 Okay, good morning and thank you for joining in for our class week six. Thank you to all those who join in through the e-learning portal who watch the video and respond. Thank you everyone for being here. Let's just start with a word of prayer and we'll get ready into class. Heavenly Father we thank you that you have allowed us to see another day. Thank you for your mercy for your grace over us. Thank you God that you shower every good thing for us. Thank you for the cross. Thank you Lord for showing us God that all things come from you. We pray that we will walk in faith Lord all the days of our life. We submit our class today. We pray God even as we start a new chapter on skills. We pray that you will empower us equip us in bringing up ways and learning ways of how we can connect and make people feel loved, cared, understood, as well as challenge them Father. Thank you for teaching us through these through these days we ask that you be with us in Jesus name. Alright so welcome once again just quickly to to bring about a recap of what we did the last week we went through the stages in the counseling process over the week last week as well as the week before we started off in talking about the three stages. We spoke about the stage of exploration. We broke that down and saying when we begin to explore we're also looking at assessing different areas of counseling life as well as getting to the second part of identifying what the problem is. So we take time to identify the problem and as we're doing that we're also helping to identify the certain goal that they that they do a certain I mean what is the goal that we can ascertain through the behavior that is being shown and helping the counseling to come in to understand and to recognize their beliefs or the thinking that that will further show us what are the strategies that underline that problem. We also spoke about how through that stage we assist the counseling to personalize their problem and so thereby when they personalize their problem they also attempt to personalize their goal. The second stage we looked into was understanding self understanding where the new goal the counseling is helped to change these problem causing beliefs and come into further new goals. It's a process of process of re changing or disputing challenging their wrong beliefs and replacing it with something that is new something that is in tune with the word of God in harmony with the word of God. And also during that time to enable them to discover their feelings help them to face it help them to discover newer ways of how they could express their negative feelings which which is in a way spiritually which is in a way helpful and also see how these changes can reflect in their thinking their feeling as well as their behavior so that you have a commitment in the divide areas of functioning we spoke about. And the last is action taking action where you're initiating interventions initiating different ways of how counseling could solve their problems and also helping them to implement implement those steps and finally a way of termination is what we looked into. So even through these these stages so this is what generally happens through a counseling process. Now in order for this to happen. The even as the counselor helps the counseling go through these different stages. There are certain skills that the counselor requires to enable the counseling to go through these three different stages. You may not expect that the counselor will do stage one stage two stage three without a guideline or a direction from a counselor and that's that's exactly what the counselor is. Next up is also all about the counselor using certain skills to bring the counseling to a place of understanding to a place of action. So that's what our next chapter chapters are going to be. And I'm on page 30 and we're going to be looking at these different kind of skills that a counselor needs to use to help the counseling move through these three stages through these processes. Once we have done with the counseling process I will show you you know I will bring about a diagram that helps you understand how how with the with the counseling counselor using these these different skills how a counseling is moved from one stage to another the stage of exploration understanding and action. So we will go through the entire skills or what are the skills that a counselor needs to be used through this process we'll go through that and once we're done with that I will show you a diagram that will help you understand that will put these two together the stages as well as the skills it will put this together for you to know that it's as important for us as counselors to be well to understand these skills to learn how to work with these skills so that the the best outcome happens through the counseling process the therapeutic relationship is a lot more tighter when you do that okay. So we're going to be looking at the first skill which is attending skills kind of give me a minute I'll just ensure that I put on and just share the yeah okay so the first skill that we are going to be looking at is the attending skills. Now before we get to understand what what these skills are this is what we call as something that we call as the micro skills what what before we understand each of these skills in place. We did see that the strength of the relationship between the counseling relationship or the therapeutic relationship is actually the quality and strength of the connection between the counselor and the counseling. Okay, so what does the all of counseling consists of these two things the way the counselor relates with the counseling and vice versa the way the counselor relates with the counselor. So it is in the midst of this relationship that change that intervention that exploration happens without a strengthening of this relationship you could you could probably assess that counseling may not be as effective. You would have probably seen or heard of people who who've told you that you know they're they haven't had a good counseling experience right and some of this could be as a result of the relationship that is there so the relationship between the counselor and the counseling. So all counseling relationships do consist of these two relationships a counselor's relationship with the counseling as well as the counselor's relationship with the counselor. So what do you how does this pan out it really shows you the the kind of interactions that happen in building this quality relationship is extremely important within within counseling. Okay, so it's just not the content that we are looking for but it is something more which is what we call the micro skills. Now when we're looking when we understand this word called micro skills we're saying that the the skills that the counselor employs in which the movement where there is movement for the counseling is what is what what is really matters. So the micro skills which is what we're going to be learning is that are those things are those skills that the counselor employs to bring about movement for the counseling through the process in counseling. So that's why understanding these micro skills are very important. So let's let's just look at what do we mean by by micro skills. Now let me give you an example. Okay, suppose you're driving and the engine of your car has stopped. What would you need to get it working again. Let's suppose you're not someone who knows too much about cars. I mean you can open the bonnet and look at it that that's that's as much as you can do. You may see smoke coming but more than that you have no idea what you would want to what you do. So if your car broke down what would you need to get it working again. So one you may need to take it to someone who's killed to work on the care of your car. You may require the right kind of tools to open the engine to fix some loose wires or parts or take away the battery and add in something. So you need certain tools. And third you would you will need to activate certain some form of condition. Like maybe you need to change your car battery or you need to add distilled water or take your car through a conducive condition to get it to start working. So there are different things. You need someone who's killed. You need tools and you also need some some good conditions. Now counseling similarly counseling is when people come who are hurting those who are hurting and we need to use certain skills. Okay. There are certain foundational skills that are needed when you're counseling somebody. Okay. There may be certain tools that that is that brings about the success of of of what of the outcome. Okay. It also requires that there may be certain conditions that help them to open up and get involved in the process. So there may be certain condition where that looking internally happens or personalizing the problem happens. So just like any other situation even in counseling. That's that's why you know be careful when lay counselors take up cases because sometimes we go without skills. We think we do inherently have those skills but but we may we may not we may not know how to use them. So it's important to have skills. It's important to have good tools and have an environment that is conducive to this conducive to the to the to the building up of the relationship. Now why why should we have these skills you know is why is it why is it enough that you know when someone comes with a problem we just tell them how to manage the problem and send them away. Well that's like like we mentioned counseling is not about giving them advice right it's about helping them to be able to come up with understanding and and and a way of working in an action point for themselves. So why is this used why should the micro skills why are micro skills necessary. So counseling micro skills are generally when you look at specific skills that one that a counselor can use to enhance communication. There are some things that you need to enhance your communication right and these skills what do they do they enable to effectively build a good working relationship with the counseling and engage them in a discussion or in a conversation that is not just helpful but also meaningful. So when you look at micro skills they are observable actions of the counselor they are things that you will see the counselor do that will have a positive change in the session. Through active listening where both the counselor and the counselor are engaging in right. So they these skills are something that you will notice that a counselor is doing intentionally in order one to build a good relationship and also to engage the counseling in a conversation that can be meaningful and helpful. So you use it you you're actually doing what you're doing is you're actually learning a new way of communicating or a more intentional way of communicating as you do this. Okay what I want to do I'm going to be I'll show you a video first of maybe a first clip first part of the clip and then later maybe at the end of the class I'll show you the better way that how it's done. And after the video I'd like you to observe and tell me what are some of the things that you notice that the counselor is being disastrous in. So let me just put that video up. Okay is everybody able to see this. Yes. Okay. All right. Diane how are you it's good to see you. Okay. Yeah I'm okay I just wanted to come in and talk to you today about a new issue that that I had come up with my husband. And basically it seems like every time I try to plan. Excuse me. Every yeah go ahead. Every time I try and plan like time together between the two of us he'll go off and do something else that you know it's just totally irrelevant like he'll go and play his games or he'll start texting with a friend or he'll start watching a movie. And it's gotten to the point where I really am starting to question does he value our time together especially if he's just engaging in all these tasks that are completely. Excuse me. Excuse me just a second. Okay it's my phone. Okay. Oh my gosh I have a text message. Yeah just one second. Okay yeah it was just right in the middle of telling you that story but I guess that can wait that's really important. Thanks I'll just leave my phone here just in case another one comes in. Okay. Yeah okay. And I should. Well maybe I should leave it here. Maybe I should kind of leave it here. Okay. No but actually you know I think I really I might be expecting an important call from my daughter. So I doubt that it'll come in while we're talking but just in case. Okay. Was this a good time to schedule my appointment? Oh yeah. Yeah of course. Okay so like I was saying I'm having issues with him with us being able to connect in our free time and it seems like he's just not prioritizing that. And I don't really know what to do about this. Are you kind of warm? I am a little warm but I'm okay. Thanks. You're comfortable. Do you want to take your jacket off? No I'm good thank you. I'm really trying to turn down this heat but I'm quite sure how to do it. It's okay. Yeah. Okay so what do you think you noticed that the councillor was doing that yeah maybe let's look at first what the councillor was doing and then we reflect on what did you notice of the councillor? I think the councillor needs the councillor. Okay. All right. Okay. What else did you notice? The behaviour of the councillor was disturbing. Yes. Okay. Yeah what? Yes. Yes the bear. Go ahead. Yeah the impression that she was giving is the councillor what she's saying and the person was like she's not, she's not of primary importance like the impression that oh you're not that important but the call is important, my comfort is important. Even that appointment time that is given to her exclusively even that that her time is not respected because the appointment is for her but it's not respected I feel. Okay good good. Any other observations? Yeah I think she's not giving any focus to the councillor. Okay. She's not listening just yeah it doesn't give, I mean when you go to someone and you know that they are listening that makes you to tell something. Yes. So she's not saying attention to anything not listening. Absolutely. Okay. Yeah so you what did you notice about the councillor? What did you notice? About the councillor. Yeah. I felt that she's very uncomfortable. She's trying to say something and then something has happened so even she's not able to put the current time into that. Right in fact she asked she said was this a good time to set up an appointment you know maybe I shouldn't have. So she's begun to see that the councillor is very very distracted is very not present with her. And you see how that has affected the way that she's even sharing her information and it's being cut in between right. So okay so you've noticed that good. After we go through the class I'll show you the rest of the clip part of the clip of how she is able to respond and you know how that. Actually changes. Okay. Just a minute. Can I share? Yes. Go ahead. Go ahead. I believe she was talking about the very thing that she's experiencing right. Exactly. Telling her husband is not paying attention to her. So the very thing that she is struggling with she's experiencing here again. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You will actually see that in the rest of the clip where the you know where the councillor has picked that up and she's actually saying something. So yeah we'll see that that's good. That's an excellent observation. Okay. So we're going to be looking at different microskills but today we will we will just be focusing on the skills of attending but there are other skills of responding questioning facilitating or influencing which we will look into in detail. As we move ahead. Okay. So what is the purpose of the skills now just as much as this word talks about it you know the word in itself gives you an understanding of what it means attending is to pay attention is to show that you as a councillor is interested in not just what is being said but you're also interested in the person sitting right in front of you. So when you're attending to someone in a in a way that's that's positive that's helpful. You're encouraging your client or your councillor to talk and it shows it shows very clearly that the councillor has a certain interest in in what is happening in the life of the of the councillor. So the purpose of attending skills is to encourage your councillor to talk to to bring them to a place or give them a certain environment that helps them to open up that helps them to really share what they are going through. Okay. Now when are these attending skills used it's used throughout the entire counselling process. And it's largely important in the beginning stages of your counselling because that's when you're establishing rapport because your first impression is the best impression. So when especially right in the beginning the the councillor who's who's there is actually keenly observing to see how much of connection they are being able to build with the councillor. So this this skill of attending is is is something that that you know it's important to build and to hone even when when we are working with counsellors counsellors. Okay. Now attending skills what is it like I said it just means paying attention to so you're paying keen attention to not just what they're saying but maybe what they're doing maybe also what they're not implying. You're paying very very keen personal attention to that. Now attending skills can we can break it down into three and we're going to be looking at it in these three different aspects. Okay. Attending non verbally and verbally you are you attend by listening and you also attend by observing. So when you're looking at paying paying somebody or paying something attention. There are these three focus points it's just not it's just not the words that you use. Okay. It's also your body language maybe the way that you're sitting the way that you're looking at someone the way that you're conducting yourself the way that you listen and the way that you observe. So all of this when it's been connected together they really help the counsellor feel that the person is interested. So let's begin with this and slowly begin to unpack. So the first one is attending non verbally and verbally. So if you're looking at attending behavior as we saw it's defined as where a place or a way to support your counselling with individual and culturally appropriate cues. Okay. So it needs to be individually appropriate. It needs to be culturally also appropriate. Now what do we mean by individually appropriate is there are a lot of times you can see you may be able to notice how you're the individual the person sitting next to you the counsellor sitting next to you. Kind of behaves like for example you know a counselling may come to you not really making complete eye to eye contact. They may be for whatever reason and we're not we're not going to look into why they are that way we're just saying maybe they can't make eye to eye contact they're always looking down. Right. And they're talking in and just little by little they may give you a glance. Now attending behavior I've got to be careful how I attend to this person. Now generally when we know in counselling is when you're attending you have good eye to eye contact. Right. Now this person this individual who's sitting in front of you if you're going to keep you know just keep your eyes focused on them throughout like that they can have they can feel uncomfortable. Right. So depending on what you are seeing the the individual do you also kind of change your attention. So like for example when they're looking down you're also got maybe a lower glance and then quickly look up when they're looking up right just to ensure that you're not making them uncomfortable or it should be culturally appropriate. Like in some cultures maybe you know looking directly could mean like as if you're staring you know as if you are you're you're really peering into their soul. Right. So that also is is you you get a certain feedback from your counselling themselves in the way that you need to attend. So you're basically helping to follow the cues appropriate cues from the counselling itself. So it is to support your counselling with appropriate cues. Okay. So it can be visual. So that's why it includes three V's which is visuals which is vocal, verbal and body language. So they're known as the three V's and the B. The visual eye contact or the vocal quality or the kind of verbal tracking that you may use and your body language. Now these aspects emphasize that remember that we live especially when we are looking you know let's say and I'd like to speak for where I'm from where we're from in an Indian culture. We have we have a real multicultural clientele that comes. Okay. And there may be certain actions gestures or things we may not see we may not things that we say or do may not be appropriate in all cultures or situations. Right. Like for example, a handshake. Right. Not everyone in maybe our Indian culture are used to the handshake maybe a lot more younger generation people may be used to the handshake. There may be some who say Namaste or you know kind of bend down and say so being careful as to how you initially also great so you need to be aware of what is culturally appropriate for your counselling. If you're not aware of this. Yeah, you know, sometimes it can either make or it can break an interview so it's always better if you're not sure to maybe ask. Right. And it's perfectly fine to ask that. So being careful of how you use these different these different skills. Okay. So in general now even as we are looking at each of them in general, let's let's remember that we need to be sensitive across the cultures. Okay. So when we look at visuals, what we're looking at is an eye contact. How do we establish good eye contact. So maintaining a good eye contact is how a professional counsellor conveys their interest. It conveys confidence. It can convey is an involvement in your counselling story. Okay. So for those counsellors who may have difficulty with closeness, making eye contact in itself can be just an important part of change. Okay. But when we're looking at eye contact, remember there should be natural breaks in your eye contact. There should be a certain ebb and flow as you're collecting your thoughts and listening to your counselling story. Remember to be careful not to stare. Okay. Just not staring. So like for example, when they're speaking or when you're saying something you can actually look away and then look back in or look onto the side and then look back in. So it's something that you learn to do as you keep going. Also what's important is notice the breaks in eye contact on the part of your counselling. Sometimes they may tend to look away when they are discussing something that is very distressing towards them. Right. So that gives you a clue. Right. That gives you a lot more. You're paying attention to what they're saying. But you're also looking at their body language in order to help you get, carry more information. Like for example, let's say they're talking about some area and they're maybe looking away at the city and sitting this way. So you can say I sense that you're extremely uncomfortable about this topic. Is that so? So you know, they get to understand that you picked up some significant distress that they're going through. Okay. So while it's excellent to maintain that eye contact when you are talking to a person, it can definitely be uncomfortable if you continue staring very intensely at them. So generally a principle that we use to break, to work through this is to break eye contact every five seconds or so. So that doesn't mean you say one, two, three, four, five. One, two, three, four, five. That doesn't mean that. Okay. But you're careful about how long you are actually keeping or maintaining that eye contact. So when you're breaking eye contact, you don't, you know, you don't, you're, what you're tending to do is that you probably look maybe a little to their side. You know, like for example, without just moving your head, you could actually put your eyes down. I mean, you're not doing this, but you could just put your eyes down. So specifically what they say is to be able to rotate from one eye to the other eye to the mouth and then one eye to the other eye so that, you know, you have like a, like a general rotation that is, that's coming up. Okay. So it's important to be able to not stare and making sure that you're also very careful in not making them uncomfortable, either by completely looking away or by completely staring at them. Okay. So when you're listening, so specifically this happens when you're listening. That's what it means by listening use the triangle. So when you're listening, you, you, the technique that you can use this, you know, to, to be able to look at one eye and then about five seconds, look at the other eye for around five seconds and then look at the mouth for five seconds and keep on rotating in this way. So when you're doing this, what, what you're also doing is through this, you're also using certain other encourages or other words. You may be, it's coupled with other listening skills, which is, you know, an agreement. You say, aha, okay. Yes. Oh, that must be hard. So the, so that's a great way to help the person to continue to talk. So it is essential to ensure that you're sensitive to this, even as you're practicing this entire skill. The next comes vocals. Okay. Vocals is the kind of voice or modulation that you use. Now, emotions are conveyed a lot frequently by your tone of voice, the pitch that you use, the pace that you use, the volume that you use. It has an effect on how maybe, you know, your counseling response emotionally to you. Okay. So for example, when you're talking about something really excited, you know, you could, the way that you said, oh, wow, that was, that's, you know, that's, that's really exciting. So you see, you know, you've used a more voice modulation, you've changed the pitch, you know, you've gotten into a different tone. But let's say they're talking about something maybe really difficult. So you could go into, I'm sorry, that must be really hard on you. So you see that, you know, depending on what they're saying, your voice can actually really create that sense of a soothing or an anxiety-regulating atmosphere for the client, for your counseling. And what you are hoping to do is it should also communicate warm. It should communicate an interest and not boredom, right? Like, oh, is that so? Oh, that must be very hard on you. Well, that's very exciting. You know, it sounds boring, even as I'm hearing it. So you use your voice as a tool for, you know, through counseling. And to be careful, because it, like I said, the emotions are very, very easily conveyed when you're speaking. I'm sure when you've spoken on the phone to someone, you can immediately understand if they're excited or not, right? But of course, there are people who can actually fake it really well. But nevertheless, there is some, a lot of information that you get by just the modulation of the voice. Next is silence. Now, silence is a very powerful tool, even in counseling. A lot of times, you know, counselors who begin to feel, oh, I should not even have a second of silence, which means if I don't say something, then, you know, it's very odd. I can't, I can't bear with silence. But let's say the person's saying something and they've stopped. You can actually wait with silence because you are hoping that they are going to say more. And when you give them enough of silence, they may, they may continue to share. Or let's say they're saying something that's maybe very painful and they've stopped. Right. And then they're crying or they've broken down. The tendency is for us to quickly say something. But allowing them that moment to maybe grieve or to cry or to feel that hurt is extremely therapeutic. So silence is an excellent tool, right? Knowing when to speak, when to sit back is a great way as you're building the skin. Okay. The other thing that you would do is what is called as verbal underlining. Verbal underlining is where you're giving vocal emphasis to certain words or certain phrases. And what does it do? It's helping to convey a sense of empathic understanding. Oh, this must be really hard for you. Right. Or you sound really excited. Right. So some things, when you're bringing it up, it works to help them. It connects with your country. There are also something that we call as encourages or minimal encourages. Now, minimal encourages are repeats of certain words or phrases. Like you're using certain problems. Like, aha, okay. Oh, yes. Oh, right. Oh, right. So all of that helps the counseling know that you are being hurt rather than when the counseling is telling you a story, you're absolutely quiet on the other end. Like they kind of probably ask you, are you with me? Or, you know, have you, did you pick up what I said? You know, because they have, they're not getting a feedback from you. So these, these vocal encourages again are extremely helpful. Okay. Next, when they're looking at verbal, you may find a little, you know, overlap here and there. Okay. Now the key verbal tracking, verbal attending skill is what we call is verbal tracking. So verbal tracking means you are following your counseling stories. So the goal is to keep the dialogue going where the counseling is the lead rather than where you as the counselor wants to go. Okay. This is specifically important, especially at the beginning of counseling, because you know, this is a period where counselors actually make their first impression of the counselor. So counselors often generally in training will begin to formulate questions in their mind regarding the stories of the counseling and actually really miss the dialogue that could be helpful in understanding the whole story. Okay. So this is, this is a place where, where you're really looking at how clients or your counseling really need to do most of the talking. So about 80% to 20% that should be taking place. So the clients do 80% and 20% is what the counselor does. So the skill here is picking up where the counselors have left off. Once your counseling spores or complete part of their stories, the counselor, you know, you must resist that temptation to ask too many questions or redirect the stories until they have had the opportunity to fully complete them. So the best way to do is to do this is to stay focused on where they left off and urge them to continue either by nodding your head or by acknowledging them or using those minimal encourages. Okay. So it helps them when you use verbal tracking, it helps them to stay on the topic which they have started and when you're seldom interrupting them or changing topics, they are able to tell you more and part a lot of part of their story. So that's why these, these three things, your verbal, vocal, as well as visual gets connected one to another as you begin to, as you're helping to attend. Okay, let me stop here. Are there any questions? Any questions or any thoughts of how you have seen it, you know, some of this work for you in your own personal experience of actually just talking to people. Now, these are excellent skills, communication, building skills, even as you're talking. Yes, Divya, go ahead. Yeah, I just wanted to ask about the silence part. So even in normal conversations, if you know the other person listening to you is silent and if you are expecting a response and there is a silence. Sometimes it creates a kind of confusion, right, as you said, like whether they got what you were trying to convey or so does that happen in the silence? That's what I was trying to understand. Okay, so even when you're using silence, you're also very conscious about the cues that you're getting from your counselling. Like, for example, they're saying a part of the story and they were abruptly stopped. That's why they were abruptly stopped. You may wait for a couple of seconds because you're waiting for them to continue, right? And you know that something has gone wrong. So you can check that. You can say, I see that you did stop. Is there something wrong? Or, you know, can I help you with something? What happened? You seem to have remembered something. So depending on the situation, if the silence is, it also matters where you're using the silence, right? So let's say they're telling the story and they were abruptly stopped. Or they've said a story and they've almost come to an end of something, right? So you use a bit of silence because like, I'll give you an example. So this council is saying, you know, I really want to manage my emotions and my thoughts very well. I really want to know how to build boundaries. But she's only said that much, okay? And then you wait, okay? Because you know that there is some story behind what she wants to tell you. But maybe this is the first time. I'm talking about this is the first time she's come to see me and she's given me these two, three sentences. Okay? And I don't have a background of a story at all. So then I waited. So what I did is give her a couple of seconds. And then I said, okay, I see that you really want to sort these two things out. Your emotions and learn how to build boundaries. Did I hear that right? She said, yes. I said, okay. And I said, okay. And I stopped. And then she said, yeah, I think you need to know a background of what I'm saying. Right? So if I had gone way ahead and said, okay, then tell me what are the emotions you feel? Now she would have gone to say, okay, I feel sadness. I feel this. I feel that. And she has not got a chance to tell me her story. But because of maybe I gave her enough time, that silence to help her to retract. Maybe she was just trying me out. She was just trying to see how comfortable can I be in talking to this person? That's what she was probably doing. Right? So when once, maybe she said, okay, that I've understood. All I did was I just reworded what she said. And so these are the two things that's even important to you. Is that right? So she said, yeah, it is. Okay. I just said that. And then she said, okay, but this, this, this. So what they're doing also in a situation would probably try to see how you're judging them. Like, this is something that often happens is maybe a counselor is crying. And they begin to feel extremely uncomfortable that they're crying. I'm so sorry that I'm broken down. I'm so embarrassed and all of that. So being silent over there is not appropriate. So being silent over there, it, it almost means like you're, you're agreeing with what your counseling just said. Right? So then I said, oh, I know that's making you uncomfortable, but you have the space and the freedom to do that. And I'm here with you as you are, as you are emoting. So please take your time. You know, if you need to cry, please take your time. I'm here with you. Right? So that something like that really may help. Or let's say your counseling is crying as well as she's saying a story. She's sobbing and she's crying and she's telling a story after story in between maybe to blow her nose or something. She stopped. You don't have to say a question that, you know, you can, you can just say, yeah, this seems, this seems hard for you. Right? Because that's encouraging her. It encourages her to maybe say something, but then I'm using just a couple of encourages to continue that and maybe then say, then adding on going ahead with, with a silence. Does that, does that help? Divya? Yes. Yes. Thank you. All right. Okay. All right. So, okay, before we get into the next slide, we will break. It's a 1049. We'll come back at 11 o'clock. We'll have a break and get back in 10 minutes.