 Thank you. We're going to call to order the meeting. The Colchester Planning Commission is 7 0 8, 7 0 2. I'm sorry, the clocks are a little off. All right. So one thing I'd like to mention if anybody comes in, we'd like you to sign in when you come in so we can have communication. Thank you very much. And now we have. That's okay. I just can't get the internet, so. There you go. That would be great. Thank you. So we have agenda considerations reserved for changes to the agenda items and order, not changing anything tonight. Comments and questions from the public, not related to anything on our agenda. All good. Anything, anything that's on supplement 44, basically, tonight and everything that has to do with East Lakeshore Drive. Yeah. Yep. Come up, give your name if you want to. I don't know if we fill this East Lakeshore Drive. I don't know if we mentioned anything. I don't remember. I know we did fencing, but we didn't do trees and landscaping that blocks. So, do we do size and placement of trees in particular? We don't want to do anything with that. We have. With the rebuilding in the zoning. You're correct. We did not address that at all. Okay. Yep. Thank you. Will we or not? Maybe in the future we can discuss that. I'm not really sure where we're at with that one. Okay, that's good. Is that okay? Absolutely. All right. So, we got our DHCA draft report view and possible action. Go in here, Roddy. I don't know if anybody does need it. I have one full copy of the draft of the report and the regulations up there. They're available to gravity like take a look through. I try to zoom in as I go through here, but just tolerate means you can't hear or see anything we're talking about. Okay. So, those of you who have been through a settlement before know that with any amendments to your regulation, you need to create a report pursuant to 4441 statute. That report addresses three things really. The impact on municipal facilities, whether or not it conforms with your town plan. What are the impacts for the public? So, that's what this report does. These are pretty short answers. They're pretty benign. I think that most of what we're talking about on these slides short has little to no impact or is neutral in terms of the effect on these three. This is your report that will be submitted to them from you, not from me. And it is submitted to them from the Planning Commission, not the Select Board. So, please feel free to edit at will if there's anything that you think that doesn't represent. Any concerns on that? It's just this thing that's kind of beyond the next item. Exactly. Good with that? Mm-hmm. Yep. There are all your dates for discussion. I think we're all good with it. Everybody's shaking heads. Yeah. Yeah? Bob and our kids. Are you ready? There is a draft of the memo. Someone needs to make a motion that we accept the amendment and adoption report as drafted to be included in the public warning and distributed accordingly. Yes, I think that. All right. Discussion? All in favor? Aye. Aye. Motion passed. So, consider a warning for public hearing amendments to the Colchester Development Regulations Supplement 44. Really, what is included here that was not included prior are a lot of the appendices, none of which have changed other than due to organization, page numbers, additional appendix that highlights every parcel that was changed in zoning designation. You did have discussion, I understand, at your last meeting about the commercial building or the commercial vehicle lengths that should be in here that's been updated. The heights of the building reflected, we talked about two, maybe three meetings ago, a 28th in the LS3. Really, I don't think, since the August 2nd meeting, there's no tax change to follow. Yep. Just compiling all of the stuff you have already for a time. Thank you, Warren. Any questions on that one? From anybody? No, I just remember seeing some typos, but I didn't really make hard to note out, so you do a final go-through. We will do that, and then we'll also have to, a lot of it will get caught with the red lining, too. It'll probably change some more. Just to clarify something, so L and N. L is the regulation for electric vehicle charging stations, and N is bicycle charging stations. Just wondering where we left them. I think we left it as to study the electric bike thing for the future, and we did not change anything for the cars. I wasn't told that they were changing. No, we didn't make changes. We decided to leave it. I think we talked about two meetings ago that we returned to all of the bicycle right there. There's a lot of room for improvement with respect to everything from what the bike rack looks like, how many should you be having, to electric bicycles as well. And with a quick little detail research right off the bat, I said we have more electrical fires from electric bikes all of a sudden now happening. I'm sorry. We now have more electrical fires, the same as the batteries on the cars. So we would have to really start getting more detailed if we just want to do that, I think. Make sure we're safe for everybody. Yeah, I'm just wondering if construction or we'll go ahead and we'll miss again an opportunity to put, you know, bike chargers in and out so people don't have to carry 50 pound bikes up two flights of stairs. I definitely would like that, but I would rather have it safe and I think a developer would be more educated before he does something that's unsafe for his property. Is there any way we can make that kind of mandatory in terms of that it's studied? We can definitely look at it again. It's the same idea as everything else. But this is at Sevens Corners, right? This one just happens to be, I think it's for everything. We did it for all the buildings. Sevens Corners is the one we focused on. Yeah, so I think one of the things we talked about a couple of meetings ago is that anything that's subject to Act 250 will have state review. So that largely is anything with over 10 units, 10 acres. Most of your larger buildings will, they will have to meet those regulations under the state energy code. We talked about Sevens Corners because given that they are in the growth center in the new town center, they are exempt from the Act 250 review. And so this could have been a loophole where something would have fallen through. That's why maybe you're thinking Sevens Corners specifically, but most other large buildings will be subject to the state code, which will require most of that to have bicycle chargers and car chargers. I'm not sure on the bicycle standards, to be honest with you. Phyllis wanted to have, you want an input on that? Yeah, just sorry guys. I just wanted to just find out when we're dealing with the electrical systems and for bikes and cars, no matter what. In specific divisions. We're working with L3F, we're working on all these different divisions. On Eastlake Shore Drive, I don't see that we need these. Unless the rental home, people are renting out line for their customers. But most of us are residential, so we have our own rental. So I don't see any of this big stuff, like you're saying, like Sevens Corners, need a car. Good. It's perfect. Thank you. We are talking about Sevens Corners. She just wanted to make sure. We're good. Perfect. So again, my concern is that construction will happen and there'll be an opportunity that's missed because we don't have some regulation in that would require bike chargers. I think we did. I think you're right. But I think, maybe I'm wrong. If anybody here wants to chime in, I think where our decision was to err on the side of caution and not make a decision on that. So we left it as is. That's how, that's... She just wanted to find it. Do you have that? Come on up. Rick Davie, East Lakes Shore Drive. There is no standard for bicycle chargers. So that's going to be the major stumbling block. That's why, like, a lot of the electric rental bikes, they take them back at night, charge them, bring them back. They don't have a standard plug that they can charge into. But I'm wondering if we can establish a standard. That would be a national thing, I would think, but... So you could. I think that the discussion I'm just remembering that the discussion that we had a few weeks ago was this is something that would take a little bit of research and some language to put together and it's up to you as to whether or not you want to delay the rest of the regulations while we work on this or save it for the next one. There's probably some great language out there that I could bring to you for consideration. If you want to do that. I don't think we should... You're delaying everything else. It's your fault. There is language I could bring to you. Yeah. Well... I don't think we should hold on to all the work we've gotten to to get to this point to start talking about the bicycles. I mean, it's a great idea and an interesting thought process but we've worked pretty hard to get to where we are to move this forward on a lot of things to back the fellow. Yep. Yeah, I have to say I'm still on board with that moving forward. I'm on board with moving forward but I feel like I've been bringing this up for a long time. I'm just concerned about wiring and wires being run and not being able to... having to tear off a sidewalk or something because we didn't act on this. I mean, electric bikes and electric vehicles are the future. That is a 10-year status of future and I don't want to hold this up but I would like to figure out a way that we could have this conversation very soon in the future. We can definitely address it again. Okay. I'm sorry guys, I had to do a really hard review of this. Yeah, I saw that. Not doing anything for me. You're with me. Quite close. I was just going to say something because most of my neighbors now have the solar on their roof. When they put those in they ask if they like the additional plug-ins and a car so I've got two makers that have the solar and the car plugs so it is definitely up to the economy. It is totally the future. Like with Sarah how we protect ourselves from the future we're not sure what we'd like to. Alright, thanks. Were you guys able to look at the other pieces? The heights, do they reflect where you want it to be? The commercial vehicle length? If I can. I just went back to the red. Do we adjust it again? We've read the others enough. When is a good time to chat? I'll take only a few. Right now. Come on up. So from last week's from the last draft it was 25 feet and I brought up the point why LS1 is 20 feet and you said well you wanted to get allow a little bit more height so now it's 28 feet which will allow definitely allow a full two-story building with a little pit roof. I want to go backwards to about character and why we're doing this and following the town master plan is about character. I think at one point it sent a letter to everybody about the number of one-and-a-half story homes that are there now that if we replace with two-story blockhouses we'll definitely change the character. So I would rather see it stay at 25 feet which I believe is a compromise and allow the people to get creative architecturally with one-and-a-half story dormers they'll still be able to get nearly two stories but the roof will be lower in doing that and if we allow 28 feet it's just going to be allow that two-story block house. Correct. Yep. Okay. Thank you. Yep. Peter Mungin, 71 Jason Drive and I apologize Kathy and I know you were your first meetings but I've been extremely busy this summer and not been able to attend the more recent ones and so I'm just curious how was the 40 44 was LS LS2 LS4 and 28 for LS3 how did you come to that decision? Okay. Go ahead. Sure. We had a few conversations on this and as today we played out 25 was in the draft for a little bit I think 20 was even in some draft at some point and the direction was to allow a full two stories out the street we measure as you may know a height of building from the average pre-construction grade so most of the homes on the base side of East Lakeshore are going to start below the road because of how we measure and the in doing 25 feet I think as today's pointed out doesn't get you to full stories you really need 10 feet you've got the foundation, you've got the 10 feet you've got a little bit of room between and then we measure to the pitch of a roof the peak so 27 and a half was a number that came up in a lot of the literature that I found about some of the floor plans for a pitched roof it was 12 on 6th grade or 12 you mean the majority of it was probably 612 612 sorry so with a pretty standard pitched roof you could get a full two stories with a pitched roof in about 27 and a half feet that's where the commission conversation went but it all started with the direction to have two stories no more so a lot of these properties it'll probably result in three because you don't have a walkout basement this is the way of the average measure the average pre-construction grade right from there so a walkout basement story so where does your base level begin starting at 28 feet so your average pre-construction grade so again these are for rebuilds so when you take the four corners and you average that point this will require an engineer to complete that and then the average of that is where you're starting from some cases it could be a few feet below sort of the road grade in some cases it's a little closer most of your flat lots it's pretty obvious where that is but here you know I've seen at least a few that I've seen come in in the past 10 months or so most of them are about half the story down where you start measuring so the the decision was made for 28 for LS 3 but 44 LS 4 across the street why the differential why aren't they at 28 for the same number of stories that's absolutely because on the lake side they wanted to keep things so it wasn't this massive houses all in a row it blocks out everything so we wanted to keep the character a little less big time I guess so you're very concerned about the view from the people the residents are very concerned about it you assigned this 12 foot delta correct so on the other side of the road we decided that you're not going to be obstructing a view but if you're building on the other side you definitely want as much lake as you can see right this gives you an opportunity to have one side of the road lots of lake view right on the lake he's going to have lake view either way this gives him an opportunity to have two floors bedrooms with views kitchens with views and I can see that situation being applicable when you're at the same level between LS 3 and LS 4 where you would want 40 on the non lake side and 28 on the lake side what do you do in the situation where the building or the base level is already 20 feet a delta of 20 feet higher than on the base side than on the water side so they're already in terms of maintaining that 12 foot delta for the folks across the street to be able to see they've already got a 20 foot delta so why wouldn't you allow that delta to be your your set value ok this individual already has 20 feet above the individual on the water side why can't they come up to still maintain that 12 feet you know delta correct I don't think we wanted the congested look I don't think we also wanted the congested look of all these big buildings on the lake side that was another concern people like the cottage look so we kind of made a compromise here of how to get that look it's a give and take you're right it's not all for the visual on LS4 it's also just for the straight visual of driving by the aesthetics of the whole that side of the road it's all played in it's not a perfect world we have to make compromises that's the best we got wasn't that part of the outreach we had the activities that's what came down to was lowering the scale on LS3 you mentioned the themes that came from those outreach yeah it was part of you know the two very strong things that came out of it one that didn't surprise me was about the heights on the bay side and that we had any sort of outreach I personally was a little surprised that the outreach you asked about the non-bay side was that there was no concern or less concern over there so I think that where the commission ended up was a reflection of less concern and almost no concern on the non-bay side part of the reason we helped those outreaches was about especially that side we hurt so little that was definitely a theme that came out of it yeah absolutely I think that's what was there for R2 to begin with that was the height, that area so we left it in place it's important to represent what's in the R2 and again this applies to not only new construction renovations correct the 28 yeah I mean renovations that would extend the height and obviously if you already have a 40 foot building or a 36 foot building you're not required to chop it off because you're putting a small addition on but if you did put a larger addition that part of the addition would be able to exceed the 20 and again it's from the average foundation height the average pre-construction grade yeah a little hard to tell when you're doing the addition there's no six much of that but there's good diagrams and regulations about that yeah and given the ones I've seen in recent months it's a pretty straightforward calculation and I'm not going to really argue about it too much yet okay alright thank you yep come on up sorry that's alright I know it's not to be addressed in this draft but what about LS1 and LS2 in the 20 foot height for those zones for the residential 20 foot height you're right I'm not going to address that one I know but is that something that's going to be looked at in the future because go back and look at what we've done to see if it works LS all of these are especially with the sewer pipe they will probably have changes in the future because we're not exactly sure what's going to happen we envision what we hope is going to happen but we'll turn out exactly that way you got one standard here and another standard there and it's basically the same type of we had a lot of community output to tell you the truth and I think it's what the residents wanted it's the property orders wanted we listened to everybody I think the groups coming out for that one is even larger than we had here to tell you the truth it's a lot of people living there what they wanted and that's what we reflect I think the consensus was we didn't really do outreach that included LS1 and LS2 it would be a little bit disingenuous to sort of make too many changes I totally agree I was just wondering if there was thought process of in the future oh for sure and all parts of town we're always looking definitely a few things that came up in your conversation anything else on that one we still okay with the 28 I'm okay with the 28 yeah we had to be flexible we have to change in the future but it's a start do you think you're good so we're all good on that one still we ended up with a 20 foot total and a 10 foot height 16 feet 18 feet in line we talked about 20 feet because I had looked at and that would just restrict it to like one manufacturer basically 17 and a half feet and without having an extended cab there's some that was like 19 feet 6 inches so it seemed to be logical to increase that to 20 feet to allow different manufacturers we kept the height at 10 which is perfect get over that you're getting to big box trucks these are just kind of large size large size vans I came for you tonight so you don't have to adjust your yes we did that with the other one the number of rooms in the ends 16 to 20 correct so we'll look at that one I couldn't out another 30 months thank you are you still looking at the commercial that one doesn't have your edges that was the next good so now we're looking for the rooms the number of rooms in the end yes I believe that's in definitions yep 20 is it all good any other concerns for supplement 44 alright ready for motion let's accept the draft yeah let's accept the draft language use that motion to warn planning commission public hearing on September 20th 2022 the proposed amendments to the Colchester development regulations known as supplement 44 and as reviewed and considered amended the evening of August 16th 2022 second discussion all in favor aye motion passes very good okay all of that will be warned public hearing any encourages I welcome to do that in writing in advance either directly or with myself I do always encourage anything especially before you have it in writing in reference to the actual public hearing perfect planning commission meeting schedule which will involve supplement 44 it's pretty good so schedule so you now have a public hearing for the 20th that is your second meeting in September your second regularly scheduled meeting your first regularly scheduled meeting would be the 6th I'm putting it out there I'll continue if you want to have a meeting and if so you'll have to tell me what you want on it I think we're good have anybody been prepared I think we're good that'll give you plenty of time to get up I didn't even pick up a tomato that's growing at you far away that's not why right to the 20th cancel your September 6th meeting yep we skip in the 6th go right to the 20th I get some time to finish everything up make sure you get all the typos Labor Day weekend yeah we're good so the next question for you you have the 20th that's the public hearing there will be nothing else on that agenda except that I think I also have an energy report from the town manager's office to share with you that we're other than that we're going to keep it to just the public hearing yep September 27th would be a delivery of that supplement assuming that you take action on the 20th you don't have to but should you take action on the 20th to approve it it would be to send that to the select board their very next meeting would be the 27th I encourage at least one person I'll be there probably to to attend to represent the planning commission to deliver it at they wouldn't have a public hearing that night of course they may just accept it they may take questions they may talk about it all the way through but it's important for them to receive it that night if they take any action it would be to warn it for an October hearing if they choose to take that action given the newspaper warning dates and all of our legal requirements it would be an October 25th select board public hearing yep with that in mind moving along on my little dots here October 4th is your regular planning commission meeting I would encourage you to figure out if you'd like to have a meeting then if you think about that between now and September the 20th of course I think obviously if you have not taken action on the 20th that they didn't probably have a good life for you at your regular meeting you can decide to continue from the 20th so I guess what I'm saying is hold your social calendar but there's certainly not much new business for you I don't think that you've shared that you'd like to get this sort of packed away a little more before you open up something new does that still seem accurate? yep you know the same thing with the 18th you'll still be ahead of where the select board would be in their public hearing so consider what you'd like to do there we could start to kick off it could be a good meeting to talk about we're getting into the details but agenda setting I have a fourth of the 18th I encourage you to do some agenda setting project prioritization there were some things that you did kick from spring to the fall take some final action on what you'd like yeah nothing new has come in for your review no new zoning amendment requests you know we talked about twice a year spring and fall I don't have anything that's come in as I say that I'll get a fourth tomorrow I don't have anything at this time for that you know same thing select board public hearing on the 25th it would be good if one or two people I will of course be there as well answer the questions represent the select board and then we're into November we're all going to be wearing sweaters so what's your time? sure yes I think so so I'm just wondering like those times that we're not meeting as a select board when should we be meeting and what with those agendas yeah I think you know going for my 11 months of experience with you you did have a presentation by the town manager's office last fall for the annual energy report we received that I think we took a vote to accept it again some questions talked about it but I think that most of the proactive work is usually done by staff members and then there's direction or relation to anything that's in the capital plan so I do have a report that I'm going to and I think we'll follow that up with maybe a presentation on the town manager's office can we just get an update where we are I'll definitely have an update for you I actually got it today but I couldn't put it on your agenda without proper warning so I have at least a written report and then you guys could read it so I'll have that on for the 20th you guys could read it and determine whether or not you want to have a member of the staff present it to you the 20th the 20th, a little bit after the public hearing yeah after the public hearing because the public hearing is going to take time that's going to be the whole read through and public hearings have to be held at a time certain so we'll do it after okay no that's good I don't know how much to present to you at night but I have a memo for you to read and then you could determine hey I'd really like to know more about this have somebody talk to us about it if you like anything else Kathy do we have some minutes to go over quickly by way of staff notes I just want to alert you that our department is now short one member of our staff has left us we will be advertising soon so just but I ever need to ask you guys this but I do appreciate as we do have a short staff during a very busy time of the year for us so it's a high permitting time for the summer usually and we'll be reaching out so if you know anybody great send in my way the job should be posted very soon can we just clear up the dates that we're not meeting so I think you just decided to skip September 6 so you can remove that you were going to hold October 4 but I think the direction was no meeting unless something came out of the select order receipt that was where somewhere you continued to public hearing for anyway but you would hold it not joining the pickleball league but there may not be a meeting it sounds like October 18th maybe a good time to have a meeting to talk about maybe some scheduling we'll keep it light and it'll just be prioritization of projects the things that we talked about before like performing as code and anything else that you really are feeling strongly you want to start to work on and part of your next supplement there's always another supplement and you're going to get right into it so for the 18th I think I'll be out of the state is there any way I could just listen in on Zoom not I don't need to participate but if I could just listen into the meeting that's not too much trouble no we probably still do it with Zoom we just don't turn the camera on so it's still probably the easiest way okay thank you all good thank you you need a motion for a minute I'll make a motion to adjourn no immersion for a minute oh for a minute yeah that's right make a motion for a minute I wasn't here for the last meeting so I can't do anything for a minute I need a second we'll discuss it alright now we need to now we need to discuss it was to clarify that it was not a short order restaurant that I wanted okay you could just take I mean you don't need to have to take it up I just want to clarify it was just a restaurant or a small restaurant but not short order I think by saying it here that puts it onto the record okay great thank you alright all in favor bye now I'll make a motion to adjourn hold on you all good okay you need a second second all in favor bye meeting's adjourned it's always I'm always Bob