 Hello and welcome to exchangeformedia.com. My guest today is a seasoned journalist turned entrepreneur. After two decades as a journalist, in 2014, she ventured into business and launched film companion. As the website ventures, it's 10th year. Let's speak to Anupama Chopra and learn more about her business. Hi, and you're really good at that. I still get nervous about doing these introductions. Thanks. I mean, coming from a journalist must be here to me. That's a big compliment. Thank you. Tell me more about your journey. Let's start with, from where did this idea of film companion come to you? And also it takes a lot of courage, you know, to be a journalist and then to start something of your own, because I have not found that courage. So tell us more about the idea and, you know, how it all started. So it actually started and the idea came from my husband, because I used to do a show on Star World called The Front Row and we produced that and that was on Star World in Star Plus for two years. And then that contract expired and we were trying to figure out like, okay, what do we do next? And he said, you know, the truth is we're not in that time anymore when film reviews should be appointment viewing on television, that at 8.30 on a Friday, you will sit down and listen. It should be available whenever anybody wants to see it. And the only way to do that is go digital and to do it on YouTube. And so it was literally just that one spark of, you know, something he said that kind of lit up the whole thing. And I was like, yeah, that completely makes sense. And because we knew we were already producers. I've been already doing television for like 10 years almost, you know, so it wasn't, it felt like a natural move. And that's literally how film companion started in 2014. As you mentioned, you were already on selection for 10 years, you had a full year of credibility and everything. But still, you know, business requires a lot more. It does, as I found out. So tell us about your business model, how you've been able to monetize it, how have you been able to scale it up? So, you know, it's been very exciting, very difficult, because truthfully, I'm not a numbers person. I'm not somebody who's, and I've always worked all my career with legacy media. So numbers was never anything I needed to worry about. You know, it was like you do your job and somebody else is selling and monetizing and business and gave over. So I never even thought about it. And also truthfully, it's not that we went into this after having thought about it a lot. We just said, Chaloom, YouTube channel, it was as casual as that. And over the years, we kind of figured out what needed to be done, the monetization model, which is still very hard. Over the years, the first one or two years, we did not monetize. No, no, it was monetizable from the beginning, because on YouTube, you can monetize. So the videos were monetized. But, you know, when you first begin, that money is not paying for anything. It's maybe paying for a cup of coffee. So it was very hard to kind of, it was purely coming from a place of what we earned in the front row. We invested infant companion, taking our own personal investments and putting it in there. And then gradually kind of figuring out that we will need to do X to make sure that it's a self-sustaining business. It can't be for me. I was very clear that it's not a question of, can you afford to keep it running? It's a question of, it can't be a vanity project. It needs to be a self-sustaining project. It has to be a business project. Yeah. I mean, I always laugh and say that I don't think I'm going to find my own private jet at the end of this. But, you know, it has to be self-sustaining because that is proof of concept. That allows you to think that, yes, people want it and they will pay something for it. So obviously for us, the main monetization model has now, after all these years, obviously there is a substantial chunk coming from YouTube itself. We have more than 3,000 videos on YouTube. Many of them have millions and millions of views. So there is much more income coming from there. There is also the branded projects that we do, which started, I think like eight years ago was our first branded project with Microsoft. We did a show called Beneath the Surface, because they had just launched or they were pushing out the Surface computer and in which I spoke with Priyanka, Shah Rukh and Karan and then at the end of it gave them a Surface computer and was called Beneath the Surface. And that was the first bit of branded content we had ever done. So it shows like that. Plus, it's commission shows. We did a podcast for Audible. So those were CIDA commissions which went straight on those platforms. But the branded stuff we put on our platform. So it's a mix and match of these things which has sustained from companion as we've grown from like literally four people to over 60. And when you started, when you were on the television efforts, you know who your audience is at. But when you started on YouTube, did you have any target audience in mind? Like who are you building this platform for? It was that it's for people who love the movies. And I don't mean it in a- That's all of India. That's all of India. That's exactly what I mean. So it's not just India but it's- It will never be to be. It will always be to be. It will never be to be. I've always been a B2C journalist. I've always talked to consumers and to movie. And when I say movie lovers, I don't, you know, there's a word called cinephiles which has become almost like a bad word you're very esoteric, you're too intellectual, etc, etc. I, you know, I don't think it's a bad word at all. But for me, it's very important to talk about people who love the movies like you and me. You don't have to be an expert on cinema. You don't have, though we have enough for that too. But if you're just somebody who loves movies and wants to know more, like how did that shot happen? You know, what were you thinking when you did it? Enjoy it and not intellectualize it. Yeah, yeah, but also you want to know more. You want to, you're curious. So the whole idea was you create a platform that has credibility and that is informative and entertaining. It's not informative in our boring way. We're not academics, you know, we're film lovers, all of us, all of us who work here. So as we enter your 10th year, would you like to give us some numbers in terms of your reach and revenue companies? For this, I have been instructed to look it up so that, so that I'm not messing it up and giving you wrong numbers. Numbers should always be correct. Numbers should always be correct. Absolutely. So website grows has in terms of consumers has gone up by 1000%, which is stunning to me in the last two years. YouTube has grown by 300%, social media by 200% and revenue has also gone up to X in the last year, because we're now actively focusing on a strong editorial barterships. All of our, what do you mean by editorial barterships? Correct. I was just going to explain. So that is, let's say we did a round table with the World Goal Council last year in which we celebrated women in film. And it was, it wasn't just actors or directors, but it was also a casting director, also a costume person. So that was in collaboration with the World Goal Council. But for me, it was also a conversation I was dying to have, because I think women in film should be celebrated and not just the actors in front of the camera because of course they're in front of you and they're already celebrated. But what about all those women who are doing production design and direction and production. So, you know, we had Gunit Monga and we had Ekala Khani and of course we had actors, we had Bhoomi and we had Aditya Raoheadi. But for me, it was a very fruitful, very energizing conversation that was enabled by WGC. So those are the kind of editorial partnerships that are that we are looking to create more of. This is this is a question that I want to understand even also as a journalist, because there's a lot I'm sure to learn from you. How do you navigate the delicate balance of offering critical assessment of stars and movies while still securing interviews with them? How frequently do you encounter complaints or threats of a wire call in the aftermath of less favorable review? You know, so I have to tell you, I just like literally a few days ago interviewed Rithik Roshan and my review and my review fighter was fairly critical. And I think it's so gracious of him. And so just evolved to look beyond that one review and say that I'm happy to sit with you. Not many, not many. So you get refuses? Absolutely. There are people, I won't name them, but there are people who will, who haven't spoken to me like three or four years because they said that that was very upsetting that you said X. And you know, truthfully, I get it. Does that affect you when you do the review next time? No, I can't. Because then you might as well not do it. Then just do interviews. There's no, there's literally no boss above me at Pankapanian, right? There's no one telling me I need to do anything. So if I'm going to do it, I have to do it with honesty, I have to do it with integrity. And if I can't, then don't do it at all. So we've spoken of business, but your whole, like the way you understand Indian cinema and the changes that have happened, we can't close this without talking about it. So you know, there's a lot that has happened on the streaming front in the last few years. So how do you think digital platforms and streaming services have influenced the dynamics of filmmaking and film production? And what are the challenges and opportunities that you see in this? You know, it's changed it like 360 degrees, which is very exciting. Because I think it's really enabled a conversation between industries and between consumers. And for me, when we started Filmkapanian, the idea was always, it was an Indian entertainment platform. It was never a Hindi cinema entertainment platform. So even before Bahubali, we had launched Filmkapanian South. You know, we were looking at all the films from South and talking about them in very, very serious ways. And for me, what the platforms are in English? In English as well as? No, no, we had Bharatwaj Angan, who at that time was the head of Filmkapanian South. And you know, there were occasional interviews he would do in Tamil, but those might be subtitled, or he would speak in English if it was, let's say, a Kannada or a Malayalam artist. But for me, that was always the vision that it's Indian cinema, it's Indian entertainment. And I think what streaming platforms have done is only precipitated that movement because we're now watching everything, we're watching each other's films, everybody's working in each other's films. For me, that's just spectacular. I feel like everybody will only gain from it. The challenges are, it's still, it's, and I guess that's the magic of the movies. You don't know what will work. You know, you just don't have any idea what will work. And we still, and you know, now of course, there's all this conventional wisdom that says, oh, only a certain type of film will work. It'll be the big star cast film, it'll be big budget, there'll be locations, there'll be this, there'll be that, which is the only reason people will get away from the small screen and come and pay those 300 rupees and come to the multiplex. But the truth is, 12th film worked. I got it. You know, so, so this, that's the magic of the movies. It's the story that works. And I feel, I'm hoping that what streaming will do is in a way compel writers to work harder, directors to work harder. And for me, one of the best things streaming has done is it's really given writers a commanding position because it's a writer's platform. And writers post Salim Saab and Javed Saab were very badly treated. You know, they were like in that pecking order, they were the last. And I think that has changed and that's wonderful because they set the foundation. Yeah, they were the superstars. They were the anomaly. Yes. Peep was also them started with them and the decline also started. Because they set up a whole different model, you know, writers after them could not could not emulate. Yeah. So you also engage a lot with global cinema, right? Are there any particular international film makers that have significantly inspired you or impressed you? And how do you, how do these influences shape your perspective on Indian cinema? So you know, it would be, it's like, of course, I watch a lot of, I mean, I grew up watching Hollywood cinema that was the movies, those were the movies that came, right? There was no streaming, there was no way to watch Korean content or anything else, right? And, and those films, mainstream Hollywood films have shaped my sensibility. You know, so like a Godfather, you know, like a taxi driver, those, those kind of like really landmarks, 70s movies, or even, you know, sort of, let's say, Alfonso Cuarón's Itu Mama Tambia, you know, a Mexican film, that's something that really kind of impacted me and stayed with me. But what I, what I don't do is I don't look at Indian cinema and say, oh, but that's so much better. Because my love for cinema started with loving Indian cinema. So I'm never doing a comparison and I never find faults in a Hindi film because it's not Godfather. It's not trying to be, the audience is different. The, the story, the culture is different. Yeah. The whole story telling is different, you know. So while watching those films, especially in the last 15 years, I've also gone to film festivals a lot. I've been exposed to a lot of international cinema. No, no, I study journalism. I have a master's in journalism. So I always feel like I should have also studied film, like in Mumbani. Coming back to film company, we've started a new segment called FC Classrooms. Yes. How does it effectively teach scriptwriting and what inspired the creation of this educational initiative? You know, this is something that I'm always kind of toyed with and we did a version of it like on Zoom during the pandemic that like, can we get somebody to kind of do classes about film, film appreciation, those kind of things. With this, with FC Classroom, which the first module is about scriptwriting with Satyanshu Singh, who is a national award-winning scriptwriter, film director, he's a professor of cinema, you know, it's the idea is to make film education available at a very affordable rate. And when I say education, obviously, we are not completely with the FTII or the SRFT. And this is not in that sense. This is a starter kit, right? If you are living somewhere in India, it's all online, but it's something you buy. So it's also at your own time, at your own convenience. And the idea really is that if you are, and it's in Hindi, I think that is critical because there is so much film education on YouTube in English. But the references are all Hollywood, the scenes that they're showing all over. So I'm just thinking there's somebody sitting in a small town in India. Satyanshu has been a teacher for years. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's been a teacher for many years now. But what this is, is an online scriptwriting module that teaches you, takes you through the basic steps of how to be a scriptwriter. And the idea is to enable anyone anywhere to buy it for an affordable sum of money and then to see if that's what you want. You know, it's a little taste of it. We just spoke of 12th sale, how it poved everyone wrong. Including me. Can I tell you, I told my husband that I think you should just go to streaming because I'm not sure this would work in the theaters. Including me. I was also advising him exactly what everybody else was advising him. But he believed in this. He believed in it. He said, it's my film and I want to see it in the theater. And we also spoke about how they've not really been, I mean, they've been good writers, but they've not got their due after job, actually. How do you see storytelling changing in seven or nine coming years? You're also taking, you're also taking another initiative to do that. And what role do you see emerging technologies play in its evolution? You know, I think it's already changing because like I said, with the advent of streaming and writers' rooms, writers suddenly became in demand. Like any good writer is booked for months. You can't, they're not available and they're being paid much, much better now. I think it's already changing, but it needs to change a lot more. I feel like there needs to be far more rigor put into writing films, put into kind of maybe the research process of films, put into like just bringing the conviction that a film needs to have. How will technology change? You know, honestly, I don't know. I'm seeing all these conversations about AI, especially in Hollywood and what it's going to do. And you know, all this stuff about, can write a scene or can put an actor in a frame or can do anything, right? But my sense is that you know, cinema is about human emotion. That's the foundation of cinema. That's the only reason you will care about a film is if somewhere it does something to you, it could make you laugh, it can make you cry, it can make you afraid. It can do anything, but it has to push some button. I'm not sure that AI can get there. I don't think AI will ever, ever come up with a line like, nere pas maa hai. Won't have hopefully not. No, I refuse to believe it. Take away, it may take away job, my job because I don't want AI to start writing and so they're doing interviews also. Absolutely. So now coming back to journalism, this is again a question that relates to you and to me, especially in film journalism. You were a journalist, you started covering films much before social media and all of that. Nowadays there's a trend that I see that a lot of film stories are just based on the social media course and there is a journalist who's just simply following their tweets and their Insta and all. Do you think social media in totality has lowered the standards of journalism in the last few years? See, it's a tough one because I also love it. I've been on, I mean Twitter has become a harder, not Twitter, X now has become a harder and harder place to kind of navigate because it's become more polarized, more shrill or more aggressive in the trolling. But I've been there for like, I don't know, like 12 years Instagram as well. So I'm not like one of those people who says that everything evil in the world comes from social media because I really enjoy it as well. I think what is dangerous is a part of influencer culture when you can't tell whether something is bought or authentic. For me, that's very scary. The idea that somebody is raving about a film but it could be because they've been paid to do it. And then when you can't, that whole idea of post truth, we're living in that post truth world because genuinely I don't know. And I think for me that's very detrimental to film journalism, to film entertainment, to criticism. Because if opinions can be bought, then what's the value of an opinion? My question is also around stories that I just, you looked at social media and you just thought your job as a journalist is to go meet people, build stories, sources and come with information which is not blatantly available in internet. But the truth is that that is being consumed. So when you see eyeballs going up on that type of content, there will be people to provide that type of content. So I think finally with journalism and with movies, the buck stops with the audience. When you stop paying for it or when you stop giving, it's an attention economy. When you stop paying attention to the most simplistic, low IQ, less worked upon thing, and you are willing to maybe pay for journalism that is of a higher quality, that's when you'll get good journalism. Otherwise, we can all sit and look at tweets and Instagram and make stories. But you know, you have to. So this is your 10th year, any big celebrations, big announcements, big launches likely? Well, yes, nothing I can speak of right now, but we are very excited and there will be lots of stuff. And you know, we just want to continue scaling. And I don't mean that just in terms of size, but in terms of quality, because I can't remember who it was that said, somebody at Pixar once said that quality is the best business plan. So if you just follow that, you know, you chase the excellence, you keep doing quality work, I think, I hope, maybe she all the best. And it all works out in the end. We really look forward to good quality content. And I think on Thursdays, yours is the most searched name on Google every time a movie is released. So we all want to see what you think about the movie amongst a few other critics that I like to follow. Thank you, Anupama, for speaking to us. We wish you all the best. Thank you.