 Good afternoon and welcome back to the touchline on Y254, Max Olazike is my name, this time round we're going to speak about the state of rugby in the country in the wake of relegation of Kenya National Rugby Sevens team Shujja from HSBC World Seven series, remember they were locking horns against Canada and they lost that particular fixture and prior to that fixture there was Unwavering rallying from a million of Kenyans led by Cabinet Secretary Zababu Namwamba and Elido while releasing a video clip saying how they are supporting Shujja to win against Canada so that remain HSBC World Seven series, something that failed to materialize and of course we are delving into that particular conversation with one person who has been a news maker on social media platforms Rallying behind Kabras Rugby football club in the local Kenya Cup scene, Jerima, good to see you, how are you doing? Good Imakilele, what inspires you to push for all this? I love supporting the boys, I've actually been to the legs in Vegas when I was in the US, so we would go there, we had a hashtag, I think kili origine tu kukenya, hashtag jazastadi, so we would hashtag jazastadi and we'd go cheer the boys there, so it's been a continuous thing but my support would be when I wasn't even 18 years old And you've never thought of, at your tender age you've never thought of probably featuring for Kenya lionesses or something No Just love for the sport Wow, that's nice game right? I think it is really nice because the first thing for you to be a fan is you have to identify your sport at a very young age because I don't think you can really delving and love a sport when you're 30 You really have to start when you're really young so that you get to understand the rules and all the dynamics, so you know 16, 17, find something to do a sport and just love it for your whole life So having been in the United States, did you get an opportunity to meet our guy, is it Mike Friday or Paltru? Mike Friday, I met him, almost all the legs I attended, 17, 18, 19, I met him and I met the boys, the egos, I met them there in the hotel How does it feel having lost him to United States considering the love he enjoyed from Kenyans? Does he miss Kenya? He does and actually he even communicates with Kenyans on social media Yeah I normally see his tweets So he still loves Kenya and that's why we still call him Otoya up to date, his name has never changed Now let's speak about what happened in the midweek regarding our relegation from HSBC World Seven series Kenyan National Plan B7 team Shujia did their best, they gave their all but you know, was it luck or we didn't prepare or it was time, it was ripe for our relegation Well, personally, myself, I'll admit and few friends of mine, we were like, let's just get relegated kus tuna pushiki tu inakata We were, it has been in the pipeline all along for us to get relegated If you remember during Murunga Zera 2018-19, we almost got relegated And then we pushed hard, we fought for it, I remember even one of the players in Vegas, Ali Cheza, Akiwana Injari Like you see these guys really struggling and here we are, now we are relegated So the next thing is now we have to play next year for, see we are going to get back to the HSBC and this is it Can we use this opportunity to put a house in order so that we make a stylish comeback in the series? Two ways, yes you can, but I think it will be very very hard to find other competitors who are fighting to go back into HSBC with you I think that will be harder than going for something in the HSBC Sevens But also I think you can put a house in order when you are still in the top league That would have been best for Kenya because you have to think of what the Sevens has meant to Kenyans personally over the past 10-15 years Year in year out you see Kenya in Vegas, Kenya all over the world, you see a flag there But now you move to a league which is not that documented as compared to the HSBC So a lot of things will come from that and I think when it comes to putting a house in order in terms of finances also That will be a key area because I think the remuneration will be different from what they usually get So it is a chance to do it but they will have to fight fight fight a lot for it to happen You know the guys who feature for Kenya National rugby Sevens team are the fantastic professionals People who give their all excellent patriots I occasionally meet Bilio Diambo but I haven't met him At least one of the experienced players, a guy was dedicated his commitment playing for Kenya Ensuring that glory gets to be brought back home But I'm pretty sure you are in constant touch with some of these players What does they feel like, their mood considering the relegation We played at the big stage in HSBC World Seven series at top level But now suddenly you come into the lower tiers Well I feel bad for the boys, the fact that we have the young blood The likes of Abu Kuse, Wang Wekesha, Tanga, Anya, King George that is Oro Those are like some young people who are trying to get there and be like the next Bilio But now what have we done to them, we are there we can't help them I can't blame the players because they don't select themselves But the whole siyasa politics at KRU that is pushing even the coaches to recycle players Is what the issue like, that should be the huge issue the KRU should be focusing on Yes we failed, we failed support the boys, we failed support the coach And now here we are what next Because if we are at KRU right now, we have a game next year in April To try and see if we are going back to HSBC, I would start training right now Get 26 players, train them, pole pole, we get the best facilities That way come next year we get in Also we have an invitation coming up in New York, I think next month if I'm not wrong That's a chance for the boys to shine Because they are winning money, go in get the money And then just have an agreement with KRU, if we play we win This money I think you just get 5% the rest is ours So sufficient preparations are key And you have mentioned about recycling of players I've seen the squad has been you know, jail of experience and new blood Did it work for the betterment and success of the team Kind of kind of not Because any coach should have a team A If you don't have a team A then what are you doing Like you say this is my team in Ngaingia We are playing Canada and we have to fight these guys Team A and Ngaingia Substitute pole pole, what did we do, we didn't do that We put in waze, which is a Bonda rugby We can be playing Bonda rugby when we are getting relegated You play such rugby when you have 100 plus points You see, you can risk it You have like few hours to come before you get relegated Now Ken, are you in agreement? Because we've heard, you know, high profile players Before they have retired, Colin Sinjera One of the old time tri-scorers You know, Mando Amonde the captain And the guy who was played in professional friend football He did a wedding recently, I'm forgetting his name Nani, William Baka William Baka, the man himself Very fantastic professional, he was also Phenomenally featured in Fokeja National rugby 7 team And you know we have heard several players Who have exited the scene But now, can we blame it on transition We delayed putting in place mechanisms That could have helped in proper transition I think what you said the delay in mechanisms I think that's one thing that should really be looked at Because these mechanisms are just not identifying the players And getting them shoot in You know, as she has said You know when the tournament is said to be Train these players, have a look at them for ample time Rather than you know lack and the season starts And that's when you're learning your players Because I feel like that is also something That may have been happening The coach came into the job Like almost halfway Some players do the whole COVID thing And then now you have to learn the players As each leg comes and you know It doesn't give you the full view of What exactly you're handling Even if you try to mix the youth and experience There will still be a gap I think that's one thing that has really really had The Kenyan rugby And also you look at The simple mistakes I feel like they've been making There are some really easy mistakes that Consistent training and you know A coach who can really push it on them Things could have not gone south for Kenya So for mechanisms I think They have to look way ahead of what's going to come And you know start really really early Because these players are good players But getting them into a team and mixing them up That's where the problem starts For KRU and also for Kenyan rugby in general, yeah You've mentioned about politics at Kenya rugby Right now as you speak You have new officials at the helm of the Kenyan after elections, Sasha Mutai Kwanjiti Saveha and our good friend Passion for rugby now is at the helm As the president having replaced Ganglodoru decided not to defend this It and we have Board of directors Including Amfri Kayanga, man who has also featured Prominently for Kenyan rugby And now in charge of Squad development I don't know What We blame when you say Politics at Kenya rugby We blame everyone Everyone thinks because If you are the chairman You have to sit down with your directors And say this is what I have for the next 2 years Or the next 3 months or the next 6 months Like 15s Who are we to blame? Gangi wasn't there When 15s the Karikap was being planned We can't blame him for that We've put it out of Karikap, right? We don't have funds So we failed to Win Bats Cup Kenyan 15s Also known as Simba We drew out of Karikap Shuja We went to HBC We go for invitation We never get invitation Right now we are playing somewhere in Madagaska That's why I think Sasha is We had a game for Kenya in SAJUZI And we lost On Wednesday On Wednesday It was a proper thrashing So literally rugby is just Dying dying We have a game coming up in July What are we doing? Are they even training? They should be in a camp right now So it's quite devastating As far as matters rugby is concerned What do we do? To get back to You know where we were to restore the lost glory We need to sit down with Mange Mude And the likes of Kina Khadi What did you do then That we are not doing now For us to get where you guys were That we are not now But I think most of the people you have At some point they have worked with Mange Mude Sasha at some point worked with Mange Mude Yes correct So they understand what is supposed to be done And can we say it is too early To blame the current leadership Because they have just got into the office the other day Because the minute you get the hand of a file You know this is what I am expected to do In the next 1, 2, 3 weeks And this is what I should be trying to get Because it sucks like It hurts right now As you think of 15s they didn't play today We were supposed to host the games here in Kenya Apparently we didn't have money to host We don't have money to take the players out there Then what do we have? And Ken, you know as a player You get to feel demotivated When such a thing happens right? Ya ya And something she said She was talking about Chipu They have a game in July Ya we have a game in Nyayo Ya and they are not training And I think a couple of weeks When the bats were starting We had the same complaint From the coach right? Ya them not being in camp And you know When you say a new leadership has stepped in I think something like that they saw But they are still not acting on it In a different situation So you know they need to recheck What priorities are there For the players themselves Especially the young ones right now They are asking the same questions Maybe we are asking What are we doing till then And that greatly demotivates you Because it shows you to some extent That you are not in someone's plans Because they are not funding you They are not calling you into camps They are not preparing you mentally So you know that really kills Of the motivation because I feel like For a good foundation We need to take care especially of Chipu Because they will carry the flag For more years than you know The more established players So for player motivation They themselves Chipu See that the major teams Having pay bills and all They just ask themselves Is it worth it Because as things stand It's a really really risky place To be where there is no funds There are no games you are playing It's really risky for the player's motivation And when Kairu says that Finale problem Is the main challenge Which we probably zonet Well with them and read from the same script With them and Just earlier on We were talking about Corporate Confidence in Kenyan sporting Activities and stakeholders And how you know In other disciplines like golf and rally They have been attracting and Wavering sponsorships from Local corporates KCB What do we do To also translate the same Into rugby Considering how rugby does as proud Just wearing that jazzy On the international platform And raising the Kenyan flag And winning Singapore 7s in 2016 Under the Trailage of our good lead friend Benjamin Aimba It's such a huge thing Playing Vancouver 7s Playing Los Angeles 7s You know that's advertising Kenyan Putting it when they wrote Ma Paswaras international Sinis concern I think the main issue is People see when Fans are complaining I won't lie to you Some fans have big people Or even ex sponsors following them So they may need to start complaining About mismanagement of fans in Kairu I think there is any sponsor who want to touch them No one, they are all back off Because if I give you a million today Then the next day I am seeing players complaining We haven't had our allowance We haven't had our pay These players need to eat They need to pay their bills They have maybe families to take care of And they cannot afford But every day they are representing us as Kenyans Not even Kairu Kenyans, the whole country So people tend to I would too I would too I would too And nowadays when someone investing They need to get value for their money For their money So value for this money is Negative And in this case it should be Proper packaging, proper branding How How they will reap from That investment And whatever they will get in return Max ask yourself When Mwangi Mude In the leadership back in the day We had Safarikom We had Kenya Ayame Qatar was going to come in If you remember so well What happened? Mismanagement of fans After Mwangi Mude left We started with pay bills M Changa Go find me Players can't pay bills Even sponsors are feeling bad They are like Why are we paying the money At the end of the day these players Have to go beg fans for money And I happened to Serve with Mwangi Mude In FKF category committee And we used to meet Regularly along the corridors At Nya National Stadium and I could ask him Chaman, Mr. Chaman Now that you know our rugby Is doing the way it's doing We were planning probably to make a comeback But he was very categorical That he's ready for consultancy He can advise where appropriately Whenever he gets reached upon He wouldn't be reluctant to give His pro-born advice on how To run the game And probably maybe the current leaders Can reach out to him And he would not be reluctant to share His insights on how the game Can be managed There is that time and there is this time And things are getting Dynamical maybe That was that time And this is the time where New leaders need to Co-opt how sport is evolving Ken? And I totally agree with that Because times also change In terms of leadership and trends Especially when you look at Where we are living right now Taf economic situations More sharp than those who are here before You can console those who are here before But you understand the situation now is different If you are coming into this role You expect hardship And I think that is something This kia ril under Sasha may have expected But in early stages In the early days they have failed To deal with it Because I think when you are running for something When you want to become something You have plans and you can see the foreseeable future We went past the national elections You knew that there was a deep hole coming In terms of the economic times But still We see the same things happening That have been happening For a couple of years now I think we need the leadership To really recheck What they are mandate Because as it stands now I don't see anything different Coming up soon There is no indication that there will be An immediate sponsor I just feel like it will continue Because that is the situation across Multiple sports in this country You mean Kenyans are getting pessimistic about The state of our sports in the country Yes, it's that bad It's that bad What is that attributed to? Why? Why the change of tune? Because you can feel like When everything is going down the slope And that is where we are right now Nothing seems to work All the Let's call them Chipu, Lioness, 15, Kenya 7 Where are they? Nothing is working out at all How about our league? The state of our league It's bad Because it should be an integral form Of the breakthrough we supposed to witness At the national level When our league is quality Then we need to Witness quality At the national level In terms of Shujia and Simbas Maybe it's as Nick had said It might take years It might take years Because tell me Those people who face relegation The young players We really think right now they have the Psych to go back again They don't have the motivation So without motivation that's where we'll have the hiccups Watch and see so many players they retire right now And considering There is this stereotype that most of The rugby players are serious professionals Having studied at the university As a lawyer As a quantity surveyor As an engineer What you are trying to insinuate is that Most of these players will quit Rugby as a sport And now concentrate on their Careers Which they did at the college and university level Because if rugby is not paying Or helping them pay their bills Why would they be there Yet they know their employment They'll get the money and Pay their bills without struggle Without having to balance to wake up at E You're waking up at 5 For you to get up to training Go train, go to work Or even some good training in the afternoon You don't even have family time The game that is denying you Ampo family time School games It is supposed to be the bedrock of Our rugby As massive investment been put In our school games because Understand, like Kenyua at Apa Hill You said how you were informed With Johnstone O'Lindi Who is now a serious player to the Kenya Rugby Sevens team level And Has there been much priority And concentration Being School games, which chan a lot of talents To the national sides I think there was hype around Butula when they did It was a really big hype But we haven't seen How these kids are going To be pushed into the setup But I think the advantage In this time that we have Is I think a lot of university sides Are really up for it They are really up for rugby A lot of them in the championship Some in the Kenya Cup And I think if they can do the job For KRU and get these kids Into scholarships, into their teams I think that will be a huge advantage For them also To have rugby and a career I think college or university education Is important so that if one doesn't go The other carries you So I think the recent growth Of university sides wanting to compete More wanting to be in the Kenya Cup Investments from their schools Sporting department I think that's one thing we can really look at But it will always be down to KRU how they setup The training camps Even clinics for these kids When they are half time or something It's always down to them To have these concrete things To transition these kids Into professionals Like get them from Butula And switch them to people From Koyonzo But you know when you throw a stone From shards In my anguka kwa mabati Ya Koyonzo secondary And you know they conquered at rugby During school games last year at 15th And they even represented the country In East Africa and Tani And no much structures Have been put in place to ensure That there is continuity So that players we get to witness At the school level are feeder programs And it's been an insightful conversation indeed Jerry, thank you for coming Probably your last sentiments Before we conclude I would say We should not blame the players And personally as a fan I'm proud of you Of what you did out there But it's time to regroup We do a whole clean up in KRU Whoever is not working We step out And we bring in new people We have a good coach Who is a coach assistant Damian Maklath No, the assistant coach Kenya 7 Wambua Kevin Wambua Kevin Wambua Should take over the Kenya 7 He should start training them right now And just proceed as a coach You know Allow me to ask some last question You know these people Who are widely travelled like yourself You said you've been in the United States But there is this concern And they never do benchmarking So that when they come back home Something they learnt They can suggest it To be incorporated into our system When you are in the U.S. What did you learn that Probably if it gets To be proposed back home Naikue It is the idea of growth of our game Have you attempted to reach out To clear you and probably give suggestions If I did they would block me I just make I just make noise on my Twitter Whether it reads or my Facebook Whether it reads and if they Won't have it they can go sit down And discuss as coaches and take over there But it sucks to see that Rag b If an instance Aimbua Woke up today I want to die again This is not where he left Rag b And this is not what he dreamt of Rag b Ever coming to an end Because this is not the best way To ever see the game die And we hope we will bounce back next year We just hope so We hope we will bounce back next year That is a proper Finishing line As we Do conclusion of this particular segment As far as discussion and insightful Conversation it's been on the state of Rag b In the country in the wake of you know the location Of Kenya Rag b7 team Shujia from HSBC World 7 series Remember we were playing against Canada on Sunday But bad day in the office we got defeated And therefore we will have to come back To the lower tiers as you know we Try to put a house in order And probably make a stylish comeback Next year it's been a pleasure Doing this Jerry My thank you for coming through Kenya Of course it's still with us don't go away stay tuned We continue start line Y255 is the hashtag that was taken by Maxwell Ken Was your twitter handle And your twitter handle the one you make Noison At two Jerry but Is an underscore between JNA So we continue you know talking about state of Rag b Even after the conclusion of the Segment on this Particular platform don't go and stay tuned We coming up with international football review Ahead of champions league finale City Up against international 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