 That's a brand once before it kind of next door was before Put your fingers on it was smashing I got some nuts to crack Oh, it's three o'clock Let's start with this one Are there any additions or corrections to the meeting from March 17th Very none. I'll entertain a motion to approve the All favor say aye Okay No Any members have a potential conflict of interest with any of the items on the agenda this evening number 3.1 Excuse me one second excuse me one second So we have a variance application by Robert butcher requesting to build a new 8-foot deep covered porch to match the width of the house and Stairway from the porch to the front property line at 320 Ontario Avenue Years ago two or three years ago, and it was approved, but I ran into some Legal issues I got thought that I'll resolve now so I can move forward with this Edition sure sure and I believe is there a neighbor here for this item as well Okay, so at this point in time what it looks like is mr. Butcher has in essence submitted the same application that he submitted in 2018 The couple of questions that staff has as looking at this again is there have been some concerns There is one neighbor Pat Kevin who wrote a letter to the board. They're located at 1,000 north 4th Street. That indicates Nate Eastway forward the plans for this house to me and two houses west of the above address I'm having a hard time understanding the roof line of the proposed porch if it stays at or above the porch line of 328 Ontario I have no problem with the variance if it's below and obstructs my view of the lake It'll decrease my value as I have a lake view then I oppose the variance I've lived here 47 years without an obstruction of my lake view and can we please clear this up for me So presently the applicant has only Provided kind of a site plan view of the proposal There's no detail in terms of the construction of the actual porch itself So it's hard for staff to recommend favorably without having any additional detail to what we're approving in terms of an actual Structure I have some pictures that I provided Across the street of what that is going to look like of what I wanted to look like the roof Right. This is this is the extent. Um, could I get the plans on the TVs, please? This is the extent if you take a look at the TVs screens of the plans that we have As far as looking at things across the street There's no detail again, and there's just no way that staff can Recommend favorably without seeing any type of detail in terms of what's being proposed Because this house has the ability to very much I mean basically right at the sidewalk the stairs are going to start and this deck is going to come in so it is going to be much closer to the street then The other neighboring properties adjacent to it This is the home that we're looking at right here Yeah, and you can see that the stairs would basically start back here and the deck is going to be coming out You know pretty much In this area with the stairs right at the property line well these so it comes from three the sidewalk you have three feet and then that's where the steps start and Then it's seven feet from there and then eight feet for the porch Do you know what happened to the files that I About the pictures that I sent or that I gave you that are they in the file that they can look at that or Across the street I had some pictures also I sent in yeah as far as the pictures That doesn't really matter what it comes down to is the plans of what you are going to construct at the site Okay, it's gonna be halfway. It's yeah It's nothing it's gonna be halfway in between the two windows atop and bottom it's gonna be halfway there right like you said right I can I can give you the plans and I get the plans to show that then that's what you guys like or want So I think I think the biggest things that the board is looking at this evening, you know are You know this this is the person that is concerned about their view probably from The window over in this area There's a porch that is on the house right next door But the house is just a little bit behind that porch in this porch that Mr. Butcher is talking about is definitely going to be going, you know Well into that front yard So so in order to answer that question we can't with the plans before us So I don't know if anyone else has any questions or anything But at this point in time it's hard for staff to recommend favorably without that information No, no, I didn't want I didn't want that I think you have more problems with like the deck that's up there next door Yeah, I don't want that And I don't know with her sight line with that porch also, I don't know how she can say that it's gonna be interfering With her view of mine because there's a house right next door to it. So I don't understand that Sir, would you could you could you come up to the podium because no one can hear you without speaking into the microphone? If you could just let us know your name and address and feel free to provide some comment Sure, my name is William Burton and I live at 10 13 North 4th Street Around the corner from mr. Butcher. I don't know mr. Butcher. We've never met. I think we've waved at each other perhaps But My concerns are along the same lines as Pat Kevin We've lived in our house since since 20 what we bought it in late 2015 It was a distressed property it was in foreclosure it had been uninhabited for 14 months and we did a total top-to-bottom gut rehab on that house and My sight lines are not impacted by this in any way But I am also on the alley and I'm you know, my concerns are just in general with preserving Zoning and you know one of the things that we did on our house Was to relocate some windows around the corner that looks down the alley so that we have a lake view Down the alley and I would hate for somebody to change the zoning You know on the alley side that would impact my property my views and On behalf of neighbors who I haven't spoken to I'm concerned about you know People all the way up the street and even across 4th Street whose views might be changed by this I just I just really don't see the point And if their property values are impacted that's going to impact my property values as well so I'm just here to stand and you know in favor of preserving zoning where where possible and in this case It seems like it's neither going to you know improve the neighborhood or improve the tax base of the city And so it kind of seems like a no-brainer to me, but Thank you leave that leave that to you all Thanks Comment with that My house with being renovated it will improve the base of that area immensely because right now It's it's a gutted place. It's a gutted house, and I'm reef remodeling it to Preserve that area to make it look a lot nicer So decrease in values. It will not decrease decrease values of this The poor children house is not going to decrease values. I'm putting money into this house And this like I said the sight lines of I don't understand that with the house It's just not it's not going to be a double-decker one But what I can do is I can give you drawings I can come back to the board and then show you what they're going to look like Yeah, the question I guess You mentioned about the alley aren't there I drove through there I thought there are like garages on the alley side and this property does not have a I don't know how That would affect a site from the From the alley side and secondly wasn't there a porch on there from the beginning? Yeah, and the front was built Yeah, and the other being there is a house on the east side to that would seem to obstruct the view Currently, but that's only common So you'd have to come up to the mic sir you'd have to come up to the mic please sorry about that To be sure the proposal you're considering is not on the alley side. It doesn't affect the alley at all My point was a more general one and I don't know whether you can consider such a thing But you know I have a lake view in down the alley from my house and I'm just saying that you know in You know hypothetically I would hate for somebody to come before you and say well We want to you know come out towards the alley any farther And you know cut off my lake view and in the same sense I'm concerned on you know for the sake of my neighbors and One of those houses is empty the house immediately to the west of mr. Butcher at 328 is is on the market and has been uninhabited for months now So I don't know if there's anybody to speak on behalf of that property, but you know I mean there's many properties that would be that would be affected by this I think and again, I just I just Stand for maintaining zoning when people you know buy a home. They have an expectation that zoning will protect the attributes that You know led them to purchase that home and you know and so forth That's my that's my concern and that's my point and those values of all those properties You know you can increase the value of one property But if you impinge on the value of multiple properties, that's probably going to have a bigger effect on the value of my property Not to mention the city tax base, but you know, I leave that to you all you're the experts, but Those are my concerns Thank you Was there a grievance that I'm sorry when we approve this the first time was there a grievance then There was no as far as what I understand. There was nothing at that point in time So so I think what it comes down to is you can see on the drawing what was originally there I just had a question for mr. Butcher. Um, you know, there's been some Code issues. There's the steps haven't been on this building for you know since 2018 you know the it's obviously in a nice neighborhood and You guys are you know are taking a lot of time What's the difference this time that you're actually going to move forward and proceed with something? I went through some legal issues and those legal issues are done now I can proceed forward with that house. Okay before there wasn't I had to wait until the legal issues for that house were resolved They're resolved now. I can move forward Any questions? When's the next meeting? Next meeting is Calendar in front of me May third week in May Okay, I just have to keep on asking about photos that I I brought in or had from last time Do you know where they are in the files? That's all information that you would need to bring. I you know Oh, I thought I can you explain? I mean the information that we have is this deck and the application that you submitted last time And again, none of that the only pictures that are in there show the original stairway, okay There's some Google Earth pictures that we had from the last time But there are I thought yeah, I thought I had the assumption that up that was gonna be able to be presented on the screen Can you show the screen please? I mean these are some of the pictures that were Okay in from last time and The only thing that we added that was different I guess what from last time was your application and this that shows a treated wood Porch, which obviously we wouldn't approve. Okay, um, you know what those? pictures are that I gave You remember a couple days ago. I sent I said here's some pictures And you said that you were gonna put them in I said, okay, do you need my name? He said oh, I know it already So oh just that deck. Okay. I sent another one via email of pictures across the street That's all I mean it's it's yeah, don't as far as the pictures across the street I mean what it comes down to is that gives us a general idea, but we need something that shows You know, here's here's what's across the street Um, yeah, exactly that's the picture that I took that's what it's the porch That's what the line is for that the roof line. It's not gonna be a double deck or anything like that I kind of wanted to match the the The neighborhood so we're blending You know in those houses on the other side of the street You can see that several of them are close to the property line right this side You know the distances are much further than The other side of the street. Here's the whole more talking about here The neighbors you can see these are closer to the street over here where he's showing the deck So this is gonna come out basically, you know right at the property line With the steps and then shortly thereafter that eight foot wide Porch yeah, like I said I can I can get some more dimensions and some drawings Yeah, I think I think the the critical thing is is gonna be to match that Drawing that you show for your the overhead view. Yeah With me one second here. Where is it? This view because it shows a dormer. It shows different roofs. We don't know what the posts are You know, so all of that in information is important to show how the deck And the porch and the steps are gonna tie into your house so that it's an attractive addition because if it is just treated Would there's no way the board's gonna approve that now if it's tied into the house and the elements and things like that I think you have a much stronger opportunity to get it approved Okay, yeah, I just came in for what I had from last time that I was approved So that's what I came in with but yeah, I can get some more stuff. Probably be good idea to recommend tabling it Yeah, I'll be able to get all that stuff Yeah Is there is there a reason you know within the Four corners of the zoning regulations why the setback is different on one side of the street versus the other side of the street Or is that you're constructed and when the homes are built Your home was probably early 1900s compared to today and 1903 I'm sorry mine was 1903. Yeah, I know pass. I would imagine the zoning back in 1903 was significantly different than it is today I see and so so from that perspective You know, you can see that your home all the homes, you know today's code requires homes to be 25 foot setback None of these homes meet that requirement In essence what you're dealing with is Exactly what mr. Butcher is proposing is to come to the board of appeals making a request to see Hey, will I be able to vary any more than what we are all already doing in this neighborhood? So so there's not a real clear-cut answer to your question other than say the zoning was much different in 1903 and where houses could build then compared to 2021 I See thank you, and I would just make one other point in case it's relevant and that is that The the the sight lines to the lake are not the site are not the same on both sides of the street Because the on the south side of the street you have a more open view looking slightly Towards the north, you know out towards Dilan Beach Whereas on the north side of the street You're really only looking at the pier and Dilan Park You know in the grassy area Unless you can see right down the line of those homes So the the sight line to actually see the lake if you're talking about a lake view is Is not necessarily the same on both sides of the street My minor point, but I just thought I'd put that out There's a motion the table can we get a second so you're coming back Bob Okay, then we have a motion to table can we ask for a second For information The motion was made by Keely and seconded by Don we need a vote all in favor say aye opposed See you next time Bob Thank you It's got a basketball hoop that they put up on there And so All the water collects and pools and all of the all of the structure underneath in the front is all rotted out And it just has deteriorated over time and now the wind is actually it's actually worse now because of all the rain in the wind So nothing hit it That's what I'm here for All right, let's see here We got a variance application by Brian and Sarah d'Ordi requesting to build a garage 36 by 32 with an additional 20 by 2 bump out total is 1192 square feet garage will be located 26 feet from the front property line at 3 3 3 north 6 Street The variances are the additional the maximum garage sizes 1,000 square feet so it's the additional 1 192 square feet that we're discussing and the minimum setback in the SR 3 zone is 30 feet and the applicants Requesting to have a 26 foot Setback for your information the house if you can take a look at the survey is 25 feet from the front property right line right now So mr. Dardi if you'd like to explain what you're after. Yeah, thank you. I appreciate the time. Thanks for having me here Yeah, I guess My wife and I have been doing houses for the past 19 years This will be our fourth house that we've bought and said we're gonna we're gonna renovate it So we've had a lot of experience with with to be honest how to make a house better And we bought this house specifically because of the potential for it and the location of it and the potential the increase of value The carport that is there. It's kind of cool Probably was really cool back in the 70s, but it is rotted out and It's fallen apart and it needs to be it needs to come down As we were looking into this my wife one my wife and I wanted to keep it to the the house modern clean kind of low impact but we were convinced by my father-in-law that given our location and that It the right thing to do would be to put a three-car garage in the house I didn't want a three-car garage, but I've been convinced otherwise. That's probably the right thing to do for the house and The amount of currently there's about 320 square feet of storage to put about the smallest three-car garage You can we're gonna have to sacrifice on the storage, which to be honest We could use a little more than we have so as we're developing and designing it we found about the thousand square foot and Realize that we had to come here and have a conversation to find out I think what it comes down to is if we can't go larger than the thousand square feet We're gonna have to make a decision between having less storage than we might need or want or Putting a two-car garage in a house that probably long term would be better served with a three-car garage and And Yeah, I guess I put a lot of the information in here and I guess I'd love to hear your thoughts or questions And we didn't realize until we got into the process that about so the right away on our street is 40 feet from center So the first 25 feet is owned by the city and then like he said our house is exactly 25 feet from there The current carport as it sits is 31 feet from that lot line So it's already encroaching on the 35 So and the hope is to build something large enough that we can have a three-car garage where I think it a house That probably should have one long term and build enough storage in there so we can have Kayaks and paddle boards and bikes and stuff like that Yes. Yes, we've been there for three years We had your neighbor here about a year ago when he put all that cement in and he was coming up from Chicago Yeah, we'll move in next door. You want to build that little? Yeah, yeah, yep. I have their I have their sir. I have their survey with me too in case we need it. So Yeah, the graces Would you like to see the? The existing garage and get a street view to see what that is So here if you want my get in the screen, please This is just a copy or the where the home is right now This is what we're taking a look at here is the carport. They're talking about demolishing this property next door If many may remember was approved for a variance to do a little larger shed Kind of structure Yeah, maybe while I'm getting this maybe you could talk a little bit of how you're matching the Garage structure with kind of the materials and look yeah the house of the board can understand that No, it's not attached. It's a we have a 1950s ranch. It's got price probably Cedar I think but but real wood siding a hip roof We just did a big project on it. You I my pictures are kind of small But we just did a big big project to modernize it. We painted everything we put some new siding on it to modernize it We did a lot of really neat things with it. We're gonna match that we're gonna put real wood siding on it we're gonna get a Probably spend more on a garage door than I ever thought you could but to have a nice wood slat not real wood but Wood slat looking modern look to it. So it'll match the house We're gonna be as narrow as we can be to have a three-car garage and as low as we can be and the Size of it is truly the depth So even if you you guys say today that we're not going you're not gonna allow me to do this The day that I do build a garage. It's gonna look the same from the front. It's not gonna be any bigger It's just the depth that we're looking to get Um, could we get the screen again, please? so this is the garage we're talking about and Mr. Doherty you can speak to the effect that the house Maybe you could talk about a little bit of your color and what you've done to the house already and one of the reasons Why you're moving to the garage because it looked like there was a significant amount of exterior remodeling that's taken place there Yeah, do you mind if I can I bring these up to you to look at sure? Okay? Yeah, it's horizontal ebay wood siding which modernizes it We put some kind of cool numbers up there on the house But the bigger part is that if you go but can you go back to that picture of the the front picture? No, the one that you had not the one that I had it was an old picture. That's what I want to point out Give me one second So you see the big all the asphalt there like the entire house from the house to the carport was asphalt everything from where that truck is over now is great is grass and landscaped and In between the house now is professionally landscaped and I built a deck off the back. So we're we're basically got rid of the parking lot to You know give it give ourselves a Yeah, yes, so it'll come out a little bit further forward and I'll go a few feet out to the left Other than that. It's pretty much the same footprint It's 27 feet away from the house I don't know it never in Never occurred to us because the footprint was already there Yes, five feet Yeah, there if you can take a look at the survey it is showing Where the existing houses over here and then this is the proposed Garage structure so you can see that it's detached onto that north side So I guess I would have loved I would have loved to have it in the tax garage But my understanding was attaching a garage is a lot more challenging than rebuilding an existing Structure in the same place. So I never explored that option And all our plans went forward with making that space between the garage and the house our outdoor space If that makes sense Jeff or if you've been over there look at The guy thing you want to say didn't he put up a little building in the back you're on that corner South northeast of your garage the you mean the grace is one that you guys approved last year. Is that what you mean? I'm talking about the guy from Chicago. He put that you wanted to put it. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I love it. It's great All in favor say aye. Aye Beautiful motion carries you're good. Thank you so much The Graby Sounds good. Yeah. Yeah, right. Maybe we'll see you again. Yeah. Yeah, right. Well, thank you very much. You're welcome. I Could address item 3.3 if you want real quick Item 3.3 has been withdrawn at this point in time So we don't have to worry about that one and then just a heads up for everyone Rob Eckerd had put in his Resignation so he will no longer be joining us. So we'll probably have someone new in the future so Appreciate it Rob's help over the years. So if you're listening Rob, thank you for helping out over that time period We'd appreciate it That's it Very none. I'll entertain a motion to adjourn All in favor say aye. Aye Post carried Thanks, everybody