 Hey everybody, welcome back to the Lynxcast. I'm your host Matt. I'm joined by Tyler and boy Do we have a show for you today? We've just spent the first half an hour before we even hit the record button Trying to get GNOME to work Because I had to switch to GNOME in order for us to actually record video because OBS is trash I mean, it's trash Everything is trash. I'm that's gonna be the theme of the day. Everything is trash. Linux is trash open sources trash OBS is trash discourse is trash Everything is trash is garbage utter garbage. Okay. That's the kind of mood. I'm in it's raining outside We have gotten like four inches of rain. I'm pretty sure I'm about to float away So everything's gonna be okay. All right, so before we get into my woes, which I thought we're over by the way Tyler, why don't you tell us what you've been doing this week on Linux? Yeah, I've been starting to use virtual box For the first time in a long time, like I just haven't been using virtual box in a long time I'm Mori the last time I was having to use like a virtual machine I was actually like needing to pass in a graphics card. So I was doing that QQ you QQ you You said that QQ emu Yeah That and KVM so like it's been just a long time since I've messed around with virtual box and it was just funny because the I don't know for some reason. I just remembered virtual box and being where when you installed like your operating system Or you booted off the live, you know ISO. You just got A full like Screen thing. No, it's 800 by 600 all the time. I totally forgot about that. Yeah you have to so you can either in virtual box you can either change to a different Video driver if you changed I don't remember which one it is It's the one under them the default one and that will get full screen automatically But that's not supported by every distro. So if you you would into a distro that does Wayland You're gonna be in a world of hurt So then you always have to log back out and switch to the default driver Otherwise, you have to install the the guest additions, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, like okay So let's just put this perspective for virtual box in order to get that stuff to work You have to insert what is the equivalent of a DVD? Basically what this is is you have to mount a DVD to your system in order to get this to work like It's the dumbest Okay, so like I could understand that like windows because nobody uses the terminal windows But in Linux it should just be like pseudo apt installed whatever I mean you can do that But it's not the way you're supposed to do it It's a mess. I don't like what you box at all. I've been I've been trying to get vert manager to work I have many people get that to work either Yeah, I don't even know so Vert manager is isn't it QQ. Yeah, it's that thing. Yeah, yeah It's just like a friend to it or whatever Supposedly it's better, but I got the last time I got to work. I wasn't impressed with it because or at least Being the noob that I am I couldn't figure out how to give it more video memory Like I wanted to have at least some video memory, but you can't like actually change that quality or whatever But maybe you can and I just couldn't figure it out. I don't know No, it's been so like I think I did use vert manager, but it's been so long since I've Actually used it so I I can't remember almost anything about it. I just know that it it worked a lot a lot better for me when it came to just Installing it and it just working for virtual box as soon as it booted up and it's like this tiny screen I was like, oh crap. How do I how do I get it to like go back to the full screen? I mean, it was it wasn't complicated at all, but I just wasn't expecting it at first. Yeah, it's just surprising What have you been up to? It feels like in this day and age they could fix that but you know, you know What have I been up to? How's life been? Okay, so Last Thursday, if you'll remember when we recorded this I Was having some distro hopping urges and I had put up a poll and asked the community whether or not What distro as you go to and void Linux one? So I installed Linux five times in about 12 hours Ha four times of those was void Linux the first three times I got it installed and it wouldn't get past grub like I'm no clue why Nothing I did could you know change that? I don't know whether I was installing long colonel or something I got strong the directions from void and then I followed the directions like the third time I found a video from one of the YouTube guys And then stalls I mean, it's not a hard install. It's like I endcurses installer You know, so wasn't like it was difficult or anything But I couldn't get past grab the fourth time I Did get past grub and got into a TTY which isn't where I was supposed to be I should have installed X FCE But I was like, you're not fine. I'm in a TTY. I can pretty much do anything. I want here now But it won't let me log in it won't let me log in as the user that I was supposed to have created It won't let me log in as root And I don't know why I get it just kept saying invalid password like and it's I mean It's possible I suppose that I type the password wrong But I type my password in so often I don't think so and it asks you to repeat the password So I want to make the same mistake twice. I wouldn't think actually four times because you got to do it for root and for your user So that was weird. So I was like, you know, I'm done with void at that point I would I'd spent like eight hours on it. I was like, you know, I'm just gonna go back to arch I was like, well, you know Normally, I would just you know, boot up into arco or something and choose arco because that's where you've been for ages. You know Fine, I'll just go ahead and do a vanilla arch install because I haven't done one of those in a long time and You know, I got it done and it's an it's I'm using it and The first couple days were shaky like I think every time you install arch the first couple days are shaky Because there's always those things that you have to install that you didn't remember to install. Yep You know drivers or packages or whatever that you have to And always the first time you try to install like something like steam and it says, oh, we can't do this because you haven't enabled the 32-bit library It's like, oh crap. I forgot to do that, you know, it's just those little things that you have to forget But after a couple days everything seems to have been working fine The USB problems that I was having under arco those seems to have been gone I was on Sunday night. I had some really weird problems with Firefox where it was just freezing up the entire system. Like I don't know what was going on there but I didn't install Firefox and switched to Brave and I Haven't had any of those problems and so I'm assuming I'm hoping that that was a Firefox problem It's also possible that it was because I was streaming. I guess I'll find out some night Yeah, so Up until we started the podcast everything was like, oh, it's doing okay. Like it's gonna be fine I might be able to stick with Arch and I was just in my DWM install and then OBS decided it was going to freeze the video for whatever reason. I don't know why so that's gonna have something I'm gonna have to search for like a Google search And see if I can fix it if I can't fix it I'm gonna have to hop again because I will not I swear to God to Utah I will not be using genom again. This is the dumbest thing. Okay. I got a rant screw the main topic Let's talk about gnomes. Yeah, please do. So like why why is it that you like really hate gnomes? Okay, like there's so many reasons man. I would like to start Okay, just just from this experience line. So first of all, let's talk about the reason why I'm using gnomes So you're like if you if you hate gnomes so much, why did you even install it? Why didn't you install something like X FCE or KDE plasma? Whatever and the the reason is is That for whatever reason on my hardware, I can't get any other display manager to work other than GDM Wait, hold on even What's it called the one that's Webkit to base? Light DM. Yeah, let him does a work for light DM will boot up into a TTY Or a like a scrolling roll wall of text and say we've started light display manager and that's where it will freeze And it happens no matter what distro. I'm on. It's really weird. It has something to do with this hardware That's like DM. I think it has been reliable. I know for me. It used to be that way for me, too I don't I don't know why it's not anymore for me It doesn't make any sense. It has to be this hardware because like I said, it doesn't matter to the distro It happened on Ubuntu or it was one of the Ubuntu's. I think it was a Zubuntu, whatever something I don't remember. It's been ages It happened in Arco. It happened here on Arch. It's just dumb. So he was like I've tried SDDM, which is KDE's login manager, right or display manager and that works fine on Arco It would not work on Arch. I don't know why I couldn't get it to work I'm assuming that the reason why is because I installed it and missed a package or dependency somewhere. It didn't matter So after installing Arch, like again, I was like, you know, I'm just going to use Ganon because I know GDM works like GDM has no problems But then I was like I installed my DWM using my DWM script and logged out and logged back in to DWM and it booted me right back out to the display manager And it did this over and over again I was like, what the hell is going on because like I know the script works on Ubuntu I know it works on Arch. Why the hell as I log in Screen goes black and it goes right back to the login screen and does it over and over again so I got to write it and asked and the fine people who write it told me that GDM by default when you're using Ganon uses Wayland and of course DWM does not use Wayland So you have to go into the GDM settings and in disable Wayland so that GDM just uses You know XOR like it should And then that worked So that was my experience with the Ganon first and then right now. I'm just looking at this I mean, I just talked about this before the recording it Workspaces on Ganon are stupid This thing in the world like you have and this isn't the way it used to be and be prior to like Ganon 40 When you had you had workspaces on both monitors, right? And when you switched workspaces on one monitor, it would switch it on both monitors, right? I guess that's how it would work now You only have workspaces on one monitor. The other monitor has no workspaces. It just is that one workspace and you can't change That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of in my entire life. I mean This is 2021 Ganon. Everyone uses multiple monitors that uses legs I mean, I bet you if we put up a poll and Asked how many there are and there are some of us that would prefer to have 20 workspaces on each It definitely needs more than one, okay Yeah, okay. I don't care how many you have like go back to the other way that they used to handle workspaces Where you if you change workspaces that would change it on both monitors. That was dumb, too But at least you had multiple workspaces on both monitors. This is worse Like you took something. It was bad and you made it worse like it's dumb I don't care how I don't give a shit about your rounded corners. Ganon fix multiple monitor support You're failing. I mean, maybe it's just my install Maybe there's some setting or something you have to change or something in order to get there As far as I know like maybe you can enable Workspaces on that extra monitor through an extension in Ganon 40 But as far as I know right now, there's no no way to get it working the way it should That's just that's so dumb and no get Ganon out of the box is uglier than xfc out of the box I'm just going to put that right out there because an xfc is really horrendously like looks like windows 98 out of the box I mean, I would actually have to Disagree with you there. I think xfc is much uglier than ganon Yeah, I don't I don't I don't get that at all. But this out of weight the theme is fuggly as hell and but But whatever I don't disagree with that But but whatever the thing is tyler you can't change it Ganon says you use this theme or else They don't want you to install ganon tweaks like you can install ganon tweaks But that's kind of like jailbreaking your iphone. You know what I mean? Like you're not supposed to do it And they don't the developers don't want you to do it. So Why the hell? I mean, I know some people like this at a weight the theme. I don't know who they are But they need mental help of some sort I think gardener bryant is one of those people because I'm pretty sure he Loves everything that ganon puts out Which I mean that's At least we know those people exist. So at least they're serving someone. Well, they have to be I I'm pretty sure those people do exist in like 99 of them work for the ganon foundation They they all seem like oh, this is the greatest thing ever and the rest of us are like, why are you doing this thing that? Looks horrible Like at least okay at a weight that has a dark theme and it looks good Like the dark theme looks good. The icons are still terrible, but the rest at least the rest of the the The ui looks good, right? This but this grayish weird shit. It's not a good. Yeah, they've they've modernized bad icons That's what I don't understand. Like all they've done with adueta over the past like 10 years It's just they've already like instead of making better icons They have literally modernized bad icons that were bad from the beginning like Okay, so ubuntu is so attached to that uh doc along the side. They won't change it, right? So we know ubuntu does not like change but ubuntu the king of not liking change Has switched icons many times Like at least three times over the last over the last 10 years They've changed completely icon packs the most reason i'm like two years ago and their icons now really good Yawar is yeah This is fantastic Like and they're even their weird mixed theme that comes out default now in and ubuntu Really good. I mean like like yaru is just it's a fantastic thing And that comes from ubuntu who can't do shit when in terms of design Like their their wallpapers are like staring into the sun Oh, dude, they're no, they're so they're so bad. So especially the last one like this last release Can we just stop for a minute and talk about I'm I'm I'm done ubuntu with purple and orange Okay, it's time for a new color scheme those things are old like I understand it's tradition But let's choose something a little bit different or at least let's tone it in terms of the wallpaper Let's tone it down just a tad. Okay. It's it's okay We you're you're very proud of those colors, but we can tone it down just a tad It doesn't have they don't have to go away. Like they're perfectly fine in terms of colors They go well together, but the the wallpapers are horrible Uh, I don't know if you've noticed this but like in pop os compared to Um, just regular ubuntu I I don't know what it is that pop os has done, but they've made the orange accent Work much Much more like I'm much more okay with it than I am in ubuntu like in ubuntu It just it doesn't really fit in like the way that they're trying to like the the color scheme that they're going for everywhere else It doesn't really match pop os has just done a better job of Working orange into it. All right. Well the reason why I talked about ubuntu is because You know ubuntu uses gnom, but they've at least tried It's like they're taking a rock and squeezing as much water out of it as possible because They've made gnom usable Like like as much as many problems as I have with ubuntu They've made gnom usable because that you know they include some extensions. They include the extension manager They think Include the ability to turn on the dark theme, you know I mean, even if you can't change themes out of the box in ubuntu, which you I mean They should just include that in the settings panel. I don't think that'd be a problem, but At least you have the option of turning to the dark theme if you want to and start gnom You you don't have those choices. They don't want you You As poor as elementary os is it allowing change for people gnom is actually 100 times worse because at least elementary has shown a Like elementary has a vision for what they're doing, right and they have A Like a mythology towards their design and they've shown willingness over the years to perfect that design Even if I don't like the design itself You know, they've shown a willingness to not only listen to the community, but you know go through and actually Move forward and add features and all the stuff to the ui that you know people really want and it's It works, you know I like a person personally. I don't like elementary os, but It works gnom on the other hand over the last 10 years They've gone through and removed features like crazy like icons on the desktop gone Uh system tray gone, you know, uh, whatever I mean, and that's because canome since the bidding since they switched to gnom3 has been the slowest piece of garbage In the world, right? It's been so bad They've had to go through and take all this stuff out in order to get gnom to actually be functional And now there's no actual Like you like you have no ability to customize this thing at all and uh They don't want you to like no I think that's what sets elementary apart from gnom is there's no facade of You can customize this like in gnom like yeah, you can customize it No one wants you to and so you you should like Essentially shouldn't be customized like you shouldn't be heavily customizing gnom And like because I mean if you heavily customize gnom and you have a problem No one in the gnom community is is is going to feel any sympathy for you because like you should have known you're going to run into problems On elementary os you're not customized like you just you're not going to install gnom tweaks like that's Not a thing because you go into elementary os knowing exactly what you're getting plus elementary os is functional out of the box, right? Especially with elementary os 6 coming out. They're going to have a dark game That's the one thing that I was definitely missing It's like it's going to be there and you know now it's going to be perfectly fine Like yeah, sure. I'd like to install my own themes or whatever, but that's uh, you know, that's superfluous. I don't really need that uh because the theme that they have is fine if Gnom is so anti-choice. They should at least choose a theme. That's actually okay Like I don't wait that it's not a good designed theme. It's just it's it's old. It's ugly Uh like I know there's going to be like two people down in the comments below That say well, I like it. Oh wait, uh, you're not saying it right Like first of all, of course, I'm not saying it right because nobody knows how to fucking say it Okay, second of all, it's ugly and you're wrong. Um, okay. It's it's just not a good thing, but Yeah, I know like okay, so there are more problems wrong with gnom than just the theme. Okay The theme is what I pick on because that's what you see up front And I will say this gnom has gotten faster than it used to be I mean it just has and now I'm hearing my voice in the background in my head I'm hearing echoes. That's excellent Oh Linux, uh um Hopefully it doesn't come out in the recording. Oh, I'm sure I'm definitely going to the way this is going of course is going to But so gnom has gotten faster But the reason why it's gone faster is because they've taken out so many features over the years Because of course it was going to get faster. I mean, they've obviously done other work too but the And the reason why it's gotten faster is because the boot to switch to using gnom And they've gone through and done the work to make it faster The gnom foundation and actually put in that work that came from the ubuntu people I'm not saying that gnom did no work at all, but If from everything that I've read Ubuntu is pushing gnom forward as much as they can while the like the Gnom people are the little boy who don't want to go to the doctors or whatever and the Parent has to drag them along in the dirt to the car or whatever. They're literally digging their heels in to every change that ubuntu wants to make Ubuntu is literally the one who's like come on you need like but like because because gnom's trying to make all of these like minimal like minimalist style changes and ubuntu is the one being like But hun remember no one wants this. Okay, so Right What what's hilarious is that we talked about that then I mean all this stuff was true like Gnom 3.38 or whatever was all this was true and then all of a sudden gnom 40 first of all They changed the number scheme and then they come out with this nonsense I mean this is I mean they were like, you know, well everybody bitches. We don't change so we're gonna change everything You know, but not the things that we should have changed. We're gonna change the things that nobody had a problem with We're gonna make rounded corners. We're gonna make this really weird Uh multitasking thing that we're stealing from elementary os never mind that you didn't do it right I mean if you're gonna steal a elementary os at least do it right. I mean, they steal the whole damn thing, right? It's just so fucking dumb We haven't even got to the contact information 25 minutes or talking about gnom Uh, I was literally waiting and then I was gonna be like just so you know, we're really far in Yeah, we haven't got to the main topic. I don't even know what the main topic is You want to know why because I can't have the fucking just the The show notes up in front of me because then I would be worrying things are gonna break because it's gnom So the main topic just just so you're aware is why is linux hardware so expensive Yeah, I don't even know what I'm talking about anymore because who cares. All right Anyways, let's jump first before we jump into that contact information. Let's see if I can do this from the top of my head Uh at the linux cast on twitter you can follow us on Facebook at facebook.com slash linux cast you can support us on patreon patreon.com slash linux cast If you want to follow tyler. He's zany pretty much everywhere links will be in the video description. You can Uh email us at email at the linux cast.com. I did that. I still haven't done the website thing yet and speaking of the website you can actually go through and Follow all of our audio feeds and stuff like that at the linux cast at orc I think that's everything. Oh and linux youtube.com slash linux cast Yes, oh, yeah, that's the the bottom. Oh, dude I thought you hit that and it went back up me hit the other one Yeah, I definitely went out of order because I don't remember a minute. I don't remember what it was. It's definitely Uh, that was it. Okay, so that was good for memory. Yeah, I will thank the patrons at the end if I remember to do that. Um, okay, so Main topic Why is linux? Because we we could literally talk about gnom and bitch about gnom for the next three hours We're not gonna do that. It's okay It's off my chest As soon as the podcast over i'm gonna be running as fast as my fat ass can go To dwm Because I missed it okay Hold on a second before we go to the main topic. I have one more thing to say there There are many desktop environments on linux. Okay, there's uh See if we can name the main ones gnom, kde, mate, xfce um plasma um lxqt lxd still floating around in some place enlightenment You know, and that's not even naming the the 10 gajillion window managers that are out there, right? Of all those like I've tried all of them The one that I hate the most is gnom by far. It's not even a close contest like There's like Oh, so we forgot about cinnamon too like cinnamon's out there cinnamon's really good like why the hell isn't gnom? Why didn't ubuntu choose cinnamon like I understand you guys don't get on well with the the linux guys But seriously cinnamon would have been so much better like every everybody says that ubuntu is the one the Distro that new users come to why didn't you choose the one desktop environment that looks like windows? Yeah, I was about to say like I mean Like mint is like I mean as soon as you hit the enlightenment desktop, you're like, oh I'm at least close to home. Yeah Like It's essentially the same thing. Yeah, like cinnamon is is really good It's like it's like a mixture between like it's a more modern version of mate And a more modern version of xfc with some of the best features of both You know, I mean, it's really good. You know, so why didn't ubuntu use that instead of gnom? I mean seriously gnom is so bad It's not and especially for windows users like linux mint seems like I would assume for most windows users when you come over to linux mint It's it's the same type of user experience, but just without any ads or all of the aggressive like Like Essentially on websites, it would just be like overly javascripty Type crap everywhere. Like so it's just it's much cleaner It's familiar. See why they wouldn't go with it Yeah, I don't all right. So let's go ahead and to do the news. Okay We've got to do the news before we get to the main topic. We're not even there yet This is gonna be a three hour show. Okay Um News tyler one each week we each select a news topic News link of the week and that this week is no different tyler. Why don't you tell us what you got? I can't show you on the screen because get home so If you're watching the video version of this normally I would go through and show you a browser I'm very worried that if I switch workspaces the video will go away So I have I apologize for that. You just I will put the links in the video description as usual. So Tyler your link of the week mine was just It's title the 13 most interesting changes of linux 5.13. And so It's pretty interesting. Um, so there's definitely new Like there's the initial support for the m1 chip That's in the kernel and then also for me the more important one For my current hardware is there's a whole bunch of new the 2020 hardware platforms Are like the early support has been added for those So that means hopefully in 5.13 this laptop with a new Radeon like graphics processor like or graphics chip will actually be able to switch and function properly And I can go back to my home on arch and just be happy But um, yeah, and there's a whole bunch of other stuff Also like free sync through hdmi without having to have the newer one is Or having display port is added So it's a whole bunch of nice quality of life improvements coming. I'm sure it will break my computer Because everything else The stupid thing is is my computer is not old Like my it's not like bleeding edge either. It's like it was built last year has the a radion or uh, has a rise in 5 3,800 x or whatever and Maybe it's a rise in 7. I don't even know it's like yeah, that's rising 7. Yeah, I was about to say I have a 3,800 x It's rising like it's one of those it's the it's the 16 core one It's it's it's good as and I have a rx 580 like it's yeah, it's an old card But I mean it works. It should be fine And everything breaks I can like Yeah, and and also with a 580 the drivers for that are mature as hell. Yeah, like there should be no problems There should be no issues, but I for two weeks now Like wait, hold on. You also don't have any weird fringe parts in there, right? Like Any extra cards or anything? No, the only thing it's a little like shady or whatever is the memory came from like a rando china You know that that that don't matter one bit whatever I mean And that's just because by the time I got around to that was like I was out of money I needed some memory and this was like, hey, you know, I could spend $400 on 32 gigabytes of memory or I could spend $200 on 64 gigabytes of memory like this This math is good Dang, yeah, man ram prices are horrible now. Oh, yeah, this was like a year and a half ago This was like at the beginning of the pandemic. So they were what weren't nearly as bad as they are now Yeah, so all right, so if I remember right my my Link for this week was windows 11 has been announced And you know, I know what you're thinking. This is a linux podcast Why are you talking about linux windows 11? And the reason why I want to talk about it was because Is it just mirrors this look like kde with some rounded corners? um I mean, no, it's even worse than that. So have you seen anyone review or check it out? I've watched a little bit of if I can't really get past it like I I watched the Like the verge does like that those super cut things of the announcement, whatever I watched that Um, I will admit their multi monitor support where they like unplug a monitor and then you plug it back in It remembers everything that was on the screen before and that's really cool Like yeah, I want that okay, but I could do without the whole windows thing Oh, there's there's a whole bunch about it. That is just jank as hell like um For one you you essentially are gonna have to use a microsoft account Uh, because stupid features will will not work like so now they've moved the windows button to the center with a They've also separated the the like search out to us to a separate button next to it Which makes no effing sense because just like in windows 10 if you Click the windows button or actually for that matter any windows when you click the start button and you just start typing It's gonna start it's gonna immediately switch over to the search button anyway So there's no reason in separating it out um But you to to be able to move it back over to the left of your screen like on the bar if you want to do that You have to be signed in with a microsoft account to be able to do that Okay And then no from what I read the only way you can sign in without a microsoft account is to disconnect your internet before You install it and then I I think I think I was watching Kind of what youtube channel was I watched when they installed it like when they had it it was before the announcement I think it was It was one of the links guys or maybe it was mood of heart I don't know but the the beginning the beginning install thing before you get to like after the install Like where you have to choose your language or whatever They went through and and pointed out like the the one screen where you have to choose the language has like Windows vista bar windows 98 scroll bar the drop down is like from windows 8 or whatever Like a like a mixture of paradigms or whatever What the hell are you doing microsoft? I mean also when you get into the actual again, this is Early like leak anyway, so i'm sure there will be changes But still the file browser is the same as it is in windows 10 There's absolutely no changes to it and that's my biggest complaint like with the ui when it comes to windows 10 Is their file browser is it's not like it looks horrible all around It's just that ui elements just don't match whatsoever And we're talking about a corporation here who pays enough people like enough money to get ui right So I don't understand it I don't know what those people are getting paid for because All right From the things that i've watched like If you delve deep enough into the the operating system You could still discover things like you know sys manager or you know all these like Things that have been around in windows forever that still look like they came from windows 95 Like they still have the same design ever the only thing that they changed was they added some round corners like like that Windows 11 is like a fence that has been painted multiple times and they didn't actually go through and scrape the old paint off They just painted over the old paint over and over again. So you got multiple years of paint showing through Like you can see you can see the original you got some of the ones that are on top of that windows vista and eight and ten and all that stuff I like okay Like we know that the reason why microsoft does this the reason why they keep all this legacy stuff around is because you know They make their money from corporations who don't want to change they still use internet explorer 11 or whatever and or internet explorer 6 and they have all these you know Plugins for that browser that they just can't pay anybody to rewrite. So you know That's where that's the reason why microsoft can't say you want Screw it We're starting over Like they tried or whatever like there was rumors that they were gonna like they were completely scrapping things and it just with longhorn whatever it was called and You know, they couldn't do it like they just they didn't they couldn't do it They have too many people that were relying on this old stuff Well support is for them support is everything Yeah, and so if you want to it if it needs to support everything the way it always has I mean you got to keep all that old shit in there. You just right well, and then they can't You put off the corporations that use your product. They're the only ones that pay for your product Like everybody else gets that shit for free you know, so, um Which honestly of all the things that they announced for windows 11 the thing that surprised me most is that they're not charging for it I thought for sure that they were going to charge like 120 dollars for an upgrade because that's what they I mean Yes, they well they gave windows 10 away for free But it was only supposed to be for a certain amount of time a lot of people still pay for windows 10 licenses um, well see here's the thing I to be honest, I think it would be like a pr nightmare for them to actually charge for it because charging for windows 11 and calling windows 11 a Major update or a major release would be literally an offense to every major release by any software ever Because it's literally all it is. It's just a UI improvement. That's it Um, well as as far as I can tell like a line of tech tips did a video on it and I've been gaming's the same Like on it Well, it's because it's just windows 10 it's windows 10 with around the corners Look exactly there's someone and a set in a centered start menu that people are going to automatically the first thing They do switch it back over to where it's always been Um, this the link that I put in the show notes is from a guy named thrott And he covers windows for a living. That's what he does. Uh, and now I talked about this last last week The comments on the the leak or whatever were hilarious like the like 90 percent I'm like, oh, can we move the start button back to where it was? And we're like, yes. Yes, you can. Yes. Yes, you can Everybody's going to do that like personally. I don't care because I don't do menus. It's pronounced window managers bitches. Yeah Like I don't need this But most people like use The funny thing is the only person In my family that uses windows still that I haven't been able to switch to linux is my mother And she still uses windows And she's like the most diverse to change ever which is, you know, fine And honestly, I could get her to switch to linux if the file picker in linux was good But the file picker in linux is terrible because every single application uses a different file picker And it's just it's so dumb Linux we need to fix that And we can get my mom losing linux like um, but I guarantee the minute Windows 11 decides to install it itself because you know, you're not going to get a choice, right here Like it's going to install itself eventually Uh, I I guess she's going to she's going to call me and say And I need to I need you to change the the position of the I can't find the start menu. Where's the start menu? Like my it's in the center now And like we had to pay for this nonsense. You have to get used to it Well, I mean there's there's also going to be so many people out there who are not the type of people to research into stuff and they're They're going to have to spend extra time like going down and clicking on the search button to search things when it works the same way like That's the one uh, the one change where I was like what in the why like what What purpose does that serve? Well, they did get rid of cortana. So that is a win. I think um, I still don't understand the whole rounder corner thing, but then I don't understand rounding corners in kanom. So That's uh, that's just my thing like Uh, I got tried, you know, I installed the pycom version that Allows you to do rounded corners. I had that enabled for about 10 seconds Really you didn't like it. No, I slowed my system down like way too much And like this is like a top-end system like I don't understand why I should slow nothing should slow it down But rounding it did not like rounded corners at all. Um, it's possible that was something to do with dwm Maybe dwm just doesn't like rounded corners. That's possible Um, I I have a feeling that probably suckless is not taking into account that people are want rounded corners You know, we're suckless. We don't need rounded corner Exactly like why would you have so much bloat on your system? Rounded corners is definitely bloat. All right, let's 41 minutes in Let's get to the main topic. Oh god. Oh, this is horrible If you're still watching at this point, thank you very much for for watching make sure you hit the subscribe button Because if you like this nonsense, we got way more where this came from Okay, so the main topic this week was mine. Why is linux hardware so expensive now? Probably five months ago or something when martin was still around martin and I did a topic about system 76 And uh, so this is gonna be fairly familiar, but I just wanted to talk a little bit about Linux hardware and why it's so expensive because there are many actually reasons why I think system 76 takes their their expense a little bit too far in terms of like, you know Adding too much of a premium on it, but that's just my opinion But I think I gotta ask the question like why is linux hardware so expensive and My answer to this is it's all about the ability to order a ton of stuff Like there's a reason why walmart is or at least at one point walmart was cheaper than like your mom and pop store You know because walmart can order stuff in bulk and your mom and pop store can't Basically the same principle here Uh These guys usually I go a lot a lot of the like the boutique computer builders or whatever they build They buy their parts just the same as you do. They probably go to best buy to buy them So that's the reason why a lot of that stuff is so expensive. Um, the real question I have is Why is there such a divide between? um Where hardware is available so like There are a ton Of linux hardware vendors that are available in like europe And like there's enterware and there's you know, several several different ones if you come here to the united states the land of free and plenty um We have system 76 and We have we do have purism and stuff but Purism purism is essentially just as expensive as system 76. Yeah, they're not cheap Like we have dell too, but if you want to try to find it the the boon to base dels good luck They bury that shit like nobody wants them to find it like um, so Basically, we have like one or two man. We have one or two but it feels like europe has all these and they all have like really cool stuff and Uh, we can't buy it over here like we can import it or whatever, but you're gonna be stuck with like the um European keyboard or whatever and it's not great. Um, maybe it's just the american enemy like i'm feeling left out europe Where's all my shit? Give me my stuff. This is i'm we're america. We're supposed to have it all You know So yeah, that's that's what i put. That's my question like what why is it Maybe is it because of boon to is based in the uk that they have all the cool hardware over there Well, I think it has to do a lot with like, um When it comes to being Based in another country and coming over here I think it takes a lot of infrastructure and a lot of money to be able to Get around the crazy import taxes and all that stuff. So um, I I guess really the question is is why isn't there more of Those type of companies that are elsewhere here in america, too. Why are there so few linux vendors? based here in america like they're like if you If we spent 25 minutes just trying to think of linux hardware vendors here in america We maybe would come up with five Maybe maybe I don't think we get to five um so It's a good question because the the cynic in me Is going to point to the fact that maybe we I mean it's just I mean we put free in the damn song One of the last words of the song that we sing at every ball game has the word Free is in the song, right? But we don't like free and open source software and hardware like it doesn't make any sense. It seems like I mean are the europeans more freedom loving people than america I mean come on if if that's true We've lost the plot, you know because america is supposed to be the best at everything And that's gonna be something most american thing ever said, but I mean I mean stereotypical american here america is the best we should have it all but that doesn't seem to be I mean, that's just dumb, right? But But then again, how do we get to the point where we do have more hardware like what's Yeah, why why is it is it? Maybe hardware prices have something to do like maybe in europe you can get The hardware needed just cheaper. Like it's just I I don't know Maybe it's a thing of interest because I I don't have any statistics to back this up. This is just a feeling so Take it with a grain of salt. It just feels like Places outside of america like linux better Like they are more attracted to the way linux works Than people here in the united states like Maybe it's because We americans are so used to the corporation slash capitalist model That we don't mind uh Being spied on by google and apple and facebook or whatever and All the hardware vendors are in cahoots with all those companies or whatever and we just don't mind it because capitalism yee-haw, you know And in europe or whatever, maybe they're not so capitalist, I don't know if I mean It's hard to put it because I mean it just like I said, I have no statistics to back it up But it just feels like here in the united states and we don't Like linux nearly as much as I mean because if you think about it, I mean We have like linux user groups here in the united states like we have conferences and stuff like that but And again, this is complete another feelings on my part But have you noticed where those linux conferences usually are they're usually on the west coast, right? And where do you hear more about the liberalism and stuff like that? You hear it on the west coast, right? And I'm sure there are Uh linux groups in the on the east coast in the middle or whatever. I'm sure they are that but Oh, yeah, whenever you hear about like the linux linux conference southwest or you know, um, the northeast one that happens in like chicago or whatever Those the those are the famous ones, right, right? You don't hear about anything on so, I mean It just feels like there's some kind of psychological Thing about you know us here in america that just don't like linux in certain parts of the country I don't know. Maybe that's just me I think it might be more of just uh, the over abundance like here in america like it's so easy to get a system Just to like if you're not into computers. It's it's so easy to get a system and For for a reasonable price Um That I feel like most people just end up getting a computer with windows And that's just they use what what's on it and it's just because it's so easy to get it Well, I mean even then that argument doesn't really work because I mean anywhere You're going to be getting a computer with essentially windows on it no matter where you buy it I mean, yeah, but the the thing is is people in europe and other places like that Apparently have somehow somewhere along the line learned to question and stand up against the major corporate Entities that run, you know the world or whatever and Like I said again complete fail feelings on this part, but you just For whatever reason there's that mentality that you know, I'm gonna switch to linux and now obviously Best majority people in europe still use windows too. I mean I mean, that's just the way it is, but Go out there and find me Some linux podcasts, okay, and every single linux podcast out there on the vast majority of them Listen to the accents They're all british or irish, you know All like that. They none of them sound like yee haw. They all sound like james bond, you know Oh Maybe that's where my feelings of americans don't like linux comes from But it just that's the way it feels to me like Okay, here's here's another thing If on linux youtubers We can name like what maybe four five guys out there that are american the rest of them Are you know are outside of america? Um, and you know Fair enough, but I mean first of all one of them is brian lunduk. We can just I mean that man lost his color ages ago So, I mean it just like I said The predominant feeling I have is just that They like linux more and the question is why Isn't linux more prevalent here like we have movements here like We like to protest right like that's one of the things that americans like to do is like we do protests really really well We do it better than anybody else in the world. Yeah Well, I mean, but also if you think about it here in america, we are not very Americans have a very big problem with things that come across as socialist in nature and free software could There are people out there who take free software as if it's a socialist movement and I feel like that's Maybe why there's a stigma Here in america against linux being Really popular or even socially like not just it because it's very weird Like when when when people hear that you're using linux, they're like, huh, what why like And I feel like a lot of people don't get interested in because there are those fanatics out there who are like Free software is essentially socialism and we got to push both forward Well, then one of the I mean if you talk to like the premier linux evangelist out there What's the number one thing that they tell you why linux is better than windows and the answer to that question Is that linux doesn't spy on you right linux doesn't change share your information And here in america that's not necessarily a good thing because the way we tend to look at it I mean, I'm not talking about everybody, but a lot of people tend to look at it I have gotten nothing to hide. So why do I care if microsoft spies on me? You know, that's the way a lot of people look Well, but back after the 9-11 attacks and all that stuff and we had like the NSA spying on us like there was a good portion of america like I'm not I don't do anything wrong What does it matter if the government spies on me? now, I mean, well, I mean and there's also there's like people complain and use like usability or ease of use or just like features as a reason to say like things are bad and they're trying to cover up spying on you but I actually had to essentially De-google my phone for a little bit because my car died on me And I needed my buddy to pick me up and I had to send him my location because I live out in the middle of nowhere So like he just needed my location to be able to find me And so I had to de-google my phone because I like I'm not going to be able to send him a Like a map location exactly where I am and him reliably find me there. He needs navigation. So like I don't know there are real reasons to Not necessarily have someone spying on you, but you know have your data being used, right? Okay, so we all know that google is convenient as fuck, right? I mean Like I think we both use android like and you know The features on here. They're really cool. Right? I mean, it's like yeah, it's awesome Like um, like I know this phone knows everything about me Like it has all of my information And I don't care because the features are really good You know, and I think that that's the the way a lot of people look at it like Why would I switch to a linux phone that can do like 90% less than this one Uh and cost just as much probably Um, and the only pro there is that it respects me, right? Yeah, that I mean I mean, we've gone all over the place in this main topic. We're talking about prices But I mean that's a boring topic. We got into privacy and so like like We've gone all over Americans don't I mean maybe Americans don't value their privacy nearly as much as like We don't have like like the EU always puts in a whole bunch of like laws like they get the gdpr And they all this stuff that where they try to protect their citizens privacy or whatever You never see any of that kind of stuff go through here Not really, uh, the biggest technological like legislation we Have tried to do is try to make it so that um, the social media companies don't pick on the politicians, you know The only thing that really matters to to to the congress here um So yeah, um, there it seems to me from just our conversation here that there are many reasons why It's possible that americans don't care about linux nearly as much as your appearance And I think that contributes to why hardware is so expensive because I mean if we had like For one if if being a global like company and being able to ship globally was cheaper Then I feel like linux hardware no matter what would just be cheaper but it's it's hard to Be a american-based corporation when essentially you're just going to be selling to the american people and And linux is just It's not it's not it's not that it's not just popular here But there is for quite a few people out there a stigma around it where they they tie it to socialism Well, I mean there's that and there's We as a people tend to Um Remember things as they are and don't think that things change So there's this whole stereotype that linux is hard to use if you use linux you're going to spend all your time in a command line and you're going to be Searching and praying for something to replace your adobe apps and your microsoft office and stuff like that so there's I mean we I can't say that that um That feeling isn't around in like european stuff I get too but It feels like part of the reason maybe why Here in america we haven't been able to get past that it's just because we're too stubborn to you know not Look at it, you know, it's we just have that stereotype and We're not gonna Disbelieve that from for whatever reason not when we have you know You can go to best buy and buy a three hundred dollar chrome book. You know, I mean Yeah, and you also gotta think about these we also are the type of people where we're very distrustful like i mean Even though we're okay with our go. I mean, we're not we're not Always very excited about our government. Most people aren't ever excited about the government but like we're we're always distrustful of just things in general and especially like I don't know about everywhere in america, but I know down here in the south It's like everyone has a saying of like there's no such thing as free like free does not exist And so when you have something that is truly 100 free It it it comes across to most people as a honeypot. So they're not even going to check it out in general What's the catch, you know, there's gotta be a catch, you know And it turns out the catch is that you're gonna have to learn how to burn a ISO onto a usb key. That's the catch The mountain of work that that is good luck getting grandma to do that all right First of all before we move on to our pics of the guy I would just like to apologize to tyler And everybody who was in the south because I use the word yee-haw and that might have come across this Is offensive to anybody because you want i'm from michigan. We don't say yee-haw here, but that's the way There all right. I live in tennessee. There are people out here that say yee-haw. I do not find that offensive Do you use wrecking and yonder down there too, man? Yeah, yeah, that's my grandfather's favorite statement. I mean, he's wrecking in all the time, you know All right, y'all let's move on to fix the week That was pretty good I like I I can do that It's much easier to do like a southern accent than it is to do like a british accent because I can't I mean We're not even gonna try. I mean, they're just no everybody. I would offend so many people Like you don't want me to do that Like you'd never be able to watch james bond again because you've lost your rights To watch james bond. All right. All right. Move on to the fix of the week. Go ahead. You go first tyler Well, so my pick of the week for this week is side quest and it's um I don't I'm not sure about side quests being like open source, but I know there are some really cool like, um There's I think there's three or four, but there are some open source VR games that you can check out on there and it's just a great way of taking a very proprietary product and Just giving facebook the proper middle finger and enjoying the product even more So I just have to promote side quest just in case anyone out there is you know interested in VR or just recently thought of or purchased a quest headset just so you know you can sideload VR games on there and They're awesome. A lot of them are Like there are the majority of the side quest games are free. So That's really nice way. I don't I've never used VR Um, it is one of those things where it's it sounds like a gimmick But as soon as you do it for the as soon as you play it for the first time It will completely change the way you think about games Like me and my buddy were playing Pavlov the other day and we were sniping and stuff and I mean I was I was literally like rolling around on the ground I turned my guardian off and cleaned up my room And I was rolling around on my ground trying to like set up a shot and snipe like squatting Like it's really fun. Yeah, it sounds it sounds great. All right. So, um My pick of the week is brave search And mostly because I couldn't figure out anything else to choose No, it's not bad. So I have my qualms with duck duck go Everyone else seems to think that duck duck go is actually pretty good Every time I make a negative statement about duck duck go in the In the comments, I'll get like 10 people saying well, yeah, duck duck goes actually pretty good I don't know what you're talking about The thing is about duck duck go is like 80 percent of the time when I I search for something on duck duck go I have to go back up to the search box and hit g bang in order to get to google Like I should just use google to begin with I don't know if it's if it's because I search for weird things. It's possible Well, everyone's different and I feel like for for people who do basic searches or things where they don't They don't know exactly the type of information or exactly the information they need Duck duck go does work. It does give you relevant search results but Google is far like if you know the information that you need or at least the type of information you need Google is going to give it to you first. Like that's just it the power of google and Yeah being as massive as they are So the thing is brave search is actually worse than duck duck go But I It's it's in beta Like so it's just it's just literally just started like a few days ago And I mean they did an alpha before that and people were using it For being in beta. It's actually not bad, but it does give you worse Results sometimes than duck duck go The the thing I like about it though is that it feels more original than duck duck go like there's always that Feeling in the back of your mind when you use duck duck go like, you know, this stuff's coming from bing, you know And I don't want to use bing. If I wanted to use bing, I'd just use bing, you know With of course with brave They have their own index, right? So they're doing this all stuff all themselves and it feels like if I'm going to support Something I'll support this because they actually feel like they're doing the work other than just reskinning bing results Now, I know that's not all duck duck go does they have their own stuff too, but it just Again, there's a stigma back there. It just always kind of reminds me they use bing results Now that being said, I also switched to the brave browser and I don't want to get into this because we've already gone over an hour Uh, but the brave browser is horrible. Man. It's just so bad I can't get into it dude. Like nani. I don't even know how the browser is because it's just so gimmicky like their bat token and everything I'm just I disable all that like, you know the cryptocurrency whatever the crypto crypto nonsense as they say it whatever. I don't care I'm a guy who likes to Very much customize my browser. I was the user chromes.css guy for firefox all the time, right? Uh, but you can't do that with browse with brave and you know Fine, I can like I can live with that But there's this thing every time you download something like if you right can click and download like an image or whatever At the bottom there's this like a like a a bar that pops up It like takes a quarter of the screen that tells you you downloaded something like and you can't turn it off like Why? Like who's designing this nonsense? It's so bad. Um now Apparently it's so big because I have the zoom turned up a little bit because you know horrible eyes Uh, but still I mean it's so so bad and you can't like I said, you can't turn it off And it doesn't go away. It just stays there. I mean you can close it But then you download something again. It comes back again. It's so dumb and I'm There's an update to firefox like yesterday I think and I hope fixed the problem that I was having Sunday night. So if it did I'm switching back to firefox like Soon after this podcast There's just there's so many little things that just drive me bonkers about the browser I may make a video and I I'm gonna do some more looking but as long as I can if the 5.13 kernel is actually out I will be checking it out immediately after this podcast as well like I Windows has worked, but that's it like I was talking about it with a buddy windows has worked and it gets stuff done But it is a horrible experience Hold on a sec hold on hold on a second You mean we've done this whole podcast and you've been using windows and you've even you didn't know that No, you didn't know that I see you learned from the mac experience where I made fun of you for the whole freaking time And you didn't tell me this time because you know how I would have reacted to that nonsense Oh, I thought you knew No, I I didn't know but I know now now we got to do another hours We got to do this podcast over so I could properly Make fun of you for using what the hell is wrong with you I've been using it for like the past four or five days I've just been how I've had to because the um graphic switching is It crashed the computer just every 30 45 minutes Doing something so I don't know if you've ever watched how I met your mother, but there's a spot where barney the guy plays Neil Patrick Harris's character. Um, I don't know remember what the context is But they were got him and his friends got into a fight and he walks out of the bar friendship over Using windows friendship over it's done. All right, that's it for this No, just no go away. I don't want to talk to you anymore Using windows. Don't get that shit on me. Okay. I just think I don't Like uh, you might be contagious. Okay. I'm just saying spread the disease. That's horrible. All right All right, uh before we go we should thank our patrons devon marcus naiklin donnie sven east coast webmeric camp michael Thanks everybody for your support. Uh, I have no clue what we're doing next week because I don't have the channel in front of me It doesn't matter. We'll do something next week. Um, it's like it's tyler's turn to pick make sure you pick one. All right. Anyways, uh, I switch back to the switch thing that we go now. We can actually be on screen again Thanks everybody for watching. We'll see you next week If you watched all the way to the end make sure you hit the subscribe button because we really do have more of this nonsense we do this every week Usually on thursday's we push back a time this uh, whatever this week And also, I mean if you made it this long in the podcast, you're a trooper Yes, seriously, give yourself a pat of the back. You made it through all this nonsense I have no clue what we even talked about. I've forgotten about it. It feels like we have bounced all over the place It feels like we've been podcasting for days Like and then at the very end somebody sprung their not their windows nonsense on me So now I gotta get away from you as quickly as possible. All right Thanks everybody for watching. We'll see you next week. See ya