 Hello and welcome to news click Very recently the government of India has permitted the post graduate eye with the doctors to perform a set of surgeries Which has received widespread opposition from the Indian Medical Association? To talk more about this we have with us the president elect of the Indian Medical Association Dr. Jayalan welcome, sir Thank you To begin with why is the Indian Medical Association opposing the government's move of permitting the Ayurveda doctors to perform a surgery? Surgery is a one form of treatment. It is something playing between life and death Then doing a surgery patient has to be undergo anesthesia His heart and his lung function is under the hands of the team of doctors who are doing So it is a highly specialized and highly skilled procedure where you need to have Anesthesia antibiotic appropriate instruments and the proper million as much the today available system Ayurveda Do not have any anesthesia medicine Ayurveda. Do not have any antibiotics to treat the infection Ayurveda as such do not have any sophisticated Equipments or instruments on their system to do that they have to only adopt with from the Allowed modern medicine system a doctor who is not trained in undergraduate in surgery who is not going adequate training and skill under the proprietorship of someone else and Allowing him to operate on another person body. It is catastrophic to the humanity and Indian Medical Association is opposing it only on the perspective of the public the humanity which is going to be operated and Improperly trained or improperly adequately equipped to people when they are operating. There's a lot of complication of going to come So such a system of double-standard. Yeah, I least socialized surgeon for Highly in our city and for the rural population can be operated by someone with an Cannot be accepted and it is against our constitution. That is the reason why Indian Medical Association is opposing it I am a statement as said that India is one of the countries which reminds in the front frontier of Modern medicine in both the evidence-based and clinical students So if the Ayurveda doctors are given permission to perform surgeries, what will happen to this particular? Improvements we have run over the past several years You are rightly asked that India is one country today Various even in our western countries the people are coming in for a medical treatment called as a medical tourism lot of sophisticated surgery like cardiac surgeries and Transplantation procedures are done much cheaper and affordable and accessible way in India That is why I am also if you see any foreign country, even if it is USA or UK 30% of the medical fraternity is Indian trained Because today in across the globe Indian trained doctors are well-respected because they know the system of education Which we are undergoing is proper meticulous and adequately trained when you are bringing out a system where? Anyone can have the degree without having a proper training and the training part is Inodicacy there is the entry into the system is also inodicate Definitely it will make a question mark into the mind of the people in the global standard and the people coming to India for treatment Is do it definitely it will have a medical tourism will be affected So always when an Indian graduate coming from a degree from a Madras medical college I'm a Christian medical college if he's going out and with that degree. He has a lot of respect When they know that it is not that they have a proper Training see something like that when you have an undergraduate you are not studying surgery Suddenly in the postgraduate only you are going to study a modern medicine and it is not going to be an appropriate It will definitely impair the the image of Indian doctors in the foreign countries And it also impairs the economy of India by reducing the foreign people coming to India for medical treatment You have also said that the Indian Medical Association. I mean has also said that the Central Council has going on in uncivil ways. So what do you imply by calling it as answer? This is natural. No every one of us as a house and we have a boundary We have a compound bar when you are poking or encroaching into the other Compound it is always the uncivilized one. Nobody will enter into the another person's house and get the Things from there and take it that and process that it is a common thing Everyone can use that is not the possible in a civilized way. See our weather system is based on if certain principles of vada pitta kabba all that that's your internal milieu intermiglio and external milieu and My medicine is a system where we are trying to talk about the Organisms and lifestyle and many other factors which is playing for the part of the disease. So we are talking about antibiotics They do not accept antibiotics. We are talking about immunization. They do not accept immunization. We are having anesthesia They do not accept anesthesia. They may use No drugs for them anesthesia now. They say no whatever it is But we will do surgery, but we will adopt everything from what you have and we can also use that that is I think it is a very very Better where it is a uncivilized that the appropriate blood for this is much much worse than that sir another important aspect here is the medical legal issues involved in these guidelines which are brought to so Can you please elaborate on it? What are the actual issues? In our country we lot of consumer protection cases are there There are different sectors of the specialization in modern medicine just because I have asked you must general surgery I cannot do all the surgeries. I cannot do a cesarean. I mean so I need to a MD Audrey I cannot do a surgery on the eye If you do I there is another three-year course is you must optology has to be done And if I have to do a surgery on on a certain things and we need to further a specialization so even lot of court cases has come when You must general surgeon operating on a cesarean section. They say you are trained in general surgery You are not a straw specialized in cesarean. So you it is not right for you to do the surgery So that is a one aspect of the medical legal which is persistent now What has happened the CCM has come there are 58 surgeries They say with the two years of training I read I will do that is starting from eye surgery So another starting from the abdominal surgery is the most difficult Galbladder surgery and there is some surgeries with the knowledge in the bone This is a three different specialty people after three years of specialization in each. We are doing that Now you are saying you are a master of all trade and you do not have an undergraduate basis And you just had a two-year stint and that we do not have a proper System in your system, but you are adopting them then if you are going and operating that and who is going to take care who is going to be the Medical legal how much more cake more Complications it will come and how the court is going to interpret on that So when the CCM is giving that it is not only the right there must be some duties and responsibilities should be also Now our council of medical council of India says and if you are not doing this and there is some Complications you are bound to punish, but now the it is a open license They are giving you can do a surgery and suppose a person is coming to up with the abdominal problem And you are you are permitted to do up and descending but on opening the abdomen I find some other disease is there and what should I do? There is no guidance So should I close the abdomen and send the others? So all this will be raised to medical another important issue will be the degree which is going to be given to the MMS So MMS general surgery for a modern medicine that is a well-known degree now another MMS degree is coming Now how the people are going to identify that if a person is going to sue that I couldn't identify that this person is A modern medicine person or Ayurveda person. So that is also going to be upheld by the court. So we cannot cheat the public We cannot Give a wrong impression to the public So if at all they want to do trained in the surgery let them get trained adequately three years and let them call their degree In their Ayurvedic term there's Shailiya and Shailiya Tandra or the languages they use in Ayurveda let them put that like that and MMS when they put as a General surgeon that is going to make a wrong image in the society that will result in a lot of medical legal cases and responsibilities in the days to come Sir another important terminology which you have used in the MMS statement is the imposing of mixopathy and I have called for public demonstrations against this particular mixopathy and You have called for the withdrawal of non-essential services including the non-covid non-covid services also So your if you are confident about your own service Why do you want to obtain from the service and voicing against the guidelines of the orders? Yeah, which we all should understand. That is why we are opposing mixopathy So I am practicing modern medicine. It has a certain principles. Ayurveda has certain principles You know me as a certain principles and Homi apathy has a certain principles And when each system has to grow because each system has contributed great to the country development So we are respecting each system each system has to grow individually means as they have to get trained within that They have to specialize in that this human body is so much a complicated one We need to get specialized in that just in the sake of naming that we want everyone to become a doctor So we mix everything and make one system. You cannot make see if it's all just small example of a driver That's where driver is cannot be a comment You cannot make a driver a person who drive auto to drive a flight Yeah, a pilot has to train in a different way Yeah, auto driver has to be trained in a different way the bus driver has to be trained Just because I have known how to drive an auto. I cannot go and drive the flight So equally if you know all over the you practice modern medicine Then that is going to make thing you think of a mixing if you want a water you mix with an Milk you add milk You know what up to the milk the milk the quality of the milk will come down The virulence the the effectiveness will be coming down when you are mixing with something which is Mixing equal things it is fine when you are mixing an unequal things and different concepts different things and you cannot do that And similarly the government is saying that this we are doing with the one system and one nation and one system How is it possible in our country our country is a multi-linguistic language? Can you make one one nation one language our country is having male and female? Can you say that is we cannot be male and female there? Can you only one system and When this kind of things is not possible see the isolated growth of each system is going to be necessary for our individual and tomorrow if I train Why even in your post in our colleges you have a professor of history you have a professor of max You have a professor of science. We say that no all professors are saying all language you study all subject you study Then come and teach it is not possible. Similarly Modern medicine has voluminous of subjects and I'm either as Rick either they all have a law that's Vedic literature So individually they have to study one person going to study everything and come a master of great for all It's not going to be a practical. It is only going to hamper the growth of individual system. That is why we are particular We are not against Ayurveda system. We are not against sitha system. Let it grow individually let it grow uniquely and everyone can Compliment each other in the treatment model and the right of the individual in the public health is a right of individual and Individual has to choose. I need a modern medicine or I need Ayurveda medicine And he must have the opportunity to treat and he must have a specialized doctors in that not Mixing it is going to the hamper the growth and it is as I said earlier It is going to hamper and invert the name of for modern medicine in across the globe With all these issues has came behind why the Irish ministry is pushing behind Such kind of guidelines. Do you find any political rationale behind? These moves. Yes as I have said earlier, this is the policy which they have they always try to say That's a one system and if you see the national education policy, which has been proposed or the Nidhi Iyok which has proposed the four committees and their vision and their policy is integration and De-sacralize the modern medicine So they they say even their philosophy says that modern medicine tendons the chemical materials to be used So we do not want to have a modern medicine. We are going back to the Ayurveda. That is well and good So when you say that it is a traditional medicine So we want to follow certain other traditions of India should be also not forgotten in the olden days We never had a Supreme Court or the High Court. You had only Katta Panjai So when you have a legal system, you can go back the traditional Katta Panjai When you want to say the whether there is a storm or the rain is going to come We used to see only the Panjangam or the old old traditional books and we never use the meteorological methods to say that So let us forget about that and they can take the older system of that and people always Walk across the country to Go from one area to other area the modern modern science only brought in aero flight and flight and other things And yes, we will go back to the traditional system That is a misconception on which these policies have been formulated. The misconceptions are there to stimulate Certain open policy and I must go and as an I mean otherwise person of Indian Medical Association. I must also go. There are equally we have in India 480 modern medicine colleges Equally, there are more Ayurveda colleges. These Ayurveda colleges the tech of the individuals are very less The the public do understand and they do not there is no competition if you see for a Neat exam and many people in the They couldn't score neat or not able to enter into the modern medicine system What they now feel even if you fail in neat no problem You come through the Ayurveda through the back door injury you can enter into the medical profession Modern medicine profession as a lateral entity that is what the modern medical education policy has been that is only to Yeah A piece the certain people a piece or the benefit certain people this policy has been taken So we we are not against the CCM decision. This is only a tip of the iceberg Our Indian Medical Association is totally against this policy of one system one nation in our country in In medical education, they can use that for various other purpose if they want But it is not possible to use in the medical education So we want and we are we have appealed. We are given adequate In materials to the government to study Women has assured us that they will reconsider the policy But I'm not sure then how it is going to come But Indian Medical Association determined to fight till we get a positive result talking about the unscientific measures in the past five to six years After the present Government which came into power We have you know seen lot of recommendations by even by the union ministers on the use of cow dung cow urine and other kind of materials for You know curing diseases Do you think that there is a total Collapse in the system or a total problem with the approach of the present Now It is I mean well planned well determined steps to take India back to the stone age And when you are going to talk about that Cow dung or whatever it is we are not saying no or we are not we are against it Everything in this world can be accepted. Well, even it is an evidence to this you do appropriate research You do appropriate study on that and prove to the scientific world and it is effective and everyone is going to accept that Just because it is said in the Vedic literature or just because it is said thousand years ago That cannot become a truth in this country and this year Because today is the world where it is based on an evidence-based medicine So, I mean vice repeatedly talking like this It is going to only damage the reputation of our country. I must even confront the Ayurvedic Ayush minister Minister of Ayush when he had a corona He he had a treatment with modern medicine He had uh, there are many many top people in the the government today When they had a problem when they had medical issues They always get a modern medicine treatment and only to only to appease their Public or the population or the World bank and they used to say that we are talking about tradition. We are talking about the traditional system And we we welcome that you talk about that but you do some some exclusive research on that By mixing it with the modern medicine you are in fact, you are killing the Ayurveda also You are degrading Ayurveda also Anyone who has what he had as a possession as a great thing an important thing You will never try to grab it from others when the moment of Ayurveda says that we need the The anaesthesia and other drugs other system other equipments from modern medicine That means they do not have that in their system Then why should we they have a college for that? Like all the colleges we converted into the modern medicine college and all the doctors we converted into the modern medicine doctors and it will become easier And another another thing they say that we are promoting Ayurveda because there is no Doctor in this country. That is also a false myth They are always saying every year in India 90,000 medical students are coming out passing in mdbs And india do not have that much of need of doctors today, especially in south india There are few states in north india. There is shortage of doctors. It is not that number of doctors are not there It is the failure of the governance. They are not ready to appoint the doctors They are not ready to give infrastructure for the doctors in the schools. That is the reason why there is apparently There is some shortage of doctors in the southern north state But take any south india any maharastra. There is not not even single pac in our state Is without a doctor. So that much again that to false propaganda They are using that there is no Doctor so they we are producing Ayurveda and that is also going to be we have to go and all the statistical evidence We have also said from Indian medical association. If the government is willing, please give us a list What are the areas you are not having doctors? We have four lakhs Doctors as a mumbai is in our association. We can supply any number of doctors to any part of the country So there is no response from the government. So it is not that lack of doctors It is only the lack of governance or lack of the mindset which is the result they apparent the The fallacy which has been created that the doctors are not in the rural areas. Thank you, sir for joining us. Thank you. Thank you