 Siniwa kwa siya kwa kwa ni senqirande n手 ulamia iniswa mwa kwa wanikunia kwa kwa wanikunia. Uwe kwa wajad na wa wajan i sezade kwa wajat na wajakunia. Siniwa kwa kwa ni senguaya. Wajad nahubutia na mwa kwa na. Uwajaka kwa wajad ni senqirande na kompa zisha na kwenya na wajakunia ngatiaa na wajakunia kwa wanikunia. Mwa ni senqirande Faith. Sama ni senqirande na kompa zisha na kwenya. Sintiwa kwa nanu kwa wanikuna hindi nafu ni senqirande na kwenya. Are you unemployed? What are you doing to get a job? Is it stressing you? Do you feel like your desire to get a job is giving you what we call depression? Are you depressed? And do you know someone who is going through this particular season of life? To help us in this discussion, I am with M.D. Jiru. He is a M.D. Jiru, the artist. Right. I believe in him. Kabisa. Asande. Karibusana M.D. Nashkuru Ram. I am M.D. Jiru. We can go with M.D. M.D. Now, tell us something about yourself. For someone who is meeting you for the first time. Who is M.D. Okay. Thank you. Thank you all. Thank you to our viewers. My name is M.D. Jiru, the artist. I am an elder. I am a speaker. And I am a jack of many trades. Wow. Karibusana, my brother. M.D. himself. And of course, remember, we are coming to you live from the broadcasting house here in Nairobi, Kenya. We are also streaming live through our website. That's at www.kibc.co. www.kibc.co. www.kibc.co. I want to talk about matters concerning our career today. I want to talk about unemployment and depression. I want to first of all start with understanding this. At what point should someone say that they are depressed? How can you pick out a depressed person? Of course, in reference to unemployment. Okay. Yeah. So, on a day-to-day basis, we do encounter stress. But prolonged stress leads to depression. So, when one is unable to do the normal functions that they normally use to do, they are usually in a state of depression. Waking up in the morning, it should not be a big deal. Maybe you can sleep in for a few minutes. I want to sleep in the whole day, especially now for this unemployed person. Now that's a case of depression. And according to statistics, there are so many cases of causes of depression. But one serious cause of depression is unemployment. And someone may wonder, so how do I deal with it? How can I cope with this state that I am in where I am depressed? Yeah, you know, we don't just work to get money. Working also gives us a sense of meaning, a sense of purpose. So once someone is unemployed, once someone doesn't have a place to go to work, they are deprived that sense of purpose, that sense of meaning. I remember some time back a couple of years when a police officer was being interrogated for one of these jobs and there were some corruption allegations. And that person said that if they lose their job, they can even die. Because of their life working as a police officer. It has been their life long dream. It gives them the identity, gives them a sense of purpose. It defines who they are. So if they lose it, you've killed them. They have lost an identity, they have lost a sense of purpose and a meaning to life. Atatu je fika ii pointia mani. These first three things are a recipe to depression. Identity, self purpose. And ladies and gentlemen, even as we talk about this, I feel free to ask your questions about this. What are you doing to cope? Many youths are unemployed. So this discussion is so relevant to you that you must be part of it. Head over to our social media platforms. The hashtag is why in the morning. And drop in your comments on Twitter. Tag me at Ram Maguko. And the official station handle is at Y254 channel. Engage with us. We do value feedback. We shall sample them even as we continue with this discussion. Md, you're good. I'm asking, I'm trying to find out about this aspect of coping. Very, very important coping mechanism. But now let's divide this discussion into different areas. One, let's talk about those who are unemployed. They have never gotten any job at all. Two, let's talk about those who have lost a job. And they are now home. They do not have anywhere to go to. And finally, number three, let's talk about those who do not have the ability to apply for any job because they say that they have not gone to school. They don't have the papers. They don't have any form of experience. At least option number one is unemployed but is applying for a job. But option number three is unemployed and they do not have the ability to apply though they believe that they do not have the ability to apply because they do not have any qualification. So it would be the name Django. I ended up finding all jobs there. I was in Manguo because of unemployment. Let's talk about these three groups of people. Let's start with number one. You are unemployed, you are applying for jobs. They are not coming through. Every single day you get, we regret to inform you messages. And sometimes Kenyan employers don't send. They don't have even the cut as you send. Sometimes they don't reply. It kills you. How can you cope up? It does, it does. So number one is you need to come up with a structure. You know 24 hours if you are not doing anything it's such a long long time. So you need to come up with structures. As much as you are applying for a job you need structures that will keep you moving. Moving in terms of keeping you occupied during the day or structures in terms of you just keeping on applying for jobs. What structures are you talking about here? Okay, keeping you number one. For example when going even for a job interview even when performing a job break you are not doing this job. You have to be in the right state of mind. So you need structures to keep you in the right state of mind. So one of those structures is like exercising. When you exercise you feel good. So you first need to allocate time for exercise. You need to allocate time for exercise. You need to allocate time to read. I remember when I was in this show some time back I said that reading is an exercise to the mind. So you need to keep your mind engaged. So physical exercises, mental exercises. Keep you in check. Then you also need to feed the inner being, the spiritual being. Spiritual exercise. Spiritual exercise. So you need to pray, whatever you believe in you need to engage in that belief. Because now here we have a problem here of somebody who is going through depression and you mentioned exercises. Things that keep you active. They get into drugs. It keeps their mind off of the stress and they feel like at some point if I smoke this or I drink that it releases all the stress and at least I have a moment of peace. Let's talk about handle that. What do you think about that? So once someone doesn't have structures in place they will fall to distractions. In physics they see that nature aboze a vacuum. So these 24 hours that you are not maybe part of it you are spending it sleeping this other vacuum will be occupied by distractions like alcohol, drugs and other forms of distraction. That's why I encourage someone who is unemployed to come up with structures and better if to even do voluntary work so as to give their life a sense of meaning. And even as you talk about that now there are those people who decide to watch movies. Is that a good thing? No, it's not. It's a series. Four seasons. Some people have ten seasons. You want to start watching that series all day, all night. Just keep you occupied. If you may be staying with your parent and watch series from morning till evening that's your job. But I applied for this work and I'm waiting for the response. It's good, it entertains. But up to what extent? So you can't watch movies the whole day. So you need to break down. Maybe in the morning I'll go for an exercise. I'll do my exercise routine. Two hours of my day I'll do voluntary work. Then in the evening maybe from around 3pm to maybe let's say 6pm because you have so much time at your hands and you can watch movies. So you submit some time of the day. Then something else that you need to explain about depression. The moment you exclude yourself you are more prone. So if you spend your whole day watching movies you are less prone in yourself. So you are more prone to depression. I was mentioning in the book that you need to have two hobbies. If you are in this scenario you are more prone to depression among them being unemployed you need to have two hobbies. One that will get you out there. One that will sell you. One that will get you out there maybe going to play football maybe basketball going to the gym. One that will make you interact with people. Secondary you don't need to forget your problems to bury your problems like an ostrich. When you ostrich you bury the head in the sand during fire. So you also need another hobby that will keep you indoors so that you can reflect. If you are out throughout the day maybe you are unemployed and you are out throughout the day you do not have time to reflect but if you balance and you have time to reflect indoors at one point you will start reflecting and if you continue like this without a job things will not be good for me. But now Adi I am really worried and this is what I know many people are going through outside there watching you this day We have so many regrets emails that we get and as you mentioned sometimes we don't even get a response How can someone maintain that motivation to keep on applying for jobs because you mentioned spiritual exercises you are praying but you keep the more you pray the greater you inform How can a youth watching it get that motivation to keep on keeping on? Okay So that's a very important question The motivation motivation comes and goes but we need to be committed and commitment is not easy I want to answer this from the autobiography of Nelson Mandel When I was studying the autobiography of Nelson Mandel I was wondering how can one man with standard prison condition for 27 years 27 27 years nimingisan So I saw that Nelson Mandel had structures and also in my book I mentioned about prison because I am using the extremes if one can cope with the prison conditions most likely they can cope with if this condition if the systems that apply for someone in prison they can apply for someone who is an employed So what did Nelson Mandel used to do? One, used to read So that's exercise to the mind Also Nelson Mandel used to exercise used to do Kalis 6 this body what do you call it exercises that you support yourself with your own body weight push ups pull ups and all kind of stuff So back to this person who is an employed you not apply for a job today and get an invitation maybe even next week it will take a period of time even when you get the job you will realize that it is not what you really really expected So you need to have coping mechanisms like shock absorbers That's why I am advocating One, you need to exercise the brain exercise the body and feed the inner person and when at it find your purpose in life because Jim Non once said that purpose help us to pull us forward you know there are those days that are birthdays if you have purpose at least your purpose will pull you forward forward forward keep you going you will not give up and in fact you said that I love is that sometimes you will not get an immediate response you may apply for a job in January and they respond in the next 12 months or 8 months in December or in the next year but you will get a response but to keep on going if you are to get to the goal that you set for yourself I am looking at the aspect of these youths who are job seeking applying and at least instead of depression what do you do when people keep on asking you because you are like what are you doing yet your mates are getting jobs your mates are getting employment and you are here your mates are developing and growing and you are still in the same place you keep on getting compared to your mates who have achieved and gotten jobs yet you haven't and to make it to us you might have graduated at the same time you know you might have achieved an effort you know so your mates who you went to school with you graduated at the same time they have gotten jobs they are doing well but what is important is effort okay let me be a bit personal because even in my book I have written it from a personal perspective okay I have been in and out of employment for a couple of times and at one point I was out of employment while staying at home you know and my mum used to encourage me that get out there you don't wake up in the morning and you just sit there watching television and any day I would come sometimes I would even think that and she would give me fair to go to that interview because she could see effort effort so not having a job is not an issue what's the effort that you are putting into it also when you go to the job maybe you have been unemployed for 2 years it's unfortunate but when you go to for an interview they will ask for the for those gaps in the CV for these 2 years what have you been doing you know you can tell the panel the interview panel that I've just been applying for jobs but if you say something like I've been doing voluntary work you know now it changes the dynamics so the key thing is effort no one can be crucified even those people living with unemployed people no one can crucify you for not for not having a job something else that you need to clarify most of the people who are unemployed those people who graduated dysentery they either stay with parents, siblings, relatives and all that you can't wake up and just watch a movie the whole day wake up and do house chores no one else is going to job at least leave them some of the duties wakutu me pika numbai kusafi some organization you add value but when you are at home and you are at work and you are at home and you are at home and you are at home and you are at home and you are at home and you are at home and you are at home and when you are at home the house is in the same state you have not even moved a pillow even if you throw it away you will get grass you will get peag, at least they will come and find you have cooked and there is some food ready even if they are going to pay your rent they will not fill the page Uh bubbles stiko so So, loss is such a painful thing which ever kind of flows, it's such a painful thing. Infact when people are kond, they are usually kond because they don't know how to cut their losses. When you listen to kond stories, most people when they are kond maybe 10k, send 2k zingine, 3k zingine. That is a kond man talking to you. Ya, because people are not good in cutting their losses. Even when relationship end, people are not able to say, see maisha, you want to try and pursue. It's human nature. You want to get back together, try to see if it will work again. You break up and then you get back together again. Ya. So, pia kwa job, kwa job scenario, you have lost your job. Ina uma, but kuzue na kwangashida. I think infact they should be canceling services for people who lose their jobs. Remember at the start of our conversation to say that job gives you identity. Job gives you meaning. Job gives you a sense of purpose. Now you have lost that. So you can imagine the loss. Where do you get your sense of purpose? Where do you get your identity? If you were identified with that particular job. Ya. So, if that job gave you some celebrity status, it put you out there. How do you cope with that? That's pressure man, that's pressure. So, infact I have written a book about that. Although I have not yet released it. So in that book usually I walk through people through a process of mourning. Just like romantic relationships. When a relationship dies, you don't jump into the next relationship. And if you jump into the next relationship, you are in a tango rebound. It's not gofa. So you can't choose a job today and tomorrow you are paying for a job. Let's make that clear. You are saying you should give it time. You give it time. You mourn that loss. You grieve over the loss. Then you enter into a better state of mind. But brother, so there is... Okay, I'm asking myself this question. How do you mourn a job? How do you mourn for a lost job? You grieve about it. How do you grieve? Different people grieve different ways. If it's for maybe it's for ladies. You can call your girls and go cry over it. Liyeni pamoja. And I think ladies are more... Ladies have an advantage. Because when a lady loses a job for example is going through a loss. She will call her fellow ladies and they will cry over it. But if a man loses a job, he can't call fellow men and they start crying over the lost job. They will most likely buy drinks to him and do that to himself. There is somebody who has a question. Let me say that question again. Nadakusu iswa li tema. Even as you get that question for me, let me ask you this. So someone has just lost a job. And after they have lost a job, yes there is that set of deficient that they go through. But now I am going to look at this from a different angle again. Because here we are talking about losing something. It might not necessarily be that you have gotten fired. What about the motion? You got demoted from that job that you used to have. And now you are at a lower ranking position. You are meeting the same people, but the motion will be better. It can't be depressing. Talk about that. So it's very depressing. Now there are so many dynamics to it. There are so many dynamics to it. Once you are demoted, accept it's hard but at least it's like in a relationship. I will compare most of this with romantic relationship. Someone can tell you that they have not broken up with you. They just want to separate with you. At least it's comforting. It's not a break up. Apon niku cheso ona cheso pier. But at least that's a soft landing. So once you are demoted, that's a soft landing. At least you have a job. So you accept. At least you have a job. Then depending on the dynamics and the kind of maybe office politics involved in all that, you start looking for another job. You start looking for another job. Then you leave the job. Depending on how it plays out. So start looking for another job. As you are doing your current one now. And don't let people know about that. That's very important. Now if someone is trying to cope with demotion, should you confide in people because this is something that some may feel embarrassed about talking with someone maybe a problem. Good. Confiding to people, that's good but who are you confiding to? If you are demoted, don't go confiding to your colleagues. Maybe that colleague was in your position. There is someone who is even happy celebrating that you have been demoted. And whatever you tell them and most of the time the kind of talk you have is a negative talk. You will give negative feedback and it will reach your boss. So don't confide to your colleagues. Relax. Confide to people outside there. Confide to people outside there. And nowadays it's very with this current generation that you have you confide to people they screenshot it. They post it all over. That's why it's important to journal. I was reading somewhere that if you are going through emotional events let that emotional event in that person. For example, instead of writing today I went to the job and I was shocked that I received my emotion later. Let it in that person. He removed yourself from I say he went to the job and shocked to him he found his emotion later. Now that you are removing yourself from the scenario you are able to come up with solutions. Write whatever you write. It's a way of getting it out. I love the fact that you are saying even if you want to confide in someone don't just talk about work issues with your colleagues and your bosses. At some point it might circulate around. Now that you are a colleague and you want to engage in your work because you were talking about your work with the workmate. That's where we need to be careful about. Let me add something before it slips from my mind. Everything that happens to us and this I run the hard way and I'm still running it it also depends on how you interpret it. It's all about interpretation. That emotion you can celebrate it. For example, let's say you are a manager that means a prestigious title but more responsibilities. More responsibilities more work in hours. Let's say you are from a manager and then you move to just a supervisory position. The workload will reduce. Yes, the prestige will come down but also the workload. Now that I have more time I can spend more time with my family I can spend more time with my friends I can, you know also you can be like now the back doesn't stop with me less stress. It all depends on how you interpret it. It also depends on how you interpret it. You can add something to back that point. Yes, quite. There was this famous photographer called Kevin Carter. He is most known for the photograph that he took of that European child. With the bird. At the background. I was trying to do some research and I found that Kevin unfortunately committed suicide and some of the some of the things that led to his suicide or his depressive state is that the nature of his work you are saying that he was not able he felt that he was incapable of helping people like that child also when he went to cover war and all that he felt that he was unable to help people. Now look at the interpretation. If Kevin did not capture that photo the world would not have known that the scenario at in Ethiopia. If Kevin did not cover the wars people could not know of the predicament of the people experiencing the war but he gave a wrong interpretation. I am not judging the wrong interpretation to whatever happened to him you see I don't discuss the fact that his work was depressive but the interpretation. Back to this person who has been demoted if you give it a wrong interpretation it will eat you up. But if you are like now you can spend more time with friends you won't get depressed. You will not get depressed. Wow That's the MD himself. Now let me ask you we moved to the par category of people and here we are looking at those who they are saying you know what I don't have a job there is nothing I can do about it because I have not gone to school I don't have this particular paper or qualification for the matter. This guy decides to go for odd jobs manual labor maybe it could be in some construction house somewhere or you can choose to become to wash people's clothes in the estates. But now the money you get is not enough for you. They go through a state of depression what is your word for this group of people you know I don't want to down pray this group of people but most of the time disappointments comes with expectations that group of people and from observation that group of people that maybe they don't have papers they are usually not disappointed they don't expect much in fact it's easier for a graduate to be to fall into depression because of lack of a job than a closet drop out or a closet lever let me put it in perspective a graduate has high expectations also the society has high expectations on the graduate but this closet lever is like I'm sure I didn't advance so much with my studies I don't need to find a way out so this group of people they are less likely to be depressed but what happens to them they are more likely to be resigned those is a scenario whereby people whatever whatever will be job beneath a kujani they are the same group of people who if you ask them what kind of a job would you want to have what do you say they are resigned so they are not usually disappointed in fact job beneath a kujani you know that answer it's not quite it doesn't give you much to work with and you wouldn't know how to deal with this particular individual it's not easy to deal with them it's not easy to deal with them so they are mostly under the category of resigned they read aliz nai alizined type of life so the only thing for them is that they can just be empowered they can just be empowered they can only be empowered only talk to them so that they can know how to respond so is that what you say can I add a dynamic to an employment there's this unique dynamic it's not unique I was doing research on depression, suicide and all that and they realized that people who live alone they are more prone to depression and suicide now someone who is living alone they are single and they lose their job that's a dynamic that I don't know how you can explain it but a dangerous dynamic very dangerous you are single you stay alone you had a job and you are paid for your rent now you get to lose that job you have no one to go home to when you are two of you go home to share the bad news not even to cater for your bills to share the bad news but now you have no one to go to it's you and your perus you enter that someone who is depressed and is in that position can they come out of it is it possible in fact depression is it's a face usually research shows that usually in our course of life some people will fall into depression so it's something that you can get in and get out of it but now there is this tendency to end up borrowing money you borrow and borrow to the point that it becomes stressful you have so many loans to pay and there is no income to pay for this money so this person ends up being depressed gets into lots of things that end up taking much of their their money but let's talk about that kwa lones mingisana na kwa depressa zadyu atalipa lones and it's an unfortunate scenario very unfortunate but it's what is happening currently in our society so the first thing in all this it's state of mind you have lost your job state of mind how is your state of mind you know someone once said that sometimes it's not about the money it's about yes money money will solve most of these problems but sometimes it's not about the money ok let me divide a bit most people when you ask when you ask most people why have you not started that business idea that you have been talking about they will be like I don't have capital you know I don't have capital so it's not lack of capital that makes us not start businesses what is it it's lack of ideas you know it's lack of ideas but we hide it under lack of lack of capital so if you can if you can find creative ideas of starting your business without money when money comes it will prepare the business to the next level if we can deal with the state of mind and they are in a good state of mind do you know even banks when you talk to your bank manager they can structure you alone they can give you more time but you need to be in a good frame of mind to go and talk to them if you are a business if maybe you are a business person you can ask for more credit in terms of goods and sell so before we go to the borrowing we need to go to the state of mind how is the state of mind how are they dealing with this loss so once we we work on that this issue of borrowing money will sort itself you know most people are depressed they end up getting to have so many loans and they don't have money they don't have money they don't have money because they don't have anywhere to go and it's quite a sad state of affairs but they can come out of it they can come out of it let me also add that now when you are depressed your body goes into survival mode you know and when you are in survival mode you are not creative if you take money if you borrow money from someone it's not money to fund an idea it's money to consume money to pay rent money to survive so it will be something recurrent but if maybe your mental state can be revamped you know you can even be like instead of paying lent this month to fund this idea that will generate more money sure I love that even as we try and come out of that and wrap things up ladies and gentlemen MD is an author and as you are talking I'm sure you heard you picked out points that he wrote this book about the book that you wrote what is it's name and it talks also about depression let's talk about that book the book is called preps the antidote to resignation anxiety depression and suicidal thoughts what is it all about it's all about those things that we can do to come out of depression and for those people who are not in a depressive state if they do these things they will not fall into depression so it's both cumulative and preventative okay alright and is it out the book is out although I'm working out with a few people I'm planning to I feel philanthropic okay I let me give a backstory this book is from a personal experience I suffered depression some time back after a job loss so we were actually talking about what you went through wow so I felt like when I was going through that period of depression one of the things that really helped me get out of it is reading books and I felt that I can give back to the society through writing a book and giving out there so I'm trying to to finalize with a few partners in there how we can distribute the book and give back to the society for free because even the ideas in the book things that I can see that have invaded the ideas it's typical things ya ni witu tuza kawidan kazi bring together then kwa observe watu engini, then kona this is what people did when they were depressed and they got out so you're saying that it's not yet out you're planning to release it if someone wants the book they can leach me via my socials via email address and I can send them I can send them a soft copy but back in the day when we were young chapa tizi kipikuwa and konanja san kids wala kuna po ile akonza so there's someone out there who may be learned me fika muisho so we can't wait for another month for us to funeralize with the partners before the book is out if they reach out even today I can send the book to them how can someone get a hold of you over social media via Instagram my page is there is maktaba digitari and also I have a page by the name mdingiru mdingiru one that's on IG most on Twitter but I have not been active mdingiru are you on Facebook okay my account disappeared that's IG many people are going to IG I don't know why but I will join you and talking of IG social media once you are going through certain battles in your life kindly get out of social media subconsciously we humans tend to compare ourselves with others in IG people post the complete story half stories behind the scenes share something when people lose jobs some people go back to their parents home even for 40 years we tend to fly and squeeze them into the cinema and they will come back and post to you but we tend to trip cost and post to you so when you are going through page this person to graduate he end up on vacation you know but easy way to hard full people don't post especially when you are going through an employment just get out of social media you will end up even posting things about your job about your former employer and it's going to be a bad thing for you wow I want to submit this discussion to a close 20 seconds to have a final word give us your parting shot as Dr Kenyan is watching you today that's your camera there so my parting shot is I will my parting shot is from the book and it's preps any time you are going through a hard situation you cannot pray preps what's preps is prayer reading eating healthy exercising leading a purposeful life and S scheduling your life and sleeping once you get the book maybe you will get in depth of what I am praying to thank you so much I appreciate the work you are doing keep on changing lives I wish you the best of course a big thanks to MDG for making time to join us today you are talking about depression and unemployment on career talk of course that brings us to the end of this particular discussion but we still have more coming up on why in the morning