 Welcome. Thanks for joining us. I am excited to have each and every one of you. Today we have Ashwath Naranen joining us to talk. He is the founder and CEO of Social Current and he is going to talk to us about tackling emerging social media because we all know that social media is constantly emerging. It is constantly changing and I'm sure some algorithms will also change during this 30-minute episode. So before we dive into this conversation, we want to make sure that you of course know who we are as well just in case you forgot or maybe we haven't met yet. Julia Patrick is the CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy. We owe these episodes to you my friend because without you we would not be almost two years strong. I'm Jared Ransom, super honored, privileged, all those good really fun words to say thank you for allowing me this opportunity to serve alongside you in this role as co-host also known as your nonprofit nerd CEO of the Raven Group. And we are also extremely grateful, have so much appreciation to our presenting sponsors that allow these conversations to continue, that allow us the opportunity to meet with so many thought leaders that really just have gems of profound wisdom in our sector. So thank you to our presenting sponsors. And again, without further ado, welcome. Thanks so much for joining us here today, Ashwa. Thanks. It's so exciting to be here. I love the energy already. So excited to kind of talk and I love talking about emerging media. So excited to talk to kind of social media and how you can tackle it. Oh my god. So first off, I love that you gave me permission to like, okay, yeah, you can do this. We can do this because it is such a stressor for so many nonprofits. And yet you see the ones that are doing it well. They're grabbing the brass ring, those that aren't not so good. So let's get started with how did you start social current and talk about what it is that you're doing? For sure. So I'll talk a little bit about what we do and then I'll say why we do it. So social current is a creative studio based out of DC. We work with social impact organizations and nonprofits purpose driven startups to do everything from social media management to graphic design, web development. But right now we have a huge focus on emerging media platforms. And so in the short term, that's short form content. That's TikTok, Instagram Reels, YouTube Shorts, Snapchat Spotlight and influencer marketing on these platforms. Because we believe these platforms have the best ability to reach the largest number of people at the lowest cost. And we think that's effective for nonprofits. And so that's kind of what we do. We've got a team of about 12 in DC and across the country, we're all students. So I'm a student at GW. And also we're all young people focused on helping organizations reach Gen Z as well, because we think that's a large part of kind of the upcoming donor base. And so that's one thing we do. And so why we started it. So essentially I moved from India to DC, you know, two and a half years ago. Before I moved here, I spent a lot of time working full time at a marketing agency. And so I got kind of that marketing agency expertise. But when I came here, I did kind of in-house work, I helped nonprofits with communications with social media. And I found myself doing the exact same thing again and again, because a lot of nonprofits have this need, but they can't afford full time staff or large agencies. And so we really came in to kind of be that cost efficient kind of service, but also to help nonprofits reach younger audiences more effectively to platforms like TikTok and, you know, Instagram Reels, which we are native to. And so that's really why we started it, which is out of the need. And since then, we've kind of grown to do everything from large national nonprofits to, you know, large venture back purpose driven startups. And yeah, we've done everything from running, you know, influencer campaigns that have reached millions of people to social media campaigns that have driven event registration. But yeah, exciting to kind of be here and talk through different strategies you can employ as well. Wow. You know, when you mention emerging social media and you list them, I often hear of them firsthand from my 11 year old, who knows all of this faster, more like in depth than I do. And I'm like, I told you to get off TikTok and he goes, Mom, this is like YouTube shorts. What are you talking about? I was like, Oh my gosh, how old am I? So I am thrilled to learn more about you. You are so right that our nonprofit sector, you know, there's 1.8 million nonprofits in the US. Julia and I share that often in this show. Many of these organizations, as you know, Ashwath are also working with like what I refer to as a skeleton staff. So there is so much on their plates. They wear so many different hats. So social media is often on the back burner, you know, or they just give it to anyone or any, you know, volunteer that will say, Okay, I'll take it on, but maybe without a strategy. So what you're doing here with social current is so needed, so needed. So thank you for that. And I'm hoping you can tell us more about like, how do we get started with some of these emerging social media? Because I even have a feeling, I don't even know if I should say it, but like Facebook is dead or dying. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I mean, that's a really good question. And I think it's really hard, especially because there's so many and they're so fast. And so I think the easiest way to start with the social media platform is consumption. It doesn't hurt if you're on these platforms, if you're consuming content, if you're just living on the platform without doing anything, I think then you understand what is happening because you know, social platforms are also another way to understand culture, understand the person, your people you're serving. And so even a platform like TikTok, like you would think that's dancing, that's, you know, only for kids. But TikTok is where I get all of my graphic design tips. TikTok is where I get a lot of food recipes. I get a lot of DC based kind of hacks to places to go, things like that. And so the way these algorithms are structured is whatever, whoever you are, they're going to cater to you. So you don't necessarily have to worry about like, I'm not, you know, the right fit for that platform. And so I would say just a very basic way to get started is just consume content and live on the platform a little and see what's happening because that in itself, you'll learn a lot. Great tip. I think the concept of information about learning is really important when we talk about the nonprofit sector and donors because donors change. And especially as we're looking at the economic power of younger donors, I'm wondering if you can give us an idea of why the nonprofit sector should be looking at this demographic. Because a lot of times I think we're very prejudice about this. We think, oh, they don't have any money. We need to go after the geriatric set because that's where the dollars live. For sure. I would say just a really quick statistic and I'll make sure to look it up, make sure it's right later. But 40% of the consumer market is Gen Z. And that's just, that's not audience. That's, you know, dollars. So that in itself shows the power of Gen Z. And then when you add millennials and younger millennials as well, it goes even higher. And so I think that statistic is really important to consider. And young people are buying a lot of things, but they might be buying things that they want. They're buying things that they want. They're donating to causes that they want to. And so I think it's important for nonprofits to keep that in mind when communicating with young people is like, if they're not, you know, necessarily buying or donating to you, it may not be because they don't have the money, but it might be in the messaging. It might be in what you're asking for. And so I think keeping that statistic in mind really highlights the power of young people. And also another thing with young people is like Gen Z and then Gen Alpha, the generation after Gen Z influence their parents, their siblings, people around them. And so that's another huge thing to kind of keep in mind because a lot of these social platforms and trends are being driven by young people. And so, you know, communicating and messaging and understanding what they want is very important to kind of build a future donor base, but also current donor base. Wow. I love that you said that the influence, because we don't talk about that enough. We think it goes the other direction. We think it comes down from the grandparents to the parents to the kids, but it can go up. Well, go ahead. I was just going to say, if you look at a platform like TikTok, that's a perfect example of how it went from down to up. It would started kind of a lot of kind of kids started using it, teenagers starting using it. And now there's the majority of the audience is over the age of 25. And so like it went down to up. They also have so many users and it's become a really popular app, one of the fastest going apps in the world in less than three years. And so I think that's an important down to up kind of thing to consider as well. Well, and I was going to say, you know, I've seen it in some of the programs for some of my clients in particular, when it comes to environmental issues, right? So like recycling has really, I've seen gone from down to up where our children are teaching us like, no, no, no, that doesn't go in the landfill, mom. That needs to go into the recycling bin. Or where should I put this banana peel as opposed to, you know, like let's toss it in the trash. So why not social media kind of kind of doing the same? So Ashwath, would you share, let's go into kind of like these early adopters. So when there's an emerging social media, you know, I was guilty saying like typically I learn it from my child. So who are the early adopters are of technology? And really, are they the same as our donors or our potential donor base? Yeah, I would say right now, the way it's been is there's kind of two early adopters that we've seen one is primarily Gen Z younger millennials. Those are one kind of base, which yes, they're definitely donors and they have kind of the money as we've talked about. And then the second one is the people making the technology. So you see the startup crowd, the people, software engineers, things like that. And when you look at a platform like Clubhouse, that was the crowd on there, the business crowd was on there. Again, Clubhouse didn't survive that that's a whole nother thing. But I think, you know, the makers of the software and the people who make this technology. And then I would say Gen Z and younger audiences. So those are two kind of segments, I would say they're definitely, you know, the same as donors. I think one thing to keep in mind is when, you know, an early adapter of technology, it moves from early adopters to like, you know, more really fast if the early adopters like it. And so, you know, you'll go from early adopters to people liking it really fast. And so even if the early adopters are not your target donors, they're going to be at some point really fast. And so I think just keeping an eye on what's trending in the technology space and what's working in the technology space is very important to kind of keep in mind. So did I hear you say Clubhouse is gone? I did a little bit. Yeah. Because I was wondering about that. And I was like, okay, and that was kind of an invitation only or invitation to start maybe. And I know that there were some equitable issues around that saying, you know, like, well, why do I want to be on a platform if it's not accessible to all people? So it had an inequitable business practice. So yeah, tell me about this. So like also feel like, okay, we might jump onto an emerging social media platform. And then before we know it, it's like gone. Right. Yeah, I think, you know, Clubhouse, I was on Clubhouse from the start, but I never liked it primarily because of that kind of it wasn't accessible to people. I think like, you know, it's a good marketing strategy to make it invite only because people want to be on something that's invite only. It's not a good, exactly. It's exclusive. It's not a good brand strategy, though. It's not a good way to build an accessible brand that people want to go to. And so I think that was important to consider. And then in the app, you know, it was audio only, but you know, you couldn't see subtitles, you couldn't see, you know, it wasn't accessible to people with disabilities. And I think that was a huge problem with the app when you look at, you know, other platforms, they're more accessible with alt text with subtitles, things like that. And so I think that was primarily another reason. But I think the concept of Clubhouse is very powerful, which is audio. I think audio is going to be very important in the future. That's why you see podcasts that are so important. And I think Clubhouse was a really clever way of having podcasts. But I think another way, you know, Clubhouse lack podcast is people listen to podcasts because they're very well crafted on Clubhouse. It was unfiltered. And so I think that's another thing with like audio. But I think the concept will live on in the future. I am not sure how. One thing I've been kind of experimenting or testing with is short form audio. I think there's something someone's going to build something around short form audio where like you hear three to five minute sound bites or one to three minute sound bites is a podcast series and things. I think that might be something that we see in the next one to two years. Maybe someone's already building it. But I think Clubhouse was not the right platform for audio. You know, I say we are executive producer Kevin Pace does that pretty much with every show. He picks out the 60 seconds of wisdom and then he repackages that. And when we look at the numbers, it's amazing how those have gone up because yeah, we are getting shorter attention spans and we need more quicker, you know, inputs into our what we're tackling. And so it makes sense. Okay, now I got to ask another really big question. And this is a tough, tough question. But how do we know when it's time to adopt something? I mean, so they're going to be viewers out there that are like, what clubhouse is gone? We were just like trying to figure out how to get on. I mean, how do you know when it's too early or too late? I think it's a combination of both art and science. I don't think it's like, you know, hard metrics or like, okay, this happens. And I know it's a new platform. But I think, you know, when when you see people around you on it. So one thing with Clubhouse is like, I knew like five other people that were randomly like, I'm on clubhouse. And so I think with social media word of mouth is very important to keep in mind when looking at a new platform, because the whole concept of social media is your friends are on there. And so seeing how many of your friends are on there or how many people are kind of, you know, on that platform, I think is an important thing to consider. And then with kind of emerging media, you know, you can always see the kind of technology that's there. So for example, like, you know, we, we can imagine going back to only photo sharing anymore, right? Because we've gone through that. And so looking at, you know, what technology is there, whether it's audio, whether it's video, I think it's important to consider. And then with clubhouse, the accessibility of things like, is it open to everyone? And is it available to everyone? I think it's important to consider. So I would say those are some things to know. I don't there's no like specific time, which is like, you know, if this happens, you adopt a new technology. But I would say like, it's important to try things out, like it doesn't hurt you to test on a platform and for it to not work out. But it might hurt you if you never test on a platform. And so I think testing things out and being on different platforms, even if that's just from a consumption perspective, is important to consider when it comes to all these platforms. And then I think also looking at kind of social trends around the world, I think in the US we focus heavily on the United States and culture here. But I think if you look at, you know, Asia and China in particular, they're far ahead. And when it comes to social platforms, like, we can't even fathom like, in-app purchases, like TikToks just launching in-app purchases, Instagram, you know, recent, they've gone way ahead on in-app purchases where like, if you're watching a recipe, you can add all the ingredients to your cart and check it out immediately. And so looking at other countries and what trends they're bringing is important. And I think TikTok taught everyone the lesson where like, TikTok came from China and no one's not coming. But to be fair, it was there for a long time and people did see it coming. People just didn't want to. And so I think that's kind of also important to look at is like, what are other countries doing and what's popular there? I love that you reiterated what you said when we started the show was the consumption. So if you start anywhere or you don't know where to start, start simply by consuming and experiencing this new platform. And I'm curious, Ashwath, if you will talk a little bit about the overwhelm, the overload of all the platforms. I feel like for me in particular, as an individual, as a parent, as a business owner, as a consultant, I've been on so many platforms. And at a certain time, it's like, I'm done. I'm done. So would you be willing to talk to us about that kind of like when is when is too many too much? And then also kind of this overwhelm? Yeah, I think I think it's definitely important to kind of set habits. I think behaviorally, you have to understand that you need to implement this stuff into behavior. And so for one thing, kind of I do with social and I have to be on social a lot because I run an agency. But I think for me, I only consume social at like certain points. So if I have five minutes before a meeting, that's when I'll consume social. And so trying to like, because then five minutes later, I can't continue scrolling. I have a meeting, I have to go. And so like, if you're if you've got five minutes in the car, you know, you can do that, or like you're waiting to pick someone up, you can scroll. But then if you have an hour or two, you won't be on social. And so I think like using social in times where you can, you know automatically that you're restricted is what what I've used kind of for me to avoid myself from going on social because apps like TikTok or Instagram or Facebook, like the whole goal is to have you be there for as long as humanly possible. And so they build that in sell the features. And so you want to use it when you know you have to stop that way, you're not kind of continuing. And then from the perspective of like content creation, these platforms, because that's a lot too, I think repurposing content is something that a lot of people don't do enough, but also because there's not enough tools for that. And so I'm going to do a shameless promo of one of our clients, which is they're building essentially a video solution where you can upload videos, you can get a transcript, you can it's like Canva but for video, so you can get a transcript, you can get a clip, you can get a GIF, you can write a blog post with the transcript, you can resize it to Instagram, Facebook, you know, LinkedIn, Instagram reels, you can do it on TikTok. And so you can take one piece of content and repurpose it. And that often is a very easy way for you to, you know, be on multiple platforms without designing 10 different graphics for 10 different platforms and just like trying to meet those requirements. And so I think that's one thing I would recommend too. And what's the name of that company? They're milk.video. Milk.video. Okay, cool. That's brilliant. Yeah. We're going to have to look into that, Jared. And we're almost 400 shows episodes in, in this period of time. And that's not all of the 60-second lessons that Kevin Pace, our executive editor, has done. So we have tons of content. And I do see that. I mean, we're, there are times, Ashworth, where we could be pulling that back in because something's happened or it's a certain time of the year or whatever. And yet we, we let go all of this content. And I think a lot of nonprofits feel that way, you know, they have different times of the year where they're trying to market or share or unite the community around a certain topic. And then it seems like they've got to start all over. They just let all that content go. 100%. And it's really hard. And I would also say like, knowing that it's not easy, like it's not easy to repurpose content. Like it is a hard thing. And so like, knowing that you're not alone, like that, like people who, you know, are able to do that, like they have teams or they have really good, you know, really good software stack. And so if you're not able to do that, like that is completely fine. And also like, if you're not able to get something out like in two hours, that's fine too. Like, you know, content doesn't have to live for 24 hours. It can live longer. And I think a lot of the tips and a lot of the insights that you might want to share, you know, if they're only living for a day, then maybe you want to refocus on insights that live longer because I think, you know, giving yourself time to repurpose content is also key. And being patient with it is also very important. Okay, I don't think anyone's ever said that. It's always just the opposite. There's always this pressure to get it out, get it out now. And even to the point where I think you see a lot of crap, to be honest, getting out, because it's rushed. And then you're on to the next thing. So I like that you just said that to be a little bit more patient and thoughtful. It kind of also makes me think, Jared, that maybe in the nonprofit sector, we worry so much about who's sitting in the chair in our office, and that we need to be expanding our knowledge and an outreach to working with the consultants and the providers that aren't sitting in our offices, but that we're partnering with. Well, you know, I have said this, and I will say it again and again and again, that our sector has been long overdue for a shake-up. And I have heard too many times of nonprofit leaders, whether it's a grant writer, whether it's a social media manager, whomever to say, I need this person in the office. I need them physically, visually here in the office. But I think where we fall behind, we nonprofit sector, is that we don't let the experts be the experts. Right. And so we have Ashwath, we have this amazing social current team. Yes, they're in DC, but they're experts. Right. And so why not utilize this level of expertise to help move our mission-driven goals forward. So I think there needs to be more of that. I know that as we're seeing this great resignation and this negotiation of people in their current jobs, but also seeking new jobs, remote is here to stay. And I really think that that is going to be a great open door opportunity to engage with these experts in all levels. It's pretty remarkable. Okay, Ashwath, we don't have much time. I've got one more crystal ball question for you. And that is, if we're adopting some of these new technologies and these new platforms, what percentage of business do you think that we should strive for? So for example, let's say we look at our pie of donors and their activity. If we are to adopt new technologies, really engage in social media, what kind of bump do you think that that will happen or will impact our nonprofits? Or is there a number that we should say, okay, we're going to strive to get, and I'm just making this a 5% increase in donors or 3% or 30, what do you advise your clients? Yeah, I would say, especially in the start, I would look at it 3 to 5% and then bumping that over time to a 10%, I think at least from social directly. And then I would also look at kind of converting maybe like another 10% of all the social content through ads or influencer marketing or paid and using all the creative that you're doing for that initial 10% to get another 10% by paying for that 10%. And so I would say that we are able to get 20%. And then I would also kind of encourage using pulling people out of social, so doing webinars, using social at the top of the funnel and then converting them to webinars, programs, courses, things like that, so that you're adding on kind of other screens of revenue, but also increasing our audience. I think using social as a top of the funnel mechanism versus like a middle of the funnel, I think is very important in terms of marketing is like social is where people see you and come in, and then you have to do all the other work inside of that to get them to kind of stay and get them to donate. So that's what I... Yeah, I think you're right. I mean, you have to... I love what you said. You got to do the work. You get the introduction, but you can't stop. You got to do the work. I love that I would refer to it as that sales funnel, the sales cycle. And that's exactly what we're doing. So we're reaching them social media, but then where are we taking them through the journey to become more involved, more engaged, more tied to our mission with the ultimate goal to really gain a new investor regardless of demographic, regardless of age. Earlier this week, we had a conversation about cryptocurrency, and I'm imagining, Ashwath, that there is a huge overlap in the individuals that are on these emerging social media platforms giving through crypto as opposed to, as I'm going to quote, my sensei, Julia Patrick. I know when it comes to this geriatric donor database, it's like we need to be in the emerging frontline, whether it's social media, whether it's the actual financial transaction. And I think really these two marry themselves quite well. Yeah, 100%. I'm seeing a lot of uptake in social impact projects and the NFT space and decentralized technology. I think that's definitely going to be a huge part of donations, at least going forward. I don't think we're at that stage yet where people can do it at scale, but we're definitely in that early adopter stage where nonprofits that are able to get into the space are benefiting. I also, you know, the NFT space is a bubble right now, so I would make sure to do all research as much as possible when doing it. I'm not the expert on NFTs or crypto, but I've been kind of exploring the space, trying to figure out what I can do there because I don't know exactly. Exactly. I'm consuming right now. And I would recommend consuming, you know, one thing I've done is I bought, you know, an NFT just like it was a random thing. I don't even know what to buy, but I was like, okay, I'm not investing in this. I'm just buying this. I'm just trying the whole process. And like you don't have to spend thousands of dollars. You can spend, you know, $50 and buy a really small thing or really, you know, it doesn't even have to be good, but I would say like trying the whole process and exploring it is one way to kind of start consuming in this space. I loved, I love, love, love so many of the things that you said today, really, really impactful. Here's your information, socialcurrent.com. Check them out, really some great ideas. I love, love, love what you said about the consumption aspect and how we move forward with a lot of our decision making if we understand what it means to be a part of it and be a part of that space. Socialcurrent has a bright future. In the chitty chat chat, if you were with us, your team's working with somebody, a big team in our community, on the other side of the country. So that's pretty exciting. So that spoke volumes to me. Hey, again, I'm Julia Patrick, CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy. I've been joined by my dear friend, the nonprofit nerd herself. I always say she's my nonprofit nerd, your nonprofit nerd, the nonprofit nerd, Jared Ransom. Again, we want to thank all of our sponsors without you. We would not be here having these robust discussions. And as we like to end every episode, we want to remind you to stay well so you can do well. We'll see you back here everyone tomorrow. Have a great day.