is offered in the community and to me this is one way that the library because it is a key anchor institution and maybe the only community anchor institution in small and rural communities that they would be able to afford to offer an alternative for high speed internet and then of course the public libraries in school districts both rely on tax revenue and that would decrease the total cost for the taxpayers is what we are saying and the public libraries have a mission to serve the entire community with information services so we're talking about databases and we're talking about video conferencing conference capability and many parents and students so again the idea that you would be maybe taking that internet high speed and offering it to the K-12 students we talked about that they would free it up for adults to be able to use also. Very good and for the school district and we're not trying to be naive here we know that if this wasn't easy interaction between these political subdivisions it would already be happening and then we just be showcasing these case studies of success the fact that it's not happening indicates that there's a chasm or separation between the political subdivisions or perhaps they've never investigated the opportunity to work together but keep in mind from the slide earlier that we have around 50,000 public school students without appropriate internet at home and as we become more digital by education systems that's a point of exposure for school districts and they are not in the business of taking internet to homes so the next best thing will be to light up the library in much faster internet than what they have today so the library school interaction is only one potential intervention it's not going to reach every student it's certainly not as convenient but right now it's a very important interim solution to getting internet to every home and so we're talking about the homework gap and we want to try to narrow that and by working together it shows the community that libraries and school districts are mindful of their public resources as well as improving service by working together we can libraries do now and there are things that we can begin right away to work on as we look to this opportunity and the first thing is for many libraries they do record attendance and people who come into the library daily you may want to identify if you aren't already your student patron visits and be able to keep recording that information and I'm going to let Krista visit a little bit with you from New York the e-rate expertise because we are looking and pointing you to the USAC website but the library commission also has some resources that she's going to highlight shall I call that then? yeah sure do you want to do that right now? yes you should be able to switch over to it if you still have it open you can make that fully yeah as I think many of you know on the phone I am in for the rest of public libraries and the city coordinator so I do need support hand-holding of getting everybody of our public libraries through the e-rate process and when we do this on the pilot and the joint pilot I'll be on the phone if I'll do that as soon as Krista visits I will come later mentioning are you okay with the audio? this is the website we have at the commission and it just goes down I've got links to different things from the USAC website and my most recent training was in there I did training across the state and then I did an online session earlier this month in December and the recording is there you can click on that that will pop you over the link to the recording which is on the commission's YouTube channel and the slides and you see the tip there is the recording and along the recording you can turn now with it so any broken work in two sections so if you just want to know about a particular form or like step three of the process I've got links in the description that will pop in the next session in two hours so if you go back to the long page I've got lots of links to your account how to get to different forms specific links for things related to Nebraska libraries if you scroll down a little bit more Sally their forms of music with Nebraska schools and reduced counts that's in the Nebraska Department of Education so this will be a lot of information about and finally that's kind of a short version okay well I think that will be enough just to we want to be sure to highlight the things that we have here locally that will help them to help folks who aren't familiar with e-rate and the USAC website how to get to where they can go to find out more filtering there is a section there on SIPA and filtering that I have where I can read some resources and information about that Fran is interested in trying to figure that out so links to information resources had some software programs you can use so those ones are going to be available now that they might be getting into or need to be getting into because in the future after this year everything e-rate related is going to be in compliance with SIPA more okay thank you so the other thing of course and it's true of the library I think in all the small world communities is to cultivate relationships in particular we're talking about with the public school district administrators their technology staff and teachers and school media director and often times one of those individuals will go volunteer in your library to help you with the issues with technology so the idea is that you're sharing this information and you have an understanding of you have a relationship with them that relates to what the library could use related to internet and the other piece of this and I know a lot of library directors do this anyway but you start attending school board meetings and other community group meetings so you're aware and you could promote what the library can offer in the community and you learn about the challenges of your school district you know we know that there's always the financial challenge it seems very often I shouldn't say always but in small role areas related to the library and of course related to the school district and often times you might be competing for the same funds and so that's something about as we talked about in the previous slide about maybe saving the taxpayers a few you know few dollars and enhancing services in your community look for ways to complement and partner with your school districts and you can research the broadband community and foundation grants and there are a number of those that are available across the state and I would be happy to look into that with you too if there is something that I could do that you have been doing I see what conferences that aren't necessarily all library related but to attend the conferences and training sessions related to broadband and e-rate and like Krista was saying and highlighting that she does do I know she goes around in the fall and she does a series of workshops and it's great that it's on video and you can you know you can access it through a link at any time and at your own speed because really this is a collaboration between the library and the CIO office but Tom is the this is really a dream for him so I think I will let you talk about that. Thanks Holly. So at the very end the last vote says apply for the Nebraska Library Commission Sparks grant it funded in April 2018 and you may be saying to yourself I haven't heard anything about a grant opportunity if you're saying that you'd be actually correct so by tuning into today's Encompass live you're the first to find out that the Library Commission and the Nebraska Information Technology Commission is in a joint project that made it to second level review with the IMLS grant program and we'll show you in the next slide a quick prospectus of what we're attempting to do. So what we're hoping to get funded for in April of 2018 is a small seed grant of $25,000 to actually pay to incentivize five rural school districts and libraries to work together to do exactly what this presentation is suggesting to do an augmentation from the school district into the library and you would be have no risk exposure for dollars in order to make this happen it would be grant funded all you'd have to do is agree to work together and invite that into the library on a temporary basis to study the result of this faster internet so we're very hopeful that we'll be funded in April 2018 the grant program is only one year and because it's so fast paced we actually have to ask for applications prior to April so you'll be looking for a notice from the library commission sometime in January two o'clock and always working on the application form as we speak so we're very excited by this we'll be a relatively low cost low risk interaction as we basically be the level one interaction that we described in the presentation so that you would get an augmented internet into the library agreed patrons from the school district be there and access the internet which would be supported and provided by the school district the grant would pay for the equipment to make this happen so like I said we're very hopeful and we look at the, you know it's called a sparks grant and that's exactly what we're doing we're trying to find it this model is something that can be used not only in Nebraska but nationally the IMLS is looking to find out some more information about this idea so when you say I'm interested you might be a pioneer for us as something that will go nationally across our country as being able to be used as a model so I encourage you even though you may think it's a lot of work for one year I don't think it's actually too much work in the meantime you'll be educating yourself about e-rate filing and category one and two and I think that's important to know and important to be able to offer on behalf of your community by the public library so the natural follow-up to this short-term experiment then is to form a consortium relationship with the school district for the level two or three interaction that we described in the slideshow there will not be a requirement to the grant but you would be invited to participate and then you would have all manner of e-grade support in order to make that consortium application happen and the bidding for the circuit to interconnect the library and the school district on a more permanent basis but just remind yourselves it would not be a requirement but it will be an opportunity if you participate in this first round of breaking the ice and igniting internet relationships so we've come to the final slide of our presentation hosting our contact information for personal follow-up and then we're able to respond to any questions that you have through the chat room or any questions that Krista may have that we haven't already thought of Great, so hopefully I know I'm using the audio because I don't have a microphone here where I'm now I'm using the cellphone so hopefully it might be even during the session does anybody have anything they want to ask of Tom or Holly while we're here about this exciting new project I love the title of the breaking the ice of the grant maybe Krista do you remember our literary reference of how that came to be it was derived from Game of Thrones as in Fire and Ice Fire and Ice that was the springboard to the title we really think it is breaking the ice and then igniting a more collaborative relationships between these two public entities we do have one question from Beth wants to know and I'm not sure we know this yet when will the grant application information be available sometime in January I'm working on the application currently but we will need to send out an application with a caveat that says only a funded but certainly it will be worth your time to take an opportunity to read it and potentially submit the application so the application would come out before we have the actual funding thank you and we do have a question I do for the audience and that is if we do not have any of these relationships in place already in the state of Nebraska why is it and we have some ideas of what those causes may be but if you're from a rural community and you've never worked with a school district or your school district and you've never worked with a public library not on program but on infrastructure and we'd be interested in knowing why has no one ever thought of it or is there such a distinction between the two or what is it in our travels that we haven't heard or seen please provide us additional background before we submit our second round grant because that will be very important to the national grant reviewers correct we do have a comment about that again about at Imperial we have tried to work with the school but we are getting a new superintendent this next year so we'll see so so we can be hopeful for Imperial with new leadership can come new perspectives so she said yes we are yes it's time to start going to school board meetings yeah always a good advice for any libraries being involved in that yeah make introductions for sure and be participating does anybody else on the line have any questions about this new project we're hoping to get going type into your questions section we can answer them now otherwise you do have the contact info there and as Holly mentioned look for more information coming in the next month or so for the application and how we are applying for the grant and hopefully we'll get it do you know when in April is there a date in particular given for the announcement of the grander is it more vague than that I think it was vague that's a very good question there's a big difference between April 1 April 30 because that's an entire month of a 12 month interaction could be lost we hope it's early in the month the sooner the better yeah we do have a question and I think you might have mentioned this but I'm not sure would the internet at the public library be limited to students or could the general public use it that's a very good question so if you go back and lead through the slides the level one interaction which is more of a pilot or experiment would be expressly reserved for patrons of the school district and that would be when I say patrons I mean actual students or staff that have a school district login and it'd be limited to those to share in that internet and it would be open for general use and it would also replace the internet that they're currently getting from an ISP again virtually scalable upwards of about $1,000 $1,000 $1,000 $1,000 $1,000 $1,000 $1,000 $1,000 upwards of $100 megabits per second through this wireless connection or in this case a wired connection but now it would be open for general usage by the community so then the pilot project and the grant that we're doing that's just for the the first version correct the proof of concept type thing correct and then potentially we could go on to the other yeah I have a big question I'd be able for everybody to use but I think the benefit is all of these students that keep coming in and using up your bandwidth they would be on the school's connection and that would make your library's connection better for the people not the students correct and it's every bit as much about starting and forming new community relationships that are very solid and very productive as it is sharing the internet correct so we really want to use a small amount of grant money to incentivize these meetings and collaborations to occur that haven't been previously at least for interactions related to infrastructure obviously we don't want to take away from the many opportunities that have already occurred between database sharing, material sharing and thematic programs that have been occurring within communities which are very very productive but this one will be specifically targeted at faster internet all month right any other questions from the audience or from Sally nobody else was typing in anything they desperately needed to know right now giving people a few minutes to type so I think maybe we'll wrap it up anything less you want to say Tom or Holly about this before we wrap it up officially no just want to thank the library commission for this opportunity to take this message statewide and even potentially beyond the state because Nebraska is not alone in our rural dilemma of needing internet even though we're one of the top five states for the number of rural extremely small rural libraries among the U.S. states we're not alone and so we've checked with other states and the whole mini consortium interaction between libraries and school districts is virtually untried around the United States so if we can get this happening in Nebraska as Holly mentioned it could be a national model for other rural states to follow and I just I'm very excited about this opportunity and really look forward to visiting with libraries across the state about this opportunity and hopefully get a lot of applications yeah I think and then rural we're the center of the country we are yeah and the thing of course is that we don't have the opportunity in the local communities to have high speed internet for many you know beyond even just the school and so this brings that into the focus and attention of the community too that you they would like more than likely to have higher speed but they don't have the capability this may make some inroads to it's a big picture one final item is keep in mind in the back of everyone's mind is that every single school district is interconnected over network Nebraska every single school district is fiber connected and every single school district has a virtually scalable and inexhaustible source of internet so we just need to find a better way to get that shared public entities within the community in a way that doesn't endanger their own e-rate filings and we think we found that mechanism and that's what we shared today during the presentation I think it's been really good with figuring out what is how the team does this talking to people from e-rate who you talk about is this like you mentioned legal can we do it this way so I think if you can just get the grant and get some of our libraries in order to try it out with us I think we'd have something good correct doesn't look like any other last minute questions have come in you guys do have contact information there for Kam and Holly keep your eyes open for announcements for the grant application for libraries to join up with it and then hopefully that we get approved alright so I think we want to present Tom and Holly and Sally they're in Nebraska so that will wrap it up for today's show if you want to switch over Sally to website we can go to the commissions page and go to encompass lives website yeah you can just search in there and I'll find it there we are so we are recording today's show Sally's doing that there in the library commission offices and the recording will be available next week when I am back in the office I'm away all this week if you click on the archive encompass live sessions underneath our upcoming shows that is where it will be posted we'll have the video we'll have the slides we'll eventually if we will have a link to wherever the application and more information about the grant will be right there at the top of the list our most recent ones go to the top and as soon as it is available I will announce it and let everybody know but I'm away I'm out of state right now so when I get back in the office after the new year is when it will be so pop back to the main page Sally for encompass lives yeah here we go so that will wrap it up for today I hope you join us for next week and if you click on learn for next week the best new children's books of 2017 the very first show of 2018 will be Sally will be back sitting next to me best new children's books of 2017 she will be with us to talk about what new titles came out last year and this will be the beginning of the 10th year of encompass live yeah I had to do the math on that so beginning of the year we'll talk about books so please do register for that show and any of our other ones and we will be more filling in for January I'm working on them I actually just had a conversation with Tom and Holly they'll be back again later in January for another topic to be announced when I get back so other than that I think that's enough so thank you everyone for attending and we will see you next time on encompass live thank you