 Hi everyone, this is Sonali. Thank you all for coming out some time for attending today's webinar on the episode 19th of the Business X Learning Series in their Scale, Value and Inset. To all the attendees out there, please type any questions you might have in the Q&A section and we will try to answer as many as possible at the end of the session. I would now like to welcome our speaker, Mr. Gaurav Mariah, Chairman and Founder of the Franchise India Group. A very warm welcome to you sir. Thank you Sonali and welcome friends and welcome to the 19th edition. This is part of our Business X series. Business X is India's leading platform. It's actually a pioneer in business research and also helping the companies to raise capital. So this Business X was started by Fanchise India Group about six years back and we saw a great opportunity to really connect the start-ups, scale-ups to the investor community and also a big work we saw in the case of a lot of business recent. We are the only company which has a firm platform with 75 cities where we are active, where we are helping businesses which are now looking to exit. We value them and then put them to market. But today's discussion is all about scaling up and we do these four different parts every time. So we talk about investment, we talk about value creation, we talk about scaling and we also talk about exit. These are the four pillars so to say where Business X really works on. So today we talk about the scaling up and how companies need to scale up a certain stage. What is the time when you need to really scale up? And also really the differentiation of a start-up and a scale-up. So that's something which we want to take off. A couple of things which needs to be clear. Very few start-ups really see your journey of scaling up. Well, I think when you were a start-up in the first three, four, five years you continue to bring the proof of concept. You get your commercials right, your business model right, your team in place and so on and so forth. And only when you have a minimum value product ready and you also have a little bit of what I call the scale-up infrastructure ready. And that's the only way you would probably start thinking on scaling up the business. So we are talking about today both the start-ups and scale-up and I also would like to share that only one out of 200 start-ups would actually see a scale-up journey. And both are difficult. It looks like the start-up is not difficult because you are absolutely new. You do not have a proof of concept. Attracting the team and the talent is difficult. But I can tell you scale-up is even more difficult. It's a very, very difficult strategy. Change is absolutely mindset, operational design, everything changes from when you are a start-up. You are much more in comfort rather. And actually using at that time can not be so problematic. If you have a bad quarter or a bad two quarters or things like that, you can still scale-up. But don't really want to scale-up. There is a very little chance, a very little option for you to do mistake. One mistake can cost you very, very heavily. I'll give you an example. Look at Zemato and Sweety. Last year, 2019, they went too deep into this dark kitchen phenomenon. But they started investing themselves into dark kitchen. At French India also, we helped the matter to really get these kitchens all over India, which they made franchise models into. Similarly, Sweety did about 150, 200 kitchens all over India. They ran about 8-9 months and with this all this going on, they had to pack up their entire business. So all the investment which was done is all gone today. And I was to also question at that time, why are they doing it the first place? This was not their business. They were aggregators. There were people who were building. A lot of people were really investing on that. This would have never been their direct investment. So a lot of these smaller mistakes companies do in the time of scale-up and this cost them there. And that's where the real issue happened, the valuation error. And we were not able to attract the new set of investors coming into business. So one has to be very clear about your strategy where you are and what you need to be there. And start-up and scale-up are two different timings in your business journey. Start-up is where you are just getting off the ground and you are setting on the business model. You are getting the proof of concepts being done, your commercial success, early stage customers, getting the team in place and so on. Start-up is not really capital for me. I think the start-up is the biggest challenge. And I have seen a lot of start-up failing in has been talent. Talent to attract for a start-up becomes a huge amount of talent. Especially these days because start-up being by nature brings a lot of uncertainty. And uncertainty people don't like at this thing. Good quality talent doesn't like uncertainty. So team strategy has to be changed. So unless you have something more, a founder has to add a story. A founder has to have a very strong conviction and he is able to attract the right kind of talent. That's the biggest problem I saw in start-ups. Most of the start-ups, great idea, great innovation, great structure, but they don't have the ability to attract the right kind of talent. Because a talent feels that the belongingness, the kind of belongingness required, the kind of time and investment required in this space, don't like it. A lot of people also join because they feel that the joining early foundation team can give them much bigger reward. But if you really ask me, it's not true. Two things that the start-ups will not fail. That's the reality of the business. So how do you really able to address and answer that? That's very important. And there really comes in the participation of the founders themselves, unless and only they are able to really get that kind of confidence across, get them the right kind of, you know, and targeting, and also a little bit of transparency of an organization. If you are well in that piece and get your first set of teams, then I think start-ups. But scale-up, talent is much easier to get because you know much more in the control of that. So let's understand that what makes a start-up go to a scale-up strategy. Well, there are many mathematics in terms of your readiness for the market, your early user group, your early customers, how they've used it, what kind of feedback is coming in, how commercially your product or service which you offered in the marketing has been proven. But more importantly, have you seen three or four years of year-on-year growth that has to be also two-digit kind of a growth, 20, 25, 30% year-on-year growth for three to four years? Then only you are ready for being called as a scale-up. Sometime then also, you're not ready. Well, because you might not have a very stable customer base. You might have done financial growth, but you don't have a very stable customer group. And I'll give you some examples. Some companies become very confused. They try to do a lot of things to just to get their financial growth going in. But really asking if you go deeper into their books, you will find that they're doing a lot to do to get that number right. They're only changing the number. There's no stability of their customer group is available there. Similarly, some companies are even to get the kind of, so to say, growth also and they also have a stability of customer, but they don't have a scalable infrastructure. So that's also a big problem. Sometimes you're really able to do everything right. Your customer is stable, your growth and financially as we've proven last two to three years, four years, but you don't have that infrastructure. You cannot handle that scale study. Suddenly if you move from, say, X position to a 10-axle, 20-axe kind of a position, you are not ready. Your infrastructure is not ready. Your capabilities are not ready. Your team structure is not ready. So that also has to be seen. So there are pretty much three things. Stable customer group, financial performance for last three years for at least 20, 25%, 30% growth, and also scalable infrastructure along with that. If you get these three things done, then you probably would be ready for any kind of a scale. For a startup, I feel that there are a lot of startups which perform in the first three, four, five years and I call them the app between nice to have products and must have products. That's something which is a very big problem. I feel that there are a lot of startups which have products which are what I call nice to have. If they have, this is a good compelling product, but it's not must to have, which means it is not a necessity. It's not a replacement. It's not replacing something. I feel that this must have products. To me, are much more useful to go to the next level of scale-up study. Nice to have would just survive and then normally either are bought by somebody who finds strategic value in the innovation which is done or some kind of a structure and they will not be able to scale their own thing. That means must have a big opportunity to really go on that. So lots of startups are actually about 95% are in nice to have kind of a placement. So they will probably at a certain stage look at some kind of integration, M&A opportunity or something like that but these companies are certainly ready for the huge scale of opportunity in that. Now we talk about a lot of constraints in both setup businesses, startups and we also talk about the scale-up and in the meantime if you have questions, keep writing on the questions on the Q&A box and I will take up those questions as we go closer to the next 15 minutes. Also, one of the areas which I found in startup, the constraint as I said, one constraint was clearly the team. Team was a big constraint and I feel that one of the biggest challenges in startups is getting the right talent and power and that's something which is very difficult because at that stage even if you offer equity or you offer some kind of a threat equity or something like that, that's also not attractive because business has built more values I would say or it has a very long distance before it can logically give unlock value for somebody to do that. So even if somebody say look I would like to offer equity in that startup, you are not going to attract that. So 3-4-5 years back this was working very well but now these days if a startup comes to you and say I want to really hire you and I want to give you small equity a lot of people are not buying it because there is a lot of so to say a bad state especially in this period in the last 2-3 years I have seen a lot of dropouts a lot of companies falling out and it has really impacted the talent and there is a nervousness in the talent of not joining startups because they feel that there is a nervousness which is stability. The second big challenge I see in startups is a marketing while it looks like a simple term but somehow startups are too passionate about making their products, services and so on. This is alright but they don't do too much of what I call go-to-market marketing it's very, very important. I think most of us are now we have a lot of these companies like Times of India which is PCCR, Understand Times a lot of other companies also heavily exporting through marketing equity to these startups because they feel that the missing link in startup to really get the early customer base and get your window up and so on is a marketing so marketing becomes a very important because early you need to actually need to gain is through going to come through marketing and sometimes you just feel that just organically you will be able to bring that business model and the financial model normally have been not captured in marketing budgets. The cost of acquisition of a customer in your startups is not there and while the good startups would have a very strong cost of acquisition and the cost of acquisition to me is a very important portion when you are designing your startup business model it needs to have that feedback. Pretty much I would say in the startup I would see these two the challenge and third is obviously if you don't have what I call minimum viable product which needs to come in but apart from that talent and marketing to play the most important aspect of it. But when you are a scale up then there is a multiple challenges coming multiple challenges. Let's start with couple of them one is a team shift. I feel that the biggest challenge I have saw is that in a same startup team which came down to scale they were not able to handle it and because you need a different kind of mindset you need mature players they need to understand multiple markets and they need to be a strong process leaders. When you are a startup you are pretty much doing multi-tasking you don't lead processes you are all over because you need to have a new startup and you have to have one person doing multiple tasks and so on and when you become a scale up you need process champions you need process champions so they need to be a lot of maturity in your team. So there is a huge shift and this shift is very difficult now because you are coming from a startup and you have these people who stood by you, they came down to a certain level down to businesses trading at say 60-70 crores but you are now looking at 60-70 crores to go to 1000 crores. It needs a different mindset and that call at that stage to take there is a lot of emotional issues which are concerning because you want to take the same guy who is handling your 30 crore balance sheet he is not the same guy who can handle your 1000 crore balance sheet so even your CFO you like it or don't like it has to change so a lot of changes has to come in and these are sometimes pushed upon by the investor and sometimes a founder has to really take those calls because founder has to surround himself with the next orbit team or the next structure. So one of the big shift really happens from a startup to scale up is a team shift which is sometimes not very smooth and that can create a lot of issues because if it is not smooth it is not designedly done when you get into a problem. Second big thing is culture. He is very personalized, very involved, very intimate kind of a culture at when you are a startup, when you go to your scale you become more purpose, driven, data driven and so on so there is less emotional but more data running it like that. This is very emotional, everything is right connected, people to people, relationship will work so culture has to shift and change while all people say that the culture remains same, answer is absolutely no I have met with so many people, so many people who are part of the founding teams and now they are part of a very large company scale company and they are moving out and one thing I ask them why are you moving out now, the company will really become excited they would say this is not the same culture, I don't enjoy anymore the truth is the business itself has changed so if you are running a large corporation, people who would have joined Ola and Uber in the initial days and they used to do the business at a very different level, they can pick up phone and call upon at any time and have a discussion they had a lot of small team meetings every win has been celebrated and to a company which is now a large company everything has to change so the culture has to be designed again rather than people get shocked, you need to really move this into a very conscious approach of how you change the culture financial management and cost efficiencies this is another big problem happening in the scale time scale time there is a little bit of crazy time so it's everything looks like being out of control everything is really out of control and I have seen companies like Ola and I once I was there in the office and I found people are doing meetings at all hours and 1.30 in the night and things of that nature and they are just spending money and all over the place they can and they just go all over they die sometime putting a lot of hard process and sometimes this is done by people who have very little management background I have seen people who are 3, 4, 5 years experience and taking decisions which can cost a very huge to the company and these are because of the rush of just growth they have a very unrealistic quarter to quarter targets so they actually don't do very strong financial and cost efficiencies and that goes out of control market penetration that's also very important you need to really see which markets you want to go as a scale up you don't have to go all over like all rooms that went into 80 countries now some countries have been phenomenal for them China has been phenomenal some countries have been sailor in these times because India is not there but I feel that a lot of countries they just went and they have no penetration they just are floating and you will see post next 2-3 months there will be a huge correction which will come in and they will have to stick to few markets only and that happens when you don't think through and go to these just expansion of going to multiple markets someone has to really think through which markets you need to go and penetrate well founders capability also is another challenge I find that your founders are not able to adapt the change they are ready for the next target and because their founders are living well around them and if they don't have the ability to detach themselves and really have seen business from a different viewpoint that also becomes a big problem a shift from innovation to execution founders love innovation they just are focused on creating new ideas and working on this and so forth so they have to be born by it so they typically would spend a 60-70% time by choice come back and now you are in a different business you are spending time with your CFOs you are spending more time on code meeting more times on your financial execution and a lot of other things and these become, these start taking a lot of time so founders while they have to stick to innovation they have to shift the focus from innovation to execution execution takes a lot of founders who don't like execution really speaking they are pretty innovation-like they are always creators and they have to, they have to start hating these situations they need to come to terms with that they need to come to terms that they would really spend in most times in board meetings or reviews like nature rather than just on the product side some have been fully done that I mean we all talk about Steve Jobs he was a great marriage between innovation and execution I mean very few people have that kind of ability but if you see that anybody who is following that they are not so much in innovation they are more in execution making sure the balance sheet of the company continues to do that and that was Steve Jobs also had some major financial problems in his life because sometimes he was too innovation driven and he never thought to really sustain the business and sustainability became a problem in terms of couple of times the company went into almost becoming a banker but if you look at Apple now it's all about super efficient execution seamless execution that's the company today I will not rate Apple as a very big innovator it's a very strong execution company something very similar to Microsoft or things of that nature so they know how to bring in brilliant distribution timing, everything else what they do to make sure that the company is a performance student so that's very important part of the shift technology is another thing which should move from startup to a scale up technology is by nature is not going to be a rabbit but when scaling up you need a lot of technology everything has to go on technology this is something which I think is a super tick mark if you don't get that tick mark then don't do engine now because you cannot manage that kind of scale without having everything coming on data and unless you have everything on data and you can read you know your customers why they're buying, what they're changing everything has to come through this if you are not ready, first from your scale idea sometimes first get your technology in place last my quality assurance another thing which has happened in large scale up but they lose control over their product and quality and that's something which goes on and on and you suddenly realize that the customer is shifting and all gone and that happens with a lot of companies I think which are especially with the consumer's front companies and they were not able to really have and retain their customer base because they were losing focus on the quality part of it just by the scale they were losing focus and scaling is a rapid expansion that's for sure like to look at the companies you know these companies delivery companies are very sophisticated companies if you really look at them they efficiently manage only one thing the trust of customer is still there that the matters we give would deliver you on time and every time Pella and Uber would make sure that they pick you up from the last mile and that's why these scale ups, all these large companies became so successful because they never lost a mile on the last mile quality and a lot of other companies were very similar to them packed up because they were not able to do it dropouts would happen, customer complaints would happen escalations would happen and all these pieces would actually be a big step so founders actually put a lot of focus I remember these early days when Flipkart was done there were some of the collections, some of the deliveries themselves used to do themselves, we used to go to houses and deliver products and it was actually a great way of PR but more importantly I think it was also to see the connect see the whole flow, see how it works and so on because end of the day it was all seamlessly and they had this window they had this window because Amazon was not there and at that time they need to really set their roots right and scale the business to a certain level that when the big boys come in which are super efficient, super technology they are able to maintain that, when key suppliers have to be done another problem I have seen in scale ups is that they try to do a lot of things themselves they would keep opening up new departments in their business and that would become a huge cost site for them and more importantly it takes a lot of energy, brain energy of the company, so you need to really see anything which is non-core, even say hiring of a people filling of a people, anything which is non-core maybe if the critical processes are there you have to train in house but rest everything has to be outsourced, you need to have very strong vendor base, this is what I like about these American companies like you work in McDonald's or basically like that before they would take at least one year to set their back end supplier capabilities they really work and actually invest in the suppliers and build their capabilities to the critical support and they focus themselves on the core value and that's where the energy goes otherwise you start building it, like you could be the biggest team in the world when boys don't have something which is not even single and you see small outlets, I see restaurant players just they really put a big central kitchen now I say why you put central kitchen because they would say we want to show the quality, but McDonald's doesn't have it McDonald's has good suppliers, they have to basic facilities they have the star food, the Karmicaw food, there is a lot of other companies available they have to create capabilities to service McDonald's at a scale also when McDonald's was just a very small company in India I say very few stores, these companies were really building capabilities and that's how they would grow, so you don't have to really start doing everything guys and this eats up all good capital from you and second it doesn't give you any entitlement so you need to really focus on how you want to build your last key suppliers productivity is another big issue, especially now almost all scale up companies are facing a big problem in productivity these people are not effective, they are not entitled how do you really monitor productivity and that's very important finally forecasting next round to get good capital raise everything is very important, six months before you even know that you need money at this kind of money, you need to start working six months in advance so that cycle has to go rather I would say a separate team just keeps focusing and keep the eye that you never have a problem where you are running on an empty tank that's a dangerous thing, even if you have a one quarter window of any scale up not having adequate gas available the road can go absolutely drain out because this can be a very very dangerous situation and we've seen a lot of good companies but at a certain stage they were not able to raise and they were not able to survive and that's happened with a lot of companies and I can tell you some of the companies also are struggling today look at and they got confused, like the company I always give example which is very confused at this state is like oh I'll flex started for something, became something, now doing something so it's just lost the plot itself, they don't know what they need to do so we have some of the concerns and structures which happens in any of our start-up companies but there is a difference between scale thinking and start-up thinking and that something that one has to very clearly understand and then only do that, I also did an episode on growth and scale growth was actually about that when you do a growth which means the growth and digging means that you're taking something becoming more bigger or larger which means that when you do a growth you would have to deploy maybe equal amount of proportionate resources on that so we can add more people, more offices and things like that but when you do scale, you actually don't deploy in the same proportion with the very little resources deployed, you can multiply much faster that's the scale strategy and that's what technology companies are good at and a lot of other companies so you need to really have a couple of things in mind when you're doing scale-up you need to have a very strong planning, you need to focus on key issues key core value, don't change the core you need to take a good leadership team you need to hire and fire on time, I can tell you one fund which we're working with on the 25th I think on March, they called all the investing companies and about 25 of them been in market and the first thing we said is go and cut the teams and this was very difficult because all the funds, all the companies were adequately funded adequately funded, they were setting on money and they said just from that, they very clearly saw and I can tell you that a lot of other funds were not able to do it a lot of investors actually shy away from taking tough decisions so you need to and when you're writing somebody's money, writing a lot of these funds and attention funds and things that are all writing on you so sometimes we get too serious about this because we're taking a decision and somebody's salary and things of that nature but you also should understand that this money which is invested in your company is also investment hard on money of somebody so in perspective while you're trying to save my team here but you're also going to do damage to somebody's capital who's been invested and if the capital is invested by say pension funds these people have retired, developed very hard and now they're invested into these funds and these funds have been invested into companies if the companies don't really do well so you can imagine what kind of damage they're doing to these potential investors and look at you how you're managing or running a business so this is also very important, sometimes hard decisions are taken to say that somebody else it's a very important part so you need to be really welcome to hire when to fire you need to also not postpone your next round anytime you're given an opportunity to raise because there's always a time to raise and that's very important to be done and you need to have big agile teams these agile teams are always in the market understanding what market is telling them and they're quickly able to adapt their pieces another area which is very important that 75% of family members happen because of what I call the premature scale because you're not ready and you just start scaling up and then you would have a big problem in that so you need to have the right team in place your customers have to be there and they should be stable and there has to be predictability and stable revenues and profit forecast your margins have to continue to improve over the time and you're able to control your cost structure you're able to all do this when you're ready for your scale of story so this is today's episode we do have half an hour normally and it's already 30 minutes so I can quickly take some of the questions which are available with Sonari if you have some questions for me I can happy to take the questions for 2-3 minutes sure sir, thank you so much for another wonderful session Gaurav sir we do have quite a few questions lined up with us and the first question I would like to take up is from Mr. Shantanu Zaha he says 2-3 staff functions can be outsourced by startups to help them scale up as they can focus purely on business delivery yeah, some of the functions you can and you should outsource and that's what I've been saying that outsourcing is very important rather than building strong relationship with these outsourcing firms and some of the firms you should really, when you're looking at scale up they are your key vendors, your OEMs so you need to really make sure that you work with them also and their teams also that their capabilities also great but you should not participate in their companies let them run as independent company and I've seen mistakes people have done they've gone and invested back in their supply of companies and things like that and that's all wrong they are anyway taken care by the business they get from you so but you need to really choose the right companies you need to also choose who can service you in all markets and but you should outsource some of the things I think and that functions, staff functions one has to understand which functions you can outsource which you cannot like in hospitality all the banqueting and other staffing and everything they all outsource and they would go services which are their own restaurants and back of the house a lot of senior management this is all available with the hotel but all the other staff is on other party role so that's how it works right the next question is from Mr. Sandeep Pudrani he says how do you know you've reached a scale up stage isn't by way of how much your turnover is to a particular amount if so what is the amount good question that what is the stage where you are scale up so scale up is multiple qualifying tick marks has to be done apart from your product being buy them now second your team infrastructure being planned and the scale infrastructure and team is in place third your last three years performance clearly serves financial and your customer attention is clearly telling you that there isn't I think and fourth enough opportunity and timing available from the next two years so if you are scaling up the next two years should be very clearly predictable that this is a timing a best time to really do that like these days maybe the opportunity is there sometimes timing is not the right because cash flows and liquidity and all other issues are in the market but there are great opportunities sometimes which I think can be doing 2021 great but so one has to really see timing and what is an opportunity forecast for next two years right the next question is from Mr. Anil he says is the services industry scalable more specifically bespoke tailoring which is very scaling intensive at every stage of the process yeah so I mean this is right so one has to really do that how you really want to engineer I personally think that technology has done a lot in bespoke and made to tailor so kind of because technology has given you that opportunity now a lot of things can be done and come closer to that but yes it has to strong process being in place but there is an opportunity and also you need to know the end game scale can have different meaning right scale by nature means you are measuring it to something right so for bespoke you are measuring it to something different value fashion then I am measuring it to something else so scale for bespoke can be say 75 locations right and that to a big scale but for value clothing it might be 750 locations right so it is depends on what you want to measure to and how you want to do that but yes I think in services industry there is a lot of good scale of ideas you know all these examples have given you actually service providers you know Zabatels and Olas and Ubers and everything is actually your service provider and actually you solve a big problem and bespoke itself is a big problem because fundamentally everybody wants the best clothes to their fitment so if you are able to address this problem there is an answer to it and technology can spoke today and I think technology is giving you that optionality today in this sector a lot has happened in this sector especially in China Hong Kong also I have seen some companies in Europe are doing very well some of the big boys are doing it because they have the bespoke capabilities available everywhere in the market The next question is from Mr. Vivekan and Gopail he says how important is it to have systems and processes in a startup? Every important in startup scale ups needs to do all in system well processes start up by nature should not be too much system and process oriented while they need to follow it because we need to also have a lot of flexibility to change because we are in an adaptation phase while things have to change much frequently but as you got to a scale story then the processes have become very definite and you need to have a regime to follow systems and processes so I think that foundation of that has to be put when you are a startup. Right and following up on Mr. Vivekan's question he also says sir how will you program that helps startups to scale up? We essentially have a consulting which works on which we call entrepreneur India which works with different entrepreneurs especially at the startup stage to build a strong 3 to 4 or 5 year growth story and capability development so that they can be ready for a scale up and so we do that but in many few industries we are not good at all industries I'll be honest and few industries like especially services based industries especially franchising businesses we are very strong on that but franchising obviously we are market leaders so we would like franchise franchising also is a great scale story because you can really grow a business and brand simple market without putting your own team and capability Right so now sir I would just like to take up the last question for the day the question is how to retain employees while scaling up because that's a real struggle It's a retain employees sorry in the scale up while scaling up yes Yeah so retention I've told you that this is one of the biggest problem in both the situation is retention and so when you start up there is a different setup problem in manpower and retention one getting very talent is a big problem and second retaining the talent because of the kind of expectation of the talent and is not sometimes matched so a lot of emotional values have to play a very important role a lot of bonding one on one discussion a lot of a transparent way of approaching the real thing a lot of belief systems work very well a lot softer side of things work very well in the scale up it's all about growth challenging and giving high growth people like professional like that they like to give their few years where they are part of something which is becoming very very big they like it so you need to give them chance empowerment would play a very important role in the retention of people I think in scale up people leave because they get frustrated but not able to do what they wanted to or their ideas not heard and they're not being empowered enough or things of that nature that frustrates you to really do that and especially if they come along the journey from a startup to scale up they are overwhelmed by things going out of their control and a lot of other people taking more responsibility and they are not able to do it so they feel a little choked at that stage so and that's where you need to really give them more empowerment give them more capability and then they would go out and do that people enjoy the scale up startup is always tough startup is very tough because you start struggling on things and you're always insecure the next month paycheck would come not come but in scale up that piece is gone now you know the company is on the right away or big to go the only thing which can choke them is their ability to really conduct the good absolutely sir so lastly I would just like to request you to input your content details because there are a few requests from people who would like to get in touch with you and share their business plans and ideas with you sure anybody can reach me and this is my email id gm at koro maria.com please reach me and I'll be more than happy to take up any questions you have or any suggestions which you need from us and visit businesssex.com for further news and I think on entrepreneur.com entrepreneurs are news piece on franchise india is an opportunity piece and business sex is a resell and investment platform thank you very much thanks Sonali for hosting another one it's a 19 the next week we will see you on the 20th edition of our business sex scale invest exit and value thank you so much thank you for sharing valuable insights with us and for a wonderful session as always we look forward to having you with us next week as well thank you very much thank you