 with Human Rights Around the World on Think Tech Live, broadcasting from our downtown studio in Honolulu, Hawaii, and Moana, Nuiakea. I'm your host, Joshua Cooper. And to the title of today's episode is the United Nations Expert Mechanism on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, Youth and Women Speaking Truth to Power for a Better Planet Guaranteed to All People. I'm very fortunate today to have Putani Kim. Putani, how are you doing today? And thank you so much for joining us. Thank you. I'm very fortunate to be invited for you, to be invited in your TV show and to tell more about Indigenous people and women and also the youth. Thank you for inviting me. Yes, today is actually exciting because it's the 15th anniversary of the UN Expert Mechanism on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, which replaced the important body of the UN Working Group on Indigenous Populations. And it's exciting to see such a rich agenda and so many Indigenous peoples really coming back for the first time after COVID. How does it feel to be in the room there with all the Indigenous peoples that you've only really heard about, but actually meeting them and seeing the commonality of all of the campaigns you're working on as Indigenous peoples? I feel really grateful and honored to speak on behalf of Indigenous people For me, it's like around people to make on Delta and Vietnam. I feel really honored to talk about and speak out for the rights of them because, yeah, you know, they're not allowed to say anything and I am really grateful to speak out on the rights of them. So I feel really honored and I'm speechless to be honest. No, it's great to hear because as you said, you're fortunate that you can go there and actually exercise all of the rights in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, passed in 1948, but also the UN Declaration of the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. And even though you have the ability to be able to exercise your rights, you're actually using those on behalf of the people of your ancestral homeland in Kampuche, Khram. How do you think they feel and are pleased with you participating in this 15th annual UN session in Geneva? That's a good question. They are thankful. Every day when I'm here, I keep them updated about what I've heard during the meetings and what I've said during my speeches. And they're really thankful for me to be attending the meetings and speak of the health of them because, you know, it's really hard to speak out for their rights because of the danger. The dangers they will face, the imprisonment and threats from the government. So yeah, they're really thankful for me because I put my time and effort in it and I fight for the right that I have because I hope in the future they have the same right I will today. No, that's a great point. Today was the thematic discussion on violence against women. And the thematic discussion on violence against Indigenous women began with United Nations Special Operator and Violence Against Women, one of the 45 special procedures of the Human Rights Council. And she talked about how Indigenous women are disproportionately impacted by violence in many different forms. She talked about it from extractive industries that come in through multinational corporations. Also the how governments target Indigenous women who are protecting their sacred lands. And I know you had some aspects to share too because inside Kampucheokrom, the women are always the ones that are working to make sure that there's more ability to practice language and be able to make sure that the rice fields are able to reproduce and that the families are able to be held together. Yes, that's right. Talking about that, during the meeting, it was something happened, an incident with the Russian representative because there was an Indigenous woman who gave a speech and also said something about the Russian regime, how they were threatened by the Russian government. And at the end of her speech, he stood up, went to her and screamed and yelled at her for what he said. And it was really, really big because during the UN meetings, you feel like you're free to speak about everything that's happening in your country, which she did. But yeah, however, she still got attacked by the Russian government and I feel like that's a real threat to the Indigenous woman, like to not be free to speak out how it, you know, the reality of it. So yeah, it's really disappointing to see that because inside of the walls of the UN, you need to have the feeling to speak freely about everything that's happening. So yeah. No, it's very true. So there were fireworks on the 4th of July at the UNX for Mechanism on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples because Yana, who represents the Indigenous peoples of Russia, she represents a committee of the Indigenous Peoples of Russia, she gave a speech and after she gave her speech, she was immediately, as you said, approached by the Russian Federation, the representative and everybody pointed out later, it was an unacceptable action. Everybody said, ironically enough, on a year that we're looking at violence against women, you actually have a government actually giving an example of what violence against women is happening, what you normally would think just in a country, but we saw it there at the UN. And she was actually in the training that we did with DOSIP the day before and she had a great speech. She documented exactly what had happened, how she's been impacted, how her community had their houses burned down and the actions of a multinational, but then if that wasn't enough, then you have after she gives a speech, which dozens of Indigenous peoples did yesterday, the Russian Federation came up, started screaming at her and actually intimidating and harassing her in a UN meeting. So it was definitely something you wouldn't think when you're having a panel discussion on it, but there it was just the day before, but it was great to see her today, being so brave to actually take the floor again today to once again speak truth to power and challenge the Russian Federation. Yes, that's right. It gave me also a power as a woman, fellow woman. It gave me power, like whatever happened to her, to me, we still have people around us who believe in us and give us strength and faith to still talk and speak out about everything, what's happening. Even though it's a little bit scary to talk about because of the big government, but besides that, we have a lot of people who believe in us and who just help us to give us strength to still speak out the reality, just the reality. Yeah, no, and when you think about how the Indigenous responded, I think it was so bold because the Russian Federation was going around and demanding from her, what is your name? Where are you to threaten her to try to, you didn't care about what she had said or talk about what issue she raised, what is your name? Who are you? And then, when another woman from Crimean Tatar spoke, he tried to do the same thing again. So I thought it was great as you're saying the solidarity. I know one Metis woman from Canada, she's a very good woman rights defender. She actually sat behind the Russian Federation to put pressure on him. And then I'll never forget, it's something that happened once to me and it's so good to see the solidarity is still strong. Once, I wrote a statement about the Panchin Lama who had disappeared, he's been disappeared for over two decades now and China said they were going to cancel the meeting. But Kenneth Deere, who spoke yesterday, actually went up to me and he said, if any Indigenous person is silenced, we all are and you give that speech because we should never ever retreat and be make sure that we could realize the rights we fought for all these years. And Kenneth Deere took the floor and I'll never forget when he said the Russian was just speaking before and he says, I demand to know the names of who spoke and Kenneth Deere sounded like something out of a movie. He said, I'm Kenneth Deere, if you're asking. So it's great to see Kenneth there from the Mohawk nation who just got land back. The Onondaga just got a land back of a thousand acres in the United States and they're all part of the Haddon Ashourney. He said, this is unacceptable and we will not tolerate that and that there should be an investigation because this is definitely an example not only of a violence against women but also reprisal because when you come to the UN and speak and provide information so that they can do their job better the last thing should ever happen is a government actually violate your rights and try to intimidate but more important threaten you to then make you not want to speak or share the true facts of what you know what's happening to your people on the ground with the global institutions. Yes, you're right because it's not only a attack on her or on the woman but it's an attack on every indigenous people. Like, yeah, let's say a group and if someone attacks one of the indigenous people we just need to stand up and fight for our rights because it's really important to keep our culture and languages and everything. And talking about languages today we had an item about international because of indigenous languages and that was also really interesting. I've learned a lot of other indigenous people and cultures and I was so happy, it was a really good day of learning about other indigenous people and culture because, yeah, I'm really interested about it I've read about it a lot but this is just next level of experience and education so I'm really grateful to you for being here and learning about it. No, it's true and what's so exciting is that before we get to the decade of language and maybe combining it I think what's also so important is Russia trying to counsel her and not allow her to speak then in their statement today they said who's really the victim because Guatemala and the governments also very strongly stood up and said this behavior is not tolerated at the UN. It made me think also Vietnam because Vietnam is also a communist one party regime where they always have attacked other young Khmer women who have spoken out but so far you've been able to deliver two speeches and in your speeches also looking at the decade of indigenous languages how is language shared in Kampucheekram? We know many monks are the ones who teach the language and it's only in the temples where the language is taught because the indigenous language of Khmer is not officially recognized by the government so the kids aren't able to learn in their mother tongue and then be able to communicate. Could you share with us some aspects about indigenous language in Kampucheekram? Yes, I would like that. So the language of ours, Kampucheekram it's supposed to be Khmer and that is our mother's song but we are not allowed to learn it in school because the government has a really strong policy on schools and on the monks because the monks are also our teachers and every time when the school and the monks want to do anything in terms of education they need to send a curriculum to the government for them to check. So they're allowed to have two hours a week of Khmer lessons which means it's really less it is almost nothing. So the children cannot remain our mother's song and that is a threat, threatening to our language because you cannot learn anything, you know? You cannot expect it from the students to keep our mother's song if it's not more than two hours. Two hours a week, I mean, two hours is nothing compared to 10 hours or something like that. Yeah, it's just, as if they are trying to remove our language and our culture because the monks, they're trying to learn the students about Khmer, the Khmer language. But yeah, but it's just the monks also get arrested, threatened and imprisoned if they do that. So it's really difficult, it's just not fair at all. Yeah, and the language is really the window to the culture, to the soul of the people. And so when we look at that, another issue that came up was the issue of the treaties. There was a very important study on treaties, agreements and other constructive arrangements between indigenous peoples and states, including peace accords, reconciliation initiatives, and constitutional recognition. I think you gave one of your most powerful speeches yesterday, it was your first talk ever at the UN. Could you share with us some of the insights that you were able to tell the world about what's going on with your people? I did do the speech on the study on treaties, agreements and other constructive arrangements. And it was about UNDRIP. So Vietnam has signed to adopt the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples and ratified the international covenants on civil and political rights and international covenants and on economic, social and cultural rights. But the thing is, they keep denying the fundamental rights of the Khmer Crown people, which means the right to self-identify as the Khmer Crown. And the recognition in the legal system as the indigenous people. And these are enshrined in Article 1 of the ICPR and also in the ICEPR, which is the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights. And also it is in Article 3 and 4 of the UNDRIP. So it's just weird because they have signed something, but they don't do it. Like, it is not right. You cannot sign something and then not doing it. It's not fair to the indigenous people at all. No, it's true. That study was so important. And now when we look at it, we have to also look at, in a way for your people, you had the European colonizer leave and then you had another settler state in Asia then take the land. And that's why usually in June, it's a day that Khmer Crown are usually quite sad, but also organizing very much around the planet. Yes, indeed, you're right. Because we're really concerned with the situation. We're indeed European colonizers illegally transferred our land to an Asian settler state. And that's why June 4 is our solemn date for us. And this day, it's where France handed over our ancestral land home to Vietnam, which was really sad, because it was without our free and informed consent. So this agreement has denied us our individual universal human rights, and also our collective rights as indigenous peoples, which is really important, you know? That's true. And then it reminds me, one of the exciting agenda items, even though this one this year was on treaties, there's been other studies that they wrote about. And the sad part, as you said, these studies now are sitting on shelves, but Vietnam's not actively trying to implement the wisdom and the recommendations from those studies. And I think one that you were looking at was the one on the child, one of the first ones, but then also the ones on education. I think women is really important to get the right education, because it's really important to still have the same education. Because you said it before, women are there to stay expected to work all day long and make rice, plant rice, and everything. So it's really not fair, because our language is already less than the Vietnamese language. So I think my opinion is to give the women the same education price to learn our language, the Thai language, the culture. And work is good. I mean, work is good to learn also, but it's really sad to think I have the education to learn everything, and the indigenous women are not. They don't have the same right to learn it, the same education that I have. So I hope in the future that they have the same education to learn Khmer, to learn about the Cambodian culture, which is Buddhism. That is like 90% of Cambodian people are Buddhists. So I hope they still get the same right like I do. I'm trying to get and fight for. No, that's a great point. I also remember that last week, Vietnam opened an exhibit on harmony, but of course not recognizing indigenous peoples calling it ethnic minor, ethnic and religious minorities. And they had a photo exhibit that's there in the, because I hear they're running for the UN Human Rights Council. How does it make you feel that a country that denies the right of self-determination, denies the right to self-identify, would now want to be on the council that's supposed to champion human rights around the world? Well, I feel about that. I still cannot wrap my mind up because, you know, how, how, how, I know, I just, I saw at the exhibition that they have one picture of the monks saying, my monks are doing the cultural music instruments, something like that. But in the reality, they are suppressing the monks. So they're just showing the outside of the world. Like, you say, I'm really good, nothing. I'm really innocent, innocent, but in real life, in the inside, it's not like that. So, yeah, it's really sad because it's really coincident because we have now the emery and also the human rights council. So it's really focusing on the human rights. And I think they know we are attending this meeting, the emery meeting. So what they did is just show the other world. Like, yeah, we are good. Don't believe them, whatever the KTF states. Don't believe them because, look, we have the exhibition about how cultural we are. We are so mixed, cultural, and every culture is open in our country. But in real life, it's not like that. So, I don't know, it was really weird because in the next room was the human rights council and we were in the next room next. This room was the human rights and this room was the meeting of the emery. So it was really weird because imagine we are neighbors and in one house, we're talking about people in this house, like what they did. And this house, like, no, we don't do it. We want to go in a good house. We want to be on the human rights council because we all marry the human rights. But in real life, they don't. No, and that really comes up to one of the themes that we'll be looking at in the coming days of the impact of development projects on Indigenous women. And I know you're very active. I've heard in some ways you're like the Khmer, Greta Thunberg, focusing on climate change. And what's exciting is there was also a major conference. There was the UN Ocean Conference that just took place in Portugal. And we know water covers 71% of the earth and 90% of that water is in oceans. And your people live right on the ocean and are impacted by sea level rise. Also the saltwater intrusion into the rice paddies. Maybe you could share why climate change is really one of the most important issues and why the oceans conference is so important as well as the COP 27 coming up. So why is it important is because we live at the Mekong Delta, Mekong water size between Cambodia and Vietnam. It's really important to keep the water level, the sea level really low because if not so, it's not a good sign when the water is above your head. It's never a good sign. So I feel like this is also an equality between us and them because yeah, I'm only in the Mekong Delta so, but I still worry about them because they are my people, so not, yeah, not that the thing about that they also, it's I'm just speechless about everything that's happening right now in the world also because the climate change also happening. The sea level is really getting higher and higher. And I have a friend who works at the Arctic. He said last week, it was 30 degrees Celsius there. It's crazy. It's supposed to be below the zero Celsius but it's no higher. So we really need to work on this otherwise it's not a good sign at all. It's true. The indigenous peoples of the Pacific really did with the high ambition coalition in Paris, push well below two degrees and aiming for 1.5 because it's really a matter of life and death and existential threat, but also really will impact your generation a great deal. So it's exciting. Maybe you can share with us why you're involved with climate and what you hope to do next with the climate after the MRAP session. After the MRAP session, I hope to push the government more and to do more to do more about the climate change, especially I feel like we're running out of time. So the sea level is higher. First thing, the second thing, it's not normal that summer is beginning that early. It's not normal to be happy that we have 40 Celsius decrease. It's not normal we still must be happy because oh yeah, the sun is shining. Wow, that is not good. It is not supposed to be that warm early in the year. And I don't remember, I mean, I now live in the Netherlands and I don't remember when the last time we had snow. I mean, when is the last time we had snow? I mean, no snow, it's not like this. No, but we used to have this much snow and we needed to be afraid and we had two, three because of the high amount of snow but how long ago was that? We saw not be happy because we saw not be happy because we can wear our swimsuits earlier in the year. That is not true. It's true, the indigenous peoples are on the front lines and are facing these threats. And while it might seem that we can get in a bikini earlier, the truth is the Marshall Islands and the Bikini et al where the tests took place, they're already potentially going to be underwater within the next seven years before the end of the global goals. And the Ocean Conference was important because the Pacific Islands and Asia took a really strong stand. 24 heads of state participated as well as 120 countries. So we really thank you for participating and sharing your experience from EBRIP and also the importance of being a climate activist and hope you'll be able to attend the climate COP that's coming up in Egypt. So you'll be able to again represent your people there to demand really that the world takes this climate catastrophe serious. Thank you for inviting me to be in your show and telling about the Emirates and about the climate activity. Aloha. Aloha. Thank you so much for watching Think Tech Hawaii. If you like what we do, please like us and click the subscribe button on YouTube and the follow button on Vimeo. You can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and LinkedIn and donate to us at thinktechhawaii.com. Mahalo.