 They've been saying, we don't have a quorum yet. This is not an official meeting yet. I just said that, so that's fine, I guess. OK, this is not a quorum. But now we're live, right, Guilford? You are being recorded. Thank you. OK. Well, do we want to get started with our presenter? Yeah, and I'm going to message Tate right now. I'll message both Joe and Tate. Yeah. And you said Stefan already told you that he's not coming? He's a no, yeah. So OK, so do we want to just read that statement about, oh, we're having a non-meeting, but I guess we can still read it. Yeah, it's not a meeting, so it doesn't matter. Yeah, we don't need to read a statement, yeah. Yeah, but I acknowledge it's actually a meeting. But can we let even from the waiting room, please, Guilford? No. Guilford. Just go stay there. Yes, please. There she goes. So should we get started with Stella? Stella? Yeah. Are you ready? Welcome, Stella. Yeah. Thank you so much for having me. This is hopefully just a very informal beginning of a conversation, but I did prepare some slides. Well, actually, a lot of them aren't my slides that I'll share. Let's see. So my name is Stella D, and I'm currently on eCAC. And we've been talking for a while about how it would be great to collaborate more closely with TAC. We've probably been talking about that on eCAC for almost a year, and it just has taken till now, which is great. But so I was just hoping to give a little bit of background that maybe you all know, but this is also perhaps for the benefit of people who watch these meetings on YouTube or what have you, on what eCAC has been doing for the last couple of years, what we're doing now, and then what we see as some particularly compelling places to collaborate with TAC. So this was, I should also say, I don't know that I'm the best person on eCAC to present on the CARP, which is the Climate Action Adaptation and Resilience Plan, because I wasn't really, I wasn't on eCAC for its writing and development. So if you have any questions on this, I may or may not be able to answer them, but it is a very long document, and there's many people who are happy to answer those questions. So the Climate Action Adaptation and Resilience Plan was this really amazing document, which I think you all probably got the link to. And that started in the summer and fall of 2020. Well, it started before then. But that's when there were task groups that were assigned. And there was a lot of community input. There were a lot of focus groups chaired by eCAC members. And then there was a review, and it was adopted by the town manager. And the CARP calls for sets out climate, pretty ambitious climate goals for Amherst, with CO2 emissions being 25% below 2016 levels by 2025, 50% below by 2030. And carbon neutrality compared to 2016 levels by 2050. Some plan principles include equity, accessibility, and belonging. Racial and climate justice is a really important part of the plan, local wealth creation and fair distribution, and community involvement and connections. And then the sectors of the plan, it laid out pretty specific goals for governance and communications, buildings, renewable energy, land use and natural systems, transportation and infrastructure. And I should stress that because this was adopted by the town, this is theoretically now supposed to guide all of the work of the town. Governance and communications, I'll kind of skim through the ones that aren't transportation, because that's really, I think, where the focus of TAC is and the focus of my communication with TAC is. But there's governance and communication, these broad principles of enhancing equity, increasing participation and leading by example. And then under these broad principles, there's more specific goals that are up to 2025 and then split into up to 2025 and then 2025 and beyond. So that includes multilingual municipal communications and then an example of one for beyond 2025 is supporting universal broadband internet access. Then there's buildings, which ECAC recently has been spending a lot of time on buildings. Those broad principles are energy efficiency, beneficial electrification, affordability, and quality of life. And PACE is something that we've really been focusing on, which is the property-assessed clean energy and then beyond 2025, hopefully including establishing building energy performance standards. Some of this also gets into a recent initiative for an enhanced stretch code that we're pushing for. So land use in natural systems includes growing food locally, good stewardship practices, and balancing competing land uses. The more specific goals include increasing access to green space, recreation and community gardens, and fostering a coordinated regional food system. OK, and then here we get to transportation infrastructure. Sorry, did you have a question? Sorry, Guilford, can you just let Tayden too? Sorry to interrupt. Oh yeah, no worries. Now we have a quorum. Now you need to start the meeting. OK, we will officially start the meeting, which is always a good thing. Can I just interrupt you then and read Stella? I'm just going to start the meeting. Sorry about that. Pursuant to Governor Baker's March 12, 2020 order suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law, this meeting of the TAC is being conducted via remote participation. It's now this meeting has officially started, and we are getting a presentation currently from Stella Deet, who is talking to us as a member of ECAC on the work that they've done so far. So go ahead, Stella. Yeah, I'm sure. Sorry. No, of course. So transportation and infrastructure, the CARP, well, stated that the broad goals are encouraging mode shifting, decarbonizing vehicles, achieving zero waste, and preparing for climate impacts. This is mostly preparing for climate impacts to infrastructure and transportation infrastructure in this context. So in the roadmap to 2025, that included prioritizing transportation safety and accessibility, transitioning rapidly to zero emission vehicles, and developing an evidence-based zero waste policy. Beyond 2025, that included developing a robust alternative transportation network, supporting regional transportation demand management, facilitating zero emissions, electric vehicle car sharing, apartment complexes, mainstreaming zero waste infrastructure and programs, integrating climate adaptation and water resources management, and then preparing the infrastructure for climate and community resilience. So that was basically the work of the CARP. It's a very large document, again, with a lot in it. But that's the CARP in a nutshell. Does anybody have any questions on that? No? Great. No, thank you. And I know some of us had participated. I had participated. I know you've had participated in the transportation working group. Amazing. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I hadn't even made that connection, Tracy. I was just going to say, I've never seen this document, which is really pathetic, and it looks amazing. And anyway, yeah. Eve was there. Yeah. So I guess you did see some small part of it. But that's great. That's why I'm here. Everybody is very busy. And so yeah. So our current ECAC vision and charge is to work cooperatively with the town and community to raise climate awareness and achieve results with a sense of urgency. In everything we do, we will put environmental justice at the forefront of our decisions. And this is the slide that we've been initiating all of our meetings with. Recently, it was created by our chair, Vasu Raghavan. And I want to point out here that one of our subcharges is to liaise with multiple member bodies, businesses, and residents, regional organizations, and institutions on programs and policy, which I would say includes you all. So this is what we had suggested for the town manager goals 2023, which is something we were working on. And with respect to transportation, I would say the things that jump out are the taking necessary steps towards and supporting the town council and developing a waste hauler bylaw that is feasible and meets the goals of offering universal curbside compost pickup and pay as you throw fee structure. And if adopted, start implementation. That's ongoing. Stephanie Sigarello, who's our town liaison and the town sustainability director, is currently working on completing a fleet vehicle inventory for all of the town vehicles. It sounds like that's a pretty involved process that I think will take some time, but that's also transportation-related. I'm thinking about whether or not to highlight anything else. I would say the creating a climate goals community dashboard would perhaps be relevant to some of the stuff that we could work on together, because I love the bike and pedestrian safety plan that you all are working on. And it seems like some of that might be relevant if we were to create a community dashboard, also for the greenhouse gas inventory. So for the 2025 roadmap, what we've done on ECAC is we've split this up. So one person is kind of point person on these different goal categories. We only have one person on each because it gets tricky with open meaning law to collaborate. So any collaboration we try to do in the meeting, but there is collaboration on all of these. There's just not offline communication kind of in accordance with open meeting law. So we've split them up into heat pumps and as a subset of residential energy, thinking about regional and state collaboration, everything to do with solar because obviously the solar survey is going on right now and that's a little bit of a category of its own. Transportation, which I'm the point person on right now and see pace. So for heat pumps and transportation, we've been having an educational series. There have been two in transportation so far. And I think a really nice next one perhaps would be for one of you all to come present if you wanted to. So far we've had a presentation by Erin Convery who's the transportation planning manager for the city of Durham. And she talked about just what they're doing there to support like a just transition with respect to transportation. And then yesterday we had somebody from the drive green team from green energy consumers come talk about electric vehicles. So for anybody watching the recording or anything these are both available or the one from yesterday might take a little bit but they'll both be available on YouTube. And we've split off the education series as separate from just our meeting. So you can also just watch the education series if you want to. And then the main thing I'm just here to talk about is possible future collaboration with TAC. So would anybody want to come present on your plan and current TAC activities? Visu pointed out that would be really great to collaborate on the goal setting process for the town manager in fall of 2023. And then I can imagine it would be nice to co-sponsor in-person events. Like I had watched a couple of your meetings from back in the summer and I watched one that was about the walk bike roll to school day, I think. And maybe next year trying to get something together for that. And then other just wondering what thoughts you all had and what's going on over in TAC. I have a question related to that. I mean, I do think it's interesting how ECAC put together goals for the town manager. Now is ECAC a committee under the town manager or? Yeah, we're a great question. We're under the town manager. So we, TAC, are advised the town manager. Yeah, we have a town council liaison, but really we're supposed to be advising the town manager. But also, but the town manager does the appointments. So in some ways, you're under the town manager. Yeah, even if you so just in terms of advising somebody that you're anyway, I'm sure exactly how that works. But yeah, so my understanding, I am I am probably not the best person to ask about this because my understanding of like. Municipal chain of command is is imperfect. But my understanding is we come up with these goals and then say like this is this is what we think you should consider. I can get more clarification on the process, whether we sent those to like the town council and if they but I think we just sent them to the town manager saying, hey, we think you should consider focusing on this. Well, I mean, I think it's an interesting idea. And I guess I also like the idea of like if we if TAC was working with ECAC and, you know, other committees, like I know I regularly attend the disability access advisory committee meetings because of their overlap with transportation and transportation safety and access and that, you know, if there are if there are goal, if there are goals for the town manager, you know, goals for the town that are supported by multiple advisory committees that, you know, maybe that has more impact than just like an individual committee saying these are our goals and another committee saying these are I mean, if a number of advisory committees have come together with the overlapping goals. So that's just totally, no, that seems totally true. I mean, because because one of the things I've heard from the when the council is discussing the town manager's goals, you know, in terms of like benchmarks and things for what the town manager needs to achieve. I mean, there's so many different projects and activities going on in this town that I mean, basically, you know, that the town and when there's only so many hours in the day and so many town staff and so on. And so, you know, the projects that are kind of up at the top of the list are the ones that the town manager and the staff are going to focus on. So OK, so I mean, either of you want to talk and welcome Joe. So this is our other story. I'm waiting. Hi, no worries, no worries. Yeah, so I'm not officially on the attack anymore, Stella, but because I still care about this stuff, I come a lot and they let me join the group. But I just wanted to say it. Wow, amazing work, super exciting ideas. Love your list at the end. Wish we'd talked 15 years ago. So really, really great. Yeah, great. And I really would encourage anyone who hasn't to look at the carp. It's a really impressive document. I mean, you know, as you probably know, Stella, I mean, part of why I am on here and others are on here is because we wholeheartedly believe in alternative modes of transportation. And so, you know, part of what we do, I mean, I don't know how much you know about what we do, but we advise the Public Works Director and like, you know, the actual street things that actually happen on our streets, you know, and projects that happen on our streets to increase the ability or facilitate walking and biking, right, as well as car, you know, there are car issues, too, right. But a lot of us are on here because we really believe in alternative modes of transportation as well as public transportation, which we're really lucky to have some of that, you know, a good deal of that in our town. So I can see how we, you know, our kind of activism will fit into your. Particularly your your aspect of the ECAC, right? I would love to figure out how, you know, we can use our purview and your goals to to really increase the number of people that bike, walk, roll or take public transportation every day in this town, right? Because I think that's, you know, the only way to go in the future. So thanks. But I think that's how we can we can really help because we're in a lot of these projects, town projects, right, that. We are we're always saying, let's have bike lanes, increase the ability to walk and make. Bus, you know, essentially bus transportation in the town really work for more people. Well, and one thing related with Saferage to school is that I mean, so one of our member who's not here tonight, she had been leading some of the Saferage to school activities and she and I met with different principals over the summer and and we are continuing to try to build some momentum from that from the schools because it is really going to take some volunteer efforts in the schools. But the Saferage to school program last year, or maybe it was last year, it expanded to be like K through 12. So it's not it used to be K through eight and they added the high school grades. And I think, you know, in terms of tying in with the environment and when I think about, you know, the clubs at the high school and things to tie into environmental issues that that could be a good way to go with it to that is not just about like the younger grades, maybe a lot more focused on like the safety of their kids and so on. But then you also just talked about the carbon footprint of everybody driving and hit driving school and just really thinking about it from like a sustainability point of view. And I would love to tie in with the students. Yeah, I wonder, because another thing that we've been talking about a lot in ECAC is how to better collaborate with. I think I forget the acronym, but it's the Amherst Amherst Client Climate Justice Coalition. Well, and there's like Sunrise and I mean, there's some other groups. Right. Network to. Yeah. Right. I think now Sunrise is part of that. Like Sunrise, Mothers Out Front, like a bunch of those organizations all got together. And so I wonder if if if trying to really focus on on safe routes to school school as a point of collaboration, because that would be something that could maybe we could be talking about that over the summer and then try to do something like in the fall. It might be nice if. So a couple of things. One, I wanted to say, you know, I like I said, I just opened up your document 15 minutes before this meeting and I had never seen it before. Part of what's really impressive about it is like not only do you have these really great goals, but you talk about how you're going to achieve them and you kind of have a timeline. And in the attack, we had tried to do that several times. So, you know, and I had been on the attack and its predecessors. Tracy had been on it. Kim has been on it with me for many years. I think we're the old the old timers here. And, you know, there's been this series of documents, the transportation plan and the complete streets plan. And then the pedestrian and bike plan. The ladder never got finalized. It's still waiting the final map and it never got adopted by the town. And we also like just at the before covid came up with like a list of priorities for the budget that I think, you know, never got adopted or communicated. So so in some ways, it really seems like ECAC has taken things further into taking goals into a vision of what you want to do and how you get there. Whereas TAC has often kind of worked, you know, either planned by plan on a specific plan or either like project by project or event by event. And so what I'm seeing in your plan is, is, you know, town support for a really ambitious vision and an ability to say the steps to get there. And so, yeah, it seems really exciting and possible to think about how do we take what you've done in your vision and bring in so many of the things that the TAC has talked about over the years and its predecessors and maybe build them together. So I think actually each of your bullets were things that I could imagine us talking about the budget priorities, the events, the I forget what else it was. But yeah. And then I'll just say in terms of school, I've also tried to get a group off the ground at UMass. And I think there's tremendous potential to do some work at UMass. I've long had a vision of UMass as a place where people come from across the state and if they weren't all bringing their individual cars and could actually learn how to bike and use transit while they're here, they might then take that back to their towns. So anyway, so that's just a little pitch for another hat I wear. But it seems like, yeah, each of these things. Well, OK, this is great. So the educational series, it seems like there are a couple different things. Probably TAC people could talk about the goal setting process. I think we could go back to that document. We had three years ago as well as some of the stuff that the tax done since. And then, yeah, we've talked a lot multiple times about doing, you know, instead of just, you know, how walk to school day works so far is like everybody drives their car down to Brown Town and then they walk up the street, right? But instead, you know, to to block off, you know, half of each of the main arteries in town and actually have like, you know, what's what do they call it? Like a bike parade or a bike train or a yeah. So that would I just think that given the vision and success you've had it sort of getting the attention of town and having these things to some extent codified and supported by the town, it could be a really amazing collaboration. So so I wonder, particularly with the. You know, the potential new elementary school that's happening where there are significant problems that we've all talked about with having children walk to that school, like. That's one, as far as I can tell, it's one of the major problems with the site. There are other great things about the site, but part of the site is like I can none of us have been able to see how it makes sense for anyone, except potentially a butters walking to that school or biking to that school because of all the trip. So so I feel like that's like a real thing we could we could really collaborate on, you know, with your with your ear to the town manager and our like knowledge of transportation and hopefully with some help that we might be able to get from our town are Guilford. Those are the kinds of things I think could make serious impact. You know, that's a great idea. I think a collective push to make sure if this if the vote goes through to make sure that the new school like whether. But it's not right now. It's not a person. Yeah, yeah, yeah, all right now. Totally. Yeah, right. So I we had done Chris and Chris is not here. And I had done like bike ped counts at get all the elementary schools in last spring and. And basically, nobody walks to almost any of them. I mean, then the most people walk to Crocker and that's because there's a neighborhood adjacent to Crocker that you just take a little path from the parking lot over to this neighborhood. And there's also an apartment complex like right at the base of the driveway of Crocker, but a lot of the other streets. I mean, historically, there were people walking more and there isn't any more. The town is spending some money improving the sidewalks and, you know, in that general area, like in the East Village area. But I was reading today, for example, about the safety to school program, and they do have infrastructure funding that can, you know, be up to like 1.5 million dollars or more. And I know East Hampton, like Springfield recently got that money. And East Hampton has a new project, too, was talked about in today's Gazette where they're doing some rail trail like connection improvements. And then it's also going to tie into the Safe Reach to School project. And so yeah, it would be great to build momentum there for sure. And I mean, I'm also interested in valley bikes. So we did have people come from North Amherst know when they were looking at the capital improvement budget about creating another valley bike station in North Amherst. I know Valley bikes right now isn't up and running yet. Like they're working on the new contract with the towns and the city of North Hampton. But you like to promote that as well. And just some alternative modes. Seems really good. So. Yeah, I can see a lot of synergy, but I like the idea of like working particularly on on these specific projects that could have some high impact, you know, because those things like seem like things we could actually do together. Do we do we want to start off with just getting the bike plan actually finished? Yes. I mean, that should be our number one thing. Right. I mean, we we need e-cac. And all of it's just just to bring the inertia with it to bring us over the end line with that. Yes. I mean, yeah, it's nice for us to think about all these other projects. But let's just get past the biggest one first, right, the biggest hurdle. Let's get a plan in place and then we can start going forward. Yeah, no, we need an amazing plan. I bike all around town with since my daughter was like 10 months or so, and now she's three and it's like sometimes a little scary. And I read the plan and I was just like, yes, these are the routes we need. So it would be great. It would be great. We're definitely like, I think, speaking on behalf of e-cac, we we feel this plan is very important and and would love to see it completed. If you've go ahead. I love those as like two starting priorities. I think your idea about the school is a fantastic one just because it's so timely and the potential is there to start off right off the bat, both building the infrastructure, but also like building the practice, you know, so right off the bat, the first walk and bike to school to the new school could be, you know, different than the other ones, where we really like are training people how to bike. I mean, I lived in Oregon for 17 years in Portland and Eugene, teach kids how to bike and walk safely and they, you know, do it collectively at first until that's how you that's how we recover walking and biking as transportation modes. And then if kids do it, they're going to think they can do it when they're older. And then I agree with Marcus, too, that if if e-cac can help get us over the finish line of the bike and plan, all that needs to be finished is the map and then approval from the town. That would be, you know, those sound like two fantastic collaborative opportunities that that could be great. They're definitely. Yeah. Well, those are some goals. So great. Yeah. No, this that that would be great. There's something else about schools. Oh, on the topic of youth and and alternative modes. So one of the one of our initial ideas for the transportation educational series, that was a really good idea that one of one of our members, Jesse Selman, had that I tried to follow through on. And it just he thought it would be really cool to have a panel of students from either the middle school or the high school talking about their experience taking the bus system in the context of kind of youth mobility. And it was a little challenging to find students who both take the bus and would be willing to come to a zoom meeting in the evening, understandably and talk about it. So this is just a call that if any of you know of anybody who's a middle school student, high school student who takes the bus and has thoughts about it, we would love to hear from them. Either in person or via writing, whatever's easiest for them. No, that's a great idea. But again, I think that's where we could tie in like with the student groups. Like, I mean, my well, I mean, what, you know, my kids take the bus sometimes, but they mainly take it when they yeah, that's not their first choice. And they would they would not want to speak publicly about how their parents make them take the bus. So yeah, with with these kids contact you directly. I could ask my both of my kids who are at the high school right now and see. Yeah, they can totally contact me directly. OK, thank you. Yeah. Yeah, it seems like there are quite a few kids who bike also, so that might also be something. Yeah, totally. Any any youth using transit if if people, you know, 15 to 18, whatever seems appropriate to talk to us, you know what I mean? Well, even some like college, I mean, I have neighbors who didn't get their driver's license until their 20s, you know, and they did manage to get around and on transit until then. So I know that's a little older, but they can also be an example of like how you can do it and you can have a job and you can. Yeah, you know, be a successful grown up. Especially if they happen to go to community college, which are really hard to get to. Oh, yeah, for sure. About a car. Yeah, so that's pretty much. That's pretty much what I was hoping to talk about. I actually do need to go make dinner at some point. It's my dinner. Thank you for coming. Thank you for that's great. Great. Yeah. Feel free to reach out at any point and let me know if anybody would be willing to come speak at any point about what you all are up to and kind of do what I did. No, I would love to speak about the bike pen plan, but I'd like us to have more of a success story to share a little bit about getting it done. But oh, no, I don't think we do, right? I think we need this relationship to help bring it over the end line. So Marcus, are you volunteering then? I will talk to my wife. OK. OK, I think you're underselling the plan. I think it's a great plan. I didn't realize it wasn't complete when I looked at it. So well, and we also want just like you have the plan, the car plan would like it to be endorsed by the council and like made official. Yeah, right. So I mean, that's a key component to and we're happy to write a memo of support or whatever. Thank you. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you. I mean, we need to vote on it, but I feel confident that everyone would. OK. OK, thank you so much. Have a great evening. All right, bye-bye. Bye. Well, that was pretty awesome. And I think we can find many paths forward with the ECAC. Yeah, I didn't get a chance. I mean, Eve had looked at the plan. I mean, I remember when it was being created, it seemed pretty amazing. And so I will slend around. Stella did send a copy of her slides and I'll send the link to the plan again. So if people want to look at that before the next meeting, that'd be great. I do think one important order of business is approving the three sets of minutes that we got from January. OK. If everyone could take a look at those, I've looked at them already. I'm going to go get my charger and perhaps we can vote on them when I return from my charger. Let's take a look. They were sent out this afternoon by Amber. OK, so did everybody see them? They were in an email. I'm just wondering. Here's what ever happened with the company that pledged 20,000 for the bike station. Yeah, I mean, so. So they needed some additional money. I mean, it was in the North Amherst. And I mean, they had pledged to pay that and also to pay like the maintenance fee and things like that. But I think it was dependent on some town support as well. And I'm not sure where that capital request stands or if there were other funds available to do that piece of it. But I thought it was a pretty compelling. I didn't ever come to tack for a vote, but I thought it was a pretty compelling case about continuing the network. And it seemed like it did have some good support. Are we prepared to make any comments and or otherwise vote on the minutes? Yeah. No, you are not, Marcus. You are OK. I have no comment. I am more than prepared to vote. Yes, I am too. So I do have a question, though. It's like, do we ever want to? I mean, our minutes are so sparse right now and that I do appreciate that Amber takes them. But do we ever need to have anything more? I don't know. Well, it seems like the January 19th one is super large. But we have had some pretty brief meetings as of late. Yeah, I think we're fine. We're fine. OK. I mean, I as somebody who used to have to do the minutes for the old version of the committee and was always behind, I am very appreciative of anybody who will take minutes. Right. Yeah, that's why I'm not worth them back. And so I'm not trying to. Yeah, I'm not complaining. So exactly, I'm not going to complain. But so I think we should probably just ban these these are minutes from January 5th, January 19th and February 17th meeting. And I feel like we should vote on them all at once, even though some of us were, you know, absent from some of those meetings, right? I guess we would just like not vote. I mean, so the as you said, the January 5th ones are so brief because there was mainly the presentation discussion from the time. And the 19th is extensive, but all of us, it looks like all of us were here for that one. And Joe was absent for the February 16th. So perhaps let's let's go ahead and do this officially. So the January 5th, two people were absent. Marcus and Tate, all those in favor of accepting these minutes. Please raise your hand. Yeah, I think some of us who are not here. Yeah. OK, we great. Three members. Joe, Tracy and I all and abstaining. The two of you, Marcus and Tate and then there so there are no nays and for so those minutes past. The next is the January 19th meeting meeting. All of us were present. All those in favor, please raise your hand. All members. Present except Tate, are you OK? All members present. That was unanimous acceptance. And so there are no that those meetings passed. And then for the February 16th, all those in favor, Joe was not here. All those may in favor, the four remaining members. I need to stand, please. I didn't. Sorry, I'm just pulling them up right now. Thank you for my hand. I can. Yes, no, I can't. I can't. I can't. Thank you. Thank you. All those. The four members, except for Joe, who is abstaining. Is that correct, Joe? Yes, thank you. So those those passed. So we've now done that administrative duty. Thank you. And so it looks like the next. The agenda item is an update on the proposed street lights. Policy. Yeah. So I have not received so loud at our last tech meeting. We had four members present and we did. We did spend some time going over, you know, what we wanted to say as a committee. And we had previously met with the sponsors. Of the proposed policy, counselor on a definitely got there had come to two of our meetings and made Joe Henneke had come to one of the meetings and we did take that motion. You know, based on the people who were here. So one thing we had heard from them is that they were going to the last time they both came is that they were going to rework their proposal based on the feedback that they had received from tech and other committees. So with that in mind, we took that we had that motion. I'll just pull it up right now. But the but I was a little surprised then because right after the tech meeting was a TSO meeting, it's all right. And at the TSO meeting, the sponsors presented an updated version of their street lights proposal because I thought that they would be speaking with us first, they did not actually provide a copy of it. They were just referencing the changes they were doing. And I don't believe even TSO has received a copy of it yet, but it is back on the agenda and they are focusing on the lighting elements and not so much the different zones of where there should be and more or less lighting, which is good, I thought. But we still didn't want to take it. I just wanted to get the people who weren't here at that meeting just up to speed on what we had talked about. So let me just pull it up. Which is why I sent it around today earlier. Guilford has a question. It looks like. Guilford, do you have a question? No, just one comment. Comment. Yes. So everybody knows where the playground is at Kendrick Park, right? Uh huh. OK, so at the playground, there's three lights. Short lights that we installed to light the walkway that cuts across the park. We've actually changed one of those lights. So if you actually get a chance and you're out walking to Kendrick Park with your kids or whatever at night during, I guess, pre-spoke time. You don't want to be there during spoke time, but pre-spoke time. Check out the lights and see which one you like and which ones you don't like. OK, yeah. So how many new lights did you put in with three or two? There's only there's only two styles of light. Two styles. OK. One is the traditional one we have all over downtown, the acorn. And then one's a similar light to the acorn, but it's it's different. OK, my daughter's going to climb up the Kendrick slide. So I'll be sure to keep an eye out. OK. But it's it's well, it's just they're different to what you'll think. So now is the light on on the Kendrick Park paths like all night or their timers on the lights? Or now it's all night. OK. We have zero smart lights. Well, I was walking home from work last night from UMass past Kendrick Park. And there were quite a there were quite a large number of older people, older youth. Yeah, the spoke crowd, we call it then. So but I didn't I don't remember them being particularly like illuminated or anything. No, that there's the the walkway has three lights. The park at the playground itself has no lights. OK, got it. Yeah, but I thank you for asking about that because I meant to bring it up when. Oh, we were talking about the TSO. Yeah, right. So I was just pulling up the document, but go ahead, Eve. Like giving me an error. Tracy, I know you've just done a ton of research and pulled a whole bunch of resources on the importance of street lighting for safety. Yes. And I believe also for like invitation, because as we know, for people to bike and walk, they need not only to be safe, but to feel safe, right? So for some people, lighting may be important, even if someone might prove in some statistical analysis that if they get their eyes adjusted, they're going to be fine, that it still might make the difference to whether they bike or not. You know what I mean, right? It options matter a lot. Yes. Yeah, so I know the TSO and Mandy, Joe and company didn't invite you to do that presentation for them. But do you think you could do that presentation for the tack? Sure, we could look at that. I don't know if I mean, you other people are members of the tack. But so obviously you all should be the ones to decide that it's not me. But to me, that would be really useful is to sort of have a full sense of what, you know, the evidence and research says. Sure. Sure. Yeah, I can look at you in something like that. I mean, I mean, I've also seen really good workshops like about it as well. And, you know, I can also share some of those links. I mean, the or I could yeah, or I could put some of them those slides in my own presentation. I think that's a great idea. I mean, because there's a lot of resources. I mean, I've I myself have watched like a number of webinars about safety at night. I mean, one thing that came up at the TSO meeting. I will pull up just I will pull up the hold on. Let me just share a screen of the. So this is the motion that we had approved last time from the four members of the president and I meant to send it around to the people who weren't present, including Stefan, Marcus and Joe. But then it's some it seemed kind of awkward to have people vote on it. So if you guys did feel comfortable endorsing it, then we can also just tell TSO and the council that you've also approved it. So so again, this is based on the idea that that the sponsors were going to go back to the 2001 policy. And and so so what we passed was the following, you know, tax supports, the idea of reducing light pollution in Amherst and using the latest available technology to do so. However, we have concerns about the traffic safety impacts of streetlights are removed, especially for pedestrians and other vulnerable road users. And if it's a sponsoring, counselors have said they're considering they decided to rework their proposals significantly and craft a new policy based on the 2001 policy. We encourage them to make the following changes to add crosswalks and bus stops as locations where streetlights will be provided. And then also there's a section in the 2001 policy that just talks about how we don't the town doesn't provide streetlights for pedestrians and residential neighborhoods. And and we wanted to remove that. So, yeah, I mean, if the people who weren't if Marcus or Joe, if you guys have any comments or if you want to also endorse that. Well, I mean, if sorry. Did you talk about, I mean, in my opinion, we need more streetlights in a lot of places. Did you all talk about that at all? Like, I mean, I've talked about that section of East Pleasant repeatedly, but where, you know, if you're biking at night at East Pleasant of shortly after Village Park, all of a sudden it gets really dark and you can't see. And then also after again, after the Eastman intersection, there's another section where you really can't see. And like, I think you need we need more lights if we want people to be biking and walking at night. And oh, and also when we did that walk on North Pleasant, remember, we also found like it was just there are places that are really dark. So I don't know. So actually, so one thing interesting with the TSO discussion. So the TSO again, the sponsors didn't show like their new policy, but they talked about it and they said that they and they both commented a little bit on the TAC motion. So one thing was right now, they're not talking about location, right? They're just talking about they aren't talking about location. But like, if you look at the 2001 policy, it says, like, we will have street lights at intersections. And right, right. We will have lights, you know, at bus stops. And so we had suggested adding the crosswalks, but also taking, getting rid of some of that other language, you know, just that seems sort of unfriendly right now. The only this legislation only looks at types of lights, right? And how to maintain them and that sort of thing. The location of that is in a follow up, which is yet to be determined as to when it's going to happen. The location in terms of, I mean, the original proposal was it it's split it up into zones, right? Right. That is gone. But at the same time, there is still the guidance, at least based on the 2001 policy, it says, you will provide street lights in the following locations, I get intersections or places where they it's been deemed important. Right. But that's not a change. That's existing. No, those aren't changes, right? Gilford, did you have a comment with your hand? Yes, one of the things they're concentrating on is actually the amount of light from the device. They want to actually lower the amount of light per device and cut down glare. Cutting out down glare is good, but lowering the output of light actually means more lights to light up a sidewalk or a side, you know, a bike path. So those are the things that are going to be kind of, you're going to you're going to probably find it weird odds at. UMass is UMass lighting is is what they don't want. They definitely do not want to see lighting like UMass has. So that's kind of what they're working for when they're cutting the light down. So in the discussion about locations, like a right to the tack and support of the idea of having lighting at mid block cross box, for example, right? That seventy seven percent of fatal traffic crashes happen outside of intersections, including at mid block crosswalks. And there were questions about, you know, whether there should be lights at crosswalks automatically or not, you know, or even bus stops, like maybe some people want to get off the bus in the dark and walk home in the dark. I mean, you know, so I can see as maybe changing some of the language in terms of like will be provided versus I should, you know, consider providing them here. But one of the arguments is that it would be more. They say they thought, at least it's more effective from a traffic safety standpoint to have, for example, like the RFBs, the rapid rectangular flashing beacons at mid block crosswalks instead of having light on all the time. I can see that point in terms of. And I mean, I thought about it more, you know, since I was listening to discussions there, but that I mean, there are some mid block crosswalks that maybe do not have much traffic at night at all. And so you wouldn't necessarily need to have lights at them all the time. But I definitely I mean, it is good to think about having more of those flashing beacons if we have them. And I didn't know Gilbert and I'd asked you a follow up question just about the relative costs and things just because. I know we can't have them all over town, for example, but it does seem like the town has been putting in more bit block. Putting them in at more mid block crosswalks than we used to. And also just to get to your point, Eve, about I feel like the second part, the second point that we made in our response. There was something, right, we won't put. It was something restrictive about where to put lighting and we're suggesting to remove that so that there are less restrictions. You know, opening that up a little more, not saying that they have to be, you know, in neighborhoods, but that they could be in, you know, removing that exclusion, which I think gets to your point. That really makes sense. And I appreciate that you're saying that they're not identifying locations. But I don't know, it seems to me that if there's a street lights policy for the town, it should include objectives other than. I know reduced light pollution and that for to do what we were just talking with the ecac rep about, which is really promote more people. You know, the mode shift of the 60 percent of maybe sometimes all bike or walk, if I feel safe and comfortable, you know, those people actually, most of them are going to need to feel like there's light all the way along a path. Like, like if you look at North Pleasant and you see all the accidents on that, I mean, yeah, that's a lot of drunk students walking up and down that street when they're not very well in area. So that's a real extreme case that I think definitely probably needs some more consistent lighting all the way up and down. But yeah, again, even like East Pleasant or North East Street, right, where someone was killed in the dark also, you know, if we want not only to support the people who feel comfortable getting off the bus in the dark, but the people who are nine years old and could get off the bus in the dark and cross safely and walk home or, you know, or new people who just moved in from the suburbs to feel comfortable walking to and from campus up and down North Pleasant, then it seems to me that one of the goals should actually be to provide lighting adequate for people that feel safe to use bike in pedestrian networks. But definitely, I mean, so I think that definitely was part of it, though. Right. I mean, the feedback we got in our meeting was that they will be including, you know, a bike plan and everything like that. So we can't say that they're not including it and all this stuff because it's right now, you know, it's a half baked solution, right? They're focusing on one side of it and you're talking about the other side and we can't push for the other side until the first side is finished because they want to take the time to actually go over everything that you're talking about. So there is no, oh, no, we're not doing anything. It's we need to talk about it more. And they've they've understood that and, you know, moving it off, which isn't great, right? We should be doing it now. But they realized they can at least get to something. But I think Marcus, like even at this stage, though. So, right, instead of going back and just saying we're going to have the 2001 policy and then just add some of the details about types of lighting, you know, glare and light pollution and things like that for the individual fixtures. I mean, to me, if if TSO and then the council are going to go ahead and adopt a new policy, recognizing, you know, as the sponsors have now recognized how super complicated it is in terms of if you do want to create low lighting zones in town and high lighting zones in town like that. Those are huge issues and they would definitely want to have a much more involved process for that. But even to me, like even going forward with the 2001 plan, which is these I mean, they even suggested it could be like an appendix that could include like lighting standards or something. To me, I would like to see at least a little bit. Of update from the 2001 language to reflect the fact that like we do want. We do have a goal now of encouraging more pedestrian activity in residential neighborhoods. We do want to be age friendly. We do want to encourage other modes and things like that. So and I think that's why it's hack and you, you know, you had missed that discussion. But I think that's why we passed the motion. We did that we still want to send a message even before you delve into that whole second question looking all over town. It's just just have some kind of general principles and guidelines about where there's lighting and where there's not lighting. And even just at the level that they're looking at it now, I mean, we did not get a formal referral back from TSO to look at it more. But at least, you know, two or three of the TSO members at their last meeting, they did say, we really do think you should talk to tech about. Now, I'm not going to make recommendations about, you know, mid-block crosswalks or things like that. And so no, I understand that. I mean, but we're dealing with, you know, politicians, right? They're after a quick win and the quick win is do the little bit. And yeah, great. We already have a document that says that we need to look to the more, you know, create. Encouraging more different modes of transportation, right? In in the climate resiliency plan, it's already there. So we don't necessarily need to go ahead and reiterate something just because we want to see it somewhere else, right? Let's attack the little bit and do that. But we really, really need to deal with the location stuff. And I think that if we kind of just try and, you know, just put a little bit in there and just move off, that's just going to be taking a success. And we're going to lose the fact that we need to really get in there, really dive into it, because they, I mean, they are also dealing with people that don't want any lighting. Right. I mean, that's half the reason why this whole thing came about. You know, there are people out there in the world, but, you know, in Amherst that want to see it in a more rural time, right? They don't want to see you mass lighting. They don't want to see too much lighting. So we've got to figure out how we can balance that out or how we can specifically address that. But doing it in the timeframe they're trying to do it in isn't necessarily the best thing. So yeah, let's take a step back, rethink what we're doing. We do need to be part of that process. You know, we can't just be, oh, let's get a little bit of opinion on, you know, Thursday from TAC and we'll be good to go for the rest of the year. No, we need to be part of it. But we can't just expect just a little bit of, you know, a little bit of whitewashing of that issue. And we're good to go for the next couple of years, because that's what we would end up having if we had put in like a little statement here or there, you know, we really need to leave it wide open, show people the pain and then we can get in there and fix it. Yeah, I mean, I think we do all generally support, you know, the idea of less light pollution and less glare and things. I mean, one issue, I mean, this is outside of the scope in terms of transportation somewhat, but it, I mean, when I, and I haven't seen the new version of the proposed policy, but some of their ideas about lighting, particularly when you limit the height of the lighting that I mean, one big issue in Amherst is that we don't own most of the poles that the lighting the streetlights are on that, you know, close to 90 percent of them are owned by Eversource. And when Eversource builds taller poles, the streetlights get moved up because Amherst only has access to a certain amount of the pole and they tend to put the electricity at the top and then the streetlights are next to electricity. And so, I mean, from a traffic safety standpoint, having those higher lights does not do anybody any good. And they also, I mean, that's why people don't. And they that's why some that's why some people want to get rid of streetlights is because they say, well, ever since they put in those new poles, the light is shining in my window and all these other things, they're not serving any safety function. I mean, that's like a much bigger issue than TAC and the council. And I mean, that's just how how Eversource, you know, makes those decisions. I don't even know if there's anything we can even do in that end. Or even if it's realistic of our counselors to have in their policy, you know, that we only want the lighting to be 20 feet or less when that's not going to be possible with the Eversource poles. No, but I mean, we can look into Lens Technology to redirect the. No, sure. Yeah. Well, and that's what Guilford, I mean, Guilford saying, like, check out the ones at Kendrick Park and tell them which ones we like. And so, so definitely. So I mean, right now the issue is in a holding pattern. So I mean, we can see if TSO wants our input on more of it. So, Joe, did you have comments? I was going to say Amherst College just did their lighting tour, their walk through. And one of the questions that came up is how are they interact in these mid section areas, these crosswalks, especially down by like where they're doing all the construction on one 16 where kids don't know where to walk, students don't know where to walk exactly. And it's really dark there. But how do you intersect with the town and who's going to be making choices as to I mean, that's like that's the common phrase that came up. We don't want to be UMass, but, you know, how do you choose the the technology, you know, the lighting and how are they going to intersect with the town, you know, as the town going to have the same priority or the common area? You know, is anybody going to want to put a light there or keep it dark? So, I mean, maybe that could be a discussion, you know, where somebody from Amherst comes to, you know, one of the council, the TSO meeting or talks attack or something to be happy to. There's a really active grounds representative for the president. You'd be involved. I mean, Amherst College is different, right? Because every, you know, I've talked with a lot of people in town. They're all like, well, we could do that thing that Amherst College does, you know, the rapid beacons. And I was like, yeah, well, Amherst College pays for all that. So, you know, it's different because they can, you know, they're making really nice improvements or changes or safety, but they pay for it. I mean, right, Guilford, you can implement it, but but our town can't do the, you know, we don't have as much money as Amherst College as we don't have the resources Amherst College does. So in Guilford, those ones, I mean, you've talked about for those like crossing beacons, the lower level, lower height ones that are on College Street and on 116, right? I mean, they don't meet any kind of standards, but also you like the town has never installed any of those itself, right? Those are all from Amherst College, right? But Amherst College wants to Amherst College wants to upgrade them all. So we're probably going to start upgrading them this summer. So what does upgrading mean? Yeah, they're going to probably be RFBs at that point. OK, OK. And then those are meeting like, you know, MAUTC. Yeah, I mean, the little flashy ballard thing does meet it when you have the rest of the pieces in, but the other pieces have gone. The impavement lighting is was all taken out. That was not very that didn't last very long. So, yeah, no, yeah. So you must have that path that goes like over on the top of the hill between like Orchard Hill and Eastman. Do you all know the path that I'm talking about? Yes. No. And it's got some nice lights. I don't know, are those like anything that would be possible? But they're sort of an in between height, if I'm remembering that, like eight feet tall or something. Which is the Eastman? It's the one where the cops are on. The what? Like up near the dorms, like the dorms at the top of the hill, like on East Pleasant Street. Yeah, like the path that I'm talking about runs parallel lane Pleasant. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's right by the little pond there in between the pond. It goes right by the the disc golf course. Yeah. Oh, that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's super nice. Yeah. It is super nice. Well, it's inviting. You know what I mean? And it's well lit without being overly bright. Like, is something like that possible? Agreed. Yeah. Yeah, OK. Guilford and actually something like that is gone. You might not know because they and they do have, I mean, that original Street Lights proposal, it did have like streetscape zones. I mean, again, they're backing off the location part, but it did have streetscape zones that would have like lower level lighting as part of their plan. So I mean, I guess the conversation to be continued. So I can share updates when I get him from TSO. I do have Joe, I do have a question just about Amherst College lighting. I think I've asked you before and it's not directly transportation related, but like those fields, the fields on route nine that sometimes those lights do end up staying on all night, even though there's no use there, right? Is it I mean, does Amherst College put like could or could they put timers on the lights to at least like turn them off if they're not in use of the lighting issues before the safety committee? So that's something I could ask them to do. Yeah, I mean, I think I mean, I know like when there's events there at night, I understand, you know, lights are on, of course. But then sometimes people all go home and the lights are still on and I'm just because my neighborhood is up against it. Like people have commented that the neighbors who live closer commented that they it's very, very bright and bright. So I'll be curious to see if it's a matter that they just you mentioned this before, did somebody just forget to switch it off? Or is there well, right? And that's why I wondered if you could just have them like a timer or something that you would ride if there's an event there on the light thing. So I'll make a big thank you. Thank you. OK, you know, it's it's hilarious because it's like one thing to leave a light on in a room, but to leave a light on that lights up the whole neighborhood is really funny. Like that's someone would forget to turn that off. Of course, now you live in a neighborhood. I mean, Kim, your neighborhood, too, with those new there's a lot of all the new housing. Oh, my God, I have no idea what that's going to what's going to happen there. Yeah, that's going to be crazy. We count so OK. So before I would I mean, I'd really like to talk about this act to reduce traffic fatalities. It was on the agenda last time and and we didn't really have much time to talk about it. But I also recognize that it's getting late and just like Stella, you know, not everybody's had dinner and things. So maybe we can just talk briefly about just our schedule for the next couple months. And and other items and then if we can circle back or we can also have a conversation at the next tech meeting about it. I mean, one of my takeaways from that act to reduce traffic fatalities is just. You know, it's past in January. Most of it took effect in April. You know, there are like mass bike and other organizations are doing outreach about the law to teach people about the law, including the safe passing distance. And then also mass bike is also doing campaigns to to distribute lights and to distribute, you know, flyers and bumper stickers and all kinds of things just to let people know about the law too. So I mean, there is some potential there if we wanted to get involved and do some of those things. That's one reason I've been bringing it up. It seemed like a lot of good ideas. So we should. And I I was just daydreaming. I saw someone the other day, you know, I I ride my bike everywhere. I I've given up driving a car for the most part. And I saw someone the other day who had like a thing on their bike that was like sticking out and I was thinking, well, but that's not exactly four feet. Why is it not? And I what if what if what if we like just did something like that, which was like a damn it. I I I do it would my kids. My kids would like be like they they would like close their eyes and not look at me. But but, you know, like four feet is a big distance. And it does feel safe when you're riding your bike. And what if we just like went up and down, you know, downtown Amherst with a thing that's like four feet and said, you know, this is what four feet is, and this is a new law or something like that. Right. I do it. I like the chagrin of my teenage children. But I would do them do it. No, they are the ones. Wait, are they still driving to the high school? Yes, don't even get me started on that. Don't it's like the worst like who are you? I think I think I might need to, you know, recall your committee membership for that. Yeah. Oh, my God. I am like, yeah, I know. It's like, oh, sorry. Yeah, it's it's you need to have a a a conflict of interest statement as soon as you get on this meeting. Well, so I mean, the big thing with the the big thing with the four foot pass law is it says that, you know, cars can cross the other line in things. Yeah. Because one thing I've had some conversations with, you know, officials and and people are saying, well, wait, does that mean we can't have bike lanes anymore? Like what if the road is too narrow? But what it's saying is that if a vehicle is just like other types of slow moving vehicles, like a tractor or carriage or anything like that, you just you're supposed to leave them space. You're supposed to have some safety and make sure it's clear. Sorry. Yeah, and make sure it's clear, of course. Right. Whose purview is it to like go and check this four feet around the state? Like, is there somebody with a measure like who would receive the complaint? Well, no, so I think it's that it's that motorists have to leave for a sheet when they pass pedestrian. So it's not like you need to have a four foot like a bike lane. And it's not like you have to it all has to be based on facilities. Again, if you don't have that built into your facility, then the motorists is only supposed to pass when it's safe to do so. Yeah. And when they pass, they're supposed to leave the four feet. So and I always wave, I'm like, hey, thanks for doing that. Like, like I wave to every single person that gives me four feet of space, like literally every day. I thought you were being friendly. Sure, that too. But I just I just it's a positive reward. I know it works with my students. I'm just trying to like make it work for motorists, too. Yeah. And I wait a lot. You know, I wait behind bicyclists pass and things. It's amazing. Yeah. No, but I think more and more people are doing that, actually. I feel like that's happening. Well, yeah, let's help get the word out and help people. No, yeah. So maybe my idea. My four foot like stick somehow might might come to. Or even, you know, we could even ask, like, you know, the town if they want to promote it, too, or something as a bumper stickers. I mean, they do have, I mean, I mean, there's a link in that webinar that I can send around the links that people, one, they can order. They can order lights like for bikes, because the new law says that you're required by law to have a red light, a rear light, as well as a front light. But it's a secondary enforcement. That means you can't pull somebody over just for the lights and that they're actually supposed to report back, you know, in terms of, like, how many people are getting pulled over and where is it happening? And what does it mean? Can you pass that around the UMass population, please? Like, and also Valley and also Valley bikes. Yeah, Kim, you could order a bunch of lights and give them out. I mean, I was hoping that maybe I will. There's something. Is UMass Eve doing anything for like, well, I think it's something we probably need to talk about. We'll probably. Yeah, let's talk about another meeting. The police. Sure. The UMass police could be, you know, big parts of that. Yeah. And the Amherst police. They do. Right. But I mean, you're talking about UMass in particular. So yeah. Sure. OK, but before we run out to seven, so let's just. So one of the things is that we typically made on the first and the third Thursdays on the month. And that's also when all the TSO meetings are. So. I don't know if we're not a big deal. Yeah. So I mean, I can't come on the 11th is the is one thing. But maybe we could meet. We could just meet on the 8th. I don't actually see a conflict with those meeting there. TSO is meeting now at seven, right? So if we meet at five 30. Oh, right. Then we could just be done with our meeting. And hopefully Guilford doesn't have to go to both meetings. Like Guilford does not look like he will do that. Well, in the town manager goes to the TSO meetings, and he lets he lets staff know and they have to come to. So I don't feel like we have much to talk about next week, right? So. Do we want to try to? Is it too late if we wait until the 18th or is that good? And the 18th of May. I can see the May. OK, let's say the 18th of May. And then also for I know Marcus, I guess I'm not sure if you were at that meeting or not, but we had talked to it. I guess it was the last meeting. We did talk about just trying to work hard on this bike ped plan and like going back through the original meetings and does reconstructing those notes. And so we were creating an informal subcommittee to do that. And even I had, I mean, Kim and I had volunteered to work on that. But if can I just, you know. Well, I guess we'll see if the new school proposal passes, but I feel like when the new school proposal passes, I feel like it will. But but I'm sure. But I wonder, I wonder about like maybe having one meeting where we update based on that reality. Two, we only have to wait until next week. Once we finish what I think we have to wait till it till it passes. Right. Right. But the vote is next week. So. And I really do. We have been trying to map. I think I feel like we should once we make. Once the committee meets to update the. Install, once we get our map done. Yeah. We should maybe that I feel like that's really important. Like. Update, you know, it was for years. I mean, and we could even, you know, talk to TSO and things about it. And I mean, one reason I had been trying to encourage safe routes to school and get in the town getting more involved again is because of like the different funding that's available. You know, for as I said, Springfield is getting, you know, the money and East Hampton is getting the money and you, but you have to have an act of safe route to school program in order to even qualify for it. And so there is a new safe routes to school coordinator for the four Western Mass counties. Her name is Tori. And I've emailed her and I haven't met with her yet, but I'm kind of set up that meeting soon. So hopefully before the 18th, we can have that meeting and start to move it forward. I mean, we met with the school administrators last spring and summer. And I think it's pretty easy to meet over the summer. But then when the school year kicks in again, then they go back into their mode of all the other things they have to do as school administrators. And we lose some of that momentum. So that's where if we can pull in with ECAC and and also get like high school students involved and build some momentum, I think that would be great. So. So everyone knows that if the school doesn't pass, you don't need to be worrying about any plans or anything for any projects because there won't be any more. What do you mean anymore? I don't pretty much if the school at the school fails, all the capital money in the town goes to maintaining buildings and no more to no extra money to roads. And yeah, if a project's no extra money for nothing. Yes. Well, I mean, is a town if that happened is a town going to try to pay for the school itself? We can't afford it. There's five. There's five buildings that are falling apart, right? Including your building, including your building. Well, there's Wildwood, Fort River, those are the two schools. So they have to repair those schools because they don't have a new school because they didn't vote the new school. Then there's DPW, there's Fire Station Library Library. Library, yeah, no, we're in deep shit. Well, there's no, no, there's no big no opposition. So hopefully that's why you have a good sign. Oh, I know. Yeah, it's no vocal, no opposition. Right. Yeah, who knows? So. But I'll have an 18 year old who will vote for the school that day on election day. I will have a new voter who will vote for the school. All right. I have a voter too. Yeah, Ari already voting to the poll. He has a voter too, so. Right, you are right, Marcus. She will drive, but. Tracy and Kim and I all have 18 year olds are all. We all have high school seniors. Yeah. Well, can. Sorry, go ahead, Guilford. I was just going to say, is that stuck in the ballot box? Well, I mean, the thing with a low turnout election, right? Is it really is depends like on who shows up? I mean, I hope to see your three kids' names in the year. They will. These kids already voted. Oh, there we go. There we go. I kid literally turns 18 that day, so I don't think she can actually vote till that day. So. So they've got the registrations. Yeah, that's cool. That's a great birthday. No, I can't you have a something to. Yeah, no, I just wanted it's the unreasonably not anticipated. I just wanted to let you all know I was running. I run on Saturday mornings through Graff Park, and this goes to you, Guilford. I there was a woman who literally lives on that corner, you know, right across from the entrance to Graff Park. She was walking her dogs. I think her name is Karen. They own their house, which is right there. And I was like, I saw her cross and she almost kind of got run over or her dogs did by some super fast drivers going around that corner there. You guys all know what I'm talking about right there at Graff Park, like literally the entrance right there. And anyway, I was like, yeah, what do you think about this? And she she thought like the parking and the overflow was not an issue, which is I know is something that we've all talked about. But I was like really interested. She's an older resident. I feel like she could be very critical because she knew the before and the after. And she really likes this sidewalks, which I do, too. They're really awesome. Of course, the parking lot could be updated a bit. But but she was in in, you know, we've talked with people before about about converting that, you know, that road is paved and then not paved. You mean Mill Lane? Yes. And she she was in very much. And I think all the residents are agree that they don't want the rest of that paint because they feel like already that little the little strips that are paved, people are going too fast. And so so so you take. But but I just wanted to give you guys feedback on that because I've been really curious about like what's been happening for people because I feel like there are so many more people and cars there. And and and and I was surprised because she really felt like, yeah, no, this is great. It works really well. And I just wanted to give feedback on that. OK, I had a long conversation with this person. That's great. Except that people really do go too fast, right? On Mill, on Mill Lane. I literally saw her almost heard she and her dogs like almost get, you know, like very close, a super fast car because people just try and use that as a connection somehow. But anyway, I just wanted to let you all know that. So my little update, which doesn't really it's not, you know, super time sensitive either. But I just I just want to say and I've been noticing and I'd send Kim a couple couple of information on this, but just how, you know, when I look at the police blotter that there is like traffic safety enforcement and I appreciate that, that there somebody was ticketed for driving the wrong way on North Pleasant Street next to Kendrick Park, which is awesome. And and that people are getting ticketed sometimes for blocking sidewalks and for not stopping and crosswalks. And April was April is still we have a few more days left. It is distracted driving Awareness Month, right? So there's been some ticketing related to that and at least pulling people over. And so those are all great things. I have been disappointed lately to see a number of people leaving the parking lot behind CVS on their cars and coming back out to North Pleasant Street, which I had never seen before. But I have seen that a lot lately. And so I hope the town can do better signage or do some enforcement and just feel like you can't. I mean, I've never, I've never even achieved of doing that. Like I've never seen anyone. I mean, is it is it something? Is that the town's responsibility or is that the land? Ilford, is that private? Yeah, it's three people's responsibility. That's CVS owns part, Barry Roberts owns parts in the town owns parts of it. But that little easement, like to go into the parking lot that all three it's owned by one and three of us and two others have rights to pass. OK, there is no one way sign on any of that. No, there is a one way sign on the building, but I think we need which building on which building on the CVS building. Or there's a sign on that side facing facing the wrong way. Yeah, saying don't go back into the alley. There used to be a stop sign, too. But everything we actually went back and looked and a lot of the signs are missing. So they're all back. OK. I suggest that we could have one of those tire things. You know, if you go the wrong way, you know, oh, yeah. I'm just kidding. But like seriously, that is like the most dangerous thing. Oh, my God, that is dangerous. I will. And actually, the last time I saw somebody was trying to turn into the parking lot as somebody was exiting in the single lane. Yes. So. Wow. All right. Taylor. OK, thank you all. My time is up, but thank you all. And good luck with everybody with the end of the semester. And ciao. Good night. See you. Take care. Thanks, no food. All right. Thank you, no. Bye.