 All right, good afternoon everyone. Thank you all for being here. Welcome to today's September 7th, City of Columbia Board of Zoning Appeals meeting. I am John Gregory, Chair for the Board and will be serving as Chair for today's meeting. At this time, I want to introduce our other members of the Board starting from my right, Davis Whittle, next to him, John Guignard, to my left, Catherine Finner and far left, Celia McIntosh. I also wanna take this time to introduce staff that is most helpful with the Board. That's Hope Hasty, Zoning Administrator and Erica Hyen, Deputy Zoning Administrator and Sky Robinson Barnes. She's our land use board coordinator. The Board is charged with hearing applications for special exceptions, variances and administrative appeals. All testimony is recorded for the record and anyone wishing to speak will need to be sworn in and come to the podium to speak. No testimony may be taken from the floor. When you come to the podium, please state your name and speak clearly into the microphone because the meeting's being recorded. We are gonna be straight on the time. So we got a timer. So if you're speaking in the podium, just please be cognizant of that. But applicants with cases before the Board are allotted a presentation time of 10 minutes. And this time also includes all persons presenting information on behalf of the applicant. This time limit does not include any questions asked by the Board or staff regarding the case. Any member of the public may address the Board in intervals of three minutes. Or if you're representing a body of three or more, we'll give you five minutes. The applicant then can come back up and has five minutes for a rebuttal. So 10, three and five, essentially. The Board reserves the right to amend these limits on a case-by-case basis. Those of you who plan to speak must be sworn and we'll do that here right now. So if you're here as an applicant or here to speak in any case, please stand at this time and raise your right hand. Okay, great. Thank you. Do you affirm or attest that the testimony you will give today is the truth and nothing but the truth? All right, thank y'all. At this time, I'm gonna turn it over to Ms. Hastie. Thank you. Good afternoon. We'll start out with the consent agenda. There is only one item on the consent agenda this afternoon and that's the approval of the August 3rd, 2023 meeting minutes. Move that we approve the consent agenda. All right, we have a motion and a second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Okay, motion's approved. Moving on to the regular agenda, we've got case 20230026B, 6430 Norris Street. It's a variance request to the front yard setback, sidewalk requirement and the transitional buff yard requirement. And the applicants here to present their case. Okay, great. Thank you, Hope. At this time, will the applicant please come forward and state your name in the microphone and we'll give you 10 minutes. Get closer. Can you get a little bit closer? Can you just pull it up to you a little bit? There you go. That might be better. Yeah. I don't think it's on. Thank you, thank you, thank you. All right, all right. John Blackman, I was at Lake Kiwi on first vacation in a long time and Erica called me and said, aren't you coming to the meeting? Anyway, thanks for accommodating me this month. I don't know how familiar y'all are with the Cedar Terrace neighborhood. We've developed a number of things out there. This property used to be zoned M1 and now it's MU1, the adjacent piece to the left which we've been trying to buy for, I don't know how long, but the gentleman died about eight years ago and they haven't probated his estate yet, so we decided to move forward. The property is zoned for I believe 17 units and we want to put eight. The MU1 zoning requires a maximum depth from the street of 20 feet. We've got to have a detention pond in the front which you've shown on this map, so we're moving them to the back. They've got 30 feet of backyard, keeping them off of the road, I think is a plus. They're all one bedroom units. We have in mind catering to the VA in one bedroom units for retirees. There are no sidewalks in the area. Right across the street was zoned RG2 also and that was allowed 48 units and we put 24 single family houses there. We're cutting the density in half on this. We just need relief and this little triangular piece to the left that we've been trying to buy is a jungle and it's sort of always gonna be a jungle. There's a ditch that runs through the middle of it and if you can, I don't know if you can scroll in to this because it shows a catch basin right in front of that lot. Anyway, that's, yeah, Beringer. Yeah. Is that, are those train tracks? They are, that was the old Ford Jackson train track. Okay. And if you notice there are a meagre forest and large yolks and then this other apartment complex and a lot of people have cut through the property we want to develop over the years. You can see all the single family houses on Drake Street we did, but that has been a path to the Cedar Terry Shopping Center for years. And we think by putting people there we'll finally cut the traffic out. We've had to call the cops numerous times to run people off the property. Okay. So this what you're proposing your application if we flip through it, the sketch here, the eight units that's what you're proposing on that detention pond in front. Correct. Okay. Criteria for variance requests. I have. I'm semi-familiar with government. I spent eight years on Cedar Planning Commission. Is this, do you have sort of some answers to some of the questions like there are short-married and exceptional conditions pertaining to the particulars, a particular piece of property, any of these. But because of where the engineer says we've got to put the detention pond and the size of the detention pond. I mean, we could build 16 units and have a four-storey building that in what we're after. So, so what the M.U.1 would allow there. But you still need to step back. We put it up front. Just to confirm M.U.1 doesn't have a maximum density. Does not have a maximum density. Yeah. Say that one more time. I was just confirming that M.U.1 district does not have a maximum density. Yeah. So you can put as much as you can feel it. Correct. So long you meet the other. So long as you can make the other parts. Yeah. Right. So how the detention pond, I mean, that's. It looks like a cute ski on it. Well, yeah. So driving, I've driven through there and it would definitely be different having these townhomes set all the way back, 185 feet. Why is the detention pond have to be half the size of the parcel? That's just what the engineers. That's what the engineers is. Okay. And he, I don't know if y'all know where Byron Oaks condominiums are. Right by the VA hospital. We, this same engineer went to FEMA for us to get that area removed from the floodplain. So we could build seven units. And the 2015 storm came right after we got it removed in the grass. I mean, the water did not come out of the ditch. So he knows what he's doing, unfortunately. Okay. I mean, I think, Mr. Blackman, I think John brought up a good point. I mean, for variances, we've got to be able to it's got to be a hardship that we're proven and you got to meet these certain criteria. So I know you mentioned you were aware of them, but I think that's what we're going to end up talking about when we get to board discussion and how this case fits in with those criteria. Does anybody have any questions for Mr. Blackman from the board? I guess I got one other question. Have you done anything in this immediate area? Any other developments in this immediate area? The 24 houses right across the street. You did all those across the street? Okay. I do have a question. Did you explore some other ways to site? We did. We thought about putting them on the right hand side by the railroad track initially, but this seemed to work out a little bit better for us. So you did all from 6439 Norris and then you wrapped the corner on Drake Street that all those units. Correct. Drake, okay. Yes. Yeah, those look good. And again, it was owned for 48 units. Yeah, okay. We got any other questions for them? And you'll have a chance to come back up. So we'll let the public come up. They'll get three minutes a piece and then you'll have a chance to come back up. Nothing other than what, I'm sure DHEC has a regime that you have to follow. Yeah. They're not a problem in Columbia anyway, are they? Yeah. All right, well, thank you very much, Mr. Blackman. Appreciate it. Thank y'all. All right, this time we will allow members of the public to come up. So if anybody wants to come up, hey, good afternoon. Will you just please state your name for the record? Yeah, good afternoon. My name is Rob Walden. I live at 1028 Cedar Terrace, which is pretty much right across the street from the parcel that we're discussing today. Yeah. So as a resident of the Brandon Aker Cedar Terrace neighborhood for about seven years now, I oppose a lot of what has been proposed with this particular development. I think my neighbors are better equipped to speak about some of the other specific issues that we as a neighborhood have. But I specifically wanna talk about the variance for the transitional buffer to five feet, especially. I believe that it is unfair for the existing homeowners, my neighbors to have to deal with another property that is so close to their property, essentially right in the middle of their backyard. I think reducing the transitional buffer to five feet is unnecessary. I think it's unfair to those existing residents. And really, I think it's obvious why those zoning requirements exist for a reason. And like you guys have already even talked about before we began speaking, not only do those zoning requirements exist for a reason, but it requires a hardship to get those waived. I don't think trying to build a development that is bigger than what the land allows really should qualify as one of those hardships. Personally, I'm not a expert in development or in building, but I do think just looking at what has been proposed, it's not particularly difficult to see that building a smaller unit, a smaller development would negate the need for this variance request at all. A smaller development could be built with the required 15 foot transitional buffer and a variance wouldn't be required at all. So again, the regulations exist for a reason. And I don't think that the developers desire to build the biggest development possible so that they can maximize their profit is really a valid reason to disregard the zoning regulations that we have in place. I know that's just one of many issues that our existing neighborhood has with this development. Like I said, I know a lot of my neighbors are prepared to speak on those, but I would encourage all the members of this committee to vote against the variance request, which I think is unnecessary and unfair to our existing residents. And with that, thank you for your time and I'll turn it over to somebody else. Thank you. Hey, good afternoon. My name is John Marshall. Ladies and gentlemen of the board, I also live on Cedar Terrace. I've been a resident of the neighborhood and community since 2017. The idea of the construction of these multifamily units being in a predominantly single family housing zone as a whole from the added stresses of the infrastructure to the damage, the construction vehicles and additional traffic will bring to our already neglected roads as well as to the environmental impacts of this potential project. So obviously variance to the setback standard. I've listened to the applicant's request. I did not hear a reason that actually satisfied the grounds for appeal. What I am hearing is a request to alter the rules set in place to protect homeowners like myself and in order to allow the builder to put as many additional units as they can. I believe for the intention of additional profit with no regards for the current residents or the impact it'll have on us or the eventual new residents of the facility being proposed or the issue it'll create for a neighborhood as a whole. As the variance application clearly states the fact that the land may be utilized more profitably should a variance be granted does not constitute grounds for the granting of said variance. My opinion to prove this request would fly in the face of the established rules as well as set up poor precedents for future zoning requests and decisions. For these reasons as well as the reasons that have been and will be presented by my fellow neighbors, I ask that you deny this request in its entirety and allow instead the builder to be bound by the existing rules. If I may, can you please pull up the aerial photo that was kind of closer in of the zone? I'd also like to point out this large swath right here that separates these more apartmenty things from the actual neighborhood. There is a giant separation there. There is no co-mingling between those two zones and areas. So and to utilize this as something to be taken over here would not really be in the spirit of the neighborhood on this side. I thank you for your time and I yield to whoever's next. Hey, good afternoon. My name is Joshua Staub. I live at 1119 Cedar Terrace. I've been in the trades for some years as an electricians helper. I've helped carpenters. I've dealt with city inspectors in North Carolina and South Carolina seeing that I had last year completed a addition to my home and I'm somewhat familiar with what you have to go through. Now my main concern is that the gentleman would like to change the variance on the side of his building that abuts to the properties on only two properties actually on Cedar Terrace. That he wants five feet and then a fence that's eight feet, points of egress, fire. How do you even build it with only five feet to the property line scaffolding can't fit there and extension ladder can't fit there. Also, we have been blessed with a lot of rain this year, thankfully, but a lot of years we don't. If that building were to catch fire, what's to say that fence won't catch on fire and then continue to have a blaze. We know what happened in Maui this year. We know what happened in Canada. So also that area is wooded there. How does any emergency vehicle get into that area? The no man's land, the Behringer property to fight a fire back there. The only way they would get in is through his parking lot and five feet on either side of a long building doesn't really give you much of a chance to fight a fire unless you're doing directly from his parking places. So that's my main issue. Also, when I was building my home, I have 30 feet from the property line back property line to the back of my addition. It's enough room for the utility company to come in and work on the lines and also for deliveries. However, even with that 30 feet, I had to have my sheetrock delivered through my back door and I designed it for deliveries. The crane truck would not deliver the sheetrock with their crane equipment for fear that they would arc electricity from the lines, that the electrical lines to their crane truck with 30 feet. So that's my safety concerns. That's my main issue for being here is just safety concerns for such small areas of egress on either side of his building. Thank you very much. Thank you, appreciate it. All right, thank you. It's different, yes. My name's Maina Hewitt. Okay, good afternoon. I have been a resident of the Cedar Terrace community since 1994. The sheet I am handing out is again, covering fire protection in that particular neighborhood. Norris Street is a very narrow street. They've already had trouble in the past with fire trucks getting into that area. The closest fire hydrant is a block and a half from that particular site. Another issue is the detention pond. Is it going to be fenced off? Because of the number of units and the number of parking spaces that they have allotted, they have only allotted 10 spaces for eight units. We already have a parking problem in that neighborhood. The other houses that were constructed on Drake Street do not have adequate parking for their houses. If a guest comes or if their child grows up to the age to have an additional vehicle. And so they park on the side of the road, narrowing this area even more so. So all of this combines into our concern for the safety. As you can tell, that area is fairly well-wooded with all growth oak trees. And if a fire should break out into that, it could spread readily into other neighbors' properties. So I hope you will take this into account. Another thing I wanna bring up is the character of the neighborhood. Having lived there since 94, it is predominantly single-family housing. Predominantly, we don't have the turnover like other communities do, long-term residents. And this will definitely alter some of the aspects of the community. There's a very, very small units. Thank you. Thank you, ma'am, appreciate it. Hey, good afternoon. Hi, my name is Jacqueline Marshall. I am a resident of Cedar Terrace neighborhood. I live actually on Cedar Terrace on one of the properties that would be right next to this one. The properties that are on Drake Street that he built, those are, they're all still single-family homes. And I believe all but two of them are owner-occupied. So they're not even rentals. They're all single-family homes. The majority of our neighborhood is single-family homes. If you would go back to the overhead view. Yes, like he was saying before me, the properties that are apartments on the other side, those are not part of our neighborhood. On the other side of the old railroad track. Right, yes. There, it does not have any type of cut through. There is no way to access it until you go out onto the main road and go around. So it's not really part of our neighborhood. It's outside of our neighborhood. The homes that are in our neighborhood are single-family homes. So we would prefer to see it kept at least two smaller housing. This property that he's proposing with eight units, that's the reason why he can't fit it in there is because it's eight units. If he did smaller units, if he did something like what he did across the street where there was four or six, he'd be able to fit it without needing any type of authorization other than the usual rules. So we don't just see any reason why he should be allowed to change the rules just to make more money off of rentals. I think that that's all that I had to say. Perfect, thank you. That's good. All right, any other members of the public wish to speak on this case? Okay. Hey, welcome. Good afternoon. Hi, my name is Sarah Navarez and I am representing the Neighborhood Association. I'm the Vice President of our Neighborhood Association at this time. So I just, I brought some pictures for you so you can actually see what the houses in our neighborhood look like. Except for one block close to this, every multifamily piece in our adjoining neighborhood is a single story brick duplex. The largest multifamily in this neighborhood at this point is a fourplex of 1,000 square foot townhouses. And I think that building something along those lines would still fit within the property that he's proposing and would be more consistent with the neighborhood. Something that we also have found is that the homes that he did build, which we would be very open to him building more of those on this property, but the homes that he did build in the past have insufficient parking. They have only compensated by actually parking on the lot he is currently proposing to build on. So he's taking away the overflow parking of the previous homes he built and providing them no overflow parking, are they gonna have guests? Are they gonna have spouses? Providing one space per unit effectively is just not enough. Especially also if he's targeting retirees using the VA, are they gonna have professional caregivers? Are they gonna need ambulance access? Having a tiny little driveway wrapping around this detention pond is not great ambulance access. It's not great fire access and provides nowhere for those caregivers or family members that may be visiting the units to park because there isn't sufficient street parking. Also wanted to highlight the sidewalk issue. So he said that there's no sidewalks in the neighborhood at present. There is actually an approved by Planning Commission sidewalk coming on Drake Street that would immediately join this property and it would allow Drake Street residents and Norris Street residents to walk safely to Hampton Park which is about a block and a half away from this property. Because the units he built before are zoned RSF-3, the rest of the entire neighborhood is RSF-2. So this is a high density spot in our neighborhood and even though the rest of the neighborhood doesn't have as much sidewalks, it makes sense to put sidewalks in the highest density section of the neighborhood. One of our neighbors, Mary Angstrom, she emailed you guys and you've got that in your packet said just because it was the 1950 standard when the other houses were built doesn't mean we're operating under 1950 standards today. I don't see that as a good reason. It is a higher density section of the neighborhood and it is new construction. We should have sidewalks for these residents. And I think if you kind of look, Mayna mentioned the turnover, but our neighborhood has 14% turnover compared to about 45% for the city as a whole. We want long-term residents. We don't feel like somebody who's living five feet away from a fence is gonna be the type of resident who's gonna stay long-term and be an active part of our neighborhood which is what we're really looking for and asking for. So I hope you give the materials that my neighbors have presented consideration with that in mind. Cool. Anything unless you'll have any questions about the neighborhood. I will also mention that- Hey, will you please come to the, we'll give you 30 more seconds. Yeah, will you please come to the podium? We have had no contact on our public Facebook page, on our publicly available email address at our meetings that we have been holding and posting publicly in the neighborhood. We've not been approached by him. We also ask the neighbors, if they've been approached, the ones whose properties back up to this property, none of them have been approached to get their perspective or to see the impact. So we don't really think that he has made an effort to see if there is the need for this variance or to see how it would impact the neighbors. And that's why you've seen the representation you have here today of our neighbors. You have essentially the entire block that black backs up to this property and I think three of the people across the street have either emailed or come here today. So you have basically two full blocks united in opposition as well as the neighborhood association. And no real reason, like Rob said, he hasn't actually given you any reason of an extraordinary circumstance to make this exception. So I think that's just really inconsistent with somebody who would be going about this in the right way. He doesn't have a reason. He's not trying to work with us. He's not trying to listen to us. And I think we do have compelling reasons that we're simply asking you to follow the code, not to deny it. We're fine with housing being built. As a neighborhood association, we are renter friendly, but we are not fine with housing being built. That's five feet away from a property line with no real reason on our electrical lines with no real reason to be so close and to be so intrusive to the homeowners that are existing there. Awesome. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Any other members of the public wish to speak on this? Hey, good afternoon. Thank you for coming. Yes, sir. My name is Jacob Bagley. I live at 6435 Norris Street. I just had a couple of personal anecdotes to say about my house and the way it was built. So my neighbors and my own AC units have all three gone out this summer. The Floors Creek, my neighbor's door, I know for a fact, and my door have both rotted due to a lack of gutter installation on the rear of the house. I've had to make expensive renovations in my home after I discovered the floor was uneven in the bathrooms. And as soon as I tore up the covering, I discovered a good deal of mold. It cost me about $700 to renovate that bathroom and about three days of my time with a friend. In addition to that, as the other neighbors have argued, it would be a major departure from the norm of the neighborhood. And I'm also concerned with the fact that there used to be a chemical plant back there. And I was maybe wondering if some of the chemicals that leashed into that soil in a breaking ground might unearth that and cause more health hazards. Thank you. Yeah, appreciate it. Thank you, ma'am. All right, any other testimonies from the public? All right, seeing none. Mr. Blackman, you do have a five minute rebuttal if you would like to come up and address some of those comments. Could you put the sketch back up? I believe we're actually adjacent to only one piece of property, Cedar Terrace. So the fence that would be on our property line, there's still the back corner of Bearanger's property before anybody's house. And we developed the 24 houses. We didn't build them, just point of reference. And remind me again of what the parking requirement is in the ME1. There is no parking requirement in the ME1 district. So, you know, and I apologize to the neighborhood for not approaching them. We thought this was fairly reasonable and not to a community of its own or retired military people back there. All right, well, appreciate it. Thank you very much. Thanks. All right, so that wraps up the public testimony and rebuttal and all that. So we'll move into board discussion. Anyone like to lead us off? Sure. I know you like to lead us off. Yeah. All right, you know, I have a lot of sympathy for the neighbors who are upset because obviously, you know, it would have been nice if he'd talk to them and so on, but there is no requirement to do so. And the project that's in front of us is the one we have to consider not some other project that they might rather see, but rather the project that the developer has proposed. It's only tangentially, it touches only in one point, one property, one piece of property on Cedar Terrace that backs onto it. I was kind of confused about the issues they were raising about the fire and it's gonna burn down, but then again, there's also the problem of flood and it seemed to me that with the reason, the problem we have, the problems that are many, but mostly they just don't seem to like the project. I think that from going down the criteria, I think that there are some conditions that do not generally apply to other properties in the vicinity, specifically the need to have a detention pond, which sets it back, which is not a result of his own actions because he has to put the detention pond, he told us, where he has to put it. From a perspective of the zoning district where it is located, it is an MU district, it's not in an RS, Residential Single Family District. I think from a public good perspective, adding density, housing density, is actually a fairly good thing. We have a severe housing shortage in Columbia and I think particularly having folks at the fort and veterans there would be a useful thing. As far as the safety issues that are raised, that's outside our purview. We can't really address that. I think that if there's a fire issue, if there's, that's obviously, I think part of the CO process, a certificate of occupancy process, or DOT, or other issues like that, that are beyond our purview. But from the standpoint that we are, I think that it seems like a worthy project from the public good, would it be easier for all of us if he had just decided to put two single family houses there? I suppose so, accepting as I say, I think that we do need some housing and it seems like a worthy enough project and it seems that the impact is actually not going to be that great. It's only eight units. And I say this living in a neighborhood chalk full of rental units. I think that we can't discriminate against people because they're homeowners or because they're renters and not homeowners and so on. I think that's outside our purview also. So for those reasons, I recommend that we approve it. Can I ask a question for clarity real quick, Hope? What this application, I mean, he would have to get, does he have to go in front of planning commission and all that or? No, the number of units would not require a planning commission review, but it would still require staff site plan review. Okay, okay, thank you. Go ahead, John, sorry. No, that's fine. Looking at the criteria, the number six is the reason set forth in this application justify the granting of the variance. There isn't any justification in the application. It just says this is what I want. So that's kind of why I was asking Mr. Blackman if he was familiar with it because he didn't address any of them really explicitly. And then I feel like, and the variance is the minimum variance that will make possible the reasonable use of the land, which isn't his, it's not the minimum variance that will make possible his desired development. It will be the minimum variance that will make possible the reasonable use of the land. And five feet to me when 15 is the minimum is really concerning. And then the granting of the variance will be in harmony with the general purpose. The intent of this ordinance will not be injurious to the neighborhood or otherwise detrimental to the public welfare. I think that the 15 foot with an eight foot fence changing it to five feet is not in harmony with the general purpose of the intent of the ordinance. So I'm a little bit more opposed to the application. I don't think it answered the criteria of why there should be a variance or, and then I think if I'm coming up with the solutions of why it meets the criteria myself, I can't on number six and seven. Yeah, I tend to agree more with John on this, Catherine. I usually agree with you on stuff, but I just have a hard time, 185 foot. I mean, that is completely different than anything in the neighborhood. You're gonna have a bunch of units that are tucked in back there. And I just, I have a hard time thinking that that's gonna fit in with the neighborhood. So you say six and seven. I said more number five, the character of the district. I think it will be out of character with the district. So that's kind of my thoughts. So I'm gonna, I'll take it next. I agree with some of the things you said about the density of the project, having more affordable housing, saving the grand oak. These are all good things, but I don't see how making it seven units instead of eight significantly changes that, but it makes the site feel 100% different for the people who live there. To live five feet from an eight foot fence, and that's your front yard, backyard. I just think that is not in the spirit of zoning. Even if you think about just run off or what that space feels like, it just sort of becomes a dark muddy mess on the sides of your building. So for me, I feel like there could be a little bit more creativity. Take another hard look at it. That there's some other way to position that building and keep the eight if you want to. So I'm inclined to give it a nay vote. Davis, you got anything? I mean, nothing really to add to what you already said, but I think my personal biggest concern is not the five foot setback because of the way the other lots back up to it. My concern is more the location of the detention pond and the setback in the front and how that would look from the street. Worry if they're gonna put a big fence around it to protect people from going in or whatever. Just might not give it the best look from the street for the neighborhood. Can I ask a question? Yeah. To remind me of sort of, is it an all or nothing in terms of the different points within the application? The three different requests. Yeah, you could vary that if you wanted to. Is it okay? Yeah. Say that again, you could do what? I mean, so there were three different, basically three different requests for variances and you could, I guess, vote to approve one and not another. The max front yard setback, the sidewalks and the transitional side yard. Yeah, yeah. And I did, and the applicant did request that I just let you know that there's a five foot side setback requirement in MU1. Five foot side, so that's not a very... Side setback requirement. Yeah, the variance is for the buffer. Yeah, the transitional buffer. Yeah, okay. And back to board discussion, I mean, I don't know the entire history of these parcels right here, but certainly all of them zoned MU1. There was some industrial facility right next to it, but it's been shut down for a number of years and I just think it's some carryover with this particular parcel. As far as that MU1 zoning. So yeah, y'all got any other comments, Yolanda? I would like, if we're gonna move to a motion, I would like to hear a motion that asks to approve it and then we approve that or deny it instead, because I think in the past we've done some to deny it and it's been confusing. So let's, if we're gonna make a motion, I'd like to hear it to approve it and then we'll vote on that approval to approve it or deny it. I can count it, it seems to me that we've got four against. So it would make it a lot easier to make the motion the other direction. Well, let's make a motion. Can I hear, I'd like to hear a motion to approve it and then we'll get a second and then we'll make a vote. But you won't get a second. That's just the motion. But it could deny, it could be, it could fail. I move that we approve the project. Okay, we have a motion, do we have a second? Second. Okay, we have a motion and a second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed? Nay. All right, the motion's been denied. All right, thank you all very much. All right, moving on to the second case, case number 2023-0027, special exception case is the applicant here. Okay, afternoon, will you please state your name? Good day, my name is Shapali Peniston Blair. Thank you. I am the CEO, founder and executive director of HHA Cares, which is a residential home, level three, ages 12 to 21. So when I say ages 12 to 21, I know a lot of us believe that the children are not in DSS custody at the age of 18, but if the child signs a VPA agreement at the age of 18, they can stay in custody until the age of 21. Also, if a child is court ordered to be in custody with DSS until the age of 21, then they are in DSS custody. I am not DSS, I am a DSS provider, okay? I'm submitting, this is just a draft of what I use with my existing group home. I only have two copies. Is that what you previously gave us? Do you know that? Is that part of the application, I believe it is. I believe it is, yeah. Okay, so today I am asking for a maximum of nine beds at 1901 Academy Street. Just to give you a brief idea of who I am. My maiden name is Shapali Boyles. I am the daughter of Joel and Thomas Boyles, who raised several children in DSS custody. Three of my brothers were adopted. Name, change, and so I have five brothers. I am the oldest and only girl. I am the proud graduate of Benedict College. I am a retired horticulture and biology teacher. Introducing our platform at HHA Cares, an existing group home that is located on 2033 Hayward Brockerton Road. Our mission is to not only serve children but provide a nurturing environment that is conducive for our children to strive and persevere. Of course we know this is a global society. Children are not in a position to pick and choose their parents. They are not in position to be in control of the situational circumstances that they are in. Some of them are dealt bad hands at birth. Presently I serve maximum of 13 girls, ages 12 to 21. Presently the youngest is 14, the oldest is 18. How are the children in South Carolina? Are we really catering to our children? In the state of South Carolina, we have overworked social workers and case managers in the office with these babies. And these babies are in the office until 8 p.m. at night until they are transported to a bed. And once they sleep, they are awakened at 7 a.m. or 8 a.m. or maybe 9 a.m. and transported back into ADSS office. I am asking for nine beds on 1901 Academy Street to help alleviate the stress, the tension, the anger of a child that has to go from pillow to post to sleep and spend their day in a bed. How are the children in South Carolina? The children of HHA cares are doing very well. How do I know? Four of our girls have graduated from high school. I just paid $100 on our society fees. I moved in one of my girls three and a half weeks ago into her dorm room at Benedict College. She is a first-generational graduate, high school maternal and paternal. She is a first-generational grad, paternal and maternal college enrollee and attendee. We are breaking curses. We are helping our girls evolve. So how are the children in South Carolina? I don't have that many beds. The house is full on 2033 here at Brockerton Road, but 1901 Academy can house eight children. And I'm asking for an approval. And once again, I am not DSS. I am a DSS provider. So this wasn't just an idea. Thomas and Jolene Boyles, my mother and father, called me one day. I was still teaching full-time. And they said, can you drive over here and have a conversation with us? I said, yes. I sat down at the table when they summons me. They said, remember, we told you that if we get a new house, we will want this house to serve children who have no place to go. I said, yes. Well, we want you to do it because we know you can make it happen. But we want you to do it now while we're living so we can see it happen. And I did it in less than two years. So I asked you again, how are the children in South Carolina? Today, I stand before you as a child advocate. I am advocating for children who have no place to go. The ultimate goal is for them to be reunited with their families. But of course, children are not in control of their situational circumstances. We have a partnership and our partnership is with Max Speed Performance Fitness, who is the owner of this property, 1901 Academy Street. Our platform is social and emotional healing with the use of horticulture and agriculture, which includes therapeutic and recreational activities such as walking for mindfulness, cooking classes, sewing classes, devotion, Bible study with Grace Life, who comes to the home every single Friday with our girls. Our girls receive mental health counseling. Our girls also go on a seven-hour field trip every single Saturday. Marzano says that when you put the exact practice in place, when the needs of a child, hierarchical needs have been served, there's other things that we need to consider. And those other things are a structural organization. They need a toolkit and we have that toolkit. Our girls attend Max Speed Performance Fitness after school for 30 to 6.30 Monday through Friday, which are the owners of the property, Mr. and Mrs. Chestnut. This is the front of the 1901 Academy Street. The address of 1901 Academy Street is actually perpendicular to sunset. But this is the front and the front is on sunset. And then the next slide, after that one, and the next one, I believe the next one will show the side view. Uh-oh. Okay, well, this would be the perpendicular angle from the home, which that gate would be an entrance for a handicapped park on the side of that gate. And of course, that parking will be used not only for the case managers and social workers, but for employee parking as well. It is a 24-hour care home. 24 hours, meaning that we do have shifts. We have three shifts. We have six to two, two to 10, 10 to 6 a.m. The ratio is five to one. When we have girls or young males or children that require a high level of attention, we call that a one-to-one. And so we will include extra staff for that one child. So that one child has a shadow all day. And it works very well. This is the green space. At the existing home, we have raised beds. Our girls harvest from their own garden. They enjoy cucumber salad with vinegar, salt and pepper. We teach them how to landscape design. So we'll be using the green space for, not only for walking for mindfulness, but we'll be using it for raised beds, horticulture and landscape design. Of course, this is a second unit. That's the kitchen area. Dining and family area, bedroom. And so one of the bedrooms is double the space of that bedroom. So today I stand before you asking for eight to nine beds. Of course, it looks like it can fit 12 children, but when I did the measurements per DSS, the ones that they use, it can only house no more than nine children. At this time, I would like to yield and introduce Mr. Mazzis Chesnut to you. Do you have any questions for me? How much more time do we have on the presentation? Well, I think you can, Yeah, we can get one. We have 10 minutes and you can ask as many questions as you'd like. Okay. Do we want to ask questions now or do we want to hear from the go up and ask questions? Well, I think Mr. Mazzis Chesnut are just here to support the application. Yeah, let's bring them up and let them give their testimony and then we'll bring you back up and ask some questions. All right, thank you. Hey, good afternoon. We all please both state your name for the record. Earl Chesnut. And Latisha Chesnut. Okay, good afternoon and thank y'all for being here. Thank you. Thank you. Well, I just want to say I appreciate the opportunity to be here to work with Ms. Polly. Latisha and I, we both are graduates from Benedict College, graduated together in 2000, met there, married, still together. But 1901 Academy Street is a property that me and one of my partners repurchased. We renovated it. It's in a unique location. We was going to just rent the property out as a regular renter. Ms. Polly and her girls do attend our business, MaxB Performance and Fitness and it's basically a health and wellness for youth. It's a gym for youth. If you go to www.maxbfitness.com, you'll pretty much pull up all that information. We've been in existence going on five years, about four and a half years. The property was actually set up to, make it just residential. I know that with the code that were required, if we continue to use it as residential, we could. But if we was to try to do anything else, it would have to go through rezoning. Luckily, Ms. Polly saw the property, had an interest in it. And right now, we're just trying to see if it could be a service to her. So my background is I was a recreation therapist. I worked for 20 years at Prisma Health. So to have Ms. Polly here, wanting to include recreation therapy and activity therapy with the girls, to have them to have a life where they can see themselves becoming adults and leading lives where they can in turn, turn around and help someone else. MaxSpeed is a youth training facility. So we train youths from the ages of five to 18. And our goal is to train youth for today so that they can have a brighter tomorrow. So we had the girls to come through, we had a summer program for them. So they came five days a week from 8.30 a.m. until about four o'clock. And to see the transformation with these girls, we had one girl that lost 45 pounds. Just, yeah. From just working out from, you know, they had activities during the morning, they did exercises, but to see the transformation with them, it was something that, you know, just made us feel proud to be able to, you know, not only witness it, but to be a part of it. So, and it helps me to kind of delve back into recreation therapy. I retired in 2020. So to be able to reestablish that commitment to our youth is something that we have both been, you know, absolutely amazed to do. And to assist these girls. So we approve, you know, we're behind our 100% to use 1901 Academy Street, you know, so that these girls or whoever else, young males, they can have a chance to, you know, grow and, you know, just become adults that will be better for this world. So, yeah. To add to that, I'm also a therapy to recreation major from Benedict College. I got into the field. Once I graduated, I worked at Carolina Children's Homes. And then I left Carolina Children's Home and we worked at what is called Youth Adventure World on the other side of DJJ. They had a facility where they dealt with youth that was putting that program instead of DJJ. After doing that for several years, I did get involved with real estate and remodeling different homes. And it was just something that, you know, related to my major. And I realized that, you know, yes, you can just rent the property out to anyone, but if we can do something where it can provide service to the youth as well as help Ms. Polly with her transition of the kids. And I think it's a great thing. All right. Well, that was kind of, yeah, moved to the members of the public. And let's just continue that. And then we'll bring you back up here. Is anyone else here from the public that wishes to speak? Okay. All right. Yeah, will you please come back up? Thank you. Thank a few of us. And I wanted to ask a couple of questions. So do you have one you wanna leave off with? No. Not really. No, no. Okay, I, mm-hmm. All right. I served on foster care review board for many, many, many years in Richland County and there's a desperate need for therapeutic homes. Now, a level three therapeutic foster home. Level one is kinship care. Level two is an ordinary foster home. And level three is just one step up for kids who need a little bit more help. But it goes all the way to five, right? Well, in the state of South Carolina, we are in hardship with serving because it's only six level three homes in a state of South Carolina. What makes mine unique is because my platform is social and emotional healing with the use of therapeutic and recreational practices, such as horticulture and arts. However, children of level three, when we think of pain and trauma, I think of an iceberg and you know, the surface of an iceberg is what we can see, but what's underneath is the damaging, the 80%. So we need to keep in mind that the behaviors that they may exhibit is from the pain and trauma. But when these children are given opportunities with structural organization and just hope, they can perform and they can strive and have that bright future, but you just have to pour it into them. Absolutely, I know, yeah, I completely agree. And I know that there have been some issues with a number of some of the other homes. So I think this might be a really wonderful program if you can do it. I think that the big issue, the only thing that I can think of is that you're gonna need to go through all kinds of other processes, right, from DHEC on DSS and all that. Yes, ma'am. So to open up HHA Cares, the existing group home, of course, this is the first process. The second process is submitting your packet to DSS. Of course, my paperwork will be identical, no changes. Secondly, they will schedule your DHEC and your fire. So your fire marshal come out before DHEC and then DHEC and then DSS. And DSS will come out with the measuring tapes and make sure you did your measurements precisely. Apart from that, before the fire marshal comes out, of course, you have to request your tap line from the city of Columbia, Water, which takes a couple of weeks. After the city of Columbia approves that tap line, then your sprinkler system company, and I'm using the same vendors, of course, they come in and they do the sprinkler system, which takes about eight hours or less. And then secondly, you would do your fire compression system. Of course, I'm going with Caroway, same company. And then lastly, you have your DHEC. Right, okay, great. Okay, well, thank you very much. I don't think we have any other questions for you. So I appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, all testimonies closed this time and we'll just move into board discussion. So I think it seems pretty straightforward. I agree. We agree. I've got a motion. I was gonna say, I was like this one, we've had some trouble with some in the past, but I feel like this site is almost perfect. Yes. Just the relation to other things and even in perpetuity, if you move on and over time, it still seems like it's gonna be sited. It sort of looks like, to me, the highest and best use of the site. Absolutely. And so that's huge. And the location close to the hospital, should they need any treatment there? It's just the whole thing just seems like a really good idea. Yeah, we got a motion from someone. I move that we approve subject to staff comments. Second. All right, we have a motion and a second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? All right, the motion's approved. Thank you all very much and good luck. Good job. All right, so next on the agenda, folks, we've got executive session. So can we get a motion to move into executive session? Move into executive session. All right, we have a motion and a second. All right, all those in favor say aye. Aye. Aye. All right, move into executive session. Yep. All right. Very good. I'm gonna make a motion that we end executive session and get back into the normal order of business. Second. All right, motion and second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? All right. Motion's approved and I'd like to make a motion to adjourn. Second. Motion and a second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Aye. Motion's approved. Thank you all. Thank you.